[Finale] Re: Printing parts in Mac OS X
this frightened me, so i checked it out, and it worked fine: i created a document with the setup wizard, set a custom page setup of 11x14 for the score as well as the parts. all extracted parts retained the page setup. if your score format is different than the desired parts page format, save the document and redefine the page setup (eg. to letter or A4) just before extracting and you're on your way: extract, and undo the page setup in the score. jef From: Jonathan Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] Just as you can't set up the page size from file menu and have it retained in the extracted part from that file like you used to in OS9. Coda say it is not a bug but that Finale can't access the OS to do this, so it looks as if we will have to live with it. -- shirling neueweise \/ new music notation specialists mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] :.../ http://newmusicnotation.com ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Fear OT
In the spirit of Californians sticking together, thank you very much for the info I will check it out today. Thanks again, Dean On Nov 26, 2004, at 11:07 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: California (I note from you sig) is quite notorious for having flaky power (so is Hawaii, for what it's worth). If you don't have a UPS, I would strongly recommend getting one. They're getting to be quite inexpensive, and well worth the cost. Uhuh, Cal. is flaky in many ways, power being one. Yeah, I should look into this. When you say inexpensive, how much are you talking? Thanks again for the good info ... Hi Dean, This is the one I haveit is both a surge protector and line conditioner. (protects against both surges and dips) I was having logic board issues and I hired an electrician to rule out power problems from within my home...my home was fine and this box was working like a champ! http://catalog.belkin.com/IWCatProductPage.process? Merchant_Id=Section_Id=76pcount=Product_Id=165162 Add it to the cart...type in 12345 where it says Redeem Coupon and see what happens :-) -Karen P.S. I'm in flakey shaky Cali! This box has been put to the test! -- ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Para mí, la música es la respiración de la vida y de Dios. Per me, la musica è l'alito della vita e di Dio Pour moi, la musique est le souffle de la vie et de Dieu. Für mich ist Musik der Atem des Lebens und des Gottes. Dean M. Estabrook Director of Music St. Andrew Presbyterian Church Yuba City, CA ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Fear OT
What? What part of California are you talking about? In the Bay Area where I live we haven't had a power outage in over a year. That being said, a UPS is a good investment regardless of rumors of flakey power. Dean M. Estabrook wrote: In the spirit of Californians sticking together, thank you very much for the info I will check it out today. Thanks again, Dean On Nov 26, 2004, at 11:07 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: California (I note from you sig) is quite notorious for having flaky power (so is Hawaii, for what it's worth). If you don't have a UPS, I would strongly recommend getting one. They're getting to be quite inexpensive, and well worth the cost. ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Fear OT
Eric Dannewitz / 04.11.28 / 4:52AM wrote: What? What part of California are you talking about? In the Bay Area where I live we haven't had a power outage in over a year. Poor Californians. Living in Greater Boston for 17 years, I've had short power outages only 3 times! Yet I have 4 UPSs in my studio. By the way, UPS can go bad. Check it often so it's not empty when you need it :-) -- - Hiro Hiroaki Honshuku, A-NO-NE Music, Boston, MA http://a-no-ne.com http://anonemusic.com ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] A Simple Question
I think Finale life is much more groovy if the last system can adjust it's length to the sum of the measure length automatically instead of page width that needs your attention. The dead MOTU Mosaic seems to do this. After long years of Finale dev, I am sure people has asked about this. Does anyone know why Finale don't/ won't/can't do this? If last system could adjust its length automatically, parts extraction would be much, much painless. -- - Hiro Hiroaki Honshuku, A-NO-NE Music, Boston, MA http://a-no-ne.com http://anonemusic.com ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Measure numbers in repeats
Crystal Premo / 04.11.27 / 9:15PM wrote: Under the ninth measure, which is the second ending, there is an (8), and underneath it a 16. Is this usual, to think of the first measure of the second ending as measure (8)/16? I've never seen this in published music, and it seems a little odd. I am not sure if I clearly understood this, but if it is: Very close. Like this: - | |1 | |2 | bar 8 | bar (8) bar 16 Crystal Premo ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Measure numbers in repeats
Crystal Premo wrote: Perhaps I am too inexperienced to have seen this before, but a client has given me a chart with edits, some of which are for measure numbers. It is a lead sheet for a jazz tune, with measure numbers on the first measure of each system. He has now indicated to place measure numbers under first and second endings thusly: the first ending is measure 8, and an 8 is written there. Under the ninth measure, which is the second ending, there is an (8), and underneath it a 16. Is this usual, to think of the first measure of the second ending as measure (8)/16? I've never seen this in published music, and it seems a little odd. I've seen similar things before, although more often with the second bar indicated as 2/(10). I always feel it's superfluous, though. Me, too. But I'll just do what the client wants. Crystal Premo [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] A Simple Question
