[Emc-users] Questions about your Stepper kit

[Tobias Gogolin]

Hello EMC users, I am new to this issue (have been lurking for a while) but
now plunged into the reality of having to (or wanting to) implement a EMC
based system, as the Torchmate Plasma Stepper Controller we had was stolen
by unqualified hand...

I am wondering if this type of  kit will work with the EMC software?
http://cgi.ebay.com/4Axis-Nema-23-Stepper-Motor-425oz-in-CNC-Mill-Control-/140572552311?_trksid=p4340.m185&_trkparms=algo%3DSIC.OPJS%26its%3DI%26itu%3DUA%26otn%3D5%26pmod%3D140580740359%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D1714182468467345141#ht_3275wt_1139

I'm not related to this seller, nor trying to promote their product, I'm
open to hear about better matches or whatever else I should consider! The
nice thing is that for what we have been quoted to replace the stolen
hardware from torchmate alone we can more than replace the hardware, we can
also greatly expand the capabilities of the table for example :
-THC (torch height control)
-4th axis for cutting pipes
-Sheetcam software
-flexibility of open source
-ability to set up other tools (routers)
-learning something new!

Thanks for any responses!

P.S.: I was going to attach a file describing this seller parallel port
module, but apparently  the list is not configured for that!
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Re: [Emc-users] ntp status exit 1 when updateing, what is that telling me?

[gene heskett]

On Saturday, July 30, 2011 11:28:02 PM Kent A. Reed did opine:

> On 7/30/2011 1:58 PM, gene heskett wrote:
> > Greetings all;
> > 
> > 
> > But for several months, despite the fact that ntpd is running just
> > fine, any update done finishes with the updater showing that ntp
> > exited with a status 1.  This is regardless of whether anything to do
> > with ntp was updated or not.
> > 
> > Does anyone know what that is all about?
> > 
> > Cheers, gene
> 
> I don't have the answer, but when I enter "ubuntu updater ntp exit
> status 1" into, say, the Google search engine, I get a ton of hits.
> Apparently you are in good company.
> 
> Regards,
> Kent
> 
I am on this list Kent, and that is always good company.  :)

Cheers, gene
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Re: [Emc-users] bad news, xylotex died

[gene heskett]

On Saturday, July 30, 2011 11:20:01 PM R. van Twisk did opine:

> Gene,
> 
> I am pretty sure they have a 4A and a higher version of it, not
> only 2amp at 40VDC
> 
> I never used them myself, but I here they where cheap and pretty
> reliable. This guy didn't put them on his 34HS9802 (Nema 42), but in a
> box with some additional cooling.
> 
As was my 4 axis xylotex, in a box that exactly fit a pair of ball bearing 
psu fans, one in each end, one sucking in and one blowing out the other 
end.  With 19 volts on those fans, they fairly screamed, so the xylotex was 
probably getting 4 or 5x its recommended airflow.  And the fans were still 
screaming when I heard the pops of the A-3977's blowing their heat sinks 
off in response to my tapping the -> arrow key on the keyboard.

That is 3 times now for the A-3977, next...

> Ries
> 
> On Jul 30, 2011, at 6:15 PM, gene heskett wrote:
> > On Saturday, July 30, 2011 06:41:18 PM R. van Twisk did opine:
> >> Gene,
> >> 
> >> I don't have experience with the G540, I am using the Vampire series
> >> which are a great set of drivers but they are not faultless!! But
> >> there return and support on broken drivers are very good.
> >> 
> >> I did hear some good news from the UIM 2400xx series www.uirobot.com
> >> I know a couple of guys using them on there mechmates without issues.
> >> 
> >> Ries
> > 
> > That looks like a backwards step, only 2 amps, generally designed for
> > nema 17 motors I assume.
> > 
> > I just found this one, doesn't look too bad.
> > 
> >  > V-48V-/120755603538?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c1d984852>
> > 
> > Upto 64 microsteps, current turndown when quiet.  I am tempted to
> > order 5 so I have a spare, at 10 bucks more than the G540.  4.2 amps,
> > 48 volt maximum.
> > 
> > And I just did, but it will be about 2 weeks free delivery from China.
> > 
> > Or, speak of el-cheapo, 70 bucks for what looks like that's about what
> > its worth:
> > 
> >  > -Board-/130532324742?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e64553586>
> > 
> > Nice fan cooled heat sink, but that chip doesn't impress me too much.
> > And its not a step up, 3 amps 36 volts, about the same as the Allegro
> > A3977 but all 4 in one package.  The 2M542 is a step up, allowing me
> > to raise the motor voltage if I am so inclined.
> > 
> > Cheers, gene
> 
> 
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Cheers, gene
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
You scratch my tape, and I'll scratch yours.

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Re: [Emc-users] ntp status exit 1 when updateing, what is that telling me?

[Kent A. Reed]

On 7/30/2011 1:58 PM, gene heskett wrote:
> Greetings all;
>
> 
> But for several months, despite the fact that ntpd is running just fine,
> any update done finishes with the updater showing that ntp exited with a
> status 1.  This is regardless of whether anything to do with ntp was
> updated or not.
>
> Does anyone know what that is all about?
>
> Cheers, gene
I don't have the answer, but when I enter "ubuntu updater ntp exit 
status 1" into, say, the Google search engine, I get a ton of hits. 
Apparently you are in good company.

