Your certainly welcome, Alain,
Chad
- Original Message -
From: Alain Veylit<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Chad McAnally<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
Thank you, Chad,
Alain
C
and other exotic woods, rather than the common lutes made
of yew.
Michael Thames
www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
- Original Message -
From: "Martin Shepherd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Lute Net"
Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 2:52 AM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double fret
;mailto:lute@cs.dartmouth.edu> ; Chad McAnally<mailto:[EMAIL
> PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 6:15 PM
> Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
>
>
>
> > I've built both harps and guitars and it seems less >important what the
> back and
cAnally<mailto:[EMAIL
PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 6:15 PM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
> I've built both harps and guitars and it seems less >important what the
back and sides are made of versus >how they are made;( within
reasonI wouldn&
ilto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: lute<mailto:lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 2:37 AM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
How's a sitar tuned?
Alain
Chad McAnally wrote:
>Hi Tony,
>It's strange, I sent this to the list a few days a
revent cracking of the back.
Michael Thames
www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
- Original Message -
From: "Chad McAnally" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "lute"
Sent: Saturday, June 25, 2005 10:50 PM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
> Hi Tony,
> It's strange, I sent this to the
s
www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
- Original Message -
From: "LGS-Europe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "lute"
Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 1:05 AM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
> >>> Absolutely. This has been my experience with not only the lute but
with
key.
> >
> >Chad
> >
> >- Original Message -
> > From: Tony Chalkley<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: lute<mailto:lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>
> > Sent: Saturday, June 25, 2005 4:51 PM
> > Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
> >
27;t make guitar sides of delrin or concrete!)
> >I.e. that they are of the right thickness to resonate and still be strong
enough to support to the soundboard seems the real key.
> >
> >Chad
> >
> >- Original Message -
> > From: Tony Chalkley&l
sides of delrin or concrete!)
>I.e. that they are of the right thickness to resonate and still be strong
>enough to support to the soundboard seems the real key.
>
>Chad
>
>- Original Message -
> From: Tony Chalkley<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: lute<mai
board seems the real key.
Chad
- Original Message -
From: Tony Chalkley<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: lute<mailto:lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Sent: Saturday, June 25, 2005 4:51 PM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
> So maybe as the fret and string have
> So maybe as the fret and string have better purchase, the neck will
> send that energy to the body? I'm tempted to think that one end would
> cancel out the other but on the other hand, the bridge would vibrate up
> and down (relative to the bridge) while the neck would forward and back
>
e collective speculation of
the folks on this list will help us all be better informed players. I know I'm
buying more fretgut
Chad
- Original Message -
From: Sean Smith<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Lutelist<mailto:lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, June
ent me fret tying diagrams. David Brown,
Bernd , and Carl.
Michael Thames
www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
- Original Message -
From: "Carl Donsbach" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "lute"
Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 9:36 AM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
> Mi
of the string.
> Now, if only I can figure out how to tie a double fret!
> Michael Thames
> www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
> - Original Message -
> From: "Chad McAnally" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "lute"
> Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 7:30 AM
> S
ameter of the string.
Now, if only I can figure out how to tie a double fret!
Michael Thames
www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
- Original Message -
From: "Chad McAnally" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "lute"
Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 7:30 AM
Subject: Re: Built-in acti
gt; ; Chad McAnally<mailto:[EMAIL
PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 11:17 PM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
I just finished reading some Dalsa in Italian Tab. then tried to read some
French tab. Man, my mind stopped working for a moment. So I checked my
Email.
Cha
Martin,
I use quite a large diameter double loop fret on bigger lutes, for example the
first fret on my large theorbo is around 1.2mm, and have no problem at all in
tightening it up. The key is to use the proper knot and leave sufficient length
to grasp well - in short the double loop fret kn
Peter Weiler wrote:
>I do have a lot of trouble getting double fret knots tight for anything
>greater than, say, 0.80 mm fretgut though.
