Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Larry Lyons
Probably. I was reading recently about camel racing in the Emirates. Up until recently they used very young kids as jockeys, that is until the international outcry forced the owners to change. They're now using small robots as jockeys - and the sport apparently is as popular. Something similar c

RE: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Erika L. Walker
Actually I did comment on this: "...Not all jockeys whip horses. You might see them waving the whip, but sometimes they are just waving it, not actually making contact. There are "excessive whipping" rules in affect these days that carry heavy fines and suspensions. It's not in anyone's best inter

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Larry Lyons
After viewing the video again, it does appear that the round exploded in the tube. Its a pity that they don't have more like that. > It isn't any more. :) > > > > Larry Lyons wrote: > > Also doesn't help that the fool was using what looked like a 40mm > mortar - I thought those were WWII era

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Larry Lyons
So have I. I was referring to the tactics of small units actually getting out into the neighbourhoods, and staying there rather than hiding on large bases and going out on isolated raids. The idea is hearts and minds rather than John Wayne bullshit. >Really so having the SAS kill entire enemy

RE: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Erika L. Walker
Unfortunately, I think that it's an issue that will never go away. The racehorse industry brings in BILLIONS of dollars a year. In NJ alone, the industry brought in 1.1 Billion dollars last year. Equine related land is one-fifth of the agricultural acreage in NJ. Of course it is a small state

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Robert Munn
Interesting article inline in the site about whips from NYT: http://www.all-creatures.org/adow/art-horsewhip.html Some regulation akin to Britain's rules on whips sounds reasonable. As for other sports, in schutzen guard dog training, trainers use a method that involves rewards and punishments t

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Mary Jo Sminkey
>heck, dogs can run a track without being >reminded of what direction to go. can't horses? maybe a mechanical carrot >zipping around a track...? And there you go...the dogs are chasing something (the rabbit) because they are predatory animals (greyhounds in particular are bred to chase down prey

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Crow T. Robot
I still see no comments about whipping an animal during a race as NOT being cruel. All other arguments aside, doesn't this one thing bother anyone else? I personally can't watch horse racing, as this just drives me nuts. In no other accepted sport is it considered OK to just beat the animal to ge

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Robert Munn
I have had family involved in the horse racing industry my whole life, so maybe I'm biased, but I don't think the sport is cruel. Like Mary Jo and Erika said, individual owners can be cruel to their horses, but what is new about some people being cruel? The entire sport should not be condemned beca

RE: Afternoon Funny

2008-05-06 Thread Adam Churvis
> From: Todd [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > 4) You couldn't find a girlfriend who could manage to wake you up by > playing > around with your hoohoo. > > Though, #3 might have something to do with that ... HOORAY FOR TODD!!! :) Respectfully, Adam Phillip Churvis President Productivity Enhancement

Re: Afternoon Funny

2008-05-06 Thread Todd
4) You couldn't find a girlfriend who could manage to wake you up by playing around with your hoohoo. Though, #3 might have something to do with that ... - Original Message - From: "Bruce Sorge" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "CF-Community" Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2008 5:01 PM Subject: Afterno

Afternoon Funny

2008-05-06 Thread Bruce Sorge
A man went to the hospital to have his wedding ring cut off from his hoohoo. According to the Nurse attending, the patient's girlfriend found the ring in his pants pocket and she got so mad at him, she used petroleum jelly to slip the ring on his hoohoo while he was asleep. I don't know what's

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Jason
a tyro question... would spectators even be interested in watching horse races without jockeys? that would be cool, no? gates open! out shoot these awesome animals running like mad without a whip...? heck, dogs can run a track without being reminded of what direction to go. can't horses? maybe a m

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Mary Jo Sminkey
>I believe, wholeheartedly, that "man" should not race horses before they are >at least 4 years old. A horse is not fully developed until the age of 4 or >5. I totally agree. This is one reason we do tend to see more injuries in racing than other equine sports where they are not competing at suc

Re: Hey Rick, how bout them tigers?

