Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
That's just stupid, but we already have "food insurance" of a sorts. They're called food stamps for those who can't afford food. Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net Join my Mafia http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 On Sep 6, 2009, at 1:37 PM, mike wrote: Imagine if you had food insurance, you could eat steak every day! On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 1:27 PM, Jeff Miles wrote: I pay less the $200/mo for food. Never really thought about food costs being high. Of course no one is this household is obese. And we eat steak twice a week. Chicken, pork and fish make up the other days. I agree that housing costs are through the roof. No pun intended. But I blame the banks mostly for this. Some have thought it a good idea making the insurance similar to a public utility. The cost of electricity has always been one of my pet peeves, especially living here in Washington STATE. It's all hydro. We should have the cheapest electricity costs in the nation. Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net Join my Mafia http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 On Sep 6, 2009, at 7:17 AM, Jeff Wright wrote: I appreciate your faith. I guess the most distressing part of the whole affair is seeing the wing nuts so ready to sell out their country for a sack of gold. They support the ultra-rich insurance barons, the M$s, the Comcasts, etc. and give the shiv to their fellow citizens. I'm really disappointed in Obama folding so early in the hand. There's so much more he could be doing. No family should ever go broke putting food on their table. No one should have to go into bankruptcy to put a roof over their heads. When is Obama going to force the food barons and the housing dons to provide cheap and affordable food and shelter? I pay more for these every year than I do health care! Single payer groceries and 3BR/2BA now! * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I think I heard somewhere that Insurance companies profits are up 1000% the past 7-10 years while rates have gone up 300% in the same time frame. Someone is making money. Our rates went up less than 5% this year, but they are very high to begin with. Stewart At 04:59 PM 9/6/2009, you wrote: This once again goes with the assumption that a government health care option would destroy all private insurance companies. While I'd love to see this happen I doubt it would. Insurance companies are the largest business in the world. I think it would take a whole lot more then a government health insurance option to bring them down. Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Yes, people without insurance, if they can afford the care, they are called "private patients" and pay much more than the ones who are insured. The docs, my colleagues, love them... In psychiatry, since the insurance coverage is so minimal even people who can barelly afford go the "private way"... psychiatrists love it. The other day I saw the paper work required from someone trying to have insurance. Unbelievable how much information the industry wants... if there is anything, I mean a mild depression when you lost your mother twenty years ago , you are denied. And the people who want to change insurances and in the mean time have gotten a cronic disease? They can´t even change jobs... What a mess! I will sound radical but medicine is not an activity that can be for profit. If you want to be a doctor this should not be your main motivation. Of course you like to earn a living with some confort... But money should not be your main motivation. If this is the case, get an MBA and become a banker... The same with hospitals and insurances... they can not be for profit. As simple as this Marcio MD -Original Message- >From: "Rev. Stewart Marshall" >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 6:26 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >No I get your point. > >I have lived under both systems (Canada's and Ours) > >I have a very compelling interest in this. > >I think the right to purchase and get Insurance is a right! > >The problem is that we have made insurance only something for someone >who can afford it and be eligible. > >My daughter tried to get insurance a few years ago on her own. Could >not get coverage she was denied by one of the biggest carriers in our >state. Why? She had asthma when she was younger. (Has not had it >in over a decade.) Son works full time is not offered insurance and >as I wrote earlier is gay (which is a reason for denial used by >insurance companies) > >Insurance companies have written the rules to guarantee them profits >and deny coverage whenever they so determine. > >Unless you have a full time job and make a decent wage you are not >offered insurance or cannot afford it. > >I advocate all people being able to get insurance but make it >affordable and easily gettable. (which it is not at this point) > >Is health care a right? Maybe maybe not, but the ability to afford >it and get it should be. (By the way dirty little secret, people >without insurance are charged much higher rates than people who do!!!) > >Stewart > > >At 02:22 PM 9/6/2009, you wrote: >>You miss my point, Rev. I expect that of Tom, but you? >> >>We are being told that health care is a "right." I disagree. Health care >>is paramount, no doubt, but it is no more a right than food or a place to >>live. >> >>I have a right to life, if nothing else, but I don't have a right to demand >>that someone provide me with food to eat. I have a right to be sheltered >>from the elements, but I don't have the right to demand that I be provided a >>home. If I want these thing, I must provide them for myself or enter into a >>charitable arrangement. Call me old fashioned for still believing in the >>work ethic. >> >>If someone must provide you with something of value in order to enjoy a >>"right," then it is not a right, but instead a privilege. For me to enjoy >>my right to free speech, no one needs to build me soap box nor provide me >>with a megaphone. I can't even force you to listen. *That* is a right. >> >> > Health care is not so easy. Very often people are frozen out of >> > health care because they either cannot afford it. (most of the folks >> > who sell cheap insurance are rip off artists) or they cannot get >>insurance. >> >>Then we should get the state out of the health care business and allow real >>competition to work, so that it can be affordable for everyone, just as it >>is for food and shelter. Guvmint interference has done far more harm than >>good in that regard. >> >>We already have examples of what to expect from guvmint run health care. >>Why hasn't anyone talked about reforming Medicare first? Shouldn't we see >>if that much more modest plan, already in existence, can be made sustainable >>and workable, before we talk about adding trillions more in spending that we >>don't have to begin with? Medicare is already going to be underwater in the >>next few years. How will O-Care be any different? >> >>I'm sure you've read it by now, but
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Really? Where's your proof of that? Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net Join my Mafia http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 On Sep 6, 2009, at 1:34 PM, mike wrote: The UK and Canada are moving away from socialized medicine, not towards it. On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 1:28 PM, Marcio wrote: I see no conflicts having socialized programs in a capitalist country. As a matter of fact I believe the world is moving in the direction. Marcio -Original Message- From: "Rev. Stewart Marshall" Sent: Sep 6, 2009 3:52 PM To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... Everyone shots themselves in the foot sometimes. Sometimes better than others. The government is not perfect but neither are we. Capitalism is not perfect either. There are some things better handle under the capitalist strategy and other things not. Stewart At 10:15 AM 9/6/2009, you wrote: This is standard wing-nut strategy to make government look bad. Of course. The guvmint never does anything to look bad. It's all a vast, right-wing conspiracy to undermine their natural efficiency. Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Why do so many believe this health OPTION would be forced on them? What part of the word OPTION do these people not understand? Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net Join my Mafia http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 On Sep 6, 2009, at 1:26 PM, Jeff Wright wrote: The beauty of the Single Payer is that we all will share the risks. Isn´t this one of the reasons that we live in society? That's what insurance is: risk pooling. It's also something I engage by choice, not coercion. I don't choose to be live in a society to be compelled, by the threat of force, to accept a system that offers no choice. That's not society, but a similar word that also begins with 's'. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Who would have thought the unions and government would own a car company 15 years ago? Sent from my iPod On Sep 6, 2009, at 2:59 PM, Jeff Miles wrote: This once again goes with the assumption that a government health care option would destroy all private insurance companies. While I'd love to see this happen I doubt it would. Insurance companies are the largest business in the world. I think it would take a whole lot more then a government health insurance option to bring them down. Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net Join my Mafia http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 On Sep 6, 2009, at 12:21 PM, Jeff Wright wrote: Everyone shots themselves in the foot sometimes. Sometimes better than others. The government is not perfect but neither are we. Capitalism is not perfect either. There are some things better handle under the capitalist strategy and other things not. I find it odd that people look to a system that has only made things much less affordable over the years, not the system that has made most things much more affordable, as the preferred solution to accessible health care. Under a free market (not capitalist) option you have choices. Under the guvmint option, you have none. That is the critical difference. I never claimed it to be perfect. Just much, much better. *** *** *** ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** *** *** *** *** ** ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** *** ** * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
This once again goes with the assumption that a government health care option would destroy all private insurance companies. While I'd love to see this happen I doubt it would. Insurance companies are the largest business in the world. I think it would take a whole lot more then a government health insurance option to bring them down. Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net Join my Mafia http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 On Sep 6, 2009, at 12:21 PM, Jeff Wright wrote: Everyone shots themselves in the foot sometimes. Sometimes better than others. The government is not perfect but neither are we. Capitalism is not perfect either. There are some things better handle under the capitalist strategy and other things not. I find it odd that people look to a system that has only made things much less affordable over the years, not the system that has made most things much more affordable, as the preferred solution to accessible health care. Under a free market (not capitalist) option you have choices. Under the guvmint option, you have none. That is the critical difference. I never claimed it to be perfect. Just much, much better. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
But you pay for us (USA) to have a military, public security, wars... roads and much more. Are you being coerced?...Or...you are sharing?... Marcio -Original Message- >From: Jeff Wright >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 5:26 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@listserv.aol.com >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >> The beauty of the Single Payer is that we all will >> share the risks. Isn´t this one of the reasons that we live in society? > >That's what insurance is: risk pooling. It's also something I engage by >choice, not coercion. > >I don't choose to be live in a society to be compelled, by the threat of >force, to accept a system that offers no choice. That's not society, but a >similar word that also begins with 's'. > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
