On Sat, Dec 15, 2012 at 11:44:17PM +1300, Chris Bannister wrote:
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 07:43:12PM -0600, Derek Martin wrote:
Same arguemnt as above. Also this is mostly not interesting
anymore. When you compare this to the amount of bandwidth consumed
by things like streaming video,
On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 12:15:49PM -0600, Derek Martin wrote:
On Sat, Dec 15, 2012 at 11:44:17PM +1300, Chris Bannister wrote:
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 07:43:12PM -0600, Derek Martin wrote:
Same arguemnt as above. Also this is mostly not interesting
anymore. When you compare this to the
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 07:43:12PM -0600, Derek Martin wrote:
Same arguemnt as above. Also this is mostly not interesting
anymore. When you compare this to the amount of bandwidth consumed
by things like streaming video, it's a drop in the bucket.
Streaming video is specifically requested. I
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 01:53:59PM +1300, Chris Bannister wrote:
On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 02:33:56PM +0200, Nikola Petrov wrote:
The fact that I don't know how the engine of my car works doesn't make
me a newbie. That's what abstractions in our world are for.
Umm, in the car world yes
Sorry for continuing this flamewar,
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 10:55:32AM +0200, Nikola
Petrov wrote:
Just because my mom doesn't want to wrap her
text or use non html make her a worse/better
person. She just doesn't care and wants her work
done.
This exactly makes her a person who _doesn't
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 10:55:32AM +0200, Nikola Petrov wrote:
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 01:53:59PM +1300, Chris Bannister wrote:
On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 02:33:56PM +0200, Nikola Petrov wrote:
The fact that I don't know how the engine of my car works doesn't make
me a newbie. That's
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 01:53:59PM +1300, Chris Bannister wrote:
On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 02:33:56PM +0200, Nikola Petrov wrote:
The fact that I don't know how the engine of my car works doesn't make
me a newbie. That's what abstractions in our world are for.
Umm, in the car world yes
On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 02:33:56PM +0200, Nikola Petrov wrote:
The fact that I don't know how the engine of my car works doesn't make
me a newbie. That's what abstractions in our world are for.
Yes, it *does* make you an ignorant newbie, on the topic of automotive
engine maintenance. (I'm one
On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 06:27:42AM -0500, Rich Kulawiec wrote:
HTML email is sent exclusively by three groups of people:
1. Ignorant newbies
2. Ineducable morons
3. Spammers
There are no exceptions.
This statement is complete and utter crap. I receive HTML mail
regularly from
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 12:06:03PM -0600, Derek Martin wrote:
HTML provides all of the features [...]
HTML also provides all of the bugs.
Nothin's free. (c.f. Crossfire, Stevie Ray Vaughan, 1989)
Several points (and these aren't exhaustive, merely illustrative):
1. It is very difficult to
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 06:24:35PM -0500, Rich Kulawiec wrote:
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 12:06:03PM -0600, Derek Martin wrote:
HTML provides all of the features [...]
HTML also provides all of the bugs.
No, it doesn't. The implementation does.
1. It is very difficult to conduct a technical
On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 06:44:35PM -0600, Jim Graham wrote:
If you keep track, you'll probably find, as I have, that HTML-only
e-mail is between 99% to 100% spam.
HTML email is sent exclusively by three groups of people:
1. Ignorant newbies
2. Ineducable morons
3. Spammers
There are no
On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 06:27:42AM -0500, Rich Kulawiec wrote:
On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 06:44:35PM -0600, Jim Graham wrote:
If you keep track, you'll probably find, as I have, that HTML-only
e-mail is between 99% to 100% spam.
HTML email is sent exclusively by three groups of people:
1.
Now just a cotton picking minute...
HTML email is sent exclusively by three groups of people:
1. Ignorant newbies
2. Ineducable morons
3. Spammers
There are no exceptions. It thus, to Jim's point, an excellent
anti-spam/anti-stupidity technique to refuse all such traffic
at the MTA.
On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 02:33:56PM +0200, Nikola Petrov wrote:
What about clients that you are doing support for?
