[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker

[Dick via Elecraft]

I really enjoy my K3s.  That said, I agree with K9MA's post that "I have never 
found the K3 noise blanker to be effective".  Though I would probably modify 
the word "never" to " very seldom".  


I realize that a great deal of work has gone into making the K3 NB all it can 
be but it needs improvement. I've found the NB on other radios to work a a 
great deal better reducing both impulse and even the "Electronic generated 
noise" mentioned by K9YC.  There has to be a way to improve the K3 NB and I 
sincerely hope that more work will be done on this needed improvement.


73,
Dick- K9OM 








On 9/3/2017 9:18 AM, K9MA wrote:
> I have never found the K3 noise blanker to be effective.


> BTW, the K3 noise blanker uses a filter with a bandwidth of about 100 kHz.


The K3 NB is really TWO blankers, operating in two different IFs. Each 
can be tweaked for various kinds of noise from the menu system.? Access 
the menu by a Long Push of the NB button.

It's important to understand that there are many kinds of noise. Noise 
blankers are most effective on IMPULSE NOISE, which is the result of 
something arcing, usually in the power system, but also electric fences 
and neon signs.

Most of the residential noise we hear today is ELECTRONIC noise, 
generated by switch-mode power supplies and microprocessors.? Noise 
blankers must be very different to suppress this sort of noise. The menu 
tweaks provided by the K3, K3S, KX3, and KX2 are very critical to making 
the NB effective on the noise you're experiencing. One size does NOT fit 
all.

73, Jim K9YC






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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker problem?

[Larry - K1UO]

Hello all..This AM on 160 meters there was a station CQing on 1.820.6 with 
a fundamental freq signal strength of S9 on my K3.  I also found (with the NB 
on) that I could hear him Q5 but very weak on 1.810.6 and the same S 0 reading 
but perfectly Q5  on 1.830.6.  I turned the noise blanker off and of course the 
images disappeared.  Is this a know problem when using the NB or is this just 
with my radio after a recent factory alignment?   I have had a K3 for years and 
never noticed anything like that before but then again this AM was very quiet 
on 160M and I had the NB on because I could hear a distant tick tick of an 
electric fence.
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker problem?

[Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft]

One other note - I see you posted to Elecraft and topband reflectors on your 
post. Please do not cross post when posting to the Elecraft list as that in-turn 
causes a flood of email to the other list and back to here, including bounce 
messages from non-members that fill our admin emaibox.


73,

Eric
/elecraft.com/

On 12/8/2015 7:56 AM, Larry - K1UO wrote:

Hello all..This AM on 160 meters there was a station CQing on 1.820.6 with 
a fundamental freq signal strength of S9 on my K3.  I also found (with the NB 
on) that I could hear him Q5 but very weak on 1.810.6 and the same S 0 reading 
but perfectly Q5  on 1.830.6.  I turned the noise blanker off and of course the 
images disappeared.  Is this a know problem when using the NB or is this just 
with my radio after a recent factory alignment?   I have had a K3 for years and 
never noticed anything like that before but then again this AM was very quiet 
on 160M and I had the NB on because I could hear a distant tick tick of an 
electric fence.
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker problem?

[Guy Olinger K2AV]

Hi Larry,

[This response is posted only to Elecraft Reflector. Posting to more than
one reflector with the same email post gets you 1) dunned by the Elecraft
Admin -- already done by Eric 2) dunned by experienced general readership
of all reflectors, who long, long ago figured out cross-posting just got
people confused. Consider yourself (in a kindly way of course) doubly
dunned.]

To Larry and all other fellow noise sufferers equipped with K3/K3S
transceivers...

Short Version:

See if the AM BC crud goes away when the NB LEVEL has IF set to OFF. The
crud is a necessary possible artifact of IF blanking in the K3/K3S. This
"IF" process in the K3/K3S is at root the same as 1950's noise blanking in
tube gear, but with modern improvements.

Long Version:

The K3 or K3S (referred to as K3 in the rest of the post) has two separate
noise blanker processes: IF and DSP. Depending on settings with a hold on
the single NB button [LEVEL] you can have none, just IF, just DSP, or both
processes running. If they are both on, they work in series. The IF NB
works first, in broadband circuits before the roofing filters. The DSP NB
works second, after the RX low IF analog to digital conversion. The DSP NB
has algorithms doing its magic, and is buried in the number soup that is
SDR.

The IF NB is basically the same NB in the tube ham receivers I used as a
teenager. A strong pulse is detected early in the RX string, and is used to
cut off the incoming broadband signal for the duration of the pulse. There
are refinements to that process, but at root blanking cuts off some part of
the RF/IF string for the duration of the noise pulse. It is possible for
the RF peaks of non-noise signals to trip the blanking threshold.

The modern, mostly digital K3 still uses the ancient IF blanking because it
still works for certain kinds of noise. Usefully, by messing with
preamp/attenuator settings and the width and delay of the blank, the oldie
but goodie blanking can be "tuned" to better blank certain kinds of noise.
We get to "tinker" with the NB and discover the best setting for a certain
kind of noise.

But the IF NB still has inescapable aspects of blanking, drawbacks when I
was a teen and the same now: modulating the RF or pre-filter IF with the
blanking pulse, and MUST have sidebands and intermodulation from the
process. Some of those artifacts of blanking will sound like chewed up
signals that are NOT in the passband. This is because the blanking pulse
has to be applied in a broadband place where the noise pulses are still
extremely sharp and narrow.

Anything loud making it through the front end bandpass filters can be in
the NB IF process blanking artifacts. On 160 meters that easily involves
strong local AM broadcast. In CW contests with many strong CW signals
around the band, you can hear beeple bopple from intermodulating CW signals
or crud from "spread out" QRN. The thinking? The crud, while possibly
irritating, is far less of a problem than the line or spark noise that is
being blocked. The K3 IF blocking does have sophisticated amenities added
to the RF/IF blanking which improve on the old tube type versions which
generally were either just on or off with no adjustments.

I have found that a pernicious recurring line noise on 160 around my QTH is
well dealt with using NB, IF set to narrow-3 and DSP to 1-7 or 2-7. This
will produce a variation in effectiveness with frequency, usually with a
noise null or two somewhere in the CW frequencies 5-10 kHz wide. The
overall noise drop in these nulls is 5, 6, 7 S units, dropping down to the
level of regular band noise without the buzz. There will be some blanker
trash that comes and goes, but I am rescued from giving up on copying
anything not S9 or louder and am able to operate the contest at 93% or so,
placing my run frequencies in the K3 NB noise null.

To those trying to get rid of a certain noise, remember that there are
21+21+(21x21) combinations of IF and DSP blanking. That's 483 combinations,
not counting variations with preamp/normal/atten settings.

Hope this has been helpful.  73,

Guy K2AV





On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 10:56 AM, Larry - K1UO  wrote:

> Hello all..This AM on 160 meters there was a station CQing on 1.820.6
> with a fundamental freq signal strength of S9 on my K3.  I also found (with
> the NB on) that I could hear him Q5 but very weak on 1.810.6 and the same S
> 0 reading but perfectly Q5  on 1.830.6.  I turned the noise blanker off and
> of course the images disappeared.  Is this a know problem when using the NB
> or is this just with my radio after a recent factory alignment?   I have
> had a K3 for years and never noticed anything like that before but then
> again this AM was very quiet on 160M and I had the NB on because I could
> hear a distant tick tick of an electric fence.
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: 

Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker problem?

[n9tf]

Great post Guy, 
  
I also encountered occasional noise on 160, (neighborhood Christmas 
decorations!) during last weekends contest as well. I found similar settings 
worked as you have described below. In addition, I found that switching in the 
notch filter and manually adjusting the notch frequency just a couple hundred 
hertz plus or minus from my CW offset of 600hz, and adding in some NR, I could 
reduce a bit more of the hash from the NB. I was typically listening on the 
250hz roofing filter and narrowed it down with DSP to 200hz. Point being, lots 
of flexibility in adjustments to kill much of the unwanted hash. 
  
 73 Gene, N9TF 
  
K3S 10057 

- Original Message -

From: "Guy Olinger K2AV" <k2av@gmail.com> 
To: "Larry - K1UO" <k...@tds.net> 
Cc: "Elecraft Reflector" <elecraft@mailman.qth.net> 
Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2015 2:45:13 PM 
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker problem? 

Hi Larry, 

[This response is posted only to Elecraft Reflector. Posting to more than 
one reflector with the same email post gets you 1) dunned by the Elecraft 
Admin -- already done by Eric 2) dunned by experienced general readership 
of all reflectors, who long, long ago figured out cross-posting just got 
people confused. Consider yourself (in a kindly way of course) doubly 
dunned.] 

To Larry and all other fellow noise sufferers equipped with K3/K3S 
transceivers... 

Short Version: 

See if the AM BC crud goes away when the NB LEVEL has IF set to OFF. The 
crud is a necessary possible artifact of IF blanking in the K3/K3S. This 
"IF" process in the K3/K3S is at root the same as 1950's noise blanking in 
tube gear, but with modern improvements. 

Long Version: 

The K3 or K3S (referred to as K3 in the rest of the post) has two separate 
noise blanker processes: IF and DSP. Depending on settings with a hold on 
the single NB button [LEVEL] you can have none, just IF, just DSP, or both 
processes running. If they are both on, they work in series. The IF NB 
works first, in broadband circuits before the roofing filters. The DSP NB 
works second, after the RX low IF analog to digital conversion. The DSP NB 
has algorithms doing its magic, and is buried in the number soup that is 
SDR. 

The IF NB is basically the same NB in the tube ham receivers I used as a 
teenager. A strong pulse is detected early in the RX string, and is used to 
cut off the incoming broadband signal for the duration of the pulse. There 
are refinements to that process, but at root blanking cuts off some part of 
the RF/IF string for the duration of the noise pulse. It is possible for 
the RF peaks of non-noise signals to trip the blanking threshold. 

The modern, mostly digital K3 still uses the ancient IF blanking because it 
still works for certain kinds of noise. Usefully, by messing with 
preamp/attenuator settings and the width and delay of the blank, the oldie 
but goodie blanking can be "tuned" to better blank certain kinds of noise. 
We get to "tinker" with the NB and discover the best setting for a certain 
kind of noise. 

But the IF NB still has inescapable aspects of blanking, drawbacks when I 
was a teen and the same now: modulating the RF or pre-filter IF with the 
blanking pulse, and MUST have sidebands and intermodulation from the 
process. Some of those artifacts of blanking will sound like chewed up 
signals that are NOT in the passband. This is because the blanking pulse 
has to be applied in a broadband place where the noise pulses are still 
extremely sharp and narrow. 

Anything loud making it through the front end bandpass filters can be in 
the NB IF process blanking artifacts. On 160 meters that easily involves 
strong local AM broadcast. In CW contests with many strong CW signals 
around the band, you can hear beeple bopple from intermodulating CW signals 
or crud from "spread out" QRN. The thinking? The crud, while possibly 
irritating, is far less of a problem than the line or spark noise that is 
being blocked. The K3 IF blocking does have sophisticated amenities added 
to the RF/IF blanking which improve on the old tube type versions which 
generally were either just on or off with no adjustments. 

I have found that a pernicious recurring line noise on 160 around my QTH is 
well dealt with using NB, IF set to narrow-3 and DSP to 1-7 or 2-7. This 
will produce a variation in effectiveness with frequency, usually with a 
noise null or two somewhere in the CW frequencies 5-10 kHz wide. The 
overall noise drop in these nulls is 5, 6, 7 S units, dropping down to the 
level of regular band noise without the buzz. There will be some blanker 
trash that comes and goes, but I am rescued from giving up on copying 
anything not S9 or louder and am able to operate the contest at 93% or so, 
placing my run frequencies in the K3 NB noise null. 

To those trying to get rid of a certain noise, remember that there are 
2

[Elecraft] K3 - noise blanker suggestions

[Bill W2BLC]

What noise blanker settings are best for the removal of lightning 
static? There must be some - maybe?


My TS480 does a far better job of cleaning up the static than does the 
K3. Already reduced the RF Gain and use the ATT. Then I tried all kinds 
of setting - no go.

Anyone have a magic pill on this?