Regards,
Kent


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Re: [Emc-users] bad news, xylotex died

[gene heskett]

On Saturday, July 30, 2011 07:51:03 PM Steve Stallings did opine:

> In general, the G540 has a good reputation.
> Unlike Xylotex, Geckodrive will repair
> their products, usually for free.
> 
> The speed and power of your motors will
> improve noticably.
> 
> The G540 does have one design quirk. The
> inputs are optocouplers driven from just
> the power of the parallel port buffers.
> This works OK for motherboard ports that
> can be put into EPP mode, but may cause
> issues with PCI based cards if you cannot
> convince them to run in EPP mode. The
> difference is that EPP mode drives the
> control signals (as opposed to data ones)
> using a totem pole with active pull up.
> Non-EPP mode uses a passive 4.7K pull up
> typically and the G540 does not work well
> with that. In particular the "charge pump"
> will fail to operate, but I suspect the
> same issue applies to the other 3 control
> pins.
> 
> I seem to remember you using a PMDX-106

Yes, works great.

> for spindle control. Interfacing that to
> the G540 could be interesting. You may be
> able to do without it entirely as the G540
> includes an isolated analog output and two
> open collector relay drivers. Some rewiring
> will be needed, but it should be workable.

That will bear looking into, but it seems the BOB should allow me to 
continue to use the setup I have.  I didn't get the g540, but 5 each of a 
slightly higher powered Chinese one per motor kit. $50.99 a channel.  Free 
ship.  One is a spare.  Hopefully I'll only blow 1 at a time.  :(

> Regards,
> Steve Stallings
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: gene heskett [mailto:ghesk...@wdtv.com]
> Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2011 4:51 PM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: [Emc-users] bad news, xylotex died
> 
> Greetings all;
> 
> My xylotex went pop,pop,pop when I hit the keyboard for a x move about 2
> hours ago.  Also the odor of burnt parts was in the air.
> 
> So, since this will be the 3rd xylotex to expire on me, I am inclined to
> look elsewhere for the next set of drivers.
> 
> Looking at the Gecko G540, which isn't that much bigger, but would allow
> me to raise the motor voltage about 20 volts above what I have now. 
> Its a package that puts 4 each 50 volt, 3.5 amp, 10 microstep G250's in
> an easily mountable package.  I see I can get it for $242 + ship, which
> is more than the xylotex.
> 
> What has been the general experience of this group with the G540?
> 
> Cheers, gene


Cheers, gene
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Chicken Little was right.

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Re: [Emc-users] bad news, xylotex died

[R. van Twisk]

Gene,

I am pretty sure they have a 4A and a higher version of it, not
only 2amp at 40VDC

I never used them myself, but I here they where cheap and pretty reliable.
This guy didn't put them on his 34HS9802 (Nema 42), but in a box with some
additional cooling.

Ries

On Jul 30, 2011, at 6:15 PM, gene heskett wrote:

> On Saturday, July 30, 2011 06:41:18 PM R. van Twisk did opine:
> 
>> Gene,
>> 
>> I don't have experience with the G540, I am using the Vampire series
>> which are a great set of drivers but they are not faultless!! But there
>> return and support on broken drivers are very good.
>> 
>> I did hear some good news from the UIM 2400xx series www.uirobot.com
>> I know a couple of guys using them on there mechmates without issues.
>> 
>> Ries
>> 
> That looks like a backwards step, only 2 amps, generally designed for 
> nema 17 motors I assume.
> 
> I just found this one, doesn't look too bad.
> 
> 
> 
> Upto 64 microsteps, current turndown when quiet.  I am tempted to order 
> 5 so I have a spare, at 10 bucks more than the G540.  4.2 amps, 48 volt 
> maximum.
> 
> And I just did, but it will be about 2 weeks free delivery from China.
> 
> Or, speak of el-cheapo, 70 bucks for what looks like that's about what 
> its worth:
> 
> 
> 
> Nice fan cooled heat sink, but that chip doesn't impress me too much.
> And its not a step up, 3 amps 36 volts, about the same as the Allegro 
> A3977 but all 4 in one package.  The 2M542 is a step up, allowing me 
> to raise the motor voltage if I am so inclined.
> 
> Cheers, gene
> -- 
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> Rune's Rule:
>   If you don't care where you are, you ain't lost.
> 
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Re: [Emc-users] bad news, xylotex died

[gene heskett]

On Saturday, July 30, 2011 07:38:21 PM Steve Blackmore did opine:

> On Sat, 30 Jul 2011 17:50:31 -0400, you wrote:
> >Greetings all;
> >
> >My xylotex went pop,pop,pop when I hit the keyboard for a x move about
> >2 hours ago.  Also the odor of burnt parts was in the air.
> >
> >So, since this will be the 3rd xylotex to expire on me, I am inclined
> >to look elsewhere for the next set of drivers.
> 
> Hi Gene
> 
> An all too common occurrence with Xylotex drives! Exceed 30V at your
> peril, reach 35V and they always go pop.
> 
Humm, 27.5 is what I have measured several times.  The supply is not 
regulated as its a huge old boat anchor made out of an old Ampex 2" vcr 
power supply.  Weighs about 30 lbs.  Its filtering is a pi section with an 
unk inductance in the middle of a pair of 75,000 uf caps.  Those caps are 
about the size of an old 'telephone' battery & in 50+ years I have yet to 
see one of those actually fail!  But I will scope it before I hook the new 
drives up, there is always a first time.  :)

All Electronics, in the event its miss-behaving, has some 9.5 amp, 28 volt 
switchers for a good price that might make a good replacement IF it will 
behave in the presence of all the noise from these drives.  I have NOT had 
real great luck with that however.  They do not like to absorb the motors 
circulating currents and may go into an over voltage shutdown.