That's so easy to handle, I'm surprised to see it asked (at least,
if you're using procmail). You create two (or more) rc files for
procmail. For example, I have a setup that
* Dale A. Raby daler...@gmail.com [12-10-12 08:33]:
...
I appologize ahead of time for this rant, but you see, I know what a DOS
window is and I guess I'm getting ornery in my old age.
or cp/m and audio tape storage.
and *ignorance* |= stupid
but lacking in knowledge and perhaps *only*
On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 07:30:14AM -0600, Dale A. Raby wrote:
Ignorant newbies may at some point become the Michael Elkins of the
future.
They may. And that would be an entirely good thing, for them and
for all of us.
But that doesn't preclude the fact that they're ignorant newbies *today*.
On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 02:33:56PM +0200, Nikola Petrov wrote:
The fact that I don't know how the engine of my car works doesn't make
me a newbie. That's what abstractions in our world are for.
Umm, in the car world yes you'd be a newbie. Don't consider it a
derogatory term. We are all
On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 07:30:14AM -0600, Dale A. Raby wrote:
Not all of us are IT professionals. Some of us are blacksmiths, gun
salesmen, truck drivers, and even ecdysiasts.
Please don't group IT professionals. and
standards/ettiquette/netiquette as one.
No exceptions? Really? I seem
On Sun, Dec 02, 2012 at 06:12:32PM +1100, Erik Christiansen wrote:
That seems a more positive step than just plonking the barbarians at the
gates who refuse to recognise the price of receiving free help. (And
yes, even in this reply, we're doing your research and investigative
thinking for
=- Peter Davis wrote on Sun 2.Dec'12 at 8:54:58 -0500 -=
Ok, this, more than any of the previous discussion, clarifies the
situation for me. Within the global community of hundreds of
millions of email users, there's a smaller, cloistered
constituency of perhaps a few thousand who prefer
On 02.12.12 08:54, Peter Davis wrote:
In my view, no amount of argument or evidence is going to change the
minds of anyone in this smaller group. That's fine. Within the domain of
lists that discuss these classic tools, we should adhere to the
practices of that community.
Eureka! That is what
On Sat, Dec 01, 2012 at 05:57:03PM -0500, Peter Davis wrote:
I see now, how some of the posts in this thread seemed so weird! So
in this light, you'll see that the mutt-users mailing list just
happens to represent the majority of posters on mailing lists.
Your conclusion seems to be drawn
On Sun, Dec 02, 2012 at 03:13:12AM +, Grant Edwards wrote:
On 2012-12-01, Chris Bannister cbannis...@slingshot.co.nz wrote:
On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 06:20:00PM +, Grant Edwards wrote:
The main Python mailing list gets regular posts from Google Groups.
Those posts are always
[ Derek Martin Wrote On Fri 30.Nov'12 at 17:17:22 GMT ]
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 03:23:58PM +, Jamie Paul Griffin wrote:
There could be any number of reasons why someone might
not compose a perfect message: there could be learning difficulties,
some other physical impairment, someone
=- Jamie Paul Griffin wrote on Sat 1.Dec'12 at 8:38:57 + -=
Long lines != the end of the world. Simple as that.
... _for you_.
But it can mean the beginning of the end for efficient
communication, when everybody starts caring less and less for it by
introducing (and trying to establish)
[ Rado S Wrote On Sat 1.Dec'12 at 9:17:29 GMT ]
=- Jamie Paul Griffin wrote on Sat 1.Dec'12 at 8:38:57 + -=
Long lines != the end of the world. Simple as that.
... _for you_.
But it can mean the beginning of the end for efficient
communication, when everybody starts caring less
On 2012-12-01, Rado Q l%...@gmx.de wrote:
=- Jamie Paul Griffin wrote on Sat 1.Dec'12 at 8:38:57 + -=
Long lines != the end of the world. Simple as that.
... _for you_.