Bill W2BLC K-Line


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 - noise blanker works fine

[Tony Estep]

On Tue, Mar 12, 2013 at 5:31 PM, Bruce McLaughlin bmcla...@bex.net wrote:
 Not only is the noise blanker outstanding but the noise reduction also works
 extremely well
=
I have to add my $0.02. The Spratly Island guys (9M4SLL) have been
very weak here, never more than S3, and to make matters worse I am
suffering from a plague of atmospheric noise on some bands at certain
times. It seemed that my only chance would be to get 'em on CW, since
the signals are so poor, but when I got home today they were spotted
only on 17 SSB. I tuned for them, but could hear only an occasional
syllable through S6 noise. Nothing to lose -- I turned on both NB and
NR and twiddled the knobs. Lo and behold, I could copy the op! Poorly,
but enough to make it worth calling him. And sure enough!! So I owe
that QSO entirely to the excellent noise handling of the K3. Both NB
and NR have advanced tremendously since the early versions, a tribute
to Elecraft's determination to keep improving their product after it
ships. Here is a clear-cut case where an apparently impossible QSO
happened because of great performance from the K3.

Tony KT0NY




-- 
http://www.isb.edu/faculty/facultydir.aspx?ddlFaculty=352
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 - noise blanker works fine

[Bill Clarke]

I have to say that the NB and DSP have been the turning point for me. 
Until this experience, I have not really been very positive about the 
K3. Now - well, pass the Kool-Aide! My backup rigs will eventually be 
hitting the road and the proceeds used for a the purchase of a second K3.


Those that know me will understand that this statement did not come easily.

Bill W2BLC



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Re: [Elecraft] K3 - noise blanker works fine

[Edward R Cole]

OK, here is another testament to the NB in the K3.

I have been plagued by an intermittent local noise source on 2m which 
is so strong that it renders contacts 15 miles away nearly impossible 
to copy (on SSB).  I made a digital copy of the audio and sent it to 
a receiver engineer in Sweden (who created Linrad) for analysis.  He 
told me that it looks like a raw electrical arc and his sw FFT NB was 
unable to counter the noise.


I am running a NB digital mode (MAP65) on 2m-eme and its NB did lower 
the noise amplitude but with no appreciable improvement in SNR so 
only super-strong signals are decoded.


page two:

Having nothing to lose, I decide to try the NB in the K3.  I played 
with the setting and finally with it set to IF-MED-7 I achieved a 
reduction of about 4 s-units (20 dB) in the noise level resulting in 
recovering about 70% of my normal eme sensitivity.  I am impressed!


73, Ed - KL7UW

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[Elecraft] K3 - noise blanker works fine

[Bill Clarke]

Just had to mention that the K3's noise blanker set at t1-1 is excellent 
for taking out a distant electric fence without causing any apparent 
degradation to the received signal. It was a pleasant surprise, as most 
noise blankers that I have experienced cause all kinds of receive problems.


Bill W2BLC

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 - noise blanker works fine

[Chad Wasinger]

My two cents..
I find that I run in T1-7 for a lot of the power line noise I hear on 2 meters. 
Absolute fantastic job at removing the noise and not degrading the weak signal 
that is normally received on SSB nets 300-400 miles out. Every once in a while 
I engage the DSP NB on the first or second setting to remove some stranger 
noise.
I would also vote that the K3 is the best transceiver I've ever owned at 
removing various types of noise you find across the band. 
What a great tool!
 Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 17:16:49 -0400
 From: b...@w2blc.net
 To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
 Subject: [Elecraft] K3 - noise blanker works fine
 
 Just had to mention that the K3's noise blanker set at t1-1 is excellent 
 for taking out a distant electric fence without causing any apparent 
 degradation to the received signal. It was a pleasant surprise, as most 
 noise blankers that I have experienced cause all kinds of receive problems.
 
 Bill W2BLC
 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 - noise blanker works fine

[Bruce McLaughlin]

Not only is the noise blanker outstanding but the noise reduction also works
extremely well.  It can significantly reduce the noise without major
alterations in the audio unlike most other such circuits I have seen in
other radios which either don't do much of anything or butcher the audio to
the point where it is unrecognizable and not copyable.  I think Elecraft
really nailed these problems with the software which is probably the major
reason why both tools works so well.

Bruce-W8FU

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Chad Wasinger
Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 5:26 PM
To: Bill Clarke; elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 - noise blanker works fine

My two cents..
I find that I run in T1-7 for a lot of the power line noise I hear on 2
meters. Absolute fantastic job at removing the noise and not degrading the
weak signal that is normally received on SSB nets 300-400 miles out. Every
once in a while I engage the DSP NB on the first or second setting to remove
some stranger noise.
I would also vote that the K3 is the best transceiver I've ever owned at
removing various types of noise you find across the band. 
What a great tool!
 Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 17:16:49 -0400
 From: b...@w2blc.net
 To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
 Subject: [Elecraft] K3 - noise blanker works fine
 
 Just had to mention that the K3's noise blanker set at t1-1 is 
 excellent for taking out a distant electric fence without causing any 
 apparent degradation to the received signal. It was a pleasant 
 surprise, as most noise blankers that I have experienced cause all kinds
of receive problems.
 
 Bill W2BLC
 
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] noise blanker is tops

[Mike Rodgers]

I too have a new noise at my no noise qth. I'm not using the dsp NB but the 
I.F. Noise blanker set to MED4 and totally takes it off the speakers AND off 
the s meter. 

Good show, Elecraft. 

Mike R

Play me some fiddle, but no stinkin' violin!

Amateur/Ham Radio KE5GBC
HF  Echolink mobile
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker video

[Jack Berry]

Thanks Rick - well done!





From: Rick Stealey rstea...@hotmail.com
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Sent: Thu, April 26, 2012 9:08:33 AM
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker video


I made a 2 minute video this morning showing how the K3 pulls out a 75 meter AM 
QSO 

that was covered by ugly line noise.
Also see how the FT-1000MP tried to cope with the noise, but came up short.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpC5RYvh5oUfeature=youtu.be

Rick  K2XT
  
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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker video

[Rick Stealey]

I made a 2 minute video this morning showing how the K3 pulls out a 75 meter AM 
QSO 
that was covered by ugly line noise.
Also see how the FT-1000MP tried to cope with the noise, but came up short.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpC5RYvh5oUfeature=youtu.be

Rick  K2XT
  
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker video

[W5RDW]

The K3 has still one of the best Noise Blankers around. With all the handles
available to adjust, I have not found any type of noise at my qth that
cannot be at least reduced to make a copy intelligible. On signals, it is so
impressive with those that literally cannot be heard w/o the blanker and
then when it's on, the signal pops out of the noise clutter magically! 

Combined with the NR feature, just about any signal that is peeking above or
buried in the noise can be made intelligible. If it were not for the NR
function, I would have never worked the A52 last year on SSB. CW was routine
(albeit he was S2/3), but the SSB signal was there somewhere as you listened
to him and only adjustment of the NR made the contact possible.

Very nice video demo, Rick! Your setting were very near mine. In fact, I
rarely touch mine from the settings I found that work at my qth. Nice to
just tap the NB button and everything becomes quite!

Roger W5RDW
Murphy, Texas

K3/P3 (w/19 in monitor)/KPA500 and eagerly awaiting to purchase the KAT500


-
Roger W5RDW
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker and Noise Reduction

[Edward Dickinson III]

While I've never met a Noise Reduction implementation that I've liked on
SSB, I'll confess to not had broad exposure to a lot of different ones.

 

However, I'll join you in your finding on the Noise Blankers.  I've only
found the trade-off between Noise Blanking and distortion introduced to be
occasionally satisfactory and then typically only at low level settings.
One sign of hope is that the hardware blanker is on a separate plug-in
board, though I don't recall every having seen any mention of design changes
to that.

 

As well, I find the Notch Filters less than satisfactory.  The Manual Notch
is not sharp.the bottom is flat and wide.  The Auto-Notch often imparts
Barrel-like acoustics which I find annoying.

 

An email query about possible improvements to the Noise Blankers and Notch
Filters sent to a member of the design team received no reply.

 

In a rig designed to set the bar when it comes to 'the numbers,' it's a
shame that the performance of these basic features of Noise Blanking and
Notch Filtering is lacking.

 

Is there yet hope?

 

 

73,

Dick - KA5KKT 

 

---

 

Am I the only one who find it difficult to use the Noise Blanker and Noise
Reduction controls on the K3?  Maybe it can't be improved but it sure
doesn't work as well as the Ft5000.  In my noisy location it sure would be
nice if these two features on the K3 could be improved.  

 

73, W0SZ 

 

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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker and Noise Reduction

[zumbruns]

Am I the only one who find it difficult to use the Noise Blanker and Noise 
Reduction controls on the K3?  Maybe it can't be improved but it sure doesn't 
work as well as the Ft5000.  In my noisy location it sure would be nice if 
these two features on the K3 could be improved.  73, W0SZ 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker Test

[wa9fvp]

Every morning a young guy in the neighborhood drives by in his wreck.  Just a
few minutes ago, as he drove by, I was fortunate to get an S meter reading
of S9 from his bad ignition system.  I was listening 20 meters using my K3
and a Hygain TH11 beam.  I setup my function generator to get an S9 level
and low and behold, the pulse level was 519mv.  I tried every combination of
pulse widths and rates but I concluded that the generator level is correct.  
I can't beleive that a car can produce a 500mv pulse at the antenna or am I
missing something.  

I'm thinking if I connect my oscilloscope  to the antenna as he drives by, I
can get a better idea of the pulse shape and amplitude.

Jack WA9FVP
Willco Electronics 





-
Jack WA9FVP
Willco Electronics
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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker Test

[wa9fvp]

I made an attempt to plot the noise blanker performance and log the results
in an Excel spread sheet.  I found that the test was in valid so I used a
different approach.
 
The test involves using a function generator that's built into my Agilent
DSOX3024.  The generator is set for pulse mode with a 200mv P-P pulse
repeating 15.5 every 15ms.  The pulse rate is similar to a car with a bad
ignition system speeding by your ham shack.  To insure that there's no RF
getting back into my very expensive oscilloscope, I connected the generator
output to the K3's RX port.  The settings were adjusted by listing to the
noise at the speaker.
 
I determined that without the DSP or the I.F. noise blanker turned on there
are sweet spots and hot spots.  That is the sweet spots are where the
pulse width is adjusted so that the noise is minimum and the hot spots are
where the noise is maximum.   I found that every 70ns, there’s a sweet spot
and 35ns form the sweet spot there's a hot spot.  Adjusted the pulse width
from 20ns to 1 ms and the hot spots and sweet spots were right on target.
 
So what does this mean?  There are conditions where you can have a motor,
car or any electrical device that generates a pulse with in the sweet spot
and you'll never hear it on your K3.  On the other hand there are conditions
where the noise source generates a pulse width that’s with in the hot spot, 
and the noise blanker will or will not effectively reduce the noise.
 
In my original test I didn’t know that there were sweet and hot spots.  I
ran the test by simply turning the NB and adjust the NB level.   My new
approach is a lot more simple and doesn’t require checking every sweet and
hot spot
 
All settings from NAR1 to NAR4 are totally useless.  It offered no noise
reduction regardless of the pulse width and pulse rate.   Settings from NAR5
to NAR7 were somewhat effective but the noise reduction was spotty and the
noise level would vary every 5 or 6 seconds.
 
MED 1 and 2 are useless settings and MED3 is spotty.  MED4 to MED7 reduces
the noise considerably.  The same is true for WID 1 and 2. usless!   WID3 is
spotty and WID4 to WID7 are the best settings.
 
The oscilloscope image below show the pulse on channel 1 and the K3's Line
Out on channel 3.  The DSP and the I.F. noise blanker is turned off.

http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/file/n6848725/k3_blkr.bmp 

-
Jack WA9FVP
Willco Electronics
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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker Test

[wa9fvp]

I made an attempt to plot the noise blanker performance and log the results
in an Excel spread sheet.  I found that the test was invalid so I used a
different approach.
   
The test involves using a function generator that's built into my Agilent
DSOX3024.  The generator is set for pulse mode with a 200mv P-P pulse
repeating every 15ms.  The pulse rate is similar to a car with a bad
ignition system speeding by your ham shack.  To insure that there's no RF
getting back into my very expensive oscilloscope, I connected the generator
output to the K3's RX port.  The settings were adjusted by listening to the
noise at the speaker.
   
I determined that WITHOUT the DSP or the I.F. noise blanker turned on there
are sweet spots and hot spots.  That is the sweet spots are where the
pulse width is adjusted so that the noise is minimum and the hot spots are
where the noise is maximum.   I found that every 70ns, there’s a sweet spot
and 35ns form the sweet spot there's a hot spot.  I Adjusted the pulse width
from 20ns to 1 ms and the hot spots and sweet spots were right on target.
   
So what does this mean?  There are conditions where you can have a motor,
car or any electrical device that generates a pulse with in the sweet spot
and you'll never hear it on your K3.  On the other hand there are conditions
where the noise source generates a pulse width that’s within the hot spot
and the noise blanker will or will not effectively reduce the noise.
   
