Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

; Sent: Fri, May 15, 2015 7:08 pm > Subject: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the > Theoretical Limit > > I'm not mistaken about the gravitational impact of a fleet of flying > cars suspended in the air by a reactionless propulsion, the earth would > face

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

I suspect that a force of this nature will balance out in the long run due to the rotation of the Earth. Dave -Original Message- From: John Berry To: vortex-l Sent: Fri, May 15, 2015 7:08 pm Subject: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

bon nanotubes >>> <http://www.physorg.com/news159199255.html> “, by Peng Chen et all from >>> Cornell Univercity in which researchers discovered that catalytic action >>> only occurs when this nanogeometry CHANGES at the openings and defects of a >>> nanotu

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

nanogeometry CHANGES at the openings and defects of a >> nanotube. Cavity QED >> <http://www.actaphys.uj.edu.pl/_old/vol27/pdf/v27p2409.pdf> , And My >> blog >> http://froarty.scienceblog.com/32155/relativistic-interpertation-of-casimir-effect-expanded/ >> >&

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

l/_old/vol27/pdf/v27p2409.pdf> , And My blog > http://froarty.scienceblog.com/32155/relativistic-interpertation-of-casimir-effect-expanded/ > > > > Fran > > *From:* Axil Axil [mailto:janap...@gmail.com] > *Sent:* Friday, May 15, 2015 12:08 PM > *To:* vortex-l > *

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

simir-effect-expanded/ Fran From: Axil Axil [mailto:janap...@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 12:08 PM To: vortex-l Subject: Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit From a previous post except in part as follows: have referenced papers

Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

hat we won't get a bubble from microwaves in a shaped cavity. Fran -Original Message- From: Bob Cook [mailto:frobertc...@hotmail.com] Sent: Monday, May 11, 2015 9:50 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the

Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

gin of the force. Even if it is relativistic as Shawyer claims > and the spatial area occupied by the device modifies the encompassed > inertial frames that breach the isotropy there remains a strong likelihood > that an equal and opposite frame is created and the device is only able to

RE: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

receive the realativistic levels of dilation. Fran From: Axil Axil [mailto:janap...@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 2:34 AM To: vortex-l Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit Dear Francis X, I am coming around to your way of thi

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

that trip asymmetrical. Fran From: Axil Axil [mailto:janap...@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 2:47 AM To: vortex-l Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit There are some more dots to connect. http://www.livescience.com/29111-

Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

:* Friday, May 15, 2015 2:34 AM > *To:* vortex-l > *Subject:* EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way > above the Theoretical Limit > > > > Dear Francis X, > > > > I am coming around to your way of thinking. > > > > Regarding... >

RE: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

] responsible for the cavity provides gamma screening. Fran From: Axil Axil [mailto:janap...@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 2:34 AM To: vortex-l Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit Dear Francis X, I am coming around to your w

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

is created and the device is only able to >> directionalize gravity to produce thrust..NOT able to accumulate a >> buoyancy. IMHO his use of the term thrust is probably correct and that we >> won't get a bubble from microwaves in a shaped cavity. >> Fran >> >> --

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

es in a shaped cavity. > Fran > > -Original Message- > From: Bob Cook [mailto:frobertc...@hotmail.com] > Sent: Monday, May 11, 2015 9:50 PM > To: vortex-l@eskimo.com > Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above > the Theoreti

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

Here is an interesting thought, if this did work to produce thrust that did not act against the earth, then the earth would be moved in the direction of the device due to attraction to the device (flying car) equal to the weight of the object (it is attracted to the whole mass of the earth, and the

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

On Tue, May 12, 2015 at 9:06 AM, Orionworks - Steven Vincent Johnson < orionwo...@charter.net> wrote: Personally, I think it is a bogus premise to assume that Newton’s laws are > not being violated when this EM device is speculated to be “hovering” a few > feet above the surface of Earth. As Dave

Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

m:* Axil Axil [mailto:janap...@gmail.com] > *Sent:* Tuesday, May 12, 2015 4:40 PM > *To:* vortex-l > *Subject:* EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way > above the Theoretical Limit > > > > I wonder if the resonant shape of the microwave cavity