But it can mean the beginning of the end for efficient
communication, when everybody starts caring less and less for
On 2012-12-01, Jamie Paul Griffin ja...@kode5.net wrote:
... and I agree completely. As I wrote, I now wrap my lines and will
make extra effort to ensure message formatting conforms so they are
more readable. I don't like upsetting people, and I have taken on
board all the valid and sensible
=- Tony's unattended mail wrote on Sat 1.Dec'12 at 10:41:11 + -=
Jamie actually did this list a service. Overly sheltered mutt
users have a tendancy to lose touch. Jamie's post actually exposed
a mutt characteristic that can be improved.
a) improving mutt is good: go ahead.
b) this
* On 01 Dec 2012, Tony's unattended mail wrote:
Regardless of which standards a mutt user endorses, a good quality
tool is lenient in what it accepts, handles it well, while being
strict in what it produces.
Yes, that's generally our principle.
Yet mutt is not good at handling common
* Jim Graham spooky1...@gmail.com [12-01-12 00:06]:
On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 11:15:42PM -0500, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
Yahoo now requires posting from a yahoo account via their smtp or from
their web service, since last year some time. I have dropped all but one
group, but only read. I
* Tony's unattended mail tony.parker-9o8uv...@cool.fr.nf [12-01-12 05:43]:
On 2012-12-01, Rado Q l%...@gmx.de wrote:
=- Jamie Paul Griffin wrote on Sat 1.Dec'12 at 8:38:57 + -=
Long lines != the end of the world. Simple as that.
... _for you_.
But it can mean the beginning of the
On 2012-12-01, jim graham spooky1...@gmail.com wrote:
On Sat, Dec 01, 2012 at 02:12:03AM +, Grant Edwards wrote:
On 2012-11-30, Jim Graham spooky1...@gmail.com wrote:
announcement type list for the freeware hurricane tracker (JStrack)
[]
It's a google groups list.
If needed I can
On 2012-12-01, Patrick Shanahan ptilopt...@gmail.com wrote:
* Grant Edwards grant.b.edwa...@gmail.com [11-30-12 21:13]:
...
I think the Yahoo list server can be used by anybody (I guess you have
to sign up for a Yahoo account, to do admin stuff). They offer a web
UI, but you don't actually
* Grant Edwards grant.b.edwa...@gmail.com [12-01-12 10:27]:
On 2012-12-01, Patrick Shanahan ptilopt...@gmail.com wrote:
* Grant Edwards grant.b.edwa...@gmail.com [11-30-12 21:13]:
...
I think the Yahoo list server can be used by anybody (I guess you have
to sign up for a Yahoo account,
On 2012-12-01, Patrick Shanahan ptilopt...@gmail.com wrote:
* Grant Edwards grant.b.edwa...@gmail.com [12-01-12 10:27]:
On 2012-12-01, Patrick Shanahan ptilopt...@gmail.com wrote:
Yahoo now requires posting from a yahoo account via their smtp or
from their web service,
Weird. I posted to
On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 11:15:42PM -0500, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
* Grant Edwards grant.b.edwa...@gmail.com [11-30-12 21:13]:
...
I think the Yahoo list server can be used by anybody (I guess you have
to sign up for a Yahoo account, to do admin stuff). They offer a web
UI, but you don't
On Sat, Dec 01, 2012 at 08:38:57AM +, Jamie Paul Griffin wrote:
And what you generally see, INCLUDING in the case which generated this
thread, is a great deal of tolerance from the community for such things,
followed by polite requests to please follow the local custom. What
you saw
On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 10:24:59AM -0500, Peter Davis wrote:
Actually, it wasn't about GMail at all. It was about the fact that
millions of email users don't care about line wrapping, or text/plain,
or any of these other 40 year old conventions. The mutt-users group
just happens to represent
On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 06:20:00PM +, Grant Edwards wrote:
The main Python mailing list gets regular posts from Google Groups.
Those posts are always malformatted (the formatting seems to change
over the years, but it never actually gets better). The ones that
aren't just spam are always
[ Derek Martin Wrote On Sat 1.Dec'12 at 18:50:41 GMT ]
On Sat, Dec 01, 2012 at 08:38:57AM +, Jamie Paul Griffin wrote:
And what you generally see, INCLUDING in the case which generated this
thread, is a great deal of tolerance from the community for such things,
followed by polite
On Sun, Dec 02, 2012 at 09:26:31AM +1300, Chris Bannister wrote:
On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 10:24:59AM -0500, Peter Davis wrote:
Actually, it wasn't about GMail at all. It was about the fact that
millions of email users don't care about line wrapping, or text/plain,
or any of these other 40
On Sat, Dec 01, 2012 at 05:57:03PM -0500, Peter Davis wrote:
Apparently even proper conversational quoting is too complex for you
to follow. I was responding to a comment on a comment on an earlier
post of mine. Since I wrote that earlier post, I think I have a pretty
good idea what it was
* Grant Edwards grant.b.edwa...@gmail.com [12-01-12 11:07]:
On 2012-12-01, Patrick Shanahan ptilopt...@gmail.com wrote:
...
