Except most auto-responders are caught by most list software.
----- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions Midwest Internet Exchange The Brothers WISP ----- Original Message ----- From: "Josh Luthman" <j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> To: "Robert Andrews" <i...@avantwireless.com> Cc: "AFMUG" <af@af.afmug.com> Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2018 5:33:29 PM Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP voltages again - specifically 2ghz The list was changed so that the reply email address was the person that sent the message. This means when (not if because we all know someone here has and will do it) someone sets a vacation auto responder it doesn't blast the list. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 5:33 PM, Robert Andrews < i...@avantwireless.com > wrote: I don't know if it's how the list is sending out or something that changed with Thunderbird but "reply-list" is now only reply-all for this message, but on the topic of 48v vs 24v there are a lot more solutions in ac-dc for 24v consumer level than 48v. and when 48v comes up most manufacturers instantly do 4x pricing it seems... On 06/21/2018 01:14 PM, Mathew Howard wrote: <blockquote> Just think how small of wire you could use with 5K... Okay, yeah, there would be some other problems that would kind of make that not worth it. 48V seems to be a pretty good compromise, there aren't really any different safety concerns between 24v and 48v, so I don't really see a good argument for anything less than 48v, other than that it's what we've been using for years... which isn't really that good of an argument, when you think about it. On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 3:02 PM, < ch...@wbmfg.com <mailto: ch...@wbmfg.com >> wrote: Well my solar string inverters are 1K DC. Yep, if efficiency is the concern 5K would be good if you are hauling the energy any distance at all. Long distance transmission lines go up to 1 MV. But safety comes into play at some point. 48 volts is still considered low voltage, less rules and regs and almost zero shock hazard. I cannot feel 48. Some can. -----Original Message----- From: Robert Andrews Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2018 1:59 PM To: af@af.afmug.com <mailto: af@af.afmug.com > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ePMP voltages again - specifically 2ghz Ok, 5K volt then.. On 06/21/2018 11:20 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com <mailto: ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: Higher is always better. Wires are smaller. Everything is more efficient. Everything runs cooler. Less voltage drop. Less power loss in conductors. Sometimes simplifies the design of the load device. *From:* Josh Luthman *Sent:* Thursday, June 21, 2018 12:17 PM *To:* Chuck McCown *Cc:* Mathew Howard ; AFMUG *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP voltages again - specifically 2ghz In a perfect world it would all be 100% 48v (or hell even 100% 24v) but the only rule of standards is that there are no standards. See XKCD 927 - https://xkcd.com/927/ Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 2:10 PM, < ch...@wbmfg.com <mailto: ch...@wbmfg.com >> wrote: Nice to see the smaller players learning how to put on their big boy pants and join the ranks of carrier grade vendors. *From:* Mathew Howard *Sent:* Thursday, June 21, 2018 12:08 PM *To:* Josh Luthman *Cc:* Chuck McCown ; AFMUG *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP voltages again - specifically 2ghz Well, MikroTik does have 48v now (the hEX PoE/PowerBox Pro will take up to 57 volts), but it's only one or the other, it doesn't do any voltage conversion. But what I've been doing at some sites is something like using one PowerBox Pro to feed all the 24v only gear, and a second one to feed the 48v gear. On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 1:02 PM, Josh Luthman < j...@imaginenetworksllc.com <mailto: j...@imaginenetworksllc.com >> wrote: Agreed. EdgePoint does 48v only but has the outdoor part. Netonix does 24v and 48v but doesn't have any outdoor capability (enclosures would have to be ridiculous for the 12 port+) Mikrotik only has 4 ports and 24v only. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >> Suite 1337 < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >> Troy, OH 45373 < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 2:01 PM, Mathew Howard < mhoward...@gmail.com <mailto: mhoward...