Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-13 Thread Nick Treleaven via Digitalmars-d
On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 at 13:43:20 UTC, user1234 wrote: On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 20:14:17 UTC, Meta wrote: The functionality is probably a good idea, but a library solution is doable today without any acrobatics. Show me a library solution that works fine with IDE completion (so for

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-13 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 13 November 2017 at 14:44:55 UTC, Nick Treleaven wrote: The commenting out case can be prevented by making ?: an actual operator, so ?/**/: would be an error. Yes, that sounds reasonable. (Also I think it's regressive to argue invalid code becoming valid is a good reason to prevent

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-13 Thread Nick Treleaven via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 05:20:39 UTC, codephantom wrote: I just saw this about the new 'damnit' operator, for C# 8. https://github.com/dotnet/csharplang/issues/556 The principle is a good one - by default you cannot dereference something that can be null, you get a compiler error ins

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-13 Thread Nick Treleaven via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 13:02:43 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote: On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 10:12:11 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: All it does is take the expression x ? x : y and make it x ?: y Yes, that is an issue because it means that typos no longer are caught. E.g. if you acc

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-12 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Sunday, 12 November 2017 at 16:47:02 UTC, bauss wrote: I told you once and I'll tell you twice. I'm definitely not a MSFT fan boy. The only thing I have in my development environment that's related to MS is their linker from Visual Studio, but I don't have anything else installed from VS.

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-12 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Sunday, 12 November 2017 at 16:47:02 UTC, bauss wrote: I told you once and I'll tell you twice. I'm definitely not a MSFT fan boy. Well, you were pretty quick to jump into the middle of a conversation, just to have a long..drawn outgo at me, because I had some critical comments to s

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-12 Thread bauss via Digitalmars-d
On Sunday, 12 November 2017 at 04:40:21 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Sunday, 12 November 2017 at 01:00:46 UTC, bauss wrote: I'm tired so I will end my post here. And I'm going to end all my posts here, cause I'm sick of arguing with MSFT fanboys, who want to restrain D's development by tying i

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-12 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Sunday, 12 November 2017 at 08:59:05 UTC, Satoshi wrote: It's for you! https://i.imgur.com/NNgrSyP.png If you're actually taking bets on that...then put me down for $10_000.00 on the MSFT fanbois that is ;-) Nice stuff with Trinix. I'll cross you off my list of fanboys...for now.

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-12 Thread Satoshi via Digitalmars-d
It's for you! https://i.imgur.com/NNgrSyP.png

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-12 Thread Satoshi via Digitalmars-d
On Sunday, 12 November 2017 at 08:33:34 UTC, Satoshi wrote: I'm going to start focusing my attention on rewriting (some) of FreeBSD userland, using D ..and see what happens. (btw. such programs can easily be migrated to Linux/OSX too...or the new 'System D' ..when it arrives ;-) You should s

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-12 Thread Satoshi via Digitalmars-d
On Sunday, 12 November 2017 at 04:40:21 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Sunday, 12 November 2017 at 01:00:46 UTC, bauss wrote: I'm tired so I will end my post here. And I'm going to end all my posts here, cause I'm sick of arguing with MSFT fanboys, who want to restrain D's development by tying i

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-12 Thread Satoshi via Digitalmars-d
On Sunday, 12 November 2017 at 03:25:47 UTC, codephantom wrote: But everyone wants a more modular, more refined, more modern, more secure operating system ...and a more secure systems programming language. How rewriting Linux from scratch will enhance security of the OS? By introducing more

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Sunday, 12 November 2017 at 01:00:46 UTC, bauss wrote: I'm tired so I will end my post here. And I'm going to end all my posts here, cause I'm sick of arguing with MSFT fanboys, who want to restrain D's development by tying it into propriatery, closed source, bloatware. I'm going to star

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 12:53:46 UTC, Satoshi wrote: Yeah, stop duplicating what's out there and start writing similar software what already exists. Sounds great. And every man, women... and their 2 dogs...are targetting mobile, web, cloud these days. The idea that D is going to com

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Sunday, 12 November 2017 at 01:00:46 UTC, bauss wrote: On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 05:20:39 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 05:23:53 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: MSFT spends a LOT of time studying these things. It would be wise to learn for free from the money they s

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Sunday, 12 November 2017 at 01:00:46 UTC, bauss wrote: and btw. if you had gone back a few threads (instead of just jumping into a conversation to just have a go at me), then you'd know that it all started because i attempted to inject some humour into the converstation, and used a youtube v

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Sunday, 12 November 2017 at 01:00:46 UTC, bauss wrote: and btw. if you had gone back a few threads (instead of just jumping into a conversation to just have a go at me), then you'd know that it all started because i attempted to inject some humour into the converstation, and used a youtube v

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Sunday, 12 November 2017 at 01:00:46 UTC, bauss wrote: I'm tired so I will end my post here. Great contribution btw. I might actually read it when i have nothing else to do...which will be a long way off...