In my original test I didn’t know that there were sweet and hot spots.  I
ran the test by simply turning on the NB and adjust the NB level.   My new
approach is a lot more simple and doesn’t require checking every sweet and
hot spot
   
All settings from NAR1 to NAR4 are totally useless.  It offered no noise
reduction regardless of the pulse width and pulse rate.   Settings from NAR5
to NAR7 were somewhat effective but the noise reduction was spotty and the
noise level from the speaker would increase and decrease about every 5 or 6
seconds.
   
MED1 and 2 are useless settings and MED3 is spotty.  MED4 to MED7 reduces
the noise considerably.  The same is true for WID 1 and 2. usless!   WID3 is
spotty and WID4 to WID7 are the best settings and  pulse levels as high as a
volt were reduced to nothing.  
   
The oscilloscope image below show the pulse on channel 1 and the K3's Line
Out on channel 3.  The DSP and the I.F. noise blanker is turned off.   

http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/file/n6848802/k3_blkr.bmp 
 


-
Jack WA9FVP
Willco Electronics
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker Test

[wa9fvp]

While setting up the test I found a strange anomaly.  If the pulse amplitude
went above 260mv, the overall noise floor increased.  I’m not sure why this
happened but I suspect it has something to do with the DSP.

When the NB was engaged, the pulse noise was reduced but the overall noise
floor was still high.  Reducing the pulse amplitude below 250mv P-P, the
noise floor suddenly dropped.  

The pulse width had a large effect on the pulse noise amplitude that was
heard at the speaker but pulse rate had very little effect on the “sweet”
and “Hot” spots.  It's like a car that was accelerating as it passed by your
shack.   The pulse duration would decrease as the car speeds up, but you
wouldn’t hear an amplitude change because the ignition system would yield
the same pulse width.  You would hear the pulse frequency increase as if it
were a higher pitch and the amplitude would decrease as the car moved away.

The question is, what is the pulse width and amplitude of an automobile. 
Does the pulse width change from car to car and electric motor to electric
motor?  How do you accurately simulate that condition?  

-
Jack WA9FVP
Willco Electronics
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[Elecraft] K3 noise blanker test

[wa9fvp]

Using an Agilent  DSOX3024 oscilloscope, with a built-in function generator, 
The generator was set for 200mv amplitude and the pulse width was adjusted
for minimum interference at each NB setting.  The generator was connected to
the K3's RX-IN port.   

On some settings and pulse widths the noise was completely eliminated while
other settings yield an almost inaudible click in the speaker.   

http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/file/n6846246/K3_NB_Test.jpg 

-
Jack WA9FVP
Willco Electronics
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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker

[wa9fvp]

After adjusting a noise blanker on another radio, I decided to test K3's
blanker.  The captured screen from my Agilent oscilloscope shows the K3
blanker turned off (the captured waveform in the background) and with the
blanker turned on (the active waveform) the pulse was reduced.   The Agilent
DSOX3024 has a built in wave generator configured to generate a pulse.  The
generator parameters are shown below.   The oscilloscope's Ch 1 was
connected to the K3's line out and ch 2 was connected to the wave generator
using a BNC T.  The other end of the BNC was connected to the RX in port
on the K3. 

The pulse was adjusted for the worst case noise and the best setting for the
K3's noise blanker under these conditions were t2-3.

Don't quote me on this.  I'm sure that other settings will work better for
your conditions.
 
http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/file/n6774838/blanker1.bmp 

-
Jack WA9FVP
Willco Electronics
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 - Noise Blanker Problems

[Geoffrey Downs]

Further to recent postings I've reverted to F/w 4.14 for test purposes and 
find that distortion of louder SSB signals seems to start at a higher 
setting of the DSP noise blanker than in f/w 4.22. For example I can turn 
the DSP blanker up to 1-6 with minimal distortion under 4.14, but only to 
1-4 in f/w 4.22. This is not a scientfic measurement, of course - just what 
I think my ears tell me.

73 to all

Geoff
G3UCK


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker (was K3 Plasma TV and other non OTjunque)

[Jim Cox]

The logical cure for line noise is to notify the power distributor in the 
area and ask them to locate the noise and eliminate it.   I have had good 
luck in this regard especially if you take the time to narrow the noise to 
specific poles, etc.
If you get little feedback from them, contact the FCC.   Its a slow process 
sometimes but the RFI from power lines can be cured.   I have had to involve 
the power distributor at every QTH during my years of Amateur Radio and had 
very good luck getting a quiet QTH  which involved power line interference; 
much easier than having to deal with neighbor's devices..

Jim K4JAF


- Original Message - 
From: Edward Dickinson, III softb...@windstream.net
To: Elecraft Reflector Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2010 10:55 PM
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker (was K3 Plasma TV and other non 
OTjunque)


I operate in a sometimes very high QRN area...45 y.o. Electric Distribution
 System in the area.  Unblanked Noise has recently and regularly been in 
 the
 10 over S-9 realm on 40 meters.

 Can improvements be made to the K3 Noise Blanker?  Firmware..? 
 Hardware..?


 73,
 Dick - KA5KKT
 
 --

 I wonder if Elecraft might have a plasma nearby and could run some test on
 the K3 NB possibly making some custom changes?

 Steve N4LQ


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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker (was K3 Plasma TV and other non OT junque)

[Edward Dickinson, III]

I operate in a sometimes very high QRN area...45 y.o. Electric Distribution
System in the area.  Unblanked Noise has recently and regularly been in the
10 over S-9 realm on 40 meters.  

Can improvements be made to the K3 Noise Blanker?  Firmware..?  Hardware..?


73,
Dick - KA5KKT

--

I wonder if Elecraft might have a plasma nearby and could run some test on 
the K3 NB possibly making some custom changes? 

Steve N4LQ


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[Elecraft] K3: Noise blanker question

[John Harper]

Is there a way to override the fact that the NB needs to be turned on again 
each time you change bands? My AGC On/Off setting stays the same regardless 
of band changes or powering the rig on  off - I'd like the NB to stay in 
the position last used when changing bands...

Thanks,

John Harper AE5X
http://www.ae5x.com/blog




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[Elecraft] K3: Noise blanker question

[Paul Kirley]

See CONFIG: NB SAVE menu item.

73, Paul W8TM



John AE5X asked:
Is there a way to override the fact that the NB needs to be turned on again 
each time you change bands? My AGC On/Off setting stays the same regardless 
of band changes or powering the rig on  off - I'd like the NB to stay in 
the position last used when changing bands...


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Re: [Elecraft] K3: Noise blanker question

[Don Wilhelm]

John and all,

The best way to determine a radio's capability to retain settings or 
alter its default behavior is to read the Menu Settings.  If you don't 
have the latest manual, but you do have updated firmware, you will need 
to download the latest manual from the Elecraft website.

In this particular case, enter the menu for CONFIG: NB SAVE and set it 
to YES.  Since this is a per band setting you will have to do it for 
each band that you wish to have the NB set to ON.

73,
Don W3FPR

John Harper wrote:
 Is there a way to override the fact that the NB needs to be turned on again 
 each time you change bands? My AGC On/Off setting stays the same regardless 
 of band changes or powering the rig on  off - I'd like the NB to stay in 
 the position last used when changing bands...

   
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Re: [Elecraft] K3: Noise blanker question - Thanks guys

[John Harper]

Got it now!

John Harper
http://www.ae5x.com/blog



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[Elecraft] K3:Noise blanker Chinese radar?

[juergen]

Hi

When the K3 was first released, the noise blanker was very effective on the 
Chinese Radar on 40 meters. This radar was very active on the CW end of 40 
meters. You could totally eliminate  this radar signal with the K3's noise 
blanker. 

As the firmware was updated, the K3's noise blanker seemed to become  less 
effective or almost had no effect at all.  Anyone else notice this loss  in 
performance? I wonder if this ability  to notch this low band radar was removed 
from the K3's noise blanker algorithm?

It could be that the  radars pulse repetition rate  or pulse width has changed 
rendering the noise blanker useless against it.

Anyway when the K3's blanker was working it was outstanding on 160, 80 and 40 
meters against this constant QRM source. 

John


--- On Thu, 5/20/10, N3XX n...@charter.net wrote:

 From: N3XX n...@charter.net
 Subject: [Elecraft] Connections to K3 ant 1  2
 To: Elecraft Reflector Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
 Date: Thursday, May 20, 2010, 3:18 AM
 Hi to all on the list,
 
 I just finished building my K3 kit a few weeks ago
 (4175).  All went well, 
 and the new xcvr is up  running with no problems.
 The antenna setup at my qth is a single cable from the
 entrance panel at the 
 house going out to tower #1, through a remote antenna
 switch to select from 
 antennas on that tower or another connection going to tower
 #2.  At tower #2 
 is another remote antenna switch to select various antennas
 on that tower. 
 In the shack I have an amp for 160-10 meters, and an amp
 for 6 meters.
 I would like to connect my single cable coming in from the
 entrance panel to 
 a 2 way coax switch,  with one of the ports going to
 my 160-10 meter amp, 
 and the other going to my 6 meter amp.  Then the
 160-10 amp would be 
 connected to the K3 antenna connector 1, and the 6 meter
 amp would be 
 connected to K3 antenna connector 2.
 Both amps will operate at the legal limit easily, and my
 concern is that 
 when xmitting through one of the antenna connectors 
 amp, I will put too 
 much rf back through the coax switch to the unused K3
 antenna connector, and 
 possibly damage the K3.
 I have been changing cabling manually but would really like
 to be able to 
 just operate a switch to make the change.
 So, if anyone on the list doing something similar to what I
 have in mind, I 
 sure would like to hear about your setup, what kind of
 switch you are using, 
 how much port to port isolation is necessary to be safe,
 etc.
 
 Tnx  73,
 Tim - N3XX 
 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3:Noise blanker Chinese radar?

[Philippe Trottet]

Hi John,
Do you check all  possibilities of the NB and no-one of those are able to block 
this Radar ?
We are facing time to time in my area such problem and had always founded a 
reliable position to minimize it, but may be the today's NB is less effective, 
I have no experience on it and I'm interested by all comments on the subject.
Bst 73's
Philippe A65BI
K3#3616
 


 juergen plebia...@yahoo.com 20-05-2010 15:15 

Hi

When the K3 was first released, the noise blanker was very effective on the 
Chinese Radar on 40 meters. This radar was very active on the CW end of 40 
meters. You could totally eliminate  this radar signal with the K3's noise 
blanker. 

As the firmware was updated, the K3's noise blanker seemed to become  less 
effective or almost had no effect at all.  Anyone else notice this loss  in 
performance? I wonder if this ability  to notch this low band radar was removed 
from the K3's noise blanker algorithm?

It could be that the  radars pulse repetition rate  or pulse width has changed 
rendering the noise blanker useless against it.

Anyway when the K3's blanker was working it was outstanding on 160, 80 and 40 
meters against this constant QRM source. 

John


--- On Thu, 5/20/10, N3XX n...@charter.net wrote:

 From: N3XX n...@charter.net
 Subject: [Elecraft] Connections to K3 ant 1  2
 To: Elecraft Reflector Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
 Date: Thursday, May 20, 2010, 3:18 AM
 Hi to all on the list,
 
 I just finished building my K3 kit a few weeks ago
 (4175).  All went well, 
 and the new xcvr is up  running with no problems.
 The antenna setup at my qth is a single cable from the
 entrance panel at the 
 house going out to tower #1, through a remote antenna
 switch to select from 
 antennas on that tower or another connection going to tower
 #2.  At tower #2 
 is another remote antenna switch to select various antennas
 on that tower. 
 In the shack I have an amp for 160-10 meters, and an amp
 for 6 meters.
 I would like to connect my single cable coming in from the
 entrance panel to 
 a 2 way coax switch,  with one of the ports going to
 my 160-10 meter amp, 
 and the other going to my 6 meter amp.  Then the
 160-10 amp would be 
 connected to the K3 antenna connector 1, and the 6 meter
 amp would be 
 connected to K3 antenna connector 2.
 Both amps will operate at the legal limit easily, and my
 concern is that 
 when xmitting through one of the antenna connectors 
 amp, I will put too 
 much rf back through the coax switch to the unused K3
 antenna connector, and 
 possibly damage the K3.
 I have been changing cabling manually but would really like
 to be able to 
 just operate a switch to make the change.
 So, if anyone on the list doing something similar to what I
 have in mind, I 
 sure would like to hear about your setup, what kind of
 switch you are using, 
 how much port to port isolation is necessary to be safe,
 etc.
 
 Tnx  73,
 Tim - N3XX 
 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3:Noise blanker Chinese radar?

[Lyle Johnson]

 As the firmware was updated, the K3's noise blanker seemed to become  less 
 effective or almost had no effect at all. 