2008-05-06 Thread Rick Root
On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 2:44 PM, G Money <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Look at the offensive starters for that team: > > > > Ivan rodriguez, placido polanco, Carlos Guillen, Sean Casey, Magglio > > Ordonez... all hired guns. > > > True, but a few hired guns is fine...your whole team isn't going to

RE: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Erika L. Walker
As a former racehorse person: I believe it is only cruel if managed and done wrongly. As it is sometimes, man does not always do what is right. I believe, wholeheartedly, that "man" should not race horses before they are at least 4 years old. A horse is not fully developed until the age of 4 or 5

FBI Raids Bush Counsel

2008-05-06 Thread Gruss Gott
FBI Agents Raid Work, Home Of Special Counsel's Bloch By JOHN R. WILKE May 6, 2008 1:59 p.m. WASHINGTON -- Federal Bureau of Investigation agents raided the Office of Special Counsel here, seizing computers and documents belonging to the agency chief Scott Bloch and staff. More than a dozen FBI a

Re: Hey Rick, how bout them tigers?

2008-05-06 Thread G Money
On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 1:13 PM, Rick Root <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > You're a hypocrite then. Sure, Bonderman, Verlander, and Maroth were > (mostly) home grown. robertson came up first with the Marlins. Neither > Maroth nore Bonderman were drafted by Detroit, though they both played > their >

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Mary Jo Sminkey
>those people love their horses... >they would NEVER purposefully injure, hurt or kill if they didnt have to. Has anyone here ever *worked* at a track or with racehorses? I did for several years while working on my admission to vet school, and while I do enjoy watching racing, I do think it does

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Rick Root
On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 1:44 PM, G Money <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > How many horses die of injuries sustained while "running" in the pasture > > for > > fun? > > Probably about the same number who die on the racing circuit.a small > percentage. > > > How many die from injuries sustained i

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Loathe
Really so having the SAS kill entire enemy villages, you don't think that was helpful? You can't compare the British and U.S. military, I've served with them, they are professional soldiers, but they care much less about civilian casualties and will shoot first, they actually protect their sold

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread G Money
They should race without a jockey. No bits, no whipping, just purty horses running as fast as they can. I wonder if that would be MORE dangerous thoughwould the horses run into each other? I doubt it. On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 1:09 PM, Crow T. Robot <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Not it's perfect

Re: Hey Rick, how bout them tigers?

2008-05-06 Thread Rick Root
On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 1:39 PM, G Money <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Detroit should have stuck with it's core guys and continued to develop > from > their farm. > > I thought it was great seeing you guys go from a laughing stock in 2003, > to > the World Series in 2006, with mostly home spun tal

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread G Money
I think the breeding question is a valid one though. I agree they would never purposefully injure their horse, but recent breeding practices MIGHT be doing just that, and it should be examined. Obviously there is an animal care consideration that should be the driving force here, but even beyond t

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Crow T. Robot
Not it's perfectly fine, except for that whipping the shit out of them part, so they'll run faster while they have an extremely uncomfortable bit in their mouth. Nah...that doesn't sound cruel at all. On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 1:05 PM, Tony <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > those people love their horse

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Tony
those people love their horses... they would NEVER purposefully injure, hurt or kill if they didnt have to. tw On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 1:49 PM, Larry Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Yes and no. I think what happened last Sunday is the result of generations of > breeding large chests and very t

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread G Money
I really think our primary mistake was a high level delusional mis-judgement of the Iraqi people, and their thoughts and feelings about their current regime. I think the Bush Admin had this ridiculous notion that common, everyday Iraqis were sitting in their houses, stewing about how much they hat

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Larry Lyons
Um what about the British involvement in Malaysia and Kenya in the 50's and Aden and Belize in the 60's - those were very successful COIN operations that used a very different approach than what the US has taken until the most recent stages of the Iraq conflict. I think what it shows is that th

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Larry Lyons
Yes and no. I think what happened last Sunday is the result of generations of breeding large chests and very thin legs, in order to create a faster animal. Perhaps its time for the horse breeding industry to rethink its current direction. >That's the question. Is horse-racing cruel? > >People

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Greg Morphis
I am at home VPN'd into my work network... not referring to anything really.. just stating that I am too at home.. technically.. On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 12:37 PM, Adam Churvis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Good for you. This is *my* house too.. but I have to VPN to the > > network which means I s

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread G Money
On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 12:18 PM, Rick Root <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > That's the question. Is horse-racing cruel? No. Not even close. Well, unless you have an abusive owner/jockey combination.but i imagine those are extremely rare. > People say "horses love to run". Sure, put horses in

Re: Hey Rick, how bout them tigers?

