Joe Schaffner wrote:
> Hello Thomas,
>
> It looks like we're all looking for non-standard ways to
> capture polytonic Greek in Linux. This must mean no keymap
> exists. Given one hundred years I'll figure out xkb and write
> one.
xkb is not so difficult to figure out. At the moment you can
already enter polytonic Greek with it, and if you set the
Greek/Latin switch to a single key (I use left-windows), entering
mixed text consisting of Greek and Latin is not difficult.
The problem is: what is, from a user point of view, the desired
behaviour of the keyboard? At the moment xkb gr(polytonic) has:
key US GR keysym with gives
<AD11> [ [ dead_tilde α ᾶ (perispomeni)
shift<AD11> { { dead_diaeresis υ (=y) ϋ (dialytika)
altgr<AD12> « dead_macron α ᾱ (macron)
<AD12> ] ] dead_iota α ᾳ (iota subscript)
shift<AD12> } } VoidSymbol α α (does nothing)
altgr<AD12> » dead_breve α ᾰ (breve)
<AC10> ; ´ dead_acute α ά (tonos/oxia)
shift<AC10> : ¨ dead_horn α ἀ (psili)
altgr<AC10> ΅ [not defined] α α (does nothing)
<AC11> ' ' dead_grave α ὰ (varia)
shift<AC11> " " dead_ogonek α ἁ (dasia)
altgr<AC11> [not defined] α α (does nothing)
AC and AD indicate the third and fourth keyboard row from below,
respectively. The number indicates the position of the key
counting from the left, but not counting shift, capslock, tab.
The column "US" shows which symbols are engraved on the physical
keys of a standard US PC 104 keyboard. The column "GR" shows what
is engraved on the physical keys of a Greek keyboard, according to
Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keyboard_layout#Greek). I
do not know how standard this is (in Greece).
The keysyms dead_ogonek and dead_horn are only interpreted as
dasia and psili if the locale is el_GR.UTF-8. To use gr(polytonic)
with 'international' UTF-locales, these keysyms should be replaced
by 0x1000314 and 0x1000313 respectively (edit the file
/etc/X11/xkb/symbols/pc/gr).
Combinations, like ᾄ, are also possible; you have to use a fixed
order:
-- iota subscript first
-- accent second
-- breathing third
So for ᾧ you woud enter the keystroke sequence (keys as marked on
a US keyboard) ]["v. [The order, I admit, seems unnatural. The
order that you propose looks better. This can be changed in the
Compose file, and maybe it should be filed as a bug -- but where?
Where does the Compose file come from?]
This works in openoffice, mozilla, and any text-mode editor you like.
The question is, is this a workable system in practice? I am sure
any desired keyboard behaviour could easily be made to work with
the tools we have (editing the files in /etc/X11/xkb and the
Compose file).
For instance, earlier on the list, Simos Xenitellis called
attention to a proposal for polytonic handling in Linux:
http://planet.hellug.gr/misc/polytonic/
This document has some keyboard combination tables of which a
small part is given below:
tonos/oxia ΄ Dead key (;) + vowel
dialytika ¨ Dead key (:) + vowel (only υ, ι)
perispomeni ῀ Dead key ([) + vowel
iota subscript ͺ Dead key ({) + vowel
psili ᾿ Dead key (') + vowel/ρ
dasia ῾ Dead key (") + vowel/ρ
varia ` Dead key (/) + vowel
macron ¯ Dead key (]) + vowel
breve ˘ Dead key (}) + vowel
Only a few of those are the same as what xkb now provides, but it
is easy to change /etc/X11/xkb/symbols/pc/gr to give it this
behaviour:
xkb_symbols "polytonic" {
include "pc/el(extended)"
name[Group1] = "Greece - Polytonic";
key <AD11> { [ dead_tilde, dead_iota ] };
key <AD12> { [ dead_macron, dead_breve ] };
key <AC10> { [ dead_acute, dead_diaeresis ] };
key <AC11> { [ 0x1000313, 0x1000314 ] };
key <AB10> { [ dead_grave, question ] };
};
This of course makes the / key "dead". The AltGr key is no longer
used. The Compose file does not have to be changed, but if the
other characters mentioned in the 'proposal' would have to be
entered (koppa, digamma, etc.) a few lines should be added to it.
Would this be easier to use than the present xkb system? I don't
know.
Thomas Wolff suggests using 'unused' keys like F6 for oxia, etc.
Again, I think that usability is the most important criterion for
the choice. To type Greek you would have to switch your keyboard
from Latin to Greek anyway. In the 'Greek' state all keys can get
a different function. Ideally the 'Greek' keys would do similar
things to 'Latin' keys (i.e. dead tilde would become dead
perispomeni, dead acute would become dead tonos, perhaps alt-i
could become dead_iota, etc.). But there does not seem to be a
special need to look for 'unused' keys, because in 'Greek' mode,
keys can be re-used.
Finally, would the system which is available on Windows XP
(http://www.microsoft.com/globaldev/perspectives/polytonic.mspx)
be better for people who type a lot of polytonic? This may require
fewer keystrokes. However, there are a lot of altgr and
shift-altgr combinations, and it looks like it would take quite
some effort to learn them. To make this method work on Linux it
seems we would have to invent keysyms for 'combined accents'
(treating, for instance, dasia+oxia+dead_iota as 'one thing'). Or
perhaps existing keysyms could be (ab)used, like the ogonek in the
original xkb gr file. It certainly can be done (although it would
be a bit of work). Well, unless μ$ has patented this.
> [..] The encoding always begins with the breathing (if it
> exists)followed by the accents (if they exist) followed by the
> iota subscript (if it exists). [My locale Config file at home
> has listed all the combinations in any order, but I find that
> tedious.]
> [..] The perl script works. Here it is: [..]
It certainly works, but it is an 'off-line' method, similar to the
beta code to utf-8 converter by Dimitri Marinakis
(http://tlgu.carmen.gr). Such utilities are useful, but wouldn't
it be better to type polytonic utf-8 directly?
Ceterum censeo /usr/lib/X11/locale/el_GR.UTF-8/Compose esse delendam.
Regards, Jan
http://www.jw-stumpel.nl/stestu
--
Linux-UTF8: i18n of Linux on all levels
Archive: http://mail.nl.linux.org/linux-utf8/
