-- Original Message --
From: Jernej Marusic [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Well from listening to this strings for a couple of times, I can
tell that
at the beginning they start the same as jaguar but than it gets
different
really quickly. Than at another point there's
no one has mentioned the possibility that they both sampled
strings from the same source and then flipped them differently.
obviously this house track was made during a period of sample
heavy marrs/coldcut influenced stuff. so its entirely possible the
strings are from an old song and that they
So, I'm sure the producer of Carino, if they are alive still, are keeping
real quiet and
not bothering with taking any action against Rolando if UR didn't clear it.
hmmm. as far as i know mike pickering is still alive. i'm sure i saw a post
here from his partner hillegonda rietveld a while
On Monday, August 4, 2003, at 06:23 PM, Matt MacQueen wrote:
no one has mentioned the possibility that they both sampled
strings from the same source and then flipped them differently.
obviously this house track was made during a period of sample
heavy marrs/coldcut influenced stuff. so its
- Original Message -
From: Matt MacQueen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2003 12:23 AM
Subject: Re: (313) Jaguar Strings on 80s House record?
no one has mentioned the possibility that they both sampled
strings from the same source
David Powers
[EMAIL
so let me get all of this correct...according to everyone here on
this list the general opinion is that UR and rolando sampled this TCOY
track and did not make it them selfs.man with all of the
bullshit that surrounded the jaguar you think someone else would have
dug this up if it
Well, i wont argue about the synth that sounds like roland track.
But listen the piano line instead Think a little bit...
Ok, now listen Sweet D track on Trax records (TX119), released in 1986. . .
.
Definitively has less groove strengh, but still !
So it might goes in favor of the hypothesis
my thoughts exactly...
peace
On Monday, August 4, 2003, at 07:06 PM, MM wrote:
so let me get all of this correct...according to everyone here on
this list the general opinion is that UR and rolando sampled this TCOY
track and did not make it them selfs.man with all of the
Damn where do I start with this -
you need to learn a bit more about copyright issues, sampling and music
law, and fair use:
http://www.music-law.com/sampling.html
There is also a rumor going around that you can use four notes of any song
under the fair use doctrine. There is no four note
Here's an excerpt of the sweet D track :
http://www.kiddyraver.com/sweetd.ram
Its close, but not the same either.
- KiDD*e*
- Original Message -
From: KiDDy*RaVeR [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2003 2:08 AM
Subject: Re: (313) Jaguar Strings on 80s
Uh what? I'm not sure what part of the song you think is close - the piano
line, the synthesized string line?
believe me, it's not close at all (legally speaking)
if you're talking about the piano line - it's not close enough to warrant
any discussion about it being similar to Jaguar.
MEK
Devil's Advocate -
If you sampled a piece of music but never cleared it legally - and, knowing
this, if it was discovered that you did sample the music and it leaked out
you ran the very great risk of being sued - especially if you had a fairly
high profile court case over that same piece of
Aiight... I'm moving to Phoenix on Friday and I'm finally to the point where
I hafta pack my stuff. How has everyone else transported their tables?
Normally I would just drive 'em along with my computers. I don't have that
option this time as I'm moving a coupla thousand miles away instead of
Hate to disagree, but it actually seems obvious to me that the Jaguar
strings weren't sampled from this. For a start off, as I believe someone
observed, there would need to be some sort of breakdown where the strings
were unaccompanied. Not sure what's meant by 'cleaned up' here, but if you
were
Michael,
Nahhh. While I respect the levels that you have thought through all of
this, all your analysis is based on the (weak, IMHO) assumption that
Jaguar DOES sample that TCOY track, and I'm arguing that it *DOESN'T*.
So everything else you conclude is based on that assumption, and it's
While technically this might be true, in reality almost ALL
compositions are copyright violations under this basis. This is a built
in limitation of the finite tonal system most commonly used, which just
by chance is going to produce substantially similar patterns.
Millions of songs share four
Ok I finally listened to this. The chance of Rolando ripping this off
seems, to me, to be none. The ornament that begins both Jaguar and
the other string part, is a CLICHÉ, easily found in many spanish
sounding type songs, movie scores, mariachi trumpet parts, etc. Like I
said just now, if we
Has anyone picked this up yet?
