Re: [AFMUG] Wimax

[Steve Jones]

you said the name, if its said two more times he will pop up and crush your
larynx with a patch cable unless you guy a radio from him

On Fri, Oct 4, 2024 at 11:14 AM  wrote:

> I remember another promise of Wimax.  NLOS
>
> Patrick was always announcing super NLOS performance on one product or
> another.
> NLOS with trees, yes.  Blocked by a hill color me skeptical.
>
>
> *From:* Mathew Howard
> *Sent:* Friday, October 4, 2024 9:23 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Tarana G2
>
> Tarana definitely does NLOS a lot better than any of its predecessors, but
> as far as "making every install work" goes, I'm still more than a little
> skeptical... perhaps that will change after I've had more experience with
> it, but I have my doubts. There are way too many variables in different
> NLOS situations for me to just go by what other people say. We've all heard
> those stories way too many times over the years.
>
> On Fri, Oct 4, 2024 at 8:44 AM  wrote:
>
>> Jeff,
>>
>>
>>
>> I know someone who tested Tarana and he seems convinced that it’s the
>> NLOS holy grail that we always wanted.  Like what every Wimax and LTE
>> vendor promised us and couldn’t deliver.  We have a long history in the
>> industry which should make us all skeptical of NLOS claims so I’m curious
>> if it’s really as great as all that. Any comment, Jeff?
>>
>>
>>
>> When we were doing 5ghz canopy, we bracketed our city with a dozen towers
>> to give ourselves lots of options and we still had to end up saying “no” to
>> half our installs.  This is urban/suburban so we’re usually talking about
>> one rooftop or one row of trees in the way.  At most 100ft of foliage to
>> penetrate before you’re in clear skies.  5ghz Canopy would work, but it
>> tended to be unreliable in those conditions and we just found it wasn’t
>> worth the trouble and the damage to our credibility if we installed it.
>> Our Alvarion VL using neighbors always talked up how well their thing
>> worked NLOS, but their actual outcomes and my own testing of the product
>> told me that it only “works” NLOS within certain definitions of “works”,
>> i.e.: you’d have to willing to accept high error rates and low MCS as
>> “working”.  Anything else built around a WiFi chipset I’d lump in with
>> Alvarion.
>>
>>
>>
>> 900mhz of course worked within the limits of its bandwidth and high
>> interference, and I’d say more or less the same about 2.4ghz.
>>
>>
>>
>> Wimax was an incremental improvement because you could get some
>> predictable and reliable outcomes NLOS, but your NLOS customers are still
>> lowering efficiency of the system due to retransmits and lower MCS, and I
>> never saw a Wimax product that wasn’t a total PITA on the management side.
>> I bitched endlessly about the Motorola CAP320, but after seeing what some
>> other vendors had I think CAP320 might have been the cream of the crop as
>> far as operability.  LTE was another incremental step up, but at best maybe
>> half as good as it was hyped up to be.
>>
>>
>>
>> If Tarana makes every install a success then we should give them all of
>> our money and be happy to do it, but it absolutely better work.
>>
>>
>>
>> -Adam
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Jeff Broadwick -
>> Lists
>> *Sent:* Friday, October 04, 2024 8:40 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Tarana G2
>>
>>
>>
>> I can get you any pricing you need.
>>
>>
>>
>> My understanding is that the G2 will be dual band, 3 and 6GHz.  It will
>> be able to use 4x 40MHz channels and still provide all the interference
>> mitigation of the G1 with 2x 40MHz channels.
>>
>>
>>
>> I’m sure there is more, but that is what I know now.
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>>
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>>
>>
>> Jeff Broadwick
>>
>> CTIconnect
>>
>> 312-205-2519 Office
>>
>> 574-220-7826 Cell
>>
>> jbroadw...@cticonnect.com
>>
>>
>>
>> On Oct 3, 2024, at 6:43 PM, Dev  wrote:
>>
>> I wish Tarana’s price was the actual price, instead of sometimes a ton,
>> sometimes a half a ton, sometimes don’t know. That way, I could calculate
>> how many decades it would be until each customer would be profitable
>> (outside of subsidized builds).
>>
>>
>>
>> On Oct 3, 2024, at 3:04 PM, Jason McKemie <
>> j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> The G1 is expensive enough, are people actually deploying these on a
>> large scale?  The AP is pricey, but not necessarily a deal-breaker - those
>> subscriber units though...
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Oct 3, 2024 at 1:21 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>
>> Osborne Effect refers to one of the most infamous marketing fails of all
>> time.
>>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect
>>
>>
>>
>> Has Tarana done this by announcing the G2 while all they have shipping is
>> the G1?
>>
>>
>>
>> Or is the G2 so much more expensive that it’s just for window shopping
>> anyway?  I figure if these are being bought with BEAD money, frugality may
>> be out the window.
>>
>> --
>> AF maili

Re: [AFMUG] EPMP 1000 Aux Port Negotiation speed

[Steve Jones]

forced executions of the 1k line, get people closer to killing off their 2k
and buying 4k for 3k backward compatibility

On Thu, Oct 3, 2024 at 4:28 PM Nate Burke  wrote:

> From bench testing, Looks like it might be a bug introduced in 4.7.0.1.
> Downgraded an EPMP 1000 2.4 radio from 4.8.1 to 4.6.2 and Aux port is now
> up at 100/Full.  Upgraded to 4.0.7.1 and back to 100/half, back to 4.6.2
> and 100/full.  Which really sucks, because they fixed the DHCP Bug in
> 4.7.0.1, but broke the aux port.  Maybe that was the fix..
> On 10/3/2024 3:47 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>
> Probably bad radios but could be the one PC to blame.
>
> I can't imagine they'd offer a 100/half port.
>
> On Thu, Oct 3, 2024 at 4:21 PM Nate Burke  wrote:
>
>> I was just looking through some of my EPMP 1000 2.4 Radios that I use to
>> POE out to a EPMP F300 Feed radio.  It seems that the Ethernet port on
>> the Aux port is reporting 100/Half.  I just tested on the bench with 2
>> EPMP 1000 2.4ghz radios plugged into my PC and see the same.  Do I have
>> multiple bad radios, or is that normal?   Ethernet into the Main port
>> shows 100/Full.  Ethernet into the Aux port is 100/Half.
>>
>> Radios are on firmware 4.8.1
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
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Re: [AFMUG] Broadband Facts labels

[Steve Jones]

powercode just added it, but that 2 years of idled development to blast
into the last few months.

Im checking that market broadband thing out in the interim

we have different non speed based tiers, but only really advertise 1 speed
and kick them up to faster when they meet certain criteria, but it changes
the rate plan name when we do.

fucking fed bullies and dumb trends

On Thu, Oct 3, 2024 at 2:54 PM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> *nods* but I think you're also supposed to make the labels available on
> portals, invoices, etc.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
>
>
> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> --
> *From: *"Ken Hohhof" 
> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> *Sent: *Thursday, October 3, 2024 2:47:04 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Broadband Facts labels
>
> It’s actually easiest to implement on your website if you don’t have
> multiple speed tiers, or just 2 or 3.
>
>
>
> I kind of like how Amplex did it, where you click on Broadband Facts below
> the speed tier and it expands to the full label.
>
> https://amplex.net/residential-wireless
>
>
>
> T-Mobile does something similar.
>
> https://www.t-mobile.com/home-internet/plans
>
>
>
> My web design skills and tools are frozen in time around 2005, so such
> fancy stuff is beyond my capabilities.  I think I once did a FAQ page where
> you clicked on the Q, and the A would expand.  So theoretically if my life
> depended on it, I could probably code it.  Not elegantly however.  I only
> have HTML, CSS and Adobe GoLive in my toolbox.  Can I just ask ChatGPT to
> do it?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Mike Hammett
> *Sent:* Thursday, October 3, 2024 2:15 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Broadband Facts labels
>
>
>
> Ask your BSS\OSS system how they're handling it.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
>
>
> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> --
>
> *From: *"Steve Jones" 
> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> *Sent: *Thursday, October 3, 2024 2:04:26 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Broadband Facts labels
>
> fudge
>
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 3, 2024 at 11:55 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> AFAIK, <100,000 subs got an extra 6 months until 10/10/24 but not exempt.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Thursday, October 3, 2024 11:38 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Broadband Facts labels
>
>
>
> whats the deadline all about? I thought us little guys still were exempt
>
>
>
> On Tue, Oct 1, 2024 at 9:24 PM Mike Hammett  wrote:
>
> Ours is just waiting our new web site launch.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
>
>
> <https://

Re: [AFMUG] Broadband Facts labels

[Steve Jones]

fudge

On Thu, Oct 3, 2024 at 11:55 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> AFAIK, <100,000 subs got an extra 6 months until 10/10/24 but not exempt.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Thursday, October 3, 2024 11:38 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Broadband Facts labels
>
>
>
> whats the deadline all about? I thought us little guys still were exempt
>
>
>
> On Tue, Oct 1, 2024 at 9:24 PM Mike Hammett  wrote:
>
> Ours is just waiting our new web site launch.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
>
>
> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> --
>
> *From: *"Ken Hohhof" 
> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> *Sent: *Tuesday, October 1, 2024 3:17:22 PM
> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Broadband Facts labels
>
> I thought I was cutting it close to the Oct. 10 deadline, but doing a spot
> check, it seems that a bunch of WISPs and FISPs a lot bigger than me are
> really waiting until the last minute.
>
>
>
> Or maybe they don’t believe it needs to be on their website, or not until
> you submit your information and start the ordering process.  I don’t know.
>
>
>
> Opinions?  Not about the labels, yeah they’re stupid, I don’t think
> customers care.  But about whether small and medium size ISPs are planning
> on implementing them.
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
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AF@af.afmug.com
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Re: [AFMUG] Broadband Facts labels

[Steve Jones]

whats the deadline all about? I thought us little guys still were exempt

On Tue, Oct 1, 2024 at 9:24 PM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> Ours is just waiting our new web site launch.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Ken Hohhof" 
> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> *Sent: *Tuesday, October 1, 2024 3:17:22 PM
> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Broadband Facts labels
>
> I thought I was cutting it close to the Oct. 10 deadline, but doing a spot
> check, it seems that a bunch of WISPs and FISPs a lot bigger than me are
> really waiting until the last minute.
>
>
>
> Or maybe they don’t believe it needs to be on their website, or not until
> you submit your information and start the ordering process.  I don’t know.
>
>
>
> Opinions?  Not about the labels, yeah they’re stupid, I don’t think
> customers care.  But about whether small and medium size ISPs are planning
> on implementing them.
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
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AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Storm Recovery

[Steve Jones]

what happened to that wispa emergency response thing back in the day

On Sun, Sep 29, 2024 at 2:54 PM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> What resources are there for storm recovery and who needs them? I know of
> one medium sized WISP (I'd say north of 10k subs) that's dead in the water
> in NC. I'm sure there's more hard down.
>
> WISPA used to have an unofficial side group that worked this.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] IP TV

[Steve Jones]

independent programming.
It looks like the most likely fiber provider offers something called YourTV
Green thats got a roku app

On Tue, Sep 24, 2024 at 1:53 PM  wrote:

> I’m not a cable guy, but I’d guess the “IP over Coax” is multicast video
> on DOCSIS, and I’d also assume it’s encrypted so as to prevent anyone from
> doing what you’re describing.
>
> They might have a cheap commercial package for waiting rooms and the like,
> so it might be a case where you just have to get the right person on the
> phone who knows what the options are.
>
>
>
> There are HDMI to Coax converters.  Maybe this doesn’t help, but it seems
> to me you could have one set top box and split that to a bunch of TV’s as
> long as it was ok to have them all on the same channel.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 24, 2024 1:50 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> Our mediacom in the region just transitioned off the coax to some ip over
> coax system, didnt have enough of the boxes in the houses so a bunch of
> people scrambled.
>
> I have a YMCA with the issue, they are moving over to another fiber
> provider. Is there a service out there that provides an IP to coax for end
> business user? not looking to resell, just a one off so they dont have to
> replace wiring and tvs on this iteration. 12 public access TVs so that
> licensing
>
>
>
> On Fri, Sep 20, 2024 at 2:28 PM  wrote:
>
> Hahah not bad
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Friday, September 20, 2024 2:26 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> It says “Fire Stick” right on the device, did they not expect a fire?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *dmmoff...@gmail.com
> *Sent:* Friday, September 20, 2024 1:15 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> Might need a consumer protection warning on the box….
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Friday, September 20, 2024 1:36 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> I hope Isreal starts manufacturing firestick like "free TV" devices, I
> have a few customers I would love to have them
>
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 18, 2024 at 8:50 AM  wrote:
>
> I have talked to vendors about building a TV head-end, but I’ve never done
> it.  I’m certain that everything you’re saying here is true, and that is
> why I think it has to be something turnkey.  I want the back end of it to
> be someone else’s problem.
>
>
>
> There’s a strong trend towards over-the-top streaming services, but
> there’s still a market segment that wants to just turn on the TV and flip
> through channels.  For my kids’ entire life we didn’t have cable, so they
> found it novel and interesting whenever we went somewhere with cable
> service.  I guess I’m saying the market for it hasn’t gone away and it
> might even come back some day.
>
>
>
> More importantly, it’s a vehicle to help sell the Internet service which
> we actually make money on.  When I was in the WISP-o-sphere we kept
> reselling satellite TV in spite of how much we hated it because some people
> would never switch off cable if we didn’t have a TV option for them.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chris Fabien
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 18, 2024 7:49 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> The obtaining channel feeds can be almost completely done over the
> Internet now. It's still a lot of pieces involved to build out a headend
> but we are down to less than 10 channels coming in over satellite. For a
> large MDU situation or where you can serve several MDU/Campus, I could see
> it being worthwhile to run a conventional headend and be able to just plug
> CATV into the TV directly without needing any STB/Roku/Etc. For normal
> residential I agree with probably not worth the hassle anymore these days,
> however we are still running it profitably and increasing our # of video
> subs as we grow the FTTH footprint.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 17, 2024 at 9:59 PM  wrote:
>
> A few of the reasons I don’t like IPTV: (after built several headends in
> my lifetime)
>
> Too many earth station antennas.
>
> Too many LNA, B, Cs
>
> Too many receivers
>
> Too many encoders.transcoders. stream processors etc
>
> Too many transmission – retransmission agreements
>
> Too much money paid for content
>
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Packetflux losing sync

[Steve Jones]

come on now, you think im like you rich bastards out there sporting the
sitemonitor 3? old school only around here with the sitemonitorII

forrest shot himself in the foot by making units that simply will not die.
I think I even have some of the PVC pipe synpipes out on the other end of
the network.

Its perplexing.

The site that was giving me fits this morning I went through setting GPS
power to 0 and rebooting sitemonitor, then rescanning expansions.
eventually with enough dicking around the sync pulse use counter began
incrementing and that particular site had sync again. dont know if the
jackleggery did it, or the issue passed

On Tue, Sep 24, 2024 at 1:35 PM castarritt  wrote:

> On the rack injector or sitemon3 webgui, there should be a little gear
> icon next to GNSS Receiver Status that you can click to change GPS
> settings.  When I have trouble keeping a GPS lock, Ill turn on the other
> two methods, and also set it to keep outputting a sync pulse even if lock
> is lost.
>
> On Tue, Sep 24, 2024 at 11:12 AM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> how do i do that?
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 24, 2024 at 11:00 AM castarritt  wrote:
>>
>>> Have you tried setting the pflux gps unit to also use galileo and
>>> glonass as well?
>>>
>>> On Tue, Sep 24, 2024 at 10:52 AM Steve Jones 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> its epmp and 450i connected to the syncinjectors. no sync on the
>>>> injector
>>>> the epmp low snr are all running 4.8.1, the 450 doesnt have internal gps
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Sep 24, 2024 at 9:55 AM Tyson Burris 
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> What firmware? I’ve reported a problem to cambium support twice
>>>>> regarding 24.01 and they wrote it off. They kept blaming the sync pipe or
>>>>> injector.
>>>>>
>>>>> Reverting the firmware fixed it.
>>>>>
>>>>> *Tyson Burris, President*
>>>>>   *Internet Communications Inc.*
>>>>>   *739 Commerce Dr.*
>>>>>   *Franklin, IN 46131*
>>>>>
>>>>> *317-738-0320 <317-738-0320> Daytime #*
>>>>> *317-412-1540 <317-412-1540> Cell/Direct #*
>>>>> *Online: **www.surfici.net* <http://www.surfici.net>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> VIA WIRELESS
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sep 24, 2024, at 10:26, Steve Jones 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> 
>>>>> So, we had an issue a few weeks ago where Nextlink turned up a new
>>>>> site, Their contractors hung the wrong radio facing us and took down a
>>>>> licensed link of ours for 3 days til we got it sorted.
>>>>>
>>>>> Since the day they turned that up, our surrounding sites have been
>>>>> having nothing but trouble maintaining sync. I change the syncpipes,
>>>>> syncinjectors, its hit or miss on if they come back up. I bring them back
>>>>> to the shop and they work fine.
>>>>>
>>>>> Im not blaming nextlink, but its odd happenstance the same day they
>>>>> turned up a site, these issues started.
>>>>>
>>>>> Forrest- have you had any increased reports of lost GPS?
>>>>> particularly around new nextlink builds?
>>>>> Are there any mechanisms to troubleshoot sync issues? In our case,
>>>>> site monitor shows zero satellites when this occurs.
>>>>>
>>>>> Our cambium APs internal GPS shows birds, but many of them with
>>>>> abysmally low SNRs.
>>>>>
>>>>> Has there been a recent GPS change?
>>>>>
>>>>> What type of systems can interfere with GPS?
>>>>>
>>>>> Could it be that harvest is starting and RTK or JD systems are doing
>>>>> something new?
>>>>> --
>>>>> AF mailing list
>>>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> AF mailing list
>>>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> AF mailing list
>>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] IP TV

[Steve Jones]

Our mediacom in the region just transitioned off the coax to some ip over
coax system, didnt have enough of the boxes in the houses so a bunch of
people scrambled.
I have a YMCA with the issue, they are moving over to another fiber
provider. Is there a service out there that provides an IP to coax for end
business user? not looking to resell, just a one off so they dont have to
replace wiring and tvs on this iteration. 12 public access TVs so that
licensing

On Fri, Sep 20, 2024 at 2:28 PM  wrote:

> Hahah not bad
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Friday, September 20, 2024 2:26 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> It says “Fire Stick” right on the device, did they not expect a fire?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *dmmoff...@gmail.com
> *Sent:* Friday, September 20, 2024 1:15 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> Might need a consumer protection warning on the box….
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Friday, September 20, 2024 1:36 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> I hope Isreal starts manufacturing firestick like "free TV" devices, I
> have a few customers I would love to have them
>
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 18, 2024 at 8:50 AM  wrote:
>
> I have talked to vendors about building a TV head-end, but I’ve never done
> it.  I’m certain that everything you’re saying here is true, and that is
> why I think it has to be something turnkey.  I want the back end of it to
> be someone else’s problem.
>
>
>
> There’s a strong trend towards over-the-top streaming services, but
> there’s still a market segment that wants to just turn on the TV and flip
> through channels.  For my kids’ entire life we didn’t have cable, so they
> found it novel and interesting whenever we went somewhere with cable
> service.  I guess I’m saying the market for it hasn’t gone away and it
> might even come back some day.
>
>
>
> More importantly, it’s a vehicle to help sell the Internet service which
> we actually make money on.  When I was in the WISP-o-sphere we kept
> reselling satellite TV in spite of how much we hated it because some people
> would never switch off cable if we didn’t have a TV option for them.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chris Fabien
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 18, 2024 7:49 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> The obtaining channel feeds can be almost completely done over the
> Internet now. It's still a lot of pieces involved to build out a headend
> but we are down to less than 10 channels coming in over satellite. For a
> large MDU situation or where you can serve several MDU/Campus, I could see
> it being worthwhile to run a conventional headend and be able to just plug
> CATV into the TV directly without needing any STB/Roku/Etc. For normal
> residential I agree with probably not worth the hassle anymore these days,
> however we are still running it profitably and increasing our # of video
> subs as we grow the FTTH footprint.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 17, 2024 at 9:59 PM  wrote:
>
> A few of the reasons I don’t like IPTV: (after built several headends in
> my lifetime)
>
> Too many earth station antennas.
>
> Too many LNA, B, Cs
>
> Too many receivers
>
> Too many encoders.transcoders. stream processors etc
>
> Too many transmission – retransmission agreements
>
> Too much money paid for content
>
> Too little ROI
>
> Too much support
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Robert
>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 17, 2024 11:52 AM
>
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> TANSTAAFL
>
> On 9/17/24 10:12 AM, Bill Prince wrote:
>
>
>
> and need not mention that "free" is almost never totally free.
>
> bp
>
> 
>
> On 9/17/2024 8:46 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>
> I’m surprised how openly they sell these:
>
> https://vseebox.com/
>
>
>
> Plus there are the Android boxes that come with pre-installed backdoors
> and malware.
>
>
>
> But hey … free TV!
>
>
>
> *From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com  *On
> Behalf Of *ch...@go-mtc.com
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 17, 2024 10:17 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com
> 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> I wonder if the streamers embed a watermark to allow traceability.
>
>
>
> *From:* Ken Hohhof
>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, Se

Re: [AFMUG] Packetflux losing sync

[Steve Jones]

how do i do that?

On Tue, Sep 24, 2024 at 11:00 AM castarritt  wrote:

> Have you tried setting the pflux gps unit to also use galileo and
> glonass as well?
>
> On Tue, Sep 24, 2024 at 10:52 AM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> its epmp and 450i connected to the syncinjectors. no sync on the injector
>> the epmp low snr are all running 4.8.1, the 450 doesnt have internal gps
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 24, 2024 at 9:55 AM Tyson Burris  wrote:
>>
>>> What firmware? I’ve reported a problem to cambium support twice
>>> regarding 24.01 and they wrote it off. They kept blaming the sync pipe or
>>> injector.
>>>
>>> Reverting the firmware fixed it.
>>>
>>> *Tyson Burris, President*
>>>   *Internet Communications Inc.*
>>>   *739 Commerce Dr.*
>>>   *Franklin, IN 46131*
>>>
>>> *317-738-0320 <317-738-0320> Daytime #*
>>> *317-412-1540 <317-412-1540> Cell/Direct #*
>>> *Online: **www.surfici.net* <http://www.surfici.net>
>>>
>>>
>>> VIA WIRELESS
>>>
>>> On Sep 24, 2024, at 10:26, Steve Jones 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>> So, we had an issue a few weeks ago where Nextlink turned up a new site,
>>> Their contractors hung the wrong radio facing us and took down a licensed
>>> link of ours for 3 days til we got it sorted.
>>>
>>> Since the day they turned that up, our surrounding sites have been
>>> having nothing but trouble maintaining sync. I change the syncpipes,
>>> syncinjectors, its hit or miss on if they come back up. I bring them back
>>> to the shop and they work fine.
>>>
>>> Im not blaming nextlink, but its odd happenstance the same day they
>>> turned up a site, these issues started.
>>>
>>> Forrest- have you had any increased reports of lost GPS?
>>> particularly around new nextlink builds?
>>> Are there any mechanisms to troubleshoot sync issues? In our case, site
>>> monitor shows zero satellites when this occurs.
>>>
>>> Our cambium APs internal GPS shows birds, but many of them with
>>> abysmally low SNRs.
>>>
>>> Has there been a recent GPS change?
>>>
>>> What type of systems can interfere with GPS?
>>>
>>> Could it be that harvest is starting and RTK or JD systems are doing
>>> something new?
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] RR Crossing Consultant

[Steve Jones]

Its me.
Send me 1500 bucks, ill let you know what time of night to do the shot

On Tue, Sep 24, 2024 at 10:57 AM  wrote:

> Was there a consultant at WISPApalooza in Vegas who said he could get RR
> crossings approved in a few weeks?
>
>
>
> My colleague seems to recall such a person, but does not recall the name
> of the business.
>
>
>
> -Adma
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Packetflux losing sync

[Steve Jones]

its epmp and 450i connected to the syncinjectors. no sync on the injector
the epmp low snr are all running 4.8.1, the 450 doesnt have internal gps

On Tue, Sep 24, 2024 at 9:55 AM Tyson Burris  wrote:

> What firmware? I’ve reported a problem to cambium support twice regarding
> 24.01 and they wrote it off. They kept blaming the sync pipe or injector.
>
> Reverting the firmware fixed it.
>
> *Tyson Burris, President*
>   *Internet Communications Inc.*
>   *739 Commerce Dr.*
>   *Franklin, IN 46131*
>
> *317-738-0320 <317-738-0320> Daytime #*
> *317-412-1540 <317-412-1540> Cell/Direct #*
> *Online: **www.surfici.net* <http://www.surfici.net>
>
>
> VIA WIRELESS
>
> On Sep 24, 2024, at 10:26, Steve Jones  wrote:
>
> 
> So, we had an issue a few weeks ago where Nextlink turned up a new site,
> Their contractors hung the wrong radio facing us and took down a licensed
> link of ours for 3 days til we got it sorted.
>
> Since the day they turned that up, our surrounding sites have been having
> nothing but trouble maintaining sync. I change the syncpipes,
> syncinjectors, its hit or miss on if they come back up. I bring them back
> to the shop and they work fine.
>
> Im not blaming nextlink, but its odd happenstance the same day they turned
> up a site, these issues started.
>
> Forrest- have you had any increased reports of lost GPS?
> particularly around new nextlink builds?
> Are there any mechanisms to troubleshoot sync issues? In our case, site
> monitor shows zero satellites when this occurs.
>
> Our cambium APs internal GPS shows birds, but many of them with abysmally
> low SNRs.
>
> Has there been a recent GPS change?
>
> What type of systems can interfere with GPS?
>
> Could it be that harvest is starting and RTK or JD systems are doing
> something new?
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

[AFMUG] Packetflux losing sync

[Steve Jones]

So, we had an issue a few weeks ago where Nextlink turned up a new site,
Their contractors hung the wrong radio facing us and took down a licensed
link of ours for 3 days til we got it sorted.