>
>-Peter
>
>
Er - what did I say Dowland's biggest fret diameter was?
Best to all,
Martin
To get on or off this list see list information at
http://w
inden (light ) or Spanish cedar ( a little
heaver) for the core.
Michael Thames
www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
- Original Message -
From: "Chad McAnally" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "lute"
Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 8:06 PM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
Interesting idea, Chad. I had always thought the energy of the string
was transmitted to the body through the bridge but it makes sense that
some energy must go to the stopping fret as well.
There is the view that the lute should be held as loosely as possible
and a lesson with Ronn MacFarlan
Michael Thames wrote: <<>>
Now I know this is a lute list, not an early keyboard list, but I have come
upon a direct parallel that may be of interest to lutenist and luthiers alike.
The same phenomenon mentioned above by Michael was recently has been noted also
on clavichords in an article by
azor
blade. Mimo might know.
Michael Thames
www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
- Original Message -
From: "Sean Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Lutelist"
Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 6:43 PM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
>
> There are a few frets
Message -
> From: "James A Stimson"
> To: "Peter Weiler"
> Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
> Date: Tue, 21 Jun 2005 19:29:25 -0400
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Dear Peter and All:
>> Now this is interesting. I
quot;James A Stimson"
To: "Peter Weiler"
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
Date: Tue, 21 Jun 2005 19:29:25 -0400
>
>
>
>
>
> Dear Peter and All:
> Now this is interesting. I assume you put the slightly smaller fret
on the
> nut
PROTECTED]To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
om> cc:
Subject:
TECTED]>
To:
Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 4:14 PM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
> Ha ha! My diabolical plan to inflate the third-quarter share price of
> fretgut manufactories is proceeding apace! Dear Martyn, Sean, and Peter,
> and all,
> Last night I added anothe
Ha ha! My diabolical plan to inflate the third-quarter share price of
fretgut manufactories is proceeding apace! Dear Martyn, Sean, and Peter,
and all,
Last night I added another fret to each of the frets on my 6 course
lute, in the manner that Sean had suggested, with smaller diameter gut
behind i
uot;
Sent: Sunday, June 19, 2005 8:50 PM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
>
> Stability is good word. Somehow, too, it requires less effort. W/ a
> single fret you feel the string bend behind the fret and you want to
> touch bottom.
>
> I remember playing an orpharion w/ sca
www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
- Original Message -
From: "Peter Weiler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Sunday, June 19, 2005 8:34 PM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
> I've thought about this for a good hour and I have to say it is a
> remarkably diffi
slide around a bit, I was thinking that more actual contact
surface would help this a bit?
Michael Thames
www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
- Original Message -
From: "Sean Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Lutelist"
Sent: Sunday, June 19, 2005 6:55 PM
Subject: Re: Buil
Stability is good word. Somehow, too, it requires less effort. W/ a
single fret you feel the string bend behind the fret and you want to
touch bottom.
I remember playing an orpharion w/ scalloped frets and it seems to take
these ideas to the next level. Bending the string behind the fret would
I have played a six course lute double-fretted, single strand of fret going
around the neck twice, with the fretting carefully selected and tied by the
lute's maker Ray Nurse, for many years. The gut frets, with all gut strings on
the lute, has lasted so well that I have only had to have the in
I've thought about this for a good hour and I have to say it is a
remarkably difficult thing to verbalize. I don't know what commercial
pressures the big boys are subject to (and I don't think that's a good
measure) but for the rest of us... you're right about a little less
tendency to slide on th
> Would it be safe to
> say that the second fret prevents the courses from sliding around so
> much?
I wouldn't think so. I just tie them tighter'n a fratboy on St. Paddy's
day.
Sean
To get on or off this list see list information at
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
n etc. as to their rational behind not using them?