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread bauss via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 23:14:50 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 11:19:39 UTC, Satoshi wrote: You are judging C#, but looks where is D and where is C#. Where is C#? In about 50% of the corporations doing enterprise programming. - good luck porting it to othe

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 12:53:46 UTC, Satoshi wrote: Yeah, stop duplicating what's out there and start writing similar software what already exists. Sounds great. Where is the secure, modular operating system, written in a safe language? And a language that you can use for the res

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 12:53:46 UTC, Satoshi wrote: Yeah, stop duplicating what's out there and start writing similar software what already exists. Sounds great. Dude.. I can only assume you're very young. Why do you think C took off as it did? It wasn't because people spent hours

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 16:45:11 UTC, 12345swordy wrote: On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 02:34:11 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 01:37:01 UTC, 12345swordy wrote: You should take your own advice first, when you insult other people by calling them "Microsoft fa

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread 12345swordy via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 02:34:11 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 01:37:01 UTC, 12345swordy wrote: You should take your own advice first, when you insult other people by calling them "Microsoft fanboys". Take your snark somewhere else. I'm just dishing out wha

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread 12345swordy via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 02:30:50 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 01:37:01 UTC, 12345swordy wrote: A supported and very popular language. Seriously in it the top ten popular language list for a good reason. You should google it. I don't have to google it. I've

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread Andre Pany via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 11:18:24 UTC, codephantom wrote: Yeah, integrating gui's into a programming language is complexthere are some gui kits for D in github, but none I find compelling at this stage - even though they're authors are doing a great job. It's not that it's too com

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread Satoshi via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 11:18:24 UTC, codephantom wrote: I'd like D to think bigger than just duplicating what's out there, and being 'compatible' with this and that operating system - or just be marketed as a quicker way to compile your slow c++ code. I'd wouldn't mind seeing a n

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread rikki cattermole via Digitalmars-d
On 11/11/2017 11:18 AM, codephantom wrote: On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 09:47:32 UTC, Patrick Schluter wrote: Indeed, the strength of D is that it is portable among the big platforms remaining. One of its drawbacks can be seen somehow as an asset. Its lack of preferred GUI kit means that it

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 09:47:32 UTC, Patrick Schluter wrote: Indeed, the strength of D is that it is portable among the big platforms remaining. One of its drawbacks can be seen somehow as an asset. Its lack of preferred GUI kit means that it is not intimately bound to the user interf

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-11 Thread Patrick Schluter via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 03:49:24 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 01:37:01 UTC, 12345swordy wrote: You should take your own advice first, when you insult other people by calling them "Microsoft fanboys". Take your snark somewhere else. and btw. if you had gone

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 05:23:53 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: MSFT spends a LOT of time studying these things. It would be wise to learn for free from the money they spent. I just saw this about the new 'damnit' operator, for C# 8. https://github.com/dotnet/csharplang/issues/556 I thought i

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 05:23:53 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: MSFT spends a LOT of time studying these things. It would be wise to learn for free from the money they spent. This is valid MSFT code, I believe: A?.B?.C?[0] ?? E A?.B?.C?[0] == E I have been coding on and off, since 1992, in va

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 01:37:01 UTC, 12345swordy wrote: You should take your own advice first, when you insult other people by calling them "Microsoft fanboys". Take your snark somewhere else. and btw. if you had gone back a few threads (instead of just jumping into a conversation t

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 01:37:01 UTC, 12345swordy wrote: best'), or ('cause the language I'm used to using has it'). You should take your own advice first, when you insult other people by calling them "Microsoft fanboys". Take your snark somewhere else. Any opinion/idea offered by so

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 01:37:01 UTC, 12345swordy wrote: You should take your own advice first, when you insult other people by calling them "Microsoft fanboys". Take your snark somewhere else. I'm just dishing out what they've been doing to me, simply cause I dared to critcise somet