Since the day they turned that up, our surrounding sites have been having
nothing but trouble maintaining sync. I change the syncpipes,
syncinjectors, its hit or miss on if they come back up. I bring them back
to the shop and they work fine.

Im not blaming nextlink, but its odd happenstance the same day they turned
up a site, these issues started.

Forrest- have you had any increased reports of lost GPS?
particularly around new nextlink builds?
Are there any mechanisms to troubleshoot sync issues? In our case, site
monitor shows zero satellites when this occurs.

Our cambium APs internal GPS shows birds, but many of them with abysmally
low SNRs.

Has there been a recent GPS change?

What type of systems can interfere with GPS?

Could it be that harvest is starting and RTK or JD systems are doing
something new?
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT Apollo 13

[Steve Jones]

can you imagine being that owners swinging dick when that invoice was
submitted, that thing had to be smacking doorways at the time

On Sun, Sep 8, 2024 at 3:43 PM  wrote:

> New movie on Netflix made up entirely of original footage.  Enjoyed every
> bit of it.  They didn’t mention this artifact.  One of my favorite things.
> https://www.nasa.gov/wp-content/uploads/static/history/afj/ap13fj/pics/towingbill.jpg
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
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AF@af.afmug.com
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Re: [AFMUG] race to the bottom?

[Steve Jones]

the government has not once in history had altruistic intentions. The goal
IMAO is to consolidate providers, eliminate those pesky independents not
beholden to the government so that when the inevitable monopolistic price
increases ensue they can step in as the shining white knight on behalf of
the taxpayers(who funded all this) and reign in the evil megacorporations
through heavy handed  regulation. Ironically those who most supported the
whole "open internet" are those who will have brought about its downfall

On Sun, Sep 22, 2024 at 10:50 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> When they say it’s about the speed, it’s usually about the price.
>
>
>
> At least people are getting more honest and just saying I got a deal from
> XYZ and switched to it because it was cheaper.
>
>
>
> I wonder if the government folks aren’t the clueless doofuses I imagine
> them to be, and their whole plan with CAF/RDOF/BEAD and talk of the digital
> divide and everyone needs gigabit fiber, has actually been to drive prices
> down.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Saturday, September 21, 2024 11:43 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] race to the bottom?
>
>
>
> theyre offering 350 dollar invoice credit to new customers, they could
> resell tmobile and clean others plates when they have all that government
> money
>
>
>
> On Sat, Sep 21, 2024 at 10:53 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> I guess it helps to have both government money and private equity money.
>
>
>
> Watch has me confused, they originally announced they were deploying
> Ericsson equipment, but then said their CAF deployments in the Midwest
> would use Tarana G1.  They show all these circles of licensed availability
> on the national broadband map but I can’t find any Tarana gear on towers by
> us.  Are they waiting for Tarana G2?  Are they deploying the Ericsson
> stuff?  Could they be doing some joint deployment with DISH?  The only
> Watch stuff I’ve seen are their pretty new trucks.  In the pretty truck
> department, they’re eating my lunch.
>
>
>
> They must be using some licensed spectrum other than CBRS because they
> have no PALs in some counties where they claim licensed (not LBR) and even
> if they were leasing someone else’s PALs the SAS is not blocking any of
> those channels out for me.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Saturday, September 21, 2024 10:08 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] race to the bottom?
>
>
>
> the party is over ken.
>
> FWA coffin nails are enroute. the likes of nextlink and watch are going to
> push pretty much every FWA only operator out of the market. Those with a
> sufficient fiber base may be able to supplement their FWA service with that
> revenue, but over time the lube just wont stroke the meat anymore.
>
> And then Nexlink and Watch will jack those rates up
>
>
>
> On Fri, Sep 20, 2024 at 9:01 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> I’m noticing some trends with the numbers for FWA that I can’t make sense
> out of.
>
>
>
> - monthly price is expected to be $30 to $50
>
> - speed is expected to be 100M to 1G
>
> - equipment cost is around $1000 per sub for AP+CPE (if you have at least
> 50-100 subs per tower)
>
> - include a free router or mesh system
>
> - throw in freebies like streaming, gift cards, reimburse cancellation
> fees, etc.
>
>
>
> I understand with fiber you probably have high take rate and low churn,
> and eventually make that investment back.  But with FWA, it seems like
> there will always be churn, and expensive CPE either not returned or having
> to be refurbished and reinstalled.  New owner might instead go with 5G home
> Internet or Starlink or another WISP (people have lots of choices), or BEAD
> subsidized fiber and now you’ve probably lost that location permanently
> (unless you’re the one putting in the fiber).
>
>
>
> So is this a race to the bottom with other people’s money?  Or am I
> missing other revenue sources like ads, harvesting and selling data,
> bundled services?
>
>
>
> I get the same feeling as the early days of streaming when everybody was
> losing money to get market share, until the reckoning when they tried to
> turn a profit.  It also seemed that way in the 5G home Internet world with
> T-Mobile and Verizon offering promo pricing, then raising prices, but now
> they’re back to $30 and $50 prices.
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] race to the bottom?

[Steve Jones]

theyre offering 350 dollar invoice credit to new customers, they could
resell tmobile and clean others plates when they have all that government
money

On Sat, Sep 21, 2024 at 10:53 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> I guess it helps to have both government money and private equity money.
>
>
>
> Watch has me confused, they originally announced they were deploying
> Ericsson equipment, but then said their CAF deployments in the Midwest
> would use Tarana G1.  They show all these circles of licensed availability
> on the national broadband map but I can’t find any Tarana gear on towers by
> us.  Are they waiting for Tarana G2?  Are they deploying the Ericsson
> stuff?  Could they be doing some joint deployment with DISH?  The only
> Watch stuff I’ve seen are their pretty new trucks.  In the pretty truck
> department, they’re eating my lunch.
>
>
>
> They must be using some licensed spectrum other than CBRS because they
> have no PALs in some counties where they claim licensed (not LBR) and even
> if they were leasing someone else’s PALs the SAS is not blocking any of
> those channels out for me.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Saturday, September 21, 2024 10:08 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] race to the bottom?
>
>
>
> the party is over ken.
>
> FWA coffin nails are enroute. the likes of nextlink and watch are going to
> push pretty much every FWA only operator out of the market. Those with a
> sufficient fiber base may be able to supplement their FWA service with that
> revenue, but over time the lube just wont stroke the meat anymore.
>
> And then Nexlink and Watch will jack those rates up
>
>
>
> On Fri, Sep 20, 2024 at 9:01 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> I’m noticing some trends with the numbers for FWA that I can’t make sense
> out of.
>
>
>
> - monthly price is expected to be $30 to $50
>
> - speed is expected to be 100M to 1G
>
> - equipment cost is around $1000 per sub for AP+CPE (if you have at least
> 50-100 subs per tower)
>
> - include a free router or mesh system
>
> - throw in freebies like streaming, gift cards, reimburse cancellation
> fees, etc.
>
>
>
> I understand with fiber you probably have high take rate and low churn,
> and eventually make that investment back.  But with FWA, it seems like
> there will always be churn, and expensive CPE either not returned or having
> to be refurbished and reinstalled.  New owner might instead go with 5G home
> Internet or Starlink or another WISP (people have lots of choices), or BEAD
> subsidized fiber and now you’ve probably lost that location permanently
> (unless you’re the one putting in the fiber).
>
>
>
> So is this a race to the bottom with other people’s money?  Or am I
> missing other revenue sources like ads, harvesting and selling data,
> bundled services?
>
>
>
> I get the same feeling as the early days of streaming when everybody was
> losing money to get market share, until the reckoning when they tried to
> turn a profit.  It also seemed that way in the 5G home Internet world with
> T-Mobile and Verizon offering promo pricing, then raising prices, but now
> they’re back to $30 and $50 prices.
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] race to the bottom?

[Steve Jones]

the party is over ken.
FWA coffin nails are enroute. the likes of nextlink and watch are going to
push pretty much every FWA only operator out of the market. Those with a
sufficient fiber base may be able to supplement their FWA service with that
revenue, but over time the lube just wont stroke the meat anymore.
And then Nexlink and Watch will jack those rates up

On Fri, Sep 20, 2024 at 9:01 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> I’m noticing some trends with the numbers for FWA that I can’t make sense
> out of.
>
>
>
> - monthly price is expected to be $30 to $50
>
> - speed is expected to be 100M to 1G
>
> - equipment cost is around $1000 per sub for AP+CPE (if you have at least
> 50-100 subs per tower)
>
> - include a free router or mesh system
>
> - throw in freebies like streaming, gift cards, reimburse cancellation
> fees, etc.
>
>
>
> I understand with fiber you probably have high take rate and low churn,
> and eventually make that investment back.  But with FWA, it seems like
> there will always be churn, and expensive CPE either not returned or having
> to be refurbished and reinstalled.  New owner might instead go with 5G home
> Internet or Starlink or another WISP (people have lots of choices), or BEAD
> subsidized fiber and now you’ve probably lost that location permanently
> (unless you’re the one putting in the fiber).
>
>
>
> So is this a race to the bottom with other people’s money?  Or am I
> missing other revenue sources like ads, harvesting and selling data,
> bundled services?
>
>
>
> I get the same feeling as the early days of streaming when everybody was
> losing money to get market share, until the reckoning when they tried to
> turn a profit.  It also seemed that way in the 5G home Internet world with
> T-Mobile and Verizon offering promo pricing, then raising prices, but now
> they’re back to $30 and $50 prices.
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] IP TV

[Steve Jones]

I hope Isreal starts manufacturing firestick like "free TV" devices, I have
a few customers I would love to have them

On Wed, Sep 18, 2024 at 8:50 AM  wrote:

> I have talked to vendors about building a TV head-end, but I’ve never done
> it.  I’m certain that everything you’re saying here is true, and that is
> why I think it has to be something turnkey.  I want the back end of it to
> be someone else’s problem.
>
>
>
> There’s a strong trend towards over-the-top streaming services, but
> there’s still a market segment that wants to just turn on the TV and flip
> through channels.  For my kids’ entire life we didn’t have cable, so they
> found it novel and interesting whenever we went somewhere with cable
> service.  I guess I’m saying the market for it hasn’t gone away and it
> might even come back some day.
>
>
>
> More importantly, it’s a vehicle to help sell the Internet service which
> we actually make money on.  When I was in the WISP-o-sphere we kept
> reselling satellite TV in spite of how much we hated it because some people
> would never switch off cable if we didn’t have a TV option for them.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chris Fabien
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 18, 2024 7:49 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> The obtaining channel feeds can be almost completely done over the
> Internet now. It's still a lot of pieces involved to build out a headend
> but we are down to less than 10 channels coming in over satellite. For a
> large MDU situation or where you can serve several MDU/Campus, I could see
> it being worthwhile to run a conventional headend and be able to just plug
> CATV into the TV directly without needing any STB/Roku/Etc. For normal
> residential I agree with probably not worth the hassle anymore these days,
> however we are still running it profitably and increasing our # of video
> subs as we grow the FTTH footprint.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 17, 2024 at 9:59 PM  wrote:
>
> A few of the reasons I don’t like IPTV: (after built several headends in
> my lifetime)
>
> Too many earth station antennas.
>
> Too many LNA, B, Cs
>
> Too many receivers
>
> Too many encoders.transcoders. stream processors etc
>
> Too many transmission – retransmission agreements
>
> Too much money paid for content
>
> Too little ROI
>
> Too much support
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Robert
>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 17, 2024 11:52 AM
>
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> TANSTAAFL
>
> On 9/17/24 10:12 AM, Bill Prince wrote:
>
>
>
> and need not mention that "free" is almost never totally free.
>
> bp
>
> 
>
> On 9/17/2024 8:46 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>
> I’m surprised how openly they sell these:
>
> https://vseebox.com/
>
>
>
> Plus there are the Android boxes that come with pre-installed backdoors
> and malware.
>
>
>
> But hey … free TV!
>
>
>
> *From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com  *On
> Behalf Of *ch...@go-mtc.com
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 17, 2024 10:17 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com
> 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> I wonder if the streamers embed a watermark to allow traceability.
>
>
>
> *From:* Ken Hohhof
>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 17, 2024 9:07 AM
>
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> TV (broadcast and streaming) is getting expensive enough that pirate TV
> boxes are making a comeback.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Nate Burke
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 17, 2024 9:45 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ;
> dmmoff...@gmail.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] IP TV
>
>
>
> I'm not sure of the brand, this was many years ago, and I don't think I
> could find a logo  I was in a largish hotel that had a STB that had a
> single Cat5 running into it.  HDMI to the TV, Analog phone port to the room
> phone, and WIFI AP.  You turned on the TV and it worked.  Maybe The
> Hospitality arena already has something that you're looking for that could
> be adapted to MDU?
>
>
>
> On 9/17/2024 8:59 AM, dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> Well, the main reason is for MDU’s.  If the owners are going to build a TV
> service into their leases then their option is either a deal for both TV
> and Internet from cable, or to work with two different companies.  They’re
> probably not going to work with two companies.  Our solution right now is
> mybundle.tv, which is not providing anything that the customer couldn’t
> get on their own, and there’s not much in it for us.
>
>
>
> I really want it to be a turnkey thing because we’ll have less sunk cost
> if we want to drop it someday.  And I’ll say we have Realchoice for one
> building now, and our cost on the TV package is something like $11/month
> per unit.  Obviously that’s profitable for us while also being attractive
> for the landlords.
>
>
>
> My ONLY complaint with Realchoice TV is they don’t have a set top box.
> There are situations where I think that would be des

Re: [AFMUG] Alexa Troubleshooting

[Steve Jones]

I'd check to see if there's an ntp option on the router to make sure the
devices are time synced

On Tue, Sep 3, 2024, 7:15 PM Bill Prince  wrote:

> Try Google Home.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 9/3/2024 2:30 PM, Nate Burke wrote:
>
> I was there when it happened at least 3 times.  'Alexa, play jass music'
> Runs for 5-7 minutes and just cuts off.
> On 9/3/2024 4:21 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>
> Is that what they told you or did you actually double check?
>
> On Tue, Sep 3, 2024 at 4:39 PM Nate Burke  wrote:
>
>> No, it just cuts off in the middle of a song.
>> On 9/3/2024 2:57 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>>
>> Does it stop at the end of a song?  That seems like a frequency issue if
>> you Google (search) this.
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 3, 2024 at 11:19 AM Nate Burke  wrote:
>>
>>> Customer confirmed that it should just be using Amazon music.
>>> On 9/3/2024 9:40 AM, Bill Prince wrote:
>>>
>>> That's a better question. Does Alexa only play music from Amazon, or
>>> does it go to your audio streamer of preference?
>>>
>>> I have no idea. I like to play music from our in-house media server.
>>>
>>>
>>> bp
>>> 
>>>
>>> On 9/3/2024 7:22 AM, Nate Burke wrote:
>>>
>>> Good question, I'll have to find out.  I just presumed that when you
>>> tell Alexa to play music, it just plays it from amazon music.
>>> On 9/3/2024 9:13 AM, Bill Prince wrote:
>>>
>>> Is his Spotify account paid up?
>>>
>>> bp
>>> 
>>>
>>> On 9/3/2024 7:11 AM, Nate Burke wrote:
>>>
>>> Both of them stop abruptly.
>>> On 9/3/2024 7:10 AM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>>>
>>> Both of them stop or just the 1?
>>>
>>> On Mon, Sep 2, 2024 at 6:40 PM Nate Burke  wrote:
>>>
 I don't use Alexa units, so maybe someone who uses them could help me
 figure out how the back-end connectivity works.  I have a business
 customer that has 2 wifi Alexa speakers in his office. He uses them to
 play music, somehow they must sync together because they both play the
 same thing.  About a week ago, he started complaining that the music
 runs for a few minutes, then stops.  Can't find any connectivity issues
 from the WAN side, so I went to his shop and verified that yes, if you
 tell alexa to play smooth jazz, it will play it for 3-4 minutes, then
 just abruptly stop.  I don't see any connectivity issues when it
 happens, My laptop stays connected to the WIFI and is pinging 8.8.8.8
 without issue.  And even if there is a blip, I'd presume that there's
 some level of caching that it would buffer across.  The Customer
 already
 replaced his router, and said that it did not fix the issue.

 If the speakers lose sync with each other, would that abruptly stop
 them?I'm not sure what else to troubleshoot, short of getting a set
 of them and trying to replicate it.  Which I sure would run for weeks
 on
 end without an issue.


 --
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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AF@af.afmug.com
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[AFMUG] parabolic shield calculator

[Steve Jones]

Nerds: Is there a visual calculator similar to
https://www.desmos.com/calculator/br9pfx6z8c that will visualize inbound
paths to show where they would reflect in regard to the feedhorn? Double
bonus if theres one that allows placement of the remote transmitter and
reflection points on the ground
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Re: [AFMUG] Vines on utility pole growing into power space - safety questions

[Steve Jones]

I would have had the powerco send their arbor crew to remove the vines
contacting the conductors

The situation has little to no real world risk, but the little part could
get big real quick if the stars aligned.

I would not let my people touch the vines, though I know there is little to
no actual risk of doing so. That little risk belongs with the power
company, not with us or anyone else.

I would probably give you a slap on the wrist, I dont know that it would be
a documented slap, but it would warrant a process review, partially for
safety reasons but primarily for efficiency, the repair should have
occurred rather than workarounds. The biggest problem with this process
review outcome is how uncommon it will be. by the next time it occurs,
there is a chance no one will remember to tell powerco to call abor crew
and it will replicate the issue (where would you put this in an SOP, and
how often would you re-train that SOP section? probably the dont fuck
around with powerlines section)

The mentality of its no more dangerous than such and such is dangerous, as
historically such and such has probably killed somebody, our goal is to
minimize injury and zero out deaths. Its expensive to kill an employee and
causes all kinds of production delays

The biggest "near miss" IMHO here is the degradation of safety culture. I
work with power company regularly and safety culture is pervasive. Every
time something unsafe is deemed safe enough to do it lowers the bar of
safety. I was riding with my power company PM the other day and he was
talking about just this. It used to be that anytime there was any near
niss, if no one was hurt or no one saw, then it was frowned upon to tell,
this led to higher incidents of injury and production loss. Theyve since
moved to a culture of bringing up any near miss, however small in the
safety meetings to see if a process change is warranted to eliminate the
risk. Overall the labor satisfaction has increased and the culture of
safety exploded, this equates to a more fiscally friendly use of labor with
a byproduct of less injury

We had some vines that had overgrown our facilities power plant (it was an
old hospital so it was a substantial powerhouse with big pole mount
transformers) they needed to do some work, they did the same thing, cut
vine bases and sprayed substantial killitall to let it die out before they
came back to do the work in the powerhouse, but had they had pole work,
they would have had the arbor crew remove the vines.

On Sat, Aug 10, 2024 at 4:31 AM Forrest Christian (List Account) <
li...@packetflux.com> wrote:

> Here's my thought:
>
> Some idiot in your organization thought that all power poles were equally
> dangerous, and they reacted accordingly.
>
> If that power pole had primary on it,  I would feel like the whole safety
> meeting as described had a good chance of being justified.
>
> Likewise,  if someone didn't know for sure that there wasn't primary on
> that pole or didn't know enough to assess the risks then that's another
> type of safety issue.  (Don't do unless you have enough knowledge to keep
> yourself safe.)
>
> But in this case the only meaningful risk was damaging other
> infrastructure on that pole while removing the vines, and to a lesser
> extent a slight shock hazard but not much more than handling a plugged in
> extension cord.  Neither of these are safety issues worthy of a "near miss"
> meeting.
>
> If I was to do a failure analysis here I'd point squarely at lack of
> training across the entire organization about this issue and particularly
> whoever it is who thought this should be treated as a BFD.
>
> On Fri, Aug 9, 2024, 7:02 PM  wrote:
>
>> Just venting now.  The more I think about this the more annoyed I’m
>> getting.
>>
>>
>>
>> We were going through the meeting agenda including root cause analysis
>> and so forth.  I stopped him at some point and asked what rule was
>> violated.  He responded with rhetorical questions like “if Elco tree
>> trimmers couldn’t remove the vines why do you think we could?” and
>> similar.  He got agitated about it, and seemed flustered that I didn’t
>> intuitively know that something was wrong here.  I dropped it, and
>> apologized saying I wasn’t asking to be combative, I’m asking because I
>> don’t know.
>>
>>
>>
>> On social interactions I can be slow on the uptake so it took me some
>> time to realize that obviously the true answer to my question was *he
>> doesn’t know*, but he couldn’t bring himself to say it.  That burned my
>> ass so bad that I spent several hours this evening digging into NESC and
>> OSHA documents, and now I am pretty convinced we didn’t do anything
>> dangerous.  It’s possible the guys don’t meet every requirement for OSHA
>> “line-clearance tree trimmers”, but if not they’re within a hair’s breadth
>> of it.  I’m talking like maybe they’ll need refresh their CPR certification
>> or something, but otherwise they have everything they need in terms of
>> tools and training

Re: [AFMUG] movies.....

[Steve Jones]

I found a cooler, one of those 3x2 ones up in a ceiling above a salon in a
strip mall. it was chained to the joist. I didnt open it, cause that was
some shady looking stuff and someone went to some effort to do it. But you
could run your telco to the facility demarc up there no problem, just walk
the partition walls

On Thu, Aug 8, 2024 at 1:37 PM  wrote:

> Was the space above high enough to stand in?  I don’t recall where I was,
> but I remember being above a ceiling somewhere and walking on top of the
> walls.
>
>
>
> I bet there are no cameras up there either.  Sounds perfect, Bill.  Count
> me in on the heist.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Bill Prince
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 08, 2024 2:33 PM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] movies.
>
>
>
> We did service to a store in a strip mall once. The best line of sight was
> above another store, but when I got into the suspended ceiling, I
> discovered that the walls between stores did not go to the roof. You could
> run any wire from any store to any other store if you went above the
> suspended ceiling.
>
>
>
> bp
>
> 
>
> On 8/8/2024 11:26 AM, dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> When I read “tunneling through stores”  I pictured a big core drill
> through adjacent basements.  Sawing through drywall partitions is a lot
> less dramatic, but geez, is that the only thing between stores?
>
>
>
> At our local mall there’s a maintenance corridor behind the stores with
> only a drywall partition between the corridor the stores.  I’ve drilled
> through it to install Internet service there so I know as a fact it’s just
> a double layer drywall partition.  Somehow it never occurred to me, but
> yeah someone could definitely access any store from there with nothing more
> than a drywall saw. Oh and the corridor was never locked…..I know that
> because friends and I used to use it as a shortcut when we were young and
> defiant badasses with no respect for The Man and his stupid rules.
>
>
>
> I don’t know about the walls between stores, but apparently those might
> also just be drywall partitions.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF   *On Behalf
> Of *Nate Burke
> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 07, 2024 4:55 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group  
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] movies.
>
>
>
> Here, this is better than the movies.  What just happened here locally.
>
> From
> https://www.dailyherald.com/20240805/news/burglars-tunnel-through-stores-to-steal-1-5m-in-jewelry-from-marquise-jewelry-in-schaumburg/
>
>
>
> In what appeared to be a calculated crime, burglars cut through the walls
> of multiple stores overnight to get into Marquise Jewelry in Schaumburg and
> steal merchandise worth $1.5 million.
>
> “Everything was gone. They did not leave us anything,” said owner Asma
> Anwar. “This was a well-planned burglary.”
>
> Anwar and Shazad Malik walked into their store at the Woodfield Mall
> Friday morning to find their shelves wiped clean by burglars who had broken
> in during the overnight hours.
>
> “I came into this place that I worked hard for 13 years to build, and I
> came to this place, and it was wiped. I was speechless at that point,”
> Malik said.
>
> The couple said they were told by police that there were six people
> involved, after the mall closed for the night; but they said they weren't
> notified about the break-in until the next morning.
>
> “I need answers on how this was going on for overnight hours, after mall
> hours, how was this going on that the security was not notified,” said
> Anwar.
>
> Schaumburg police said the crime was discovered by a construction worker
> who entered a vacant store adjacent to Marquise Jewelry at about 9:30 a.m.
> Monday and reported a hole in the drywall. Police said they found the
> suspects covered one of the surveillance cameras to avoid detection.
>
> More disturbing was how the burglars gained access to their store. The
> couple found a small hole in the wall, and later learned from police the
> burglars cut through the walls of three other businesses to get to their
> jewelry store.
>
> “This is a concern my family's safety, this is a concern for my safety.
> This is a concern for millions of people walking in this mall,” Anwar said.
>
> The couple said they have security in their store and the mall also has
> security patrolling overnight, so it's unclear why they were not notified
> sooner.
>
> “We are small business owners. We are not a corporation. It going to take
> us a long time to recover, if we can,” said Anwar.
>
> “It's a whole mess. It's a big mess, you know. It's a heartbreaking
> thing,” Malik said.
>
> Schaumburg police called the investigation “very active” and said they are
> reviewing surveillance footage from multiple sources, as well as other
> evidence.
>
> On 8/7/2024 3:35 PM, CBB - Jay Fuller wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> Noticed Moviepass is trying to get me to subscribe for $1 a month or
> something.  Been happy with AMC's program every since Moviepass
> imploded.anyone

Re: [AFMUG] movies.....

[Steve Jones]

I always get a kick, pun intended, out of drywall. People get locked in
rooms and dont even know you can almost always just kick into the next
room. with the build quality these says you can kick your way to the
outside if you want.