A-NO-NE Music wrote: I think Finale life is much more groovy if the last system can adjust it's length to the sum of the measure length automatically instead of page width that needs your attention. The dead MOTU Mosaic seems to do this. After long years of Finale dev, I am sure people has asked about this. Does anyone know why Finale don't/ won't/can't do this? If last system could adjust its length automatically, parts extraction would be much, much painless. That assumes that you don't mind if the final system doesn't stretch full page. If what you wish could be implemented with an on/off option so that those of us who want full-width final systems can turn it off, I don't have a problem with you asking [EMAIL PROTECTED] (or [EMAIL PROTECTED]) for it. Rarely do I see commercial publications where a partial-width final system or staff is the case. Most of the time, each system or staff runs the full width of the page. That is what I prefer to see, and don't mind editing the parts to accomplish that, moving measures as necessary to get the page to look proper with a fully-justified final system. -- David H. Bailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] A Simple Question
dhbailey / 04.11.28 / 9:45AM wrote: Rarely do I see commercial publications where a partial-width final system or staff is the case. Most of the time, each system or staff runs the full width of the page. That is what I prefer to see, and don't mind editing the parts to accomplish that, moving measures as necessary to get the page to look proper with a fully-justified final system. I agree. But then how do you deal with the last system contains only 2 or 3 bars stretching and showing ugly looking? I didn't ask Finale to be smart that far, meaning calculating entire portion to even out to the last system :-) -- - Hiro Hiroaki Honshuku, A-NO-NE Music, Boston, MA http://a-no-ne.com http://anonemusic.com ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] A Simple Question
A-NO-NE Music wrote: I think Finale life is much more groovy if the last system can adjust it's length to the sum of the measure length automatically instead of page width that needs your attention. The dead MOTU Mosaic seems to do this. After long years of Finale dev, I am sure people has asked about this. Does anyone know why Finale don't/ won't/can't do this? If last system could adjust its length automatically, parts extraction would be much, much painless. But, sometimes a human's taste is needed. Sometimes we have to look the score over, spread the bars out a bit, and make the last system work out all by ourselves. You just can't leave everything to a computer, or your score will look like you left everything to a computer. Raymond Horton Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Fear OT
A-NO-NE Music wrote: Eric Dannewitz / 04.11.28 / 4:52AM wrote: What? What part of California are you talking about? In the Bay Area where I live we haven't had a power outage in over a year. Poor Californians. Living in Greater Boston for 17 years, I've had short power outages only 3 times! Yet I have 4 UPSs in my studio. By the way, UPS can go bad. Check it often so it's not empty when you need it :-) I keep a UPS, mostly in case my neighbors blow the master breaker (apartment living at its worst), or some bonehead knocks a power pole out with his car, but in nearly 50 years of living in California, I can recall precisely one power outage not caused by User Error. And we're still trying to get Enron to pay us back for that one. :( cd ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Measure numbers in repeats
At 9:15 PM -0500 11/27/04, Crystal Premo wrote: Perhaps I am too inexperienced to have seen this before, but a client has given me a chart with edits, some of which are for measure numbers. It is a lead sheet for a jazz tune, with measure numbers on the first measure of each system. He has now indicated to place measure numbers under first and second endings thusly: the first ending is measure 8, and an 8 is written there. Under the ninth measure, which is the second ending, there is an (8), and underneath it a 16. Is this usual, to think of the first measure of the second ending as measure (8)/16? I've never seen this in published music, and it seems a little odd. Crystal Premo How to number 2nd endings is an editorial choice. I've seen it done in different ways, and done it different ways myself. I'll often take the lazy way out and number the first ending bar as 8 and the 2nd ending bar as 9, as long as the score and parts are all exactly the same. (Of course I number every bar; using marginal numbers only slows down rehearsals unacceptably.) To me AS A PLAYER the 16 makes no sense, even though it is mathematically correct, because measures 9-15 are not so marked, so I wouldn't use it unless you insert double measure numbers (1-9, 2-10, 3-11, etc.). My preference would be to use (8) for the 2nd ending and 9 for the first bar of the following that ending, as long as score and parts are all exactly the same. This becomes ESPECIALLY important when, as in many Broadway show books, repeats are written out in some parts and marked with 1st and 2nd endings in others. (And of course this is NEVER indicated in the piano-conductor books!) In that case, it is absolutely essential to mark the double measure numbers in sections that are copied as repeats, because they need to line up with the continuous measure numbers in the parts that are written out, especially when there might be cuts taken in exactly such situations, throwing the orchestra into chaos until somebody figures out what's happening. (And yes, it's happened to me!!) John -- John Susie Howell Virginia Tech Department of Music Blacksburg, Virginia, U.S.A 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Fear OT
