it sucks On Fri, Jun 22, 2018 at 3:34 PM Josh Luthman <j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
> You'll get used to it in a couple days :) > > > Josh Luthman > Office: 937-552-2340 > Direct: 937-552-2343 > 1100 Wayne St > Suite 1337 > Troy, OH 45373 > > On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 8:52 PM, Mathew Howard <mhoward...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> But the down side is that a lot of messages don't make it to the list, >> because somebody forgets to use reply all... I know this to be true, >> because I did it several times just today :P >> >> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018, 5:35 PM Josh Luthman <j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> >> wrote: >> >>> The list was changed so that the reply email address was the person that >>> sent the message. >>> >>> This means when (not if because we all know someone here has and will do >>> it) someone sets a vacation auto responder it doesn't blast the list. >>> >>> >>> Josh Luthman >>> Office: 937-552-2340 >>> Direct: 937-552-2343 >>> 1100 Wayne St >>> <https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g> >>> Suite 1337 >>> <https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g> >>> Troy, OH 45373 >>> <https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g> >>> >>> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 5:33 PM, Robert Andrews <i...@avantwireless.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't know if it's how the list is sending out or something that >>>> changed with Thunderbird but "reply-list" is now only reply-all for this >>>> message, but on the topic of 48v vs 24v there are a lot more solutions in >>>> ac-dc for 24v consumer level than 48v. and when 48v comes up most >>>> manufacturers instantly do 4x pricing it seems... >>>> >>>> On 06/21/2018 01:14 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: >>>> >>>>> Just think how small of wire you could use with 5K... >>>>> >>>>> Okay, yeah, there would be some other problems that would kind of make >>>>> that not worth it. 48V seems to be a pretty good compromise, there aren't >>>>> really any different safety concerns between 24v and 48v, so I don't >>>>> really >>>>> see a good argument for anything less than 48v, other than that it's what >>>>> we've been using for years... which isn't really that good of an argument, >>>>> when you think about it. >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 3:02 PM, <ch...@wbmfg.com <mailto: >>>>> ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Well my solar string inverters are 1K DC. >>>>> >>>>> Yep, if efficiency is the concern 5K would be good if you are >>>>> hauling the energy any distance at all. >>>>> Long distance transmission lines go up to 1 MV. >>>>> >>>>> But safety comes into play at some point. 48 volts is still >>>>> considered low voltage, less rules and regs and almost zero shock >>>>> hazard. I cannot feel 48. Some can. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- From: Robert Andrews >>>>> Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2018 1:59 PM >>>>> To: af@af.afmug.com <mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >>>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP voltages again - specifically 2ghz >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Ok, 5K volt then.. >>>>> >>>>> On 06/21/2018 11:20 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com <mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Higher is always better. >>>>> Wires are smaller. >>>>> Everything is more efficient. >>>>> Everything runs cooler. >>>>> Less voltage drop. >>>>> Less power loss in conductors. >>>>> Sometimes simplifies the design of the load device. >>>>> *From:* Josh Luthman >>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, June 21, 2018 12:17 PM >>>>> *To:* Chuck McCown >>>>> *Cc:* Mathew Howard ; AFMUG >>>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP voltages again - specifically 2ghz >>>>> In a perfect world it would all be 100% 48v (or hell even 100% >>>>> 24v) but the only rule of standards is that there are no >>>>> standards. >>>>> See XKCD 927 - https://xkcd.com/927/ >>>>> Josh Luthman >>>>> Office: 937-552-2340 >>>>> Direct: 937-552-2343 >>>>> 1100 Wayne St >>>>> <https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+%0D%0A%C2%A0+%C2%A0+%C2%A0+%C2%A0+Suite+1337+%0D%0A%C2%A0+%C2%A0+%C2%A0+%C2%A0+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g> >>>>> Suite 1337 >>>>> Troy, OH 45373 >>>>> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 2:10 PM, <ch...@wbmfg.com >>>>> <mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Nice to see the smaller players learning how to put on >>>>> their big boy >>>>> pants and join the ranks of carrier grade vendors. >>>>> *From:* Mathew Howard >>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, June 21, 2018 12:08 PM >>>>> *To:* Josh Luthman >>>>> *Cc:* Chuck McCown ; AFMUG >>>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP voltages again - specifically >>>>> 2ghz >>>>> Well, MikroTik does have 48v now (the hEX PoE/PowerBox Pro >>>>> will take >>>>> up to 57 volts), but it's only one or the other, it >>>>> doesn't >>>>> do any >>>>> voltage conversion. But what I've been doing at some >>>>> sites is >>>>> something like using one PowerBox Pro to feed all the 24v >>>>> only gear, >>>>> and a second one to feed the 48v gear. >>>>> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 1:02 PM, Josh Luthman >>>>> <j...