It was posted to alt.binaries.sounds.mp3.electronic 2 days ago, where've
you been? :-)
1st impression: It's Kraftwerk, it washes over you like a familiar
perfume from an old girlfriend, but ultimately it's benign, it's
inoffensive and despite the familiar odor,
wait a minute.this is what i am saying .the jaguar is NOT
sampled in my opinion, and everything i have figured out based on facts
make me think that it has NOT been sampledits just my opinion if
everyone wants to think that the Jaguar is sampled or copied ...let them
think that
-- Original Message --
From: Matt MacQueen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I mean, go dig out Jaguar again and tell me that's a sample...
IMHO
there is no way. Have you ever tried to sample stuff and use it
in a
track? There's extraordinary difficulty in finding a
-- Original Message --
From: MM [EMAIL PROTECTED]
now after talking about
it for a bit and realizing thati would find it REAL hard that
it
could be sampled knowing how important the record was to
rolando
thats all i am saying .
now youre
I mean, go dig out Jaguar again and tell me that's a sample...
IMHO there is no way. Have you ever tried to sample stuff and use it
in a
track? There's extraordinary difficulty in finding a clean
enough
version of that string part of the track to be able to sample it
and
make Jaguar
On Mon, 4 Aug 2003, Kent williams wrote:
My friend Rich found this:
http://www.psychiatry.uiowa.edu/~kent/Carino-TCOY.mp3
Listen to the string synth at the beginning, contrast and compare with
synth strings in Night of the Jaguar
Doesn't the piano there sound just like SL2's Changing
- Original Message -
From: Matt MacQueen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: MM [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313@hyperreal.org;
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2003 2:27 AM
Subject: Re: (313) Jaguar Strings on 80s House record?
I mean, go dig out Jaguar again and tell me
I mean, go dig out Jaguar again and tell me that's a sample... IMHO
there is no way. Have you ever tried to sample stuff and
use it in a
track? There's extraordinary difficulty in finding a clean enough
version of that string part of the track to be able to sample it and
make
the jungle producer adam f replayed a big chuck of a bob james
track (nautilus i think it was) and turned it into a jungle tune
that got released on a major and AFAIK didnt get sample clearance.
Hmm. I can't believe that - big labels are usually pretty weary of things
like that - even if the
Mike Pickering is proly not yet 40
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2003 12:36 AM
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: (313) t-coy
So, I'm sure the producer of Carino, if they are alive still, are keeping
real quiet and
not
Mark All as Read
|-Original Message-
|From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
|Sent: 05 August 2003 08:53
|To: 313@hyperreal.org
|Subject: Re: (313) Jaguar Strings on 80s House record?
|
|
| the jungle producer adam f replayed a big chuck of a bob james
| track (nautilus i
Yes I remember them 'Tell me how it Feels'
Mind you there were a couple of nice 'pop house' tracks on the first
M-People record.
Yes give the man a break he virtualy brought House Music to the Hacienda way
back...and possibly opened many a door to the UK dance scene, expecially in
the North
Yeah wasn't he also behind Quando Quango?
if so - the man's a genius
rc
on 5/8/03 8:03 PM, Mann, Ravinder [CCS] at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Yes I remember them 'Tell me how it Feels'
Mind you there were a couple of nice 'pop house' tracks on the first
M-People record.
Yes
Yeah wasn't he also behind Quando Quango?
if so - the man's a genius
i found this interesting:
http://www.cerysmatic.clara.net/Factory/index.html?quando.html
and this:
http://www.discogs.com/~hillegonda
robin...