> >Looking at the Gecko G540, which isn't that much bigger, but would
> >allow me to raise the motor voltage about 20 volts above what I have
> >now.  Its a package that puts 4 each 50 volt, 3.5 amp, 10 microstep
> >G250's in an easily mountable package.  I see I can get it for $242 +
> >ship, which is more than the xylotex.
> >
> >What has been the general experience of this group with the G540?
> 
> I've no personal experience of them but heard no complaints on the Mach
> group or elsewhere. Even if you manage to blow one up, send it back
> Geckodrive will fix it for free ;)
> 
> Steve Blackmore

Something to be said for that, I doubt this company will.  That is why I 
bought an extra, insurance. ;-)

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> 
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Cheers, gene
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Nice guys finish last.
-- Leo Durocher

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Re: [Emc-users] bad news, xylotex died

[gene heskett]

On Saturday, July 30, 2011 07:33:20 PM Jon Elson did opine:

> gene heskett wrote:
> > What has been the general experience of this group with the G540?
> 
> I can't specifically comment on the 540, but I have used the G251 drives
> that are part
> of the 540 package, and they seem to be just as good as the earlier G201
> drives.
> It is pretty rare to let the smoke out of these drives without a serious
> problem like a
> shorted motor.
> 
> Jon
> 
Thanks Jon.  I think I made a slight step upwards to another driver I 
found, see prev. msg., to 48 volts & 4.2 amps, which should be a lot more 
safety margin if I duplicate the settings.  I ordered 5 of them so I have a 
spare.

Cheers, gene
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
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New Hampshire law forbids you to tap your feet, nod your head, or in
any way keep time to the music in a tavern, restaurant, or cafe.

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Re: [Emc-users] ntp status exit 1 when updateing, what is that telling me?

[gene heskett]

On Saturday, July 30, 2011 07:16:16 PM Jon Elson did opine:

> gene heskett wrote:
> > Greetings all;
> > 
> > emc, on 10.04 LTS.
> > 
> > I just was greeted by an update request when I turned on the monitor,
> > so 2 sessions later it has done all the recommended up dates
> > including an as yet un-executed emc, and its rebooting now.  Logged
> > in via ssh -Y still doesn't work, but emc signed on as EMC2 -
> > 2.4.6-76-gf8ea663, not revalent to this that I know of.
> > 
> > But for several months, despite the fact that ntpd is running just
> > fine, any update done finishes with the updater showing that ntp
> > exited with a status 1.  This is regardless of whether anything to do
> > with ntp was updated or not.
> > 
> > Does anyone know what that is all about?
> > 
> > Cheers, gene
> 
> I have never gotten NTP to work reliably on a real-time system.  Of
> course, I am no expert,
> so it may be a setup problem.  But, I can imagine that the time
> correction used by NTP could
> cause real problems to a real time program, so RTAI may defeat the
> adjustments.

I can appreciate that, but when emc nor rtai are not running? It is ATM, 
and I just did an ./ntp restart to see if any errors came out, there were 
none, and the date on that box is to the second synced with this box.

So I don't /think/ that is the problem.  ntp these days may do a crash set 
call to ntpdate at bootup on most systems, but IIRC it now uses a similar 
call to what 'adjtimex' does, which diddles the count per second, which if 
the mobo crystal is on spec, 1/sec.  I have had mobo's that I had to 
set it for 9998 in order to get it within reach of ntp keeping it there.  
But ntpd itself is now using a wider ranging method albeit it is still 
tuning the oscillator by only 1% maybe.  Its control hasn't had discrete 
time jumps in 2 or 3 years now.

I think the point is that when the updater runs, it apparently must be 
doing something that I, as root, cannot trigger in normal use, so I am 
inclined to point fingers at the updater, not ntpd.
 
> Jon
> 
> 
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Cheers, gene
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
The trouble with heart disease is that the first symptom is often hard to
deal with: death.
-- Michael Phelps

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Re: [Emc-users] bad news, xylotex died

[Steve Blackmore]

On Sat, 30 Jul 2011 17:50:31 -0400, you wrote:

>Greetings all;
>
>My xylotex went pop,pop,pop when I hit the keyboard for a x move about 2 
>hours ago.  Also the odor of burnt parts was in the air.
>
>So, since this will be the 3rd xylotex to expire on me, I am inclined to 
>look elsewhere for the next set of drivers.

Hi Gene

An all too common occurrence with Xylotex drives! Exceed 30V at your
peril, reach 35V and they always go pop.

