On Mon, Jun 23, 2014 at 8:23 AM, Moriel Schottlender <mor...@gmail.com> wrote: > Did this really just happen? > > Did we really just read someone suggesting that women are not participating > as much in the mailing list -- with the more-than-subtle suggestion of the > cause being that they didn't feel this group is completely woman-friendly -- > and your response was to "remind us" what the point of this group is about? > Did I misunderstand your email? > > > We're all here for the same goal, but some of us experience this problem > differently than others, and some appear to have gone frustrated and annoyed > and are not participating as much as they used to. That's a problem. That's > not something we should ignore. And we should figure out why it happens > (because it seemed to have happened to more than just two arguing women) and > how to make sure it is getting better. > > > Here's my (shocking) suggestion, as a starting point, at least in this > mailing list, to make things a tad better for women to participate in: > > In a group about the gender gap, men should attempt to take a step back.
Can we get this in the footer of every email? Or a link to: http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/Statement_of_purpose:_communities_including_men Then these threads can be one reply with a pointer to the link. :) -VAL > That is *not* to say they shouldn't participate: they absolutely should. But > they should understand that the dynamic between the genders is so > unbalanced, that at least in a group dedicated to the issue, they should > take extra care to listen, not be confrontational, and overall to not sound > like they are overtaking the conversation, making assumptions or > generalizations. > > The discussions would be a lot more productive, and women may feel a lot > less frustrated -- and choose to share more of their experiences with the > rest of the group which might actually bring us to consider solutions. > > And who knows, maybe we'll even have *one* space where women don't feel like > they need to constantly defend the "reasons" for their experiences and > feelings or be worried of the harassment that is otherwise a pretty usual > experience. > > > Moriel > > > > On Mon, Jun 23, 2014 at 9:57 AM, Derric Atzrott > <datzr...@alizeepathology.com> wrote: >> >> >> Carol Moore dc, 23/06/2014 06:34: >> >> A lot of women used to be outspoken about all this here when this email >> >> list started, but that stopped after a bunch of guys joined and started >> >> hassling them about it. >> >> SURPRISE!! >> > >> > By looking at this directory, I can tell that I mostly stopped reading >> > this list in January 2012, one week after a fight between two vocal >> > women. >> > >> > Nemo >> >> Nemo and Carol both, I really don't like the direction that this >> discussion is >> going. Can we please steer it back on topic and remember why we are all >> here? >> >> From the Mailing list signup page: >> "Addressing gender equity and exploring ways to increase the participation >> of >> women within Wikimedia projects. >> >> Wikimedia Foundation surveys show that the participation of women in >> Wikipedia >> and related projects are between 9 and 13 percent. This mailing list is >> provided by the Wikimedia Foundation as a communication tool to >> collectively >> address the realities of the gender gap within our projects. We are >> focused >> on discussing solutions and exploring opportunities that may serve as a >> starting point to improve gender equity, increase the participation of >> women >> and trans women, and reduce the impact of the gender gap within Wikipedia, >> Wikimedia Commons, and the 'free knowledge movement'. We want to encourage >> you >> to engage with others in this effort. Your thoughts and opinions in this >> regard matter to us and to the community." >> >> Thank you, >> Derric Atzrott >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Gendergap mailing list >> Gendergap@lists.wikimedia.org >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/gendergap > > > > > -- > No trees were harmed in the creation of this post. > But billions of electrons, photons, and electromagnetic waves were terribly > inconvenienced during its transmission! > > _______________________________________________ > Gendergap mailing list > Gendergap@lists.wikimedia.org > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/gendergap > -- Valerie Aurora Executive Director You can help increase the participation of women in open technology and culture! Donate today at http://adainitiative.org/donate/ _______________________________________________ Gendergap mailing list Gendergap@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/gendergap