Ive heard that too about MP/QQ...
also Blue Zone, an early manchester soul out.. song that went like
'Love is a Big Thing
We got love
We don't need nobody else'
featuring Lisa Stansfield,
52nd Street featured Charmange ?? who went on to sing for Urban Cookie
Collective (Still the best name
Yeah wasn't he also behind Quando Quango?
if so - the man's a genius
yes, and I forgot to mention that!
not sure if he played sax or actually did production/writing.
also, did he have something to do with section 25 maybe as well?
but I'm not sure of that. Maybe that was just a collaboration?
thinking about it why the hell are we on a 313 list when we should be on a
0161 list
:)
robin...
ps. listening to a greg wilson mix from 83 that backs the above statement
up too
Yeah wasn't he also behind Quando Quango?
if so - the man's a genius
yes, and I forgot to mention that!
not
Maybe sell em and buy a pair of 2nd hand decks in your new town ? [depends
how emotionally attached you are to them and how new they are etc I guess
but shipping 2 1210s a long way sounds mighty expensive!]
Peace,
Marc
-Original Message-
From: logic7 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent:
thinking about it why the hell are we on a 313 list when we should be on a
0161 list
heh!
because
a) everyone would be bitchin about each other! he's a joker, he's a one
track wonder, he wouldn't know a good track if it poked him in the eye!
their records are always too fast, they got no soul
thinking about it why the hell are we on a 313 list when we should be on a
0161 list
heh!
because
a) everyone would be bitchin about each other! he's a joker, he's a one
track wonder, he wouldn't know a good track if it poked him in the eye!
their records are always too fast, they got no
well, record.
picked up a new Purpose Maker thing at lunch.
I never buy purpose maker things either.
but its cool, kind of plinky plonky house on one side, fairly 'nice' I
think.
doesn't do anything groundbreaking, just pretty nice.
4 tracker - Changes Of Life (reprise), Roots, Reprise and
Cool whats the changes of life reprise like [or is that the plinky thing ?]
Ta,
marc
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2003 1:10 PM
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: (313) new records
well, record.
picked up a new
Cool whats the changes of life reprise like [or is that the plinky thing
?]
it's cool. plinky plonky! kind of a lot slower than a usual mills track,
you can hear the original patterns but the pitch has changed and the chords
are all wrong and out of tune, but it sounds cool. I think 'Roots' is
Looks good just downloaded and taking a listen - like the crazy start :D
Ta,
Marc
-Original Message-
From: Eric Scuccimarra [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, August 04, 2003 10:11 PM
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: (313) WBAR - Playlist - 8-1-03
DJ Skooch -
a friend mailed this to me...anyone know for sure...i
don't have cable:
every monday i watch Road Rules on mtv, and dude
they have played TWO different Drexciya songs on a few
different episodes! ain't that some chit?
unfortunately i don't remember the names, but i'm
willing to bet they're
they have sound clips of this on the groovetech website
very interesting release...nice and slow...and strangely familiar ('roots'
is a bit like...erm wiggin or summat)
i'll probs pick this up when i see it...
robin...
Cool whats the changes of life reprise like [or is that the plinky
the site has been down or otherwise screwed up for about 2 weeks now, and
dan's mix has just been sitting there, but finally i can at least post a
link to it:
http://downlowmusic.org/Mp3s/dan%20curtin-interstellar%20groove%201_low.mp3
=~50mb Mp3
will put a realaudio streaming version up
Shameless self-promotion time...
Brand new mix online at :
http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/users/mbl/Bang4DaBucks.mp3
Tracklisting at :
http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/users/mbl
Some 313 bits, some breaks/hipHop, some house, some DnB err usual mashup
randomness :D
Did I allready mention how
Can someone please tell me how important new order was for the
development
of techno? What do the detroit guys think of new order? how did it
influence
what they were doing?
pretty important i would say, but i'll let the more verbose 313 members go
on about that ;)
And what new order
[Maarten Baute [EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Can I find some information on the net covering the link between new order
and detroit techno?
And what new order albums should I buy as an introduction to the band?
Can't comment on the techno connection, but as far as recommendations,
there's no better
Hi folks,
I posted a short live PA on my website a couple months ago, and since
then I've gotten a few requests for a track listing. I've now added one
to my site.
Thanks,
--
Dennis DeSantis
www.dennisdesantis.com
Massive influence in European circles, the Manchester scene was probably
just as important as the UK shoegaze scene as far as influence on
electronic music. As far as techno, or more specifically Detroit techno,
its hard to say but I wouldnt doubt it.