People spend crazy amounts of money on security, systems, armored doors,
etc. but all you have to do is kick your way in through the walls. or into
the jewlry store that probably had an armorded drop door on the front and a
steel drop bar door on the back

On Wed, Aug 7, 2024 at 3:58 PM Nate Burke  wrote:

> Here, this is better than the movies.  What just happened here locally.
>
> From
> https://www.dailyherald.com/20240805/news/burglars-tunnel-through-stores-to-steal-1-5m-in-jewelry-from-marquise-jewelry-in-schaumburg/
>
>
> In what appeared to be a calculated crime, burglars cut through the walls
> of multiple stores overnight to get into Marquise Jewelry in Schaumburg and
> steal merchandise worth $1.5 million.
>
> “Everything was gone. They did not leave us anything,” said owner Asma
> Anwar. “This was a well-planned burglary.”
>
> Anwar and Shazad Malik walked into their store at the Woodfield Mall
> Friday morning to find their shelves wiped clean by burglars who had broken
> in during the overnight hours.
>
> “I came into this place that I worked hard for 13 years to build, and I
> came to this place, and it was wiped. I was speechless at that point,”
> Malik said.
>
> The couple said they were told by police that there were six people
> involved, after the mall closed for the night; but they said they weren't
> notified about the break-in until the next morning.
>
> “I need answers on how this was going on for overnight hours, after mall
> hours, how was this going on that the security was not notified,” said
> Anwar.
>
> Schaumburg police said the crime was discovered by a construction worker
> who entered a vacant store adjacent to Marquise Jewelry at about 9:30 a.m.
> Monday and reported a hole in the drywall. Police said they found the
> suspects covered one of the surveillance cameras to avoid detection.
>
> More disturbing was how the burglars gained access to their store. The
> couple found a small hole in the wall, and later learned from police the
> burglars cut through the walls of three other businesses to get to their
> jewelry store.
>
> “This is a concern my family's safety, this is a concern for my safety.
> This is a concern for millions of people walking in this mall,” Anwar said.
>
> The couple said they have security in their store and the mall also has
> security patrolling overnight, so it's unclear why they were not notified
> sooner.
>
> “We are small business owners. We are not a corporation. It going to take
> us a long time to recover, if we can,” said Anwar.
>
> “It's a whole mess. It's a big mess, you know. It's a heartbreaking
> thing,” Malik said.
>
> Schaumburg police called the investigation “very active” and said they are
> reviewing surveillance footage from multiple sources, as well as other
> evidence.
>
> On 8/7/2024 3:35 PM, CBB - Jay Fuller wrote:
>
>
>
> Noticed Moviepass is trying to get me to subscribe for $1 a month or
> something.  Been happy with AMC's program every since Moviepass
> imploded.anyone trying moviepass again?
>
> Are there even any descent movies anymore?  Found "Clear and Present
> Danger" on my antique DVR last night and watched it.
> Realized I saw it a while back but probably not "Patriot Games".  Thought
> "Sum of all Fears" was one of the better movies of its
> time.  Nothing like that anymore.  Nothing "good" since Olympus Has Fallen
> / England has Fallen / whatever else they did"
>
> I know there was a writer's strike but it seems they just didn't recover.
> Seems like Hollywood is imploding.  Some of us say
> "good" since their politics aren't exactly my politicsbut I **must**
> unplug and just be entertained from time to time
>
> Wife asked me to make "Mr Robot" fall out of the sky (oh, i'm sorry,
> now-a-days that is "cloud" right lol).   Guess we will see
> how that is.
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Kei trucks

[Steve Jones]

these things ar epopping up in videos and conversations a lot lately. Im
wondering of japan is running a psyop so they can dump them on the us
market to get themselves in a better emissions rating without having to do
a cash for clunkers type thing


On Tue, Aug 6, 2024 at 10:59 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> Japanese minitruck.  I think they have to be at least 25 years old to
> import into the US.  Protectionism?  No, “safety”.
>
>
>
> Maybe think of it like halfway between a JD Gator and a pickup truck.
>
>
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kei_truck
>
>
> https://www.nbcnews.com/business/autos/kei-trucks-are-gaining-popularity-us-small-size-low-prices-rcna156653
>
> https://minitrucks.net/
>
> https://minidumps.com/
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnBeuTseWIE
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Bill Prince
> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 6, 2024 10:10 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Kei trucks
>
>
>
> You mean Kia?
>
>
> --
>
> bp
>
> part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 5, 2024 at 5:21 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> Anybody using a kei truck in your business?  Which one, and for what?
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
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Re: [AFMUG] Is this thing on?

[Steve Jones]

did anybody see that germany got us 3 of our spies back today?

On Mon, Jul 29, 2024 at 10:35 AM  wrote:

> Harris, Trump, Global Warming, Covid, Gaza, Ukraine, Olympics, Electric
> Vehicles, Proj 2025
> Pick your poison and start the conversation!
>
> (please don't)
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
> Chuck McCown
>
> McCown Technology Corporation
> 8401 N Commerce Dr
> Lake Point, Utah 84074
> 801-250-9503 Office
> 435-830-4306 Cell
> www.mccowntech.com
> www.microtrench.pro
> www.terabitnetworks.com
> -Original Message-
> From: dmmoff...@gmail.com
> Sent: Monday, July 29, 2024 7:50 AM
> To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Is this thing on?
>
> Probably my fault.  I've been on PTO for 2 weeks.  Nobody wanted to leave
> me
> out of the loop 😉
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: AF  On Behalf Of fiberrun--- via AF
> Sent: Monday, July 29, 2024 8:16 AM
> To: af@af.afmug.com
> Cc: fiber...@mail.com
> Subject: [AFMUG] Is this thing on?
>
> Not a single message in two weeks. Everyone enjoying the summer?
>
>
> -- Jared
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Multipath mitigation

[Steve Jones]

What about something similar to the computer screen privacy filters,
wouldnt that be along the same concept of blocking multipath?

like a raydome with a waffle pattern of 1/2 inch deep holes or something
like that?

i assume the privacy filters are something similar, just blocks angled light

On Sun, Jul 7, 2024 at 10:37 AM Peter Kranz via AF  wrote:

> I’ve used the uptilt mitigation technique, but not had any where near the
> success of just placing a concrete brick on the roof in front of the
> antenna to block the view of the multipath source (I’m dealing with
> multipath off the SF Bay in my links).
>
>
>
> Peter Kranz
> www.UnwiredLtd.com <http://www.unwiredltd.com/>
> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
> Mobile: 510-207-
> pkr...@unwiredltd.com
>
>
>
> *From:* Forrest Christian (List Account) 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 03, 2024 2:05 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Cc:* Peter Kranz 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Multipath mitigation
>
>
>
> If that's the case, then maybe some uptilt on the SM, effectively moving
> the AP to the bottom of the pattern might work.  Of course this relies on
> an antenna pattern with fairly sharp cutoff at the edges.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jul 3, 2024, 12:50 PM Peter Kranz via AF  wrote:
>
> Easiest solution to this is to position the SM antenna in a location where
> it cannot see the reflected signal from the corn field but still has clean
> LOS to the main beam. We try to get clever about using features on the
> rooftop, building, etc.. to block the multipath reflection.
>
>
>
> Peter Kranz
> www.UnwiredLtd.com <http://www.unwiredltd.com/>
> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
> Mobile: 510-207-
> pkr...@unwiredltd.com
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Saturday, June 29, 2024 10:10 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Multipath mitigation
>
>
>
> Is there an SM side solution for this? We have a handful of customers we
> have to go out twice a year to move their equipment up 5 feet or down 5
> feet. In the fall, I love to point out they just harvested the field across
> the road, didnt they. theyre always "how did you know"
>
>
>
> I could take the loss hit in many of these cases to do a splitter and
> diverse antennas, but would that harm or hurt more?
>
>
>
> Some of them we just have 2 radios installed a spring and fall radio, we
> just have them swap which ones plugged in. 2 450b SMs leaves a lot of
> budget for something that doesnt require touching
>
>
>
> One of you geeks has to have come up with a solution over the years
> other than truck rolls.
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy Holidays

[Steve Jones]

they can choose to love their country or their investments.


On Mon, Jul 8, 2024, 12:09 PM  wrote:

> I doubt they would ever go for that but I do think their investments need
> to be managed by a blind trust.
>
>
>
> *From:* Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Monday, July 8, 2024 10:33 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy Holidays
>
> Id support it to a degree for basic care and privatized insurance for
> everything else. but there would have to be fat cut from the national
> budget and I dont see that ever happening, Would have the caveat that no
> politician can hold any private investments in any company, they have to
> liquidate and place their money in a 1% federally insured account for the
> duration of their office.
>
> It would never work here, too much grift.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 8, 2024 at 11:15 AM  wrote:
>
>> I am all for nationalized health care.  But I am old enough that it is
>> right around the corner for me.
>> My wife just about croaked in Barcelona last summer.  Spent a week in a
>> hospital there until I arranged a jail break.  Paid absolutely nothing.
>>
>>
>> *From:* dmmoff...@gmail.com
>> *Sent:* Monday, July 8, 2024 8:16 AM
>> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy Holidays
>>
>>
>> To the original post: People hung up on college degrees might not be if
>> they saw what some of the trades are making.  I’ve been in communications &
>> IT for 24 years, but if I’d started as an electrical linesman instead then
>> I’d be only a few years from retirement.  They are doing hard--and
>> sometimes dangerous—work, but they are getting paid big bucks to do it.
>> People in master mechanics programs are also cleaning house right now.
>>
>>
>>
>> I have a CIS degree.  My experience is that college teaches you *about*
>> things, but not how to *do* things.  Sometimes you do need that
>> background about the topic to be good at doing it, and other times it
>> really didn’t matter.  It’s also clear to me that what you get out of
>> college is proportional to what you put into it (and I suppose that’s true
>> of life in general), so if someone is going to college because it’s
>> expected of them and not because of a real interest in the subject then
>> their outcome will be less optimal than if they did something they actually
>> liked or at least found engaging.
>>
>>
>>
>> To Steve regarding funding STEM degrees: I agree whole heartedly with
>> that, and it’s something I’ve said in other forums.  Someone told me that
>> funding only STEM degrees is equivalent to the government telling people
>> what jobs they can have.  Au contraire, the *economy* is telling people
>> what jobs they can have, and this would just be allocating funding
>> according to economic reality.  You can get a degree in chemical
>> engineering and still become an English teacher if you happen to be good at
>> that subject, and that’s what you really want to do, but you’d also have
>> another marketable set of knowledge you can use in other contexts.
>>
>>
>>
>> I’ll take you one step further: I consider myself a conservative (a
>> moderate one; a New York conservative), and I’m on board with universal
>> healthcare.  Let’s do it.  Forget the bleeding heart arguments about it,
>> just look at the economic realities.
>>
>> 1) The systems in other countries result in less health care spending per
>> capita.
>>
>> 2) In countries with universal healthcare their small businesses and
>> startups are not handicapped with trying to pay for employees’ health
>> insurance.  Here they have to offer insurance to be competitive in the
>> labor market, and it’s a major hurdle for having success with a business.
>>
>> 3) We *already* put about as much public money per capita into covering
>> people’s medical bills as other countries do, and we’re only covering a
>> portion of people with specific circumstances.  Either get all meddling
>> fingers out of it and let the market figure out what to do, or go all in
>> and rebuild the system so it works.  We’re one foot in and one foot out
>> right now and it’s brutally expensive and by many metrics it’s not all that
>> effective.  I know some would argue more in favor of letting the market
>> handle it, but recall that we’ve done that before and we had quacks calling
>> themselves doctors and selling all kinds of bullshit to people.  I’m
>> thinking back when Coca-Cola contained cocaine and was sold as a medicine.
>> If you let the market 

Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy Holidays

[Steve Jones]

Id support it to a degree for basic care and privatized insurance for
everything else. but there would have to be fat cut from the national
budget and I dont see that ever happening, Would have the caveat that no
politician can hold any private investments in any company, they have to
liquidate and place their money in a 1% federally insured account for the
duration of their office.

It would never work here, too much grift.



On Mon, Jul 8, 2024 at 11:15 AM  wrote:

> I am all for nationalized health care.  But I am old enough that it is
> right around the corner for me.
> My wife just about croaked in Barcelona last summer.  Spent a week in a
> hospital there until I arranged a jail break.  Paid absolutely nothing.
>
>
> *From:* dmmoff...@gmail.com
> *Sent:* Monday, July 8, 2024 8:16 AM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy Holidays
>
>
> To the original post: People hung up on college degrees might not be if
> they saw what some of the trades are making.  I’ve been in communications &
> IT for 24 years, but if I’d started as an electrical linesman instead then
> I’d be only a few years from retirement.  They are doing hard--and
> sometimes dangerous—work, but they are getting paid big bucks to do it.
> People in master mechanics programs are also cleaning house right now.
>
>
>
> I have a CIS degree.  My experience is that college teaches you *about*
> things, but not how to *do* things.  Sometimes you do need that
> background about the topic to be good at doing it, and other times it
> really didn’t matter.  It’s also clear to me that what you get out of
> college is proportional to what you put into it (and I suppose that’s true
> of life in general), so if someone is going to college because it’s
> expected of them and not because of a real interest in the subject then
> their outcome will be less optimal than if they did something they actually
> liked or at least found engaging.
>
>
>
> To Steve regarding funding STEM degrees: I agree whole heartedly with
> that, and it’s something I’ve said in other forums.  Someone told me that
> funding only STEM degrees is equivalent to the government telling people
> what jobs they can have.  Au contraire, the *economy* is telling people
> what jobs they can have, and this would just be allocating funding
> according to economic reality.  You can get a degree in chemical
> engineering and still become an English teacher if you happen to be good at
> that subject, and that’s what you really want to do, but you’d also have
> another marketable set of knowledge you can use in other contexts.
>
>
>
> I’ll take you one step further: I consider myself a conservative (a
> moderate one; a New York conservative), and I’m on board with universal
> healthcare.  Let’s do it.  Forget the bleeding heart arguments about it,
> just look at the economic realities.
>
> 1) The systems in other countries result in less health care spending per
> capita.
>
> 2) In countries with universal healthcare their small businesses and
> startups are not handicapped with trying to pay for employees’ health
> insurance.  Here they have to offer insurance to be competitive in the
> labor market, and it’s a major hurdle for having success with a business.
>
> 3) We *already* put about as much public money per capita into covering
> people’s medical bills as other countries do, and we’re only covering a
> portion of people with specific circumstances.  Either get all meddling
> fingers out of it and let the market figure out what to do, or go all in
> and rebuild the system so it works.  We’re one foot in and one foot out
> right now and it’s brutally expensive and by many metrics it’s not all that
> effective.  I know some would argue more in favor of letting the market
> handle it, but recall that we’ve done that before and we had quacks calling
> themselves doctors and selling all kinds of bullshit to people.  I’m
> thinking back when Coca-Cola contained cocaine and was sold as a medicine.
> If you let the market run the show completely then you have to accept bad
> outcomes along with the good ones.  Civil court didn’t fix it all then, and
> I don’t see why it would now either.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Friday, July 05, 2024 7:24 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy Holidays
>
>
>
> I think im one of the only conservatives that is pro free higher
> education. More as an investment than as an expense
>
>
>
> remove all liberal arts, STEM, not STEAM only (you want an art history
> degree, you can pay for it), 1:1 community service requirement per
> classroom instruct

Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy Holidays

[Steve Jones]

im all for putting the coke back in the coke, so much more productivity
from the coke drinking workforce

On Mon, Jul 8, 2024 at 9:59 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> Awww, you’re telling me they took the coke out of Coke?  Next you’re going
> to tell me there’s no worm in tequila bottles.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *dmmoff...@gmail.com
> *Sent:* Monday, July 8, 2024 9:16 AM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy Holidays
>
>
>
> To the original post: People hung up on college degrees might not be if
> they saw what some of the trades are making.  I’ve been in communications &
> IT for 24 years, but if I’d started as an electrical linesman instead then
> I’d be only a few years from retirement.  They are doing hard--and
> sometimes dangerous—work, but they are getting paid big bucks to do it.
> People in master mechanics programs are also cleaning house right now.
>
>
>
> I have a CIS degree.  My experience is that college teaches you *about*
> things, but not how to *do* things.  Sometimes you do need that
> background about the topic to be good at doing it, and other times it
> really didn’t matter.  It’s also clear to me that what you get out of
> college is proportional to what you put into it (and I suppose that’s true
> of life in general), so if someone is going to college because it’s
> expected of them and not because of a real interest in the subject then
> their outcome will be less optimal than if they did something they actually
> liked or at least found engaging.
>
>
>
> To Steve regarding funding STEM degrees: I agree whole heartedly with
> that, and it’s something I’ve said in other forums.  Someone told me that
> funding only STEM degrees is equivalent to the government telling people
> what jobs they can have.  Au contraire, the *economy* is telling people
> what jobs they can have, and this would just be allocating funding
> according to economic reality.  You can get a degree in chemical
> engineering and still become an English teacher if you happen to be good at
> that subject, and that’s what you really want to do, but you’d also have
> another marketable set of knowledge you can use in other contexts.
>
>
>
> I’ll take you one step further: I consider myself a conservative (a
> moderate one; a New York conservative), and I’m on board with universal
> healthcare.  Let’s do it.  Forget the bleeding heart arguments about it,
> just look at the economic realities.
>
> 1) The systems in other countries result in less health care spending per
> capita.
>
> 2) In countries with universal healthcare their small businesses and
> startups are not handicapped with trying to pay for employees’ health
> insurance.  Here they have to offer insurance to be competitive in the
> labor market, and it’s a major hurdle for having success with a business.
>
> 3) We *already* put about as much public money per capita into covering
> people’s medical bills as other countries do, and we’re only covering a
> portion of people with specific circumstances.  Either get all meddling
> fingers out of it and let the market figure out what to do, or go all in
> and rebuild the system so it works.  We’re one foot in and one foot out
> right now and it’s brutally expensive and by many metrics it’s not all that
> effective.  I know some would argue more in favor of letting the market
> handle it, but recall that we’ve done that before and we had quacks calling
> themselves doctors and selling all kinds of bullshit to people.  I’m
> thinking back when Coca-Cola contained cocaine and was sold as a medicine.
> If you let the market run the show completely then you have to accept bad
> outcomes along with the good ones.  Civil court didn’t fix it all then, and
> I don’t see why it would now either.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Friday, July 05, 2024 7:24 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy Holidays
>
>
>
> I think im one of the only conservatives that is pro free higher
> education. More as an investment than as an expense
>
>
>
> remove all liberal arts, STEM, not STEAM only (you want an art history
> degree, you can pay for it), 1:1 community service requirement per
> classroom instruction hour, manual labor or degree related community
> service only, 90% mandatory score, 95% mandatory attendance, 100 percent
> drug and alcohol abstinence during the school year, tested biweekly. Zero
> criminal tolerance. You pay on the loan until youve completed the mandatory
> community service and repay all deferments from that time period. Then each
> year you maintain full time employment, 10 

Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy Holidays

[Steve Jones]

Greed is good capitalist is the only way handouts should work.

On Sat, Jul 6, 2024, 12:34 PM  wrote:

> Maybe student loan availability should be based on ROI calculations.  If
> you want to borrow to get a liberal arts degree with little chance of being
> a high earner, you are very limited on the amount and the interest rate is
> high.  Ditto pell grants etc.  Useless degrees (speaking only from the
> greed is good strictly - capitalist perspective ) could be had but not at
> taxpayer expense.  Kinda like getting a line of credit for your business.
> You gotta prove a path for repayment or you ain’t gonna git it.
>
>
>
> *From:* Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Saturday, July 6, 2024 11:16 AM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy Holidays
>
>
> Seems a tad dystopian.  Wasn’t there a TV show or movie where at a certain
> age people were assigned a role in life, whether that’s what they want or
> not?
>
>
>
> Or I guess they could use the Sorting Hat from Harry Potter.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *ch...@go-mtc.com
> *Sent:* Saturday, July 6, 2024 11:35 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy Holidays
>
>
>
> I have two British grandsons.  They are tested at 15 to determine whether
> they take a vocational track or an academic track for college.  Seems to
> work out pretty well for them.
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
> Chuck McCown
>
> McCown Technology Corporation
> 8401 N Commerce Dr
> Lake Point, Utah 84074
> 801-250-9503 Office
> 435-830-4306 Cell
> www.mccowntech.com
> www.microtrench.pro
> www.terabitnetworks.com
>
>
>
> *From:* Chuck McCown
>
> *Sent:* Saturday, July 6, 2024 9:53 AM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy Holidays
>
>
>
> Only for BS degrees.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Jul 5, 2024, at 5:24 PM, Steve Jones  wrote:
>
> 
>
> I think im one of the only conservatives that is pro free higher
> education. More as an investment than as an expense
>
>
>
> remove all liberal arts, STEM, not STEAM only (you want an art history
> degree, you can pay for it), 1:1 community service requirement per
> classroom instruction hour, manual labor or degree related community
> service only, 90% mandatory score, 95% mandatory attendance, 100 percent
> drug and alcohol abstinence during the school year, tested biweekly. Zero
> criminal tolerance. You pay on the loan until youve completed the mandatory
> community service and repay all deferments from that time period. Then each
> year you maintain full time employment, 10 percent is waived for 10 years.
> but that would actually require something, so of course it would be too
> unfair.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 4, 2024 at 12:52 PM Forrest Christian (List Account) <
> li...@packetflux.com> wrote:
>
> I feel that it's  time for college to go through a major revision.
>
>
>
> First, I lean quite strongly toward the Mike Rowe worldview in that we
> need to quit telling our kids that they need a college education to make it
> in this world.  Right now if you're in one of the blue collar trades you're
> far better off than a lot of the people who have ms or bs degrees.  There
> will always be a demand for plumbers, electricians, mechanics, and so on.
>
>
>
> On the college side, we need to adjust what we teach to provide for a
> condensed program where you cut out most (but not all) of the non-relevant
> programs.   Yes, it's hard to learn certain trades without college, but a
> degree in computer science shouldn't need a lot of the liberal arts classes.
>
>
>
> Finally, we need to reform the student loan program so that we quit
> graduating students with degrees in underwater basketweaving with 6 figure
> loan balances.  Right now, lenders are able to loan to anyone without risk
> and as such there is no incentive for lenders or schools to ensure that the
> students will be able to repay their loans from a typical job in the
> student's chosen degree program.   This has led to ballooning tuition and
> overall school costs since there is no pressure to keep costs low.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 4, 2024, 10:36 AM  wrote:
>
> With the risk of starting something, I thought I would inject some
> observations:
>
>
>
> I do watch Charley Kirk on YouTube for a quick fix of watching him
> dissolve some of the woke ideology being spouted by young college kids.
> For me it is like junk food for my worldview.  Can only take so much of it,
> like eating too many sweets.  And he can get a bit too alt-right for me at
> times.
>

Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy Holidays

[Steve Jones]

I think im one of the only conservatives that is pro free higher education.
More as an investment than as an expense

remove all liberal arts, STEM, not STEAM only (you want an art history
degree, you can pay for it), 1:1 community service requirement per
classroom instruction hour, manual labor or degree related community
service only, 90% mandatory score, 95% mandatory attendance, 100 percent
drug and alcohol abstinence during the school year, tested biweekly. Zero
criminal tolerance. You pay on the loan until youve completed the mandatory
community service and repay all deferments from that time period. Then each
year you maintain full time employment, 10 percent is waived for 10 years.
but that would actually require something, so of course it would be too
unfair.

On Thu, Jul 4, 2024 at 12:52 PM Forrest Christian (List Account) <
li...@packetflux.com> wrote:

> I feel that it's  time for college to go through a major revision.
>
> First, I lean quite strongly toward the Mike Rowe worldview in that we
> need to quit telling our kids that they need a college education to make it
> in this world.  Right now if you're in one of the blue collar trades you're
> far better off than a lot of the people who have ms or bs degrees.  There
> will always be a demand for plumbers, electricians, mechanics, and so on.
>
> On the college side, we need to adjust what we teach to provide for a
> condensed program where you cut out most (but not all) of the non-relevant
> programs.   Yes, it's hard to learn certain trades without college, but a
> degree in computer science shouldn't need a lot of the liberal arts classes.
>
> Finally, we need to reform the student loan program so that we quit
> graduating students with degrees in underwater basketweaving with 6 figure
> loan balances.  Right now, lenders are able to loan to anyone without risk
> and as such there is no incentive for lenders or schools to ensure that the
> students will be able to repay their loans from a typical job in the
> student's chosen degree program.   This has led to ballooning tuition and
> overall school costs since there is no pressure to keep costs low.
>
> On Thu, Jul 4, 2024, 10:36 AM  wrote:
>
>> With the risk of starting something, I thought I would inject some
>> observations:
>>
>> I do watch Charley Kirk on YouTube for a quick fix of watching him
>> dissolve some of the woke ideology being spouted by young college kids.
>> For me it is like junk food for my worldview.  Can only take so much of it,
>> like eating too many sweets.  And he can get a bit too alt-right for me at
>> times.
>>
>> Yesterday he was preaching something that I think he was partially,
>> perhaps mostly wrong about.  He is a college dropout and preaches that
>> college is a scam and you would be better off just learning to code and
>> find an internship that does not require a degree.
>>
>> I think he is only partially right.
>> By and large, most BA programs are probably not worth the money unless
>> they go onto grad school.  A BA in art history doesn’t have much value when
>> searching Indeed for a job.  It can however get you into law school.
>>
>> And we all know that if you start and successfully run a WISP you
>> absolutely must be an autodidact.  An autodidact with ambition.  Cannot
>> pick up either of those at a college.  And do not need college to be a
>> superior ISP or WISP.  It does however take a special type of person.
>>
>> But there are a couple of areas where I know, from personal experience,
>> that you really benefit from formal education:
>>
>> 1)Computer Science – the part where you learn hardware theory,
>> operating system design, compiler design, advanced data structures, OO
>> methods etc.  Really hard to pick up this stuff by watching youtube
>> videos.  And really hard to get any good at it unless you are forced to do
>> homework and labs.  Understanding what happens with the hardware, the stack
>> and OS during a hardware interrupt is important and not so easy to learn on
>> your own.  Try to write some DSP functions from scratch on your own... or
>> perhaps some machine code to hand optimize a MCU routine.  Much easier if
>> you had a class on assembly.
>>
>> 2)RF and antennas.  Reflection coefficients and the mastery of Smith
>> charts.  EM simulation software and optimization.  S11 and PCB stripline
>> and microstrip layout.  Etc etc.  Again, a good autodidact can teach
>> themselves anything.  But I tried for years to master Smith charts and it
>> was not until college that I finally got to where I could use them.
>> Now-a-days the software does it all for you but you still need to know.
>>
>> 3)To understand some of this stuff, like DSP etc, you also need some
>> upper level math, calculus and trig.  Hard to do on your own.
>>
>> I also imagine that if you want to get into medical school, classes on
>> chemistry, biology etc are essential.  All PE programs will always need
>> degreed engineers.  So yeah Charley, if you

[AFMUG] ChatGPT is capable of evil

[Steve Jones]

So Ive always thought a nerd with enough time could come up with a
surveillance mechanism using the power grid

I started asking ChatGPT about it, mind you im retarded, so I dont even
know what to ask. but in a short bit chatgpt helped me to refine my
questions to it and develop a pathway toward malice.