@imaginenetworksllc.com >>>>> <mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Agreed. >>>>> EdgePoint does 48v only but has the outdoor part. >>>>> Netonix does 24v and 48v but doesn't have any outdoor >>>>> capability >>>>> (enclosures would have to be ridiculous for the 12 >>>>> port+) >>>>> Mikrotik only has 4 ports and 24v only. >>>>> >>>>> Josh Luthman >>>>> Office: 937-552-2340 >>>>> Direct: 937-552-2343 >>>>> 1100 Wayne St >>>>> <https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St&entry=gmail&source=g> >>>>> >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> >> >>>>> Suite 1337 >>>>> >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> >> >>>>> Troy, OH 45373 >>>>> >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 2:01 PM, Mathew Howard >>>>> <mhoward...@gmail.com <mailto:mhoward...@gmail.com>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Yeah, that's the easiest compromise at this point. >>>>> What I'd like, is a box that I can connect a power >>>>> supply to >>>>> (whether that's 48v, or 24v, I don't care) that >>>>> gives my a >>>>> 48v and a 24v output, and has another connection >>>>> for >>>>> batteries and it deals with feeding the batteries >>>>> the >>>>> correct voltages and current. Whether that's 12v, >>>>> 24v or 48v >>>>> batteries, I don't really care... although I'd >>>>> prefer 12v or >>>>> 24v so can use a smaller number of bigger >>>>> batteries, if I >>>>> want to. >>>>> Ideally, Forrest would build this, so I could just >>>>> plug it >>>>> into the SiteMonitors that are already there, and >>>>> be able to >>>>> monitor and control it as well. >>>>> Of course I can buy all the parts separately to do >>>>> the same >>>>> thing, but having a pre-built box to do the job >>>>> would be a >>>>> lot cleaner. >>>>> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 12:52 PM, Josh Luthman >>>>> <j...@imaginenetworksllc.com >>>>> <mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> It was 48v >>>>> Then it was mostly 24v >>>>> Now it's going 48v >>>>> Just give it a little bit, it'll go back to >>>>> 24v. >>>>> I'd rather get a power supply doing 26v to >>>>> fix my >>>>> problem in 2 minutes than start changing >>>>> things >>>>> to 48v >>>>> which would blow so much stuff up (epmp non >>>>> gps, ubnt M >>>>> gear, half the Mikrotiks) >>>>> >>>>> Josh Luthman >>>>> Office: 937-552-2340 >>>>> Direct: 937-552-2343 >>>>> 1100 Wayne St >>>>> <https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St&entry=gmail&source=g> >>>>> >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> >> >>>>> Suite 1337 >>>>> >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> >> >>>>> Troy, OH 45373 >>>>> >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 1:05 PM, Mathew Howard >>>>> <mhoward...@gmail.com >>>>> <mailto:mhoward...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> No, there's not really a good reason, it >>>>> just means >>>>> you have an extra part to deal with. >>>>> We still use UBNT for our 2.4ghz stuff, >>>>> but >>>>> those >>>>> are the only radios that won't run off 48v >>>>> on most >>>>> of our new sites, so I've done some that >>>>> are 48v >>>>> only and just use those things on the >>>>> radios that >>>>> need them. But if you have more than 1 or >>>>> 2 >>>>> things >>>>> that need 24v, it's generally more >>>>> practical to just >>>>> use a bigger voltage converter and run >>>>> multiple >>>>> radios off it. >>>>> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 11:57 AM, >>>>> <ch...@wbmfg.com <mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Yep, that was what I was thinking. >>>>> So, looks to me like there is no >>>>> reason >>>>> not to >>>>> do 48 volts. >>>>> *From:* Mathew Howard >>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, June 21, 2018 10:56 >>>>> AM >>>>> *To:* Chuck McCown >>>>> *Cc:* Dave ; AFMUG >>>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP voltages >>>>> again - >>>>> specifically 2ghz >>>>> You mean like this? >>>>> >>>>> https://www.ubnt.com/accessories/instant-8023af-adapters/ >>>>> <https://www.ubnt.com/accessories/instant-8023af-adapters/> >>>>> >>>>> <https://www.ubnt.com/accessories/instant-8023af-adapters/ >>>>> <https://www.ubnt.com/accessories/instant-8023af-adapters/>> >>>>> Or do you have something better in >>>>> mind? >>>>> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 11:53 AM, >>>>> <ch...@wbmfg.com >>>>> <mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Me too... >>>>> So, what appetite is there for an >>>>> inline POE >>>>> regulator that would convert 48 >>>>> to 24? >>>>> *From:* Mathew Howard >>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, June 21, 2018 >>>>> 10:50 AM >>>>> *To:* Dave >>>>> *Cc:* AFMUG >>>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP >>>>> voltages again - >>>>> specifically 2ghz >>>>> ugh... I keep forgetting to use >>>>> reply-to-all... >>>>> Not every single UBNT radio... >>>>> all the >>>>> airfibers will happily take 48v. >>>>> Mikrotik is >>>>> finally starting to make most of >>>>> the new >>>>> stuff handle 48v (including the >>>>> PowerBox >>>>> Pro), but yeah. UBNT is the reason >>>>> I still >>>>> have to use 24v on most of our >>>>> towers... >>>>> they make a converter you can >>>>> stick >>>>> on in >>>>> line with the radios, but that's >>>>> kind of a >>>>> pain if you have more than one or >>>>> two, and >>>>> it's an extra part to fail. >>>>> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 11:46 AM, >>>>> Dave >>>>> <dmilho...