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 11 November 2017 at 01:37:01 UTC, 12345swordy wrote: A supported and very popular language. Seriously in it the top ten popular language list for a good reason. You should google it. I don't have to google it. I've been using it for 17 years. - VS.NET does most of the coding for

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread 12345swordy via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 23:14:50 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 11:19:39 UTC, Satoshi wrote: You are judging C#, but looks where is D and where is C#. Where is C#? A supported and very popular language. Seriously in it the top ten popular language list for a go

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 11:19:39 UTC, Satoshi wrote: You are judging C#, but looks where is D and where is C#. Where is C#? - good luck porting it to other (non MS, non .NET environments). - performance of large code bases can often be sluggish - VS.NET does most of the coding for you.

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread Nathan S. via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 12:25:06 UTC, Biotronic wrote: I find I often use this in C# with a more complex expression on the left-hand side, like a function call. A quick search shows more than 2/3 of my uses are function calls or otherwise significantly more complex than a variable. Also,

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 19:59:29 UTC, meppl wrote: I wonder what Mr. Bright and Mr. Alexandrescu would say about the request to implement both, `??` and `?:`. Seriously? Implement both? I'm really not sure whether that's just meant to be humour or what. The first things that should b

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 14:37:13 UTC, bauss wrote: On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 12:48:53 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 12:42:55 UTC, Satoshi wrote: 99% of Windows users couldn't find how to do basic stuff in Linux .. yeah.. imagine if I had said that...all he

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread Patrick Schluter via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 19:59:29 UTC, meppl wrote: On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 05:23:53 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: On 11/6/17 12:20, Michael wrote: I can't quite see why this proposal is such a big deal to people - as has been restated, it's just a quick change in the parser for a sligh

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread meppl via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 05:23:53 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: On 11/6/17 12:20, Michael wrote: I can't quite see why this proposal is such a big deal to people - as has been restated, it's just a quick change in the parser for a slight contraction in the code, and nothing language-breaking, i

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread Michael via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 05:23:53 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: On 11/6/17 12:20, Michael wrote: [...] You're right, I didn't, that was intentional, because sometimes people write things like that. And it took a while for anyone to say anything about it. That is my point. But that's the th

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread bauss via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 12:48:53 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 12:42:55 UTC, Satoshi wrote: 99% of Windows users couldn't find how to do basic stuff in Linux .. yeah.. imagine if I had said that...all hell would have broken loose. And 99% of Linux users don't

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 10:51:28 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: Based on other posts that you've made, you seem interested in bashing anything related to Windows or Microsoft, and that really isn't productive when we're trying to have a technical discussion. - Jonathan M Davis And I se

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 12:51:04 UTC, codephantom wrote: So making a joke about MSFT excuses you and others to start bashing on me? Really. That is more of a joke. ohh..anyone don't know what MSFT fanboy is? https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Microsoft%20Fanboy

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 12:42:55 UTC, Satoshi wrote: You didn't say anything negative about MSFT you just start making jokes about it. Then get rect and start crying and saying you did not troll. I'm not MSFT fanboy, I just find some of the C# features useful, nothing more. So making

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 12:42:55 UTC, Satoshi wrote: 99% of Windows users couldn't find how to do basic stuff in Linux .. yeah.. imagine if I had said that...all hell would have broken loose.

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 12:42:55 UTC, Satoshi wrote: You didn't say anything negative about MSFT you just start making jokes about it. ok. note taken. no jokes about msft allowed on D forums. got it. thanks for your input Satoshi.

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread Satoshi via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 12:27:22 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 11:55:52 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: [...] Well, you just got it wrong, and your comments were unfair, and actually, your comment were 'bashing' on me! I simply used a humourous youtube video, as

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 12:23:06 UTC, Satoshi wrote: I'm comparing C# to D because D is trying to do the same stuff as C#. GUI development and website development. I used vibe.d, I used ASP.NET core and I'm still missing some C# features in D. So I'm sharing my experience and expectation

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 11:55:52 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: I "had a go at you," because it seemed like you were bashing on Adam for suggesting that we look at what C# had done and what research Microsoft had done simply because it was Microsoft that had done it. You have been bashing