At 08:15 AM 11/28/04 -0800, Carl Dershem wrote: I keep a UPS, mostly in case my neighbors blow the master breaker (apartment living at its worst), or some bonehead knocks a power pole out with his car, but in nearly 50 years of living in California, I can recall precisely one power outage not caused by User Error. You guys are lucky. We lose power about monthly for one reason or another, more often during the winter, and the UPS has really saved the day. Last year we were out for nearly 24 hours -- really rough as we lose our water pump. We have wood heat for backup and cooking, so as long as we have time to fill some jugs before the tank depressurizes, we're okay. No UPS to help for that, and we're not quite economically ready to put our house on a backup generator. And we're still trying to get Enron to pay us back for that one. :( [Sound of coffee meeting keyboard.] Dennis ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Fear OT
Before we beat this issue to death, what I meant by flaky power wasn't just power outages, but noisy power lines, brown outs, and other kinds of power sags (voltage too low) or surges (too high). Although the electric companies *say* you are getting 117 volts at your outlet, if you plug in a chart voltmeter, you may find that your milage may vary considerably. Although most modern equipment can compesate for this (somewhat), you will strain your computer. And, my memory is not perfect on this, but as I recall the Enron incident led to rolling blackouts. I believe it was in the news that many bay area companies were installing building UPS systems to protect their work. *sigh*. Anyway, $30 is not a bad investment, considering. At 08:15 AM 11/28/2004 -0800, Carl Dershem wrote: A-NO-NE Music wrote: Eric Dannewitz / 04.11.28 / 4:52AM wrote: What? What part of California are you talking about? In the Bay Area where I live we haven't had a power outage in over a year. Poor Californians. Living in Greater Boston for 17 years, I've had short power outages only 3 times! Yet I have 4 UPSs in my studio. By the way, UPS can go bad. Check it often so it's not empty when you need it :-) I keep a UPS, mostly in case my neighbors blow the master breaker (apartment living at its worst), or some bonehead knocks a power pole out with his car, but in nearly 50 years of living in California, I can recall precisely one power outage not caused by User Error. And we're still trying to get Enron to pay us back for that one. :( cd ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale - Bruce K. H. Kau[EMAIL PROTECTED] 'Aina Haina, Honolulu, Hawai'i Second star to the right, and straight on 'til morning ... ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Measure numbers in repeats
John Howell wrote: How to number 2nd endings is an editorial choice. I've seen it done in different ways, and done it different ways myself. I'll often take the lazy way out and number the first ending bar as 8 and the 2nd ending bar as 9, as long as the score and parts are all exactly the same. This kind of practice is actually seen as wrong by all major publishers. It is possible that in your special case it doesn't cause any grief, but I strongly advise against doing it this way. It will add almost indefinite complications to rehearsals as soon as several editions of the same piece exist. The correct way to number first and second endings is to number the first bar of the first and second ending the same. There are rare cases where the whole repeat is renumbered in brackets. A typical example is when one part is added or changed the second time round. As far as I know this practice is also prefered in film scores, as it makes editing the sound track easier. Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Measure numbers in repeats
Actually, I have seen this type of notation, but mostly on vocal music with a backup CD-track. Since the CD is keyed to the measure number as played, it was needed to clarify where on the CD matches what part of the music. I've seen it in other situations, too, but I can't recall exactly why. (Some of my old band music was marked this way.) I think it was for marching music where timing on the football field made a difference ... but that was such a long time ago. At 06:25 PM 11/28/2004 +0100, Johannes Gebauer wrote: John Howell wrote: How to number 2nd endings is an editorial choice. I've seen it done in different ways, and done it different ways myself. I'll often take the lazy way out and number the first ending bar as 8 and the 2nd ending bar as 9, as long as the score and parts are all exactly the same. This kind of practice is actually seen as wrong by all major publishers. It is possible that in your special case it doesn't cause any grief, but I strongly advise against doing it this way. It will add almost indefinite complications to rehearsals as soon as several editions of the same piece exist. The correct way to number first and second endings is to number the first bar of the first and second ending the same. There are rare cases where the whole repeat is renumbered in brackets. A typical example is when one part is added or changed the second time round. As far as I know this practice is also prefered in film scores, as it makes editing the sound track easier. Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale - Bruce K. H. Kau[EMAIL PROTECTED] 'Aina Haina, Honolulu, Hawai'i Second star to the right, and straight on 'til morning ... ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Measure numbers in repeats
