Re: [FRIAM] Movement vs. Behavior, and what's in the Black Box

On 5/13/20 1:14 PM, thompnicks...@gmail.com wrote: > Thus my suspicion about some of the argument going on between EricC and Glen > is equivocation concerning what it is that is behaving, not disagreement > about whether behavior is going on. Maybe. But for my part, I'm arguing that the questi

Re: [FRIAM] Movement vs. Behavior, and what's in the Black Box

On 5/13/20 12:56 PM, Steven A Smith wrote: > On 5/13/20 11:58 AM, uǝlƃ ☣ wrote: >> The boundary is a cut-point in that medium. There might be many possible >> cut-points. > Agreed.  And similarly many possible levels of aggregation of the graph > of object-object relations?

Re: [FRIAM] Movement vs. Behavior, and what's in the Black Box

On 5/13/20 11:17 AM, Steven A Smith wrote: > I'm not sure why you need to suggest (sarcastically?) that the choice of > words don't matter (if that is what you are suggesting and in that > tone?).   Maybe I'm missing something.  HAD you (or Eric) used > IggityBiggity, I think it would have really t

Re: [FRIAM] Movement vs. Behavior, and what's in the Black Box

Excellent idea! "Bracket[ed|ing]" is a great term. I worry a bit about relying too much on jargon, since I think the mapping I'm trying to make (from deep, thinking human to shallow passive circuit element like a copper wire) might get lost in that jargon. For example, talking about the brackete

Re: [FRIAM] Movement vs. Behavior, and what's in the Black Box

Of course. Sorry for *hiding* it. But when I said one "changing color" isn't different from another "changing color", I was focusing on color changes. That's why I said the full clause "changing color" after both examples. I'm sorry for not trying to make that more clear... maybe all caps ... or

Re: [FRIAM] Movement vs. Behavior, and what's in the Black Box

EricC introduced the word "visible". I'm fine with it. Y'all can use whatever word you choose. Iggitybiggity would be just as fine. My choice is "hidden". I *also* reject the concept of "interiority", as I infer it. There is only the boundary between the seer and the seen, the measurer and the m

Re: [FRIAM] Movement vs. Behavior, and what's in the Black Box

There is no need to distinguish between behavior and non-behavior movement. It's a distraction. That's part of my position in this discussion. To play fair, though, I'll take your example of the live vs. dead duck. I don't care whether the duck is alive or dead. I don't distinguish between dead

Re: [FRIAM] Movement vs. Behavior, and what's in the Black Box

I think Jon's contribution (and my response) argue that the entire space can be spanned by such domain specifiers. So, I don't think we're dealing with borderline examples, only examples that demonstrate the spanning. I don't think agree with Holt's criteria for distinguishing behavior from mov

Re: [FRIAM] the end of the pandemic

I understand. But remember that I care very little about the person wearing (or not) a helmet. I care *much* more about the other drivers, the ambulance, healthcare costs (of both dead and not-dead), etc. What that implies is that I don't care very much about the stories from MEs or EMTs, etc. W

Re: [FRIAM] Movement vs. Behavior, and what's in the Black Box

Yes, you're right. Scale is merely one parameter by which the domain can be shifted. The only problem is that "domain" is a pretty abstract concept. So choosing a concrete example (like scale) helps move the discussion along without getting too caught up in the generalization. This bears directl

Re: [FRIAM] the end of the pandemic

Aha! Excellent point! That viruses are parasites might be a critical issue, though. What do viruses really do for us? It's less a matter of whether they feel pain and more about parasitism. I hesitate to google "ethics of parasitism". On 5/12/20 9:53 AM, Steven A Smith wrote: > and Virii?  Don'

Re: [FRIAM] the end of the pandemic

Ha! Well, these analogies do break down. So "precisely the same way" doesn't really work. For example, I think you'd be hard pressed to say that the costs associated with obesity are "precisely the same" as the costs associated with cleaning your smashed body off the road. I continue to argue f

Re: [FRIAM] Movement vs. Behavior, and what's in the Black Box

OK. Thanks. I'll try again. It's not the movement of the water that concerns me as much of the movement of the *cells* that cause the movement of the water. If we can credibly talk about pond scum behaving, then we can talk about a) individual cellular behavior and b) tissue behavior. This is w