I am not explaining properly/sufficiently. Yahoo *requires* your posting
addr matches your smtp.
:^)
Ah, that's indeed quite different than what you wrote
On 2012-12-02, Patrick Shanahan ptilopt...@gmail.com wrote:
* Grant Edwards grant.b.edwa...@gmail.com [12-01-12 11:07]:
On 2012-12-01, Patrick Shanahan ptilopt...@gmail.com wrote:
...
I am not explaining properly/sufficiently. Yahoo *requires* your posting
addr matches your smtp.
:^)
On 2012-12-01, Chris Bannister cbannis...@slingshot.co.nz wrote:
On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 06:20:00PM +, Grant Edwards wrote:
The main Python mailing list gets regular posts from Google Groups.
Those posts are always malformatted (the formatting seems to change
over the years, but it never
On 01.12.12 17:57, Peter Davis wrote:
the 72-column wrapping rule and the non-HTML rule can hardly be
considered netiquette except perhaps within this tiny circle.
Otherwise they are, at best, quaint relics of an earlier era.
There are other bastions of consideration for the reader, not yet
[ Will Yardley Wrote On Thu 29.Nov'12 at 19:54:15 GMT ]
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 10:45:01AM -0500, Peter Davis wrote:
Bear in mind that this list, by it's very subject matter, self-selects
for members who tend towards old school tools and technologies. Mutt
users are obviously more likely
On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 09:57:50AM -0500, Mark H. Wood wrote:
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 10:14:25AM -0600, Jim Graham wrote:
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 10:45:01AM -0500, Peter Davis wrote:
Bear in mind that this list, by it's very subject matter, self-selects
for members who tend towards old
On 2012-11-30, Mark H. Wood mw...@iupui.edu wrote:
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 10:14:25AM -0600, Jim Graham wrote:
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 10:45:01AM -0500, Peter Davis wrote:
Bear in mind that this list, by it's very subject matter, self-selects
for members who tend towards old school tools and
[ruminations on a GMail Killer]
I wonder if the feeling is not so much being daunted by Google, but
rather that the thought of building a GMail Killer is not very
interesting. I find that Open Source projects tend to assign small
value to competition, preferring to do what no one else is doing.
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 03:23:58PM +, Jamie Paul Griffin wrote:
There could be any number of reasons why someone might
not compose a perfect message: there could be learning difficulties,
some other physical impairment, someone very young and new to the
concept of technical mailing lists,
On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 09:57:50AM -0500, Mark H. Wood wrote:
I don't think it was about sending mail through a .gmail address; it
was about using the GMail web thingy to compose the mail being sent,
People actually USE that POS!? The e-mail lists (now only one left)
that I've created all
On 2012-11-30, Jim Graham spooky1...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 09:57:50AM -0500, Mark H. Wood wrote:
I don't think it was about sending mail through a .gmail address; it
was about using the GMail web thingy to compose the mail being sent,
People actually USE that POS!?
On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 06:20:00PM +, Grant Edwards wrote:
I killfiled all postings from google groups years ago...
Well, I suppose you'll never be on my list, then (it's a support and
announcement type list for the freeware hurricane tracker (JStrack)
that I wrote back in ca. 1996, and
On Sat, Dec 01, 2012 at 02:12:03AM +, Grant Edwards wrote:
On 2012-11-30, Jim Graham spooky1...@gmail.com wrote:
announcement type list for the freeware hurricane tracker (JStrack)
[]
It's a google groups list.
If needed I can change the killfile rule so that it doesn't apply to a
* Grant Edwards grant.b.edwa...@gmail.com [11-30-12 21:13]:
...
