Great stuff Robert. I too like seeing questions like this on the list. Please bring moaaaarrrrrr!!!! On Sat, Feb 4, 2012 at 8:58 AM, Robert Muwanga <[email protected]> wrote:
> I should really ask more questions like this. Really brings good ideas and > interesting responses but most importantly a lot of real world answers. > Thanks for all the replies people. Its quite interesting to see people's > views on this issue. One reads a lot of 'hypothetical' answers online but > with no connection to the real world, but this conversation has brought > some testaments to the table. > > > On Fri, Feb 3, 2012 at 10:36 AM, Markus A. Wipfler < > [email protected]> wrote: > >> So true, great analogy. >> >> Regards, >> >> -- >> Markus >> >> On Feb 3, 2012, at 7:32 AM, Sanga Collins wrote: >> >> > Hi Simon. >> > >> > I just executed this exact migration (a month or so from finalizing >> zentyal slaves) to summarize the experience. >> > >> > Windows infrastructure is like a microwaveable tv dinner. Expensive but >> Put it in for 7 minutes and you get a decent meal void of flavor and taste >> but every time you do it it turns out pretty much the same. Linux >> infrastructure is like cooking from scratch with cheap ingredients. Great >> cook a d u have a great meal. Bad cook and it's a cluster-fck of useless >> stuff. >> > >> > Companies for the most part won't take chances on Linux and will opt >> for the package deal. For them it's less risk and head ache. They don't >> give a hoot if a good Linux admin can deliver the moon and stars for pennys >> on the dollar if they feel risk of getting a sack of turd is equally high. >> > >> > Sent from my iPad >> > >> > On Feb 2, 2012, at 7:21 AM, Simon Vass <[email protected]> wrote: >> > >> >> Zentyal or Zimbra over Exchange + AD any day of the week and twice on >> Sundays. In terms of sheer time spent administering each system, and >> therefore to me the TCO or TCA. I still administer both, even with >> Powershell which does at least allow the option of headless delivery for >> Windows and Exchange (wonder where they got that idea from). To the multi >> gig updates just to run the platform! >> >> >> >> Zentyal and Zimbra both do a great job of bringing together >> Postfix+Dovecot+WInterface+Database store+LDAP, Zentyal does without having >> to anywhere near a tarbell/deb file if you don't want. >> >> >> >> We do need to do a whole lot more to promote Linux both in the front >> and back office, far more people ask about and have heard of Linux than a >> few years ago. In my day dreams I imagine one day it might be fun to do >> some TV/Web programs around Linux, but so don't have the time. >> >> >> >> I see Albert Mucunguzi has a Tech spot on UBC maybe we could suggest >> sending our more smartly dressed members along to talk about free and open >> source software? >> >> >> >> >> >> Simon Vass >> >> Managing Director >> >> E-Tech Uganda Ltd >> >> >> >> http://www.etech.ug >> >> Tel: +256 (0) 312260620 or (0) 312260621 >> >> email: [email protected] >> >> skype: e-techservicedesk >> >> >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> >> From: "Markus A. Wipfler" <[email protected]> >> >> To: "Uganda Linux User Group" <[email protected]> >> >> Sent: Thursday, 2 February, 2012 1:44:25 PM >> >> Subject: Re: [LUG] Does Uganda have a demand for Linux Administrators? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Mostly true. Windows is APITA and fugly. But seriously would you >> rather administer Active Dir + Exchange or try to move your whole Org to >> SAMBA + LDAP + courier/dovecot, etc…. Of course you could look at stuff >> like zimbra but if you want enterprise level functionality you will still >> have to pay for it. Also there is always the compatibility issue with >> legacy applications and windows only hardware drivers, not to mention staff >> retraining. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I love linux and a great part of my work is spend in a terminal window >> but the average user will never even want to know what a tar ball is or how >> to apt-get install a bin, and why should they? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Regards, >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Markus >> >> >> >> >> >> On Feb 2, 2012, at 12:35 PM, [email protected] wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> You have to admit though, sometimes one really wants to do exactly >> that. :) >> >> >> >> Windows can be frustrating if one is used to something more... >> serviceable. >> >> >> >> >> >> Cavin Mugarura < [email protected] > wrote: >> >> >> >> When doing a migration you have to use your brain >> >> >> >> Not scorched earth policy, by dousing every computer with windows with >> gasoline and setting it ablaze >> >> >> >> >> >> T-Mobile. America’s First Nationwide 4G Network >> >> >> >> "Markus A. Wipfler" < [email protected] > wrote: >> >> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>>> Interesting if you join a company you can convince them to migrate >> to Linux >> >>> >> >>> Why would you do that??? Imagine you are the new sys admin at xyz >> company in charge of backend services running enterprise microsoft software >> like Exchange, Active Directory, Sharepoint which are used by hundreds or >> thousands of users. >> >>> Now since you love linux and believe that linux is like a super patch >> that fixes any computer problem, you suggest to management that you want to >> migrate all backend services to linux. I am not saying its impossible >> >> but is >> >> it feasible? You can drive your car with your feet but it does't >> necesarily make it a good idea. What I am saying is that just using Linux >> for Linux sake is plain stupid. >> >>> >> >>> Remember a couple of years ago Germany's government tried to make a >> switch to Linux (backend + frontend) which sadly failed and now they are >> back to running windows. The problem in their case basically boiled down to >> 3 issues: >> >>> >> >>> - hardware support (too many printers, scanners, etc.. just didn't >> work