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread Satoshi via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 12:06:42 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 11:45:25 UTC, Satoshi wrote: How many corporations is using D right now? 10? Windows is still dominant OS and there are a lot of job opportunities for C#. D is unusable for startups or corporations

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 11:45:25 UTC, Satoshi wrote: How many corporations is using D right now? 10? Windows is still dominant OS and there are a lot of job opportunities for C#. D is unusable for startups or corporations where are junior programmers hired anyway because it's too comp

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 11:45:25 UTC, Satoshi wrote: Nobody is trying to silent you, you just started trolling there. Bullshit! I tried to inject some humour into the discussion. I thought that was pretty self-evident. The MSFT fanboys on these forums, which seem to completely lack

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread Jonathan M Davis via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, November 10, 2017 11:39:48 codephantom via Digitalmars-d wrote: > On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 10:51:28 UTC, Jonathan M Davis > > wrote: > > Shooting down an idea just because it comes from Microsoft (or > > any other company) rather than judging it on its technical > > merits is just

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread Satoshi via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 11:26:41 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 11:19:39 UTC, Satoshi wrote: You are judging C# Umm... I have 17y in C# programming. Was one of the first to take it up. Have designed/developed apps for large corporates. Umm... My old colleague

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 10:51:28 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: Shooting down an idea just because it comes from Microsoft (or any other company) rather than judging it on its technical merits is just bad policy. Ideas should be judged based on their own merit, not simply on where they cam

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 11:19:39 UTC, Satoshi wrote: You are judging C# Umm... I have 17y in C# programming. Was one of the first to take it up. Have designed/developed apps for large corporates. Yet, I switched from C# to D. I don't think looking to MSFT for programming language ad

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread Satoshi via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 11:12:38 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 10:51:28 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: we're trying to have a technical discussion. - Jonathan M Davis And will someone please tell me, where is technical benefit of putting this crap (?: or ??) int

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 10:51:28 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: we're trying to have a technical discussion. - Jonathan M Davis And will someone please tell me, where is technical benefit of putting this crap (?: or ??) into a programming language? After 8 pages of people rambling on a

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread Satoshi via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 08:24:59 UTC, codephantom wrote: On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 05:23:53 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: MSFT spends a LOT of time studying these things. It would be wise to learn for free from the money they spent. Is that the same company that made Windows 10? Not ju

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 10:51:28 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: Shooting down an idea just because it comes from Microsoft (or any other company) rather than judging it on its technical merits is just bad policy. Ideas should be judged based on their own merit, not simply on where they cam

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 10:51:28 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: merit, not simply on where they came from. Based on other posts that you've made, you seem interested in bashing anything related to Windows or Microsoft, and that really isn't productive when we're trying to have a technica

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread Jonathan M Davis via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, November 10, 2017 10:36:01 codephantom via Digitalmars-d wrote: > On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 10:24:01 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: > > And what? > > This Windows 10. > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHG6fXEba0A > > You want us to look the MSFT on how things should be done?? In general

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 10:24:01 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: And what? This Windows 10. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHG6fXEba0A You want us to look the MSFT on how things should be done??

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread Adam Wilson via Digitalmars-d
On 11/10/17 00:24, codephantom wrote: On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 05:23:53 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: MSFT spends a LOT of time studying these things. It would be wise to learn for free from the money they spent. Is that the same company that made Windows 10? And what? -- Adam Wilson IRC: L

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-10 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 10 November 2017 at 05:23:53 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: MSFT spends a LOT of time studying these things. It would be wise to learn for free from the money they spent. Is that the same company that made Windows 10?

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-09 Thread Adam Wilson via Digitalmars-d
On 11/6/17 12:20, Michael wrote: I can't quite see why this proposal is such a big deal to people - as has been restated, it's just a quick change in the parser for a slight contraction in the code, and nothing language-breaking, it's not a big change to the language at all. On Monday, 6 Novembe

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-08 Thread jmh530 via Digitalmars-d
On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 at 07:32:05 UTC, aberba wrote: I have gone through all the threads and none of the comment argues why we REALLY need Elvis in D. Seem to me like some kind of "language peer influence" or something. It can be done as a library and using ternary works (more expre

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-08 Thread codephantom via Digitalmars-d
On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 at 07:32:05 UTC, aberba wrote: I have gone through all the threads and none of the comment argues why we REALLY need Elvis in D. Seem to me like some kind of "language peer influence" or something. Presumably, it's just a more 'elegant' (less verbose) way of