Michael Thames
www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
- Original Message -
From: "Peter Weiler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Sunday, June 19, 2005 5:53 PM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
> By the way, apart from the historical
By the way, apart from the historical evidence matter, double frets are
very, very nice to use on lutes. I've had some trouble getting a
double-strand tied tight enough in the past, but I really like Sean's
idea of using independent frets side-by-side. This makes them easy to
tie and allows one t
I think that double frets are considered commonplace among our very near
cousins in the HIP viol crowd, so we shouldn't be surprised to find that
they were used on lutes of the same period.
- Peter
- Original Message -
From: "Sean Smith"
To: Lutelist
Subject: Re:
Thanks Gernot! And Peter, I knew there was another Holbein that
depicted double frets. I just couldn't remember which.
thank you.
Concerning the Poulton/Dowland image. Perhaps it was overkill to double
the frets on a small lute. So far it hasn't been worth it to "double
up" on my descant.
Sea
Intersting to note though that the Berlin Holbein, depicting a quite
different lute, also shows clear doubles.
- Peter
" I would Like to see that, so everyone can see the details involved in
clearly showing double frets. As I'm sure that this painting shows DF's
it
still is not convincing evide
d 1.80mm looks, then take another look ! In these photos there
> >> is not
> >> even a hint of what looks like two frets together.
> >> And if these are not single frets, please show me what a double
> >> fret
> >> looks like.
> >>
> >
---
From: "Sean Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Lutelist"
Sent: Sunday, June 19, 2005 4:44 PM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
>
> Michael,
> Unfortunately I no longer have the blow-ups from the Ambassadors on my
> hard drive. Perhaps if Gernot Hilger
1.80mm looks, then take another look ! In these photos there
>> is not
>> even a hint of what looks like two frets together.
>> And if these are not single frets, please show me what a double
>> fret
>> looks like.
>>
>> Michael Thames
>> www.T
> is not
> even a hint of what looks like two frets together.
> And if these are not single frets, please show me what a double
> fret
> looks like.
>
> Michael Thames
> www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
> - Original Message -
> From: "Tony Chalkley
single frets, please show me what a double fret
looks like.
Michael Thames
www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
- Original Message -
From: "Tony Chalkley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Lute Net"
Sent: Sunday, June 19, 2005 3:02 PM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
&
ust try it some time.
Nice try...
- Original Message -
From: "Michael Thames" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Martyn Hodgson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "Lute Net"
; "Lute builder Net" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, June 19, 2005 9:47 PM
Subj
s
www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
- Original Message -
From: "Sean Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Lutelist"
Sent: Sunday, June 19, 2005 11:16 AM
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
> >
> >
> > The only possible way that double frets
>
>
> The only possible way that double frets could work is if the fret
> closest to the nut was slightly lower than the other, allowing the
> string to
> make contact with the crest of the higher fret. Otherwise you have big
> intonation problems.
>
Michael,
The ridge closer to the nut qui
On Jun 19, 2005, at 9:20 AM, Craig Robert Pierpont wrote:
>We obviously have a difference of opinion here. I would be
> interested to see Martyn's historical evidence.
The lute in Holbein's "The Ambassadors" very clearly has doubled frets.
As realistically as this painting is done I believ
We obviously have a difference of opinion here. I would be interested to see
Martyn's historical evidence. I have heard of using double fret loops for so
long that I took it as a given that this was always an option of varying
popularity, but the question being raised, I can't remember where
ence to this is
a personal choice as to how much tolerance one has for out of tunness
Michael Thames
www.ThamesClassicalGuitars.com
- Original Message -
From: "Martyn Hodgson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Lute Net"
Sent: Sunday, June 19, 2005 6:15 AM
Subject: Fwd: Re: B
Martyn Hodgson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:Date: Sun, 19 Jun 2005 13:11:37 +0100
(BST)
From: Martyn Hodgson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Built-in action? Double frets
To: Michael Thames <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
The historical evidence is that double fret loops were gene
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