Re: [FRIAM] the end of the pandemic

The contrary argument was made to me by my dad, who called himself a "Goldwater Conservative", was that when you end up as a blood smear all over the highway or all smashed up against a tree, *someone* has to clean that sh¡t up. Factor in, further, rubbernecking, the possibility of children seei

Re: [FRIAM] the end of the pandemic

This is clearly wrong. People go berserk on a regular basis over various injustices (the strangling of black men, lynching of trans people, bankruptcy from healthcare bills, losing one's home because they got laid off, living in a tent on the highway with 3 children, choosing between rent and fo

Re: [FRIAM] the end of the pandemic

On 5/11/20 9:11 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > Compared to what? Confluence or Slack?One problem I have with the > former is that web-based editing is still spongy, slow and arbitrarily > different from a real editor.Slack still lacks nestable threads and > encourages shallow, synchronou

Re: [FRIAM] the end of the pandemic

Among the many reasons email is obsolete is the ability of other tools to "pin" a post so that it's easily found later on. In principle, the Mailman list page could do this. But it's comparatively awkward. Piling more into the footer can play the same role, but since few posters clean up their p

Re: [FRIAM] Movement vs. Behavior, and what's in the Black Box

Oh never mind. Forget I ever participated. On 5/10/20 10:36 AM, thompnicks...@gmail.com wrote: > Ok. Glen. Please, what the dickens is an "internal" state? And, once I > become aware of it, does it become external? -- ☣ uǝlƃ .-. .- -. -.. --- -- -..-. -.. --- - ... -..-. .- -. -.. -..-. -

Re: [FRIAM] Movement vs. Behavior, and what's in the Black Box

Hm. Well, I've been talking about hidden states the whole time. So, I suppose you're simply not talking to me, despite having mentioned things I've said and using my name in some posts. I'll bow out. On 5/10/20 1:44 PM, Eric Charles wrote: > I offered the dead-duck vs the live-duck and Weekend a

Re: [FRIAM] Movement vs. Behavior, and what's in the Black Box

Ha! Well, by ignoring the poignant example, you've ignored my entire point. And it's that point by which I can't agree with the unmoored distinction you're making. The celery example isn't about being alive. Sorry for injecting that into it. The celery example is about *scale*. Celery's movement

Re: [FRIAM] a model of mine about virus diffusion

Very cool, Pietro! I used the HardFinishLockdown button and saw a nice uptick. Maybe I missed it, but it would be nice to have a parameter to stop the lockdown similar to the one for starting the lockdown, so I wouldn't have to babysit it and hit the button. 8^) (Also, I used Netlogo 6.0.1 so i

[FRIAM] desmos.com

I feel sure some of you know about this: https://www.desmos.com/calculator/2qmzul3mj5 I cling to a copy of the CRC Standard Curves and Surfaces ... like a sweaty bible-thumper. My last copy was *STOLEN* by some evil-doer at the dot com I was working at back in 2001 or so ... lowered my faith

Re: [FRIAM] Tonight We Riot!

I wonder at the type of triggers a game like this sets off. Clearly I don't have the same trigger you have. But I would challenge that the metaphor of antidote::Pandemic Resilience is a bad one. A more appropriate metaphor would be analgesic::Pandemic Resilience ... or maybe even anesthetic::Pa

Re: [FRIAM] What Is the Real Coronavirus Toll in Each State? - The New York Times

I disagree, of course. >8^D I think dividing out population and area are a misguiding distraction. The simple slopes are better. As we've discussed ad nauseum, these "normalizers" are *also* models. And all models are always wrong. So, for every derivation, you're stacking wrongness upon wrongne

Re: [FRIAM] First draft of new book

Woohoo! Congrats! No index, yet? Are indices semi-automated these days? ... like with word cloud algorithms? On 5/8/20 7:47 AM, j...@cas-group.net wrote: > I have finished a first draft of my new book today, it is still full of typos > but at least I have finished a first version now ( that fee

[FRIAM] Tonight We Riot!

https://tonightweriot.com/ > tonight we riot is a revolutionary crowd brawler about worker liberation and > lobbing molotovs at mech suits & crazy bosses! -- ☣ uǝlƃ .-. .- -. -.. --- -- -..-. -.. --- - ... -..-. .- -. -.. -..-. -.. .- ... . ... FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoo

Re: [FRIAM] (no subject)

For some reason, the link to Gorski's debunking is messed up in that article. I had to go looking for it: https://respectfulinsolence.com/2020/05/06/judy-mikovits-pandemic/ You *forced* me to watch Plandemic, too. I'll never get that time back. 8^D On 5/7/20 3:46 PM, Roger Critchlow wrote: > T

[FRIAM] “Sherlock Testing in One Pot.”