2008-05-06 Thread G Money
On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 12:09 PM, Rick Root <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I would agree except that, as a Detroit Lions fan, it's quite easy for me > to > think of a more poorly run organization. > > I will admit though, Peter Angelos is the worst owner in baseball. > Detroit should have stuck with

RE: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Adam Churvis
> Good for you. This is *my* house too.. but I have to VPN to the > network which means I still can't access certain sites. > I will check this afternoon because I'm in the middle of something. I just meant that it's a pet subject of mine. Not excluding anyone. What are you referring to regardin

Re: Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Cameron Childress
People love to run too. People get hurt running too. Some people die when running. We much protect people from running! Where are the robots from iRobot when you need them? We should all stay indoors for our own good. Oh please protect us from ourselves great Federal government! /done -Came

Is horse racing cruel?

2008-05-06 Thread Rick Root
That's the question. Is horse-racing cruel? People say "horses love to run". Sure, put horses in a pasture, and they'll run around. Trot, canter, gallop, whatever. How many horses die of injuries sustained while "running" in the pasture for fun? How many die from injuries sustained in racing?

Re: Boating Update

2008-05-06 Thread Rick Root
> what lake? Jordan Lake.. about 5 miles west of Apex, NC http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=jordan+lake,+nc&ie=UTF8&ll=35.770472,-79.032898&spn=0.209477,0.464172&z=11 http://tinyurl.com/62muyj > what size engine? It's a 140hp Mercruiser 3.0L 4 cylinder I/O. 1985 Glasstream 172 Cutlass (17'

Re: Hey Rick, how bout them tigers?

2008-05-06 Thread Rick Root
On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 10:35 AM, G Money <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The Orioles.i'm trying to think of an organization that has been > as > poorly run over the past 10 or 15 years than the Orioles. They have the > money, the resources, the fan base, the nice ballpark..there is no > r

Re: Hey Rick, how bout them tigers?

2008-05-06 Thread Tony
the orioles are tied for 2nd in the TOUGHEST LEAGUE in the majors. i dont wanna hear shit. had that one homerun counted in that one game against the yankees in the 1996 ALCS http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_American_League_Championship_Series things in our world would be way diff. its all good,

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Loathe
Nothing. G Money wrote: > I know Vietnam was a completely different conflict...i know that.but two > lessons that were very clear from that conflict: > > 1) It is extremely difficult to beat a determined local insurgency on their > own soil and > 2) You cannot win if you force yourself to fig

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread G Money
I know Vietnam was a completely different conflict...i know that.but two lessons that were very clear from that conflict: 1) It is extremely difficult to beat a determined local insurgency on their own soil and 2) You cannot win if you force yourself to fight with your arms tied behind your ba

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Greg Morphis
Ah okay.. nothing to get excited about... 'preciate it On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 10:39 AM, G Money <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > It just confirms what we suspected, that the location of a gun can be pretty > quickly ascertained upon firing, but it doesn't say howfocuses instead > on how our mili

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Loathe
Yeah it's great, too bad we can't use them. G Money wrote: > It just confirms what we suspected, that the location of a gun can be pretty > quickly ascertained upon firing, but it doesn't say howfocuses instead > on how our military has developed highly mobile guns for this reason. > > On Tue

Iron Man

2008-05-06 Thread Scott Stewart
My wife took me on a date to see "Iron Man". Fantastic movie. Robert Downey Jr. is great as Tony Stark, humorous and convincing. The effects are well done and believable.. If you liked Spider Man you'll love Iron Man. Marvel does it again. -- Scott Stewart ColdFusion Developer SSTWeb

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Greg Morphis
On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 10:38 AM, Adam Churvis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > This is *my* house... Good for you. This is *my* house too.. but I have to VPN to the network which means I still can't access certain sites. I will check this afternoon because I'm in the middle of something.