No I get your point. I have lived under both systems (Canada's and Ours) I have a very compelling interest in this. I think the right to purchase and get Insurance is a right! The problem is that we have made insurance only something for someone who can afford it and be eligible. My daughter tried to get insurance a few years ago on her own. Could not get coverage she was denied by one of the biggest carriers in our state. Why? She had asthma when she was younger. (Has not had it in over a decade.) Son works full time is not offered insurance and as I wrote earlier is gay (which is a reason for denial used by insurance companies) Insurance companies have written the rules to guarantee them profits and deny coverage whenever they so determine. Unless you have a full time job and make a decent wage you are not offered insurance or cannot afford it. I advocate all people being able to get insurance but make it affordable and easily gettable. (which it is not at this point) Is health care a right? Maybe maybe not, but the ability to afford it and get it should be. (By the way dirty little secret, people without insurance are charged much higher rates than people who do!!!) Stewart At 02:22 PM 9/6/2009, you wrote: You miss my point, Rev. I expect that of Tom, but you? We are being told that health care is a "right." I disagree. Health care is paramount, no doubt, but it is no more a right than food or a place to live. I have a right to life, if nothing else, but I don't have a right to demand that someone provide me with food to eat. I have a right to be sheltered from the elements, but I don't have the right to demand that I be provided a home. If I want these thing, I must provide them for myself or enter into a charitable arrangement. Call me old fashioned for still believing in the work ethic. If someone must provide you with something of value in order to enjoy a "right," then it is not a right, but instead a privilege. For me to enjoy my right to free speech, no one needs to build me soap box nor provide me with a megaphone. I can't even force you to listen. *That* is a right. > Health care is not so easy. Very often people are frozen out of > health care because they either cannot afford it. (most of the folks > who sell cheap insurance are rip off artists) or they cannot get insurance. Then we should get the state out of the health care business and allow real competition to work, so that it can be affordable for everyone, just as it is for food and shelter. Guvmint interference has done far more harm than good in that regard. We already have examples of what to expect from guvmint run health care. Why hasn't anyone talked about reforming Medicare first? Shouldn't we see if that much more modest plan, already in existence, can be made sustainable and workable, before we talk about adding trillions more in spending that we don't have to begin with? Medicare is already going to be underwater in the next few years. How will O-Care be any different? I'm sure you've read it by now, but if not, read Whole Foods CEO John Mackey's op-ed on real reform in health care. Very good ideas in it and one of the few honest propositions in this debate. http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204251404574342170072865070.ht ml And I will reiterate for clarity: I already spend much more on food and shelter than I do on health care, at any point in time. I don't consider myself lacking in any of the three. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
You did not understand me. I am not going to insist. With all respect... Marcio -Original Message- >From: mike >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 5:33 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >You don't seem to have a full grasp on capitalism. If your letters didn't >arrive you'd switch carriers and get them to arrive. It's called Fedex and >UPS and DHL etc. Would one pizza shop across the nation be good? Only one >choice? Somehow I think not, why make good pizza if you know your >customers only choice is to not eat it? And now imagine if the govt forced >everyone to buy one pizza a week to support their govt pizza shops..now how >good would the pizza be? I'll stick with being able to pick from 20 >different shops around me...different tastes, different prices. > Competition. > >On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 1:16 PM, Marcio wrote: > >> If the USPS was privatized no letters would arrive in non-profit routes... >> as a matter of fact they would be closed. Like happens to patients under >> private health insurance... >> >> Marcio >> >> -Original Message----- >> >From: Jeff Miles >> >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 4:04 AM >> >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >> >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... >> > >> > True, the post office certainly has on many occasions. >> > Does anyone really stop and think what the post office does on a >> >daily basis? I have yet to find a privet company that has worked as >> >efficiently and consistently. And, being governmentally run, the post >> >office's goal isn't to make a profit. No government program is run to >> >make a profit. People bitch when the programs loose money, and they'd >> >bitch about prices and taxes if the programs were making money. It's a >> >no win situation. >> > I have yet, in my 47 years, realized something getting lossed by >> the >> >USPS. On occasion it's taken a day or more to get here or there. But >> >at the cost, I really can't complain. And with the millions of letters >> >and packages they deal with each day, Fed-Ex and UPS seem to be doing >> >just fine. In fact new people are coming on board. What's the new one? >> >Some Yellow truck, 3 letters, can't remember the name. >> > Socialized mail can't be that bad for business. >> > Maybe that was President Obama's hidden agenda in asking kids to >> >write a letter. It was to themselves, but maybe he'd had hopes they'd >> >actually mail them and boost the profits of the USPS? Or maybe he'd >> >had the market flooded and hoped they'd all lick some tainted stamps? >> >The conspiracy theories flourish. >> > >> >> >> * >> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >> * >> > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
You are dreaming... try to take away from the British and the Canadians what they have! Even Tatcher who privatized everything could not do it. You are misinformed... Now don´t now come with "reports" from the right extremists sites... Marcio -Original Message- >From: mike >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 5:34 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >The UK and Canada are moving away from socialized medicine, not towards it. > >On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 1:28 PM, Marcio wrote: > >> I see no conflicts having socialized programs in a capitalist country. As a >> matter of fact I believe the world is moving in the direction. >> >> Marcio >> >> -Original Message- >> >From: "Rev. Stewart Marshall" >> >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 3:52 PM >> >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >> >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... >> > >> >Everyone shots themselves in the foot sometimes. >> > >> >Sometimes better than others. >> > >> >The government is not perfect but neither are we. >> > >> >Capitalism is not perfect either. >> > >> >There are some things better handle under the capitalist strategy and >> >other things not. >> > >> >Stewart >> > >> > >> >At 10:15 AM 9/6/2009, you wrote: >> >> > This is standard wing-nut strategy to make government look bad. >> >> >> >>Of course. The guvmint never does anything to look bad. It's all a >> vast, >> >>right-wing conspiracy to undermine their natural efficiency. >> > >> >Rev. Stewart A. Marshall >> >mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net >> >Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org >> >Ozark, AL SL 82 >> > >> > >> >* >> >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >> >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >> >* >> >> >> * >> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >> * >> > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I believe those at the town hall meetings could do a lot to quiet these agitators. If everyone there were to simply turn and stare at the person shouting I'd bet they'd quit rather quickly. Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net Join my Mafia http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 On Sep 6, 2009, at 11:03 AM, Chris Dunford wrote: Very true. Both sides have their agitators. I do think it's insane that some representatives have refused to give any time to their constituents when that is the very reason they have a month off. There is some merit to that point of view, but, at the same time, it seems like a town hall "meeting" at which the shouters won't let the representatives respond is pretty much a waste of everyone's time. Again, the shouters must share some of the blame if Congressmen are hiding in their offices. None of them would be doing so if the attendees would state their questions/concerns coherently and listen to the responses. The representatives shouldn't be hiding, and the shouters shouldn't be shouting. Nothing is accomplished. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
This is such a stupid comment I've heard far to often. Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net Join my Mafia http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 On Sep 6, 2009, at 11:04 AM, mike wrote: Brilliant! Socialism is great till you run out of everyone elses money. On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 10:41 AM, TPiwowar wrote: On Sep 6, 2009, at 11:45 AM Sep 6, mike wrote: If gov't programs aren't supposed to make money, can we at least ask they don't LOSE so much? Simple. Just raise taxes. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> I pay less the $200/mo for food. Never really thought about food > costs being high. Of course no one is this household is obese. And we > eat steak twice a week. Chicken, pork and fish make up the other days. I didn't say that food was expensive. I said I pay more on the 2 items that we consider to be essential to living, food and shelter, than to what we consider the very expensive 3rd leg, medicine. I do this fairly easily in a relatively expensive city to live in. That food, which uses a mixed but largely free market system, is so cheap and plentiful that even the poor can easily afford it, is lost on the socialized medicine proponents. > I agree that housing costs are through the roof. No pun intended. But > I blame the banks mostly for this. I too blame the banks, the central banks that is. Funny how political interference in the housing market to create "affordable housing" ended up creating a pig-sty free for all that only caused housing prices to rise out of reach for all but the wealthiest. To add insult to injury, we now have a political class that considers these inflated housing prices to be so sacrosanct that they must be propped up at all costs. Again, the irony will be lost as to why things cost so damned much. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I was born and lived in Idaho for many years. I'm a strong supporter of gun rights. But these idiots bring guns to a presidential speeches need to be locked up just for being stupid. And to protect the rest of us from their stupidity. I wonder if these people believe their gun rights apply when they walk into their local schools? Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net Join my Mafia http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 On Sep 6, 2009, at 8:58 AM, mike wrote: Yeah we got SEIU members shouting down and pushing people around so they can't practice their constitutional free speech, so why should they be aloud to carry any guns and practice that right either? Go Go Government! On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 5:50 AM, phartz...@gmail.com >wrote: On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 2:30 AM, mike wrote: The finger biter should be thankful that Mr. Rice was not one of the numerous anti-reform types who carry firearms to these events. Steve * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
The UK and Canada are moving away from socialized medicine, not towards it. On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 1:28 PM, Marcio wrote: > I see no conflicts having socialized programs in a capitalist country. As a > matter of fact I believe the world is moving in the direction. > > Marcio > > -Original Message- > >From: "Rev. Stewart Marshall" > >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 3:52 PM > >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM > >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > > > >Everyone shots themselves in the foot sometimes. > > > >Sometimes better than others. > > > >The government is not perfect but neither are we. > > > >Capitalism is not perfect either. > > > >There are some things better handle under the capitalist strategy and > >other things not. > > > >Stewart > > > > > >At 10:15 AM 9/6/2009, you wrote: > >> > This is standard wing-nut strategy to make government look bad. > >> > >>Of course. The guvmint never does anything to look bad. It's all a > vast, > >>right-wing conspiracy to undermine their natural efficiency. > > > >Rev. Stewart A. Marshall > >mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net > >Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org > >Ozark, AL SL 82 > > > > > >* > >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > >* > > > * > ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > * > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