RE: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

>From Mixent: > I suspect you are confusing centripetal and centrifugal. (They are opposites). I suspect your suspection is correct. I meant centrifugal. A part-time dyslexic like me is occasionally prone to mangle or substitute wording. Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson svjart.orionworks.com zaz

RE: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

: Axil Axil [mailto:janap...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2015 4:40 PM To: vortex-l Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit I wonder if the resonant shape of the microwave cavity produces a pattern of positive and negative vacuum energy

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

"Axil Axil Tue, 12 May 2015 13:40:01 -0700 I wonder if the resonant shape of the microwave cavity produces a pattern of positive and negativ

RE: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

in a far better place than the idiot who answers them. Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson svjart.orionworks.com zazzle.com/orionworks From: Lennart Thornros [mailto:lenn...@thornros.com] Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2015 8:00 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

OK Vincent I beat you with ten years and I try to avoid being retired. I really think you made a good analogy withe funnel and water. A new one to me.My objective is not to impact the science world. However, I have a clear liking of new ventures. LENR to me is a new venture. I understand that my qu

RE: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

Lennart, I don’t wish to portray myself out as an expert on gravitry. I’m definitely not. All I can say is that I have been interested in the subject for most of my life. (I’m 62.) As such, it should not come as a surprise that I have come up with a few eccentric observations. As a freshly m

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

In reply to Axil Axil's message of Tue, 12 May 2015 16:39:37 -0400: Hi, [snip] >I wonder if the resonant shape of the microwave cavity produces a pattern >of positive and negative vacuum energy that corresponds to the high and low >energy pattern of microwave radiationn produced by interference. T

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

In reply to John Berry's message of Tue, 12 May 2015 17:50:30 +1200: Hi, >Yes, the reaction mass is the earth. Yes it is, and perhaps with the EM drive it still is. Or maybe the Sun, or maybe the Milky Way, or maybe the entire universe, or maybe the space-time continuum itself. Perhaps our laws o

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

I wonder if the resonant shape of the microwave cavity produces a pattern of positive and negative vacuum energy that corresponds to the high and low energy pattern of microwave radiationn produced by interference. The zone of increased positive vacuum energy may produce longer lived virtual partic

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

Steven you seems to understand this with gravity. I have to confess I understand very little. As you say my two pedal brain cannot see what gravity is. Perhaps you can help me (I am sure many others can also) but I cannot even understand that gravity does not impact my body (or any body) different

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

skeptics! Dave -Original Message- From: Bob Cook To: vortex-l Sent: Tue, May 12, 2015 11:50 am Subject: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit  Dave-- I believe there are 2 forces that are involved in moving a massive obje

RE: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

Personally, I think it is a bogus premise to assume that Newton’s laws are not being violated when this EM device is speculated to be “hovering” a few feet above the surface of Earth. As Dave rightly points out if the “hovering” device were to be situated outside the influence of Earth’s gr

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

t;. Bob - Original Message - From: David Roberson To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Monday, May 11, 2015 10:31 PM Subject: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit I agree that hovering does not violate Newton's laws. That is a special

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

-Original Message- From: Bob Cook [mailto:frobertc...@hotmail.com] Sent: Monday, May 11, 2015 9:50 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit Hovering does not violate Newton's laws IMHO. Energy and mome

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

And easier access to orbit, or indeed removing the need for orbit all together. On Tue, May 12, 2015 at 10:29 PM, Craig Haynie wrote: > "Why concentrate upon a very special case instead of the more general > applications for these drives? Hovering is useful, but it is not going to > enable one

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

"Why concentrate upon a very special case instead of the more general applications for these drives? Hovering is useful, but it is not going to enable one to travel among the stars." Hovering gives us flying cars. On Tue, May 12, 2015 at 1:50 AM, John Berry wrote: > Yes, the reaction mass is

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

Yes, the reaction mass is the earth. On Tue, May 12, 2015 at 1:44 PM, wrote: > In reply to Frank Znidarsic's message of Mon, 11 May 2015 18:58:16 -0400: > Hi Frank, > [snip] > >The video states that m drive obeys Newtow's laws. It has no reaction > mass. It does not obey Newton's laws. That

