Re: [Finale] OT: piano part names
Have a look here: http://www.concertpitchpiano.com/ DiagramsAndImages.html Michael On 4 Mar 2007, at 04:47, shirling neueweise wrote: does anyone have any links to diagrammes or images of the inside of a piano? i need something (for reference) which names many of the components - capo bar, treble bridge, duplex bar, etc. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] How much can I quote?
Raymond Horton wrote: This sounds to me, already, like a dumb question, but here goes anyway: Is there any guideline established as to how much I can quote of a copyrighted piece of music without getting into trouble? I know that there are guidelines for broadcast, but are there any for compositional plagiarism? I'm guessing there are not, but hoping there are. DISCLAIMER: I am not a lawyer, I have never even played a lawyer on TV, so what follows is not intended in any way to be legal advice and I would encourage you, when in doubt, to consult a copyright attorney in your area who is versed in music and entertainment copyright specifically: There is nothing codified, not even for broadcast. Copyrighted material is copyrighted and without getting permission and/or paying a fee, nothing can be done with it. With that said, there seems to be a threshold below which actions usually aren't taken. A few bars of a quotation probably won't get a lawsuit, yet the same amount of an original recording, sampled, can result in a lengthy court case and payment of a fine. Essentially, what has seemed in the past to be the test used to be what sort of an economic impact on the the original copyrighted material did the copying make. So a small quotation would never undermine the sales potential of the original or be mistaken for the original, and so didn't used to be likely to be prosecuted to a successful end for the original copyright owner. More recently it has become more a world of mine, mine, mine, get your stinking hands off MY STUFF So that things which would have no economic impact at all nor would reduce the marketability of the original are being successfully prosecuted. The one area which is much more open is the area of satire/parody. I was interested to learn (wish I could remember the learned copyright site I read this on) that this is much more narrowly defined and interpreted than I had thought. I was originally under the impression that using a copyrighted melody with new lyrics in a satirical manner was protected, but the interpretation of this clause (where free speech and personal property principles clash) has been that it is alright to use the melody and put new words if the new creation parodies the original creation. So using a well-known melody which was about love can't be used to put words which parody a TV commercial (for instance.) But using the Barney Song and changing the words to be satirical about Barney is protected by that aspect of the law, apparently. So if your use of the copyrighted material is satirical towards the original (sappy romantic music turned into carnival-type two-step, for instance) you might be alright with a larger quotation than if you simply want to evoke an image by a short quotation of a well-known melody. -- David H. Bailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] German
I need an English translation for the following: munter Leicht bewegt Langsam, jedoch fliebend Vorspiel ruhig Musik zum Kaspertheater Tanz der Holzpuppen Wiegenlied Schlufslied Many thanks, to my German speaking colleagues! ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] 6/4 3/2
On 3 Mar 2007 at 18:09, Chuck Israels wrote: On Mar 3, 2007, at 5:50 PM, David W. Fenton wrote: How do you resolve those things without endless rehearsal? What if two players have the same passage but interpret the notation slightly differently? Or in contradictory ways? Ah, I think that happens often, and sometimes produces unexpectedly beautiful results. One of the charms of this method of music making. The conflicts are always resolved on the main pulses. The pushes and pulls are a big part of the thrill of the music. While I can see that in cases where players are passing motives back and forth, if they are playing in unison rhythm, particularly in faster passages, is it not a problem? I mean, are you arguing that it's *always* better to have loose ensemble because the notation doesn't specify a particular interpretation? -- David W. Fentonhttp://dfenton.com David Fenton Associates http://dfenton.com/DFA/ ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] OT: piano part names
At 13:49 +0100 3/4/07, Michael Cook wrote: Have a look here: http://www.concertpitchpiano.com/DiagramsAndImages.html yes, this is exactly the kind of detail i was hoping for, but there isn't a diagramme of the actual frame and string parts (treble bridge pin hitches etc.) http://www.concertpitchpiano.com/GrandActionModel.html any other links? cheers, jef -- shirling neueweise ... new music publishers mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] :.../ http://newmusicnotation.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] How much can I quote?