when they where plugged into linux desktops / laptops and the amount >> of support and time required to make them work) >> >>> - interoperability (its hard migrating away from proprietary >> software, especially Ms Office / Exchange combo) >> >>> - training and user adoption (reluctancy of staff to use new, >> unfamiliar software, cost / time of training staff) >> >>> >> >>> As far as I can see the best chance linux (AND Linux Admins) have >> here in Uganda is in the market of S >> >> oHo and >> >> SME's. Here Linux could be used as a cost effective and even superior >> alternative to propriatary software with a relatively low learning curve >> for end users. (Employes still use outlook, ms office but with linux >> backend, firewall, router, directory service, intra/extra net,etc…) >> >>> >> >>> IMHO Linux will always be a niche OS. Why blindly advocate it to >> everyone? It reminds me of some saved people I know, who believe everyone >> else is going straight to hell if you don't join them. LOL. >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> Regards, >> >>> >> >>> -- >> >>> Markus >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>>> >> >>>> If you fail to do so, blame yourself >> >>>> >> >>>> In my local language there's a saying "bamusella omukatale yatongana >> noruguddo" literally translated as "he was charged high prices at the >> market and he is now quarrelling with the road >> >>>> >> >>>> If you are referring to job posting s advertising fo >> >> r >> >> Microsoft skills that's another issue >> >>>> >> >>>> This issue is actually a side show >> >>>> What is more important is to promote Linux on a bigger scale in >> government, schools, private sector and non profits >> >>>> >> >>>> Of course outfits like LUG have tried but with dismal results >> >>>> >> >>>> Sometime back I wrote how entities like LUG, IT companies can work >> together and promote Linux but I guess my proposal fell on deaf ears >> >>>> >> >>>> LUG meetup s are good but most times when I look at the agenda, it s >> not different from a pastor preaching to a choir >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> "Stephen S. Musoke" < [email protected] > wrote: >> >>>> >> >>>>> Ronald, >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> You are wrong. Windows flourishes because it is already at the >> desktop, so >> >>>>> is much easier to integrate at the Server end. >> >> Truth >> >> be told, Windows is >> >>>>> becoming better at the backend and is also very good at integrating >> with >> >>>>> Linux/Unix (MSFT/Novelle) partnership. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> You will not find a truly homogenous environment, you will find >> Windows for >> >>>>> File/Print/Active Directory and *nix at the database and >> application server >> >>>>> levels, and in virtualized applicatons. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Stephen >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On >> Behalf Of >> >>>>> Ronald Kato Odongo >> >>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2012 9:37 AM >> >>>>> To: Uganda Linux User Group >> >>>>> Subject: Re: [LUG] Does Uganda have a demand for Linux >> Administrators? >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>> >> >>> >> >>>>> It would be be up to us interested in Linux administration to go >> out and >> >>>>> offer it as an alternative to Windows. Windows is flourishing due >> in part to >> >>>>> ignorance about Linux technologies. If we pushed Linux harder into >> the >> >>>>> market, then the market would realize it's enormous advantage over >> windows. >> >>>>> Sometimes the best products are ignored because not enough has been >> put in >> >>>>> promoting them. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> On Thu, Feb 2, 2012 at 9:27 AM, Robert Muwanga < [email protected]> >> >>>>> wrote: >> >>>>> >> >>>>> On a curious note, I have seen a lot of companies that utilise >> Microsoft >> >>>>> Server backend systems but unless it is the big telco boys (and >> banks) I >> >>>>> haven't heard of an interest in Linux for either backend or front >> end in >> >>>>> Uganda in particular. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> So, the >> >> question is, what's people's opinion with regards on the demand for >> >>>>> Linux in Uganda? is it rising? is it shrinking or stagnant? And in >> effect, >> >>>>> what is the demand for Linux administrators in the country? >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >> >> >>>>> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: >> [email protected] >> >>>>> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >> >>>>> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug >> >>>>> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug >> >>>>> >> >>>>> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted b >> >> y >> >> INFOCOM: >> >>>>> http://www.infocom.co.ug / >> >>>>> >> >>>>> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them >> (including >> >>>>> attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible for >> them in >> >>>>> any way. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> -- >> >>>>> Thanks and Regards, >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Ronald Kato Odongo >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >> >> >>>>> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: >> [email protected] >> >>>>> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >> >>>>> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug >> >>>>> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug >> >>>>> >> >>>>> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: >> http://www.infocom.co.ug / >> >>>>> >> >>>>> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them >> (including attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible >> for them in any way. >> >>>> >> >> >> >>>> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug >> >>>> >> >>>> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: >> [email