Thanks, Johannes. I don't like it, either, but this client does a great many things which I question the rationality of. It is easier just to go along and not put my name on the sheet. I think this will be the last work I accept. Crystal Premo [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Johannes Gebauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Finale] Measure numbers in repeats Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 18:25:26 +0100 John Howell wrote: How to number 2nd endings is an editorial choice. I've seen it done in different ways, and done it different ways myself. I'll often take the lazy way out and number the first ending bar as 8 and the 2nd ending bar as 9, as long as the score and parts are all exactly the same. This kind of practice is actually seen as wrong by all major publishers. It is possible that in your special case it doesn't cause any grief, but I strongly advise against doing it this way. It will add almost indefinite complications to rehearsals as soon as several editions of the same piece exist. The correct way to number first and second endings is to number the first bar of the first and second ending the same. There are rare cases where the whole repeat is renumbered in brackets. A typical example is when one part is added or changed the second time round. As far as I know this practice is also prefered in film scores, as it makes editing the sound track easier. Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Measure numbers in repeats
These are good points. However, I've been trying to get my voice students to read music for the last twenty years, and I'd be so surprised to find a singer who does anything but follow the lyrics. Crystal Premo [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Bruce K H Kau [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Finale] Measure numbers in repeats Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 07:33:11 Actually, I have seen this type of notation, but mostly on vocal music with a backup CD-track. Since the CD is keyed to the measure number as played, it was needed to clarify where on the CD matches what part of the music. I've seen it in other situations, too, but I can't recall exactly why. (Some of my old band music was marked this way.) I think it was for marching music where timing on the football field made a difference ... but that was such a long time ago. At 06:25 PM 11/28/2004 +0100, Johannes Gebauer wrote: John Howell wrote: How to number 2nd endings is an editorial choice. I've seen it done in different ways, and done it different ways myself. I'll often take the lazy way out and number the first ending bar as 8 and the 2nd ending bar as 9, as long as the score and parts are all exactly the same. This kind of practice is actually seen as wrong by all major publishers. It is possible that in your special case it doesn't cause any grief, but I strongly advise against doing it this way. It will add almost indefinite complications to rehearsals as soon as several editions of the same piece exist. The correct way to number first and second endings is to number the first bar of the first and second ending the same. There are rare cases where the whole repeat is renumbered in brackets. A typical example is when one part is added or changed the second time round. As far as I know this practice is also prefered in film scores, as it makes editing the sound track easier. Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale - Bruce K. H. Kau[EMAIL PROTECTED] 'Aina Haina, Honolulu, Hawai'i Second star to the right, and straight on 'til morning ... ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Fear OT
Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote: At 08:15 AM 11/28/04 -0800, Carl Dershem wrote: I keep a UPS, mostly in case my neighbors blow the master breaker (apartment living at its worst), or some bonehead knocks a power pole out with his car, but in nearly 50 years of living in California, I can recall precisely one power outage not caused by User Error. You guys are lucky. We lose power about monthly for one reason or another, more often during the winter, and the UPS has really saved the day. Where are you at? Even on the farm when I was a kid (and used electricity only a few hours a day, except for the well head), we never lost power that often. Last year we were out for nearly 24 hours -- really rough as we lose our water pump. We have wood heat for backup and cooking, so as long as we have time to fill some jugs before the tank depressurizes, we're okay. That's not good. Do you at least make it a practice to keep water jugs filled in case of outage? And we're still trying to get Enron to pay us back for that one. :( [Sound of coffee meeting keyboard.] Hey - they caused the blackouts, and made lots of money off of them, but have refused to even consider repayment. cd ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Fear OT
Bruce K H Kau wrote: And, my memory is not perfect on this, but as I recall the Enron incident led to rolling blackouts. I believe it was in the news that many bay area companies were installing building UPS systems to protect their work. *sigh*. Anyway, $30 is not a bad investment, considering. We had some here (San Diego, CA), but my home was never affected, and my office (2 miles away) only once, for an hour. But my electric bill doubled during that period, and has never gone down since. cd ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Fear OT
At 09:51 AM 11/28/04 -0800, Carl Dershem wrote: Where are you at? Even on the farm when I was a kid (and used electricity only a few hours a day, except for the well head), we never lost power that often. Central Vermont. We have a town power company that does a pretty good job, and it buys power from several sources. But it doesn't take too much to down lines or blow those big pole breakers, particularly in winter. Our outages last winter were from a cars taking down poles, ice breaking branches and downing lines, an exploded transformer (that was a sight!), on-pole breakers opening and needing replacement (that happened twice). There were a few scheduled maintenance outages, plus we have small glitches and dropouts pretty regularly during the summer (electrical storms anywhere in the area can glitch us) and spring ice melt. The calmest time is the fall. That's not good. Do you at least make it a practice to keep water jugs filled in case of outage? We have 5 gallons of bottled water on hand in case we're not home when the power goes down. Dennis ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] FinaleScript help?