-Original Message- >From: Jeff Wright >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 4:21 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >> Everyone shots themselves in the foot sometimes. >> >> Sometimes better than others. >> >> The government is not perfect but neither are we. >> >> Capitalism is not perfect either. >> >> There are some things better handle under the capitalist strategy and >> other things not. > >I find it odd that people look to a system that has only made things much >less affordable over the years, not the system that has made most things >much more affordable, as the preferred solution to accessible health care. > >Under a free market (not capitalist) option you have choices. > >Under the guvmint option, you have none. > >That is the critical difference. > >I never claimed it to be perfect. Just much, much better. > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* Here you go into government x free market. This is not the way I see the world. They need each other. Free market? Yes for somethings... socialized programs... for others. They can function harmonically. Don´t beliebe that the Free Market is going to solve health care for all... Marcio * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
You don't seem to have a full grasp on capitalism. If your letters didn't arrive you'd switch carriers and get them to arrive. It's called Fedex and UPS and DHL etc. Would one pizza shop across the nation be good? Only one choice? Somehow I think not, why make good pizza if you know your customers only choice is to not eat it? And now imagine if the govt forced everyone to buy one pizza a week to support their govt pizza shops..now how good would the pizza be? I'll stick with being able to pick from 20 different shops around me...different tastes, different prices. Competition. On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 1:16 PM, Marcio wrote: > If the USPS was privatized no letters would arrive in non-profit routes... > as a matter of fact they would be closed. Like happens to patients under > private health insurance... > > Marcio > > -Original Message- > >From: Jeff Miles > >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 4:04 AM > >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM > >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > > > > True, the post office certainly has on many occasions. > > Does anyone really stop and think what the post office does on a > >daily basis? I have yet to find a privet company that has worked as > >efficiently and consistently. And, being governmentally run, the post > >office's goal isn't to make a profit. No government program is run to > >make a profit. People bitch when the programs loose money, and they'd > >bitch about prices and taxes if the programs were making money. It's a > >no win situation. > > I have yet, in my 47 years, realized something getting lossed by > the > >USPS. On occasion it's taken a day or more to get here or there. But > >at the cost, I really can't complain. And with the millions of letters > >and packages they deal with each day, Fed-Ex and UPS seem to be doing > >just fine. In fact new people are coming on board. What's the new one? > >Some Yellow truck, 3 letters, can't remember the name. > > Socialized mail can't be that bad for business. > > Maybe that was President Obama's hidden agenda in asking kids to > >write a letter. It was to themselves, but maybe he'd had hopes they'd > >actually mail them and boost the profits of the USPS? Or maybe he'd > >had the market flooded and hoped they'd all lick some tainted stamps? > >The conspiracy theories flourish. > > > > > * > ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > * > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Imagine if you had food insurance, you could eat steak every day! On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 1:27 PM, Jeff Miles wrote: >I pay less the $200/mo for food. Never really thought about food > costs being high. Of course no one is this household is obese. And we eat > steak twice a week. Chicken, pork and fish make up the other days. >I agree that housing costs are through the roof. No pun intended. > But I blame the banks mostly for this. >Some have thought it a good idea making the insurance similar to a > public utility. The cost of electricity has always been one of my pet > peeves, especially living here in Washington STATE. It's all hydro. We > should have the cheapest electricity costs in the nation. > > > Jeff Miles > jmile...@charter.net > > Join my Mafia > http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 > > On Sep 6, 2009, at 7:17 AM, Jeff Wright wrote: > > I appreciate your faith. I guess the most distressing part of the >>> whole affair is seeing the wing nuts so ready to sell out their >>> country for a sack of gold. They support the ultra-rich insurance >>> barons, the M$s, the Comcasts, etc. and give the shiv to their fellow >>> citizens. >>> >> >> I'm really disappointed in Obama folding so early in the hand. There's so >> much more he could be doing. >> >> No family should ever go broke putting food on their table. No one should >> have to go into bankruptcy to put a roof over their heads. When is Obama >> going to force the food barons and the housing dons to provide cheap and >> affordable food and shelter? I pay more for these every year than I do >> health care! >> >> Single payer groceries and 3BR/2BA now! >> >> >> * >> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >> * >> > > > > * > ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > * > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I see no conflicts having socialized programs in a capitalist country. As a matter of fact I believe the world is moving in the direction. Marcio -Original Message- >From: "Rev. Stewart Marshall" >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 3:52 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >Everyone shots themselves in the foot sometimes. > >Sometimes better than others. > >The government is not perfect but neither are we. > >Capitalism is not perfect either. > >There are some things better handle under the capitalist strategy and >other things not. > >Stewart > > >At 10:15 AM 9/6/2009, you wrote: >> > This is standard wing-nut strategy to make government look bad. >> >>Of course. The guvmint never does anything to look bad. It's all a vast, >>right-wing conspiracy to undermine their natural efficiency. > >Rev. Stewart A. Marshall >mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net >Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org >Ozark, AL SL 82 > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> The beauty of the Single Payer is that we all will > share the risks. Isn´t this one of the reasons that we live in society? That's what insurance is: risk pooling. It's also something I engage by choice, not coercion. I don't choose to be live in a society to be compelled, by the threat of force, to accept a system that offers no choice. That's not society, but a similar word that also begins with 's'. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I pay less the $200/mo for food. Never really thought about food costs being high. Of course no one is this household is obese. And we eat steak twice a week. Chicken, pork and fish make up the other days. I agree that housing costs are through the roof. No pun intended. But I blame the banks mostly for this. Some have thought it a good idea making the insurance similar to a public utility. The cost of electricity has always been one of my pet peeves, especially living here in Washington STATE. It's all hydro. We should have the cheapest electricity costs in the nation. Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net Join my Mafia http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 On Sep 6, 2009, at 7:17 AM, Jeff Wright wrote: I appreciate your faith. I guess the most distressing part of the whole affair is seeing the wing nuts so ready to sell out their country for a sack of gold. They support the ultra-rich insurance barons, the M$s, the Comcasts, etc. and give the shiv to their fellow citizens. I'm really disappointed in Obama folding so early in the hand. There's so much more he could be doing. No family should ever go broke putting food on their table. No one should have to go into bankruptcy to put a roof over their heads. When is Obama going to force the food barons and the housing dons to provide cheap and affordable food and shelter? I pay more for these every year than I do health care! Single payer groceries and 3BR/2BA now! * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I am also losing faith in Obama... he is not standing up for what he believes. He is afraid of big business. I understand, he is not independently wealthy like JFK. Marcio -Original Message- >From: Jeff Wright >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 11:17 AM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >> I appreciate your faith. I guess the most distressing part of the >> whole affair is seeing the wing nuts so ready to sell out their >> country for a sack of gold. They support the ultra-rich insurance >> barons, the M$s, the Comcasts, etc. and give the shiv to their fellow >> citizens. > >I'm really disappointed in Obama folding so early in the hand. There's so >much more he could be doing. > >No family should ever go broke putting food on their table. No one should >have to go into bankruptcy to put a roof over their heads. When is Obama >going to force the food barons and the housing dons to provide cheap and >affordable food and shelter? I pay more for these every year than I do >health care! > >Single payer groceries and 3BR/2BA now! > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
If the USPS was privatized no letters would arrive in non-profit routes... as a matter of fact they would be closed. Like happens to patients under private health insurance... Marcio -Original Message- >From: Jeff Miles >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 4:04 AM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > > True, the post office certainly has on many occasions. > Does anyone really stop and think what the post office does on a >daily basis? I have yet to find a privet company that has worked as >efficiently and consistently. And, being governmentally run, the post >office's goal isn't to make a profit. No government program is run to >make a profit. People bitch when the programs loose money, and they'd >bitch about prices and taxes if the programs were making money. It's a >no win situation. > I have yet, in my 47 years, realized something getting lossed by the >USPS. On occasion it's taken a day or more to get here or there. But >at the cost, I really can't complain. And with the millions of letters >and packages they deal with each day, Fed-Ex and UPS seem to be doing >just fine. In fact new people are coming on board. What's the new one? >Some Yellow truck, 3 letters, can't remember the name. > Socialized mail can't be that bad for business. > Maybe that was President Obama's hidden agenda in asking kids to >write a letter. It was to themselves, but maybe he'd had hopes they'd >actually mail them and boost the profits of the USPS? Or maybe he'd >had the market flooded and hoped they'd all lick some tainted stamps? >The conspiracy theories flourish. > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Poeple are brainwashed in America, by big money. They are raised to believe thar "private is always better"... Sad... Marcio -Original Message- >From: Jeff Miles >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 4:11 AM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > > I forgot to add, hopefully you can depend on the USPS or some other >carrier to mail that deceased relative home who didn't get medical >care due to being non insured, under insured, or cut off by the insurer. > Why do people insist on defending these mafioso type companies that >do nothing but steal from them and then turn and complain about the >government wasting money? This kind of thought just baffles the shit >out of me. > > >Jeff Miles >jmile...@charter.net > >Join my Mafia >http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 > >On Sep 5, 2009, at 11:29 PM, mike wrote: > >> Obama says his single payer will run like the post office...God help >> us >> all.. >> >> On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 8:18 PM, Marcio wrote: >> >>> Ihave always been interested in health care as an MD and of course >>> as a >>> patient. I am very surprised that this great Country will not adopt >>> a Single >>> Payer, Medicare for all. But Americans will alwways do the right >>> thing, >>> after trying everything else. We will get there. >>> >>> Marcio >>> >>> -Original Message- >>>> From: Jeff Wright >>>> Sent: Sep 5, 2009 8:43 PM >>>> To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >>>> Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... >>>> >>>>>> Don't bother arguing with this bunch. What they have inflicted >>>>>> on this >>>>>> List in recent months is much like what the USA has had >>>>>> inflicted on >>> it >>>>>> in recent weeks of wild attacks against rational health care. I >>>>>> don't >>>>>> know if you have been following any of this from afar, doctor, >>>>>> but it >>>>>> has been crazy. No rationality, just insults. Very sad. >>>> >>>> I agree. I know that expect much better from our elected >>>> representatives >>>> and their lapdogs in the press. >>>> >>>> It's sad that a country that once prided itself on free expression >>>> has >>>> rulers and elites who can only look down their noses and spew >>>> slurs those >>>> that choose to speak their minds. Dissent is now treated as >>>> treason. >>>> >>>> >>>> * >>>> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, >>>> privacy ** >>>> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ >>>> ** >>>> * >>> >>> >>> * >>> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, >>> privacy ** >>> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// >>> www.cguys.org/ ** >>> * >>> >> >> >> * >> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, >> privacy ** >> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// >> www.cguys.org/ ** >> * > > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