I love the world we live in where we created tools for morons to ultimately
do bad shit they dont have the mental capacity to figure out. This is about
three minutes of talking to it. Id bet if a smart person with solid state
knowlege and mechanica andl electronic engineering skills were to talk to
it for a couple days, they could design a functional phantom key logging PC
power cord, then grow that to an external power circuit based surveillance
tool, solving the problems from the inside out

https://chatgpt.com/share/65e15a89-30a9-424e-ad9d-a29207658914
-- 
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Re: [AFMUG] Multipath mitigation

[Steve Jones]

Primarily we Use the EPMP f300-25  but have some connectorized SMs in the
field. That may be worth looking at putting them to two separate Antennas.

I had toyed with the notion of  a mikrotik switch running some snmpget
queries against the 2 radio scenarios and bridging whichever one has best
SNR, but never spent time to even see if the mikrotik scripting would do
such things

With the newer, higher QAM radios coming out, im guessing that the margins
will get slimmer and slimmer for cobblefuckery

I had at one point poked around with the idea of a half circle shield to
kill half the reflector, better ro lose half to obstruction than all to
destructive multipath, never did that either since it would be no different
to take that on and off than to move the radio from mount to mount

On Sat, Jun 29, 2024 at 8:43 PM Forrest Christian (List Account) <
li...@packetflux.com> wrote:

> Which SM are you running?
>
> With certain MIMO radios one,  in theory, could put two antennas up
> instead of a single antenna with multiple element.
>
> I.e if you have a mimo sm with two horizontal and two vertical elements in
> be antenna,  you might be able to swap with two single element dual
> polarizaton antennas.
>
> A lot depends on the MIMO implementation here.
>
> On Sat, Jun 29, 2024, 11:14 AM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> Is there an SM side solution for this? We have a handful of customers we
>> have to go out twice a year to move their equipment up 5 feet or down 5
>> feet. In the fall, I love to point out they just harvested the field across
>> the road, didnt they. theyre always "how did you know"
>>
>> I could take the loss hit in many of these cases to do a splitter and
>> diverse antennas, but would that harm or hurt more?
>>
>> Some of them we just have 2 radios installed a spring and fall radio, we
>> just have them swap which ones plugged in. 2 450b SMs leaves a lot of
>> budget for something that doesnt require touching
>>
>> One of you geeks has to have come up with a solution over the years
>> other than truck rolls.
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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[AFMUG] Multipath mitigation

[Steve Jones]

Is there an SM side solution for this? We have a handful of customers we
have to go out twice a year to move their equipment up 5 feet or down 5
feet. In the fall, I love to point out they just harvested the field across
the road, didnt they. theyre always "how did you know"

I could take the loss hit in many of these cases to do a splitter and
diverse antennas, but would that harm or hurt more?

Some of them we just have 2 radios installed a spring and fall radio, we
just have them swap which ones plugged in. 2 450b SMs leaves a lot of
budget for something that doesnt require touching

One of you geeks has to have come up with a solution over the years
other than truck rolls.
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Re: [AFMUG] Microsoft

[Steve Jones]

I LOVE Microsoft
These guys are the best
One of my favorites is making the network adapter like 30 billion clicks
deep and throwing in the new network adapter settings thing that screws up
nerd configs. I love it
I love that OneNote was absolutely perfect and they turned it into a
shitbird webapp
I love that they constantly depreciate fully functional features and if
they replace them its cracked out versions of its former self, totally hawt.

I cant lie, i did love that when windows 10 got pushed on us, printers that
hadnt worked in forever suddenly had support, their generic print driver
was pretty amazing, but thankfully in true microsoft fashion, they made
sure to obliterate that in w11.

I think its like when Meta got caught trying to fuck with depressed people.
Microsoft knows they are so embedded in the world that they want to keep us
all slightly frustrated. I dont know if theres a conspircay associated with
that or if theyre just dicks. I lean toward them just being dicks


On Fri, Jun 28, 2024 at 10:46 PM Ryan Ray  wrote:

> I have a few hundred employees embedded into the Office 365 infrastructure
> and it's not that bad. I've been a Windows Administrator since the NT days,
> migrated a school district from Novell Netware to AD when it was time.
>
> The intune management platforms are good for computers and devices as an
> MDM service. It is a little slow processing new policies due to it being
> "in the cloud".
>
> Sharepoint is a decent-ish document management / website portal for your
> employees. It's nice to be able to do a lot of searches into your company
> and figure out what's happening with your data.
>
> Outside of work I don't personally like some decisions they're making,
> like shoehorning things like "recall" into your OS. I don't like them
> fucking with my OS, and advertising. It takes a bunch of work to use intune
> policies to remove a lot of the "Cruft" out of the OS, especially for
> employees.
>
> I really like the Windows Susbsystem Linux. It's nice to be able to run a
> Ubuntu box on my windows machine.
>
> It depends what you're looking to do. I also use MacOS quite heavily. You
> should use all OS's and determine what you like about each one to keep your
> life moving forward.
>
> On Fri, Jun 28, 2024 at 4:43 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
>> Oops, one more, how did I forget this one?  It kind of sums up all the
>> others.
>>
>>
>> https://www.howtogeek.com/my-windows-computer-just-doesnt-feel-like-mine-anymore/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Bill Prince
>> *Sent:* Friday, June 28, 2024 6:10 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Microsoft
>>
>>
>>
>> We do subscribe to MS 365. Partially for the office suite of programs
>> (mostly Word and Excel for us), but the main attraction is that we get 6TB
>> of online backup for a measly $99/year. It's the best value in online
>> backup that I know.
>>
>>
>>
>> Personally, I've been using ThunderChicken for email longer than I can
>> remember.
>>
>>
>>
>> and Micro$oft has always been evil and incompetent.
>>
>>
>>
>> This brings an old joke to mind
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> bp
>>
>> part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jun 28, 2024 at 3:58 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>
>>
>> https://www.pcworld.com/article/2376883/attention-microsoft-activates-this-feature-in-windows-11-without-asking-you.html
>>
>>
>> https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2024/06/microsoft-removes-documentation-for-switching-to-a-local-account-in-windows-11/
>>
>> https://www.howtogeek.com/windows-11-start-menu-ads-how-to-turn-them-off/
>>
>>
>> https://www.theverge.com/2023/8/30/23851902/microsoft-bing-popups-windows-11-malware
>>
>>
>> https://www.techradar.com/computing/windows/well-done-microsoft-youve-made-me-hate-windows-11-with-your-pushy-ads
>>
>>
>>
>> Email support has gotten difficult now that people tell me they have a
>> new PC with Outlook but it isn’t Outlook, it’s “new Outlook for Windows”
>> which is apparently the successor to the Windows Mail app which was the
>> successor to Outlook Express.  Outlook Express was actually a decent
>> program, especially for free, but the successors are crap IMHO.  In any
>> case, “new Outlook” is nothing like actual Outlook.  Which you have to buy
>> as part of Microsoft Office 365.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Nate Burke
>> *Sent:* Friday, June 28, 2024 4:42 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Microsoft
>>
>>
>>
>> My Windows XP box is still pretty stable.
>>
>> On 6/28/2024 4:13 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>>
>> Is Microsoft becoming evil, or incompetent, or both?
>>
>>
>>
>> I could cite a bunch of examples, but “the new Outlook for Windows” comes
>> to mind.  And Copilot, which seems like they brought Clippy back from the
>> dead.  I am resisting the urge to type a whole bunch more annoying things
>> they are doing as of late.  Even the techie media has been dumping on them.
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.c

Re: [AFMUG] Is PMP 450 stuff still useful?

[Steve Jones]

the non i 450 AP works awesome as preinstall onboarding AP. we bring the
new and recovered SMs up in the shop in bulk, get them normalized with
cnmaestro template and firmware, verify they entered CBRS correctly and are
ready for field techs

On Mon, Jun 17, 2024 at 12:19 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> Those are all discontinued but still useful.  I wouldn't deploy a non 450i
> AP at a new site but I still have some in service.  Lower xmt power, less
> CPU power than  a 450i or m.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: AF  On Behalf Of Seth Mattinen via AF
> Sent: Monday, June 17, 2024 11:56 AM
> To: AFMUG 
> Cc: Seth Mattinen 
> Subject: [AFMUG] Is PMP 450 stuff still useful?
>
> I have a dozen 3 GHz PMP 450 Flat Panel Subscriber Module (C036045C014A)
> and
> three 3GHz PMP450 connectorized AP with antennas (not i or m) from when I
> shut down my WISP stuff. Maybe a couple of the smaller subscriber modules.
> Are these still useful in today's world?
>
> ~Seth
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Hey Bill Prince

[Steve Jones]

Im betting thats one of those things that after only ever seeing in
pictures give you a powerful dick punch seeing its magnitude in person


On Mon, Jun 10, 2024 at 3:57 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> If any of them have never seen the Golden Gate Bridge, it’s still one of
> the marvels of the modern world.  Or maybe I’m just old fashioned.  Looks
> good on Steve’s poop map, although there’s probably seagull poop.  I seem
> to remember there’s an old fort called the Presidio at the south end, is
> that a tourist attraction?  North across the bridge is wine country.
>
>
>
> Where did Jimmy Stewart rescue Kim Novak in Vertigo?
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3H-kimidv6E
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Monday, June 10, 2024 1:31 PM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Hey Bill Prince
>
>
>
>
> https://www.arcgis.com/apps/View/index.html?appid=b6fab720912642b6aedafdb02a76d2a4
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jun 8, 2024, 11:12 AM  wrote:
>
> tnx
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Bill Prince
>
> *Sent:* Friday, June 7, 2024 5:12 PM
>
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Hey Bill Prince
>
>
>
> There is a Ghirardelli factory/shop near fisherman's wharf; not more than
> a block or two walk IIRC (but it's been a while since I went there).
>
> There's also fisherman's wharf and Pier 39 (not 49 if I remember
> correctly).
>
> As mentioned there is the Exploratorium, Steinhart Aquarium, Cal Academy,
> and Muir Woods to name just a handful of the big ones, but there are
> probably a couple dozen in and around the city. If you haven't done it,
> taking one of the ferry rides around the bay is a real treat; especially
> for someone who has never been there.
>
> In the south bay, there is Great America, the computer history museum, and
> Tech Interactive.
>
> I do like the Monterey Bay Aquarium, but I haven't been there in a while.
>
> bp
>
> 
>
> On 6/7/2024 11:32 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>
> Is there a Ghirardelli factory or store?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com  *On
> Behalf Of *ch...@go-mtc.com
> *Sent:* Friday, June 7, 2024 1:14 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com
> 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Hey Bill Prince
>
>
>
> Thanks.
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
> Chuck McCown
>
> McCown Technology Corporation
> 8401 N Commerce Dr
> Lake Point, Utah 84074
> 801-250-9503 Office
> 435-830-4306 Cell
> www.mccowntech.com
> www.microtrench.pro
> www.terabitnetworks.com
>
>
>
> *From:* Forrest Christian (List Account)
>
> *Sent:* Friday, June 7, 2024 11:58 AM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Hey Bill Prince
>
>
>
> I'm not Bill, but I do have some recommendations based on my semi-frequent
> visits...
>
>
>
> First of all, don't forget to find a good,  authentic mission style
> burrito somewhere along the way. If I find a specific place next weekend
> when I'm down there,  I'll let you know.
>
>
>
> Santa Cruz is where I always think when I think about Northern California
> Beach with amusement park.
>
>
>
> There's an old time coin operated arcade/museum near pier 49 in San
> Francisco.   My visits to that part of the world almost always contains a
> Boudin sourdough bread bowl with clam chowder in it from the Boudin bakery
> and then a walk over to the arcade, and then a walk over to the end of pier
> 49 to see the sea lions.
>
>
>
> Closer to the bay Bridge is the explotatorium which is a great science
> museum on one of the other piers.  I usually try to arrange my visits for
> the adult only evenings but that won't apply for you.
>
>
>
> If I'm relying on public transportation (or just want the experience) you
> can take a cable car from mission and market up over the hill and down to
> basically the Boudin bakery.  Then there are old time trolleys which
> service the route along the piers so I've been known to use the trolley to
> go from pier 49 to the exploratorium.
>
>
>
> Both myself and my wife were disappointed by the Monterey Bay aquarium,
> as in the one in the Salt Lake Valley might be better.   Different
> critters, obviously and the Monterey bay aquarium has been around for quite
> some time.   I'm sure this is because of how many aquariums and similar
> we've visited and that our expectations were higher than reality because of
> the reputation.   I'm not saying don't go,  just expect a smaller aquarium.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 7, 2024, 10:23 AM  wr

Re: [AFMUG] Hey Bill Prince

[Steve Jones]

https://www.arcgis.com/apps/View/index.html?appid=b6fab720912642b6aedafdb02a76d2a4

On Sat, Jun 8, 2024, 11:12 AM  wrote:

> tnx
>
>
>
> *From:* Bill Prince
> *Sent:* Friday, June 7, 2024 5:12 PM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Hey Bill Prince
>
>
> There is a Ghirardelli factory/shop near fisherman's wharf; not more than
> a block or two walk IIRC (but it's been a while since I went there).
>
> There's also fisherman's wharf and Pier 39 (not 49 if I remember
> correctly).
>
> As mentioned there is the Exploratorium, Steinhart Aquarium, Cal Academy,
> and Muir Woods to name just a handful of the big ones, but there are
> probably a couple dozen in and around the city. If you haven't done it,
> taking one of the ferry rides around the bay is a real treat; especially
> for someone who has never been there.
>
> In the south bay, there is Great America, the computer history museum, and
> Tech Interactive.
>
> I do like the Monterey Bay Aquarium, but I haven't been there in a while.
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 6/7/2024 11:32 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>
> Is there a Ghirardelli factory or store?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com *On Behalf Of *ch...@go-mtc.com
> *Sent:* Friday, June 7, 2024 1:14 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Hey Bill Prince
>
>
>
> Thanks.
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
> Chuck McCown
>
> McCown Technology Corporation
> 8401 N Commerce Dr
> Lake Point, Utah 84074
> 801-250-9503 Office
> 435-830-4306 Cell
> www.mccowntech.com
> www.microtrench.pro
> www.terabitnetworks.com
>
>
>
> *From:* Forrest Christian (List Account)
>
> *Sent:* Friday, June 7, 2024 11:58 AM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Hey Bill Prince
>
>
>
> I'm not Bill, but I do have some recommendations based on my semi-frequent
> visits...
>
>
>
> First of all, don't forget to find a good,  authentic mission style
> burrito somewhere along the way. If I find a specific place next weekend
> when I'm down there,  I'll let you know.
>
>
>
> Santa Cruz is where I always think when I think about Northern California
> Beach with amusement park.
>
>
>
> There's an old time coin operated arcade/museum near pier 49 in San
> Francisco.   My visits to that part of the world almost always contains a
> Boudin sourdough bread bowl with clam chowder in it from the Boudin bakery
> and then a walk over to the arcade, and then a walk over to the end of pier
> 49 to see the sea lions.
>
>
>
> Closer to the bay Bridge is the explotatorium which is a great science
> museum on one of the other piers.  I usually try to arrange my visits for
> the adult only evenings but that won't apply for you.
>
>
>
> If I'm relying on public transportation (or just want the experience) you
> can take a cable car from mission and market up over the hill and down to
> basically the Boudin bakery.  Then there are old time trolleys which
> service the route along the piers so I've been known to use the trolley to
> go from pier 49 to the exploratorium.
>
>
>
> Both myself and my wife were disappointed by the Monterey Bay aquarium,
> as in the one in the Salt Lake Valley might be better.   Different
> critters, obviously and the Monterey bay aquarium has been around for quite
> some time.   I'm sure this is because of how many aquariums and similar
> we've visited and that our expectations were higher than reality because of
> the reputation.   I'm not saying don't go,  just expect a smaller aquarium.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 7, 2024, 10:23 AM  wrote:
>
> Planning a 3 day largely unstructured excursion around the bay area with
> grand children and their DNA donors.
>
>
>
> Day 1 Computer Museum, Winchester House then thinking of heading toward
> Monterey for the clam chowder samples and perhaps the aquarium.  This might
> stretch into the second day.  Is there an amusement part in Half Moon Bay?
> I seem to remember some touristy stuff there.
>
>
>
> Then downtown SF, street cars, wharf with navy vessels and Bubba Gump
> shrimp, perhaps Alcatraz.
>
>
>
> Then ??? and home.
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] AI tools

[Steve Jones]

chatgpt is great for technical stuff, it writes all mysql queries for me
and has written a couple contracts.

for customer interaction it's still too obvious, and irritating that most
go through 2 to 3 AI layers before agent actually gets you to a human.

I have yet to find one without a left bias, not outwardly problematic til a
customer is having a problem accessing a gun site and it spouts agenda.

On Mon, Jun 3, 2024, 9:02 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> Seems like all AI get a lot of their training on Reddit.  Pros and cons to
> that.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Adam Moffett
> *Sent:* Monday, June 3, 2024 7:51 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AI tools
>
>
>
> I just gave Perplexity (free version) two questions where I know how GPT
> responded.
>
>
>
> "How do I configure OSPF export filters on Arista EOS?"
>
> This answer was accurate, in fact it was more concise than what I got from
> chat GPT.
>
>
>
> "How do you configure an XGS-PON interface on the Nokia ISAM 7360?"
>
> This answer was wrong.  Now, to be fair, Nokia has a lot of products, and
> I think what it gave me was the correct commands for a different Nokia
> product.  It's the right sort of syntax you'd see on a Lucent/Alcatel/Nokia
> product, it's just wrong for the ISAM 7360.
>
>
>
> Another difference between those questions is Arista's documentation is
> freely available on the web whereas Nokia's documentation requires an
> account and login to access.  The reason I'd look for help on Nokia is
> specifically because the commands can vary, and the documentation is too
> much to digest for a mere human.  The doc package for the ISAM 7360 is
> >20,000 pages.  That's not counting release notes, white papers, forum
> posts, and technical notes.  So this is the exact sort of thing I really
> would like help researching and it gave me a wrong answer on the first
> test.
>
>
>
> I followed up with "These instructions may be for a different Nokia
> product. Are you sure they will work on 7360 ISAM?"  It provided several
> citations and concluded, "therefore the instructions I provided should
> be applicable to the 7360."
>
>
>
> The first citation is a reddit post about configuring the ports on an NT
> (ethernet) card.  It apparently learned the naming convention of PON ports
> from another source and adapted the instructions on reddit using the NT
> card command syntax and inserting the PON port names.  That's an impressive
> bit of learning and correlating sources, and it's the sort of thing a human
> might try while learning the platform.  It's still wrong though.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jun 1, 2024 at 7:27 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> Anybody here use AI on a daily basis, like for research or creative
> purposes?
>
>
>
> I’m an AI naysayer, but this looks awfully attractive.  There’s a free
> tier, or unlock the full capability and almost unlimited queries for
> $20/mo.  I’m not sure I could do a decent eval on it though.
>
>
>
>
> https://www.howtogeek.com/perplexity-is-the-only-paid-ai-chatbot-you-need-heres-why/
>
> https://www.perplexity.ai/pro
>
>
>
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>
> --
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] Multi-path, Reflections, and Ducting

[Steve Jones]

This is 3 ghz, different freznel. But I think it may be slant, or maybe
that was the 320. It's been a long time since I onboarded that system.
It's hard to get techs to understand for sure. I always wanted to set up a
water tray use the ripples to show destructive and constructive miltipath
and the different ways freznel obstruction/reflectivity impacts the
receiver side

On Tue, May 14, 2024, 9:30 AM  wrote:

> I can’t remember, is the 450 slant polarity?
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Monday, May 13, 2024 12:41 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Multi-path, Reflections, and Ducting
>
>
>
> yep, til we switch to 450 we had one customer like this. the coolest part
> was you could watch him harvest his field by his rssi. it was a perfect
> example customer. two radios about 10 feet apart on the roof, each only
> worked half the year
>
>
>
> On Fri, May 10, 2024, 3:58 PM Nate Burke  wrote:
>
> Way back in the early days of FSK we did a poor mans spacial diversity for
> a customer.  Put an SM on either end of his roof, and told him to switch
> cables if it stopped working.
>
> On 5/10/2024 3:53 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>
> Yep, been hearing this for the last 20 years.
>
> Has to have something to do with ground reflections changing with the
> crop.
>
> A space diversity setup would cure it.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Nate Burke
>
> *Sent:* Friday, May 10, 2024 2:34 PM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Multi-path, Reflections, and Ducting
>
>
>
> For those of you who don't have to deal with it, whatever it's called,
> this is what us flatlanders have to put up with.At the top of the pipe,
> the radio would only get a maximum of -76, at it's current height, it's at
> -59.  All happened last week when that hayfield grew.  Signal was fine
> before then, and it steadily lost signal all last week.  (It is LOS to the
> tower, the tower is just directly in line with the pipe in the picture)
>
>
>
>
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] Pot

[Steve Jones]

; *To:* af@af.afmug.com
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Pot
>
>
>
> My google-foo says it can be:
>
> Kevin
> Ken
> Gary
> Terry
>
> but I like Darren too.
>
>
>
> bp
>
> 
>
> On 5/3/2024 9:09 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>
> .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} @font-face {font-family:"Cambria
> Math"; panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}@font-face {font-family:calibri;
> panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}@font-face {font-family:aptos;}@font-face
> {font-family:tahoma; panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}p.msonormal,
> li.msonormal, div.msonormal {margin:0in; font-size:12.0pt;
> font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif;}a:link, span.msohyperlink
> {mso-style-priority:99; color:blue;
> text-decoration:underline;}span.emailstyle20
> {mso-style-type:personal-reply; font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif;
> color:windowtext;}.msochpdefault {mso-style-type:export-only;
> font-size:10.0pt; mso-ligatures:none;}div.wordsection1 {page:wordsection1;}
>
> “I have a card” = entitled Karen (I forget the name for a male Karen, is
> it Darren?)
>
>
>
> *From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com  *On
> Behalf Of *Chuck McCown via AF
> *Sent:* Friday, May 3, 2024 10:29 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com
> 
> *Cc:* ch...@go-mtc.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Pot
>
>
>
> I have always had employees that were in rehab.  But never had anyone
> using at work before this guy.  He pointed to the fact he has a pot card
> for anxiety.  I have a card in my pocket that says I am old enough to buy
> whisky too, but I doubt any employer would be OK with me sucking a flask
> while working.
>
>
>
> I know certain prescription conventional drugs can make you not safe to
> operate equipment.  But this guy had to operate equipment as part of his
> job.  I would make an accommodation for someone that had pain meds
> temporarily that left them a bit impaired but not as an every day thing.
>
>
>
> This guy was MAX drama too.  One thing I tell everyone when I hire them,
> the only thing I really care about is no drama.  Do not bring your drama to
> work.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Steve Jones
>
> *Sent:* Thursday, May 2, 2024 10:01 PM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Pot
>
>
>
> lite duty, no operating machinery or equipment
>
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2024, 9:18?AM  wrote:
>
> I think the ADA does want you to accommodate rehab appointments in
> someone’s work schedule.
>
> …..which I would do anyway.  If they’re working on getting straight I
> don’t want to stand in their way.  I don’t know if anyone goes to rehab for
> pot though.  Probably not.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Forrest Christian
> (List Account)
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 01, 2024 5:11 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Pot
>
>
>
> Utah code 26-61a-111(4)..
>
>
>
> "Nothing in this section requires a private employer to accommodate the
> use of medical cannabis or affects the ability of a private employer to
> have policies restricting the use of medical cannabis by applicants or
> employees."
>
>
>
> There are also federal court cases where the court has determined that
> marijuana use is not subject to the ADA.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 30, 2024, 10:42?PM Chuck McCown via AF 
> wrote:
>
> If an employee has a prescription for pot for anxiety do we have to allow
> them to partake at work.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
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Re: [AFMUG] SNMP

[Steve Jones]

Librenms is the easiest NMS to set up, its a pita to add OIDs to it outside
the learning curve. SNMPc from castlerock was the best for responsive snmp
monitoring, could execute all kinds of stuff based on snmpc conditions, the
dude could probably be set up somewhat similar. I despise
proprietary monitoring from vendors device families because they end
support on long life products. NMS snmp monitoring is my
preferred solution, only one communications channel to ensure it is
functioning properly and only one alert channel to maintain. Every time I
come across something proprietary i try to tell it to get off my lawn

site monitors are good contact monitors, simple, but the oid structure is a
little archaic since you have to add the index for each module, but
theyre like a fat girl, ugly but reliable as hell and always there at
dinnertime. We used to use the site monitor input 2 to monitor for voltage.
had power supply that was generator only, so we would get an alert when it
ran the monthly test and put power to that input and when sites would lose
power and go on generator.