New CRISPR-based test for Covid-19 could be a simple, cheap at-home diagnostic, scientists say https://www.statnews.com/2020/05/05/crispr-covid-19-test-could-be-simple-cheap-at-home-diagnostic/ > STOP stands for “Sherlock Testing in One Pot.” It builds on Zhang’s 2017 > CRISPR invention, called

Re: [FRIAM] What Is the Real Coronavirus Toll in Each State? - The New York Times

I don't think so. Doubling time (under non-ideal lockdown conditions) conflates density with the other measures. If a sparsely populated area has the same doubling time as a densely populated area, the doubling time graph might gloss over how *badly* the sparsely populated area is doing in contr

Re: [FRIAM] What Is the Real Coronavirus Toll in Each State? - The New York Times

Well, there's this one. But there's still an enrollment bias: https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04334954?term=serosurvey&cond=covid-19&draw=2&rank=1 I suspect a truly random sampling for either drawing blood or sticking a swab up your nose is a bit difficult ... maybe a bit less irritating

Re: [FRIAM] What Is the Real Coronavirus Toll in Each State? - The New York Times

y seat is Gainesville. > > > > https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/national/coronavirus-us-cases-deaths/ >  provides maps of deaths and cases per county, raw numbers and per 10 > population.  > > -- rec -- > > > > On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 3:18 PM

Re: [FRIAM] What Is the Real Coronavirus Toll in Each State? - The New York Times

Hall: 20,441 DeKalb: 759,297 On 5/6/20 12:08 PM, thompnicks...@gmail.com wrote: > Glen, those Hall/King comparisons are pretty dramatic.  Go Kemp! What is the > population of the two counties?  -- ☣ uǝlƃ .-. .- -. -.. --- -- -..-. -.. --- - ... -..-. .- -. -.. -..-. -.. .- ... . ... FRIA

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

Well, this goes back to the branch Jochen started a long time ago regarding path dependence and the hard problem. The question I asked was how do we partition the state? Some goes inside the *body*, some goes outside the body. I'd argue they're both stigmergic. It's obvious why the state accumul

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

On 5/6/20 6:37 AM, uǝlƃ ☣ wrote: > There's a paper by Shalizi or Crutchfield, maybe, that talks about tradeoffs > between space and time in computation that I'm pretty sure was posted on this > list at some point. That type of evaluation criteria applied to both the > co

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

Excellent examples! For controlled experiments, though, I'd prefer to avoid testing subjects most people already think of as having an inside context ("inner world", experience-as, "what it's like to be a", etc. for anyone who might be triggered by the word "context" >8^). So, I wouldn't want to

Re: [FRIAM] Movement vs. Behavior, and what's in the Black Box

While lying in bed this morning, waiting patiently for the alarm to go off, moving nothing but whatever autonomous functions are required to keep me alive, I *struggled* to find a biological example of behavior that doesn't involve movement. The best I could come up with was the change in color

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

So, in state space reconstruction, it seems, we're attempting to infer a structure that is *as* expressive as the data we feed it, similar I guess to deep learning or genetic programming. All the sci-fi movies focus on the brain (or maybe even the CNS). But what I'd like to see is something like

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

Thanks. I've read the Chemero one. And I've read something by Hutto, but I don't think it was that. Regardless, my (maybe testable) hypothesis is what I'm interested in: If a black box demonstrates behavior that can't be captured by any (known) algorithm, then that would be an indication that s

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

I'm not sure what school I'm in. But neither of those positions seems right to me. I tend to believe in (quasi)cycles and flows. E.g. when I'm dreaming, my mind is inside me. When I'm engrossed in some activity, my mind is spread over both inside and outside ... as if the skin between me and the

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

Your interpretation is not quite what I would have said, but close enough. You're also right about what I meant by "black box". But the point I was making is that if we take EricC's principle seriously, then anything that goes on inside the box can be accurately and precisely "surmised" from ou