You should come to Brazil and see how the US helped torture thousands of people in Brazil at the time it supported our military dictatorship... A bite is nothing when compared with it... Marcio -Original Message- >From: mike >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 3:30 AM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >That was one of your fellow left wing nuts that did the biting off Tom. I'm >sure you will now justify it somehow. > >On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 8:59 PM, t.piwowar wrote: > >> On Sep 5, 2009, at 11:18 PM, Marcio wrote: >> >>> Ihave always been interested in health care as an MD and of course as a >>> patient. I am very surprised that this great Country will not adopt a Single >>> Payer, Medicare for all. But Americans will alwways do the right thing, >>> after trying everything else. We will get there. >>> >> >> I appreciate your faith. I guess the most distressing part of the whole >> affair is seeing the wing nuts so ready to sell out their country for a sack >> of gold. They support the ultra-rich insurance barons, the M$s, the >> Comcasts, etc. and give the shiv to their fellow citizens. Did you catch the >> news report about one of them biting off the finger of someone who disagreed >> with them? Makes me glad that there is a computer separating us. >> >> >> >> * >> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >> * >> > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Funny, I lived in the USA for 30 years. You will not believe, I love the Post Office. I never had ONE problem with them. I think it is funny how conservative americans make the Post Office scapegoats... why don´t you mention the Armed Forces, National Security, and so many government agencies that we would survive without them. Also, do private health insurance does such a good job: I have tried them both as a patient and as a doctor. I am glad I have Medicare now... Marcio -Original Message- >From: mike >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 3:29 AM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >Obama says his single payer will run like the post office...God help us >all.. > >On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 8:18 PM, Marcio wrote: > >> Ihave always been interested in health care as an MD and of course as a >> patient. I am very surprised that this great Country will not adopt a Single >> Payer, Medicare for all. But Americans will alwways do the right thing, >> after trying everything else. We will get there. >> >> Marcio >> >> -Original Message- >> >From: Jeff Wright >> >Sent: Sep 5, 2009 8:43 PM >> >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >> >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... >> > >> >> > Don't bother arguing with this bunch. What they have inflicted on this >> >> > List in recent months is much like what the USA has had inflicted on >> it >> >> > in recent weeks of wild attacks against rational health care. I don't >> >> > know if you have been following any of this from afar, doctor, but it >> >> > has been crazy. No rationality, just insults. Very sad. >> > >> >I agree. I know that expect much better from our elected representatives >> >and their lapdogs in the press. >> > >> >It's sad that a country that once prided itself on free expression has >> >rulers and elites who can only look down their noses and spew slurs those >> >that choose to speak their minds. Dissent is now treated as treason. >> > >> > >> >* >> >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >> >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >> >* >> >> >> * >> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >> * >> > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I lived and worked in the USA for 30 years. Can´t complain. Became a citizen. Love this Country. But in terms of health care I am perplexed how millionaire adds have brainwashed a lot of good Americans to believe that what they have now is good. And of course not to bother with the ones who don´t have insurance... They sound that they will be healthy and wealthy forever... so, why bother? But ibe if these days they will find themselves in their place...and then what? The beauty of the Single Payer is that we all will share the risks. Isn´t this one of the reasons that we live in society? Marcio -Original Message- >From: "t.piwowar" >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 12:59 AM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@listserv.aol.com >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >On Sep 5, 2009, at 11:18 PM, Marcio wrote: >> Ihave always been interested in health care as an MD and of course >> as a patient. I am very surprised that this great Country will not >> adopt a Single Payer, Medicare for all. But Americans will alwways >> do the right thing, after trying everything else. We will get there. > >I appreciate your faith. I guess the most distressing part of the >whole affair is seeing the wing nuts so ready to sell out their >country for a sack of gold. They support the ultra-rich insurance >barons, the M$s, the Comcasts, etc. and give the shiv to their fellow >citizens. Did you catch the news report about one of them biting off >the finger of someone who disagreed with them? Makes me glad that >there is a computer separating us. > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
They will by popular pressure, as it happened in Canada. Read the history of the Medicare in Canada. Marcio -Original Message- >From: "Eric S. Sande" >Sent: Sep 6, 2009 1:35 AM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >>But Americans will alwways do the right thing, after trying everything >> >else. > >Yes, the system is supposed to be self-correcting. > >But it is naiive to suppose that institutions that have stakes in the >game will leave the table. > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> Everyone shots themselves in the foot sometimes. > > Sometimes better than others. > > The government is not perfect but neither are we. > > Capitalism is not perfect either. > > There are some things better handle under the capitalist strategy and > other things not. I find it odd that people look to a system that has only made things much less affordable over the years, not the system that has made most things much more affordable, as the preferred solution to accessible health care. Under a free market (not capitalist) option you have choices. Under the guvmint option, you have none. That is the critical difference. I never claimed it to be perfect. Just much, much better. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> Again very disingenuous. > > You can make a choice in housing very simply. You either find a > house within your income bracket or you move. > > Cant afford Steak, buy chicken and ground beef. > > Been there done that. You miss my point, Rev. I expect that of Tom, but you? We are being told that health care is a "right." I disagree. Health care is paramount, no doubt, but it is no more a right than food or a place to live. I have a right to life, if nothing else, but I don't have a right to demand that someone provide me with food to eat. I have a right to be sheltered from the elements, but I don't have the right to demand that I be provided a home. If I want these thing, I must provide them for myself or enter into a charitable arrangement. Call me old fashioned for still believing in the work ethic. If someone must provide you with something of value in order to enjoy a "right," then it is not a right, but instead a privilege. For me to enjoy my right to free speech, no one needs to build me soap box nor provide me with a megaphone. I can't even force you to listen. *That* is a right. > Health care is not so easy. Very often people are frozen out of > health care because they either cannot afford it. (most of the folks > who sell cheap insurance are rip off artists) or they cannot get insurance. Then we should get the state out of the health care business and allow real competition to work, so that it can be affordable for everyone, just as it is for food and shelter. Guvmint interference has done far more harm than good in that regard. We already have examples of what to expect from guvmint run health care. Why hasn't anyone talked about reforming Medicare first? Shouldn't we see if that much more modest plan, already in existence, can be made sustainable and workable, before we talk about adding trillions more in spending that we don't have to begin with? Medicare is already going to be underwater in the next few years. How will O-Care be any different? I'm sure you've read it by now, but if not, read Whole Foods CEO John Mackey's op-ed on real reform in health care. Very good ideas in it and one of the few honest propositions in this debate. http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204251404574342170072865070.ht ml And I will reiterate for clarity: I already spend much more on food and shelter than I do on health care, at any point in time. I don't consider myself lacking in any of the three. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Sure are you ready to pay .80 a letter? $20 package and give up Saturday delivery? You cannot tell the Post office what they are allowed to charge and then bitch about them losing money. The USPS must go before Congress for every rate hike and then they are limited on how much they can raise rates on first class stamps. Not a real efficient way to run a business. Stewart At 10:45 AM 9/6/2009, you wrote: If gov't programs aren't supposed to make money, can we at least ask they don't LOSE so much? Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Everyone shots themselves in the foot sometimes. Sometimes better than others. The government is not perfect but neither are we. Capitalism is not perfect either. There are some things better handle under the capitalist strategy and other things not. Stewart At 10:15 AM 9/6/2009, you wrote: > This is standard wing-nut strategy to make government look bad. Of course. The guvmint never does anything to look bad. It's all a vast, right-wing conspiracy to undermine their natural efficiency. Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I believe by law that the USPS is required to deliver mail to any residence or business no matter where they are located within the US and it's territories. I know of no other country where the mail service is run by private contractors? (By the way in Canada they do contract out the delivery of parcels on a local basis. He also delivers all the mail for carriers to drop boxes around the city.) Stewart At 09:45 AM 9/6/2009, you wrote: Alas, the wing nuts forced the Post Office to be spun off to operate as a non-governmental quasi-business. That is when a lot of the problems at the Post Office started. Their mission was unchanged, but revenue sources were cut and strict limits were imposed on what they could charge. No thought was given to the essential societal function that the Post Office provides. It is a tribute to their managers that the Post Office continues to do a fairly good job. Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Again very disingenuous. You can make a choice in housing very simply. You either find a house within your income bracket or you move. Cant afford Steak, buy chicken and ground beef. Been there done that. Health care is not so easy. Very often people are frozen out of health care because they either cannot afford it. (most of the folks who sell cheap insurance are rip off artists) or they cannot get insurance. My middle son is gay he is almost uninsurable and where he works does not offer insurance to him as an asst. manager. (gets paid 9$ an hour.) Health Insurance in this day and age is awful. Stewart At 09:17 AM 9/6/2009, you wrote: I'm really disappointed in Obama folding so early in the hand. There's so much more he could be doing. No family should ever go broke putting food on their table. No one should have to go into bankruptcy to put a roof over their heads. When is Obama going to force the food barons and the housing dons to provide cheap and affordable food and shelter? I pay more for these every year than I do health care! Single payer groceries and 3BR/2BA now! * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Not just the anti's. I saw a report some time ago how much had been contributed to the pro's in this whole debate. Money is flowing all over the place. Stewart At 09:57 AM 9/6/2009, you wrote: Because they own stock in these companies? I would wager that an awful lot of the anti-reformers own stock in health insurance companies. Steve Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Brilliant! Socialism is great till you run out of everyone elses money. On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 10:41 AM, TPiwowar wrote: > On Sep 6, 2009, at 11:45 AM Sep 6, mike wrote: > >> If gov't programs aren't supposed to make money, can we at least ask they >> don't LOSE so much? >> > > Simple. Just raise taxes. > > > > > > * > ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > * > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> Very true. Both sides have their agitators. > > I do think it's insane that some representatives have refused to give any > time to their constituents when that is the very reason they have a month > off. There is some merit to that point of view, but, at the same time, it seems like a town hall "meeting" at which the shouters won't let the representatives respond is pretty much a waste of everyone's time. Again, the shouters must share some of the blame if Congressmen are hiding in their offices. None of them would be doing so if the attendees would state their questions/concerns coherently and listen to the responses. The representatives shouldn't be hiding, and the shouters shouldn't be shouting. Nothing is accomplished. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