On Wed, May 8, 2024 at 1:45 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> We are needing to add some monitoring of old fashioned alarm contacts in
> one of our sites.  In the past I used Netguardians.  Not sure what Forrest
> has.
>
> Is SNMP still the defacto NMS comm method or are there better more modern
> stuff out there we should be looking at?
>
>
> Best Regards,
> Chuck McCown
>
> McCown Technology Corporation
> 8401 N Commerce Dr
> Lake Point, Utah 84074
> 801-250-9503 Office
> 435-830-4306 Cell
> www.mccowntech.com
> www.microtrench.pro
> www.terabitnetworks.com
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Re: [AFMUG] Pot

[Steve Jones]

lite duty, no operating machinery or equipment

On Wed, May 1, 2024, 9:18 AM  wrote:

> I think the ADA does want you to accommodate rehab appointments in
> someone’s work schedule.
>
> …..which I would do anyway.  If they’re working on getting straight I
> don’t want to stand in their way.  I don’t know if anyone goes to rehab for
> pot though.  Probably not.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Forrest Christian
> (List Account)
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 01, 2024 5:11 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Pot
>
>
>
> Utah code 26-61a-111(4)..
>
>
>
> "Nothing in this section requires a private employer to accommodate the
> use of medical cannabis or affects the ability of a private employer to
> have policies restricting the use of medical cannabis by applicants or
> employees."
>
>
>
> There are also federal court cases where the court has determined that
> marijuana use is not subject to the ADA.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 30, 2024, 10:42 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
> wrote:
>
> If an employee has a prescription for pot for anxiety do we have to allow
> them to partake at work.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> --
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Re: [AFMUG] Won One

[Steve Jones]

I want to do drops for metronet. just kick dirt on the fiber.

On Mon, Apr 29, 2024, 1:29 PM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> MetroNet does the same thing.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Bill Prince" 
> *To: *af@af.afmug.com
> *Sent: *Monday, April 29, 2024 1:09:01 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Won One
>
> From my limited experience with them (mostly through friends who have no
> other choice), their installations are "divide an conquer. They send out a
> different crew to do every micro-step of an installation.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 4/29/2024 10:52 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>
> Had a 150 Mbps customer leave for Comcast/Xfinity 1.3 G $25/ month loss
> leader service.
>
> He lasted a couple months.
>
> He said their customer service is non existent.
>
>
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] sale bulk used Mikrotik swtiches

[Steve Jones]

any crs309?

swg has never once responded to inquiries over the years

On Sat, Apr 27, 2024, 5:10 PM Zach Underwood  wrote:

> We have standardized on refurbished cisco 3650 POE for our IDF switches
> that are deploying close to 100 a month right now.  That may be pushed up
> to 200-300 a month by the end of the year.
>
> We use arista for fore switch at our MDU sites, Mikrotik routers as site
> route and arista for both route and switch in the datacenter.
>
> On Sat, Apr 27, 2024 at 5:21 PM Dennis Burgess via AF 
> wrote:
>
>> Just wondering what the reason is for pulling the MikroTik Switches ?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *Dennis Burgess*
>>
>>
>> * Mikrotik : **Trainer, Network Associate, Routing Engineer, Wireless
>> Engineer, Traffic Control Engineer, Inter-Networking Engineer, Security
>> Engineer, Enterprise Wireless Engineer*
>>
>> *Hurricane Electric: **IPv6 Sage Level*
>>
>> *Cambium: **ePMP*
>>
>>
>>
>> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>>
>> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>>
>> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>>
>> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>> --
>> *From:* AF  on behalf of Zach Underwood <
>> zunder1...@gmail.com>
>> *Sent:* Friday, April 26, 2024 9:17 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] sale bulk used Mikrotik swtiches
>>
>> We are working on pulling out Mikrotik switches from the network and
>> looking for vendors to buy the used switches. I have tried SWG and they
>> went silent on emails so I am looking for another vendor. All hardware is
>> located in ATL but can bulk ship.
>>
>> We have almost all models of crs1xx, crs2xx, crs3xx with a mix of poe and
>> non poe
>>
>> Example we have close to 100x CRS328
>>
>> --
>> Zach Underwood (RHCE,RHCSA,RHCT,UACA)
>> My website
>> 
>> advance-networking.com
>> 
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>>
>
>
> --
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> My website 
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[AFMUG] DC power supplies in parallel

[Steve Jones]

I have a bunch of various meanwell 48 vDC power supplies mostly  120 and
350 watt models with most loads being 45wattish and some 108wattish.

One site im re-cabling has 1100w in PSUs taking a ton of space providing
for a total demand of around 440w. Seems overkill and only accounts for the
DC direct powered stuff, not the other 300w or so

Whats the consensus on an AC powered site? individual PSUs for ever
equipment. Big PSU/rectifier for all?
Our battery capacity at this particular site is on the APC at the base
providing just AC to the top, we are not bringing the batteries up for
reasons and all electronics are up top.
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Re: [AFMUG] ASN check

[Steve Jones]

Its because we have upstreams in different towns both doing BGP. If the
path on our network between them goes down it orphans customers so this
allows a hobbled failover. We have passed 3-400mbps across it to our
surprise. I think our upstreams peer with zayo near each other. We
originally had EOIP but it was problematic and unreliable

On Tue, Apr 23, 2024 at 3:08 AM TJ Trout  wrote:

> Why gre? Sounds interesting, how much traffic can you pass via gre?
>
> On Mon, Apr 22, 2024, 7:14 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> Yeah, apparently they moved our BGP to a new switch and had a syntax
>> error. We never noticed because our backup external GRE flowed bypass
>> traffic. I assume enough was getting out to wherever our upstreams meet
>> there was announcement.
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 17, 2024 at 8:22 AM Mike Hammett  wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> https://radar.qrator.net/as/40121/ipv4/neighbors/providers?prefix-history=30036
>>>
>>>
>>> https://stat.ripe.net/special/bgplay#bgplay_fetch.resource=142.202.109.0&bgplay_fetch.ignoreReannouncements=false&bgplay_fetch.starttime=1712823872&bgplay_fetch.endtime=1713342272&bgplay_fetch.rrcs=11,14&bgplay_fetch.instant=null&bgplay_fetch.type=bgp
>>>
>>>
>>> It looks like Mediacom dropped at 2024-04-12 05:18:55 UTC. Well,
>>> "dropped" it looks like at least some IPs through some peers are reachable
>>> via Mediacom.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -
>>> Mike Hammett
>>> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>>> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>
>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>
>>> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
>>> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>
>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>
>>> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
>>> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
>>>
>>>
>>> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
>>> --
>>> *From: *"Steve Jones" 
>>> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
>>> *Sent: *Tuesday, April 16, 2024 2:07:42 PM
>>> *Subject: *[AFMUG] ASN check
>>>
>>> 40121
>>> can somebody else verify this is only showing one peer, im no looking
>>> glass master, but it appears one of our peers stopped announcing on the 12th
>>>
>>> --
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>>>
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>>>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT - robot flamethrowing dog

[Steve Jones]

I need this for customer service

On Tue, Apr 23, 2024 at 4:15 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> I’m sure someone here wants one of these.
>
> Maybe for de-icing solar panels.
>
> Or when it’s taking too long for 900 MHz to kill your evergreens.
>
>
> https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/23/thermonator-flamethrowing-robot-dog-shoot-fire/
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] now that's a big antenna

[Steve Jones]

thats what we install at everybodies house

On Sun, Apr 21, 2024 at 11:27 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> https://spectrum.ieee.org/apollo-era-antenna-voyager-2
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Re: [AFMUG] ASN check

[Steve Jones]

Yeah, apparently they moved our BGP to a new switch and had a syntax error.
We never noticed because our backup external GRE flowed bypass traffic. I
assume enough was getting out to wherever our upstreams meet there was
announcement.

On Wed, Apr 17, 2024 at 8:22 AM Mike Hammett  wrote:

>
> https://radar.qrator.net/as/40121/ipv4/neighbors/providers?prefix-history=30036
>
>
> https://stat.ripe.net/special/bgplay#bgplay_fetch.resource=142.202.109.0&bgplay_fetch.ignoreReannouncements=false&bgplay_fetch.starttime=1712823872&bgplay_fetch.endtime=1713342272&bgplay_fetch.rrcs=11,14&bgplay_fetch.instant=null&bgplay_fetch.type=bgp
>
>
> It looks like Mediacom dropped at 2024-04-12 05:18:55 UTC. Well, "dropped"
> it looks like at least some IPs through some peers are reachable via
> Mediacom.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
>
>
> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> --
> *From: *"Steve Jones" 
> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> *Sent: *Tuesday, April 16, 2024 2:07:42 PM
> *Subject: *[AFMUG] ASN check
>
> 40121
> can somebody else verify this is only showing one peer, im no looking
> glass master, but it appears one of our peers stopped announcing on the 12th
>
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Re: [AFMUG] ASN check

[Steve Jones]

We had a provider maintenance on the 12th and never realized all the
bandwidth moved to the other peer. though its odd, the two locations have
an external GRE tunnel that is up, so some prefix propagation has to be
occurring somewhere.

I restarted and cleared the BGP session, had only been up since the 12th
now.
I have an open ticket with them now

On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 2:51 PM  wrote:

> Well this CIRBN LLC is peered with you
>
> I don’t know who your other peer is supposed to be, but I’d make sure your
> BGP connection to them is in the “Established” state and maybe reset that
> connection.  “clear ip bgp neighbor x.x.x.x” or whatever equivalent command
> on your router.  Also verify you’re advertising some routes to the other
> guy.  If you’re connected and advertising routes to him then quite possibly
> he’s not redistributing them.
>
>
>
> Lumen does that to us on a semi-regular basis, so we have to watch for
> that now.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 16, 2024 3:26 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] ASN check
>
>
>
> So I am reading that right, my peer is up to me but not announcing me
>
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 2:11 PM Josh Baird  wrote:
>
> https://bgp.he.net/AS40121#_peers
>
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 3:09 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
> 40121
>
> can somebody else verify this is only showing one peer, im no looking
> glass master, but it appears one of our peers stopped announcing on the 12th
>
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Re: [AFMUG] ASN check

[Steve Jones]

So I am reading that right, my peer is up to me but not announcing me

On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 2:11 PM Josh Baird  wrote:

> https://bgp.he.net/AS40121#_peers
>
> On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 3:09 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> 40121
>> can somebody else verify this is only showing one peer, im no looking
>> glass master, but it appears one of our peers stopped announcing on the 12th
>> --
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>>
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[AFMUG] ASN check

[Steve Jones]

40121
can somebody else verify this is only showing one peer, im no looking glass
master, but it appears one of our peers stopped announcing on the 12th
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Re: [AFMUG] OT LinkedIn

[Steve Jones]

It all depends on what your campaign get get to show in the email
subject line of the linkdin email notification. I think thats the extent of
the linkedin interaction most who would use your blades do. At some point,
to try to be visible, a linkedin account was set up, its never really used
with the exception of periodically cleaning clutter from email and seeing a
linkedin notification the peaks curiosity. Usually that results in clicking
the link, seeing to content, seeing there are a bunch of unread PMs,
realizing those are all just spam PMs and linkedin trying to get you to pay
and then not coming back again until the next time an interesting email
subject line hits during inbox cleanup

On Fri, Mar 1, 2024 at 9:37 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> Is a marketing campaign on LinkedIn worth the effort?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Wood Pole Mount

[Steve Jones]

unacceptable

On Thu, Feb 29, 2024 at 3:03 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> Way too busy building microtrench blades, saws, grout machines etc.
>
> *From:* Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 29, 2024 9:09 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Wood Pole Mount
>
> "I sold off all my tower mount business to a local fabricator.  Not sure
> if he is doing the chain mount or not. "
>
> WTF chuck
>
> On Tue, Feb 20, 2024 at 12:20 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
> wrote:
>
>> I sold off all my tower mount business to a local fabricator.  Not sure
>> if he is doing the chain mount or not.
>>
>> Hunter Clark  hun...@c3fab.com
>>
>> Best Regards,
>> Chuck McCown
>>
>> McCown Technology Corporation
>> 8401 N Commerce Dr
>> Lake Point, Utah 84074
>> 801-250-9503 Office
>> 435-830-4306 Cell
>> www.mccowntech.com
>> www.microtrench.pro
>> www.terabitnetworks.com
>>
>> *From:* Jeff Broadwick - Lists
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 20, 2024 11:10 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Wood Pole Mount
>>
>> Chain mount.  Chuck has them as does PV and CommScope.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>> Jeff Broadwick
>> CTIconnect
>> 312-205-2519 Office
>> 574-220-7826 Cell
>> jbroadw...@cticonnect.com
>>
>> On Feb 20, 2024, at 1:06 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>> I think I’ve got some of the Valmont ones on the shelf.  Like everything
>> from SitePro1, they are huskier than they look in the catalog.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *dmmoff...@gmail.com
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 20, 2024 11:40 AM
>> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Wood Pole Mount
>>
>>
>>
>> +1 to both of those suggestions.
>>
>>- I’ve seen plenty of universal mounts attached to a wooden pole
>>(J-arms, J-pipes, or whatever you want to call them).
>>- Rohn WM4 is the name brand galvanized 4” wall mount, but there are
>>a thousand copies out there.  Just watch out for zinc plating or other BS
>>finishes.  I’m sure Channel Master is fine.
>>
>>
>>
>> One other thing, you’re not supposed to drill into the top surface of a
>> wooden pole because rain will pool in the holes and speed up rotting.
>> You’re also not supposed to drill the sides within so many inches of the
>> top (4” maybe? I don’t recall).  That’s why those pole-top mounts you see
>> are straddling the top and have bolt holes farther down.  If you put a
>> galvanized pipe into one of those wall mounts then you can have your mast
>> above the top and also not be putting hardware at the top.  Electric/phone
>> companies won’t like that solution because it uses more vertical real
>> estate, but if it’s just a light pole then it ought not be a problem.
>>
>>
>>
>> If you do want something heavy duty that won’t break the bank then look
>> at the Site Pro version of the WM4:
>>
>> https://www.sitepro1.com/store/cart.php?m=product_list&c=1218
>>
>>
>> https://valmont-sitepro1-cdn.s3.amazonaws.com/spec-sheet/HDWM04%20(Assembly).pdf
>>
>> I don’t know the thickness of the steel stock, but the Channel Master one
>> weighs 1 pound and the Site Pro one weighs 6.8 pounds, so I’m sure it’s
>> sufficiently burly for most equipment.
>>
>>
>>
>> -Adam
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 20, 2024 10:52 AM
>> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Wood Pole Mount
>>
>>
>>
>> Or the ChannelMaster 4" offset wall mounts, we call them W brackets.
>>
>>  Original Message 
>> From: "Josh Luthman"
>> Sent: 2/20/2024 9:37:59 AM
>> To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group"
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Wood Pole Mount
>>
>> Just use a Jpole?  Or an MTOW?
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 20, 2024 at 10:31?AM Matt 
>> wrote:
>>
>> I need to mount a small steel pole to a wood light pole. The kits I
>> see online are like $300 range and way more robust than I need. Just
>> mounting a small yagi a few feet above the top of the wood pole. Does
>> anyone know of anything?
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>> --
>> --
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>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
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>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
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Re: [AFMUG] Wood Pole Mount

[Steve Jones]

"I sold off all my tower mount business to a local fabricator.  Not sure if
he is doing the chain mount or not. "

WTF chuck

On Tue, Feb 20, 2024 at 12:20 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
wrote:

> I sold off all my tower mount business to a local fabricator.  Not sure if
> he is doing the chain mount or not.
>
> Hunter Clark  hun...@c3fab.com
>
> Best Regards,
> Chuck McCown
>
> McCown Technology Corporation
> 8401 N Commerce Dr
> Lake Point, Utah 84074
> 801-250-9503 Office
> 435-830-4306 Cell
> www.mccowntech.com
> www.microtrench.pro
> www.terabitnetworks.com
>
> *From:* Jeff Broadwick - Lists
> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 20, 2024 11:10 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Wood Pole Mount
>
> Chain mount.  Chuck has them as does PV and CommScope.
>
> Regards,
>
> Jeff
>
> Jeff Broadwick
> CTIconnect
> 312-205-2519 Office
> 574-220-7826 Cell
> jbroadw...@cticonnect.com
>
> On Feb 20, 2024, at 1:06 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> 
>
> I think I’ve got some of the Valmont ones on the shelf.  Like everything
> from SitePro1, they are huskier than they look in the catalog.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *dmmoff...@gmail.com
> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 20, 2024 11:40 AM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Wood Pole Mount
>
>
>
> +1 to both of those suggestions.
>
>- I’ve seen plenty of universal mounts attached to a wooden pole
>(J-arms, J-pipes, or whatever you want to call them).
>- Rohn WM4 is the name brand galvanized 4” wall mount, but there are a
>thousand copies out there.  Just watch out for zinc plating or other BS
>finishes.  I’m sure Channel Master is fine.
>
>
>
> One other thing, you’re not supposed to drill into the top surface of a
> wooden pole because rain will pool in the holes and speed up rotting.
> You’re also not supposed to drill the sides within so many inches of the
> top (4” maybe? I don’t recall).  That’s why those pole-top mounts you see
> are straddling the top and have bolt holes farther down.  If you put a
> galvanized pipe into one of those wall mounts then you can have your mast
> above the top and also not be putting hardware at the top.  Electric/phone
> companies won’t like that solution because it uses more vertical real
> estate, but if it’s just a light pole then it ought not be a problem.
>
>
>
> If you do want something heavy duty that won’t break the bank then look at
> the Site Pro version of the WM4:
>
> https://www.sitepro1.com/store/cart.php?m=product_list&c=1218
>
>
> https://valmont-sitepro1-cdn.s3.amazonaws.com/spec-sheet/HDWM04%20(Assembly).pdf
>
> I don’t know the thickness of the steel stock, but the Channel Master one
> weighs 1 pound and the Site Pro one weighs 6.8 pounds, so I’m sure it’s
> sufficiently burly for most equipment.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 20, 2024 10:52 AM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Wood Pole Mount
>
>
>
> Or the ChannelMaster 4" offset wall mounts, we call them W brackets.
>
>  Original Message 
> From: "Josh Luthman"
> Sent: 2/20/2024 9:37:59 AM
> To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group"
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Wood Pole Mount
>
> Just use a Jpole?  Or an MTOW?
>
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 20, 2024 at 10:31?AM Matt  wrote:
>
> I need to mount a small steel pole to a wood light pole. The kits I
> see online are like $300 range and way more robust than I need. Just
> mounting a small yagi a few feet above the top of the wood pole. Does
> anyone know of anything?
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] Fw: NBC News: Alabama station in disbelief after 200-foot radio tower stolen

[Steve Jones]

How does somebody steal an AM tower without getting electrocuted? arent
they all energized?

On Fri, Feb 9, 2024 at 5:50 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> Is that the “you’re not using it so it’s mine now” rule?
>
>
>
> Does that apply to cars?  How about spouses?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *CBB - Jay Fuller
> *Sent:* Friday, February 9, 2024 4:53 PM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: NBC News: Alabama station in disbelief after
> 200-foot radio tower stolen
>
>
>
>
>
> It's in our neighboring county.  Been there, know the guy, know the
> station.
>
> For those of you who don't know, I operate a LPFM in our home county
> (since 2014)
>
>
>
> 1)  Ok, why on EARTH is this viral?  Like internationally viral?
>
>
>
> 2)  For all the backstory  / scuttlebutt you could ever want (and not even
> on facebook) :
>
>
>
>
> https://www.radiodiscussions.com/threads/wjlx-200-tower-reported-stolen.769741
>
>
>
> 3)  Ok, so chop chop the guy wires, the tower thuds on the ground and you
> just unscrew it in 10 foot sections
>
> just like a rohn25, no?  I don't know how "no one" knew it was missing
> tho.  Clearly no one listens to that AM,
>
> except for the locals, who say it has been off air for at least 5 years.
>
>
>
> In my home county we have two licensed AMS,  1340 and 1460.  1460 has been
> off air for at least 5 years,
>
> but never filed as silent and still shows as licensed.  1340 signed off
> last week - the property had been abandoned,
>
> seized for unpaid taxes, auctioned from the federal government (all by the
> guy currently running it), and now it's being
>
> sold for a development of houses.  Good for them.
>
>
>
> Promise you lots of other AMS feeding fm translators where the AMs are
> also silent
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
>
> *From:* Chuck McCown via AF 
>
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
>
> *Cc:* ch...@go-mtc.com
>
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 8, 2024 2:18 PM
>
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Fw: NBC News: Alabama station in disbelief after
> 200-foot radio tower stolen
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Jaime Solorza
>
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 8, 2024 12:42 PM
>
> *To:* Chuck McCown
>
> *Subject:* NBC News: Alabama station in disbelief after 200-foot radio
> tower stolen
>
>
>
>
> https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/alabama-station-disbelief-200-foot-radio-tower-stolen-rcna137877
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Odd routing issue

[Steve Jones]

are your routing IPs in a bridge with other IP addresses?

On Wed, Jan 3, 2024, 10:09 AM castarritt  wrote:

> Had an odd issue last night.  All 'tik OSPF routed network with routers at
> each tower site.  Simple single area OSPF setup, no MPLS or other overlay,
> about 700 internal routes.  Last night, some customers on APs connected to
> specific tower routers lost connection to the internet.  Our monitoring
> system never lost connection to any of the customer SMs or anything else in
> our network, so no alarms were raised.  The issue lasted a few hours
> overnight and recovered on its own without any of us getting to take a look
> at it.  It is like the affected routers lost their dynamic default route.
> The affected routers appear to be randomly scattered around our network.
> They aren't all connected along the same backhaul paths, and in one case
> where we had two routers at a specific site, only one of the routers was
> affected.  This happened at the tail end of a heavy rain storm that was
> causing a lot of OSPF topology changes as microwave links went in and out
> of service due to rain fade.
>
> Anyone else seen something like this?  Is our routing table getting too
> big for 'tik to handle with a single OSPF area?
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] EPMP 3000 AP losing firmware

[Steve Jones]

There was something that cause me to poke at it, but it was years ago. I
just remember the screen was odd to see


On Tue, Jan 2, 2024 at 1:21 PM Nate Burke  wrote:

> Was yours acting up before the issue?  This AP had been slowly loosing TX
> power for about 2 months.
> On 1/2/2024 12:38 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
>
> I had this issue once. I dont recall an RMA. It probably ended up deployed
> again close by in case of further issue then forgot about. I do remember
> loading multiple firmwares in both banks multiple times to make sure
> nothing collapsed
>
> On Thu, Dec 21, 2023 at 4:55 PM Nate Burke  wrote:
>
>> I had an EPMP3000 AP on a tower that died after a web page initiated
>> reboot.  I got it swapped out and when I put it on the bench, accessing
>> on 169.254.1.1 loaded a page saying to 'Load Firmware'  With a big
>> disclaimer saying 'No Firmware validation done, make sure you load a
>> proper image'
>>
>> I loaded the 4.6.1 firmware on it, and it appears to be booting normally
>> now.  I'm concerned to deploy it again, since 'something' happened, but
>> why wouldn't it have loaded the backup firmware if the primary was
>> corrupted?  Anyone run into this before?  The AP was acting up which is
>> what prompted the initial reboot.  2 Sm's next to each other on a roof,
>> one SM had 70% packet loss, the Other SM had 0% packet loss.  Only thing
>> that hadn't been rebooted yet was the AP.
>>
>>
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>>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] EPMP 3000 AP losing firmware

[Steve Jones]

I had this issue once. I dont recall an RMA. It probably ended up deployed
again close by in case of further issue then forgot about. I do remember
loading multiple firmwares in both banks multiple times to make sure
nothing collapsed

On Thu, Dec 21, 2023 at 4:55 PM Nate Burke  wrote:

> I had an EPMP3000 AP on a tower that died after a web page initiated
> reboot.  I got it swapped out and when I put it on the bench, accessing
> on 169.254.1.1 loaded a page saying to 'Load Firmware'  With a big
> disclaimer saying 'No Firmware validation done, make sure you load a
> proper image'
>
> I loaded the 4.6.1 firmware on it, and it appears to be booting normally
> now.  I'm concerned to deploy it again, since 'something' happened, but
> why wouldn't it have loaded the backup firmware if the primary was
> corrupted?  Anyone run into this before?  The AP was acting up which is
> what prompted the initial reboot.  2 Sm's next to each other on a roof,
> one SM had 70% packet loss, the Other SM had 0% packet loss.  Only thing
> that hadn't been rebooted yet was the AP.
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Ken Hohof

[Steve Jones]

I am not grown up enough to make such a commitment


On Sun, Dec 31, 2023 at 9:26 AM Adam Moffett  wrote:

> I always miss his wisdom.
> I know an election years is coming, but Steve & Jamie please behave
> yourselves this time.
>
> Get Outlook for iOS 
> --
> *From:* AF  on behalf of Chuck McCown via AF <
> af@af.afmug.com>
> *Sent:* Sunday, December 31, 2023 1:08:02 AM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com 
> *Cc:* Chuck McCown 
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Ken Hohof
>
> Everbuddy say welcome back Ken!!!
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Prevailing Wage

[Steve Jones]

Was that a mistake or intentional? With all the taxpayer funded welfare
going out to the ISPs, I can see a "well meaning bureaucrat" intentionally
putting the wording in to get some of the welfare back to those workers
controlling the "means of production"



well meaning bureaucrat - commie
means of production - commie speak

On Fri, Dec 15, 2023 at 8:10 AM  wrote:

> There’s a new rule in NY State:
> https://legislation.nysenate.gov/pdf/bills/2023/a5608
>
>
> https://dol.ny.gov/system/files/documents/2023/12/enforcement-guidance-roadway-excavation-quality-assurance-act-update-3.pdf
>
>
>
> 'a "Covered excavation project" shall mean construction work for which a
> permit may be issued to a contractor or subcontractor of a utility company
> by the state, a county or a municipality to *use*, excavate, or open a
> street. '
>
>
>
> Intentionally or not, they put the word “use” in that sentence.  The DOL
> issued that enforcement guidance saying it means any time you are working
> “in, on, or under” a street.  Basically, if you’re working as a contractor
> on a job that needs any kind of permit from a state, local, or county to
> work in their ROW then you have to pay prevailing wage.  That’s regardless
> of whether it’s a state job or not.  This does not apply to in-house
> employees or work outside the ROW.  This is going to cause some waves for a
> lot of us in NY State.
>
>
>
> If I can get the “prevailing” $54/hour as a lineman on almost every job,
> then I might quit this “Network Engineering” thing and just be a builder.
>
>
>
> So where do federal and state labor departments get their data to
> determine “prevailing wage”?  I have never met a tradesman of any sort who
> made prevailing wage outside of when the government mandates it, and I have
> never understood how it was “prevailing” if nobody seems to actually get
> that wage. Is it a selection bias issue like maybe they’re only getting
> data from large union shops?
>
>
>
> -Adam
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Re: [AFMUG] Got paid

[Steve Jones]

see, im not gonna be that mind of prime, when i dont pay people, imma stick
to it. so much more spending money

On Wed, Nov 1, 2023 at 7:59 PM Sam Lambie  wrote:

> I wouldn't have pulled the review or comments until the bank said the
> transfer was good to go. I wonder if he is going to stiff you again, with
> excuses as to why the transfer didn't work... Sometimes, I don't believe in
> humanity.
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 26, 2023 at 1:29 PM Craig Schmaderer 
> wrote:
>
>> I am sorry it had to come to this. LOL, yeah right.   You are just
>> sorry that you got outplayed by Chuck.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Josh Luthman
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, October 25, 2023 8:28 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Got paid
>>
>>
>>
>> That's awesome!
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Oct 24, 2023 at 4:53 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
>> wrote:
>>
>> I did.  Wire transfer has not landed yet but here is his last email to me:
>>
>> Thank you Chuck I really appreciate you . I will transfer things
>> around
>> and send it today and send conformation . I am sorry it had to come to
>> this
>> . I should have moved more swiftly .
>>
>>
>>
>> Best Regards,
>> Chuck McCown
>>
>> McCown Technology Corporation
>> 8401 N Commerce Dr
>> Lake Point, Utah 84074
>> 801-250-9503 Office
>> 435-830-4306 Cell
>> www.mccowntech.com
>> www.microtrench.pro
>> www.terabitnetworks.com
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Robert Andrews
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2023 2:19 PM
>> To: af@af.afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Got paid
>>
>> Did you pull the comments and review?
>>
>> On 10/24/23 11:53, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>> > A prime contractor has owed me about $15K for 6 months.  Totally
>> dogging
>> > me.
>> > They showed up in my FB feed crowing about a big job they had just
>> > completed.  So I started making snarky comments on their posts.  I also
>> > gave them a bad review and commented that they don’t pay their subs.
>> The
>> > owner of the company called me and settled about 15 minutes after
>> posting
>> > the review.
>> > A whole lot cheaper than attorneys.
>> >
>>
>> --
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>>
>>
>> --
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>>
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>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
>
> --
> --
> *Sam Lambie*
> Taosnet Wireless Tech.
> 575-758-7598 Office
> www.Taosnet.com 
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Re: [AFMUG] Geolocation updates

[Steve Jones]

last time we got now blocks it took almost a year and a half to get them
cleaned up, a few emails to the NANOG list, some custting, some colorful
emails to sysop nerds at various locations, we still periodically run into
issues with some smaller banks who host with some software firewalls at
their webhost

On Mon, Oct 23, 2023 at 8:09 AM Josh Luthman 
wrote:

> You can hope, but that will probably never happen.  It's just the way it
> is.
>
> On Sun, Oct 22, 2023 at 10:00 PM  wrote:
>
>> I see the mention of Hulu on that page.  Someone’s Hulu TV has the
>> channels from another market which is what prompted today’s musings.
>>
>> Will the “IP Admin” at Hulu override stuff?
>>
>>
>>
>> I have a similar list of geolocation providers already, but I can’t
>> believe all of these ding dongs have completely separate databases and
>> don’t talk to each other.
>>
>>
>>
>> Also, since it’s now a thing that is service affecting and impacts TV ad
>> revenue, I hope to hell ARIN or someone starts a central repository so we
>> don’t have to update a dozen different people if something changes.  I
>> haven’t dug into all of them yet, but IP2Location wants a notarized
>> affidavit attached to your request for changes.  I have no idea why they
>> placed some of our IP’s on the wrong side of the state, but apparently they
>> didn’t require a sworn and notarized affidavit to screw it up.
>>
>>
>>
>> -Adam
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Mike Hammett
>> *Sent:* Sunday, October 22, 2023 2:44 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Geolocation updates
>>
>>
>>
>> https://thebrotherswisp.com/index.php/geo-and-vpn/
>>
>>
>>
>> -
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
>> [image: Image removed by sender.] [image:
>> Image removed by sender.]
>> [image:
>> Image removed by sender.]
>> [image:
>> Image removed by sender.] 
>> Midwest Internet Exchange 
>> [image: Image removed by sender.] [image:
>> Image removed by sender.]
>> [image:
>> Image removed by sender.] 
>> The Brothers WISP 
>> [image: Image removed by sender.]
>> [image: Image removed by
>> sender.]
>>
>>
>> 
>> --
>>
>> *From: *dmmoff...@gmail.com
>> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
>> *Sent: *Sunday, October 22, 2023 1:03:19 PM
>> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Geolocation updates
>>
>> Which services do you need to update when you move IP blocks or get new
>> blocks?
>>
>>
>>
>> I can’t believe they all have their own separate databases.  There must
>> be smaller ones that key off of larger ones.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>>
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Re: [AFMUG] prevailing wage

[Steve Jones]

partner is not technically and employee, but the partnership is not formal,
so hes technically a 1099 contractor. he definitely makes over prevailing
wage though. I just dont knw what documentation i need to show it. Or if i
have to payroll him rather than 1099, he meets the IRS 1099 worksheet
requirements

On Wed, Oct 11, 2023 at 8:34 PM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> I don't think it matters how many layers are between the person working
> and the government body, the worker still has to meet those wage thresholds.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
>
>
> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> --
> *From: *"Steve Jones" 
> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> *Sent: *Wednesday, October 11, 2023 6:09:15 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] prevailing wage
>
> My part er is informal. I have his 1099, he gets 50 percent after
> expenses, one of those expenses is operator pay. On PW jobs am I allowed to
> have 1099, or would I have to put him on payroll? I don't have any actual
> payroll right now. Last year I ended up having my accountant stop
> submitting because other than my son I didn't have any and this year I
> still didn't have enout to reach back out.
> I don't know anything about this stuff
>
> On Wed, Oct 11, 2023, 4:14 PM  wrote:
>
>> Prevailing wage is the state equivalent of federal Davis Bacon.
>> Typically, your state's Dept of Labor maintains the schedules.
>> You have to get the rates and make sure the workers get paid the rate
>> and then retain the documentation in case of claim or objection. Part of
>> my town administrator job is running our town owned wisp.
>> the only workaround is hiring a sole proprietor or using your own
>> laborforce.
>> David Young
>> Town of Warwick MA
>> warwickbroadband.net
>>
>> On 2023-10-11 17:03, Steve Jones wrote:
>> > I have a solar project that's come up for horizontal drilling. it
>> > requires prevailing wage.
>> > I don't know exactly what this means from my standpoint.
>> > to this point I've just been busy enough to run by myself or with my
>> > informal 1099 partner or with my son.
>> >
>> > I've used day labor periodically but never got to the need where I
>> > hired them. I'm not saying I pay cash, but people are compensated. I
>> > do carry a work comp policy for more wage than I pay out.
>> >
>> > what's it mean for me and what paperwork do I have to have in order to
>> > meet the requirement
>>
>> --
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>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] prevailing wage

[Steve Jones]

My part er is informal. I have his 1099, he gets 50 percent after expenses,
one of those expenses is operator pay. On PW jobs am I allowed to have
1099, or would I have to put him on payroll? I don't have any actual
payroll right now. Last year I ended up having my accountant stop
submitting because other than my son I didn't have any and this year I
still didn't have enout to reach back out.
I don't know anything about this stuff

On Wed, Oct 11, 2023, 4:14 PM  wrote:

> Prevailing wage is the state equivalent of federal Davis Bacon.
> Typically, your state's Dept of Labor maintains the schedules.
> You have to get the rates and make sure the workers get paid the rate
> and then retain the documentation in case of claim or objection. Part of
> my town administrator job is running our town owned wisp.
> the only workaround is hiring a sole proprietor or using your own
> laborforce.
> David Young
> Town of Warwick MA
> warwickbroadband.net
>
> On 2023-10-11 17:03, Steve Jones wrote:
> > I have a solar project that's come up for horizontal drilling. it
> > requires prevailing wage.
> > I don't know exactly what this means from my standpoint.
> > to this point I've just been busy enough to run by myself or with my
> > informal 1099 partner or with my son.
> >
> > I've used day labor periodically but never got to the need where I
> > hired them. I'm not saying I pay cash, but people are compensated. I
> > do carry a work comp policy for more wage than I pay out.
> >
> > what's it mean for me and what paperwork do I have to have in order to
> > meet the requirement
>
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[AFMUG] prevailing wage

[Steve Jones]

I have a solar project that's come up for horizontal drilling. it requires
prevailing wage.
I don't know exactly what this means from my standpoint.
to this point I've just been busy enough to run by myself or with my
informal 1099 partner or with my son.

I've used day labor periodically but never got to the need where I hired
them. I'm not saying I pay cash, but people are compensated. I do carry a
work comp policy for more wage than I pay out.

what's it mean for me and what paperwork do I have to have in order to meet
the requirement
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Re: [AFMUG] who caves first? charter? disney?

[Steve Jones]

im seeing a trend toward the commercials coming back into the fray. Theres
so much free streaming out there now with commercial breaks its cutting the
big players throats. Im about to cancel netflix since their repository has
turned to shit and they keep boosting prices. I only use prime video becaus
eits included. The only market winner right now seems to be youtube tv

On Thu, Sep 7, 2023 at 7:00 AM Dennis Burgess 
wrote:

> Networks, etc., are dead, my opinion.  On demand is where it is at, ZERO
> commercials needed.I don’t watch sports, nor have a “network TV
> service”.  Netflix and YouTube premium is about it.  Lots of options, zero
> commercials, I don’t think I have seen a commercial in at least 5 years.
> Lol, unless at someone else’s home.
>
>
>
> The only issue is the decentralization of the streaming industry now,
> originally it was Netflix and that was about it, Disney is making crappy
> decisions, raising rates, you add HBO, Paramount, etc, and you are back to
> a cable bill.  Disney keeps removing content, witch sucks for consumers and
> the people who helped make the movies.
>
>
>
> Movie houses are also going belly up, less and less of them.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * CBB - Jay Fuller
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 6, 2023 9:49 PM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] who caves first? charter? disney?
>
>
>
>
>
> Talking heads are making it out to be a big deal.  They'll both lose a lot
> of money.  Charter may not survive
>
> pay tv may not survive
>
>
>
> my take?  per 1,000 facebook posts here last Saturday as SEC football
> kicked off, they're all dropping whatever
>
> charter they had left and going to youtube tv.  meaning it's all being
> dumped on our networks (ok, no worries).
>
>
>
> disney isn't going to lose that revenue, now it's just coming in from a
> different pay-tv provider.
>
>
>
> so i see charter being the big loser.  Those SEC football fans are going
> to find a way to get the feed.
>
> Seems youtube tv is now getting their money - - - if they weren't before.
>
>
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] EPMP4600

[Steve Jones]

i gotchu fam.

On Wed, Sep 6, 2023 at 4:46 PM  wrote:

> Maybe I need a sarcasm filter.
>
> Nobody should do any of this, these are not serious “solutions”, and
> there’s no “EIRP Problem”.  The EIRP limit (and other rules) are there to
> protect incumbent licensed operators who have invested a small fortune into
> radio equipment they are relying on to provide critical communication
> services as well as to protect the new unlicensed users from harming each
> other.  Anybody who does any of the things in those bullet points should be
> flogged.
>
>
>
> ….but there’s also nothing new here.  People will misconfigure EIRP and
> install bigger antennas out of ignorance even if they’re an upright
> citizen.  Hell I’m getting the impression from Peter Kranz’s original
> question that he didn’t even know there was an EIRP limit.  So that’s
> exhibit A.  The people who would use hacked or international radios know
> exactly what they’re doing and if they don’t already know how to get them
> then they’ll learn it from Reddit, or from shady vendors, or they’ll figure
> it out by accident when they buy a foreign model off EBay.   Or they’re
> already doing it.
>
>
>
> My point is 6ghz is not going to be safe for licensed PTP anymore.  Maybe
> I’m being pessimistic about it.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *TJ Trout
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 06, 2023 5:29 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] EPMP4600
>
>
>
> I'm baffled that you would even propose or share that information
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 6, 2023, 1:56 PM  wrote:
>
> The industry already has solutions to the EIRP problem.
>
>
>
>- Buy international units set to follow the rules in Russia or Hong
>Kong and then you can run any channel you want at whatever power you want.
>- Alter the firmware on a US unit to enable rules for another country
>or maybe put it in an engineering test mode with no limitations.
>- “Misconfigure” the antenna gain so you can turn up the Tx power.
>- If antenna gain can’t be adjusted in the config, then buy integrated
>units with small antennas and then run pigtails off the circuit board to a
>bigger antenna
>
>
>
> You shouldn’t really do any of this, but all of those “solutions” have
> been seen in the wild.  For awhile you could factory reset AirMax gear and
> then on first login just pick whatever country you wanted.  I knew a guy
> who did that for all of his PTP links and I got him in trouble with his
> boss.  Or at least his boss pretended he was in trouble, but for all I know
> maybe they started laughing together as soon as I was out of the room.
>
>
>
> If I had 6ghz licensed links right now I would be coming up with
> contingency plans for if/when they get trashed by some jabroni.  Like the
> private pool is about to become a public pool and you know all the
> neighborhood kids are gonna pee in it.  It might be time to look for
> another pool.  Just saying.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *castarritt
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 06, 2023 3:03 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] EPMP4600
>
>
>
> 36dbm is max for 6ghz, and that is assuming an SM with built in GPS.  SMs
> without GPS will be limited to 30dbm.  I haven't used any Mimosa, but I bet
> they will limit it to the same EIRP if you set them up with the correct
> antenna gain.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 6, 2023 at 1:56 PM Peter Kranz via AF  wrote:
>
> I currently have a few experimental 6Ghz licenses, where we have been
> trialing the Mimosa A6 equipment. So far the A6 has not been super stable,
> although the performance when it is stable was exciting at > 800 Mbps for
> subs. Also has problems with timing for customers past 5 miles or so.
>
>
>
> Anyway, I’m thinking of switching gears to Cambium’s 4600 platform to have
> something more stable. Am I correct in that Cambium is limiting the EIRP of
> the SMs to 36db? So the 25db subscriber dish transmits into the dish at +11?
>
>
>
> This sounds like the solution is limited to about 4-5 miles as a result..
> Am I missing something here?
>
>
>
> Peter Kranz
> www.UnwiredLtd.com 
> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
> Mobile: 510-207-
> pkr...@unwiredltd.com
>
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] battery nerd question

[Steve Jones]

we have a dozen or so, but are looking at pole mount micropops (our own
poles). We are losing a grain elevator site because they decommissioned the
elevator and theres no real options for the customers in some of the areas.
Im just trying to get to something we can get solar power with enough
battery to last through overcast. So Im calculating per battery runtimes,
then will look at number of batteries we would need to survive vs paying
for a ROW meter vs losing the customers. Just have to get to the cost per
customer to retain them and the benefit gained per pole


On Tue, Aug 15, 2023 at 8:53 AM Brian Webster 
wrote:

> How many of the batteries do you have? Do you need any voltages other than
> the 48 volts? If you have 4 batteries and only need 48 volts then wire them
> in series and not have to deal with the converter.
>
>
>
> Thank you,
>
> Brian Webster
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *
> dmmoff...@gmail.com
> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 15, 2023 6:59 AM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] battery nerd question
>
>
>
> *You’re around C/30 which should be on the high end *of capacity*.
>
> Lower load usually means a little extra capacity out of the battery.  I
> realized that sentence might have been ambiguous.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* dmmoff...@gmail.com 
> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 15, 2023 6:56 AM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* RE: [AFMUG] battery nerd question
>
>
>
> You can do the whole thing in Watts.
>
>
>
> 12V * 150ah = 1800 Watt-hours
>
> 1800Wh / 50W = 36 hours
>
>
>
> If they’re telling me 95% efficiency, I’d assume 50W out needs 53W in (50
> / 0.95).
>
> There’s usually an efficiency curve for the device based on load and
> temperature so it wouldn’t be 95% in all circumstances.  Your system should
> be drawing less than 5A off the battery, and if your multimeter has a 10A
> fuse like most do, then you could put the meter in line and actually
> measure the amperage before and after the converter.  Then you’d know for
> sure.
>
>
>
> And the battery’s total capacity will have a curve based on C-rate so
> there’s some variability there too.  Usually it lasts longer when you’re
> drawing lower amperage.  You’re around C/30 which should be on the high
> end.
>
>
>
> Age and maintenance of the battery affect runtime as well.  If I want 6
> hours of runtime then I plan Ah for 12 hours runtime. When my batteries are
> halfway toasted I’m still getting useful life out of them.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Monday, August 14, 2023 9:57 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] battery nerd question
>
>
>
> Just trying to cipher runtimes
>
> I have on hand 150ah 12 volt batteries, so thats what id be looking to use.
>
> Excluding the conversion loss of a 12v to 48v step up converter is the
> math correct here?
>
> 12v 150ah=1800 watt hours
> 1800 watt hours at 48v = 37.5ah
> 50 watts of radio running 48v = 1.04 amps
> 37.5ah @ 1.04 amps = 32.77 hours runtime
>
>
>
> does a step up that claims 95% efficiency mean 95% of the watt hours?
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[AFMUG] battery nerd question

[Steve Jones]

Just trying to cipher runtimes
I have on hand 150ah 12 volt batteries, so thats what id be looking to use.
Excluding the conversion loss of a 12v to 48v step up converter is the math
correct here?
12v 150ah=1800 watt hours
1800 watt hours at 48v = 37.5ah
50 watts of radio running 48v = 1.04 amps
37.5ah @ 1.04 amps = 32.77 hours runtime

does a step up that claims 95% efficiency mean 95% of the watt hours?
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Re: [AFMUG] Robot solar panel cleaners

[Steve Jones]

I don't think we are allowed to do that any more.

On Mon, Aug 7, 2023, 2:12 PM Bill Prince  wrote:

> These are designed for dust, but maybe they might work for light snow too?
>
>
> https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/clarence-thomas-bought-267-000-180329496.html
>
> --
> bp
> 
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Solar

[Steve Jones]

to get me to come to the state of california would require an act of god
and a pile of gold bars. I would rather lick ebola sores and scopp my eyes
out with spoons.

But for real, last time i looked at freight transport to florida it was
around 2500, california probably 3-4x that to california. For duct, Adams
Cable was offering free shipping on it.

On Wed, Aug 2, 2023 at 3:28 PM Bill Prince  wrote:

> What's the transport fee to come to the outer coast in California?
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 8/1/2023 6:15 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
>
> dont forget to hire me to drill in 2 inch duct for the conductors
>
> On Tue, Aug 1, 2023 at 1:40 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
> wrote:
>
>> No, they all take COGS X 3 for the installed price.  You really have to
>> be your own contractor to get the best deal.  I presume that is going out
>> in an open field?  If so, I would use that mount that uses the poles you
>> hammer into the ground with a skid steer.
>>
>> Get construction grunts to mount them up.  Once mounted hire an
>> independent electrician to do the wiring.  The grunts can be trained up to
>> do the bulk of the wiring.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Daniel Pautz via AF
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 1, 2023 11:19 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> *Cc:* Daniel Pautz
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Solar
>>
>>
>> Now if only the installers weren’t so greedy.   Chuck know of any good
>> commercial / industrial installers?   Considering a big 500kw + install up
>> here in Ogden.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Trey Scarborough
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 01, 2023 10:16 AM
>> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Solar
>>
>>
>>
>> Wow I'm going to have to check these guys out there just down the street
>> from me. I actually almost moved in to that complex when I was looking for
>> my new office.
>>
>> On 7/31/23 6:28 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>>
>> Beene Brothers Ventures LLC
>>
>> 2090 Fm157 Mansfield, TX 76063 US
>>
>> beenebrothe...@gmail.com
>>
>> https://beenebrothers.com
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jul 31, 2023, at 5:26 PM, Jim Bouse [Brazos WiFi]
>> mailto:j...@brazoswifi.com wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>> Not bad. Where did you order from?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Jim
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S22+ 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>  Original message 
>>
>> From: Chuck McCown via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com
>>
>> Date: 7/31/23 6:20 PM (GMT-06:00)
>>
>> To: af@af.afmug.com
>>
>> Cc: Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@go-mtc.com
>>
>> Subject: [AFMUG] Solar
>>
>>
>>
>> Just bought a pallet of new 490 watt panels for 40 cents per watt.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> --
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>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
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>>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Solar

[Steve Jones]

dont forget to hire me to drill in 2 inch duct for the conductors

On Tue, Aug 1, 2023 at 1:40 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> No, they all take COGS X 3 for the installed price.  You really have to be
> your own contractor to get the best deal.  I presume that is going out in
> an open field?  If so, I would use that mount that uses the poles you
> hammer into the ground with a skid steer.
>
> Get construction grunts to mount them up.  Once mounted hire an
> independent electrician to do the wiring.  The grunts can be trained up to
> do the bulk of the wiring.
>
>
>
> *From:* Daniel Pautz via AF
> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 1, 2023 11:19 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Cc:* Daniel Pautz
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Solar
>
>
> Now if only the installers weren’t so greedy.   Chuck know of any good
> commercial / industrial installers?   Considering a big 500kw + install up
> here in Ogden.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Trey Scarborough
> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 01, 2023 10:16 AM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Solar
>
>
>
> Wow I'm going to have to check these guys out there just down the street
> from me. I actually almost moved in to that complex when I was looking for
> my new office.
>
> On 7/31/23 6:28 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>
> Beene Brothers Ventures LLC
>
> 2090 Fm157 Mansfield, TX 76063 US
>
> beenebrothe...@gmail.com
>
> https://beenebrothers.com
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Jul 31, 2023, at 5:26 PM, Jim Bouse [Brazos WiFi]
> mailto:j...@brazoswifi.com wrote:
>
> 
>
> Not bad. Where did you order from?
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S22+ 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  Original message 
>
> From: Chuck McCown via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com
>
> Date: 7/31/23 6:20 PM (GMT-06:00)
>
> To: af@af.afmug.com
>
> Cc: Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@go-mtc.com
>
> Subject: [AFMUG] Solar
>
>
>
> Just bought a pallet of new 490 watt panels for 40 cents per watt.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] Are you reliant on searching?

[Steve Jones]

I cant see my screen half the time, let alone the mouse

On Tue, Aug 1, 2023, 1:38 PM Bill Prince  wrote:

> There is a setting that causes the curser to be an expanding/contracting
> bullseye by tapping the CTRL key .
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 8/1/2023 9:38 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>
> Hey!  I lose the cursor all the time.  Mostly on my surface with the touch
> pad.
>
>
>
> *From:* Nate Burke
> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 1, 2023 8:13 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Are you reliant on searching?
>
> I guess I'm just becoming a curmudgeon.  Just watching him do things, I'm
> like 'It's 2 clicks to get to the setting you want'  instead, he clicks the
> search button, has to move to the keyboard to type, then back to the mouse
> to select the setting it's returned.  I guess that's better than watching
> the boss who continually loses his mouse on the screen and can't figure out
> where he's clicking.
>
> On 7/31/2023 8:37 PM, CBB - Jay Fuller wrote:
>
>
> My windows search feature has also been periodically crashing.  Having to
> use start menu.  Wish they would fix w an update.
>
> - Reply message -
> From: dmmoff...@gmail.com
> To: "'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'" mailto:af@af.afmug.com
> Subject: [AFMUG] Are you reliant on searching?
> Date: Mon, Jul 31, 2023 5:46 PM
>
>
> A few weeks ago the Windows search box was broken for me, but I was in the
> middle of something where I couldn't restart my computer.  That was the
> first time I'd used the Start Menu to open applications in 4 or 5 years.  I
> only use Start to find the "shutdown" button.  Yes, it's faster to search by
> the name of the application than to click through the Start Menu for it.  I
> also use it for the Control Panel items I open most often.  For example I
> start typing "ethernet" and then click "ethernet settings" as soon as it
> appears and I type "device" and click on "device manager".
>
> I don't generally search for settings in a device.  Maybe I'll try it.
>
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Nate Burke
> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2023 4:38 PM
> To: Animal Farm mailto:af@af.afmug.com
> Subject: [AFMUG] Are you reliant on searching?
>
> We've got a new employee in his 20's.  He never browses for programs off his
> start menu, but uses the windows search box for everything.
>
> Anything that has a search box, he types into that.  I didn't even know that
> the Grandstream UCM's had a search function, but he only uses that to find
> settings to change.  Is this normal behavior now? Is it actually faster?
>
> --
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> listAF@af.afmug.comhttp://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
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>
>
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Are you reliant on searching?

[Steve Jones]

With windows its becoming about the only way to get to stuff any more, they
make everything 30 clicks deep now. Start menu isnt natively
directory driven. Same with phones and the billions of icons, its quicker
just to go to search for the app. Its bullshit.. change. Kids always
messing with the status quo.


On Mon, Jul 31, 2023 at 3:49 PM Nate Burke  wrote:

> We've got a new employee in his 20's.  He never browses for programs off
> his start menu, but uses the windows search box for everything.
>
> Anything that has a search box, he types into that.  I didn't even know
> that the Grandstream UCM's had a search function, but he only uses that
> to find settings to change.  Is this normal behavior now? Is it actually
> faster?
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT Everyone was right.