I just checked the source codec files of the DSP Noise Blanker back to 
May of 2008 - absolutely no change has been made to the algorithm, 
*except* the most recent beta which adds a feature but does not take 
away any.

73,

Lyle KK7P
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Re: [Elecraft] K3:Noise blanker Chinese radar?

[Lyle Johnson]

 As the firmware was updated, the K3's noise blanker seemed to become  less 
 effective or almost had no effect at all. 
 

 I just checked the source code files of the DSP Noise Blanker back to 
 May of 2008 - absolutely no change has been made to the algorithm, 
 *except* the most recent beta which adds a feature but does not take 
 away any.
   

And checked the DSP source code files further back, to October 2007 
(first customer shipments).  The algorithm is identical.

73,

Lyle KK7P
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Re: [Elecraft] K3:Noise blanker Chinese radar?

[Merv Schweigert]

Lyle Johnson wrote:
 As the firmware was updated, the K3's noise blanker seemed to become  less 
 effective or almost had no effect at all. 
 

 I just checked the source codec files of the DSP Noise Blanker back to 
 May of 2008 - absolutely no change has been made to the algorithm, 
 *except* the most recent beta which adds a feature but does not take 
 away any.

 73,

 Lyle KK7P
   
Living in Hawaii gives one a real opportunity to test the NB on the 
Hainan radar on 40 meters
and other freqs as well,  my K3 #26XX has never been able to remove the 
pulses,  I can
 compare to a couple of other brand X radios and one of them removes the 
pulses
very well, the other only so - so.So operating 40 meters when the 
radar is on, requires me to
turn on another radio to be able to use the band.  
I figure it takes a special set up of timing and algorithm to tackle the 
Hainan dragon.
73 Merv KH7C


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Re: [Elecraft] K3:Noise blanker Chinese radar?

[Lyle Johnson]

 Living in Hawaii gives one a real opportunity to test the NB on the 
 Hainan radar on 40 meters
 and other freqs as well...

The latest beta has an improved DSP noise blanker that may be more 
effective.

73,

Lyle KK7P
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker icon

[Radio Amateur N5GE]

On Tue, 23 Mar 2010 21:31:32 -0400, Ron W3ZV w...@verizon.net wrote:

From page 25 near the bottom of the left column.  Found by searching
for 'blanker' with the PDF reader search function...

The NB icon will flash slowly if the I.F.
blanker setting is too high for the present signal
conditions. If this happens, use a lower setting.

Tom, N5GE

K3 #806 with SUB RX, PR6, 
KRC2 and K144XV
K3 #1055 with PR6 and XV432
W1, 2 W2's and other small kits

http://www.n5ge.com
http://www.swotrc.net

My noise blanker was blinking randomly and intermittently. I know it was 
complaining about something I was doing, but what? If its in the manual, 
I missed it. Any help?

Ron W3ZV
[snip]

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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker icon

[Ron W3ZV]

My noise blanker was blinking randomly and intermittently. I know it was 
complaining about something I was doing, but what? If its in the manual, 
I missed it. Any help?

Ron W3ZV
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker icon

[Brett Howard]

Its clearly outlined on page 25 of the manual in the section titled
Noise Blanking.  Look for the info icon.


http://www.elecraft.com/manual/K3_Owner%27s_Manual_Rev_D6sm.pdf

~Brett


On Tue, 2010-03-23 at 21:31 -0400, Ron W3ZV wrote:
 My noise blanker was blinking randomly and intermittently. I know it was 
 complaining about something I was doing, but what? If its in the manual, 
 I missed it. Any help?
 
 Ron W3ZV
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[Elecraft] [K3] Noise blanker insertion loss

[Wes Stewart]

I just noted that my noise blanker has an S-unit of insertion loss.

Anyone else see this?

Wes  N7WS


  
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Noise blanker insertion loss

[Edward Dickinson, III]

Yes...


73,

Dick - KA5KKT




I just noted that my noise blanker has an S-unit of insertion loss.

Anyone else see this?

Wes  N7WS




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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Noise blanker insertion loss

[Wes Stewart]

Thanks. Too bad.
--- On Sun, 1/31/10, Edward Dickinson, III softb...@windstream.net wrote:

From: Edward Dickinson, III softb...@windstream.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Noise blanker insertion loss
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Date: Sunday, January 31, 2010, 2:27 PM

Yes...


73,

Dick - KA5KKT




I just noted that my noise blanker has an S-unit of insertion loss.

Anyone else see this?

Wes  N7WS




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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Noise blanker insertion loss

[Lyle Johnson]

 I just noted that my noise blanker has an S-unit of insertion loss.

I measure 2.0 dB (AGC OFF, using AFV/dBV internal functions and 
monitoring a steady nominal S5 carrier on 6 meters).

73,

Lyle KK7P
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Noise blanker insertion loss

[Brett Howard]

I just got done using that feature to measure filter flatness for
someone...  Gotta admit thats a VERY handy feature!

~Brett

On Sun, 2010-01-31 at 16:31 -0800, Lyle Johnson wrote:
  I just noted that my noise blanker has an S-unit of insertion loss.
 
 I measure 2.0 dB (AGC OFF, using AFV/dBV internal functions and 
 monitoring a steady nominal S5 carrier on 6 meters).
 
 73,
 
 Lyle KK7P
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Noise blanker insertion loss

[Joe Planisky]

Nearly the same here (-2.2dB), but only when the IF NB is used.  No  
loss at all with just the DSP NB engaged.

73
--
Joe KB8AP

On Jan 31, 2010, at 4:31 PM, Lyle Johnson wrote:


 I just noted that my noise blanker has an S-unit of insertion loss.

 I measure 2.0 dB (AGC OFF, using AFV/dBV internal functions and
 monitoring a steady nominal S5 carrier on 6 meters).

 73,

 Lyle KK7P
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Noise blanker insertion loss

[Wes Stewart]

Thanks Lyle,

I put my stepped attenuator in the line between the K3 and the XG2 and checked 
the S-meter.  The way I had it calibrated, a 3dB step took it from S9 down to 
S8.  I re-calibrated the S-meter offset until the meter read S9 and a 6dB step 
was required to take it to S8.  (Offset value went from 22 down to 20)

Now I don't see an S-unit of change with the blanker in and out and using your 
method, I read 2.8 dB of insertion loss.  Higher than yours but not quite as 
troublesome.

Regards,

Wes  N7WS

--- On Sun, 1/31/10, Lyle Johnson k...@wavecable.com wrote:

From: Lyle Johnson k...@wavecable.com
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Noise blanker insertion loss
To: Wes Stewart n...@yahoo.com
Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net, IIIEdward Dickinson softb...@windstream.net
Date: Sunday, January 31, 2010, 5:31 PM


 I just noted that my noise blanker has an S-unit of insertion loss.

I measure 2.0 dB (AGC OFF, using AFV/dBV internal functions and monitoring a 
steady nominal S5 carrier on 6 meters).

73,

Lyle KK7P



  
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Noise blanker insertion loss

[Wes Stewart]

Correct.  You can turn blanking on with the front panel switch and go to the 
setup function and dial it in and out with the knob and listen for the relay 
click.

--- On Sun, 1/31/10, Joe Planisky jp...@jeffnet.org wrote:

From: Joe Planisky jp...@jeffnet.org
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Noise blanker insertion loss
To: Lyle Johnson k...@wavecable.com
Cc: Wes Stewart n...@yahoo.com, elecraft@mailman.qth.net, IIIEdward 
Dickinson softb...@windstream.net
Date: Sunday, January 31, 2010, 6:32 PM

Nearly the same here (-2.2dB), but only when the IF NB is used.  No  
loss at all with just the DSP NB engaged.

73
--
Joe KB8AP

On Jan 31, 2010, at 4:31 PM, Lyle Johnson wrote:


 I just noted that my noise blanker has an S-unit of insertion loss.

 I measure 2.0 dB (AGC OFF, using AFV/dBV internal functions and
 monitoring a steady nominal S5 carrier on 6 meters).

 73,

 Lyle KK7P
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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker

[Howard K2HK]

When using the NB, if the IF blanker is enabled at any setting, I lose most of 
the signal. The DSP blanker works as expected. What should I check?
 
Howard..K2HK  
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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker

[rfenabled]

Snip

A six cylinder diesel doesn't have ignition noise.  What noise are you
comparing against?  73, Guy.

End Snip

I beg to disagree. The computer controlling many diesel engines today produce 
noise as do the electronic injectors etc.

Commercial vehicles may use split system style air conditioner's and these do 
generate noise as well.

As I stated in a previous posting, the TS-480SAT does not do a very good job in 
my vehicle whereas the K3 handles it very easy.

I have yet to start tracing where the noise is coming from but I will be able 
to reduce it somewhat when time allows.

73's
Gary
Sent via BlackBerry® from Telstra
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker

[Guy Olinger K2AV]

Ignition noise is very specific: cylinder fire timed very short
duration pulse noise with an extremely high peak to average signal
value without a signal frequency center, sometimes adversely affecting
frequencies continuously from below AM broadcast through UHF.  Back in
the day I can remember simultaneously seeing ignition noise from
passing cars on channel 7 TV on the screen, hearing it on AM radio,
and hearing the muffler (or lack thereof) going up the street.

The point is that blanking ignition noise is usually an easy reduction
and has been done easily with technology dating back to the 50's.
Blanking or reducing other kinds of hash, squeaks, snarls, and other
kinds of engine electronic control leakage is another can of worms
entirely.

Since the very specific and narrow term ignition noise (spark plugs)
was probably not intended in reference to a diesel car, as the heat
from mechanical compression ignites the mixture in a diesel, my
question what WAS the noise at issue?  Though you have listed some
sources below, what is the KIND or SOUND of noise generated by those
devices?

73, Guy.

On Thu, Jan 7, 2010 at 3:50 PM,  rfenab...@gmail.com wrote:
 Snip

 A six cylinder diesel doesn't have ignition noise.  What noise are you
 comparing against?  73, Guy.

 End Snip

 I beg to disagree. The computer controlling many diesel engines today produce 
 noise as do the electronic injectors etc.

 Commercial vehicles may use split system style air conditioner's and these do 
 generate noise as well.

 As I stated in a previous posting, the TS-480SAT does not do a very good job 
 in my vehicle whereas the K3 handles it very easy.

 I have yet to start tracing where the noise is coming from but I will be able 
 to reduce it somewhat when time allows.

 73's
 Gary
 Sent via BlackBerry® from Telstra
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Maarten van Rossum]

I have power lines at approximately 150 meters from my QTH. The only thing I
don't like about the NB is that every time you switch the radio off and on,
you have to engage the NB again. I wish it would stay on permanently since
it's very effective and doesn't seem to have any down sides.

73, Maarten
PD2R

P.s. As a professional fire fighter I absolutely love you callsing: PY1RO
;-)



2009/12/20 Eric gliderboy1...@yahoo.com

 I can confirm Lance's statement that the K3 noise blanker is excellent!  I
 used it with quite aggressive settings to wipe out some impulse noise on 6m
 during the Geminids shower.  That allowed me to run wsjt and work a number
 of stations.

 73

 Eric WD6DBM

 About to begin construction of an xv-432 as soon as the xyl leaves cm97
 tomorrow...:-)

 Sent from my ePhone (I wish)
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Arie Kleingeld PA3A]

Maarten,

In the menu: NB Save.

Switch that to on. That will solve the problem.

73 Arie PA3A


Verzonden: zondag 20 december 2009 10:08
Aan: Eric
CC: py...@terra.com.br; elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Onderwerp: Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

I have power lines at approximately 150 meters from my QTH. The only thing I
don't like about the NB is that every time you switch the radio off and on,
you have to engage the NB again. I wish it would stay on permanently since
it's very effective and doesn't seem to have any down sides.

73, Maarten
PD2R


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Maarten van Rossum]

Arie,

Many thanks, I should read the manual.again.

Mary Christmast,

Maarten

2009/12/20 Arie Kleingeld PA3A p...@xs4all.nl

 Maarten,

 In the menu: NB Save.

 Switch that to on. That will solve the problem.

 73 Arie PA3A


 Verzonden: zondag 20 december 2009 10:08
 Aan: Eric
 CC: py...@terra.com.br; elecraft@mailman.qth.net
 Onderwerp: Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

 I have power lines at approximately 150 meters from my QTH. The only thing
 I
 don't like about the NB is that every time you switch the radio off and on,
 you have to engage the NB again. I wish it would stay on permanently since
 it's very effective and doesn't seem to have any down sides.

 73, Maarten
 PD2R



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[Elecraft] K3 noise blanker 6 meters

[K7WIA]

I use my K3 only for 6 meter work, but I have been unhappy with the
performace of the noise blanker for pulse spikes.

no matter how I adjust the DSP or the IF blanker I cant seem to bank out the
pulses.