>Looking at the Gecko G540, which isn't that much bigger, but would allow me 
>to raise the motor voltage about 20 volts above what I have now.  Its a 
>package that puts 4 each 50 volt, 3.5 amp, 10 microstep G250's in an easily 
>mountable package.  I see I can get it for $242 + ship, which is more than 
>the xylotex.
>
>What has been the general experience of this group with the G540?

I've no personal experience of them but heard no complaints on the Mach
group or elsewhere. Even if you manage to blow one up, send it back
Geckodrive will fix it for free ;)

Steve Blackmore
--

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Re: [Emc-users] bad news, xylotex died

[gene heskett]

On Saturday, July 30, 2011 06:41:18 PM R. van Twisk did opine:

> Gene,
> 
> I don't have experience with the G540, I am using the Vampire series
> which are a great set of drivers but they are not faultless!! But there
> return and support on broken drivers are very good.
> 
> I did hear some good news from the UIM 2400xx series www.uirobot.com
> I know a couple of guys using them on there mechmates without issues.
> 
> Ries
> 
That looks like a backwards step, only 2 amps, generally designed for 
nema 17 motors I assume.

I just found this one, doesn't look too bad.



Upto 64 microsteps, current turndown when quiet.  I am tempted to order 
5 so I have a spare, at 10 bucks more than the G540.  4.2 amps, 48 volt 
maximum.

And I just did, but it will be about 2 weeks free delivery from China.

Or, speak of el-cheapo, 70 bucks for what looks like that's about what 
its worth:



Nice fan cooled heat sink, but that chip doesn't impress me too much.
And its not a step up, 3 amps 36 volts, about the same as the Allegro 
A3977 but all 4 in one package.  The 2M542 is a step up, allowing me 
to raise the motor voltage if I am so inclined.

Cheers, gene
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Rune's Rule:
If you don't care where you are, you ain't lost.

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Re: [Emc-users] Trying to understand EMC's operation

[Steve Blackmore]

On Sat, 30 Jul 2011 13:30:25 -0500, you wrote:

>I remember that the developers at one point changed the way g64px.xxx worked 
>so that it actually converted arcs to short line segments so the combining of 
>line segments worked for the arcs also.  
>
>but that is just a vauge recolection.

An odd solution, maybe that now explains the following

"G64 P- Q- it turns on the "naive cam detector"; when there are a series
of linear XYZ feed moves at the same feed rate that are less than Q-
away from being collinear, they are collapsed into a single linear move.
On G2/3 moves in the G17 (XY) plane when the maximum deviation of an arc
from a straight line is less than the G64 P- tolerance the arc is broken
into two lines (from start of arc to midpoint, and from midpoint to
end). those lines are then subject to the naive cam algorithm for
lines."

However, It still doesn't explain why the huge slowdowns on just G64
moves!

"G64 without P means to keep the best speed possible, no matter how far
away from the programmed point you end up."

Just ran it again in Mach and EMC, in Mach commanded feed was 3600
mm/min, it never dropped below 3500.

In EMC it only reached 3500 or over on ten short occasions or so
throughout the whole file. The rest of the time it was accelerating and
decelerating wildly and never getting to anything like maximum velocity,
despite both having same motor tuning parameters and pulse widths etc.  

Clearly - it's not doing what the manual says it does in G64 mode.

Something for the developers to look at.

Steve Blackmore
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Re: [Emc-users] bad news, xylotex died

[Jon Elson]

gene heskett wrote:
> What has been the general experience of this group with the G540?
>   
I can't specifically comment on the 540, but I have used the G251 drives 
that are part
of the 540 package, and they seem to be just as good as the earlier G201 
drives.
It is pretty rare to let the smoke out of these drives without a serious 
problem like a
shorted motor.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Trying to understand EMC's operation

[Jon Elson]

Steve Blackmore wrote:
>
> Further testing would be helpful to see if it's only stepper systems or
> that servo systems see the same slow downs.
>
> The burning problem is because the spindle speed and feed are optimised
> for cutting at 3200 mm/min as per cutter manufacturers spec. (It's an
> 8mm diameter 2 flute down spiral end mill) They recommend 6 - 7m/min at
> 2 rpm. I can't do 6m/min so have to slow spindle down to 12000 or
> so. Feed is slowing to 400mm in parts, hence the burning.
>
> If anybody wants the full file to test email me and I'll send it to you
Well, I guess I could try it, but I certainly don't have any machine 
that can run at this
speed.  I don't know if that would make any difference.  I do have two 
servo-controlled machines
that do not have any steps in the system anywhere.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] ntp status exit 1 when updateing, what is that telling me?

[Jon Elson]

gene heskett wrote:
> Greetings all;
>
> emc, on 10.04 LTS.
>
> I just was greeted by an update request when I turned on the monitor, so 2 
> sessions later it has done all the recommended up dates including an as yet 
> un-executed emc, and its rebooting now.  Logged in via ssh -Y still doesn't 
> work, but emc signed on as EMC2 - 2.4.6-76-gf8ea663, not revalent to this 
> that I know of.
>
> But for several months, despite the fact that ntpd is running just fine, 
> any update done finishes with the updater showing that ntp exited with a 
> status 1.  This is regardless of whether anything to do with ntp was 
> updated or not.
>
> Does anyone know what that is all about?
>
> Cheers, gene
>   
I have never gotten NTP to work reliably on a real-time system.  Of 
course, I am no expert,
so it may be a setup problem.  But, I can imagine that the time 
correction used by NTP could
cause real problems to a real time program, so RTAI may defeat the 
adjustments.


Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] bad news, xylotex died

[Steve Stallings]

In general, the G540 has a good reputation.
Unlike Xylotex, Geckodrive will repair
their products, usually for free.

The speed and power of your motors will
improve noticably.

The G540 does have one design quirk. The
inputs are optocouplers driven from just
the power of the parallel port buffers.
This works OK for motherboard ports that
can be put into EPP mode, but may cause
issues with PCI based cards if you cannot
convince them to run in EPP mode. The 
difference is that EPP mode drives the
control signals (as opposed to data ones)
using a totem pole with active pull up.
Non-EPP mode uses a passive 4.7K pull up
typically and the G540 does not work well
with that. In particular the "charge pump"
will fail to operate, but I suspect the
same issue applies to the other 3 control
pins.

I seem to remember you using a PMDX-106
for spindle control. Interfacing that to
the G540 could be interesting. You may be
able to do without it entirely as the G540
includes an isolated analog output and two
open collector relay drivers. Some rewiring
will be needed, but it should be workable.

Regards,
Steve Stallings 

-Original Message-
From: gene heskett [mailto:ghesk...@wdtv.com] 
Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2011 4:51 PM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
Subject: [Emc-users] bad news, xylotex died

Greetings all;

My xylotex went pop,pop,pop when I hit the keyboard for a x move about 2 
hours ago.  Also the odor of burnt parts was in the air.

So, since this will be the 3rd xylotex to expire on me, I am inclined to 
look elsewhere for the next set of drivers.

Looking at the Gecko G540, which isn't that much bigger, but would allow me 
to raise the motor voltage about 20 volts above what I have now.  Its a 
package that puts 4 each 50 volt, 3.5 amp, 10 microstep G250's in an easily 
mountable package.  I see I can get it for $242 + ship, which is more than 
the xylotex.

What has been the general experience of this group with the G540?

Cheers, gene
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Be not anxious about what you have, but about what you are.
-- Pope St. Gregory I


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Re: [Emc-users] bad news, xylotex died

[R. van Twisk]

Gene,

I don't have experience with the G540, I am using the Vampire series
which are a great set of drivers but they are not faultless!! But there
return and support on broken drivers are very good.

I did hear some good news from the UIM 2400xx series www.uirobot.com 
I know a couple of guys using them on there mechmates without issues.

Ries



On Jul 30, 2011, at 4:50 PM, gene heskett wrote:

> Greetings all;
> 
> My xylotex went pop,pop,pop when I hit the keyboard for a x move about 2 
> hours ago.  Also the odor of burnt parts was in the air.
> 
> So, since this will be the 3rd xylotex to expire on me, I am inclined to 
> look elsewhere for the next set of drivers.
> 
> Looking at the Gecko G540, which isn't that much bigger, but would allow me 
> to raise the motor voltage about 20 volts above what I have now.  Its a 
> package that puts 4 each 50 volt, 3.5 amp, 10 microstep G250's in an easily 
> mountable package.  I see I can get it for $242 + ship, which is more than 
> the xylotex.
> 
> What has been the general experience of this group with the G540?
> 
> Cheers, gene
> -- 
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> Be not anxious about what you have, but about what you are.
>   -- Pope St. Gregory I
> 
> --
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[Emc-users] bad news, xylotex died

[gene heskett]

Greetings all;

My xylotex went pop,pop,pop when I hit the keyboard for a x move about 2 
hours ago.  Also the odor of burnt parts was in the air.

So, since this will be the 3rd xylotex to expire on me, I am inclined to 
look elsewhere for the next set of drivers.

Looking at the Gecko G540, which isn't that much bigger, but would allow me 
to raise the motor voltage about 20 volts above what I have now.  Its a 
package that puts 4 each 50 volt, 3.5 amp, 10 microstep G250's in an easily 
mountable package.  I see I can get it for $242 + ship, which is more than 
the xylotex.

What has been the general experience of this group with the G540?

Cheers, gene
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Be not anxious about what you have, but about what you are.
-- Pope St. Gregory I

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Re: [Emc-users] Feed per rev (g95)

[Karl Cunningham]

I don't know if you're still trying to figure this out.

What was the encoder scale set to and how many pulses per rev does the 
encoder put out. If you're using a quadrature encoder with 250 
pulses/rev, the scale should be 16.67 = (250 pulses/rev) * (4 
quadrature counts per pulse) / (60 RPM/RPS).