On Sep 6, 2009, at 11:45 AM Sep 6, mike wrote: If gov't programs aren't supposed to make money, can we at least ask they don't LOSE so much? Simple. Just raise taxes. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Very true. Both sides have their agitators. I do think it's insane that some representatives have refused to give any time to their constituents when that is the very reason they have a month off. What are we paying them for if they spend this month only with paying business leaders and not the ones who voted them in. Tom posted that link to Frank asking what planet a questioner was from and while I think Frank is a first class boob, I give him credit for having the meeting when many of his colleagues have hidden under their desks. On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 9:35 AM, Chris Dunford wrote: > > Yeah we got SEIU members shouting down and pushing people around so they > > can't practice their constitutional free speech, so why should they be > aloud > > to carry any guns and practice that right either? Go Go Government! > > No comment on the right-wing shouters at the town halls preventing others > from exercising THEIR right to free speech? > > No one is blameless here, and the sooner we all stop pointing out the other > side's bad behavior while ignoring our side's bad behavior, the sooner we > can get to fixing what's wrong. > > > * > ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > * > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> Yeah we got SEIU members shouting down and pushing people around so they > can't practice their constitutional free speech, so why should they be aloud > to carry any guns and practice that right either? Go Go Government! No comment on the right-wing shouters at the town halls preventing others from exercising THEIR right to free speech? No one is blameless here, and the sooner we all stop pointing out the other side's bad behavior while ignoring our side's bad behavior, the sooner we can get to fixing what's wrong. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
You are right, he did not put it as I said it, I was being more tongue in cheek. However I did see the question/answer and he was definitely making a point that the USPS was not run well and got a chuckle from the audience. In Obama's words 'It's the post office that's always having problems' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LS12Z-MJpvw As far as competing, Obama was asked that at a town hall by a college student and at the end of agreeing with the questioner that the government will control from end to end it's health care and therefore the playing field for competition that the public should just 'trust' the government to be fair. On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 4:43 AM, Chris Dunford wrote: > > Obama says his single payer will run like the post office...God help us > > all.. > > That really wasn't what he said, Mike. What he said was that FedEx and UPS > compete successfully with the USPS, proving that the right's claim that "no > private insurer will be able to compete with a > government-subsidized health program" isn't necessarily true. Pretty hard > to argue with that logic. > > And, AFAIK, none of the plans on the table are single-payer. > > > * > ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > * > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Yeah we got SEIU members shouting down and pushing people around so they can't practice their constitutional free speech, so why should they be aloud to carry any guns and practice that right either? Go Go Government! On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 5:50 AM, phartz...@gmail.com wrote: > On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 2:30 AM, mike wrote: > > > > The finger biter should be thankful that Mr. Rice was not one of the > numerous anti-reform types who carry firearms to these events. > > Steve > > > * > ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > * > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
If gov't programs aren't supposed to make money, can we at least ask they don't LOSE so much? On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 12:04 AM, Jeff Miles wrote: >True, the post office certainly has on many occasions. >Does anyone really stop and think what the post office does on a > daily basis? I have yet to find a privet company that has worked as > efficiently and consistently. And, being governmentally run, the post > office's goal isn't to make a profit. No government program is run to make a > profit. People bitch when the programs loose money, and they'd bitch about > prices and taxes if the programs were making money. It's a no win situation. >I have yet, in my 47 years, realized something getting lossed by the > USPS. On occasion it's taken a day or more to get here or there. But at the > cost, I really can't complain. And with the millions of letters and packages > they deal with each day, Fed-Ex and UPS seem to be doing just fine. In fact > new people are coming on board. What's the new one? Some Yellow truck, 3 > letters, can't remember the name. >Socialized mail can't be that bad for business. >Maybe that was President Obama's hidden agenda in asking kids to > write a letter. It was to themselves, but maybe he'd had hopes they'd > actually mail them and boost the profits of the USPS? Or maybe he'd had the > market flooded and hoped they'd all lick some tainted stamps? The conspiracy > theories flourish. > > > > Jeff Miles > jmile...@charter.net > > Join my Mafia > http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 > > > On Sep 5, 2009, at 11:29 PM, mike wrote: > > Obama says his single payer will run like the post office...God help us >> all.. >> >> On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 8:18 PM, Marcio wrote: >> >> Ihave always been interested in health care as an MD and of course as a >>> patient. I am very surprised that this great Country will not adopt a >>> Single >>> Payer, Medicare for all. But Americans will alwways do the right thing, >>> after trying everything else. We will get there. >>> >>> Marcio >>> >>> -Original Message- >>> >>>> From: Jeff Wright >>>> Sent: Sep 5, 2009 8:43 PM >>>> To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >>>> Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... >>>> >>>> Don't bother arguing with this bunch. What they have inflicted on this >>>>>> List in recent months is much like what the USA has had inflicted on >>>>>> >>>>> it >>> >>>> in recent weeks of wild attacks against rational health care. I don't >>>>>> know if you have been following any of this from afar, doctor, but it >>>>>> has been crazy. No rationality, just insults. Very sad. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> I agree. I know that expect much better from our elected >>>> representatives >>>> and their lapdogs in the press. >>>> >>>> It's sad that a country that once prided itself on free expression has >>>> rulers and elites who can only look down their noses and spew slurs >>>> those >>>> that choose to speak their minds. Dissent is now treated as treason. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> * >>>> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy >>>> ** >>>> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >>>> >>>> * >>>> >>> >>> >>> * >>> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >>> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >>> * >>> >>> >> >> * >> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >> * >> > > > > * > ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > * > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> This is standard wing-nut strategy to make government look bad. Of course. The guvmint never does anything to look bad. It's all a vast, right-wing conspiracy to undermine their natural efficiency. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> DHL is going out of business because it was doing a terrible job. The > foreign owners seemed unable to put an effective management team in > place in the USA. Their service was horribly unreliable. Instead of > working harder at fixing the problem they just decided to give up. > The German stock holders of the parent company really should give > their German managers the heave ho. DHL was a huge operation and they > just pissed it away. Shockingly bad management. I patiently await for the irony of this situation to dawn on Herr Doctor. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 10:29 AM, TPiwowar wrote: > It baffles the shit out of me too. Why do they defend predatory monopolists > who amass huge fortunes by overcharging for inferior software? Because they own stock in these companies? I would wager that an awful lot of the anti-reformers own stock in health insurance companies. Steve * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
On Sep 6, 2009, at 3:04 AM Sep 6, Jeff Miles wrote: Does anyone really stop and think what the post office does on a daily basis? I have yet to find a privet company that has worked as efficiently and consistently. And, being governmentally run, the post office's goal isn't to make a profit. No government program is run to make a profit. Alas, the wing nuts forced the Post Office to be spun off to operate as a non-governmental quasi-business. That is when a lot of the problems at the Post Office started. Their mission was unchanged, but revenue sources were cut and strict limits were imposed on what they could charge. No thought was given to the essential societal function that the Post Office provides. It is a tribute to their managers that the Post Office continues to do a fairly good job. This is standard wing-nut strategy to make government look bad. They stack the deck against the organization so that they can use it as a whipping boy in support of their bizarre, unworkable political philosophies. Now as Obama gradually fixes their mess people are already forgetting the terrible Bush-Cheney ideological mis- management that got us into our current economic situation. Note that while millions of middle-class Americans lose their jobs, the American oligarchs continue to pay themselves $100,000,000 bonuses. And for the upcoming G8 meeting it has already been announced that the US will oppose putting a lid on the oligarchs. Even a US President is unable to stand against them. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
On Sep 6, 2009, at 3:11 AM Sep 6, Jeff Miles wrote: Why do people insist on defending these mafioso type companies that do nothing but steal from them and then turn and complain about the government wasting money? This kind of thought just baffles the shit out of me. It baffles the shit out of me too. Why do they defend predatory monopolists who amass huge fortunes by overcharging for inferior software? And then applaud when $Bs of ill-gotten funds are sent out of the country to pay for Communist-style health care for the foreigners that they hate with such passion. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
On Sep 6, 2009, at 8:50 AM Sep 6, phartz...@gmail.com wrote: The finger biter should be thankful that Mr. Rice was not one of the numerous anti-reform types who carry firearms to these events. "65-year-old William Rice, who is covered under the Medicare program, was taken to an area hospital." I hope he stuck to his guns and refused Communist-funded treatment. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