I think the Yahoo list server can be used by anybody (I guess you have
to sign up for a Yahoo account, to do admin stuff). They offer a web
UI, but you don't actually have to use it -- you can subscribe to it
using any e-mail
On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 11:15:42PM -0500, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
Yahoo now requires posting from a yahoo account via their smtp or from
their web service, since last year some time. I have dropped all but one
group, but only read. I refuse to use their web service.
Strange...because one of
[ Grant Edwards Wrote On Fri 30.Nov'12 at 18:20:00 GMT ]
On 2012-11-30, Jim Graham spooky1...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Nov 30, 2012 at 09:57:50AM -0500, Mark H. Wood wrote:
I don't think it was about sending mail through a .gmail address; it
was about using the GMail web thingy to
[ Erik Christiansen Wrote On Thu 29.Nov'12 at 5:26:49 GMT ]
On 28.11.12 12:16, Derek Martin wrote:
All methods of judgement are rigid, by their very nature. It is only the
human element which allows them to be flexible (for example, I knew
what you meant when you typed rigit). Humans
On 29.11.12 08:42, Jamie Paul Griffin wrote:
I suppose what i'm saying is there are more important things in life to
worry about than something like this. I think provided people make some
sort of effort to conform to the way mailinglist posts should be
formatted, and particularly avoid things
* Jamie Paul Griffin ja...@kode5.net [11-29-12 03:45]:
...
I suppose what i'm saying is there are more important things in life to
worry about than something like this. I think provided people make some
sort of effort to conform to the way mailinglist posts should be
formatted, and
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 08:42:16AM +, Jamie Paul Griffin wrote:
[ Erik Christiansen Wrote On Thu 29.Nov'12 at 5:26:49 GMT ]
It can be worse than just evidencing irritation at inconsiderately
formatted posts, fullquoting, top posting, lack of proper sentence
structure, html, or other
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 08:08:45AM -0600, Jim Graham wrote:
Look at it from the other direction---you're on an e-mail list, where
people ask questions, and other people use their own free time and
volunteer to help those asking the questions. It is perfectly reasonable
to expect that the
On 2012-11-29, Erik Christiansen dva...@internode.on.net wrote:
[...]
Each reader has his own disrespect triggers. e.g. I press the FOAD
button when confronted by the extreme laziness of uncapitalised
sentences.
For me nothing causes 'next' to be hit faster than SMS-speak or using
certain
Bear in mind that this list, by it's very subject matter, self-selects
for members who tend towards old school tools and technologies. Mutt
users are obviously more likely to be strict about text-only,
72-column wrapped messages than users of, say, GMail.
The main point about any etiquette is
* Jamie Paul Griffin ja...@kode5.net [11-29-12 10:25]:
...
People that read mailing lists simply for amusement at what, I imagine,
they see as incompetence in others is ridiculous.
Agreed, but do not understand where this notion was presented.
It undermines the very purpose of the
On 2012-11-29, Peter Davis p...@pfdstudio.com wrote:
Bear in mind that this list, by it's very subject matter, self-selects
for members who tend towards old school tools and technologies. Mutt
users are obviously more likely to be strict about text-only,
72-column wrapped messages than users
On 2012-11-29, Peter Davis p...@pfdstudio.com wrote:
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 10:14:25AM -0600, Jim Graham wrote:
... so
how is having a .gmail address so bad? I'm very curious at this point.
Sorry if I was unclear. The vast majority of email users, many of whom
are using GMail (or Yahoo
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 10:45:01AM -0500, Peter Davis wrote:
Bear in mind that this list, by it's very subject matter, self-selects
for members who tend towards old school tools and technologies. Mutt
users are obviously more likely to be strict about text-only,
72-column wrapped messages than
* Grant Edwards grant.b.edwa...@gmail.com [11-29-12 14:52]:
On 2012-11-29, Peter Davis p...@pfdstudio.com wrote:
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 10:14:25AM -0600, Jim Graham wrote:
... so
how is having a .gmail address so bad? I'm very curious at this point.