Karl


sa...@empirescreen.com wrote:
> Well - I gave up trying to figure it out and scaled the velocity from
> the encoder counter by 16.66 and now it read correctly.  So -
> boring at 300RPM and .001 IPR gives me .3IPM which seems right.
> 
> Awesome - now when I slow the spindle rpm - the IPM slows also.
> (taking the same cut at .001 per rev)


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Re: [Emc-users] Trying to understand EMC's operation

[samco]

I remember that the developers at one point changed the way g64px.xxx worked so 
that it actually converted arcs to short line segments so the combining of line 
segments worked for the arcs also.  

but that is just a vauge recolection.

sam

On Sat, 30 Jul 2011 19:12:52 +0100
 Steve Blackmore  wrote:
> On Sat, 30 Jul 2011 11:12:54 -0500, you wrote:
> 
> >Steve Blackmore wrote:
> >>
> >> Thanks for testing - Looks like you found it, it does appear to be some
> >> trajectory planner bug on transition from lines to curves/curves to
> >> lines.
> >>
> >> I tested the code on some mdf,  I'm glad it was only a test and not an
> >> expensive piece of wood, the cutter left burn marks on some of the
> >> slowdowns :(
> >>   
> >Can we get more specific?  What version are you running?  I pretty much 
> >only have
> >built from source versions of EMC here, but would be willing to run some 
> >tests if it
> >would help.
> 
> Hi Jon
> 
> Version is 2.4.6
> 
> Further testing would be helpful to see if it's only stepper systems or
> that servo systems see the same slow downs.
> 
> The burning problem is because the spindle speed and feed are optimised
> for cutting at 3200 mm/min as per cutter manufacturers spec. (It's an
> 8mm diameter 2 flute down spiral end mill) They recommend 6 - 7m/min at
> 2 rpm. I can't do 6m/min so have to slow spindle down to 12000 or
> so. Feed is slowing to 400mm in parts, hence the burning.
> 
> If anybody wants the full file to test email me and I'll send it to you.
> Thanks
> 
> Steve Blackmore
> --
> 
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Re: [Emc-users] Trying to understand EMC's operation

[Steve Blackmore]

On Sat, 30 Jul 2011 11:12:54 -0500, you wrote:

>Steve Blackmore wrote:
>>
>> Thanks for testing - Looks like you found it, it does appear to be some
>> trajectory planner bug on transition from lines to curves/curves to
>> lines.
>>
>> I tested the code on some mdf,  I'm glad it was only a test and not an
>> expensive piece of wood, the cutter left burn marks on some of the
>> slowdowns :(
>>   
>Can we get more specific?  What version are you running?  I pretty much 
>only have
>built from source versions of EMC here, but would be willing to run some 
>tests if it
>would help.

Hi Jon

Version is 2.4.6

Further testing would be helpful to see if it's only stepper systems or
that servo systems see the same slow downs.

The burning problem is because the spindle speed and feed are optimised
for cutting at 3200 mm/min as per cutter manufacturers spec. (It's an
8mm diameter 2 flute down spiral end mill) They recommend 6 - 7m/min at
2 rpm. I can't do 6m/min so have to slow spindle down to 12000 or
so. Feed is slowing to 400mm in parts, hence the burning.

If anybody wants the full file to test email me and I'll send it to you.
Thanks

Steve Blackmore
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[Emc-users] ntp status exit 1 when updateing, what is that telling me?

[gene heskett]

Greetings all;

emc, on 10.04 LTS.

I just was greeted by an update request when I turned on the monitor, so 2 
sessions later it has done all the recommended up dates including an as yet 
un-executed emc, and its rebooting now.  Logged in via ssh -Y still doesn't 
work, but emc signed on as EMC2 - 2.4.6-76-gf8ea663, not revalent to this 
that I know of.

But for several months, despite the fact that ntpd is running just fine, 
any update done finishes with the updater showing that ntp exited with a 
status 1.  This is regardless of whether anything to do with ntp was 
updated or not.

Does anyone know what that is all about?

Cheers, gene
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
In the misfortune of our friends we find something that is not displeasing
to us.
-- La Rochefoucauld, "Maxims"

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Re: [Emc-users] Using a PC in extended temperature ranges and mobile application

[dave]

On Sat, 2011-07-30 at 11:23 -0400, Matt Shaver wrote:
> On Sun, 17 Jul 2011 06:35:22 -0400
> Dave  wrote:
> 
> > Does anyone have any experience in testing for condensation issues?
> 
> I operate a couple of 802.11 wireless access points outdoors, year
> round. They supply my internet service, so they are "mission critical".
> I'm in Maryland, so temps range from +100F to perhaps -20F and humidity
> from almost 0 to 100%. These devices are in regular PVC electrical
> enclosures and I've never had condensation problems. I've lost lots to
> springtime lightning though :)
> 
> Just to add my anecdote to the pile...
> 
> Thanks,
> Matt

Thinking in terms of regular steel outside boxes (or Al) the
conductivity and specific heat of PVC is going to be somewhat different.
However anything that survives your temps with almost 4" of rain a month
has to have something going for it. That much rain is half a years worth
here. ;-)

current temp 77 with 36% humidity going to 88/21. Dewpoint 46. 

Dave


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Re: [Emc-users] Feed per rev (g95)

[samco]

Well - I gave up trying to figure it out and scaled the velocity from the 
encoder counter by 16.66 and now it read correctly.  So - boring at 300RPM 
and .001 IPR gives me .3IPM which seems right. 

Awesome - now when I slow the spindle rpm - the IPM slows also.  (taking the 
same cut at .001 per rev)  

:)

sam

On Sat, 30 Jul 2011 02:07:46 +0100
 Andy Pugh  wrote:
> 
> 
> On 29 Jul 2011, at 21:32, sam sokolik  wrote:
> 
> > just thought I would hook motion.spindle-speed-in to**the velocity 
> > output from the spindle encoder that I am using for rigid tapping.  
> 
> Not answering the question, but I think G95 uses spindle position, not 
> velocity. 
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Re: [Emc-users] (EMC USERS) Adding parallel port

[schoone...@tiscali.co.uk]

;Could you tell what I need to do to make pins 2 to 9 act correctly on the
additional parports too.