I can take out the power line type buzz but not the sharp spikes

When playing with the IF adjustments and I increase it to NAR-7 with the DSP
OFF my S meter goes from S3 to S6 and the backkground noise increases and
sounds almost like intermod.

When I turned my antenna all of a sudden the noise level dropped to S3 my
normal background level.

I tuned down band a found 3 very strong signals,S9+40 (baby monitors) 49.830
49.870  49.890

It seems the IF blanker samples signals before the filters and therefore
look at a very large sprectrum.

and it appears that those strong down band signals overload the blanker...

I turned my antenna and peaked the monitor signals, then tuned up band, when
I got to 50.450 the overload went away. which is 600KC above the interfering
signals.

The bad part is if I turn my antenna to where I don't have the overload my
antenna will be stuck on JA land... not much good this time of the cycle
when you live in Seattle

It would be nice to be able to keep it pointed at Florida but that right
where the interferences is the worse.

don't know of the DSP code can be modified to incorperate pulse type spikes
or not..

　

Ed K7WIA

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View this message in context: 
http://n2.nabble.com/K3-noise-blanker-6-meters-tp4196761p4196761.html
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[Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Eric]

I can confirm Lance's statement that the K3 noise blanker is excellent!  I used 
it with quite aggressive settings to wipe out some impulse noise on 6m during 
the Geminids shower.  That allowed me to run wsjt and work a number of 
stations.  

73

Eric WD6DBM

About to begin construction of an xv-432 as soon as the xyl leaves cm97 
tomorrow...:-)

Sent from my ePhone (I wish)
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[Elecraft] K3 Noise blanker board

[Mike Weir]

Good morning all
Almost finished putting the K3 all together but last night I did notice while 
putting the NB board on the 8th pin from the left was missing. I ended up 
plugging it into the main board but will wait to find out if this is 
intentional or defective before I power up the unit. 
Thanks 
Mike
VE3WDM
  
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Windows Live: Friends get your Flickr, Yelp, and Digg updates when they e-mail 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise blanker board

[Bob Cunnings]

Well, according to the K3 schematic, pin 5 of the connector shows 'no
connection'. This would be the 8th pin from one end.

Bob NW8L

On Wed, Dec 9, 2009 at 4:14 AM, Mike Weir ve3...@hotmail.com wrote:

 Good morning all
 Almost finished putting the K3 all together but last night I did notice while 
 putting the NB board on the 8th pin from the left was missing. I ended up 
 plugging it into the main board but will wait to find out if this is 
 intentional or defective before I power up the unit.
 Thanks
 Mike
 VE3WDM
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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker

[Barry Simpson]

I have not noticed before but the noise blanker does not work on the KRX3
whereas the noise reduction does work. Is this a fault with my particular
rig or is that the way it should behave ?

 

Barry  VK2BJ

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker

[Brett Howard]

Have you configured your sub rx to have a noise blanker?  I think you
have to go into the menu for the KNB3 and then hit sub and turn that on.
Then I'm not sure if you have to also use BSET to enable it or not but
this is at least a thought of something to check.

~Brett

On Fri, 2009-08-21 at 07:06 +, Barry Simpson wrote:
 I have not noticed before but the noise blanker does not work on the KRX3
 whereas the noise reduction does work. Is this a fault with my particular
 rig or is that the way it should behave ?
 
  
 
 Barry  VK2BJ
 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker

[Barry Simpson]

Thanks for the suggestion Brett but it doesn't work !

73

Barry  VK2BJ

-Original Message-
From: Brett Howard [mailto:br...@livecomputers.com] 
Sent: 21 August 2009 09:13
To: Barry Simpson
Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker

Have you configured your sub rx to have a noise blanker?  I think you
have to go into the menu for the KNB3 and then hit sub and turn that on.
Then I'm not sure if you have to also use BSET to enable it or not but
this is at least a thought of something to check.

~Brett

On Fri, 2009-08-21 at 07:06 +, Barry Simpson wrote:
 I have not noticed before but the noise blanker does not work on the KRX3
 whereas the noise reduction does work. Is this a fault with my particular
 rig or is that the way it should behave ?
 
  
 
 Barry  VK2BJ
 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker

[Barry Simpson]

Hi Brett again

It does work now. I rtfm !
I hadn't got the VFO's configured as independent .

Thanks again for your suggestion.

73

Barry  VK2BJ

-Original Message-
From: Brett Howard [mailto:br...@livecomputers.com] 
Sent: 21 August 2009 09:13
To: Barry Simpson
Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker

Have you configured your sub rx to have a noise blanker?  I think you
have to go into the menu for the KNB3 and then hit sub and turn that on.
Then I'm not sure if you have to also use BSET to enable it or not but
this is at least a thought of something to check.

~Brett

On Fri, 2009-08-21 at 07:06 +, Barry Simpson wrote:
 I have not noticed before but the noise blanker does not work on the KRX3
 whereas the noise reduction does work. Is this a fault with my particular
 rig or is that the way it should behave ?
 
  
 
 Barry  VK2BJ
 
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[Elecraft] K3 noise blanker behavior with sub receiver

[Charles Johnson]

I have noticed some strange behavior in the K3 regarding the noise 
blanker (NB) and the sub receiver.  If I have the sub receiver turned 
off and am listening to the main receiver with the noise blanker turned 
on, then enable the sub receiver, the noise blanker is turned off in the 
main receiver. I then have to turn it back on for the main receiver, 
then enter B SET and turn it on for the sub receiver. The CONFIG:VFO IND 
has to be enabled to even allow you to turn on the sub receiver's noise 
blanker. If CONFIG:VFO IND is not enabled, I can not find a way to turn 
on the sub receiver's noise blanker. The noise reduction (NR) on the 
other hand, works completely differently. The settings are maintained as 
you turn the sub receiver on and off, and you can turn on the noise 
reduction in the sub receiver by turning it on for the main receiver. 
Seems to me the two functions should work the same way. I use the noise 
blanker a lot. It works very well on my power line noise, but using it 
with the sub receiver is not very straight forward. What am I missing 
here? Thanks, Charlie, K4ZRJ
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker behavior with sub receiver

[Arie Kleingeld PA3A]

Charles,

There's a setting in the menu to remember the NB settings.
Switch that on and the problem is solved.

73,
Arie PA3A

-Oorspronkelijk bericht-
Van: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] Namens Charles Johnson
Verzonden: dinsdag 28 juli 2009 20:02
Aan: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Onderwerp: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker behavior with sub receiver


I have noticed some strange behavior in the K3 regarding the noise 
blanker (NB) and the sub receiver.  If I have the sub receiver turned 
off and am listening to the main receiver with the noise blanker turned 
on, then enable the sub receiver, the noise blanker is turned off in the

main receiver. I then have to turn it back on for the main receiver, 
then enter B SET and turn it on for the sub receiver. The CONFIG:VFO IND

has to be enabled to even allow you to turn on the sub receiver's noise 
blanker. If CONFIG:VFO IND is not enabled, I can not find a way to turn 
on the sub receiver's noise blanker. The noise reduction (NR) on the 
other hand, works completely differently. The settings are maintained as

you turn the sub receiver on and off, and you can turn on the noise 
reduction in the sub receiver by turning it on for the main receiver. 
Seems to me the two functions should work the same way. I use the noise 
blanker a lot. It works very well on my power line noise, but using it 
with the sub receiver is not very straight forward. What am I missing 
here? Thanks, Charlie, K4ZRJ
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Noise Blanker Observations?

[Ignacy]

From time to time I have a very strong powerline or other impulse noise or
noises. K3 sometimes takes care of it sometimes not. I general, I have a
feeling that NB is IC-7000 is a bit better although K3 does well with some
types of noise that IC7000 cannot bite with the DSP NB. 

NB takes care of short impulse noises from a single location very well. When
the noise is from multiple locations or of a very complex type, NB does not
do much. In such a case, a device like MFJ-1026 does wonders; you will need
a second antenna.  

Ignacy




S Sacco wrote:
 
 All -
 
 One of the reasons for purchasing a K3 over, say, an Icom IC-756ProIII was
 that the ProII I used to have had a noise blanker button, but it never
 seemed to actually do much.
 
 Sadly, I'm in the midst of several severe power line noise sources (the
 power company is getting to them as they can), but I'm finding that my K3
 NB
 is having no effect, in ANY of the zillion settings available.  This isn't
 strange, bizarro noise - just arching from a power line.   Is anyone else
 experiencing less than satisfactory NB performance with their K3?  I'm
 running the latest Production firmware.
 
 Comments appreciated - you can make them private, if you like, and I'll
 post
 a summary.
 
 Thanks,
 
 Steve NN4X
 K3 S/N 1317
 K3 S/N 0458
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-- 
View this message in context: 
http://n2.nabble.com/Noise-Blanker-Observations--tp2493506p2510021.html
Sent from the [K3] mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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[Elecraft] [K3] Noise Blanker Observations?

[S Sacco]

All -

One of the reasons for purchasing a K3 over, say, an Icom IC-756ProIII was
that the ProII I used to have had a noise blanker button, but it never
seemed to actually do much.

Sadly, I'm in the midst of several severe power line noise sources (the
power company is getting to them as they can), but I'm finding that my K3 NB
is having no effect, in ANY of the zillion settings available.  This isn't
strange, bizarro noise - just arching from a power line.   Is anyone else
experiencing less than satisfactory NB performance with their K3?  I'm
running the latest Production firmware.

Comments appreciated - you can make them private, if you like, and I'll post
a summary.

Thanks,

Steve NN4X
K3 S/N 1317
K3 S/N 0458
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise blanker

[David Woolley (E.L)]

Gary Smith wrote:

I have a Corsair II whose noise blanked usually does a fair job of 


My question for this forum is to ask how satisfied you are with the 
noise reduction in the K3 as opposed to your experiences with other 


You are confusing two different concepts.  I believe the K3 supports both.

In its terminology, noise blanking is used to elimenate broadband spikes 
and basically uses a very broadband detector, early in the receiver, to 
mute the signal later in the receiver, where it has suffered enough 
group delay to allow the blanker to react.  It needs to be done in the 
analogue processing, at least when digitising at less than 10s of Ms/s


Noise reduction is intended for relatively narrow band, or continuous 
sources.  I believe it includes an automatic notch filter, but it may 
also involve blanking audio sub-bands with little energy, etc.  It's 
done in the software defined part of the system.



--
David Woolley
The Elecraft list is a forum for the discussion of topics related to 
Elecraft products and more general topics related ham radio

List Guidelines http://www.elecraft.com/elecraft_list_guidelines.htm
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[Elecraft] K3 Noise blanker

[Gary Smith]

Another question for K3 owners:

I have a severe case of RFI which is intermittent and I wrote about 
it in a post to the RFI forum. You can hear an example of it here if 
you wish, it's less than a meg in size:http://doctorgary.net/QRM-
1.mp3 Not to go into much detail on the specific RFI here but to 
understand the character of the issue, read my detailed post on the 
rfi reflector and go here: 
http://lists.contesting.com/pipermail/rfi/2008-October/006238.html

I have a Corsair II whose noise blanked usually does a fair job of 
eliminating this RFI. My Omni V does nothing to reduce this RFI. It 
usually happens at night. As I am more into low band DXing, this is 
an issue.

My question for this forum is to ask how satisfied you are with the 
noise reduction in the K3 as opposed to your experiences with other 
recievers with similar RFI as I am experiencing.

I have not to date found the source of the RFI so perhaps a better 
noise blanker is what I will find that is my best option. The K3 
seems to be getting a lot of great press so I am interested in the 
K3. A superior noise blanker is imperitave but I would not be willing 
to have a radio that hears less well than the Corsair II or Omni V.

I have a few other K3 questions but will ask them in separate posts.

Thank you,

Gary
KA1J
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise blanker

[John]

At 09:20 AM 10/10/08, you wrote:


I have a severe case of RFI which is intermittent


Gary,

It sounds like you need the power company more than an NB. I had 
noise just like that, intermittent.  I turned out to be a transformer 
on a power pole. It could be arcing due to a faulty power line 
connection.  You need to have the power company open the line at a 
fuse point, removing power from the line. You will need to run your 
radio off batteries while they are checking. I found that most power 
companies will work with their customers to resolve a problem.


Good luck!
John
k7up  


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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker

[Bryce A. Carr]

 With over 200 on 160 from this 80 ft. wide city lot I take a real interest in 
noise blankers. A few days ago my friend gave me his K3 kit to build for him. 
s/n 1487 2.21 firmware with 2.7khz, 1.0 khz, .400 khz filters. His 2nd rx still 
on order.
Tonight I have it together except for the 100w amp and this evening I was 
playing qrp and listening to OHR that covered most all of the 40m band and was 
peaking S9 with my gp ant on 7.070 mhz with 2 khz bandwidth selected. 