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Loathe
They can do it with radar. 2/505th caught the "mad mortorman" outside Strpce Kosovo using the radar and a quick reaction force. Greg Morphis wrote: > Yeah I've seen something on Future Weapons where they can pinpoint a > shot fired from a gun.. it only takes 1 shot and they know.. > However there

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Loathe
We are not allowed to use counter battery artillery in Iraq or Afghanistan due to fears of civilian casualties. Cameron Childress wrote: > Yeah, it looks like that's the case to me as well. The explosion seems to > come from the base of the mortar launcher. I do find it very interesting > that

Re: Cable TV Beat Down

2008-05-06 Thread Bruce Sorge
+1 for Hulu. William Bowen wrote: > http://www.hulu.com > > of course, it requires broadband... > ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.

Re: Cable TV Beat Down

2008-05-06 Thread William Bowen
http://www.hulu.com of course, it requires broadband... > So what are all these web sites I can go to to get sporting events > and/or cool shows? > > Cable bills suck. -- will "If my life weren't funny, it would just be true; and that would just be unacceptable." - Carrie Fisher ~~~

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread G Money
It just confirms what we suspected, that the location of a gun can be pretty quickly ascertained upon firing, but it doesn't say howfocuses instead on how our military has developed highly mobile guns for this reason. On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 10:10 AM, Greg Morphis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >

RE: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Adam Churvis
This is *my* house... Actually, they're both "lobbed." The only difference is the angle at which the interior ballistics becomes exterior ballistics: a rifle shot, because of its higher velocity and shorter distance to target than a mortar round, requires less elevation for the round to "fall" on

God I hate people sometimes

2008-05-06 Thread Bruce Sorge
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-dog7-2008may07,0,6297012.story?track=rss Dog set on fire in Lancaster Investigators look for suspects after neighbors hear yelping then see the dog running with its fur ablaze. The pit bull mix is being treated for burns. Investigators are searching fo

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Greg Morphis
I'm sure it's blacklisted here.. stupid software.. Anyways I'll check when I get home. On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 10:05 AM, Bruce Sorge <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > This should help clear things up. > > > http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ground/counter-battery-radar.htm > > Bruce > >

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Bruce Sorge
This should help clear things up. http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ground/counter-battery-radar.htm Bruce G Money wrote: > I'm not sure either..been a long time since I've done physics. > > I'm not sure that terminal velocity would do you much good, but if you knew > a rate of

Cable TV Beat Down

2008-05-06 Thread Gruss Gott
So what are all these web sites I can go to to get sporting events and/or cool shows? Cable bills suck. ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doublecli

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread G Money
I'm not sure either..been a long time since I've done physics. I'm not sure that terminal velocity would do you much good, but if you knew a rate of acceleration and a direction at any point on the arc.you should be able to approximate it's place of origin, if you have a general idea of th

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Bruce Sorge
It isn't any more. :) Larry Lyons wrote: > Also doesn't help that the fool was using what looked like a 40mm mortar - I > thought those were WWII era weapons. That a 60+ year old mortar is still > operable is surprising. ~| A

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Larry Lyons
Also doesn't help that the fool was using what looked like a 40mm mortar - I thought those were WWII era weapons. That a 60+ year old mortar is still operable is surprising. >Although I found great joy in seeing this POS blown up, I tend to agree >with the author that it was more likely bad am

Re: Hey Rick, how bout them tigers?

2008-05-06 Thread Larry Lyons
Go Nats. Orioles suck dead budgies. Ever since their own tried to sabotage the Nationals from starting up I've been really down on them. Personally though I like the mid-Atlantic league. The smaller farm team leagues seem to have almost everything that the majors lack - entertainment for one th

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Greg Morphis
That, I don't know.. I think you'd need something else in there to get an approx. position.. Things falling have a terminal velocity... If it's terminal velocity is maxed at say 200mph. Well if you can reach that speed from falling 1000 feet.. how do you know it wasn't dropped 1 feet? or 1200

RE: Boating Update

2008-05-06 Thread Scott Stewart
Fun What size engine is it..? -- Scott Stewart ColdFusion Developer SSTWebworks 4405 Oakshyre Way Raleigh, NC. 27616 (919) 874-6229 (home) (703) 220-2835 (cell) -Original Message- From: Rick Root [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2008 10:23 AM To: CF-Community Subj

Re: Who twitters?