Listers, Can anyone point to a good resource for using FinaleScript, other than what MakeMusic gives in their documentation? For a non-programmer like me the descriptions seem quite incomplete. Specifically what I would like for it to do is listed below, but in general I'd like to have a resource that would be more useful. Problem: open a file from an earlier version of Finale (I use 2005a Mac), print it, then close it *without* saving it. I just want to print a series of parts; I don't want to convert and update them. But this requires going through every single part, opening, printing, closing, telling it not to save, next file... If FinaleScript is supposed to automate things like this, I'd like to know how to do it. Thanks. Andrew Levin ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Ouch! Got bitten by the file overwrite bug?
I think I may have been zapped by the file overwrite bug. I say may because I wasn't watching my actions too closely, but I'll try to reconstruct things below. Incidentally, I use FinMac 2005a on a PowerMac G4/466, OS X 10.3.5, plenty of RAM, HD space, etc. I was making two arrangements of the Wachet Auf tenor chorale, for string quartet and string trio. I had completed the trio version and closed it. I was working on the quartet version and wanted to copy over the bowings/articulations from the trio version from first violin part to first violin part. So I opened the trio score, copied the part, and pasted it into the quartet score. No problems. Let me note, by the way, that both scores are called score. I do this on all of my arrangements, keeping them in their own folders. I don't use Autosave, but I do save every few minutes, before and after significant changes or completions. In this case I kept working on the quartet score, and when done I wanted to view the score in page view to set the title, composer etc. For some reason the view options to fit width and fit entire page on screen (I can't remember the exact menu titles) were greyed out and the key combos didn't work. Then I noticed that I couldn't select anything with mass mover and the title tool didn't work. At this point I saved (or, at least, I gave the key command; I don't know if it actually saved), then quit the program, hoping that starting up again will return functionality to the program. So what happened? When I restarted Finale and opened the quartet score, it was the *trio* score. The quartet score was gone and was now a complete duplicate of the trio score. This makes absolutely no sense! Fortunately this wasn't a critical arrangement, but I did lose a couple of hours. (I can hear it now: save different versions as you work. I'll be doing that from now on!). The awful thing is, I don't know what exactly caused it, so I'm not too confident to do other work in Finale for fear of losing work. Does this sound like anything any of you have run into? Any thoughts? And yes, I have sent this in to Mac Support. I'll share whatever I learn from it. Andrew Levin ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] singers
On Nov 28, 2004, at 9:40 AM, Crystal Premo wrote: These are good points. However, I've been trying to get my voice students to read music for the last twenty years, and I'd be so surprised to find a singer who does anything but follow the lyrics. Unfortunately this is too often true, but when you encounter well trained, intelligent, and literate singers, you are often in the company of some of the most able musicians you can find. I am lucky enough to be married to one and to have a daughter with similar training and ability. There have been moments when they have put my musicianship to shame. Chuck Chuck Israels 230 North Garden Terrace Bellingham, WA 98225-5836 phone (360) 671-3402 fax (360) 676-6055 www.chuckisraels.com ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
RE: [Finale] singers
I was required to learn to read music with high proficiency in a high school choir class. I think it was reinforced because I took music theory then, too, and had to practice it as a written skill. It takes practice, though, when you don't play an instrument. I took enough piano for it to stick. I have had some students who don't play who certainly read well enough. I think a lot of the singers I encounter are actors who sing, and have never taken music in any other context. Crystal Premo [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Chuck Israels [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Finale] singers Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 10:31:22 -0800 On Nov 28, 2004, at 9:40 AM, Crystal Premo wrote: These are good points. However, I've been trying to get my voice students to read music for the last twenty years, and I'd be so surprised to find a singer who does anything but follow the lyrics. Unfortunately this is too often true, but when you encounter well trained, intelligent, and literate singers, you are often in the company of some of the most able musicians you can find. I am lucky enough to be married to one and to have a daughter with similar training and ability. There have been moments when they have put my musicianship to shame. Chuck Chuck Israels 230 North Garden Terrace Bellingham, WA 98225-5836 phone (360) 671-3402 fax (360) 676-6055 www.chuckisraels.com ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] A Simple Question
At 8:40 AM -0500 11/28/04, A-NO-NE Music wrote: I think Finale life is much more groovy if the last system can adjust it's length to the sum of the measure length automatically instead of page width that needs your attention. The dead MOTU Mosaic seems to do this. After long years of Finale dev, I am sure people has asked about this. Does anyone know why Finale don't/ won't/can't do this? Mosaic could do it because either end of any system could be dragged horizontally to wherever you wanted it, a nice bit of flexibility I've often taken advantage of. And while it may be dying, it isn't quite dead yet. I'm using it in Classic on an OS X machine, although it took my son-in-law, the IT expert, to get it installed and working. Yes, I'll have to move to something more modern, and probably sooner rather than later, but the frank discussion of all Finale's problems in this forum makes it unlikely that Finale will be my choice, completely aside from MM's Bill Gates-like marketing schemes and failure to fix old and well-known problems. They lost adoption by our music department for much simpler and much stupider reasons: the Fall our students were due to arrive with OS X machines, there was no OS X Finale ready for them. And the continuing problems with OS X adaptation only reinforce our decision to go with Sibelius at that time. John -- John Susie Howell Virginia Tech Department of Music Blacksburg, Virginia, U.S.A 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] weighing in on measure numbering and widows.