On Sep 6, 2009, at 8:52 AM Sep 6, Rev. Stewart Marshall wrote: DHL is the three letter name you are looking for German and has closed up shop for a lot of things. (If I remember they are the ones who closed up shop on an Ohio town?) DHL is going out of business because it was doing a terrible job. The foreign owners seemed unable to put an effective management team in place in the USA. Their service was horribly unreliable. Instead of working harder at fixing the problem they just decided to give up. The German stock holders of the parent company really should give their German managers the heave ho. DHL was a huge operation and they just pissed it away. Shockingly bad management. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> I appreciate your faith. I guess the most distressing part of the > whole affair is seeing the wing nuts so ready to sell out their > country for a sack of gold. They support the ultra-rich insurance > barons, the M$s, the Comcasts, etc. and give the shiv to their fellow > citizens. I'm really disappointed in Obama folding so early in the hand. There's so much more he could be doing. No family should ever go broke putting food on their table. No one should have to go into bankruptcy to put a roof over their heads. When is Obama going to force the food barons and the housing dons to provide cheap and affordable food and shelter? I pay more for these every year than I do health care! Single payer groceries and 3BR/2BA now! * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
And they pay pretty well also. Do not see any UPS drivers looking for Food Stamps. I do have a USPS worker in my congregation who is being retrained right now due to shuffling of jobs, With the cut backs and attrition in the USPS she is changing jobs and must go through months of training (some of which she already knows) to be able to do this job. Stewart At 06:43 AM 9/6/2009, you wrote: > Obama says his single payer will run like the post office...God help us > all.. That really wasn't what he said, Mike. What he said was that FedEx and UPS compete successfully with the USPS, proving that the right's claim that "no private insurer will be able to compete with a government-subsidized health program" isn't necessarily true. Pretty hard to argue with that logic. And, AFAIK, none of the plans on the table are single-payer. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
On Sun, Sep 6, 2009 at 2:30 AM, mike wrote: > That was one of your fellow left wing nuts that did the biting off Tom. I'm > sure you will now justify it somehow. The fellow who had the tip of his pinky bitten off, a Mr. Rice, an opponent of healthcare reform, is the one who initiated the physical altercation. He admits that he attacked the pro-reform demonstrator by punching him in the face, thereby initiating the altercation. With that in mind, it appears as though the pro-reform demonstrator was defending himself as the two tussled after he had been physically assaulted. This was apparently not a case of a wanton and completely unjustified finger biting by a "left wing nut" against an anti-reform demonstrator. The finger biter should be thankful that Mr. Rice was not one of the numerous anti-reform types who carry firearms to these events. Steve * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I agree with what you said but a few corrections. DHL is the three letter name you are looking for German and has closed up shop for a lot of things. (If I remember they are the ones who closed up shop on an Ohio town?) Also the USPS is a non government business. They were cut out of the government a number of years ago. USPS are not federal workers and are not Civil Servants. Now to add a few things. We are still one of the few countries to get Saturday mail service, and we pay some of the lowest rates in the world for postage. Look at the cost of mailing a letter from most foreign countries It is over a Euro to mail a post card here (We can mail for .26 and foreign is not that expensive) It costs my in laws almost $1.00 CAN to mail down here, about .80 up there. And before you say look at the exchange, remember they don't get paid in US$ they get paid in Canadian. (I know I lived up there for 4.5 years and my salary was actually lower if you took into account the exchange rate to an equivalent postilion down here.) When I ebay I regularly use USPS priority Mail and am well satisfied with it. It ends up being cheaper than UPS or FEDex. And it gets there within 2-3 days. I have not been disappointed yet. Stewart At 02:04 AM 9/6/2009, you wrote: True, the post office certainly has on many occasions. Does anyone really stop and think what the post office does on a daily basis? I have yet to find a privet company that has worked as efficiently and consistently. And, being governmentally run, the post office's goal isn't to make a profit. No government program is run to make a profit. People bitch when the programs loose money, and they'd bitch about prices and taxes if the programs were making money. It's a no win situation. I have yet, in my 47 years, realized something getting lossed by the USPS. On occasion it's taken a day or more to get here or there. But at the cost, I really can't complain. And with the millions of letters and packages they deal with each day, Fed-Ex and UPS seem to be doing just fine. In fact new people are coming on board. What's the new one? Some Yellow truck, 3 letters, can't remember the name. Socialized mail can't be that bad for business. Maybe that was President Obama's hidden agenda in asking kids to write a letter. It was to themselves, but maybe he'd had hopes they'd actually mail them and boost the profits of the USPS? Or maybe he'd had the market flooded and hoped they'd all lick some tainted stamps? The conspiracy theories flourish. Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> Obama says his single payer will run like the post office...God help us > all.. That really wasn't what he said, Mike. What he said was that FedEx and UPS compete successfully with the USPS, proving that the right's claim that "no private insurer will be able to compete with a government-subsidized health program" isn't necessarily true. Pretty hard to argue with that logic. And, AFAIK, none of the plans on the table are single-payer. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I forgot to add, hopefully you can depend on the USPS or some other carrier to mail that deceased relative home who didn't get medical care due to being non insured, under insured, or cut off by the insurer. Why do people insist on defending these mafioso type companies that do nothing but steal from them and then turn and complain about the government wasting money? This kind of thought just baffles the shit out of me. Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net Join my Mafia http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 On Sep 5, 2009, at 11:29 PM, mike wrote: Obama says his single payer will run like the post office...God help us all.. On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 8:18 PM, Marcio wrote: Ihave always been interested in health care as an MD and of course as a patient. I am very surprised that this great Country will not adopt a Single Payer, Medicare for all. But Americans will alwways do the right thing, after trying everything else. We will get there. Marcio -Original Message- From: Jeff Wright Sent: Sep 5, 2009 8:43 PM To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... Don't bother arguing with this bunch. What they have inflicted on this List in recent months is much like what the USA has had inflicted on it in recent weeks of wild attacks against rational health care. I don't know if you have been following any of this from afar, doctor, but it has been crazy. No rationality, just insults. Very sad. I agree. I know that expect much better from our elected representatives and their lapdogs in the press. It's sad that a country that once prided itself on free expression has rulers and elites who can only look down their noses and spew slurs those that choose to speak their minds. Dissent is now treated as treason. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
True, the post office certainly has on many occasions. Does anyone really stop and think what the post office does on a daily basis? I have yet to find a privet company that has worked as efficiently and consistently. And, being governmentally run, the post office's goal isn't to make a profit. No government program is run to make a profit. People bitch when the programs loose money, and they'd bitch about prices and taxes if the programs were making money. It's a no win situation. I have yet, in my 47 years, realized something getting lossed by the USPS. On occasion it's taken a day or more to get here or there. But at the cost, I really can't complain. And with the millions of letters and packages they deal with each day, Fed-Ex and UPS seem to be doing just fine. In fact new people are coming on board. What's the new one? Some Yellow truck, 3 letters, can't remember the name. Socialized mail can't be that bad for business. Maybe that was President Obama's hidden agenda in asking kids to write a letter. It was to themselves, but maybe he'd had hopes they'd actually mail them and boost the profits of the USPS? Or maybe he'd had the market flooded and hoped they'd all lick some tainted stamps? The conspiracy theories flourish. Jeff Miles jmile...@charter.net Join my Mafia http://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/status_invite.php?from=550968726 On Sep 5, 2009, at 11:29 PM, mike wrote: Obama says his single payer will run like the post office...God help us all.. On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 8:18 PM, Marcio wrote: Ihave always been interested in health care as an MD and of course as a patient. I am very surprised that this great Country will not adopt a Single Payer, Medicare for all. But Americans will alwways do the right thing, after trying everything else. We will get there. Marcio -Original Message- From: Jeff Wright Sent: Sep 5, 2009 8:43 PM To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... Don't bother arguing with this bunch. What they have inflicted on this List in recent months is much like what the USA has had inflicted on it in recent weeks of wild attacks against rational health care. I don't know if you have been following any of this from afar, doctor, but it has been crazy. No rationality, just insults. Very sad. I agree. I know that expect much better from our elected representatives and their lapdogs in the press. It's sad that a country that once prided itself on free expression has rulers and elites who can only look down their noses and spew slurs those that choose to speak their minds. Dissent is now treated as treason. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
That was one of your fellow left wing nuts that did the biting off Tom. I'm sure you will now justify it somehow. On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 8:59 PM, t.piwowar wrote: > On Sep 5, 2009, at 11:18 PM, Marcio wrote: > >> Ihave always been interested in health care as an MD and of course as a >> patient. I am very surprised that this great Country will not adopt a Single >> Payer, Medicare for all. But Americans will alwways do the right thing, >> after trying everything else. We will get there. >> > > I appreciate your faith. I guess the most distressing part of the whole > affair is seeing the wing nuts so ready to sell out their country for a sack > of gold. They support the ultra-rich insurance barons, the M$s, the > Comcasts, etc. and give the shiv to their fellow citizens. Did you catch the > news report about one of them biting off the finger of someone who disagreed > with them? Makes me glad that there is a computer separating us. > > > > * > ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > * > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Obama says his single payer will run like the post office...God help us all.. On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 8:18 PM, Marcio wrote: > Ihave always been interested in health care as an MD and of course as a > patient. I am very surprised that this great Country will not adopt a Single > Payer, Medicare for all. But Americans will alwways do the right thing, > after trying everything else. We will get there. > > Marcio > > -Original Message- > >From: Jeff Wright > >Sent: Sep 5, 2009 8:43 PM > >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM > >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > > > >> > Don't bother arguing with this bunch. What they have inflicted on this > >> > List in recent months is much like what the USA has had inflicted on > it > >> > in recent weeks of wild attacks against rational health care. I don't > >> > know if you have been following any of this from afar, doctor, but it > >> > has been crazy. No rationality, just insults. Very sad. > > > >I agree. I know that expect much better from our elected representatives > >and their lapdogs in the press. > > > >It's sad that a country that once prided itself on free expression has > >rulers and elites who can only look down their noses and spew slurs those > >that choose to speak their minds. Dissent is now treated as treason. > > > > > >* > >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > >* > > > * > ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > * > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
But Americans will alwways do the right thing, after trying everything >else. Yes, the system is supposed to be self-correcting. But it is naiive to suppose that institutions that have stakes in the game will leave the table. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