As expected, the NR button was of slight help with this terrible racket in the 
audio line but the NB button completely removed it with no reduction in desired 
audio level. Completely, I mean 100%
The S meter dropped from S9 to my normal KH6 40m noise floor of S5. No trace of 
it heard with the other filters either.
My K3 is on order.
Congrats to Elecraft. Aloha, Bryce, kh6at
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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker, Filter and DSP Measurements

[Jack Smith]

I've added a third page of K3 performance measurements to my web site 
this evening.

http://www.cliftonlaboratories.com/elecraft_k3_noise_blanker_and_crystal_dsp_filtering.htm

Four topics are covered:
1. IF noise blanker
2. Linearity of DBV function
3. Frequency domain filter measurements
4. Time  domain filter measurements

73 de Jack K8ZOA
www.cliftonlaboratories.com


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker, Filter and DSP Measurements

[Alan Bloom]

Jack,

Thanks for posting all this data.  Very interesting.  (At least to a
data-junkie engineer. ;=)

Al N1AL

On Fri, 2008-08-22 at 16:14, Jack Smith wrote:
 I've added a third page of K3 performance measurements to my web site 
 this evening.
 http://www.cliftonlaboratories.com/elecraft_k3_noise_blanker_and_crystal_dsp_filtering.htm
 
 Four topics are covered:
 1. IF noise blanker
 2. Linearity of DBV function
 3. Frequency domain filter measurements
 4. Time  domain filter measurements
 
 73 de Jack K8ZOA
 www.cliftonlaboratories.com
 
 
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] noise blanker

[Tom Childers, N5GE]

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 11:55:54 +0200, Petr Ourednik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Hi,


My antennas are really close to electric fence (just few metres) 
so the pulses on all bands with K3 are over S9+20dB !


Ouch!

Solution 1:

Take one pickup truck and tie the back bumper to the fence with an insulated
rope.  Jump in the cab and pull the fence as far as you can away from your QTH
and destroy the charger.

Solution 2.

Help your neighbor find a fence charger that is not so noisy.

Solution 3.

Move to another location.

All the above is tongue in cheek.

Tom, N5GE - SWOT 3537 - Grid EM12jq

Those who would give up 
Essential Liberty to 
purchase a little Temporary 
Safety deserve neither 
Liberty nor Safety 

An excerpt from a letter 
written in 1755 from the 
Assembly to the Governor 
of Pennsylvania.

Support the entire Constitution, not 
just the parts you like.

http://www.n5ge.com
http://www.eQSL.cc/Member.cfm?N5GE

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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] noise blanker

[Jim Wiley]

Solution 4:

Remind the neighbor that interference from an electric fence is not 
permitted.  Even though such interference falls under the umbrella of 
incidental radiation, it still must not interfere with the operation 
of a licensed radio station.  There are some fairly recent (within the 
past 5 years or so) cases where the FCC got involved in this type of 
problem, and some substantial fines were assessed.   A search of QST 
archives should turn up some of Riley's correspondence on these issues. 



Attempting to work out the issues with the neighbor may be useful, as 
electric fences are not supposed to radiate, and there may be repair 
actions that can substantially reduce or eliminate the problem.   
However, I  advise  anyone with this sort of problem that the only 
assistance you should provide is in identification of the noise source, 
and monitoring to verify that repairs have been effective. 



Do not under any circumstances attempt to repair the equipment 
yourself!  Not only can such equipment generate hazardous voltages,  if 
you make a repair, successful or not,  you could find yourself liable 
for damages should anyone subsequently be injured by this same system.  
You could also find yourself sued for the cost of later repair or 
replacement under the assumption that since you are not a professional 
service person for the device, whatever you did caused any subsequent 
problems. 



- Jim, KL7CC
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RE: [Elecraft] [K3] noise blanker

[Bill Johnson]

I have found that if there are weeds growing near any of the wires, the
noise will arc.  I suggested to my neighbor that I could hear his fence and
what caused the issue.  He took care of it... for awhile Maybe the old
pony will pass in the next couple of years and that will be the end of it.
I use the DSP with some limited effect because it creates more artifacts
than it cures with the fence noise.  Oh, my TS-2000 has the same issue...
worse, actually.

I like solution 1!  Just if I could pull it off without the horse noticing
me!


72,

Bill 

K9YEQ
K2 #35, K2 # 5279, KX1 #35, Mini Modules, etc.  




-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom Childers, N5GE
Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2008 3:42 PM
To: Petr Ourednik
Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [K3] noise blanker

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 11:55:54 +0200, Petr Ourednik [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:

Hi,


My antennas are really close to electric fence (just few metres) 
so the pulses on all bands with K3 are over S9+20dB !


Ouch!

Solution 1:

Take one pickup truck and tie the back bumper to the fence with an insulated
rope.  Jump in the cab and pull the fence as far as you can away from your
QTH
and destroy the charger.

Solution 2.

Help your neighbor find a fence charger that is not so noisy.

Solution 3.

Move to another location.

All the above is tongue in cheek.

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[Elecraft] [K3] noise blanker

[Petr Ourednik]

Hi,

according to preview discussion on noise blanker of K3 I decided to 
write few words also as I have lot of experiences with that I guess...
My antennas are really close to electric fence (just few metres) 
so the pulses on all bands with K3 are over S9+20dB !

A few points as the results of my tests and final settings
which I am using on my K3 untill now.

1. Only the combination of the dsp and IF is able to kill the el.fence
pulses
2. dsp/t1-7 does not help in my case with any combination of IF values
3. IF NAR/MED/WID does not help if values are lower than 4...
4. dsp/t2-5,6,7 or t3-5,6,7 values are really agressive and it
suppressing
the pulses effectively if its in combination with IF setting MED or WID
with
higher than 4 values.

My standard setting to be able to live on the bands together with
el.fence 
close to my antennas is:
dsp t3-5
IF WID4

In case of dry weather I must switch to:
dsp t3-7
IF WID5

THE MAIN PROBLEM IS that with the values higher than 5 on dsp/IF it
affecting 
the receiving signals a lot. Even strong sigs on the bands are coloured
a lot
and its not copyable for speed higher than 30 wpm.
The weak signals are destroyed with agressive dsp/IF setting so much
that its
useless on lowbands unfortunately.

I am NOT anxious or even dissapointed with that as Elecraft boys still
working 
on the DSP/IF noise blanker function code I guess and it takes time to
debug it.

73, Petr OK1RP
K3 #778
-- 
Petr Ourednik
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://topband.blog.cz (160m)

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Jim Brown]

On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:30:26 +0100, Stephen Prior wrote:

The NB is, it seems to me, no better than many others I have used 
(eg TS-850) and the NR does not seem, to me at least, to be any better
than that on the TS-480 this K3 replaced. 

That's not surprising, and I'm not complaining -- I'm just not declaring it 
equivalent to the second coming. At some point, you bump up against the 
limits of what can be achieved without destroying the signal. On the other 
hand, I also think that there is an experience factor here -- we, the 
operators, learning to get the most out of the tools that are included. 

73,

Jim K9YC



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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Craig]

Hi Stephen

I am  feeling much the same about my K3's noise blanker. I live in a semi rural 
area with many poorly maintained power poles and many electric fences. The 
noise types and frequency varies on a day to day basis. I find the K3's DSP 
blanker to be much more effective than its IF blanker.  The DSP blanker runs 
rings around the K3's IF blanker and i mostly leave the K3's IF blanker off 
because of lack of performance.   

My old crapped out TS830S  at my QTH has the best performing  noise blanker for 
dealing with these varying noise sources. It is surprising that the K3's IF 
blanker seems to distort signals even on its lowest setting  yet on the TS830S 
it seems to cope rather well in comparison, having both the ability to blank 
most power line noise and not distort signals very much. 

The TS830S has my vote for the best overall noise blanking performance on power 
line noise sources. Both the K3 and K2's noise blanker,  when they find the 
kind of noise they  like seem darn impressive. Unfortunately random noise 
sources dont behave in such a predictable and consistent manner.

The TS830S because if its pre-selection also copes much better when using the 
noise blanker in crowded conditions.  For these  reasons i will always keep 
this great old semi boat anchor radio whose receiver is no slouch either in IMD 
dynamic range performance. Its hard to believe that almost 30  years later  
that it holds its own against the  technology marvels and tall poppies of  the 
transceiver world.


73
Craig
VK3HE




--- On Sun, 8/17/08, Stephen Prior [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 From: Stephen Prior [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker
 To: Bill W5WVO [EMAIL PROTECTED], Jim Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED], 
 elecraft elecraft@mailman.qth.net
 Date: Sunday, August 17, 2008, 4:30 PM
 This is a 'me too'.
 
 Having, in waiting for my K3, read all sorts of accolades
 for the NB and NR,
 I feel, now that I have the radio in front of me, somewhat
 deflated.  The NB
 is, it seems to me, no better than many others I have used
 (eg TS-850) and
 the NR does not seem, to me at least, to be any better than
 that on the
 TS-480 this K3 replaced.  And, I have experimented with all
 the various
 settings available and am running the latest firmware.
 
 Having said that, I remain 95% delighted with the K3.  The
 strong signal
 handling is fantastic, I like the ergonomics and the tx
 audio is simply
 excellent.  I would not swap it for any other radio.  But,
 the NB and NR
 have not lived up to my (maybe unrealistic) expectations.
 
 73 Stephen G4SJP 
 
 
 On 17/08/2008 20:45, Bill W5WVO
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  Jim Brown wrote:
  
  Yes, but what is NR and NB doing to signals
 you're trying to
  copy?
  It's easy to fool yourself about how well it
 works when
  listening
  ONLY to band noise. To be useful, the NB/NR must
 suppress the
  noise
  while not doing too much damage to the signal
 you're trying to
  copy.
  So far, I haven't been thrilled by what I hear
 of that.
  
  Have to agree with you on that, Jim. It's
 definitely a trade-off
  between noise suppression and signal intelligibility.
 As with many
  things, it works better on CW than it does on SSB.
  
  Once the major promised features of the K3 are in
 place (still
  waiting for a fix for the SSBCW VFO offset issue
 when changing
  modes), I'm hoping the NB and NR code will be
 thoroughly
  revisited.
  
  Bill W5WVO
  
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Julian, G4ILO]

Stephen Prior wrote:
 
 This is a 'me too'.
 
 [snip]
 
 But, the NB and NR
 have not lived up to my (maybe unrealistic) expectations.
 
 
I have never made much use of the noise blanker of any radio. It never made
a difference to the kind of noise I experience, which is a bit like a
close-up recording of frying, like a chorus of 100 switched mode power
supplies. I hoped the much-vaunted DSP NR would have an impact on this, but
it just makes the voice sound distorted and narrow. Perhaps I'm expecting
too much as well. 

-
Julian, G4ILO
http://www.g4ilo.com/ G4ILO's Shack 
http://www.ham-directory.com/ Ham Directory 
-- 
View this message in context: 
http://n2.nabble.com/K3-noise-blanker-tp729039p730371.html
Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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[Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[George]

I am the happy owner of  K3 #340.  I also own a Kenwood TS 830S, which is one 
fine radio, even in 2008 (see Sherwood's tables for performance figs.).  
However,  I have never had much success with the 830's noise blanker, and 
usually don't bother to turn it on; whereas with the K3's noise fighters are 
able to eliminate practically all the line noise at my qth.  I used to use an 
MFJ 1026 device to quite effectively eliminate noise when using the 830, but 
find I don't need it with the K3.  What gives??

George, n4ym
K2 #4758
K3 #340
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[Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Arie Kleingeld PA3A]

All,
 
I''ve been playing with my K3 (#1255) for a week now and I'm getting the
feel of the controls.  Everything is OK but I'm still working on the
settings of the NB and the NR.
Firmware 2.23 / 1.88
 
Now about NR.
I receive a S9 pulse from an electric fence. Getting rid of this was
easy with the NB of a FT1000MP, is impossible to get rid of with the K2
(still unmodified) NB and
the pulse is very much suppressed (not totally) in the K3 !  Wow.
Thinking about earlier threads about static noise and beating the Rob
Sherwood test on dsp radio's on that subject, I found the reason: AGC
PLS is on. Boy, lucky me!
Switching off the AGC PLS brings back the electric fence pulse on S9.
 