My take on the measure numbering issue is this: If the numbers delineate form in a useful way, as in an AABA 32 measure tune, then the measure after the second A section in a score, lead sheet, or part that has a 1st and 2nd ending set up is measure 17. Of course, I can see rehearsal situations in which this choice might cause confusion, but I also think it carries useful information when dealing in standard cookie cutter forms where certain measure numbers contain formal information. I use measure number regions to control this. I would not use this method in creating music that was likely to encounter the exigencies of show rehearsals. In that case, rehearsal efficiency would be compromised, and that consideration should be paramount. As to the question of final systems on parts: I have no problem with seeing partial lines at the end of a part and again, for me, it can be a question of musical form. I like the part to suggest the form in the most graphic way possible. If this means that there are a couple of extra measures on the last line (resulting from a coda extension, for instance), I don't mind seeing them on the page that way. If things work out smoothly by distributing the music evenly, and the last measure is in its normal place at the end of the page, I'm happy to leave it like that. But if trying to do that results in extra wide or extra crowded spacing, I'd opt for the widow. YMMV. Chuck Chuck Israels 230 North Garden Terrace Bellingham, WA 98225-5836 phone (360) 671-3402 fax (360) 676-6055 www.chuckisraels.com ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] A Simple Question
John Howell wrote: Mosaic could do it because either end of any system could be dragged horizontally to wherever you wanted it, a nice bit of flexibility I've often taken advantage of. And so can Finale. Best regards, Jari Williamsson ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] A Simple Question
Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote: I don't know where or why it started, but it's like force-justifying the end line of paragraphs or making sure novels fill up the last page. Preventing the musical equivalent of widows orphans helps reading (and sometimes economics), but is there any practical reason to keep on with the full-line fill? Are there complaints that score reading is interfered with? Isn't this only tradition? (Blank music paper use lines going all across the page.) And musicians are used to have music on the end system extend to the same right position as the rest, perhaps they would get confused if it wasn't? Best regards, Jari Williamsson ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Fear OT
At 1:06 PM -0500 11/28/04, Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote: At 09:51 AM 11/28/04 -0800, Carl Dershem wrote: Where are you at? Even on the farm when I was a kid (and used electricity only a few hours a day, except for the well head), we never lost power that often. Central Vermont. We have a town power company that does a pretty good job, and it buys power from several sources. But it doesn't take too much to down lines or blow those big pole breakers, particularly in winter. Our outages last winter were from a cars taking down poles, ice breaking branches and downing lines, an exploded transformer (that was a sight!), on-pole breakers opening and needing replacement (that happened twice). There were a few scheduled maintenance outages, plus we have small glitches and dropouts pretty regularly during the summer (electrical storms anywhere in the area can glitch us) and spring ice melt. The calmest time is the fall. I can confirm similar events in S.W. Virginia. We have a serious ice storm every year or two, that takes down branches and any trees that have gotten weak since the last time, and takes down any nearby power lines with them. We have hurricanes (although never as fiercely as the folks on the coastline) that do the same. Our neighborhood has underground power cables, but we're still at the mercy of the larger local power grid. And of course there are the squirels who self-immolate in the transformers. (I can't recall a case of a driver taking out a pole; around here they seem to be marginally smarter than the squirels!) And the electrical storms in spring and summer can be fierce. The automatic breakers often fix the problem within minutes, and our power company is pretty good about getting crews out quickly and fixing things reasonably soon, but storm-caused outages can cover large areas of geography, not all of it reasonably accessible here in the mountains. (For those in the West, translate mountains as hills. Sounds like your farm was in a rather protected part of the country! And is\t sounds as if I should look seriously into getting a UPS for the computer, besides the protected power strips I currently use. Where is this $30 model, and does it really do the job? John -- John Susie Howell Virginia Tech Department of Music Blacksburg, Virginia, U.S.A 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Measure numbers in repeats