[Steve Jones]

False
The bear was shot by the conservative, then eaten and made into a rug.

Thats why political leanings of bear attack victims are a skewed metric.
Though it is inherently more dangerous for leftward leaning to walk in bear
country than rightward leaning, vaccinated or not.

I have a buddy who goes on night time wild boar knife hunts, I suspect none
of the other folks who buy that package are leftward leaning. It
doesnt have anything to do with bear attacks, I just think my buddy does
cool shit and I hope he works through his trauma.


On Mon, Jul 3, 2023 at 12:15 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> Third draft:
> Lessee, we can presume the bear is a liberal because it got vaccinated.
> So a liberal bear is more likely to attack conservatives.
>
> So I think you guys are good.  [image: Winking smile]
>
>
> *From:* Bill Prince
> *Sent:* Sunday, July 2, 2023 7:45 PM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Everyone was right.
>
>
> I'm not a democrat
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 7/2/2023 4:55 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>
> Not sure the logic of that joke makes sense
>
> Lessee, we can presume the bear is a democrat because it got vaccinated.
> So a democrat bear is more likely to attack republicans.
>
> So I think you guys are good.  [image: Winking smile]
>
>
> *From:* Chuck McCown via AF
> *Sent:* Sunday, July 2, 2023 5:23 PM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Cc:* ch...@go-mtc.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Everyone was right.
>
> Then they will not attack.  They only attack democrats!
>
>
>
> *From:* Bill Prince
> *Sent:* Sunday, July 2, 2023 12:58 PM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Everyone was right.
>
>
> What if the grizzly is vaccinated?
>
>
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 7/2/2023 11:08 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>
> .005 but that is attack, not death.  I actually calculated it.
> Deaths is .0005
>
> Lightening is 100 x more likely to get her.
>
>
> *From:* Bill Prince
> *Sent:* Sunday, July 2, 2023 11:25 AM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Everyone was right.
>
>
> My wife wants to know the micromorts for death by grizzly bear when
> backpacking in Yellowstone National Park.
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 7/2/2023 9:32 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>
>
>
> --
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Re: [AFMUG] Fun way to start the day. Incredible PBX Voicemail Notification

[Steve Jones]

I would have paused for 6 seconds every 4 words when talking to her. I
would have done it through the whole conversation. I hate pause talkers,
its like chewing with your mouth open. I would have paid any cost on repair
and gave credits, but I would have paused ever 2 words when telling her

On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 10:46 PM CBB - Jay Fuller 
wrote:

>
> At least she thanked you for listening.  If you listened to the endlol
>
> - Reply message -
> From: "Chuck McCown via AF" 
> To: "Adam Moffett" , "AnimalFarm Microwave Users
> Group" 
> Cc: 
> Subject: [AFMUG] Fun way to start the day. Incredible PBX Voicemail
> Notification
> Date: Thu, Jun 29, 2023 12:16 PM
>
> I think that maybe our guys hand dug at that site and may have hit the
> irrigation line with a digging bar but did not notice it.  She says the
> pipe was punctured.
>
> In any event I called her and she bitched at me for 20 minutes.  I will
> give here a month of free service.
>
>
>
> *From:* Adam Moffett
> *Sent:* Thursday, June 29, 2023 10:53 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Cc:* ch...@go-mtc.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fun way to start the day. Incredible PBX Voicemail
> Notification
>
> Hard to imagine they had low pressure ever since that install and only
> investigated today.
>
> I found recently that in State of NY the statute of limitations on
> property damage is 3 years.  Not that they *cant* sue you after that, but
> it’s an extra hurdle that’s difficult to cross.
>
> I received a similar complaint recently you see. .
>
>
> Get Outlook for iOS 
> --
> *From:* AF  on behalf of Chuck McCown via AF <
> af@af.afmug.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, June 29, 2023 11:57:19 AM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com 
> *Cc:* ch...@go-mtc.com 
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Fun way to start the day. Incredible PBX Voicemail
> Notification
>
> Install was done 3 years ago.  HDD install.  And she says the pipe is 12"
> below our duct  Sweetheart.
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Re: [AFMUG] This thing on?

[Steve Jones]

Except we dont know that it is running out. Capped once empty wells are
found to be full of oil. The same people who were giving mercury to kids
for cuts and scratches are the ones who decided oil wa derived from spoiled
dinosaurs. That's a lot of dinosaurs. Less dinosaurs by volume than there
are people dying now and, by their logic, also turning into oil.
For all we actually know oil is just the organic earths blood,
replenisheshed by its liver just like ours.
Decimating economies to save us from fossil fluid depletion is on par with
causing hepatitis outbreaks in the 2020s by switching to plastic bags in
the 80s to save the rain forests which turned out not to actually be the
lungs of the earth.
Al gore invented the series of tubes we know as he internet to spread fear
mongering.
Work toward oil independence because we want more efficient tooling, not
because some suit with an ego needs it to happen.

On Thu, Jun 29, 2023, 1:02 PM  wrote:

> So the real news article was about floating artic ice being gone, and they
> say 80-85% of it is gone now.  So they missed on the exact timing, but most
> of it is gone.
>
> The bit about the “end of humanity” was a clickbait headline someone
> attached to that.
>
> The kid thought a clickbait headline was representing the real story,
> believed it and retweeted it.  She was wrong.  Her 15 minutes are up
> anyway, and now it’s “Greta who?” unless you’re someone who wants to pick
> on her.
>
>
>
> One kid being wrong doesn’t mean the earth isn’t getting warmer or that
> it’s not a problem.
>
>
>
> For any who don’t believe that the climate will create problems for our
> descendants, and that it’s nothing to do with us if it does, do you at
> least believe these points?
> 1) No matter how much fossil fuel there is it’s not infinite so it makes
> sense to conserve it.
>
> 2) To get the oil price we have, we sell to where it’s more expensive and
> buy from where it’s cheaper.  “Where it’s cheaper” is almost universally
> countries that don’t like us (or we don’t like), and reducing consumption
> means we can buy less from them without paying more.
>
>
>
> I know people made a lot of hay about “energy independence” when domestic
> oil production exceeded domestic demand a few years ago, but I think they
> were overlooking that if we actually tried to be independent on oil the
> price would skyrocket on account of not having those cheaper imports in our
> supply and losing the revenue from the exports.  We’ve also long since
> exceeded that production level, but it’s not worth crowing about it in
> 2022-2023. The price remains high because Russia is mostly off the market,
> and as we increase production Saudi Arabia (and OPEC in general) reduces
> theirs to preserve the high price.  The low price sometimes cited occurred
> when *demand* plummeted during lock downs.  Then everybody (USA included)
> cut production because low prices are bad for the oil producers.
>
>
>
> If you’re not on board with fossil fuel reduction for climate change
> reasons you should be on board because it’s simply better for our country
> if we stop relying on something that will eventually run out, which
> finances regimes that are belligerent to us, and finances business
> interests that meddle in both our foreign and domestic policy for their own
> benefit.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown via AF
> *Sent:* Thursday, June 29, 2023 1:15 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Cc:* ch...@go-mtc.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] This thing on?
>
>
>
> She did say :“A top climate scientist is warning that climate change will
> wipe out humanity unless we stop using fossil fuels over the next five
> years.”
>
>
>
> That was 5 years ago.
>
>
>
> So the warning seems to say that we had 5 years to stop using fossil fuels
> or humanity will be wiped out.
>
> So time to get  your affairs in order...
>
>
>
> *From:* Bill Prince
>
> *Sent:* Thursday, June 29, 2023 10:28 AM
>
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] This thing on?
>
>
>
> The rest of the story.
>
>
> https://www.factcheck.org/2023/06/viral-posts-distort-greta-thunberg-tweet-warning-about-climate-change/
>
> bp
>
> 
>
> On 6/21/2023 3:53 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
>
> Greta Thunberg day.  5 years ago today Greta Thunberg, climate activist,
> tweeted, "A top climate scientist is warning that climate change will wipe
> out all of humanity unless we stop using fossil fuels over the next five
> years."
>
>
>
> The tweet has since been deleted. However, today is our last day before
> catastrophic, world-wide destruction. Have a 

Re: [AFMUG] This thing on?

[Steve Jones]

96 hours O2 for 5 people
480 man hours O2
120 hours - 4 people
160 hours - 3 people
240 hours - 2 people
480 hours - me

just saying





On Thu, Jun 22, 2023 at 10:59 AM Chuck McCown via AF 
wrote:

> Water pressure at 12,500' is something like 5400 psi.  There is a lot of
> area on that tube.  Who trusts essentially fiberglass to withstand 5400
> psi?
> If it was a pressure vessel it is one thing, but this is essentially a
> vacuum inside the tube, the forces pushing on it are not pulling on those
> fibers.  The tiniest non symmetry in shape would be no bueno.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: dmmoff...@gmail.com
> Sent: Thursday, June 22, 2023 7:02 AM
> To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
> Cc: ch...@go-mtc.com
> Subject: RE: [AFMUG] This thing on?
>
> I read a commentary today saying the hull was made of titanium and carbon
> fiber.
>
> An Operations Director for the manufacturer delivered a quality control
> report saying that the carbon fiber hull carried a risk of small defects
> expanding into major failures under pressure.  They were relying on an
> acoustic fault detection system that was supposed to alert the pilot if
> there were sounds indicating stress in the hull.  That Operations Director
> said you'd have a matter of milliseconds between that alert system going
> off
> and a catastrophic failure.  He'd expressed those concerns verbally and was
> ignored, so he delivered that report to senior management in 2018 to create
> a written record of his concerns, and was immediately fired.  Then he took
> his report to OSHA, there was a lawsuit about divulging company information
> or some such.  Lawsuit settled later that year, OSHA didn't take any action
> against the manufacturer.  I'd bet a nickel that OSHA doesn't have specific
> rules for submarines, and without any rules to follow they don't have
> enough
> knowledge to assess whether one is actually safe.
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via AF
> Sent: Wednesday, June 21, 2023 7:32 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> Cc: ch...@go-mtc.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] This thing on?
>
> What a horror show.  There were so many ways they could have improved their
> chances at survival.  Supposedly dissolvable straps should have dropped
> sand
> ballast by now.  They had a way to mechanically drop steel ballast.  And a
> inflatable bladder.
>
> Why not a power and comm tether to the mother ship?  I realize it is
> 12,500'
>
> of cable but fiber optics are pretty much neutrally buoyant.
>
> But no underwater pinger.  No ELT.  How about a sat tel or VHF radio.  Some
> kind of way to talk to the world.  No high pressure air to blow tanks.  I
> would have wanted explosive bolts on the hatch if there was no other way to
> get out.  But why not some kind of fresh air intake assuming you could
> surface.  This haunts my sleep.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Bill Prince
> Tryin' to get my ass outa this cramped submarine.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 6/21/2023 3:10 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
> > Errbody dead?
> >
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
> --
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>
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[AFMUG] This thing on?

[Steve Jones]

Errbody dead?
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Re: [AFMUG] OT NEC

[Steve Jones]

Dead wire has to be marked at both ends now or removed, that was in nec.

Most municipalities defer to nec as adopted, so for the flammable on racks
have them show you the specific code so you can verify compliance. That
sound more like fire code than electric code and that you go buy a case of
whatever the local fire chief drinks cause he can make or break you

On Mon, Jun 12, 2023, 7:46 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> THHN. And we learned that the fire code for pallet racks is proportional
> to square footage.  We think we are in the lowest group so almost no rules
> by our reading.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jun 12, 2023, at 5:50 PM, dmmoff...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> 
>
> On 1) it’s common practice to wirenut the conductors together on the dead
> wire.  Then if someone got confused later and energized it they’d
> immediately pop their breaker.  That’s safer than having someone
> accidentally put 208V into a wire hanging in the middle of nowhere.  I
> can’t imagine why it would be cited as “junction box without cover”.
>
> What type of wire is it?  Something like an SJOW coming out of a box?
> Maybe put a twist-lock socket on the end of it and re-energize it.  Now
> it’s an outlet.
>
>
>
> (2) might not be a misunderstanding.  NFPA has definitions for various
> classes of flammable materials, and depending on what you’re storing it
> might not be that you *can’t* put flammable items on the racks, rather
> you might be required to have a sprinkler system in order to do so.
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown via AF
> *Sent:* Monday, June 12, 2023 6:17 PM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Cc:* ch...@go-mtc.com
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] OT NEC
>
>
>
> Got gigged by the fire department today on a couple items.
>
>
>
> 1)Hand coil of wire up in the ceiling over a spot where a machine used
> to be.  Not gonna cut it off as some other machine may go there.  It is
> coiled and cut dead and capped in the breaker panel.  They are quoting a
> junction box without a cover and saying I guess I have to mount a big assed
> box up there to enclose this dead wire?  Opinions.
>
>
>
> 2)Nothing flammable on our pallet racking.  Every warehouse I have
> ever been has pallet racking full of things in corrugated boxes.  Having a
> hard time buying this.  So we can only store steel and rocks up there.
> They do say we can put our non flammable items on a pallet  Anyone ever
> run across this before?
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
> Chuck McCown
>
> McCown Technology Corporation
> 8401 N Commerce Dr
> Lake Point, Utah 84074
> 801-250-9503 Office
> 435-830-4306 Cell
> www.mccowntech.com
> www.microtrench.pro
> www.terabitnetworks.com
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Release of Liability Review

[Steve Jones]

So an update on this. Surprisingly, no homeowners have refused to sign, If
there is non exposure mitigation, we document it on the sheet and both sign
next to the mitigation (an example was a farm nobody knew where the water
lines were and the private locate company couldnt find them with GPR. We
mechanically excavated a 2 foot trench over the suspected area it might be
and hand dug another foot, then sent the drill head through the daylight on
that section.

I actually had a homeowners association sign this when we were doing power
duct for the whole neighborhood. Initially we had no waiver, but nobody
knew for sure where the water was. I hand dug down a hydrant and put my
spade into the pvc main and it shattered at 5 foot. They said "oh yeah, its
brittle" So they signed this for the entire water plant. we had blanket
permission to hit it all, lol. We had two other water contacts at 36 inches
and at 24 inches. I ended up paying the bill, but I had to get protected in
the event we hit 20 water lines.

My lawyer looked it over, said it was good, she only recommended adding
something to the nature of indemnification of someone coming out and
climbing on a piece of equipment they shouldnt be on and falling off. Ill
add that when I redo my documentation.

On Mon, Aug 15, 2022 at 5:52 PM Robert  wrote:

> They would have been a bad customer too...
>
> On 8/15/22 12:05 PM, Mark Radabaugh wrote:
>
> They were mad at the other provider before they switched to us - so who
> knows?
>
> By the time she got to me she had already aggravated the installer, the
> field service manager, the customer service manager, the billing manager,
> and the operations manager.
>
> Given there was little chance I could make her happy I figured it was
> better to make 5 other people happy.   She might not have been happy with
> the result, but everybody else was.
>
> Mark
>
>
>
> On Aug 15, 2022, at 1:49 PM, Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:
>
> Did she get service from some other provider?
>
> *From:* Mark Radabaugh
> *Sent:* Monday, August 15, 2022 11:40 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Release of Liability Review
>
> Nope.
>
>
>
> On Aug 15, 2022, at 12:19 PM, Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:
>
> Did she ever capitulate?
>
>
> *From:* Mark Radabaugh
> *Sent:* Monday, August 15, 2022 7:05 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Release of Liability Review
>
> Same. Customer refused to sign the service agreement after the
> install.   She was kind of pissed off when we went back and picked up the
> equipment.Oh well.
>
> Mark
>
>
>
> On Aug 14, 2022, at 6:16 PM, Bill Prince  wrote:
>
>
> I don't know about that. We've had people who requested service, and then
> refused to sign our service agreement. No signy. No servicey. Our service
> agreement was pretty short and simple.
>
> --
> bp
> part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com
>
>
> On Sun, Aug 14, 2022 at 1:01 PM Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
>
>> You guys might not sign it, but a homeowner wanting fiber has the choice
>> of a) no fiber or b) sign itthey're going to sign it.
>>
>> On Sun, Aug 14, 2022 at 12:10 AM Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> That had like an 8 or 9 dollar price tag?
>>>
>>> On Sat, Aug 13, 2022, 9:41 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> They didn’t call for a locate prior to drilling.  Scuba divers had to
>>>> dive inside the pipe and weld on a patch from the inside.  Quite the
>>>> ordeal.  Good thing we had good insurance.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *From:* Steve Jones
>>>> *Sent:* Saturday, August 13, 2022 8:25 PM
>>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Release of Liability Review
>>>>
>>>> Ouch
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Aug 13, 2022, 8:09 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> One of them was 48” I think and washed out a railroad track...  And it
>>>>> was our fault...
>>>>>
>>>>> *From:* Chuck McCown via AF
>>>>> *Sent:* Saturday, August 13, 2022 5:00 PM
>>>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>>>>> *Cc:* Chuck McCown
>>>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Release of Liability Review
>>>>>
>>>>> I have repaired tons of stuff, bought trees, bought sod, whatever it
>>>>> takes to make the landowner happy.  Not really their fault either if they
>>>>> don’t know it is there.  Just the cost of doing business.  GL takes care

Re: [AFMUG] OT tracert

[Steve Jones]

godaddy is always the problem.


On Wed, May 31, 2023 at 1:02 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> Thanks everyone.  Not sure what is to blame here.  It appears Godaddy is
> the problem at times.  Working better now.  But all of you had a much
> different tracert than I did.  I had a multple second delay between cogents
> last node and godaddy.
>
>
>
> *From:* Forrest Christian (List Account)
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 31, 2023 11:13 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Cc:* Chuck McCown
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT tracert
>
> See
> https://pagespeed.web.dev/analysis/http-www-microtrench-blades-com/7zj3glpe5h?form_factor=mobile
> for some insights.
>
> Seems like there are some very large images which can be better
> compressed.   And a few other things.
>
> On Wed, May 31, 2023, 10:17 AM Chuck McCown via AF 
> wrote:
>
>> Could some of you do a tracert to www.microtrench-blades.com please
>> Go Daddy is blaming the slow load on my ISP yeah.
>>
>> Something is making it load very slow for me and others.
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
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> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Air vac

[Steve Jones]

I dont know the math behind air pressure, but if I split the 150psi into
two, then does each orifice get 75psi?

On Tue, May 23, 2023 at 9:54 AM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> Spoke to a venturi engineer just now.  He says 72 psi is the magic
> number.  It has something to do with atmospheric air pressure and the
> density of the air.  I presume that number would change with altitude.
>
>
>
> *From:* Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Monday, May 22, 2023 9:34 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Air vac
>
> I use an auger to dig them, vac to clear them. Same thing with the
> airspade/airvac combo.  I dont do posts less than 48 inches. Whats really
> pushing this is the last project was installing 2 inch duct for the power
> company, the old primaries were failed concentric, as it turns out the
> stuff is dangerous, it faults on its own, jabbing shovels and post hole
> diggers at it is a recipe for disaster and water is its mortal enemy. Im
> chasing more contracts with that power company to replace more of that
> concentric. Im not gonna get the cutting power of water, but ill have dry
> spoils to put back in the hole.
>
> I wish I hadnt done all the drugs, id be able to understand the maths on
> this, im wondering if I cant split the input and double the lift with two
> venturis
>
> On Mon, May 22, 2023 at 9:23 AM  wrote:
>
>> So you dug post holes with a shop vac?  Is it sandy where you are?  I
>> feel like I hit about 10,000 rocks per post hole.  Many too big for a vac
>> hose, and many just big enough to clog it.
>>
>> I might have to try it anyway.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
>> *Sent:* Sunday, May 21, 2023 6:12 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Air vac
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm having better luck with the prototype than a shop vac already, just
>> trying to improve the lift. Toting a generator isnt really an option.
>>
>> I also just have a shop vac hose, if theres moisture the dirt collects on
>> the sides with a shop vac and loses lift. That's how I've always dug post
>> holes.
>>
>> On Sun, May 21, 2023, 3:53 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
>> wrote:
>>
>> I think you would have better luck with a strong shop vac and a 30 gallon
>> drum.  I have seen guys do that and it worked OK.  Air powered vacuum
>> producers work but I don’t know how well.  Sometimes they are called
>> eductors or ejectors.
>>
>>
>>
>> Take a look at this one:
>>
>>
>> https://www.globalindustrial.com/p/2-in-line-vac-only-aluminum?infoParam.campaignId=T9F&gclid=CjwKCAjwgqejBhBAEiwAuWHioM68tuz0PVLcvHFy4CRspRtvhy5gEQQryMrUkOoNv4MVeUTRSWTkvxoCrv8QAvD_BwE
>>
>>
>>
>> Best Regards,
>> Chuck McCown
>>
>> McCown Technology Corporation
>> 8401 N Commerce Dr
>> Lake Point, Utah 84074
>> 801-250-9503 Office
>> 435-830-4306 Cell
>> www.mccowntech.com
>> www.microtrench.pro
>> www.terabitnetworks.com
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Steve Jones
>>
>> *Sent:* Sunday, May 21, 2023 11:56 AM
>>
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>>
>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Air vac
>>
>>
>>
>> I need advice from you nerds.
>>
>> I'm a broke joke, so hydrovac isnt in my budget. Besides, I want dry
>> spoils to put back in the hole.
>>
>> This revision works for venturi. I have multiple size reducer but right
>> now I'm just doing 3/4 to to inch. The 3/4 to 1 then 1 to half back to 1.5
>> for the venturi side seemed to have the best lift, but the hardware store
>> didnt have everything, so it's all in 2 inch right now
>>
>> I'll dump to a 2000lb peanut sack if I can find one, but for now I'll
>> just use a 30 gallon drum and dump on the mega movers.
>>
>>
>>
>> This is for use in conjunction with the airspade I did have some coin to
>> get.
>>
>>
>>
>> Venturi math gets complicated and I'm full retard so I need to find he
>> best ways to increase negative pressure and where to drill the ports.
>>
>>
>>
>> I also wonder if theres an option to recapture the exhaust into the
>> airspade.
>>
>>
>>
>> I need you nerds to go full geek.
>>
>>
>>
>> If I can get valves correct I'll have the local machinist make me a
>> couple that are pressure rated.
>>
>>
>>
>> This is to mimic the airvac I also cant afford.
>>
>>
>>
>> This proof of concept has th

Re: [AFMUG] Air vac

[Steve Jones]

I use an auger to dig them, vac to clear them. Same thing with the
airspade/airvac combo.  I dont do posts less than 48 inches. Whats really
pushing this is the last project was installing 2 inch duct for the power
company, the old primaries were failed concentric, as it turns out the
stuff is dangerous, it faults on its own, jabbing shovels and post hole
diggers at it is a recipe for disaster and water is its mortal enemy. Im
chasing more contracts with that power company to replace more of that
concentric. Im not gonna get the cutting power of water, but ill have dry
spoils to put back in the hole.

I wish I hadnt done all the drugs, id be able to understand the maths on
this, im wondering if I cant split the input and double the lift with two
venturis

On Mon, May 22, 2023 at 9:23 AM  wrote:

> So you dug post holes with a shop vac?  Is it sandy where you are?  I feel
> like I hit about 10,000 rocks per post hole.  Many too big for a vac hose,
> and many just big enough to clog it.
>
> I might have to try it anyway.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Sunday, May 21, 2023 6:12 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Air vac
>
>
>
> I'm having better luck with the prototype than a shop vac already, just
> trying to improve the lift. Toting a generator isnt really an option.
>
> I also just have a shop vac hose, if theres moisture the dirt collects on
> the sides with a shop vac and loses lift. That's how I've always dug post
> holes.
>
> On Sun, May 21, 2023, 3:53 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:
>
> I think you would have better luck with a strong shop vac and a 30 gallon
> drum.  I have seen guys do that and it worked OK.  Air powered vacuum
> producers work but I don’t know how well.  Sometimes they are called
> eductors or ejectors.
>
>
>
> Take a look at this one:
>
>
> https://www.globalindustrial.com/p/2-in-line-vac-only-aluminum?infoParam.campaignId=T9F&gclid=CjwKCAjwgqejBhBAEiwAuWHioM68tuz0PVLcvHFy4CRspRtvhy5gEQQryMrUkOoNv4MVeUTRSWTkvxoCrv8QAvD_BwE
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
> Chuck McCown
>
> McCown Technology Corporation
> 8401 N Commerce Dr
> Lake Point, Utah 84074
> 801-250-9503 Office
> 435-830-4306 Cell
> www.mccowntech.com
> www.microtrench.pro
> www.terabitnetworks.com
>
>
>
> *From:* Steve Jones
>
> *Sent:* Sunday, May 21, 2023 11:56 AM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Air vac
>
>
>
> I need advice from you nerds.
>
> I'm a broke joke, so hydrovac isnt in my budget. Besides, I want dry
> spoils to put back in the hole.
>
> This revision works for venturi. I have multiple size reducer but right
> now I'm just doing 3/4 to to inch. The 3/4 to 1 then 1 to half back to 1.5
> for the venturi side seemed to have the best lift, but the hardware store
> didnt have everything, so it's all in 2 inch right now
>
> I'll dump to a 2000lb peanut sack if I can find one, but for now I'll just
> use a 30 gallon drum and dump on the mega movers.
>
>
>
> This is for use in conjunction with the airspade I did have some coin to
> get.
>
>
>
> Venturi math gets complicated and I'm full retard so I need to find he
> best ways to increase negative pressure and where to drill the ports.
>
>
>
> I also wonder if theres an option to recapture the exhaust into the
> airspade.
>
>
>
> I need you nerds to go full geek.
>
>
>
> If I can get valves correct I'll have the local machinist make me a couple
> that are pressure rated.
>
>
>
> This is to mimic the airvac I also cant afford.
>
>
>
> This proof of concept has the lift to clear potholes and handholes,  but I
> need to clean it up and get more efficiency.
>
> A side discovery is that this setup is perfect for blowing straw and seed
> with glue
> --
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Cellular router question

[Steve Jones]

I worked with the cradlepoint engineers. We had a hard time finding any
scenario where a repeater would not cause more harm than good. Ended with a
700 dollar antenna recomended so price wasnt even all that much more than a
quality repeater.
The biggest concern was the unavoidable feedback loop that would occur



On Sun, May 21, 2023, 6:07 PM Jaime Solorza 
wrote:

> That's what I was thinking...
>
> On Sun, May 21, 2023, 12:48 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> Just went through this with a customer. Dont do it. Get a sim router with
>> external connector and go to an external antenna
>>
>> On Sun, May 21, 2023, 1:31 PM Jaime Solorza 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I have an upcoming project to install a cellular router in a canyon site
>>> with spotty service..(-127, -138dBm)...
>>> I was wondering if anyone has used the output port of booster with cable
>>> to input port of cellular router?
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] Air vac

[Steve Jones]

I'm having better luck with the prototype than a shop vac already, just
trying to improve the lift. Toting a generator isnt really an option.
I also just have a shop vac hose, if theres moisture the dirt collects on
the sides with a shop vac and loses lift. That's how I've always dug post
holes.