On Sep 5, 2009, at 11:18 PM, Marcio wrote: Ihave always been interested in health care as an MD and of course as a patient. I am very surprised that this great Country will not adopt a Single Payer, Medicare for all. But Americans will alwways do the right thing, after trying everything else. We will get there. I appreciate your faith. I guess the most distressing part of the whole affair is seeing the wing nuts so ready to sell out their country for a sack of gold. They support the ultra-rich insurance barons, the M$s, the Comcasts, etc. and give the shiv to their fellow citizens. Did you catch the news report about one of them biting off the finger of someone who disagreed with them? Makes me glad that there is a computer separating us. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Ihave always been interested in health care as an MD and of course as a patient. I am very surprised that this great Country will not adopt a Single Payer, Medicare for all. But Americans will alwways do the right thing, after trying everything else. We will get there. Marcio -Original Message- >From: Jeff Wright >Sent: Sep 5, 2009 8:43 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >> > Don't bother arguing with this bunch. What they have inflicted on this >> > List in recent months is much like what the USA has had inflicted on it >> > in recent weeks of wild attacks against rational health care. I don't >> > know if you have been following any of this from afar, doctor, but it >> > has been crazy. No rationality, just insults. Very sad. > >I agree. I know that expect much better from our elected representatives >and their lapdogs in the press. > >It's sad that a country that once prided itself on free expression has >rulers and elites who can only look down their noses and spew slurs those >that choose to speak their minds. Dissent is now treated as treason. > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> > Don't bother arguing with this bunch. What they have inflicted on this > > List in recent months is much like what the USA has had inflicted on it > > in recent weeks of wild attacks against rational health care. I don't > > know if you have been following any of this from afar, doctor, but it > > has been crazy. No rationality, just insults. Very sad. I agree. I know that expect much better from our elected representatives and their lapdogs in the press. It's sad that a country that once prided itself on free expression has rulers and elites who can only look down their noses and spew slurs those that choose to speak their minds. Dissent is now treated as treason. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Quoting TPiwowar : On Sep 5, 2009, at 5:18 PM Sep 5, Marcio wrote: Well... he has been quite helpful to me... Don't bother arguing with this bunch. What they have inflicted on this List in recent months is much like what the USA has had inflicted on it in recent weeks of wild attacks against rational health care. I don't know if you have been following any of this from afar, doctor, but it has been crazy. No rationality, just insults. Very sad. They even call me Hitler so I'm feeling in good company with President Obama. You mean like: On Wed, 2 Sep 2009 23:50:30 -0400, t.piwowar wrote: America has its Dick Cheney. CGUYS has Chris Dunford. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
On Sep 5, 2009, at 5:18 PM Sep 5, Marcio wrote: Well... he has been quite helpful to me... Don't bother arguing with this bunch. What they have inflicted on this List in recent months is much like what the USA has had inflicted on it in recent weeks of wild attacks against rational health care. I don't know if you have been following any of this from afar, doctor, but it has been crazy. No rationality, just insults. Very sad. They even call me Hitler so I'm feeling in good company with President Obama. I think it best to take the lead from our esteemed Representative from Massachusetts... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGX-2oTNens He starts by asking: "What planet are you on?" * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Well... he has been quite helpful to me... Marcio -Original Message- >From: Reid Katan >Sent: Sep 5, 2009 2:44 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >Quoting rleesimon : > >> Hey ...leave Tom alone ...he got 'nuf cra'frum apr to last him... > >Hey. He brings it on himself. > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Quoting rleesimon : Hey ...leave Tom alone ...he got 'nuf cra'frum apr to last him... Hey. He brings it on himself. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Hey ...leave Tom alone ...he got 'nuf cra'frum apr to last him... -Original Message- From: mike [mailto:xha...@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, September 04, 2009 5:13 PM Subject: Re: Intensive Care Unit... Do you cover your eyes and ears when you say that? On Fri, Sep 4, 2009 at 6:36 AM, Jordan wrote: > katan wrote: > >> On Wed, 2 Sep 2009 23:50:30 -0400, t.piwowar wrote: >> >> >> >>> America has its Dick Cheney. CGUYS has Chris Dunford. >>> >>> >> >> Ever notice how The List can have a pleasant conversation, or even a >> lively debate. . .until Tom joins in? >> >> > No. > > > > * > ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > * > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Do you cover your eyes and ears when you say that? On Fri, Sep 4, 2009 at 6:36 AM, Jordan wrote: > katan wrote: > >> On Wed, 2 Sep 2009 23:50:30 -0400, t.piwowar wrote: >> >> >> >>> America has its Dick Cheney. CGUYS has Chris Dunford. >>> >>> >> >> Ever notice how The List can have a pleasant conversation, or even a >> lively debate. . .until Tom joins in? >> >> > No. > > > > * > ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > * > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
katan wrote: On Wed, 2 Sep 2009 23:50:30 -0400, t.piwowar wrote: America has its Dick Cheney. CGUYS has Chris Dunford. Ever notice how The List can have a pleasant conversation, or even a lively debate. . .until Tom joins in? No. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
On Wed, 2 Sep 2009 23:50:30 -0400, t.piwowar wrote: >America has its Dick Cheney. CGUYS has Chris Dunford. Ever notice how The List can have a pleasant conversation, or even a lively debate. . .until Tom joins in? -- R:\katan LET'S GO METS!! LET'S GO METS!! * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> > America has its Dick Cheney. CGUYS has Chris Dunford. > > What an ignorant comment that is... No, Chris, run with it. Ask Tom to go hunting. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> America has its Dick Cheney. CGUYS has Chris Dunford. What an ignorant comment that is... * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:45 PM, Chris Dunford wrote: Unfortunately for your prejudices, the information he received was not "the truth", it was wrong. Out-and-out, unadorned, irredeemably wrong. Not correct. False. Unsound. Counterfactual. Inaccurate. Defective. Faulty. Wrong. If you think otherwise, you have no clue what you're talking about. America has its Dick Cheney. CGUYS has Chris Dunford. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Let me first thank all of you... Belonging to this group has saved me thousand of dollars from paying a psychoanalyst... Every opinion you give is a big help. The reason why I don´t move to another computer shop? Separation Anxiety... that is, I get attached to people (and things) and it is hard for me to depart from them... This applies to wife, clothes, cars, friends, computer shops, and... this list. I am coming to Batimore soon and I hope to bring back the Pentium 4 to test in the old computer...before I separate from it... Will let you all know... but if I become redundant and boring... let me know and I will move on to other computer issues... or... buy a Dell. They do have Dells in Brazil. In Brazilian Portuguese... Many thanks Marcio -Original Message- >From: "Rev. Stewart Marshall" >Sent: Sep 2, 2009 10:01 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >And the truth shall set you free. > >Stewart > > >At 06:51 PM 9/2/2009, you wrote: >>On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:11 AM, Chris Dunford wrote: >>>We already know the answer to the "questionable shop" part. They've >>>given Marcio some very wrong information twice (that we know about). >> >>Telling customers the truth is a very bad, unpardonable thing to do. >>Must keep pumping the M$ party line. >> >> >>* >>** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >>** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >>* > >Rev. Stewart A. Marshall >mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net >Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org >Ozark, AL SL 82 > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
And the truth shall set you free. Stewart At 06:51 PM 9/2/2009, you wrote: On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:11 AM, Chris Dunford wrote: We already know the answer to the "questionable shop" part. They've given Marcio some very wrong information twice (that we know about). Telling customers the truth is a very bad, unpardonable thing to do. Must keep pumping the M$ party line. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:11 AM, Chris Dunford wrote: > > We already know the answer to the "questionable shop" part. They've > > given Marcio some very wrong information twice (that we know about). > > Telling customers the truth is a very bad, unpardonable thing to do. > Must keep pumping the M$ party line. Unfortunately for your prejudices, the information he received was not "the truth", it was wrong. Out-and-out, unadorned, irredeemably wrong. Not correct. False. Unsound. Counterfactual. Inaccurate. Defective. Faulty. Wrong. If you think otherwise, you have no clue what you're talking about. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
On Sep 2, 2009, at 8:11 AM, Chris Dunford wrote: We already know the answer to the "questionable shop" part. They've given Marcio some very wrong information twice (that we know about). Telling customers the truth is a very bad, unpardonable thing to do. Must keep pumping the M$ party line. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Marcio, Then your questions for this list will be more about what software can I run to accomplish such and such ... or how can I sync it to my telephone... and not "how do I get it to start up"... "I've lost everything" kind of issues... But we'll help you with whatever ... we're just hoping you don't keep subjecting yourself to the more dire problems... db John Settle wrote: * I don´t have a Dell The suggestion is you buy one. Hee is their international sales page. http://multinationalexpansion.suite101.com/article.cfm/dell_computer_international_sales * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
* I don´t have a Dell The suggestion is you buy one. Hee is their international sales page. http://multinationalexpansion.suite101.com/article.cfm/dell_computer_international_sales * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> >Dell? No, I am always doing generic computers... I buy the parts... This is > >no good? > > If you don't know what you're doing, or have a questionable shop, this > is no good. We already know the answer to the "questionable shop" part. They've given Marcio some very wrong information twice (that we know about). * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