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

More word games. OK. s/world/context/g. Is that better? On 5/5/20 12:43 PM, thompnicks...@gmail.com wrote: > Oh. Isn't my 'world' that which surrounds me? Your world, that which > surrounds you? Etc. So for me to have an "inner world" I not only have to > climb inside me I have to climb insi

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

Not at all. Why? On 5/5/20 12:35 PM, thompnicks...@gmail.com wrote: > Careful. Isn't the formulation "inner world" entirely contradictory? -- ☣ uǝlƃ .-. .- -. -.. --- -- -..-. -.. --- - ... -..-. .- -. -.. -..-. -.. .- ... . ... FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

However, I think we can come up with a (maybe someday) testable hypothesis based on hidden states. In principle, if EricC's principle is taken seriously, the inner world of a black box device will be *completely* represented on its surface (ala the holographic principle). Any information not exh

Re: [FRIAM] Ranked Choice Voting app

Trolling gets a bad rap. I just finished this book: Hater, by John Semley https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/586135/hater-by-john-semley/ He does a very good job in a small book placing our modern (stigmatized) troll within the larger space of contrarians. And he talks about a lot of pop

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tempest_(codename) On 5/5/20 9:29 AM, thompnicks...@gmail.com wrote: > Can one do an EEG of a computer?  -- ☣ uǝlƃ .-. .- -. -.. --- -- -..-. -.. --- - ... -..-. .- -. -.. -..-. -.. .- ... . ... FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p M

Re: [FRIAM] Positively selected mutations

Thanks! So, is the implication that even after we get some one vaccine, it may not be very effective? Like the flu. The flu shot Renee' gets at the hospital include 4 strains, whereas the ones I get at my clinic have only 3. So, does this talk of a mutating spike imply something similar will be

Re: [FRIAM] NYT shows King going negative

I have no such doubt. I'm just making a lazy attempt to track the effects of reopening on the number of cases. I only posted this one to caution anyone who might tend to rely on any single data source. DeKalb (hosting Atlanta) and King (hosting Seattle) are a good contrast due to their density

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

This is analogous to starving one's dog, then pointing at the corpse and asking: What is this behavior y'all are ascribing to dogs? On 5/5/20 4:27 AM, Prof David West wrote: > How does a computer behave? Or, what is a computer's behavior? I am looking > at my computer - actually four of them (iP

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

I don't think this gets us anywhere. My claim is that whatever motivates Nick's insistence that metaphor is important to thought *is* a member of the class represented by the hard problem. If you *also* insist that metaphor is important to thought, yet you reject the hard problem, then I would

Re: [FRIAM] Fwd: Thesis Proposal - Dylan Fitzpatrick - Today - Monday, May 4 at 9am - via Zoom

I would hope, in the proposal, something was said about unintended feature detection, e.g. https://www.newstatesman.com/science-tech/2020/04/how-biased-algorithms-perpetuate-inequality On 5/4/20 1:19 PM, George Duncan wrote: > Most appropriate topic  > > > -- Forwarded message

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

Is it? You people can't help yourselves. It's compulsive. You might want to get some help for that. On 5/4/20 10:47 AM, Frank Wimberly wrote: > Choosing one's rifle is so concrete.  It makes me want to run out and blow > away a few cacti.  Oh, it's a metaphor! -- ☣ uǝlƃ .-. .- -. -.. --- -- -

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

Hm. I can't quite parse this, but don't want to ignore it. I'm not convinced that Chalmers' naturalistic dualism is at all different from Peirce's real/extant distinction. From that perspective, Chalmers' dualism and Nick's monism are irrelevant to whether or not Nick understands the hard probl

Re: [FRIAM] Ranked Choice Voting app

Well, the usual caveats apply. I really have no idea what I'm talking about. But that's never stopped me before. My intuition is given unlimited campaign funding (as free speech), really really long campaign seasons, and influence ops (ala Russia), 1st past the post 2 party systems foment false

[FRIAM] Ranked Choice Voting app

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Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

Then we have nothing more to argue about. You understand the hard problem. Maybe this thread can rest in peace, now. On 5/1/20 4:16 PM, thompnicks...@gmail.com wrote: > Absolutely.  If strong AI people are in the "quacks like a duck" school, than > I am a strong AI person. -- ☣ uǝlƃ .-. .- -.