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-07 Thread aberba via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 10:12:11 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: On Monday, November 06, 2017 09:26:24 Satoshi via Digitalmars-d wrote: [...] _Everything_ that is added to the language complicates it further. It's one more thing that everyone learning the language has to learn and know an

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-07 Thread Meta via Digitalmars-d
On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 at 13:43:20 UTC, user1234 wrote: On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 20:14:17 UTC, Meta wrote: [...] import std.stdio; writeln(safeDeref(tree).right.right.val.orElse(-1)); writeln(safeDeref(tree).left.right.left.right.orElse(null)); writeln(safeDeref(tree).left.right.left.r

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-07 Thread bauss via Digitalmars-d
On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 at 17:37:42 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote: On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 at 17:27:30 UTC, bauss wrote: Which this operator has already proven to be in other successful languages. Not exactly this variation, but I get your point. On the other hand, so has hundreds of

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-07 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad via Digitalmars-d
On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 at 17:27:30 UTC, bauss wrote: Which this operator has already proven to be in other successful languages. Not exactly this variation, but I get your point. On the other hand, so has hundreds of other operators from other languages... So which one should one not imp

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-07 Thread bauss via Digitalmars-d
On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 at 16:32:50 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote: On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 at 14:08:07 UTC, bauss wrote: I think we have a problem in this community to always bash down things with "It can be solved as a library.", "I don't see the value of this being added.", "I'm not

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-07 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad via Digitalmars-d
On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 at 14:08:07 UTC, bauss wrote: I think we have a problem in this community to always bash down things with "It can be solved as a library.", "I don't see the value of this being added.", "I'm not going to use this feature, so nobody else will." It is considered good

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-07 Thread jmh530 via Digitalmars-d
On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 at 14:08:07 UTC, bauss wrote: [snip] However there's another idiom to D, which is what I'll call the "high-level" idiom which is mostly people writing applications with libraries such as vibe.d, which heavily relies on classes and reference types passed around, rat

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-07 Thread bauss via Digitalmars-d
On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 at 13:36:19 UTC, Atila Neves wrote: On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 19:13:59 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: On 10/28/17 04:38, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: [...] C# has extensive experience with this operator and I think it would be wise to study the history of what they di

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-07 Thread user1234 via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 20:14:17 UTC, Meta wrote: [...] import std.stdio; writeln(safeDeref(tree).right.right.val.orElse(-1)); writeln(safeDeref(tree).left.right.left.right.orElse(null)); writeln(safeDeref(tree).left.right.left.right.val.orElse(-1)); vs. writeln(tree?. right?.right?.val ?

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-07 Thread Atila Neves via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 19:13:59 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: On 10/28/17 04:38, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: [...] C# has extensive experience with this operator and I think it would be wise to study the history of what they did and why the did it. NOTE: I understand that other languages ha

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-07 Thread Dejan Lekic via Digitalmars-d
On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 at 09:42:50 UTC, Satoshi wrote: I strongly agree with you. As I wrote earlier int this thread. Kotlin has the `?.` operator for the same reason. I honestly can't think of a more obvious operator for that purpose...

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-07 Thread Satoshi via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 19:13:59 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: On 10/28/17 04:38, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: [...] C# has extensive experience with this operator and I think it would be wise to study the history of what they did and why the did it. NOTE: I understand that other languages ha

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-06 Thread Michael via Digitalmars-d
I can't quite see why this proposal is such a big deal to people - as has been restated, it's just a quick change in the parser for a slight contraction in the code, and nothing language-breaking, it's not a big change to the language at all. On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 19:13:59 UTC, Adam Wi

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-06 Thread Meta via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 19:55:13 UTC, Jacob Carlborg wrote: On 2017-11-06 20:40, Dmitry Olshansky wrote: I’d argue this NOT what we want. Nullability is best captured in the typesystem even if in the form of Nullable!T. Yeah, it would be better if the elvis operator good integrate with

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-06 Thread Jacob Carlborg via Digitalmars-d
On 2017-11-06 20:40, Dmitry Olshansky wrote: I’d argue this NOT what we want. Nullability is best captured in the typesystem even if in the form of Nullable!T. Yeah, it would be better if the elvis operator good integrate with a nullable/option type as well in addition to null. -- /Jacob Ca