On Tue, 1 Sep 2009 22:42:58 -0300, Marcio wrote: >Dell? No, I am always doing generic computers... I buy the parts... This is no >good? If you don't know what you're doing, or have a questionable shop, this is no good. Isn't this a computer that you use for business? You don't need the headaches or spending more time "on the couch". (-: If you want to "play" with computers, get a Dell for work and build your own for home. -- R:\katan - SOYLENT GREEN IS PEOPLE!!! * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Does it seem to you that it is serving you well? It used to be a good way to go but now it is more expensive and problematic than buying a good off the shelf machine. Building your own or having it built is something to do if you enjoy it. It's not going to save you money or give you a better computer. db Marcio wrote: Dell? No, I am always doing generic computers... I buy the parts... This is no good? Marcio -Original Message- From: "Rev. Stewart Marshall" Sent: Sep 1, 2009 9:59 PM To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... Actually Dells rank a little higher on the quality scale than HP's and I think even Gateways now. Stewart At 07:54 PM 9/1/2009, you wrote: Quoting Marcio : What do you mean by Dells? Dell computers. www.dell.com They build computers. It would be like getting an HP or a Gateway or--gods forbid--a Mac. They build a fairly quality machine. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I understand the feeling I still build my own. But sometimes you have to dump a problem (your local shop) and go with someone who has a pretty good proven track record. Plus with the right warranty they will be there and fix it under your supervision. Stewart At 08:42 PM 9/1/2009, you wrote: Dell? No, I am always doing generic computers... I buy the parts... This is no good? Marcio Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Dell? No, I am always doing generic computers... I buy the parts... This is no good? Marcio -Original Message- >From: "Rev. Stewart Marshall" >Sent: Sep 1, 2009 9:59 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >Actually Dells rank a little higher on the quality scale than HP's >and I think even Gateways now. > >Stewart > >At 07:54 PM 9/1/2009, you wrote: >>Quoting Marcio : >> >>>What do you mean by Dells? >> >>Dell computers. www.dell.com They build computers. It would be like >>getting an HP or a Gateway or--gods forbid--a Mac. They build a fairly >>quality machine. >> >> >>* >>** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >>** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >>* > >Rev. Stewart A. Marshall >mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net >Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org >Ozark, AL SL 82 > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I know, I know... the patients always improve... the psychiatrists don´t. Would you believe that I lied in a couch for three and half years, four times a week (50 minutes) at a time that there were no computers?...What that didit do for me? I played the harmonica a little better... Marcio -Original Message- >From: Chris Dunford >Sent: Sep 1, 2009 9:52 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >> Marcio you know what they say about a doctor who tries to cure himself >> >> Stewart > >Rev, it's back to Aphorisms 101 for you. Aren't you thinking of lawyers? "A >lawyer who represents himself has a fool for a client." > >But for doctors: "Physician, heal thyself". I'm not convinced that's sound >advice for psychiatrists, though. :) > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Actually Dells rank a little higher on the quality scale than HP's and I think even Gateways now. Stewart At 07:54 PM 9/1/2009, you wrote: Quoting Marcio : What do you mean by Dells? Dell computers. www.dell.com They build computers. It would be like getting an HP or a Gateway or--gods forbid--a Mac. They build a fairly quality machine. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I know I was rejiggering it. Stewart At 07:52 PM 9/1/2009, you wrote: > Marcio you know what they say about a doctor who tries to cure himself > > Stewart Rev, it's back to Aphorisms 101 for you. Aren't you thinking of lawyers? "A lawyer who represents himself has a fool for a client." But for doctors: "Physician, heal thyself". I'm not convinced that's sound advice for psychiatrists, though. :) * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
> Marcio you know what they say about a doctor who tries to cure himself > > Stewart Rev, it's back to Aphorisms 101 for you. Aren't you thinking of lawyers? "A lawyer who represents himself has a fool for a client." But for doctors: "Physician, heal thyself". I'm not convinced that's sound advice for psychiatrists, though. :) * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Quoting Marcio : What do you mean by Dells? Dell computers. www.dell.com They build computers. It would be like getting an HP or a Gateway or--gods forbid--a Mac. They build a fairly quality machine. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Marcio you know what they say about a doctor who tries to cure himself Stewart At 07:23 PM 9/1/2009, you wrote: I know, I am trying to work on my masoquist traits... with my analyst: myself. Marcio -Original Message- >From: db >Sent: Sep 1, 2009 2:51 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >Marcio, > >You are you own worst enemy! ... but as you say you love it. > >We all ... most of us anyway ... just wish you would do the easy and >more inexpensive thing by leaving that boat anchor on the bottom where >it now rests and belongs for all eternity and just get a computer off >the shelf that is current and works. > >That shop is your enabler as in ... a unhealthy codependent relationship. > >But I guess if you got a Dell, we'd never hear from you again... > >:) > >When you come up and get that chip for your "Jones", pick up a Dell too >at the same time ... for your computing. > >db Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Dell computers. www.dell.com They also have an outlet where they sell off lease computers and refurbs. I know you do not have a Dell. Marcio you have a shop built computer. I was responding to the guy who suggested you buy one while up here. Stewart At 07:16 PM 9/1/2009, you wrote: What do you mean by Dells? Marcio -Original Message- >From: db >Sent: Sep 1, 2009 4:16 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >Well actually I might have been. Are you allowed to take Dells out of >the States? > >db > >TPiwowar wrote: >> On Sep 1, 2009, at 2:51 PM Sep 1, db wrote: >>> We all ... most of us anyway ... just wish you would do the easy and >>> more inexpensive thing by leaving that boat anchor on the bottom >>> where it now rests and belongs for all eternity and just get a >>> computer off the shelf that is current and works. >> >> Are you suggesting that Marcio do something illegal with his hardware? >> PCs are toxic waste! >> >> >> >> >> * >> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >> * >> > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I know, I am trying to work on my masoquist traits... with my analyst: myself. Marcio -Original Message- >From: db >Sent: Sep 1, 2009 2:51 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >Marcio, > >You are you own worst enemy! ... but as you say you love it. > >We all ... most of us anyway ... just wish you would do the easy and >more inexpensive thing by leaving that boat anchor on the bottom where >it now rests and belongs for all eternity and just get a computer off >the shelf that is current and works. > >That shop is your enabler as in ... a unhealthy codependent relationship. > >But I guess if you got a Dell, we'd never hear from you again... > >:) > >When you come up and get that chip for your "Jones", pick up a Dell too >at the same time ... for your computing. > >db > >Marcio wrote: >> Sorry to take your time guys. As I said before, to some extent I enjoy >> computers and its vicissitudes... Talked with shop right now. I have a >> generic computer with an ASUS Mobo and a Pentium 4 (I believe 2.6). It was >> giving me all kinds of problems. It had Windows XP Pro and I have the Vista >> Upgrade. >> >> They said that when they get the computer ON in AM the processor temperature >> goes to 60 degrees but when they installed Vista the temperature went much >> higher and the computer stopped. They said that the solution is a new >> Pentium 4 Chip which I just bought and will bring back to them in the end of >> the month (I will be in Baltimore in September). I just want to see if the >> computer will work with the new Pentium 4, and if they can install Windows >> Vista so that I may upgrade when Windows 7 comes in. The guy said that they >> will do it...with the new chip. I am concerned... >> >> By the beginning of October I will give you all a follow up... >> >> Many thanks >> >> Marcio >> >> -Original Message- >> >>> From: Chris Dunford >>> Sent: Sep 1, 2009 7:37 AM >>> To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@listserv.aol.com >>> Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... >>> >>> >>>> I sent it to the shop. They were going to start from zero with Windows >>>> Vista. Then they called me to >>>> say that I should not do this becuase of many drivers. They thought I >>>> should do it with the XP >>>> Professional. >>>> >>> Marcio, I said this the first time, and I'll say it again: You need to find >>> a new computer shop. Last time they said that MS was taking Vista off the >>> market because of "too many bugs". This time it's the drivers. There is no >>> problem with Vista and "many drivers". These people do not know what >>> they're talking about. >>> >>> I second the recommendations about Dell. They're not expensive, and they're >>> reliable. This isn't worth your time. >>> >>> >>> * >>> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >>> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >>> * >>> >> >> >> * >> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >> * >> >> > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
What do you mean by Dells? Marcio -Original Message- >From: db >Sent: Sep 1, 2009 4:16 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >Well actually I might have been. Are you allowed to take Dells out of >the States? > >db > >TPiwowar wrote: >> On Sep 1, 2009, at 2:51 PM Sep 1, db wrote: >>> We all ... most of us anyway ... just wish you would do the easy and >>> more inexpensive thing by leaving that boat anchor on the bottom >>> where it now rests and belongs for all eternity and just get a >>> computer off the shelf that is current and works. >> >> Are you suggesting that Marcio do something illegal with his hardware? >> PCs are toxic waste! >> >> >> >> >> * >> ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >> ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >> * >> > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
I don´t have a Dell Rev. I have a generic computer. Marcio -Original Message- >From: "Rev. Stewart Marshall" >Sent: Sep 1, 2009 4:46 PM >To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM >Subject: Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit... > >Yes and no. It depends on what is in them plus you void the warranty. > >I know Dell has a Canadian outlet (my in laws.) > >So I assume that they also have one in South America, Brazil. > >Stewart > > >At 03:16 PM 9/1/2009, you wrote: >>Well actually I might have been. Are you allowed to take Dells out >>of the States? >> >>db >> >>TPiwowar wrote: >>>On Sep 1, 2009, at 2:51 PM Sep 1, db wrote: >>>>We all ... most of us anyway ... just wish you would do the easy >>>>and more inexpensive thing by leaving that boat anchor on the >>>>bottom where it now rests and belongs for all eternity and just >>>>get a computer off the shelf that is current and works. >>> >>>Are you suggesting that Marcio do something illegal with his >>>hardware? PCs are toxic waste! >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>* >>>** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >>>** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >>>* >> >> >>* >>** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >>** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >>* > >Rev. Stewart A. Marshall >mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net >Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org >Ozark, AL SL 82 > > >* >** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** >** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** >* I don´t have a Dell * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
It could be a field goal but with your glasses you won't see anything anyway. On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 1:01 PM, TPiwowar wrote: > On Sep 1, 2009, at 10:06 AM Sep 1, Rev. Stewart Marshall wrote: > >> Depends on what he is comfortable with. >> > > I just wiped a drive this a.m. and reinstalled M$'s latest good OS: Win XP. > > Why provide Apple with more fodder for its commercials? > > M$ is making its usual promises for the next OS, but I suspect it will be > just another episode of Charlie Brown trying to kick that football, > > > > > > * > ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > * > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Yes and no. It depends on what is in them plus you void the warranty. I know Dell has a Canadian outlet (my in laws.) So I assume that they also have one in South America, Brazil. Stewart At 03:16 PM 9/1/2009, you wrote: Well actually I might have been. Are you allowed to take Dells out of the States? db TPiwowar wrote: On Sep 1, 2009, at 2:51 PM Sep 1, db wrote: We all ... most of us anyway ... just wish you would do the easy and more inexpensive thing by leaving that boat anchor on the bottom where it now rests and belongs for all eternity and just get a computer off the shelf that is current and works. Are you suggesting that Marcio do something illegal with his hardware? PCs are toxic waste! * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:popoz...@earthlink.net Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
Well actually I might have been. Are you allowed to take Dells out of the States? db TPiwowar wrote: On Sep 1, 2009, at 2:51 PM Sep 1, db wrote: We all ... most of us anyway ... just wish you would do the easy and more inexpensive thing by leaving that boat anchor on the bottom where it now rests and belongs for all eternity and just get a computer off the shelf that is current and works. Are you suggesting that Marcio do something illegal with his hardware? PCs are toxic waste! * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Intensive Care Unit...
On Sep 1, 2009, at 10:06 AM Sep 1, Rev. Stewart Marshall wrote: Depends on what he is comfortable with. I just wiped a drive this a.m. and reinstalled M$'s latest good OS: Win XP. Why provide Apple with more fodder for its commercials? M$ is making its usual promises for the next OS, but I suspect it will be just another episode of Charlie Brown trying to kick that football, * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