Re: [FRIAM] At the limits of thought

See! Now I *have* to buy the Kindle copy of the Kernberg book, remove the DRM, and ascii-fy it, so I can feed it into megahal . Damn you people. On 5/1/20 4:03 PM, thompnicks...@gmail.com wrote: > Tiz Frabjious and the boregos did gyro gimbal in the mame. [...]

Re: [FRIAM] At the limits of thought

So Frank has been harassing me with psychobabble >8^D and during the course of it, I finally snapped and thought again about this paper: Experience Grounds Language https://arxiv.org/abs/2004.10151 The idea is that WS3 and higher *ground* the algorithm such that it's mechanism and output wi

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

Excellent! Now we're getting somewhere. So the problem of qualia and, say, whether or not we could build a machine that *enjoys* playing the piano, you fall in the camp of the strong-AI people. We can definitely build a machine that thinks and feels just like a human. Is that right? (Full discl

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

I don't know if it's any harder or not. That's above my pay grade. But I don't *have* to answer the question to understand the question. Chalmers et al are *asking* the question. Some of them speculate on the answer. Some don't speculate on the answer. You said you didn't understand the *problem

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

Ha! Again, you contradict yourself. You've said repeatedly that you haven't gained the computational skills you thought you might gain by engaging with the complexity club. So, it's *not* easy for you, even if you claim it is. I suppose we might say that, when first presented with a perspectiv

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

Excellent! So you *do* understand the hard problem. On 5/1/20 1:13 PM, thompnicks...@gmail.com wrote: > I can't see any substantive difference in our positions. ''So, let's just > say, for the purposes of argument that I'm right, and move on." -- ☣ uǝlƃ .-. .- -. -.. --- -- -..-. -.. --- -

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

On 5/1/20 8:41 AM, thompnicks...@gmail.com wrote: > First, remember, a proper monist shouldn't talk about his "stuff",whatever it > is, as if it is distinguishable from other "stuff",  because that is dualism, > full stop.  So I really shouldn’t be doing this at all. That's just nonsense. Even

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

I (kindasorta) agree with the /that/ below. But I disagree with Dave's explicit statement, which was: On 4/30/20 12:41 PM, Prof David West wrote: > We cannot use another (perhaps our internal awareness of being conscious) > instance of consciousness because we do not know/understand it either.

[FRIAM] climate change initiative open data portal

http://cci.esa.int/data/#dash -- ☣ uǝlƃ .-. .- -. -.. --- -- -..-. -.. --- - ... -..-. .- -. -.. -..-. -.. .- ... . ... FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com archives:

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

I described experience as a comprehension. Then you say it's not that sort of thing. Then you go on to describe experience as a comprehension. 8^) I guess the problem is that I'm relying too much on that jargon? You describe 2 types of comprehension: O∞) the object versus On) the observers of th

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

I've disagreed with this point before. So, I won't lay the whole thing out again. But I think we can and do model things we don't understand with other things we don't understand. We do this all the time. There are 2 main things that allow us to do this: 1) we understand, or imagine we understan

Re: [FRIAM] narcissism

That's a fantastic question! I can't answer. But I'll definitely start injecting that question into what I read. I have run across those communities that talk about techniques for increasing one's charisma, mostly in the context of trying to understand the alt-right, involuntary celibates, pick-

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

OK. Here's the setup: Nick says 1: Metaphorical thinker maps their experience onto another's experience, modeling that other's experience with their own. Nick says 2: I don't understand the hard problem of consciousness. Glen says: Expressions 1 and 2 are contradictory. I suppose it's on me to

Re: [FRIAM] narcissism

Excellent! Thanks. The context always helps. Re: below -- The research I'm seeing uses measurement tools like the Narcissistic Personality Index for grandiose types, the Pathological Narcissism Inventory, the HyperSensitive Narcissism Scale, etc. and correlates (postively or negatively) with va

Re: [FRIAM] narcissism

What little lit. I've seen so far argues that vulnerable narcissists don't tend to embark on difficult tasks. One paper argues they "self-handicap" so that they will never be in a position such that they fail. There are other "defensive" tactics as well. The paper argues that vulnerable types re

Re: [FRIAM] narcissism

Well, to be clear, the journal articles I've seen *indicate* that the grandiose one's don't suffer much. I wouldn't know one way or another. I'm just going off what I read in the articles. And I apologize in advance, but without *some* evidence in support of what you're saying, it's impossible