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-06 Thread Dmitry Olshansky via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 19:13:59 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: On 10/28/17 04:38, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: Walter and I decided to kick-off project Elvis for adding the homonym operator to D. Razvan Nitu has already done a good part of the work: https://github.com/dlang/dmd/pull/7242 https

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-06 Thread Adam Wilson via Digitalmars-d
On 10/28/17 04:38, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: Walter and I decided to kick-off project Elvis for adding the homonym operator to D. Razvan Nitu has already done a good part of the work: https://github.com/dlang/dmd/pull/7242 https://github.com/dlang/dlang.org/pull/1917 https://github.com/dlang

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-06 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 10:12:11 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: All it does is take the expression x ? x : y and make it x ?: y Yes, that is an issue because it means that typos no longer are caught. E.g. if you accidentally comment out or delete the second expression. Which is why I

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-06 Thread Biotronic via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 10:12:11 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: x ? x : y and make it x ?: y It saves 2 characters plus the length of the variable name. That's it. I find I often use this in C# with a more complex expression on the left-hand side, like a function call. A quick search s

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-06 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu via Digitalmars-d
On 11/05/2017 07:20 PM, Neia Neutuladh wrote: On Saturday, 28 October 2017 at 11:38:52 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: Walter and I decided to kick-off project Elvis for adding the homonym operator to D. It's easy to write in function form:   auto orElse(T)(T a, lazy T b)   {     ret

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-06 Thread Jonathan M Davis via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, November 06, 2017 09:26:24 Satoshi via Digitalmars-d wrote: > Look, this operator does not break anything. If you don't want to > use it, just don't, but why do you force everyone else to not to > use it, just because it is not adding anything "more valuable" > than just better syntax?

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-06 Thread Satoshi via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 08:06:54 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: On Monday, November 06, 2017 07:10:43 bauss via Digitalmars-d wrote: On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 00:20:09 UTC, Neia Neutuladh wrote: > On Saturday, 28 October 2017 at 11:38:52 UTC, Andrei > > Alexandrescu wrote: >> [...] > >

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-06 Thread Jonathan M Davis via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, November 06, 2017 07:10:43 bauss via Digitalmars-d wrote: > On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 00:20:09 UTC, Neia Neutuladh wrote: > > On Saturday, 28 October 2017 at 11:38:52 UTC, Andrei > > > > Alexandrescu wrote: > >> Walter and I decided to kick-of

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-05 Thread bauss via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 6 November 2017 at 00:20:09 UTC, Neia Neutuladh wrote: On Saturday, 28 October 2017 at 11:38:52 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: Walter and I decided to kick-off project Elvis for adding the homonym operator to D. It's easy to write in function form: auto orElse(T)(T a, laz

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-05 Thread Neia Neutuladh via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 28 October 2017 at 11:38:52 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: Walter and I decided to kick-off project Elvis for adding the homonym operator to D. It's easy to write in function form: auto orElse(T)(T a, lazy T b) { return a ? a : b; } writeln(args[1].length.o

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-05 Thread MrSmith via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 30 October 2017 at 19:46:54 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: I see from comments that different people think of it in a different way. I suggest them to read this section from Kotlin docs to understand the reasoning behind the elvis operator. The principle of least astonishment indic

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-02 Thread Jonathan M Davis via Digitalmars-d
On Thursday, November 02, 2017 09:46:06 H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote: > On Thu, Nov 02, 2017 at 12:50:47PM +, Nick Treleaven via Digitalmars-d > wrote: [..] > > > I'd like to mention null-coalescing assignment syntax. Perl has `$a > > //= $b`, and PHP has voted to support `$a ??= $b`, exp

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-02 Thread H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d
On Thu, Nov 02, 2017 at 12:50:47PM +, Nick Treleaven via Digitalmars-d wrote: [..] > I'd like to mention null-coalescing assignment syntax. Perl has `$a > //= $b`, and PHP has voted to support `$a ??= $b`, expanding to `$a = > $a ?? $b`. [...] > I expect D could do the same with `a ?:= b` or u

Re: Project Elvis

2017-11-02 Thread Nick Treleaven via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 28 October 2017 at 11:38:52 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: Walter and I decided to kick-off project Elvis for adding the homonym operator to D. I'd like to mention null-coalescing assignment syntax. Perl has `$a //= $b`, and PHP has voted to support `$a ??= $b`, expandin

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