@wletc.com >>>>> <mailto:dmilho...@wletc.com>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> They make dental floss for >>>>> that :) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 06/21/2018 11:39 AM, Josh >>>>> Luthman wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Except for every single >>>>> Ubnt device >>>>> and a majority of >>>>> Mikrotiks.... >>>>> Josh Luthman >>>>> Office: 937-552-2340 >>>>> Direct: 937-552-2343 >>>>> 1100 Wayne St >>>>> <https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St&entry=gmail&source=g> >>>>> >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+%0D%0A++++45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+%0D%0A++++45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> >> >>>>> Suite 1337 >>>>> >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+%0D%0A++++45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+%0D%0A++++45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> >> >>>>> Troy, OH 45373 >>>>> >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+%0D%0A++++++Wayne+St+Suite+%0D%0A++++++1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+%0D%0A++++++Wayne+St+Suite+%0D%0A++++++1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> >> >>>>> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at >>>>> 12:39 PM, Josh >>>>> Baird < >>>>> joshba...@gmail.com >>>>> <mailto:joshba...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> I promise life will be >>>>> easier if >>>>> you just use 48V. :) >>>>> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 >>>>> at >>>>> 12:35 PM, >>>>> Josh Luthman >>>>> < >>>>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com >>>>> <mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> I'm trying to use >>>>> a >>>>> Powerbox >>>>> Pro to power up >>>>> two >>>>> epmp APs. The 5 GHz is just fine but the >>>>> 2 GHz is saying >>>>> current too >>>>> low. Both ports >>>>> are getting >>>>> 23 volts and the >>>>> cables are >>>>> <10 feet (from the >>>>> Powerbox Pro). >>>>> Does anyone know >>>>> if >>>>> the 2ghz >>>>> requires more >>>>> voltage possibly? >>>>> Spec sheet does >>>>> say >>>>> 23 volts >>>>> min but it's weird >>>>> one powers >>>>> (5 ghz) and the >>>>> other doesn't. >>>>> Josh Luthman >>>>> Office: >>>>> 937-552-2340 >>>>> Direct: >>>>> 937-552-2343 >>>>> 1100 Wayne St >>>>> <https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St&entry=gmail&source=g> >>>>> >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> >> >>>>> Suite 1337 >>>>> >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> >> >>>>> Troy, OH 45373 >>>>> >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> < >>>>> https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >>>>> >> >>>>> -- >>>>> AF mailing list >>>>> AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> >>>>> >>>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>>> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >>>>> >>>>> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>>> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> -- >>>>> AF mailing list >>>>> AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> >>>>> >>>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>>> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >>>>> >>>>> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>>> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>> -- AF >>>>> mailing list >>>>> AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> >>>>> >>>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>>> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >>>>> >>>>> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>>> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- AF mailing list >>>>> AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> >>>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>>> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >>>>> < >>>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>>> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- AF mailing list >>>>> AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> >>>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>>> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >>>>> >>>>> -- AF mailing list >>>>> AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> >>>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>>> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> -- >>>> AF mailing list >>>> AF@af.afmug.com >>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> AF mailing list >>> AF@af.afmug.com >>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>> >> > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >
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