Crystal Premo wrote: Thanks, Johannes. I don't like it, either, but this client does a great many things which I question the rationality of. It is easier just to go along and not put my name on the sheet. I think this will be the last work I accept. I wasn't actually disgreeing with your client. I was disagreeing with John Howell's way of counting repeat bars. What your client asks for may in fact have good reasons. Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] A Simple Question
John Howell wrote: Mosaic could do it because either end of any system could be dragged horizontally to wherever you wanted it, a nice bit of flexibility I've often taken advantage of. You can do that in Finale, too. Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] A Simple Question
At 8:23 PM +0100 11/28/04, d. collins wrote: Jari Williamsson écrit: Isn't this only tradition? (Blank music paper use lines going all across the page.) Probably only a tradition, and a fairly recent one; but I don't see why it would come from blank music paper. Many early editions, both in movable type and engraved, have staffs going across the page, but the music sometimes stops in the middle of the staff, the last part of which simply remains empty. The fact is that today, if you happen to work for a traditional publisher, you will likely be considerd an unprofessional engraver if you don't fill up your lines and your pages. That's probably true, but I'd be happier if both traditional and non-traditional publisher concerned themselves with the really important critera, like assuring good page turns. Going right back to Petrucci's Odhecaton of 1501, the first publication of part-music using movable type and the triple-impression method, Dennis's observation is quite correct. In fact there are staves or pages of unfilled staff lines, suggesting that the printing of the staff lines was the first impression through the press. Before learning computer engraving, I filled reams of manuscript paper with music, and the only criteria that mattered were instant readability and efficient layout for efficient rehearsals. When I reached the last bar I stopped, no matter where it was on a staff, and my double bar made it clear that that was the end. The one mistake that I came across in other people's manuscript (and tried to avoid in my own) was putting a bar line BEFORE the end of a staff line, whether the notes extended to the end or not. That's a flat-out invitation to confusion. And so is dividing a measure in half at the end of a line. Bad planning, confusing reading, even if you do come across it in music from traditional publishers. John -- John Susie Howell Virginia Tech Department of Music Blacksburg, Virginia, U.S.A 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] A Simple Question
John Howell wrote: At 8:23 PM +0100 11/28/04, d. collins wrote: Jari Williamsson écrit: Isn't this only tradition? (Blank music paper use lines going all across the page.) Probably only a tradition, and a fairly recent one; but I don't see why it would come from blank music paper. Many early editions, both in movable type and engraved, have staffs going across the page, but the music sometimes stops in the middle of the staff, the last part of which simply remains empty. The fact is that today, if you happen to work for a traditional publisher, you will likely be considerd an unprofessional engraver if you don't fill up your lines and your pages. That's probably true, but I'd be happier if both traditional and non-traditional publisher concerned themselves with the really important critera, like assuring good page turns. Going right back to Petrucci's Odhecaton of 1501, the first publication of part-music using movable type and the triple-impression method, Dennis's observation is quite correct. In fact there are staves or pages of unfilled staff lines, suggesting that the printing of the staff lines was the first impression through the press. The situation with blank staves in Petrucci prints is a bit more complex than that, and varies between different books... But I digress. Remaining in a similar era, though, it's impossible to produce meaningful editions of e.g. Binchois songs while trying to fill whole lines. The suggestion that it's the 'only' tradition assumes we're all working in the mainstream. ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] A Simple Question
dhbailey / 04.11.28 / 11:55AM wrote: I find it to be only a matter of a small effort to move measures around to get the final systems to look fine. snip The way I deal with the final system is to move measures down from preceding systems until they all balance out and the layout looks proper to my eye. I realized most of folks hear are for one-time-only output to publisher. My need is different. I often change arrangements per gigs, so taking time on finalizing the parts is not practical to me. I also re-space busy measures and/or whatever reason which makes sight-reader easier. Any attempt like this screws the ending automatically. I too am used to read full with end system on classical music, but it is not so true with jazz music. Space can be used for instruction of solo order. Indent is useful for Coda for sight-reader's eyes, etc. etc. -- - Hiro Hiroaki Honshuku, A-NO-NE Music, Boston, MA http://a-no-ne.com http://anonemusic.com ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Ouch! Got bitten by the file overwrite bug?