2008-05-06 Thread Adam Haskell
I twitter sometimes, lots of folks were at cf.Objective Adam Haskell On Sun, May 4, 2008 at 11:10 AM, Zaphod Beeblebrox < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I'm trying to figure out if I really need twitter in my life...so I guess > I > need to find some people to follow > > zB > > > ~~~

Re: Hey Rick, how bout them tigers?

2008-05-06 Thread G Money
The Orioles.i'm trying to think of an organization that has been as poorly run over the past 10 or 15 years than the Orioles. They have the money, the resources, the fan base, the nice ballpark..there is no reason you all should be perennial losers. Talk about underachieving. Here's a

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread G Money
Really? I would think the fact that it was lobbed would actually make it EASIER. Couldn't you use some fairly simple physics based on trajectory and rate of acceleration/deceleration to determine pretty quickly where it came from? On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 9:08 AM, Greg Morphis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> w

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Cameron Childress
I think the distance from the origin is really the biggest problem here. The sound from the firing of a weapon comes from the weapon, regardless of it's trajectory. The problem I guess is that the origin may not be located in an area controlled by friendlies. -Cameron On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 10:0

Re: Hey Rick, how bout them tigers?

2008-05-06 Thread Tony
hahahahaha fuck the tigers go orioles w000 h tw On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 10:07 AM, G Money <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Umsorry about the blank emailwhat I meant to say was: > > Don't sweat it, my team sucks too.coursemy team has half the > payroll :) > > > On Tue,

RE: Boating Update

2008-05-06 Thread Erika L. Walker
What Lake Rick? ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;192386516;25150098;k Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/CF-Commu

Boating Update

2008-05-06 Thread Rick Root
I can't remember if I mentioned to y'all but when we took the boat out for the first run of the season a few weekends ago, it overheated. Since I wasn't paying attention to the temp gauge, it overheated badly. Turned out to be a faulty water impeller (the one in the stern drive), but we also disc

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Greg Morphis
Yeah I've seen something on Future Weapons where they can pinpoint a shot fired from a gun.. it only takes 1 shot and they know.. However there are some differences here.. Gun's shoot lateral (minus the subtle drop due to gravity). The technology used to locate this uses highly sensitive speakers

Re: Hey Rick, how bout them tigers?

2008-05-06 Thread G Money
Umsorry about the blank emailwhat I meant to say was: Don't sweat it, my team sucks too.coursemy team has half the payroll :) On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 9:07 AM, G Money <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 8:52 AM, Rick Root <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > >

Re: Hey Rick, how bout them tigers?

2008-05-06 Thread G Money
On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 8:52 AM, Rick Root <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Mon, May 5, 2008 at 8:42 AM, G Money <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Great game yesterday, eh? > > > > Sorrybut I'm actively rooting against the Tigersthe Yankees of > the > > central division. > > > > Fuck. Leave

Re: McCain may not be eligible for the presidency

2008-05-06 Thread Cameron Childress
On Sun, May 4, 2008 at 8:14 PM, Larry Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > There are power groups in this nation that do want to ensure that others > are "kept down" and suppressed. > Like the IRS. B. -Cameron -- Cameron Childress Sumo Consulting Inc http://www.sumoc.com --- cell: 67

Re: On Anti-Mortar Weapons

2008-05-06 Thread Cameron Childress
Yeah, it looks like that's the case to me as well. The explosion seems to come from the base of the mortar launcher. I do find it very interesting that certain weapons fire sources can be triangulated, but the comment that it requires three rounds fired is puzzling in this day of high technology.

Re: Hey Rick, how bout them tigers?

2008-05-06 Thread Rick Root
On Mon, May 5, 2008 at 8:42 AM, G Money <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Great game yesterday, eh? > > Sorrybut I'm actively rooting against the Tigersthe Yankees of the > central division. > Fuck. Leave me alone. =) ~| Ad