On Sun, May 21, 2023, 3:53 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> I think you would have better luck with a strong shop vac and a 30 gallon
> drum.  I have seen guys do that and it worked OK.  Air powered vacuum
> producers work but I don’t know how well.  Sometimes they are called
> eductors or ejectors.
>
> Take a look at this one:
>
> https://www.globalindustrial.com/p/2-in-line-vac-only-aluminum?infoParam.campaignId=T9F&gclid=CjwKCAjwgqejBhBAEiwAuWHioM68tuz0PVLcvHFy4CRspRtvhy5gEQQryMrUkOoNv4MVeUTRSWTkvxoCrv8QAvD_BwE
>
> Best Regards,
> Chuck McCown
>
> McCown Technology Corporation
> 8401 N Commerce Dr
> Lake Point, Utah 84074
> 801-250-9503 Office
> 435-830-4306 Cell
> www.mccowntech.com
> www.microtrench.pro
> www.terabitnetworks.com
>
> *From:* Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Sunday, May 21, 2023 11:56 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Air vac
>
> I need advice from you nerds.
> I'm a broke joke, so hydrovac isnt in my budget. Besides, I want dry
> spoils to put back in the hole.
> This revision works for venturi. I have multiple size reducer but right
> now I'm just doing 3/4 to to inch. The 3/4 to 1 then 1 to half back to 1.5
> for the venturi side seemed to have the best lift, but the hardware store
> didnt have everything, so it's all in 2 inch right now
> I'll dump to a 2000lb peanut sack if I can find one, but for now I'll just
> use a 30 gallon drum and dump on the mega movers.
>
> This is for use in conjunction with the airspade I did have some coin to
> get.
>
> Venturi math gets complicated and I'm full retard so I need to find he
> best ways to increase negative pressure and where to drill the ports.
>
> I also wonder if theres an option to recapture the exhaust into the
> airspade.
>
> I need you nerds to go full geek.
>
> If I can get valves correct I'll have the local machinist make me a couple
> that are pressure rated.
>
> This is to mimic the airvac I also cant afford.
>
> This proof of concept has the lift to clear potholes and handholes,  but I
> need to clean it up and get more efficiency.
> A side discovery is that this setup is perfect for blowing straw and seed
> with glue
>
> --
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Cellular router question

[Steve Jones]

Just went through this with a customer. Dont do it. Get a sim router with
external connector and go to an external antenna

On Sun, May 21, 2023, 1:31 PM Jaime Solorza 
wrote:

> I have an upcoming project to install a cellular router in a canyon site
> with spotty service..(-127, -138dBm)...
> I was wondering if anyone has used the output port of booster with cable
> to input port of cellular router?
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] asus routers

[Steve Jones]

yeah, serverplus screwed up their notifications email again so everybody is
getting bounces from them. lol

asus routers are always getting hijacked I dont know why anybody still uses
them

On Thu, May 18, 2023 at 2:19 PM TJ Trout  wrote:

> ?? we had one go down yesterday
>
> On Thu, May 18, 2023 at 12:03 PM Robert  wrote:
>
>> If you have customers running asus..   Shit is hitting the wall.
>>
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>>
>
>
> --
> Thank you,
>
> TJ Trout
> Volt Broadband
> 209.480.3122 Cell
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Re: [AFMUG] Insurance

[Steve Jones]

10 bucks a month, I wont poison or stab them for 6 months. Boom. Now you
have insurance out the gate. Send me my check upon each new hire

On Mon, May 15, 2023, 10:54 AM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> I got crap on a job listing for offering health insurance after 6 months.
> My opinion is that we hire untrained entry level people.  They are young
> and poor.  Young might mean healthy, poor does mean medicaid eligibility.
> If they are any good and have lasted 6 months then insurance is a nice
> thing to add along with PTO etc.  We give raises twice a year guaranteed.
>
> Opinions?
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Headphones and earbuds

[Steve Jones]

Hearing protection, or open ears in manufacturing. Even with hearing
protection, you will hear the odd noise in the hum. noise cancelling is bad
juju because its only injecting more energy. People who demand shit like
earbuds also dont comprehend why they can watch cat videos on the machine.

Fuck them all anyway. your house, your rules. you should go find him on the
street and wait til hes mowing with them on, come up behind him and push
his ass under the mower, while hes bleeding to death, ask him what he might
have done different had he heard you coming. Theres no reason not to also
make this a teachable moment. He may argue about the mower being loud and
he wouldnt have heard you anyway, so in that case it may just be better to
wait til hes swinging in a hammock with his ear buds in and shiv him in the
neck

On Fri, May 12, 2023 at 4:18 PM Forrest Christian (List Account) <
li...@packetflux.com> wrote:

> If you can't hear ambient noise it's an issue.
>
> Safety violation.
>
> My take:
>
> If it's a loud area,  then you need hearing protection.   Note that most
> earbuds don't isolate that much, as such if you're even moderately close to
> the osha hearing protection levels then you can exceed them by permitting
> earbud use.  Hearing outside noise is not nearly as important here as
> ensuring that you don't exceed dB levels.
>
> In quieter areas, then you have the need to hear ambient noise.
>  Depending on the area and whether you feel that being aware of the
> direction of the noise is important, having a one earbud policy is often
> OK.
>
> Or you can demand use of something like:
>
> https://amp.earplugstore.com/saf-t-ear-bluetooth-dual-safety-earbuds.html
>
> From an enforcement perspective,  a no earbud at all policy is easiest.
>
> On Fri, May 12, 2023, 1:00 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:
>
>> I warned an employee wearing noise cancelling earphones that they were a
>> safety hazard yesterday.  Today I noticed he had them on again, I pointed
>> to his ear.  He went off on me, complaining that everyone else had
>> earbuds.  I told him that many times I started talking to him and he either
>> acted like he was not hearing anything or he chose to ignore me.  Yadda y
>> adda, yadda.  He quit a few minutes later.  Good worker but lousy
>> attitude.  43 years old and had worked about 20 different places.
>>
>> So I adopted an open ears policy.  If I am the asshole, that is fine.  I
>> am a boomer and proud of it.
>>
>> Whadya y’all think?
>>
>>
>>
>> *Should Employees Be Allowed to Wear Earbuds?*
>> --
>>
>>
>>
>> Currently, the Occupational Health and Safety Administration (OSHA) does
>> not have guidelines on earbud use in the workplace. However, OSHA has
>> issued recommendations regarding earbud use while on the job. Of course,
>> wearing earbuds in some work environments poses more of a threat than in
>> others.
>>
>> Earbud Dangers
>>
>> The dangers of wearing earbuds while on the job are similar to
>> non-employment use of these devices. People wearing earbuds simply cannot
>> hear emergency signals, but it goes beyond that. Overall, earbuds may pose
>> a safety hazard because the employee is less cognizant of their
>> surroundings and is not paying attention to their safety.
>>
>> No Earbuds Allowed
>>
>> OSHA urges employers to forbidTop of Form
>>
>>  Bottom of Form
>>
>> the use of earbuds when workers are operating any sort of heavy
>> equipment. Anyone working on a manufacturing or construction site where
>> heavy equipment is used should not have earbuds, headphones, or similar
>> devices on their heads. For example, even if the forklift operator is not
>> wearing earbuds, a fellow employee in the vicinity using these devices
>> could end up getting hit if they cannot hear the machine. Along with
>> earbuds, the same warnings hold true for smartphones.  Manufacturing
>> machinery such as milling machines emit noises that indicate problem
>> conditions or unsafe conditions.  Operators of machines need to be able
>> to hear what is going on with the machine.
>>
>> Other Earbud Risks
>>
>> In most manufacturing industries, various energy-related hazards exist.
>> These may include chemical, electrical, or fire hazards. Failure to hear a
>> warning device due to earbud use not only puts that employee at risk if
>> they cannot hear warnings from coworkers but may be at risk as earbuds also
>> affect evacuations or the realization that equipment is not functioning
>> properly. For maximum safety, no employee in a manufacturing setting should
>> wear earbuds, even if they are not in an area of heavy equipment use. That
>> includes those working in warehouses. Earbuds are never a substitute for
>> any type of hearing protection on the job.
>>
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[AFMUG] Compressor / component CFM mismatch

[Steve Jones]

I have an airspade coming. I got the 105cfm variant because its whats
available, they do have 150 and 225 cfm

My partners compressor is 275 cfm. Ive never really looked at controls to
see if its adjustable beyond just the valve since we use it for blowing
material only

will a 105 cfm nozzle just restrict flow or will it tear it apart? Sales
guy said it would be fine, but sales guys are dumb.

Im dumb too, I have issues comprehending the difference between PSI and
CFM, I assume its a volts/amps comparison and psi is applied volts, CFM is
available amps for consumption, but its the restriction component im
struggling to comprehend and dont want to blow up a $3k tool.
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Re: [AFMUG] Yealink "Forbidden"

[Steve Jones]

I hate when customers do that, because they never bring their firewall with
them.

On Wed, May 3, 2023 at 4:16 PM CBB - Jay Fuller 
wrote:

>
> I would take one of their phones completely offsite, preferably to a
> completely different provider (or if that isn't possible, another segment
> of your network).   If they work fine there, it is probably a problem there
> in your network.  Likely if it says forbidden again it's a problem with the
> voip provider.  We're a grandstream shop here but when i've seen forbidden
> it is almost always a voip provider problem.
>
> Good luck!  I usually don't give network advice, i'm by far not the
> smartest guy here. :)
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> *From:* dmmoff...@gmail.com
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 3, 2023 1:32 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Yealink "Forbidden"
>
> I was hoping somebody would know would triggers a “Forbidden” message on
> the Yealink’s screen.  I can assume, but I don’t know.
>
>
>
> “Do other devices have issues or are all issues isolated to Zoom phones?”
> ß good question.  The phones are in focus because having no phones is an
> emergent issue.  I can’t prove there *aren’t* any other related issues.
> That’s part of why I want to understand what’s happening.  It’s an
> apartment building.  If there are tenants having some weirdly specific
> issue like this they might not have reported it yet.
>
>
>
> You see two subnets because I moved the phones to a different VLAN….that
> was something their IT guy suggested.  The one in 100.64.x.x is just
> unplugged or something and that was the last known IP.
>
>
>
> I appreciate the suggestions regarding ALG and Firewall rules, but those
> have been checked and re-checked.
>
>
>
> We do provide the Internet access, and for historical reasons we do also
> control the router and switches.  We’re moving away from managed systems
> like that, but for the next 6 months or so it’s still in my purview.
>
>
>
> What we did change on Monday was layer2 topology.  There were literally 10
> switches in between these phones and the router.  Now there are 2.  That
> should be *better* if anything.  They’re blaming their issues on that
> change, but I don’t see *how*.  It’s the same switches except I jumpered
> up a different fiber path through the building to shorten that 10 switch
> daisy chain.  The only thing new is a couple of SFP transceivers on
> previously unused ports.  I did compare port settings and there’s no
> difference between new and old.  I might go swap transceivers, but that
> would be an act of desperation because it would make no sense.
>
>
>
> I haven’t talked to Zoom directly, but if the customer’s IT guy is to be
> believed they are remarkably unhelpful.
>
>
>
> Also exciting is the customer is part of a larger corporation and their IT
> guy is in another state.  The best we can do for remote hands is a
> maintenance person.  I can go there again and play around, but I don’t
> wanna.  Firstly, I got other stuff to do.  Secondly, there’s the “post hoc
> ergo propter hoc” issue.  Any time people see you touch something they may
> assume any problem they have for the next month is because you were there.
> “I can’t print, car won’t start, and there’s a wasp nest in the attic…..I
> bet it was that damn internet guy.”
>
>
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 03, 2023 1:12 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Yealink "Forbidden"
>
>
>
> Are the two private subnets in the screenshot the one network at the one
> location?  Are you providing the internet?  Do you have SIP ALG enabled?
> Do other devices have issues or are all issues isolated to Zoom phones?
>
>
>
> On Wed, May 3, 2023 at 12:47 PM  wrote:
>
> Apparently Zoom tier1 isn’t helping.  “Check your firewall settings” and
> other basic stuff.  I don’t know if they’re just script readers or if this
> IT guy doesn’t know what to ask.
>
>
>
> I don’t want to be the guy who just points fingers at the other guy, so
> I’m trying.  I just wish I could capture the SIP messages….friggin TLS so
> super secure that I can’t friggin help you.  If only the world had no bad
> people, then we wouldn’t need security.
>
> I want to hear Steve Jones’s plan for eliminating all the bad people.  I
> bet he has one.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Darin Steffl
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 03, 2023 10:49 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Yealink "Forbidden"
>
>
>
> This is really simple. If they can ping the internet or do anything else
> that requires internet at the same time the phones show offline, it's not
> your problem. They should be contacting their phone provider.
>
>
>
> Their voip provider can provide them host names to ping or trace to in
> order to troubleshoot. If you don't sell the voip, you shouldn't be
> troubleshooting it aside from making sure your network ping, jitter, and
> packe

Re: [AFMUG] Yealink "Forbidden"

[Steve Jones]

Its a bold assumption that its the bad people i want to eliminate (-:

Im not saying either way

but if there were no "good" people, then "bad" people could only stand to
get better. growth like that brings joy
If all the "bad" people were gone, then good people would only stand to get
worse. Decline brings sadness.

Call me the harbinger of joy

On Wed, May 3, 2023 at 11:47 AM  wrote:

> Apparently Zoom tier1 isn’t helping.  “Check your firewall settings” and
> other basic stuff.  I don’t know if they’re just script readers or if this
> IT guy doesn’t know what to ask.
>
>
>
> I don’t want to be the guy who just points fingers at the other guy, so
> I’m trying.  I just wish I could capture the SIP messages….friggin TLS so
> super secure that I can’t friggin help you.  If only the world had no bad
> people, then we wouldn’t need security.
>
> I want to hear Steve Jones’s plan for eliminating all the bad people.  I
> bet he has one.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Darin Steffl
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 03, 2023 10:49 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Yealink "Forbidden"
>
>
>
> This is really simple. If they can ping the internet or do anything else
> that requires internet at the same time the phones show offline, it's not
> your problem. They should be contacting their phone provider.
>
>
>
> Their voip provider can provide them host names to ping or trace to in
> order to troubleshoot. If you don't sell the voip, you shouldn't be
> troubleshooting it aside from making sure your network ping, jitter, and
> packetloss are normal.
>
>
>
> On Wed, May 3, 2023, 8:13 AM  wrote:
>
> I’m trying to help a customer with their Yealink phones.  Their provider
> is Zoom.
>
> I’m 99% sure this is not my problem, but I’m chronically too nice to
> people so I’m helping anyway.
>
>
>
> So apparently when they go to dial out they’ll get a message on the screen
> saying “Forbidden”.  I’m not sure if there’s more to the message because I
> only know what they’re telling me.   When this starts happening their IT
> guy says the phones show up as “offline” in whatever management portal
> they’re using.  They factory reset the phone, it reprovisions, shows up as
> “online” in their portal and works again for some period of minutes or
> hours and then does the same thing again.  I asked if a simple reboot
> works, but the IT guy says they factory reset instead of reboot because
> it’s so easy to do 🙄.
>
>
>
> They point at me because the phone is “offline”, and they’re tying it to
> network maintenance that was done on Monday morning, but their story is not
> totally consistent about what day it started.  May have been Monday, may
> have been last week, depends who you ask.  I’ve taken packet captures and I
> can see the supposedly “offline” phone talking on port 443 to an AWS server
> (I assume provisioning server) and talking to Zoom on port 5091.  That’s
> all TLS/SSL so I can’t see the messages, but they’re definitely still
> talking to the mothership when they’re reported as “offline”.  They also do
> other normal stuff like DNS queries, NTP sync, and normal LAN chatter like
> CDP, ARP, etc.  I also checked for packet loss to the phones and there’s
> none/negligible loss.  So I’m telling these guys your phones are 100%
> definitely *not* offline.  I told them they need to check with Zoom to
> see what application layer messages are happening, because due to the
> encryption I don’t have a clue, but I’d wager the carrier is sending back a
> 403 Forbidden for some reason.
>
>
>
> Below is a screenshot of his management tool (customer name blocked out).
> I don’t recognize it, maybe one of you all does.
>
> In the meantime I’m wondering if the collective has seen something like
> this with Yealink and/or Zoom.  Any wild-ass guesses?
>
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Yealink "Forbidden"

[Steve Jones]

Make sure they disable any ALG "helpers" in their firewall.
Make sure, if youre multihomed that in/out arent asymmetric, i dont know
why, but this periodically has caused issues for sip
that interface looks similar to goto
have the it guy give the phone a completely unrestricted policy for testing
he will say "we didnt change anything". fuck him. if theyre defaulting,
theyre probably also pulling current FW down.
We ran into a timebomb issue where broadcom had made some change to their
services and they only applied when a session was terminated and restored,
some PBX, this was months/years later.
They have an IT guy, have him send you the failures that are occuring. not
descriptions, but actual diagnostic data, its his job, theyre literally
paying this mope for it.
Dont spend time helping people with their SIP issues, I do it too often

On Wed, May 3, 2023 at 10:48 AM Darin Steffl 
wrote:

> This is really simple. If they can ping the internet or do anything else
> that requires internet at the same time the phones show offline, it's not
> your problem. They should be contacting their phone provider.
>
> Their voip provider can provide them host names to ping or trace to in
> order to troubleshoot. If you don't sell the voip, you shouldn't be
> troubleshooting it aside from making sure your network ping, jitter, and
> packetloss are normal.
>
> On Wed, May 3, 2023, 8:13 AM  wrote:
>
>> I’m trying to help a customer with their Yealink phones.  Their provider
>> is Zoom.
>>
>> I’m 99% sure this is not my problem, but I’m chronically too nice to
>> people so I’m helping anyway.
>>
>>
>>
>> So apparently when they go to dial out they’ll get a message on the
>> screen saying “Forbidden”.  I’m not sure if there’s more to the message
>> because I only know what they’re telling me.   When this starts happening
>> their IT guy says the phones show up as “offline” in whatever management
>> portal they’re using.  They factory reset the phone, it reprovisions, shows
>> up as “online” in their portal and works again for some period of minutes
>> or hours and then does the same thing again.  I asked if a simple reboot
>> works, but the IT guy says they factory reset instead of reboot because
>> it’s so easy to do 🙄.
>>
>>
>>
>> They point at me because the phone is “offline”, and they’re tying it to
>> network maintenance that was done on Monday morning, but their story is not
>> totally consistent about what day it started.  May have been Monday, may
>> have been last week, depends who you ask.  I’ve taken packet captures and I
>> can see the supposedly “offline” phone talking on port 443 to an AWS server
>> (I assume provisioning server) and talking to Zoom on port 5091.  That’s
>> all TLS/SSL so I can’t see the messages, but they’re definitely still
>> talking to the mothership when they’re reported as “offline”.  They also do
>> other normal stuff like DNS queries, NTP sync, and normal LAN chatter like
>> CDP, ARP, etc.  I also checked for packet loss to the phones and there’s
>> none/negligible loss.  So I’m telling these guys your phones are 100%
>> definitely *not* offline.  I told them they need to check with Zoom to
>> see what application layer messages are happening, because due to the
>> encryption I don’t have a clue, but I’d wager the carrier is sending back a
>> 403 Forbidden for some reason.
>>
>>
>>
>> Below is a screenshot of his management tool (customer name blocked
>> out).  I don’t recognize it, maybe one of you all does.
>>
>> In the meantime I’m wondering if the collective has seen something like
>> this with Yealink and/or Zoom.  Any wild-ass guesses?
>>
>>
>>
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[AFMUG] chuck-where da mtows at

[Steve Jones]

Ar eyou still making these?

the websites nothing but blades now
wbmfg.com isnt working

wheres the 100grands?
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Re: [AFMUG] Cable Spooler

[Steve Jones]

I have a cordless dewalt I wrapped rubber splice tape around the chuck just
for this works perfect. works great for respooling mule tape also. just
hold the chuck up against the spool edge and letter rip. a fancy pants city
slicker might make a bracket to hold it too

On Tue, Apr 25, 2023 at 9:54 AM Nate Burke  wrote:

> I'm sure something exists, but I can't find the right term.  Is there a
> cheap/easy way of spooling up small cable spools.  12"-18" diameter
> wooden spools.  I was thinking like a small tire or something in a drill
> to hold against the edge of the spool to spin it while another person
> guides the wire on the spool.  Is something like this for sale?  I found
> lots of fishing line spoolers, but they are small.  And a 'Drill wheel'
> Gives me a bunch of sanding tools. I'm guessing I just haven't thought
> of the right term to search for yet.
>
> I've had multiple boxes of Shireen DC-1030 cable that have come with
> Broken cardboard spools in the box, and we have to re-spool the entire
> box onto a new spool by hand.  Spinning the wooden spool by hand for a
> thousand rotations is very tiring.
>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Amish Lands

[Steve Jones]

obviously you dont want your kids playing near the punji traps or
claymores. but digging the holes and sharpening the sticks for the traps is
a good family project. And if you catch one of the petas or neonazis in the
holes, its an excellent opportunity to teach problem solving skills, like
where to separate the joints so that the captures are more easily
transported to the pig pen. Its about working smarter, not harder. Then
there is melting the fillings down into ingots and the grinding of the
teeth to powder for the gardens. So many opportunities on a compound for
family bonding.

On Fri, Apr 21, 2023 at 8:35 AM Adam Moffett  wrote:

> I mean maybe?  I used ludicrous examples because I'm not trying to pick on
> anyone particular.  I don't care which side of the cup you drink the
> kool-aid from, I just don't want a bunch of lunatics hanging around where
> my kids might be playing.
>
> On Fri, Apr 21, 2023 at 9:17 AM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> a proper compound doesnt need to concern itself with the quality of the
>> neighbors. All you need to worry about is proper placement of punji traps
>> and claymores. Its the alphabets you need to worry about, they have
>> helicopters
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Apr 21, 2023 at 5:48 AM Adam Moffett  wrote:
>>
>>> So would you guys actually buy that compound? I'm trying to wrap my head
>>> around who would buy it and what for.
>>>
>>> I was looking at an empty lot to be my little outdoor playground, and it
>>> has one of these Amish places adjacent to it.  In the back of my head I'm
>>> picturing some kind of weirdo cultists moving in.  Like nudist PETA
>>> eco-terrorists or  neo-confederate klansmen.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 20, 2023 at 8:09 PM Adam Moffett 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> The Amish are making a mass exodus from NY.  You can drive through
>>>> Amish communities and see "for sale" signs one after the other.  The Amish
>>>> are generally known for good workmanship, to the point where some people go
>>>> out of their way to get Amish building contractors.  They also have
>>>> multigenerational households, so you get these large properties with huge
>>>> well-built houses, barns, and outbuildings.  The problem is they have no
>>>> utilities at all.  They'll have hand pumped wells and outhouses and wood
>>>> stoves.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/234-Hunts-Corners-Center-Lisle-Rd-Marathon-NY-13803/223346029_zpid/
>>>> ?
>>>>
>>>> I linked the above example because it was easy to find, but that
>>>> particular one has electric out by the road.  I saw a similar one for sale
>>>> where there was no electric service available and it was listed for $140k.
>>>> That's a friggin 'steal except for one thing:  What could you do with a
>>>> huge house with no electricity?  A scout camp?  Start a cult?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Amish Lands

[Steve Jones]

a proper compound doesnt need to concern itself with the quality of the
neighbors. All you need to worry about is proper placement of punji traps
and claymores. Its the alphabets you need to worry about, they have
helicopters


On Fri, Apr 21, 2023 at 5:48 AM Adam Moffett  wrote:

> So would you guys actually buy that compound? I'm trying to wrap my head
> around who would buy it and what for.
>
> I was looking at an empty lot to be my little outdoor playground, and it
> has one of these Amish places adjacent to it.  In the back of my head I'm
> picturing some kind of weirdo cultists moving in.  Like nudist PETA
> eco-terrorists or  neo-confederate klansmen.
>
> On Thu, Apr 20, 2023 at 8:09 PM Adam Moffett  wrote:
>
>> The Amish are making a mass exodus from NY.  You can drive through Amish
>> communities and see "for sale" signs one after the other.  The Amish are
>> generally known for good workmanship, to the point where some people go out
>> of their way to get Amish building contractors.  They also have
>> multigenerational households, so you get these large properties with huge
>> well-built houses, barns, and outbuildings.  The problem is they have no
>> utilities at all.  They'll have hand pumped wells and outhouses and wood
>> stoves.
>>
>>
>> https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/234-Hunts-Corners-Center-Lisle-Rd-Marathon-NY-13803/223346029_zpid/
>> ?
>>
>> I linked the above example because it was easy to find, but that
>> particular one has electric out by the road.  I saw a similar one for sale
>> where there was no electric service available and it was listed for $140k.
>> That's a friggin 'steal except for one thing:  What could you do with a
>> huge house with no electricity?  A scout camp?  Start a cult?
>>
>>
>>
>>
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