As suggested, it is the type of card
that matters.
I found that newer NetMOS chipped cards work, 9865 chip or newer springs to 
mind .
Google the forum it is all fully discussed there.

regards



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Re: [Emc-users] Trying to understand EMC's operation

[Jon Elson]

Steve Blackmore wrote:
>
> Thanks for testing - Looks like you found it, it does appear to be some
> trajectory planner bug on transition from lines to curves/curves to
> lines.
>
> I tested the code on some mdf,  I'm glad it was only a test and not an
> expensive piece of wood, the cutter left burn marks on some of the
> slowdowns :(
>   
Can we get more specific?  What version are you running?  I pretty much 
only have
built from source versions of EMC here, but would be willing to run some 
tests if it
would help.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Adding parallel port

[Jon Elson]

Viesturs Lācis wrote:
> 2011/7/30 gene heskett :
>   
>> I believe EPP is the magic acronym.
>> 
>
> EPP mode is only for communication with external I/O hardware, like Mesa 
> cards.
> Farzin, You should check, if that add-in card supports data input on pins 2-9.
> AFAIK not all do.
>   
Pico Systems boards also need the EPP mode. But Viesturs is right, EPP 
is NOT needed for
general purpose I/O for auxiliary control, step pulse output and similar 
connections.
It would be quite surprising if anything with a PCI connection did not 
support bidirectional
mode. It is possible that some oddball brand might not use the standard 
register layout
for controlling the input/output mode selection. It is also possible 
that some boards, when in
EPP mode, may ignore the in/out command bit, so you should set the board 
for PS/2 (bidir)
mode. How to set PCI plug-in boards for a default mode varies by make. 
Some have an
EPROM on the board that can be set by a program (like SIIG).

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Adding parallel port

[Kirk Wallace]

On Sat, 2011-07-30 at 16:34 +0430, Farzin Kamangar wrote:
> Hello EMC users,
> I have difficulty when adding additional parallel ports (other than the
> parallel port on mother board) and configuring them as input. When I monitor
> the pins 2 to 9 they are
> always off, but the pins 10 or 11 are on.

If the parallel port in question indicates that ECP, EPP or
Bi-directional is supported, then my guess is that input on pins 2-9
should work. One problem might be that for input, you may need a pull up
resistor on each input pin to pull the pin up to 3 or 5 volts. Then have
your input device sink the pin to ground for the active state. Most PCI
cards I have seen are 5 volt compatible. Size the resistors to be
greater than the sinking current limit of the input device, so the
device will not try to sink more current than it can handle (V=IxR, ie
5=.003xR or 5/.003 = 1.6kOhms). The parallel port input pin should not
sink or source much current, but you may need to use diodes to protect
against reverse voltage (series blocking) and/or over voltages or spikes
(Zener shunt). I am not an expert on this so the above should just give
you a start on do your own research. These links might be handy:
http://www.beyondlogic.org/spp/parallel.htm 
http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?EMC2_Supported_Hardware 
   (See section "PCI and PCIe Parallel Port Cards")

Posting more details of your parallel port card and what it is connected
too, might help us to give better advise too.

-- 
Kirk Wallace
http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/
http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/index.html
California, USA


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Re: [Emc-users] Using a PC in extended temperature ranges and mobile application

[Matt Shaver]

On Sun, 17 Jul 2011 06:35:22 -0400
Dave  wrote:

> Does anyone have any experience in testing for condensation issues?

I operate a couple of 802.11 wireless access points outdoors, year
round. They supply my internet service, so they are "mission critical".
I'm in Maryland, so temps range from +100F to perhaps -20F and humidity
from almost 0 to 100%. These devices are in regular PVC electrical
enclosures and I've never had condensation problems. I've lost lots to
springtime lightning though :)

Just to add my anecdote to the pile...

Thanks,
Matt

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Re: [Emc-users] Trying to understand EMC's operation

[gene heskett]

On Saturday, July 30, 2011 11:21:40 AM Steve Blackmore did opine:

> On Fri, 29 Jul 2011 15:31:49 -0500, you wrote:
> >All,
> >
> >I have a dual boot computer configured with both Windows/Mach and
> >Linux/EMC2.4.6.  I ran Steve's code on both systems and the problem
> >that he describes is evident when running the code on EMC, but not on
> >Mach.
> >
> >To answer Jon's question:
> >>   Does it start out running well, but then the slowdown develops
> >>   later in the part program?
> >
> >No - The problem is apparent at the first G2 move.  The machine appears
> >to change feedrate between G2 and G1 moves.  Moving from one G2 line
> >to another G2 line is smooth, and moving  from one G1 line to another
> >G1 line is smooth.  G1 moves appear to run at around 60% of the
> >feedrate of the G2 moves, so the transition from G1 to G2 (or G2 to
> >G1) makes the machine seem erratic.  If I slow the feedrate down, the
> >problem persists.
> >
> >My test machine is a stepper machine - the change in feedrate is even
> >more noticeable because of the change in pitch at different motor
> >speeds.  I don't think that this is a processor power issue, as I can
> >reproduce it even after deleting all but the first 6 lines of motion
> >code (leaving the safety block).
> 
> Hi Rogge
> 
> Thanks for testing - Looks like you found it, it does appear to be some
> trajectory planner bug on transition from lines to curves/curves to
> lines.
> 
> I tested the code on some mdf,  I'm glad it was only a test and not an
> expensive piece of wood, the cutter left burn marks on some of the
> slowdowns :(

