I should really ask more questions like this. Really brings good ideas and interesting responses but most importantly a lot of real world answers. Thanks for all the replies people. Its quite interesting to see people's views on this issue. One reads a lot of 'hypothetical' answers online but with no connection to the real world, but this conversation has brought some testaments to the table.
On Fri, Feb 3, 2012 at 10:36 AM, Markus A. Wipfler <[email protected] > wrote: > So true, great analogy. > > Regards, > > -- > Markus > > On Feb 3, 2012, at 7:32 AM, Sanga Collins wrote: > > > Hi Simon. > > > > I just executed this exact migration (a month or so from finalizing > zentyal slaves) to summarize the experience. > > > > Windows infrastructure is like a microwaveable tv dinner. Expensive but > Put it in for 7 minutes and you get a decent meal void of flavor and taste > but every time you do it it turns out pretty much the same. Linux > infrastructure is like cooking from scratch with cheap ingredients. Great > cook a d u have a great meal. Bad cook and it's a cluster-fck of useless > stuff. > > > > Companies for the most part won't take chances on Linux and will opt for > the package deal. For them it's less risk and head ache. They don't give a > hoot if a good Linux admin can deliver the moon and stars for pennys on the > dollar if they feel risk of getting a sack of turd is equally high. > > > > Sent from my iPad > > > > On Feb 2, 2012, at 7:21 AM, Simon Vass <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> Zentyal or Zimbra over Exchange + AD any day of the week and twice on > Sundays. In terms of sheer time spent administering each system, and > therefore to me the TCO or TCA. I still administer both, even with > Powershell which does at least allow the option of headless delivery for > Windows and Exchange (wonder where they got that idea from). To the multi > gig updates just to run the platform! > >> > >> Zentyal and Zimbra both do a great job of bringing together > Postfix+Dovecot+WInterface+Database store+LDAP, Zentyal does without having > to anywhere near a tarbell/deb file if you don't want. > >> > >> We do need to do a whole lot more to promote Linux both in the front > and back office, far more people ask about and have heard of Linux than a > few years ago. In my day dreams I imagine one day it might be fun to do > some TV/Web programs around Linux, but so don't have the time. > >> > >> I see Albert Mucunguzi has a Tech spot on UBC maybe we could suggest > sending our more smartly dressed members along to talk about free and open > source software? > >> > >> > >> Simon Vass > >> Managing Director > >> E-Tech Uganda Ltd > >> > >> http://www.etech.ug > >> Tel: +256 (0) 312260620 or (0) 312260621 > >> email: [email protected] > >> skype: e-techservicedesk > >> > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: "Markus A. Wipfler" <[email protected]> > >> To: "Uganda Linux User Group" <[email protected]> > >> Sent: Thursday, 2 February, 2012 1:44:25 PM > >> Subject: Re: [LUG] Does Uganda have a demand for Linux Administrators? > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Mostly true. Windows is APITA and fugly. But seriously would you rather > administer Active Dir + Exchange or try to move your whole Org to SAMBA + > LDAP + courier/dovecot, etc…. Of course you could look at stuff like zimbra > but if you want enterprise level functionality you will still have to pay > for it. Also there is always the compatibility issue with legacy > applications and windows only hardware drivers, not to mention staff > retraining. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> I love linux and a great part of my work is spend in a terminal window > but the average user will never even want to know what a tar ball is or how > to apt-get install a bin, and why should they? > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Regards, > >> > >> -- > >> Markus > >> > >> > >> On Feb 2, 2012, at 12:35 PM, [email protected] wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> You have to admit though, sometimes one really wants to do exactly > that. :) > >> > >> Windows can be frustrating if one is used to something more... > serviceable. > >> > >> > >> Cavin Mugarura < [email protected] > wrote: > >> > >> When doing a migration you have to use your brain > >> > >> Not scorched earth policy, by dousing every computer with windows with > gasoline and setting it ablaze > >> > >> > >> T-Mobile. America’s First Nationwide 4G Network > >> > >> "Markus A. Wipfler" < [email protected] > wrote: > >> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>> Interesting if you join a company you can convince them to migrate to > Linux > >>> > >>> Why would you do that??? Imagine you are the new sys admin at xyz > company in charge of backend services running enterprise microsoft software > like Exchange, Active Directory, Sharepoint which are used by hundreds or > thousands of users. > >>> Now since you love linux and believe that linux is like a super patch > that fixes any computer problem, you suggest to management that you want to > migrate all backend services to linux. I am not saying its impossible > >> but is > >> it feasible? You can drive your car with your feet but it does't > necesarily make it a good idea. What I am saying is that just using Linux > for Linux sake is plain stupid. > >>> > >>> Remember a couple of years ago Germany's government tried to make a > switch to Linux (backend + frontend) which sadly failed and now they are > back to running windows. The problem in their case basically boiled down to > 3 issues: > >>> > >>> - hardware support (too many printers, scanners, etc.. just didn't > work when they where plugged into linux desktops / laptops and the amount > of support and time required to make them work) > >>> - interoperability (its hard migrating away from proprietary software, > especially Ms Office / Exchange combo) > >>> - training and user adoption (reluctancy of staff to use new, > unfamiliar software, cost / time of training staff) > >>> > >>> As far as I can see the best chance linux (AND Linux Admins) have > here in Uganda is in the market of S > >> oHo and > >> SME's. Here Linux could be used as a cost effective and even superior > alternative to propriatary software with a relatively low learning curve > for end users. (Employes still use outlook, ms office but with linux > backend, firewall, router, directory service, intra/extra net,etc…) > >>> > >>> IMHO Linux will always be a niche OS. Why blindly advocate it to > everyone? It reminds me of some saved people I know, who believe everyone > else is going straight to hell if you don't join them. LOL. > >>> > >>> > >>> Regards, > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Markus > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>> > >>>> If you fail to do so, blame yourself > >>>> > >>>> In my local language there's a saying "bamusella omukatale yatongana > noruguddo" literally translated as "he was charged high prices at the > market and he is now quarrelling with the road > >>>> > >>>> If you are referring to job posting s advertising fo > >> r > >> Microsoft skills that's another issue > >>>> > >>>> This issue is actually a side show > >>>> What is more important is to promote Linux on a bigger scale in > government, schools, private sector and non profits > >>>> > >>>> Of course outfits like LUG have tried but with dismal results > >>>> > >>>> Sometime back I wrote how entities like LUG, IT companies can work > together and promote Linux but I guess my proposal fell on deaf ears > >>>> > >>>> LUG meetup s are good but most times when I look at the agenda, it s > not different from a pastor preaching to a choir > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> "Stephen S. Musoke" < [email protected] > wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> Ronald, > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> You are wrong. Windows flourishes because it is already at the > desktop, so > >>>>> is much easier to integrate at the Server end. > >> Truth > >> be told, Windows is > >>>>> becoming better at the backend and is also very good at integrating > with > >>>>> Linux/Unix (MSFT/Novelle) partnership. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> You will not find a truly homogenous environment, you will find > Windows for > >>>>> File/Print/Active Directory and *nix at the database and application > server > >>>>> levels, and in virtualized applicatons. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> Stephen > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of > >>>>> Ronald Kato Odongo > >>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2012 9:37 AM > >>>>> To: Uganda Linux User Group > >>>>> Subject: Re: [LUG] Does Uganda have a demand for Linux > Administrators? > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> > >>> > >>>>> It would be be up to us interested in Linux administration to go out > and > >>>>> offer it as an alternative to Windows. Windows is flourishing due in > part to > >>>>> ignorance about Linux technologies. If we pushed Linux harder into > the > >>>>> market, then the market would realize it's enormous advantage over > windows. > >>>>> Sometimes the best products are ignored because not enough has been > put in > >>>>> promoting them. > >>>>> > >>>>> On Thu, Feb 2, 2012 at 9:27 AM, Robert Muwanga < [email protected]> > >>>>> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> On a curious note, I have seen a lot of companies that utilise > Microsoft > >>>>> Server backend systems but unless it is the big telco boys (and > banks) I > >>>>> haven't heard of an interest in Linux for either backend or front > end in > >>>>> Uganda in particular. > >>>>> > >>>>> So, the > >> question is, what's people's opinion with regards on the demand for > >>>>> Linux in Uganda? is it rising? is it shrinking or stagnant? And in > effect, > >>>>> what is the demand for Linux administrators in the country? > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >> > >>>>> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug > >>>>> > >>>>> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: > [email protected] > >>>>> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] / > >>>>> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug > >>>>> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug > >>>>> > >>>>> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted b > >> y > >> INFOCOM: > >>>>> http://www.infocom.co.ug / > >>>>> > >>>>> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them > (including > >>>>> attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible for > them in > >>>>> any way. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> -- > >>>>> Thanks and Regards, > >>>>> > >>>>> Ronald Kato Odongo > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >> > >>>>> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug > >>>>> > >>>>> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: > [email protected] > >>>>> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] / > >>>>> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug > >>>>> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug > >>>>> > >>>>> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: > http://www.infocom.co.ug / > >>>>> > >>>>> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them > (including attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible > for them in any way. > >>>> > >> > >>>> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug > >>>> > >>>> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: > [email protected] > >>>> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] / > >>>> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug > >>>> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug > >>>> > >>>> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: > http://www.infocom.co.ug / > >>>> > >>>> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them > (including attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible > for them in any way. > >>> > >>> > >> > >>> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug > >>> > >>> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: > [email protected] > >>> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] / > >>> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug > >>> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug > >>> > >>> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: > http://www.infocom.co.ug / > >>> > >>> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them > (including attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible > for them in any way. > >> > >> > >> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug > >> > >> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: > [email protected] > >> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] / > >> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug > >> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug > >> > >> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: > http://www.infocom.co.ug / > >> > >> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them (including > attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible for them in > any way. _______________________________________________ > >> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug > >> > >> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: > [email protected] > >> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > >> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug > >> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug > >> > >> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: > http://www.infocom.co.ug/ > >> > >> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them (including > attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible for them in > any way. > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug > >> > >> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: > [email protected] > >> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > >> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug > >> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug > >> > >> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: > http://www.infocom.co.ug/ > >> > >> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them (including > attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible for them in > any way. > >> _______________________________________________ > >> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug > >> > >> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: > [email protected] > >> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > >> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug > >> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug > >> > >> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: > http://www.infocom.co.ug/ > >> > >> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them (including > attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible for them in > any way. > > _______________________________________________ > > The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug > > > > Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: > [email protected] > > Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > > Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug > > To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug > > > > The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: > http://www.infocom.co.ug/ > > > > The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them (including > attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible for them in > any way. > > _______________________________________________ > The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug > > Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: > [email protected] > Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug > To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug > > The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: > http://www.infocom.co.ug/ > > The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them (including > attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible for them in > any way. >
_______________________________________________ The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: [email protected] Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: http://www.infocom.co.ug/ The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them (including attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible for them in any way.