@gmail.com >> wrote: Yeah, that's the easiest compromise at this point. What I'd like, is a box that I can connect a power supply to (whether that's 48v, or 24v, I don't care) that gives my a 48v and a 24v output, and has another connection for batteries and it deals with feeding the batteries the correct voltages and current. Whether that's 12v, 24v or 48v batteries, I don't really care... although I'd prefer 12v or 24v so can use a smaller number of bigger batteries, if I want to. Ideally, Forrest would build this, so I could just plug it into the SiteMonitors that are already there, and be able to monitor and control it as well. Of course I can buy all the parts separately to do the same thing, but having a pre-built box to do the job would be a lot cleaner. On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 12:52 PM, Josh Luthman < j...@imaginenetworksllc.com <mailto: j...@imaginenetworksllc.com >> wrote: It was 48v Then it was mostly 24v Now it's going 48v Just give it a little bit, it'll go back to 24v. I'd rather get a power supply doing 26v to fix my problem in 2 minutes than start changing things to 48v which would blow so much stuff up (epmp non gps, ubnt M gear, half the Mikrotiks) Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >> Suite 1337 < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >> Troy, OH 45373 < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 1:05 PM, Mathew Howard < mhoward...@gmail.com <mailto: mhoward...@gmail.com >> wrote: No, there's not really a good reason, it just means you have an extra part to deal with. We still use UBNT for our 2.4ghz stuff, but those are the only radios that won't run off 48v on most of our new sites, so I've done some that are 48v only and just use those things on the radios that need them. But if you have more than 1 or 2 things that need 24v, it's generally more practical to just use a bigger voltage converter and run multiple radios off it. On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 11:57 AM, < ch...@wbmfg.com <mailto: ch...@wbmfg.com >> wrote: Yep, that was what I was thinking. So, looks to me like there is no reason not to do 48 volts. *From:* Mathew Howard *Sent:* Thursday, June 21, 2018 10:56 AM *To:* Chuck McCown *Cc:* Dave ; AFMUG *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP voltages again - specifically 2ghz You mean like this? https://www.ubnt.com/accessories/instant-8023af-adapters/ < https://www.ubnt.com/accessories/instant-8023af-adapters/ > < https://www.ubnt.com/accessories/instant-8023af-adapters/ < https://www.ubnt.com/accessories/instant-8023af-adapters/ >> Or do you have something better in mind? On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 11:53 AM, < ch...@wbmfg.com <mailto: ch...@wbmfg.com >> wrote: Me too... So, what appetite is there for an inline POE regulator that would convert 48 to 24? *From:* Mathew Howard *Sent:* Thursday, June 21, 2018 10:50 AM *To:* Dave *Cc:* AFMUG *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ePMP voltages again - specifically 2ghz ugh... I keep forgetting to use reply-to-all... Not every single UBNT radio... all the airfibers will happily take 48v. Mikrotik is finally starting to make most of the new stuff handle 48v (including the PowerBox Pro), but yeah. UBNT is the reason I still have to use 24v on most of our towers... they make a converter you can stick on in line with the radios, but that's kind of a pain if you have more than one or two, and it's an extra part to fail. On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 11:46 AM, Dave < dmilho...@wletc.com <mailto: dmilho...@wletc.com >> wrote: They make dental floss for that :) On 06/21/2018 11:39 AM, Josh Luthman wrote: Except for every single Ubnt device and a majority of Mikrotiks.... Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+%0D%0A++++45373&entry=gmail&source=g < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+%0D%0A++++45373&entry=gmail&source=g >> Suite 1337 < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+%0D%0A++++45373&entry=gmail&source=g < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+Wayne+St+Suite+1337+Troy,+OH+%0D%0A++++45373&entry=gmail&source=g >> Troy, OH 45373 < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+%0D%0A++++++Wayne+St+Suite+%0D%0A++++++1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g < https://maps.google.com/?q=1100+%0D%0A++++++Wayne+St+Suite+%0D%0A++++++1337+Troy,+OH+45373&entry=gmail&source=g >> On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 12:39 PM, Josh Baird < joshba...@gmail.com <mailto: joshba...@gmail.com >> wrote: I promise life will be easier if you just use 48V. :) On Thu, Jun 21, 2018 at 12:35 PM, Josh Luthman < j...@imaginenetworksllc.com <mailto: j...@imaginenetworksllc.com >> wrote: I'm trying to use a Powerbox Pro to power up two epmp APs. The 5 GHz is just fine but the 2 GHz is saying current too low. Both ports are getting 23 volts and the cables are <10 feet (from the Powerbox Pro). Does anyone know if the 2ghz requires more voltage possibly? Spec sheet does say 23 volts min but it's weird one powers (5 ghz) and the other doesn't. 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