Re: [FRIAM] narcissism

On 4/29/20 12:51 PM, Frank Wimberly wrote: > https://youtu.be/DlopY4DfFV4 This one didn't seem to say anything about the 2 phenotypes. So it (obviously) can't help distinguish them, which means it can't help unify them. If one doesn't even recognize there could be a difference, then one can't un

Re: [FRIAM] narcissism

I have not read Kernberg's "Borderline Conditions and Pathological Narcissism". The kindle copy seems to be $75, which is out of my price range for almost any book. If the libraries open up soon, I can probably get my hands on a copy. Regardless, I *do*, right now, have access to almost every sc

Re: [FRIAM] narcissism

The evidence presented in Shröder-Abé et al does not support that. I worry about the authority with which you assert such things. At the very least, your lack of supporting evidence *prevents* me from doing any homework on my own that might support what you're saying. Everything I'm finding disa

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

But how do we process this statement by Nick: On 4/17/20 4:08 PM, thompnicks...@gmail.com wrote: > I think an obsessively metaphorical thinker is one who has the arrogance to > suppose that s/he has */some/* familiar experience by which s/he can model > any experience of another person. I actua

Re: [FRIAM] narcissism

Just FYI, you *forced* me to take another stupid personality test... I couldn't resist the link on that blog entry. It says I'm a good match for either INFP or INTP. At first, I was going to say there's no way in hell anyone would ever call me a "healer". But, then again, I got my first copy of

Re: [FRIAM] narcissism

It may look like analysis paralysis when one party simply restates their position with no more evidence each time. (Am not! Are too! Am not! ;^) But for my part, teasing out whether the narcissism is something we can actually use or not *is* an attempt to formulate plans of action. The question

Re: [FRIAM] narcissism

OK. Well, risking too much repetition, if he were competent, he wouldn't have said that ... and the policies would not have followed ... and he would defer to the experts. Because, as Dunning-Kruger and Zajenkowski et al, and Schröder-Abé et al, seem to point out, competent people have a good ha

Re: [FRIAM] narcissism

Well, Gil should accuse *me* of yapping, too. So yes, you and me both. But his narcissism is irrelevant. You may as well claim that his *hair* makes him dangerous. It's irrelevant. What's relevant is his incompetence. My guess is that Obama is a narcissist, too ... anyone who *wants* to be Presi

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

This seems to contradict what you've said about it being impossible to doubt everything. If I recall the argument, you would say that launching into an action like putting your leg down to get out of bed or jumping a creek or whatever *means* you fully believe (don't doubt) that the floor is the

Re: [FRIAM] narcissism

Trump's narcissism is NOT the problem. It's his sheer incompetence that's the problem. So all this yapping about him being a narcissist might be, at best, wasted breath and, at worst, a red herring distracting from the real problem. On 4/27/20 12:03 PM, uǝlƃ ☣ wrote: > Sorry

Re: [FRIAM] At the limits of thought

Ha! Yes, I have 2 twitch logins, one for play and one for work. I find it fascinating how these people can both play some game well *and* read chat and facilitate parasocial relationships with large numbers of their fans. I briefly worked on using Twitch to stream tutorials for my M&S workflow (

Re: [FRIAM] At the limits of thought

Excellent! Such credit tracking is something I've always wished I were competent at. I look at all these publications of people I respect and see hundreds of items in the references and my imagination runs wild with how much work they had to do to track down where any given idea came from. Renee

Re: [FRIAM] At the limits of thought

Well said! While I don't think I understand the Gröbner basis analogy, I would argue that the motivations will also be derived from the world, though perhaps more deeply with long memories. [†] Add to that the loopiness where the agents co-construct the world that constructs them and it's not cl

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

I've placed a cleaned up copy here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1NQ7vi5JCv97WPyC88Ym0DRdERFZSUCyKJsHrx9q5QP8/edit?usp=sharing I've added a couple of questions as comments on that document. If you care to edit it, let me know your gmail address and I'll add you as an editor. > ---

Re: [FRIAM] narcissism

Sorry for any overemphasis. I was merely *wondering if* there might be 2 types. I was inferring it partly from the Alternate model in the DSM 5 and partly from my own sense that the way people talk about them is contradictory. Your quote from Kernberg only hints at it. Being episodic, myself, I