On Mar 4, 2007, at 8:03 AM, dhbailey wrote: The one area which is much more open is the area of satire/parody. I was interested to learn (wish I could remember the learned copyright site I read this on) that this is much more narrowly defined and interpreted than I had thought. I was originally under the impression that using a copyrighted melody with new lyrics in a satirical manner was protected, but the interpretation of this clause (where free speech and personal property principles clash) has been that it is alright to use the melody and put new words if the new creation parodies the original creation. So using a well- known melody which was about love can't be used to put words which parody a TV commercial (for instance.) But using the Barney Song and changing the words to be satirical about Barney is protected by that aspect of the law, apparently. So if your use of the copyrighted material is satirical towards the original (sappy romantic music turned into carnival-type two-step, for instance) you might be alright with a larger quotation than if you simply want to evoke an image by a short quotation of a well- known melody. The case I linked to in my last message was exactly about that. A cabaret-type musical included a song called the Cunnilingus Champion of Company C based more or less loosely on The Boogie Woogie Bugle Boy. In the reading, despite care being taken NOT to use the exact melody, the case was found for plagiarism. The eight to the bar piano left hand was used, a similar 3 way female vocal arrangement was used, and the tempo was the same, and the lyrics scanned very closely to the original, even though most of the words were NOT the same. The clincher was apparently evidence that the composer had listened to and used as a reference Bette Midler's version when he composed the tune. Parody as a defence was not upheld, because it was not the SONG that was parodied, but an entire style and era, by the composer's own admission. Weird. I confess that I don't understand many of these cases at all. Many of the arguments upheld by the judges are contradictory, to my eye anyway, and it is beyond me how someone could think that a left-hand piano riff in common use for seventy years or more could be copyrighted, simply by virtue of it's being used in a popular song. I strongly suspect it is a matter of who has the biggest, most muscular lawyers arguing the case. Christopher ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] 6/4 3/2
On 04 Mar 2007, at 8:47 AM, David W. Fenton wrote: On 3 Mar 2007 at 18:09, Chuck Israels wrote: On Mar 3, 2007, at 5:50 PM, David W. Fenton wrote: How do you resolve those things without endless rehearsal? What if two players have the same passage but interpret the notation slightly differently? Or in contradictory ways? Ah, I think that happens often, and sometimes produces unexpectedly beautiful results. One of the charms of this method of music making. The conflicts are always resolved on the main pulses. The pushes and pulls are a big part of the thrill of the music. While I can see that in cases where players are passing motives back and forth, if they are playing in unison rhythm, particularly in faster passages, is it not a problem? The section players keep their ears open and follow the phrasing adopted by the lead player. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German
I even know some of these! I am as happy as little guul! (Mike Meyers, Sprockets) Amazing what one picks up from trombone parts in Mahler, Wagner and Hindemith. On Mar 4, 2007, at 7:57 AM, Lawrence David Eden wrote: munter Lively Leicht bewegt Moving easily (not the best translation if you want to put an English marking) Langsam, jedoch fliebend Slowly, but (sorry don't know this word!) Vorspiel prelude or overture, before the story. (Can it even mean foreplay? Or am I being to literal? A friend of mine at school also used it to refer to a pre-game barbecue before the big soccer matches.) ruhig calmly Musik zum Kaspertheater Music for the Puppet Theater, whatever that is Tanz der Holzpuppen Dance of the Wood Dolls. Maybe Toy Dolls or just Dolls would be better English. Wiegenlied Lullabye (literally, cradle song) Schlufslied Sleep song? Sorry, you got me. (No, it doesn't mean that!) 8-) Christopher ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] 6/4 3/2
On 4 Mar 2007 at 9:35, Darcy James Argue wrote: On 04 Mar 2007, at 8:47 AM, David W. Fenton wrote: On 3 Mar 2007 at 18:09, Chuck Israels wrote: On Mar 3, 2007, at 5:50 PM, David W. Fenton wrote: How do you resolve those things without endless rehearsal? What if two players have the same passage but interpret the notation slightly differently? Or in contradictory ways? Ah, I think that happens often, and sometimes produces unexpectedly beautiful results. One of the charms of this method of music making. The conflicts are always resolved on the main pulses. The pushes and pulls are a big part of the thrill of the music. While I can see that in cases where players are passing motives back and forth, if they are playing in unison rhythm, particularly in faster passages, is it not a problem? The section players keep their ears open and follow the phrasing adopted by the lead player. And they have photographic memories that mean they get it right the first time through in the performance? Sorry, but I can't believe that the tight ensemble I hear in the best recordings comes from following the lead player, but instead comes from careful rehearsal and well-marked parts, along with the highest level of musical skill and good ears. If you have limited rehearsal time and/or less than stellar players, why would clearer parts *not* be a real time-saver? -- David W. Fentonhttp://dfenton.com David Fenton Associates http://dfenton.com/DFA/ ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] 6/4 3/2