Sorry if I was unclear. The vast
* Will Yardley mutt-us...@veggiechinese.net [11-29-12 14:54]:
...
rant
One of the thing that bugs me is that, both on the backend side, and on
the UI side, it seems like the open source folks have given up even
trying to create an integrated system (i.e., not a bunch of stuff stuck
together
* Will Yardley mutt-us...@veggiechinese.net [11-29-12 17:14]:
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 03:14:31PM -0500, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
KMail and Kontact (calendar) integrate fairly well. Calendars share
dates.
That's client software, isn't it?
I'm not talking about client software - I'm
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 11:27:13AM -0500, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
* Jim Graham spooky1...@gmail.com [11-29-12 11:16]:
Perhaps the same as for a hotmail/yahoo/ms/aol/... address. Years past
Well yeah, I remember those...never used them because I knew they were
useless from day one (except
On 2012-11-27, Jamie Paul Griffin ja...@kode5.net wrote:
[ Tony's unattended mail Wrote On Tue 27.Nov'12 at 16:45:58 GMT ]
On 2012-11-27, Jamie Paul Griffin ja...@kode5.net wrote:
I'm sorry but you've lost me again :-) - both of you
There are two kinds of people:
1) Those who oppose
On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 05:46:31PM +, Jamie Paul Griffin wrote:
On 2012-11-27, Jamie Paul Griffin ja...@kode5.net wrote:
I'm sorry but you've lost me again :-) - both of you
There are two kinds of people:
1) Those who oppose ambiguity
2) Those who are wrong
Now
On 28.11.12 12:16, Derek Martin wrote:
All methods of judgement are rigid, by their very nature. It is only the
human element which allows them to be flexible (for example, I knew
what you meant when you typed rigit). Humans have differing
levels of tolerance; but regardless of the level,
=- Jeremy Kitchen wrote on Mon 26.Nov'12 at 10:48:24 -0800 -=
don't you think this discussion has been exhausted to death now?
It only started out as a request to wrap lines in my email bodies.
I do find that part kind of funny.
You were asked to wrap, came up with a reasonable excuse
[ Rado S Wrote On Tue 27.Nov'12 at 10:20:12 GMT ]
=- Jeremy Kitchen wrote on Mon 26.Nov'12 at 10:48:24 -0800 -=
don't you think this discussion has been exhausted to death now?
It only started out as a request to wrap lines in my email bodies.
I do find that part kind of funny.
On 2012-11-27, Jamie Paul Griffin ja...@kode5.net wrote:
[ Rado S Wrote On Tue 27.Nov'12 at 10:20:12 GMT ]
You were asked to wrap, came up with a reasonable excuse why you
weren't, got a solution in reply and said ok, thanks, I'll do that.
Three weeks later...
Occasionally the secretly
On 2012-11-27, Jamie Paul Griffin ja...@kode5.net wrote:
I'm sorry but you've lost me again :-) - both of you
There are two kinds of people:
1) Those who oppose ambiguity
2) Those who are wrong
Now those who oppose ambiguity want quotes to be trimmed, with a
direct reply underneath so
[ Tony's unattended mail Wrote On Tue 27.Nov'12 at 16:45:58 GMT ]
On 2012-11-27, Jamie Paul Griffin ja...@kode5.net wrote:
I'm sorry but you've lost me again :-) - both of you
There are two kinds of people:
1) Those who oppose ambiguity
2) Those who are wrong
Now those who
On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 07:14:45PM +, Tony's unattended mail wrote:
On 2012-11-25, Chris Bannister cbannis...@slingshot.co.nz wrote:
With regards to mailing list posts, which is what the original post
of mine was addressing, sending HTML posts is very wasteful. They
are archived in
On 2012-11-26, Chris Bannister cbannis...@slingshot.co.nz wrote:
Waste is something that in itself has no value. But formatting has
value added to the presentation. So it's a stretch to label html as
waste, before even discussing the significance of it.
I don't see how an html email adds
[ Tony's unattended mail Wrote On Mon 26.Nov'12 at 16:59:03 GMT ]
don't you think this discussion has been exhausted to death now?
It only started out as a request to wrap lines in my email bodies.