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

e any reason to suspect that the typical EM Drives that we are discussing are only useful to balance gravitational forces? Dave -Original Message- From: Bob Cook To: vortex-l Sent: Mon, May 11, 2015 9:49 pm Subject: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoreti

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

Hovering does not violate Newton's laws IMHO. Energy and momentum are conserved. Bob Cook - Original Message - From: To: Sent: Monday, May 11, 2015 6:44 PM Subject: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit In reply to Frank Z

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

In reply to Frank Znidarsic's message of Mon, 11 May 2015 18:58:16 -0400: Hi Frank, [snip] >The video states that m drive obeys Newtow's laws. It has no reaction mass. >It does not obey Newton's laws. That comment was an understatement bordering >on misinformation. > > >Frank Z Which of Newt

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

The video states that m drive obeys Newtow's laws. It has no reaction mass. It does not obey Newton's laws. That comment was an understatement bordering on misinformation. Frank Z

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

with regard to accepting the reality of EM Drives. > > >Dave > > > >-Original Message- >From: mixent >To: vortex-l >Sent: Sun, May 10, 2015 10:48 pm >Subject: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical >Limit > > &

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

EM Drives. > > Dave > > > > -Original Message- > From: mixent > To: vortex-l > Sent: Sun, May 10, 2015 10:48 pm > Subject: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the > Theoretical Limit > > In reply to Craig Haynie's message of Sun, 10 May 2

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

other energy due to mass conversion will not be accounted for. This is a major issue with regard to accepting the reality of EM Drives. Dave -Original Message- From: mixent To: vortex-l Sent: Sun, May 10, 2015 10:48 pm Subject: Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

Ok, well if it is used for static thrust only, it is then a coin toss if it would work opposing gravity as static on the surface of the earth experiences 1G of acceleration. According to the equivalence principle... On Mon, May 11, 2015 at 4:27 PM, Craig Haynie wrote: > Thanks Robin. You're rig

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

Thanks Robin. You're right. He does say that this force of 1 tonne per kilowatt is for 'static thrust'. "I found an answer from the website. He is referring specifically to a 'static thrust', not used to do work. "The static thrust/power ratio is calculated assuming a superconducting EmDrive with

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

In reply to Craig Haynie's message of Sun, 10 May 2015 23:43:04 -0400: Hi, >" IOW he creates a force, but as long as that force doesn't act over a >distance, then it need do no work." > >I'm the one who suggests that the thrust created by the EM Drive could be >used to levitate an object. Shawyer

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

A reactionless drive tends to break the conservation of energy by just existing. Since there is no equal and opposite energy does not balance, double the velocity would be achieved with double the energy but yield 4 times the stored energy, eventually that leads to excess energy out. Now in the c

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

" IOW he creates a force, but as long as that force doesn't act over a distance, then it need do no work." I'm the one who suggests that the thrust created by the EM Drive could be used to levitate an object. Shawyer is saying that the EM Drive could create 1 tonne of thrust for 1 kilowatt of powe

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

In reply to Craig Haynie's message of Sun, 10 May 2015 23:19:42 -0400: Hi, I'm suggesting that in theory no energy is required as long as there is no movement. IOW he creates a force, but as long as that force doesn't act over a distance, then it need do no work. E = F x d; F = m x a. E = m x a

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

His claim is 1 tonne of thrust per kilowatt. One tonne of thrust will accelerate an object. An object under the acceleration of gravity will be countered by the thrust, costing 48 kilowatts of power in the process. This is not the same as suspending an object by a rope or something. Are you suggest

Re: [Vo]:Nextgen EM Drive's Potential seems way above the Theoretical Limit

In reply to Craig Haynie's message of Sun, 10 May 2015 18:07:28 -0400: Hi, [snip] It doesn't cost any energy at all to support a car. The ground does this just fine with no energy expenditure. E = F . d. If d = 0, then E = 0. I'm not sure how this applies to an EM drive (if at all), but perhaps