So let's try the NB of the K3 on this.
IF NAR 1-7: no good result
IF MED 5: pulse pretty much gone, but...
IF WID 4: pulse pretty much gone, but...
DSP 1-1 to 3-4: very little result
 
So I'm able to suppress the pulse with the NB or with the AGP PLS
setting.
The thing that worries me (and here is the but...)  is that when I'm
using the NB, setting in IF NAR/WID/WID x, and x4, introduces noise and
signals that are not there without the NB on.
So settings 5, 6 and 7 seem useless here.
Anybody experiencing the same? Or did I miss something?
 
 
73
Arie PA3A
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RE: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Arie Kleingeld PA3A]

One more addition:

NB off, AGC PLS set to nor.
Bandwidth set to 400 Hz (with 400Hz roofing filter).

The pulse is back (about S5)working the agc.
Pulse is suppressed again at bandwidth 550 Hz (yes 550Hz, not 450Hz) or
greater (roofing filter = 2.1k at BW 450 Hz - 2100Hz)


Arie





-
Onderwerp: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker


All,
 
I''ve been playing with my K3 (#1255) for a week now and I'm getting the
feel of the controls.  Everything is OK but I'm still working on the
settings of the NB and the NR. Firmware 2.23 / 1.88
 
Now about NR.
I receive a S9 pulse from an electric fence. Getting rid of this was
easy with the NB of a FT1000MP, is impossible to get rid of with the K2
(still unmodified) NB and the pulse is very much suppressed (not
totally) in the K3 !  Wow. Thinking about earlier threads about static
noise and beating the Rob Sherwood test on dsp radio's on that
subject, I found the reason: AGC PLS is on. Boy, lucky me! Switching off
the AGC PLS brings back the electric fence pulse on S9.
 
So let's try the NB of the K3 on this.
IF NAR 1-7: no good result
IF MED 5: pulse pretty much gone, but...
IF WID 4: pulse pretty much gone, but...
DSP 1-1 to 3-4: very little result
 
So I'm able to suppress the pulse with the NB or with the AGP PLS
setting. The thing that worries me (and here is the but...)  is that
when I'm using the NB, setting in IF NAR/WID/WID x, and x4, introduces
noise and signals that are not there without the NB on. So settings 5, 6
and 7 seem useless here. Anybody experiencing the same? Or did I miss
something?
 
 
73
Arie PA3A
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RE: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Arie Kleingeld PA3A]

One more addition:

NB off, AGC PLS set to nor.
Bandwidth set to 400 Hz (with 400Hz roofing filter).

The pulse is back (about S5)working the agc.
Pulse is suppressed again at bandwidth 550 Hz (yes 550Hz, not 450Hz) or
greater (roofing filter = 2.1k at BW 450 Hz - 2100Hz)


Arie





-
Onderwerp: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker


All,
 
I''ve been playing with my K3 (#1255) for a week now and I'm getting the
feel of the controls.  Everything is OK but I'm still working on the
settings of the NB and the NR. Firmware 2.23 / 1.88
 
Now about NR.
I receive a S9 pulse from an electric fence. Getting rid of this was
easy with the NB of a FT1000MP, is impossible to get rid of with the K2
(still unmodified) NB and the pulse is very much suppressed (not
totally) in the K3 !  Wow. Thinking about earlier threads about static
noise and beating the Rob Sherwood test on dsp radio's on that
subject, I found the reason: AGC PLS is on. Boy, lucky me! Switching off
the AGC PLS brings back the electric fence pulse on S9.
 
So let's try the NB of the K3 on this.
IF NAR 1-7: no good result
IF MED 5: pulse pretty much gone, but...
IF WID 4: pulse pretty much gone, but...
DSP 1-1 to 3-4: very little result
 
So I'm able to suppress the pulse with the NB or with the AGP PLS
setting. The thing that worries me (and here is the but...)  is that
when I'm using the NB, setting in IF NAR/WID/WID x, and x4, introduces
noise and signals that are not there without the NB on. So settings 5, 6
and 7 seem useless here. Anybody experiencing the same? Or did I miss
something?
 
 
73
Arie PA3A
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Jim Brown]

On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 10:10:06 +0200, Arie Kleingeld PA3A wrote:

 pulse is very much suppressed (not totally) in the K3 !  Wow.

Yes, but what is NR and NB doing to signals you're trying to copy? 
It's easy to fool yourself about how well it works when listening 
ONLY to band noise. To be useful, the NB/NR must suppress the noise 
while not doing too much damage to the signal you're trying to copy. 
So far, I haven't been thrilled by what I hear of that. 

73,

Jim K9YC


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Bill W5WVO]

Jim Brown wrote:

 Yes, but what is NR and NB doing to signals you're trying to
copy?
 It's easy to fool yourself about how well it works when
listening
 ONLY to band noise. To be useful, the NB/NR must suppress the
noise
 while not doing too much damage to the signal you're trying to
copy.
 So far, I haven't been thrilled by what I hear of that.

Have to agree with you on that, Jim. It's definitely a trade-off
between noise suppression and signal intelligibility. As with many
things, it works better on CW than it does on SSB.

Once the major promised features of the K3 are in place (still
waiting for a fix for the SSBCW VFO offset issue when changing
modes), I'm hoping the NB and NR code will be thoroughly
revisited.

Bill W5WVO

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Stephen Prior]

This is a 'me too'.

Having, in waiting for my K3, read all sorts of accolades for the NB and NR,
I feel, now that I have the radio in front of me, somewhat deflated.  The NB
is, it seems to me, no better than many others I have used (eg TS-850) and
the NR does not seem, to me at least, to be any better than that on the
TS-480 this K3 replaced.  And, I have experimented with all the various
settings available and am running the latest firmware.

Having said that, I remain 95% delighted with the K3.  The strong signal
handling is fantastic, I like the ergonomics and the tx audio is simply
excellent.  I would not swap it for any other radio.  But, the NB and NR
have not lived up to my (maybe unrealistic) expectations.

73 Stephen G4SJP 


On 17/08/2008 20:45, Bill W5WVO [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Jim Brown wrote:
 
 Yes, but what is NR and NB doing to signals you're trying to
 copy?
 It's easy to fool yourself about how well it works when
 listening
 ONLY to band noise. To be useful, the NB/NR must suppress the
 noise
 while not doing too much damage to the signal you're trying to
 copy.
 So far, I haven't been thrilled by what I hear of that.
 
 Have to agree with you on that, Jim. It's definitely a trade-off
 between noise suppression and signal intelligibility. As with many
 things, it works better on CW than it does on SSB.
 
 Once the major promised features of the K3 are in place (still
 waiting for a fix for the SSBCW VFO offset issue when changing
 modes), I'm hoping the NB and NR code will be thoroughly
 revisited.
 
 Bill W5WVO
 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[ab2tc]

Hi,

One of the main reasons for me buying the K3 was the demonstrated ability to
eliminate pulse noise emanating from power lines and ignition noise (I
listened to before/after audio clips demonstrating this on the web). The NB
is very effective and does not distort signals at all unless they are
really, really strong (S9+20dB++). I have never even tried the NR function -
frankly I don't understand what it's supposed to do. Removing white noise
from a signal is theoretically impossible and yet that's seems to be what
the expectation of the NR is. Surprisingly most of the effectiveness of the
NB on my pulse noise is coming from the DSP portion of the NB, although I
use a combination of the two (setting t2-4,MED3), as suggested by many.

Knut - AB2TC


Stephen Prior wrote:
 
 This is a 'me too'.
 
 Having, in waiting for my K3, read all sorts of accolades for the NB and
 NR,
 I feel, now that I have the radio in front of me, somewhat deflated.  The
 NB
 is, it seems to me, no better than many others I have used (eg TS-850) and
 the NR does not seem, to me at least, to be any better than that on the
 TS-480 this K3 replaced.  And, I have experimented with all the various
 settings available and am running the latest firmware.
 
 Having said that, I remain 95% delighted with the K3.  The strong signal
 handling is fantastic, I like the ergonomics and the tx audio is simply
 excellent.  I would not swap it for any other radio.  But, the NB and NR
 have not lived up to my (maybe unrealistic) expectations.
 
 73 Stephen G4SJP 
 
 
 


-
AB2TC - Knut
-- 
View this message in context: 
http://n2.nabble.com/K3-noise-blanker-tp729039p729777.html
Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Dave Martin]

On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 4:30 PM, Stephen Prior [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 This is a 'me too'.

 Having, in waiting for my K3, read all sorts of accolades for the NB and NR,
 I feel, now that I have the radio in front of me, somewhat deflated.  The NB
 is, it seems to me, no better than many others I have used (eg TS-850) and
 the NR does not seem, to me at least, to be any better than that on the
 TS-480 this K3 replaced.  And, I have experimented with all the various
 settings available and am running the latest firmware.

 Having said that, I remain 95% delighted with the K3.  The strong signal
 handling is fantastic, I like the ergonomics and the tx audio is simply
 excellent.  I would not swap it for any other radio.  But, the NB and NR
 have not lived up to my (maybe unrealistic) expectations.

 73 Stephen G4SJP


I recall hearing quite effective noise reduction on the demo files
offered by one or two manufacturers of NR speakers or NR boards, even
on SSB.  It didn't seem very similar to what we have with the K3 noise
reduction.  Does anyone have one of the speakers to compare with the
K3 NR?  My noise is terrible here and I've thought several times of
ordering one of the speakers or boards, but hate to without some way
to compare them first to what I have with the K3.

Dave  W5DHM
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Tom W8JI]

Having, in waiting for my K3, read all sorts of accolades 
for the NB and NR,
I feel, now that I have the radio in front of me, somewhat 
deflated.  The NB
is, it seems to me, no better than many others I have used 
(eg TS-850) and
the NR does not seem, to me at least, to be any better 
than that on the

TS-480 this K3 replaced.


Have to agree with you on that, Jim. It's definitely a 
trade-off
between noise suppression and signal intelligibility. As 
with many

things, it works better on CW than it does on SSB.



I think perhaps the people that are ecstatic about noise 
reduction have noise that is greatly different than the type 
of signal they are trying to copy. The unhappy campers are 
trying remove noise that is similar in characteristics to 
what they are trying to hear. If the blanker or reduction 
system can't tell the noise from the signal it can't work no 
matter how much time and effort is put in the design.


An RF noise nulling device would be a solution if the noise 
is from a defined direction and source.


This reminds me a little of that For Eyes commercial.

73 Tom

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Stephen Prior]

Hi Knut,

Well interference is a very personal thing of course, and I suffer here from
power line noise too, especially when it is damp which is pretty much all of
the time.  Global warming does not seem to have reached the south western
tip of the UK yet- we've had the wettest, coldest summer wx for a long time
here!

The thing with the NB function is that it seems to take an awful lot of
effort in playing with settings to result in any tangible improvement and it
has only marginally helped with the power line noise problems despite lots
of such playing. 

73 Stephen G4SJP



On 17/08/2008 22:03, ab2tc [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 Hi,
 
 One of the main reasons for me buying the K3 was the demonstrated ability to
 eliminate pulse noise emanating from power lines and ignition noise (I
 listened to before/after audio clips demonstrating this on the web). The NB
 is very effective and does not distort signals at all unless they are
 really, really strong (S9+20dB++). I have never even tried the NR function -
 frankly I don't understand what it's supposed to do. Removing white noise
 from a signal is theoretically impossible and yet that's seems to be what
 the expectation of the NR is. Surprisingly most of the effectiveness of the
 NB on my pulse noise is coming from the DSP portion of the NB, although I
 use a combination of the two (setting t2-4,MED3), as suggested by many.
 
 Knut - AB2TC
 
 
 Stephen Prior wrote:
 
 This is a 'me too'.
 
 Having, in waiting for my K3, read all sorts of accolades for the NB and
 NR,
 I feel, now that I have the radio in front of me, somewhat deflated.  The
 NB
 is, it seems to me, no better than many others I have used (eg TS-850) and
 the NR does not seem, to me at least, to be any better than that on the
 TS-480 this K3 replaced.  And, I have experimented with all the various
 settings available and am running the latest firmware.
 
 Having said that, I remain 95% delighted with the K3.  The strong signal
 handling is fantastic, I like the ergonomics and the tx audio is simply
 excellent.  I would not swap it for any other radio.  But, the NB and NR
 have not lived up to my (maybe unrealistic) expectations.
 
 73 Stephen G4SJP
 
 
 
 
 
 -
 AB2TC - Knut



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RE: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[Rob May]

I received my K3 (#1417) Monday, had it on the air Tuesday.  I'm using a 
computer headset plugged into the the back of the radio with a foot switch to 
leave both hands free.  I hunt and pounced about 3 or 4 hours last night in the 
NAQP.  I was amazed at the NR and NB.  I have intermittent S9 power line noise 
here and I can eliminate that.  In addition, by playing with the NR setting and 
the AFX (a great feature that really does help on some signals) I was able to 
have clear copy on signals that I could barely tell were even there before.  I 
was so impressed that I went and got my wife to show her what it could do.  My 
other radio is a IC-718, so I'm comparing PC to a calculator, but still, very 
impressive.  I've using the latest beta firmware.