Hi Andrew, Yep, that's it. FWIW, if you had had autosave *on*, you could have reverted to the most recently auto-saved version of the quartet score and it probably would have been okay. Autosave is safe in Fin2005a (but not Fin2004). I don't use Autosave, but I do save every few minutes, before and after significant changes or completions. In this case I kept working on the quartet score, and when done I wanted to view the score in page view to set the title, composer etc. For some reason the view options to fit width and fit entire page on screen (I can't remember the exact menu titles) were greyed out and the key combos didn't work. Then I noticed that I couldn't select anything with mass mover and the title tool didn't work. I don't think this is related to the file overwrite bug -- but I could be wrong. Anyway, I have seen this behavior, where Finale seems to forget which window is the frontmost one. You can usually solve this by using Exposé -- hit F10 to show all your Finale windows, then click the one you want. This seems to remind Finale which window is in front. (On second thought, maybe it *is* related... ?) At this point I saved (or, at least, I gave the key command; I don't know if it actually saved), then quit the program, hoping that starting up again will return functionality to the program. Did you get a message prompting you to save changes when you quit? Or did Finale just quit without prompting you? So what happened? When I restarted Finale and opened the quartet score, it was the *trio* score. The quartet score was gone and was now a complete duplicate of the trio score. This makes absolutely no sense! Welcome to my world. Fortunately this wasn't a critical arrangement, but I did lose a couple of hours. (I can hear it now: save different versions as you work. I'll be doing that from now on!). Autosave also helps, as I said. The official solution is to never have multiple files open simultaneously, which, for my work, is Not Acceptable. The awful thing is, I don't know what exactly caused it, so I'm not too confident to do other work in Finale for fear of losing work. I wish we could find the steps to reproduce the problem, because this is a big one. On the plus side, it happens very infrequently. On the minus side, that means it's almost impossible to track down and hardly anyone ever reports it to Coda. - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] measure numbering
For my money, auseful feature would be the facility to specify thata measure(s) be ignoredwhen numbering measures - 1st/2nd time bars for example. The current method involving specifying regions and such seems very cumbersome. (Unless I'm missing something.) All the best, Lawrence "þaes ofereode - þisses swa maeg"http://lawrenceyates.co.uk ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Measure numbers in repeats
On 28 Nov 2004, at 12:25 PM, Johannes Gebauer wrote: John Howell wrote: How to number 2nd endings is an editorial choice. I've seen it done in different ways, and done it different ways myself. I'll often take the lazy way out and number the first ending bar as 8 and the 2nd ending bar as 9, as long as the score and parts are all exactly the same. This kind of practice is actually seen as wrong by all major publishers. It is possible that in your special case it doesn't cause any grief, but I strongly advise against doing it this way. It will add almost indefinite complications to rehearsals as soon as several editions of the same piece exist. The correct way to number first and second endings is to number the first bar of the first and second ending the same. Really? So you're saying that, for a one-measure first and second ending, *both* measures would have the same number? Is that really standard practice? That seems like a really terrible idea to me. I've always either done what John does, above (just number consecutively, ignoring repeats) -- which I prefer -- or, when necessary, renumber the entire repeat, film-score style, as you describe below. I have never even considered having, for instance, two measure 9's in the same piece, one for the first ending, and one for the second. What is the rationale for this? There are rare cases where the whole repeat is renumbered in brackets. A typical example is when one part is added or changed the second time round. As far as I know this practice is also prefered in film scores, as it makes editing the sound track easier. Johannes - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Smart Shape Bracket Settings
WinFin2K3, and wondering about something I've not liked forever: How do you adjust the amount of the drop of the vertical lines at the ends of smart shape square brackets? I can't seem to find anything about changing the existing settings (which are about 1/3 the right size, seems to me), though I can see how to create a custom line style (which I'm not all that interested in doing). Am I stuck with custom lines to make it look right? If so, what the hell were they thinking when them made the bracket endings so tiny? And what were they thinking when they provided no UI to change these settings? -- David W. Fentonhttp://www.bway.net/~dfenton David Fenton Associateshttp://www.bway.net/~dfassoc ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Fear OT
Before we beat this issue to death, what I meant by flaky power wasn't just power outages, but noisy power lines, brown outs, and other kinds of power sags (voltage too low) or surges (too high). Although the electric companies *say* you are getting 117 volts at your outlet, if you plug in a chart voltmeter, you may find that your milage may vary considerably. Although most modern equipment can compesate for this (somewhat), you will strain your computer. Yup, this is true. This is why I have a UPS that also has a line conditioner built in. It protects against the things you mentioned above. Also, the one I bought has a USB port built into it so I can hook it up to my computer and monitor it .something Hiro very wisely mentioned. -K And, my memory is not perfect on this, but as I recall the Enron incident led to rolling blackouts. I believe it was in the news that many bay area companies were installing building UPS systems to protect their work. *sigh*. Anyway, $30 is not a bad investment, considering. At 08:15 AM 11/28/2004 -0800, Carl Dershem wrote: A-NO-NE Music wrote: Eric Dannewitz / 04.11.28 / 4:52AM wrote: What? What part of California are you talking about? In the Bay Area where I live we haven't had a power outage in over a year. Poor Californians. Living in Greater Boston for 17 years, I've had short power outages only 3 times! Yet I have 4 UPSs in my studio. By the way, UPS can go bad. Check it often so it's not empty when you need it :-) I keep a UPS, mostly in case my neighbors blow the master breaker (apartment living at its worst), or some bonehead knocks a power pole out with his car, but in nearly 50 years of living in California, I can recall precisely one power outage not caused by User Error. And we're still trying to get Enron to pay us back for that one. :( cd ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale - Bruce K. H. Kau[EMAIL PROTECTED] 'Aina Haina, Honolulu, Hawai'i Second star to the right, and straight on 'til morning ... ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale -- Karen Guthery [EMAIL PROTECTED] ichat: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