On Mon, Nov 26, 2012 at 05:14:30PM +, Jamie Paul Griffin wrote:
[ Tony's unattended mail Wrote On Mon 26.Nov'12 at 16:59:03 GMT ]
don't you think this discussion has been exhausted to death now?
It only started out as a request to wrap lines in my email bodies.
I do find that part
On 2012-11-24, Patrick Shanahan ptilopt...@gmail.com wrote:
* Tony's unattended mail tony.parker-9o8uv...@cool.fr.nf [11-24-12 15:58]:
Again, this is another straw man. What I am suggesting is not the
format=flowed standard. It's a hypothetical hybrid.
Saying that people will violate a
On Sat, Nov 24, 2012 at 08:46:59PM +, Tony's unattended mail wrote:
On 2012-11-24, Derek Martin inva...@pizzashack.org wrote:
Yeah, I said exactly that in another message. Now generate HTML
mail with Mutt. Plus you still get a lot of folks -- many of whom
use GUI clents -- who
* Tony's unattended mail tony.parker-9o8uv...@cool.fr.nf [11-25-12 08:48]:
On 2012-11-24, Patrick Shanahan ptilopt...@gmail.com wrote:
* Tony's unattended mail tony.parker-9o8uv...@cool.fr.nf [11-24-12 15:58]:
Again, this is another straw man. What I am suggesting is not the
format=flowed
On 2012-11-25, Chris Bannister cbannis...@slingshot.co.nz wrote:
With regards to mailing list posts, which is what the original post
of mine was addressing, sending HTML posts is very wasteful. They
are archived in various places on the Net, where they are stored for
ever and a day. Yeah,
On 2012-11-23, Jim Graham spooky1...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Nov 23, 2012 at 09:47:46PM +, Tony's unattended mail wrote:
BTW, sending a variable width format allows for 72 character
rendering, so these dated ergonomics studies are not at odds with an
unwrapped source text anyway.
Two
On Fri, Nov 23, 2012 at 09:27:49PM -0500, Peter Davis wrote:
But you still haven't answered the other part: how does the MUA or
terminal keep plain test that is meant by the sender to be aligned
as he/she typed it? That was a part of the question that needs an
answer, as it MUST be
On Fri, Nov 23, 2012 at 09:27:49PM -0500, Peter Davis wrote:
I don't think there's any question in typography circles or in usability
circles that proportional fonts are more readable than fixed width
fonts.
On this, I agree 100%. But when did we switch from e-mail to typography?
I use TeX
On Sat, Nov 24, 2012 at 09:16:22AM +, Tony's unattended mail wrote:
On 2012-11-23, Jim Graham spooky1...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Nov 23, 2012 at 09:47:46PM +, Tony's unattended mail wrote:
BTW, sending a variable width format allows for 72 character
rendering, so these dated
On Fri, Nov 23, 2012 at 05:04:38PM -0600, Jim Graham wrote:
On Fri, Nov 23, 2012 at 09:47:46PM +, Tony's unattended mail wrote:
BTW, sending a variable width format allows for 72 character
rendering, so these dated ergonomics studies are not at odds with an
unwrapped source text
On Sat, Nov 24, 2012, at 09:03 AM, Jim Graham wrote:
On Fri, Nov 23, 2012 at 09:27:49PM -0500, Peter Davis wrote:
I don't think there's any question in typography circles or in usability
circles that proportional fonts are more readable than fixed width
fonts.
On this, I agree
On Fri, Nov 23, 2012 at 09:47:46PM +, Tony's unattended mail wrote:
It's been pointed out that this number comes from scientific studies
regarding the ergonomics of reading.
Sure, but not in what I quoted and responded to for which you're now
responding. You bring a new argument.
On 2012-11-24, Jim Graham spooky1...@gmail.com wrote:
By variable width format, I mean a text message with unwrapped
paragraphs (which only has EOLs when semantically necessary).
Ok, but the question still applies. if a table, for example, is typed
in a fixed-width 72--76 column format,
On Sat, Nov 24, 2012, at 11:34 AM, Derek Martin wrote:
Except the ideal line length has been proven (to the extent that such
is possible) scientifically to not be a fallacy.
Actually, even a quick Google search on readability line length turns
up results that make claims for 50 character
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