I don't recall that one, but the Kmart DC fire in 1981 in Falls Twp, PA burned to the ground from aerosols rocketing thru openings in fire walls that were protected by water curtains instead of linked doors- or maybe the doors didn't activate from the trace heat of residual aerosol rocket trail?
City water, redundant tanks and pumps, 22 minutes from first flow activation to first steel joists on the floor. Total loss, >1M sf, predicted by FM who suggested a sacrificial building some distance from the main DC. Kmart thought that would be too inconvenient- but later, was it more inconvenient than losing one of 7 regional DC's? Would a FM'er get fired for calling a client who just suffered a billion dollar loss and saying "I told you so"? Note that in the "water curtains" the heads are closed- In PA L&I didn't know the difference in open and closed head and was requiring deluge systems with heads 6' on center out of ignorance, circa 1986 +/-. Don't even want to know how many were installed in blind faith of their expertise as the AHJ and they're time bombs ticking away.... I know of one college library (one guess, Nacia) that had a deluge system around stair opening trip and flood the place; and another where a boiler drain was installed in the deluge valve trim maybe 4' away from a similar faucet the housekeepers used for buckets. Can't believe they never came in hung over and set it off. Those things scare the heck outa me- and the Phila orchestra, for another memorable reason to KIS,S. glc -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:54 PM To: [email protected] Cc: [email protected]; [email protected] Subject: RE: Water curtains for windows Water curtains instead of 2-4 hour rated firewalls/fire doors? Anyone else remember a particular carpet manufacturing plant in La Grange, Georgia, a good 15 years ago, that relied on a number of them instead of sprinklers, and amazingly burnt to the ground in a fire that started off in the middle of the shift? Bad memories aye? Jack C Kilavuz Mob: +65 9277 5741 Save Paper ? Save Power ? Save the Environment - Think before printing this e-mail! "Autry, David" <[email protected]> Sent by: [email protected] 23/09/2009 04:57 AM Please respond to [email protected] To "[email protected]" <[email protected]> cc Subject RE: Water curtains for windows Somewhere, somehow, somebody told some architects and engineers that they can use water curtains in lieu of fire-rated construction. David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov ** Note new email address: [email protected] -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [ mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Jerry Costello Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 3:48 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Water curtains for windows We have found that on occasion the arch will get a building modification to utilize sprinklers in lieu of a particular "fire rating" at a window wood panel etc... Normally the modification is quite specific as to one side or both. We have in these cases always used the 6' spacing rules for water curtain. Jerry M Costello set Advance Fire Protection Ph 714-526-2231 Fax 562-691-5482 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Chris Cahill Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 1:17 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Water curtains for windows Now I'm curious. What did you find? I didn't think there was anything about glass in 13. What Tim referenced is for vertical openings. Not applicable to glass walls. There is some stuff in the atrium section of IBC but that's very specific to atriums and wouldn't apply to other openings. Chris Cahill, P.E. Fire Protection Engineer Sentry Fire Protection, Inc. 763-658-4483 763-658-4921 fax Email: [email protected] Mail: P.O. Box 69 Waverly, MN 55390 Location: 4439 Hwy 12 SW Waverly, MN 55390 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Bobby Gillett Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 2:51 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Water curtains for windows Nevermind, we found it. Sorry about that...after all it is one of those days. Bobby Gillett Sr. Project Manager Key Fire Protection, Inc. (731) 424-0130 office (731) 424-9285 fax (731) 267-4853 cell [email protected] -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Bobby Gillett Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 2:49 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Water curtains for windows It's one of those days. We have a job calling for a water curtain (sprinklers on both sides of a window), Where is the direction from NFPA for this? I know TYCO makes a window sprinkler, but isn't there direction for standard sprinklers in NFPA somewhere? Thank You, Bobby Gillett Sr. Project Manager Key Fire Protection, Inc. (731) 424-0130 office (731) 424-9285 fax (731) 267-4853 cell <mailto:[email protected]> [email protected] _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ______________________________________________________________ Notice of Confidentiality This transmission contains information that may be confidential and that may also be privileged. Unless you are the intended recipient of the message (or authorised to receive it for the intended recipient) you may not copy, forward, or otherwise use it, or disclose it or its contents to anyone else. If you have received this transmission in error please notify us immediately and delete it from your system. RSA Group ============================================================== _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