[FRIAM] narcissism

Waco https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/waco/s01 I don't know much about Koresh or the Branch Davidians. I remember watching it (and the Ruby Ridge coverage) on TV back then. (I was pretty libertarian back then ... but that was back when the word "libertarian" meant something ... it's a useless

Re: [FRIAM] Warring Darwinians for Glen, Steve

Thanks for reposting these! On 4/26/20 3:12 PM, Jochen Fromm wrote: > have you thought about turning your ideas about the hard problem of > consciousness into an article or book? 10 years ago you had this nice idea of > a cross section of reality, a unique slice of the same world that is > resp

[FRIAM] CD3+, CD4+, CD8+

Suppressed T cell-mediated immunity in patients with COVID-19: A clinical retrospective study in Wuhan, China https://www.journalofinfection.com/article/S0163-4453(20)30223-1/abstract Does anyone here have a sense for the types of conditions (cf covid19 comorbidities) that cluster around all 3 p

Re: [FRIAM] Local News not so good

The only suggestion I could make with a straight face might be poverty and/or wealth distribution. You guys have a higher poverty rate and more of a divide between you rich people with multiple homes and the rest of the population. I'm tempted to include some sort of cultural difference, too. Yo

Re: [FRIAM] Local News not so good

Bah! The rt.live people must have been listening to our conversation. 8^) We'll have to look elsewhere for the Easter bump. https://rt.live/ > Model Updates > > Based on suggestions and ideas from the community, we made a major model > update on 4/23. The new version of this model accounts

Re: [FRIAM] Local News not so good

Also, you can see that many states in the rt.live data show a bump around the 16th, some later toward the 19th. I grok the point about feeling symptoms then coming in, then wait for the test results. But we also have to factor in that many people who are infected won't come in and get tested at

Re: [FRIAM] Local News not so good

If median ... median ... incubation is ~5 days, and we had perfect case data (Ha!), then we'd see the bump near the 18th/19th. The rt.live data shows NM's R(t) > 1 on the 14th, two days after Easter, then seemingly peaking ~16th, with a fat tail. The smoother could easily be affecting that. A go

Re: [FRIAM] Local News not so good

I don't know. It still looks pretty good to me. (See attached.) And the site Steve sent shows NM headed back in the right direction after a bit of a bump: https://rt.live/ I've been watching Atlanta (DeKalb county) and Georgia and will be interested to see the number of cases curve after this F

Re: [FRIAM] Fundraiser by Christina Z. : Ohoris Staff Relief Fund

8^) Sorry. I didn't intend to accuse anyone of purposefully manipulation. That's why I mentioned the Telephone Game. It doesn't matter what we intend, the message will get perverted. ("The only problem with communication is the illusion that it exists." -- somebody somewhere I'm too lazy to look

Re: [FRIAM] Fundraiser by Christina Z. : Ohoris Staff Relief Fund

ProPublica's thing seems good too: https://projects.propublica.org/nonprofits/organizations/362193608 On 4/22/20 2:20 PM, Angel Edward wrote: > Go to Charity Navigator or Charity Watch. There are others. They’ll give you > access to the IRS forms and more importantly give you how much of thir fu

Re: [FRIAM] At the limits of thought

o "see where they're coming from" because they, like us, will have grown up poking around in the world. On 4/22/20 8:01 AM, uǝlƃ ☣ wrote: > > https://aeon.co/essays/will-brains-or-algorithms-rule-the-kingdom-of-science > -- ☣ uǝlƃ .-. .- -. -.. --- -- -..-. -.. -

Re: [FRIAM] Fundraiser by Christina Z. : Ohoris Staff Relief Fund

Heh, it's funny how something you say can be perfectly inverted by the audience to mean the opposite of what you intended. The Telephone Game is always relevant. My point to Steve was about "effective altruism", the idea that the philanthropist has any idea whatsoever of the relative optimality

[FRIAM] Earth School

https://ed.ted.com/earth-school > Welcome to Earth School! We’re embarking on a month of daily adventures – or > Quests – that will help you understand and celebrate our natural world, while > learning about how dependent we are on our planet. Now more than ever, we > need to protect, nurture a

[FRIAM] At the limits of thought

https://aeon.co/essays/will-brains-or-algorithms-rule-the-kingdom-of-science -- ☣ uǝlƃ .-. .- -. -.. --- -- -..-. -.. --- - ... -..-. .- -. -.. -..-. -.. .- ... . ... FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam unsubscribe http://redfish.c

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