Sounds like I should be careful then, as I made a vice to hold a gun stock 
yesterday, and am about to do the grosser parts of carving the bedding 
channel for a BP action.  These cuts will be 'out of sight' and generally 
straight line in maple & a cherry forearm cap, but still...

> Steve Blackmore
> --
> 
> 
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Cheers, gene
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Re: [Emc-users] Trying to understand EMC's operation

[Steve Blackmore]

On Fri, 29 Jul 2011 08:53:57 -0400, you wrote:

>I loaded this into a 2.4 system that I use to test Gcode.  It ran just 
>like my other programs run.This system is not hooked up to any 
>motors at the moment, but I don't see anything abnormal.
>
>Does the velocity shown on the display drop off when it "almost stops" 
>at the end of each block?  Or is the velocity jumping around?

The velocity varies by a large amount, unfortunately more than enough to
cause burn marks on some of the slow downs.

Steve Blackmore
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Re: [Emc-users] Trying to understand EMC's operation

[Steve Blackmore]

On Fri, 29 Jul 2011 15:31:49 -0500, you wrote:

>All,
>
>I have a dual boot computer configured with both Windows/Mach and 
>Linux/EMC2.4.6.  I ran Steve's code on both systems and the problem that he 
>describes is evident when running the code on EMC, but not on Mach.
>
>To answer Jon's question:
>
>>   Does it start out running well, but then the slowdown develops later in 
>> the part program?
>
>No - The problem is apparent at the first G2 move.  The machine appears to 
>change feedrate between G2 and G1 moves.  Moving from one G2 line to another 
>G2 line is smooth, and moving  from one G1 line to another G1 line is smooth.  
>G1 moves appear to run at around 60% of the feedrate of the G2 moves, so the 
>transition from G1 to G2 (or G2 to G1) makes the machine seem erratic.  If I 
>slow the feedrate down, the problem persists.
>
>My test machine is a stepper machine - the change in feedrate is even more 
>noticeable because of the change in pitch at different motor speeds.  I don't 
>think that this is a processor power issue, as I can reproduce it even after 
>deleting all but the first 6 lines of motion code (leaving the safety block).
>
Hi Rogge

Thanks for testing - Looks like you found it, it does appear to be some
trajectory planner bug on transition from lines to curves/curves to
lines.

I tested the code on some mdf,  I'm glad it was only a test and not an
expensive piece of wood, the cutter left burn marks on some of the
slowdowns :(

Steve Blackmore
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Re: [Emc-users] Adding parallel port

[Viesturs Lācis]

2011/7/30 gene heskett :
>
> I believe EPP is the magic acronym.

EPP mode is only for communication with external I/O hardware, like Mesa cards.
Farzin, You should check, if that add-in card supports data input on pins 2-9.
AFAIK not all do.


Viesturs

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Re: [Emc-users] Adding parallel port

[gene heskett]

On Saturday, July 30, 2011 08:11:13 AM Farzin Kamangar did opine:

> Hello EMC users,
> I have difficulty when adding additional parallel ports (other than
> the parallel port on mother board) and configuring them as input. When
> I monitor the pins 2 to 9 they are
> always off, but the pins 10 or 11 are on. I do not have this problem
> when I configure the parallel port on the mother board as input. Pins 2
> to 9 on the parport on mother board
> are all on and they turn off when connect them to ground (They are all
> O.K.) Could you tell what I need to do to make pins 2 to 9 act
> correctly on the additional parports too.
> I do not have any problem when configuring additional parports as
> output.Thanks and regards
> Farzin

There are parport cards that do not properly do the mode emc uses, Rosewill 
being one of them.  I have on hand another card, a PCI1P from StarTech.com 
according to the box that claims all 3 of the common modes are supported.

However, as in all things that require I pull the emc computer off its high 
shelf in the shop, it has not been actually tested.  Perhaps others here 
have also found a card that works reliably?

I believe EPP is the magic acronym.

You didn't say what brand your card is, so I can't go much farther.  Please 
post the snippet from an lspci -v that represents your add-in card.

Cheers, gene
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
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Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.

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[Emc-users] Adding parallel port

[Farzin Kamangar]

Hello EMC users,
I have difficulty when adding additional parallel ports (other than the
parallel port on mother board) and configuring them as input. When I monitor
the pins 2 to 9 they are
always off, but the pins 10 or 11 are on. I do not have this problem when I
configure the parallel port on the mother board as input. Pins 2 to 9 on the
parport on mother board
are all on and they turn off when connect them to ground (They are all O.K.)
Could you tell what I need to do to make pins 2 to 9 act correctly on the
additional parports too.
I do not have any problem when configuring additional parports as
output.Thanks and regards
Farzin
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