As far as recommendations go, I would pick
After hearing lots and lots of hype about this albulm for the past couple of
months, I had very high expectations. I don't think it lives up to what
I've heard but it still is amazing albulm. The first track really sucks me
in especially with the synthy opening. I think Ping Pong and Headcase
In my opinion the new album is much more Plastikman again than the last ones.
Richie concentrated again on the sound he got famous before he did such IMHO
crappy stuff like the Orange 12. This is a worth foolow up to Muzik and Sheet
One adapted to 2003. Will definitely be one of the important
Dennis DeSantis wrote:
Hi folks,
I posted a short live PA on my website a couple months ago, and since
then I've gotten a few requests for a track listing. I've now added
one to my site.
Thanks,
Wicked mix from Dennis you all should check it out! :)
Regards,
Ramon
you're comparing plastikman releases to richie hawtin releases?
or you're saying that consumed and artifakts didn't hold up to the
plastikman records before them, but this one does?
- Original Message -
From: Arne Weinberg [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313 Mailing List 313@hyperreal.org
Sent:
- Original Message -
From: Maarten Baute [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2003 8:23 PM
Subject: (313) My London Visit (record shopping).
So... should I check the Reckless n1 soul basement in Islington? Is it
any
good?
I think I will visit Reckless
a better question would be: how much of an influence was Kraftwerk on New
Order?
I recall an interview where they mention a track of thiers with a working
title KW1 which stood for the Kraftwerk One I think it later became
Your Smile or something similar.
personally: No record collection could be
[sean deason [EMAIL PROTECTED]]
a better question would be: how much of an influence was Kraftwerk on New
Order?
I recall an interview where they mention a track of thiers with a working
title KW1 which stood for the Kraftwerk One I think it later became
Your Smile or something similar.
Yes, it's pretty nice, no great stylistic innovation but who cares
when the melodies and textures are so good - highlights for me were
the tracks Aero Dynamik and 'Elektro Cardiogram. Certainly worth
purchasing + comes out on my birthday in the UK - hurrah!
Yeah, that's what I thought. Even
Why would that be a better question? Thats like if I said a better
question would be, how much influence the Kraut rock bands had on
Kraftwerk, or how much influence the minimalist composers had on Kraut
rock. We could go in circles
a better question would be: how much of an influence was
- Original Message -
From: Maarten Baute [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2003 8:58 PM
Subject: (313) new order.
Can I find some information on the net covering the link between new order
and detroit techno?
Aha! One of my favorite subjects, and for a
Don't forget Smallfish! Old St. tube, bit of a trek from town but you never
know what you'll find!
- Original Message -
From: Phonopsia [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Maarten Baute [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2003 10:45 PM
Subject: Re: (313) My London Visit
-- Original Message --
From: sean deason [EMAIL PROTECTED]
personally: No record collection could be complete without the
LowLife
album. most of the tracks from that album got loads of club play in
Detroit's and LowLife was the soundtrack to many of my
- Original Message -
From: Phonopsia [EMAIL PROTECTED]
'Your Silent Face' - I suspect this is the one you mean, Sean?),
thanx Tristian! yes, *thats* the one I was trying to recall. it's very
kraftwerk sounding. even the vocals are sang in a very cold detached
monotone with a very
coolness! everyone on 313 should own this album. it's not very Joy Division,
nor New Order sounding, at least not the New Order sound that they became
known for (mess around, mess around, mess mess mess around...) but a perfect
hybrid of the two and more.
- Original Message -
From:
- Original Message -
From: sean deason [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Phonopsia [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Maarten Baute
[EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2003 11:42 PM
Subject: Re: (313) new order.
- Original Message -
From: Phonopsia [EMAIL PROTECTED]
'Your
oh, and one more thing! Mike Pickering - yep, OK, he did M-People, but I
think he's made his contribution - 52nd Street anyone? Good Factory band,
innovative etc. Give him a break
MP in 52nd st ? no way. 'cool as ice' (which was their only release on
factory) is the bomb tho.
check
- Original Message -
From: sean deason [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313@hyperreal.org
Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2003 11:47 PM
Subject: Re: (313) new order.
coolness! everyone on 313 should own this album. it's not very Joy
Division,
nor New Order sounding, at least not the
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