protected] >> >>>> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] / >> >>>> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug >> >>>> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug >> >>>> >> >>>> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: >> http://www.infocom.co.ug / >> >>>> >> >>>> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them >> (including attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible >> for them in any way. >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> >>> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug >> >>> >> >>> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: >> [email protected] >> >>> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] / >> >>> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug >> >>> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug >> >>> >> >>> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: >> http://www.infocom.co.ug / >> >>> >> >>> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them >> (including attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible >> for them in any way. >> >> >> >> >> >> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug >> >> >> >> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: >> [email protected] >> >> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] / >> >> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug >> >> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug >> >> >> >> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: >> http://www.infocom.co.ug / >> >> >> >> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them >> (including attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible >> for them in any way. _______________________________________________ >> >> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug >> >> >> >> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: >> [email protected] >> >> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >> >> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug >> >> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug >> >> >> >> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: >> http://www.infocom.co.ug/ >> >> >> >> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them >> (including attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible >> for them in any way. >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug >> >> >> >> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: >> [email protected] >> >> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >> >> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug >> >> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug >> >> >> >> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: >> http://www.infocom.co.ug/ >> >> >> >> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them >> (including attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible >> for them in any way. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug >> >> >> >> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: >> [email protected] >> >> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >> >> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug >> >> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug >> >> >> >> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: >> http://www.infocom.co.ug/ >> >> >> >> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them >> (including attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible >> for them in any way. >> > _______________________________________________ >> > The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug >> > >> > Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: >> [email protected] >> > Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >> > Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug >> > To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug >> > >> > The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: >> http://www.infocom.co.ug/ >> > >> > The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them (including >> attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible for them in >> any way. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug >> >> Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: >> [email protected] >> Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >> Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug >> To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug >> >> The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: >> http://www.infocom.co.ug/ >> >> The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them (including >> attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible for them in >> any way. >> > > > _______________________________________________ > The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug > > Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: > [email protected] > Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug > To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug > > The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: > http://www.infocom.co.ug/ > > The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them (including > attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible for them in > any way. > -- Sanga M. Collins Network Engineering ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Google Voice: (954) 324-1365 E- fax: (435) 578 7411
_______________________________________________ The Uganda Linux User Group: http://linux.or.ug Send messages to this mailing list by addressing e-mails to: [email protected] Mailing list archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ Mailing list settings: http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug To unsubscribe: http://kym.net/mailman/options/lug The Uganda LUG mailing list is generously hosted by INFOCOM: http://www.infocom.co.ug/ The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them (including attachments if any). The mailing list host is not responsible for them in any way.