I have to say that the steep skirts of the 2.8 8 pole filter were worth the 
upgrade, it was great to be able to work stations that were less than 1 kHz 
apart.
Rob
NV5E



 Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2008 21:30:26 +0100
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; elecraft@mailman.qth.net
 CC:

 This is a 'me too'.

 Having, in waiting for my K3, read all sorts of accolades for the NB and NR,
 I feel, now that I have the radio in front of me, somewhat deflated. The NB
 is, it seems to me, no better than many others I have used (eg TS-850) and
 the NR does not seem, to me at least, to be any better than that on the
 TS-480 this K3 replaced. And, I have experimented with all the various
 settings available and am running the latest firmware.

 Having said that, I remain 95% delighted with the K3. The strong signal
 handling is fantastic, I like the ergonomics and the tx audio is simply
 excellent. I would not swap it for any other radio. But, the NB and NR
 have not lived up to my (maybe unrealistic) expectations.

 73 Stephen G4SJP


 On 17/08/2008 20:45, Bill W5WVO  wrote:

 Jim Brown wrote:

 Yes, but what is NR and NB doing to signals you're trying to
 copy?
 It's easy to fool yourself about how well it works when
 listening
 ONLY to band noise. To be useful, the NB/NR must suppress the
 noise
 while not doing too much damage to the signal you're trying to
 copy.
 So far, I haven't been thrilled by what I hear of that.

 Have to agree with you on that, Jim. It's definitely a trade-off
 between noise suppression and signal intelligibility. As with many
 things, it works better on CW than it does on SSB.

 Once the major promised features of the K3 are in place (still
 waiting for a fix for the SSBCW VFO offset issue when changing
 modes), I'm hoping the NB and NR code will be thoroughly
 revisited.

 Bill W5WVO

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker

[S Sacco]

Knut -

Regarding NR and DSP, check out the excellent (and WAY UNDERUTILIZED)
K3 forums and wiki at:
http://www.zerobeat.net/mediawiki/index.php/K3_DSP

73,
Steve NN4X



On Sun, Aug 17, 2008 at 5:03 PM, ab2tc [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Hi,

 One of the main reasons for me buying the K3 was the demonstrated ability to
 eliminate pulse noise emanating from power lines and ignition noise (I
 listened to before/after audio clips demonstrating this on the web). The NB
 is very effective and does not distort signals at all unless they are
 really, really strong (S9+20dB++). I have never even tried the NR function -
 frankly I don't understand what it's supposed to do. Removing white noise
 from a signal is theoretically impossible and yet that's seems to be what
 the expectation of the NR is. Surprisingly most of the effectiveness of the
 NB on my pulse noise is coming from the DSP portion of the NB, although I
 use a combination of the two (setting t2-4,MED3), as suggested by many.

 Knut - AB2TC


 Stephen Prior wrote:

 This is a 'me too'.

 Having, in waiting for my K3, read all sorts of accolades for the NB and
 NR,
 I feel, now that I have the radio in front of me, somewhat deflated.  The
 NB
 is, it seems to me, no better than many others I have used (eg TS-850) and
 the NR does not seem, to me at least, to be any better than that on the
 TS-480 this K3 replaced.  And, I have experimented with all the various
 settings available and am running the latest firmware.

 Having said that, I remain 95% delighted with the K3.  The strong signal
 handling is fantastic, I like the ergonomics and the tx audio is simply
 excellent.  I would not swap it for any other radio.  But, the NB and NR
 have not lived up to my (maybe unrealistic) expectations.

 73 Stephen G4SJP





 -
 AB2TC - Knut
 --
 View this message in context: 
 http://n2.nabble.com/K3-noise-blanker-tp729039p729777.html
 Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker Question

[Vic K2VCO]

Mike Warden wrote:


When I am listening to any SSB signal (or AM signal) and I engage the Noise
Blanker (NB) function, both the S-Meter reading and the audio drop way down.
For example, if I am listening to an SSB signal at S-9 and have the audio
set at a moderate level, engaging the NB IF function, at any level from NAR1
through WID7 results in an S-Meter drop to S1 or lower and an audio drop to
an almost inaudible level.


This is not normal. Either the IF NB board is not plugged in properly or 
there is some kind of problem with it. There should be no signal loss 
when it's activated.

--
73,
Vic, K2VCO
Fresno CA
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco
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[Elecraft] K3 Noise Blanker Question

[Mike Warden]

I have Elecraft K3 Serial # 924 (kit) and, after a very straightforward
assemble, test, and calibration, everything appears to be working perfectly,
except for one small concern that may or may not be a real issue.  Any
advice would be appreciated.

 

When I am listening to any SSB signal (or AM signal) and I engage the Noise
Blanker (NB) function, both the S-Meter reading and the audio drop way down.
For example, if I am listening to an SSB signal at S-9 and have the audio
set at a moderate level, engaging the NB IF function, at any level from NAR1
through WID7 results in an S-Meter drop to S1 or lower and an audio drop to
an almost inaudible level.

 

I understand that the NB-IF function may result in some loss of the signal,
but the loss I'm experiencing seems excessive to me.

 

I have tried the NB function with the ACG set for Slow, Fast, and Off, with
the same results.

 

Is this normal, or do I have something set incorrectly?  Any advice would be
appreciated.

 

'73

-mike-

W2PY

 

 

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker sure does the job.

[drewko1]

You can try switching off a suspected street lamp by beaming its
photocell with a laser pointer. The photocell is located on top of the
lamp housing. It is directional, usually oriented toward the north
(but not always) so you would have to spot it with the laser from this
particular direction. 

You could go around the neighborhood with a portable radio and a laser
pointer, trying each lamp. Or set up a recorder at your rig, tuned to
WWV time signals, and log the times when you switch off particular
streetlamps. Having a tripod for the laser pointer might help. A green
laser will make a nice beam which you can see, not just a spot.

How you explain your activities to the cops when they pick you up is
another story...

73,
Drew
AF2Z


On Mon, 23 Jun 2008 09:11:23 -0700, Brett Howard  wrote:

?I've got a HUGE problem in my area too.  It only comes on at night (not
all nights though) and its periodic.  Like a lil over a minute on and
then 40 something seconds off and it goes on and off like that all
night.  It generally comes on shortly after the street lamps do.  A talk
with the power company results in a guy calling back saying he was in
the area and couldn't hear anything.  Well no doubt you weren't there
when the noise is.  And he says that if its the street lamps they have
no jurisdiction I have to speak with the city.  Unfortunately I have no
real way to tell what light it is.



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[Elecraft] K3 noise blanker sure does the job.

[Kenneth A. Christiansen]

I ordered my K3 in June of 2007 after a strong local noise level started 
at my Fargo ND QTH. (That was the factor that convinced me I needed a 
K3). The noise went away for a few months about the time I got my K3 so 
while I was pleased with how the K3 took care of the normal noise of the 
city I did not know how it would work if the noise came back. Last night 
I was working the Elecraft net on 20 meters and KD5ONS was coming in 
about S7 and about the best copy I have had on him in months. I turned 
on my IC-746PRO on 2 meters to check into the local 2 meter net and 
noticed the S meter sat at S9. I switched to AM and sure enough the bad 
line noise was back. I turned off the NB on the K3 and sure enough I 
could barely tell KD5ONS was in there as the S meter jumped to S8 and 
Kevin was only S7. I was running the K3 with PRE ON, ATT OFF,  DSP E3-4, 
IF MED3 and the default width  of 400 HZ with the 500 HZ roofing filter. 
With the NB ON the S meter would drop to S1 when there was a break in 
the action and I was copying stations down to S1 with no way to know 
there was any noise in the area. I sure made the right decision to buy 
the K3 as this noise problem was here all last summer and the K2 and 746 
just could not do anything about it. I have an MFJ-852 noise meter and 
thought the noise was from my own house but pulling all the AC fuses to 
the house and and running the rig on a battery showed no change. There 
are 8 of us on the transformer which is in my back yard so it could be 
coming from any one of my neighbors. At least I don't have to deal with 
it this year due to the fact the K3 does such a good job of getting rid 
of the noise. The 746 on 2 meters FM can only pick up the strongest 
stations when the noise is there and they have lots of noise on them 
unless the strength is over S9. This morning the noise is gone but that 
is the way it was last year too. I never figured out a pattern to the 
noise as some times it would come on for a few seconds and other times 
it would come on for hours at a time.


73

Ken W0CZ
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker sure does the job.

[Joseph M. Durnal]

I've noticed the same.  Since local noise that I can't cure (yeah, I
could write to the FCC, but I'm not supposed to have antennas anyway,
so they could just write tol the HOA) is my biggest problem, I want a
rig that will help me work through it.  I still have a lot of side by
side testing to do with the K3 and the FT-2000D, but my initial review
has really gone to the K3.

73 de Joseph Durnal NE3R

On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 8:41 AM, Kenneth A. Christiansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 I ordered my K3 in June of 2007 after a strong local noise level started at
 my Fargo ND QTH. (That was the factor that convinced me I needed a K3). The
 noise went away for a few months about the time I got my K3 so while I was
 pleased with how the K3 took care of the normal noise of the city I did not
 know how it would work if the noise came back. Last night I was working the
 Elecraft net on 20 meters and KD5ONS was coming in about S7 and about the
 best copy I have had on him in months. I turned on my IC-746PRO on 2 meters
 to check into the local 2 meter net and noticed the S meter sat at S9. I
 switched to AM and sure enough the bad line noise was back. I turned off the
 NB on the K3 and sure enough I could barely tell KD5ONS was in there as the
 S meter jumped to S8 and Kevin was only S7. I was running the K3 with PRE
 ON, ATT OFF,  DSP E3-4, IF MED3 and the default width  of 400 HZ with the
 500 HZ roofing filter. With the NB ON the S meter would drop to S1 when
 there was a break in the action and I was copying stations down to S1 with
 no way to know there was any noise in the area. I sure made the right
 decision to buy the K3 as this noise problem was here all last summer and
 the K2 and 746 just could not do anything about it. I have an MFJ-852 noise
 meter and thought the noise was from my own house but pulling all the AC
 fuses to the house and and running the rig on a battery showed no change.
 There are 8 of us on the transformer which is in my back yard so it could be
 coming from any one of my neighbors. At least I don't have to deal with it
 this year due to the fact the K3 does such a good job of getting rid of the
 noise. The 746 on 2 meters FM can only pick up the strongest stations when
 the noise is there and they have lots of noise on them unless the strength
 is over S9. This morning the noise is gone but that is the way it was last
 year too. I never figured out a pattern to the noise as some times it would
 come on for a few seconds and other times it would come on for hours at a
 time.

 73

 Ken W0CZ
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[Elecraft] K3 noise blanker sure does the job.

[Ken Kopp]

Hi Ken,

I used to be the line noise tech for my power company
employer ...

Touch lamps are a seldom-thought-of source of line noise.

Wall-warts, too.

73! Ken Kopp - K0PP
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker sure does the job.

[Brian Alsop]

Ken Kopp wrote:


Hi Ken,

I used to be the line noise tech for my power company
employer ...

Touch lamps are a seldom-thought-of source of line noise.

Wall-warts, too.

Walwarts of the future will most likely be a real pain.  I understand 
some legislation has required all of them to be switching in the near 
future.


73 de Brian/K3KO

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 noise blanker sure does the job.

[Vic K2VCO]

Brian Alsop wrote:

Walwarts of the future will most likely be a real pain.  I understand 
some legislation has required all of them to be switching in the near 
future.


I have a small halogen lamp which has a walwart that can be used as a 
noise generator for adjusting the filters in my K2. It produces a 
wideband hash that is perfect for this purpose. It is very loud in most 
of the HF spectrum. I have never heard a switcher make a noise like 
this; usually they make burbles, floaters, and digital tinkles.


Speaking of switchers, I once had an IC751 with a built-in AC supply, a 
switcher which was mounted in a flat shielded box on the bottom of the 
radio. There was a tinkling noise audible on all bands which drove me 
crazy. This was some years ago, and it didn't occur to me that it might 
be the power supply. I actually sent the radio to ICOM, and they 'fixed' 
several things but the noise remained.


Although I know switchers can be quiet -- especially when you are 
careful to use baluns, etc. on antennas to reduce local noise pickup -- 
I prefer an old heavy Astron linear supply in my shack.

--
73,
Vic, K2VCO
Fresno CA
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco
K2 no. 709
K3 no. 7
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