Darcy James Argue wrote: On 04 Mar 2007, at 8:47 AM, David W. Fenton wrote: On 3 Mar 2007 at 18:09, Chuck Israels wrote: On Mar 3, 2007, at 5:50 PM, David W. Fenton wrote: How do you resolve those things without endless rehearsal? What if two players have the same passage but interpret the notation slightly differently? Or in contradictory ways? Ah, I think that happens often, and sometimes produces unexpectedly beautiful results. One of the charms of this method of music making. The conflicts are always resolved on the main pulses. The pushes and pulls are a big part of the thrill of the music. While I can see that in cases where players are passing motives back and forth, if they are playing in unison rhythm, particularly in faster passages, is it not a problem? The section players keep their ears open and follow the phrasing adopted by the lead player. To this I would add that the whole concept of unified phrasing, following the lead player, etc. is predicated upon there being experienced players who are well versed in a number of different styles, so there is a preliminary basis of experience and knowledge assumed. Put the same chart in front of an 8th grade school jazz band that you put in front of a band full of 20-year professional veterans of the jazz idiom and you'll get very different performances. But of course the same goes in the world of viol music (or any genre of music). Interpretations can be discussed and differences of opinion can be worked out to present a quality performance, based on knowledge and experience. In the jazz world this seems to happen more by way of common consensus on the fly rather than hashed-out-in-rehearsal perfection. And such interpretations in the jazz world, say (were it only still possible) by the Basie band and the Duke Ellington orchestra, would result in two very different and equally wonderful performances. Each band had a very unique, identifiable sound (they all did, not just those two) which was in part created by the very rhythmic tensions and interpretations Darcy and Chuck are mentioning. But the very nature of the music welcomes that sort of interpretation and any attempt to make the notation more precise and exact only gets in the way. Ellington, for example, would not always write out the various parts (from what I've read of his composing and arranging style) note-for-note from start to finish, but would rather put sketches and leave the actual sounds up to his trusted players. -- David H. Bailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] 6/4 3/2
On 04 Mar 2007, at 9:55 AM, David W. Fenton wrote: If you have limited rehearsal time and/or less than stellar players, why would clearer parts *not* be a real time-saver? David, As I have said before, in the specific situation Bob was asking about, having a different meter in, e.g., the saxophones vs. the brass does *not* constitute clearer parts and would most definitely not be a time saver. One of the things that's throwing you is that jazz doesn't have pronounced downbeat accents. The first note in the bar is rarely the most accented note in the bar, even if no accents are indicated. In 4/4, an entrance or short note on beat two or four is going to be played more forcefully than one on beat 3. Using time signature changes to indicate accents, or internal accent patterns, doesn't work the way you seem to expect it to work. I think you're having some trouble wrapping your head around the idea that jazz is *deliberately* under-notated (at least, compared to a lot of 20th-century classical music) in order to leave a certain amount of flexibility in the hands of the players. Yes, it takes time for section players to get accustomed to the way the lead player phrases, but not *that* much time -- the best players will internalize most of the lead player's habits within a couple of rehearsals, at most. Over-notated parts won't help mediocre players swing harder. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German
Christopher got most of them. Langsam, jedoch fliebend should be Langsam, jedoch fließend. The correct translation is Slowly, but flowing. I've never seen the word Schlufslied. Could this be a misreading of Schlaflied, meaning lullaby? Michael On 4 Mar 2007, at 13:57, Lawrence David Eden wrote: I need an English translation for the following: munter Leicht bewegt Langsam, jedoch fliebend Vorspiel ruhig Musik zum Kaspertheater Tanz der Holzpuppen Wiegenlied Schlufslied Many thanks, to my German speaking colleagues! ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] How much can I quote?
Christopher Smith wrote: [snip] I confess that I don't understand many of these cases at all. Many of the arguments upheld by the judges are contradictory, to my eye anyway, and it is beyond me how someone could think that a left-hand piano riff in common use for seventy years or more could be copyrighted, simply by virtue of it's being used in a popular song. I strongly suspect it is a matter of who has the biggest, most muscular lawyers arguing the case. I think you're correct but I would add that not only do the lawyers have to be the biggest, most muscular copyright attorneys, the successful party has to have the deepest pockets. Which was what made the George Harrison MySweetLord/He'sSoFine case so interesting -- both parties had very, very deep pockets. One thing I find amusing among all these apparently conflicting decisions is that the newer era of intellectual property and copyright law is still a wide-open frontier and all the judges are trying to come up with the definitive ruling, paying less attention to case law than other older, more well established areas of the law. Each judge wants to be the one who all future cases turn to and all future judges use as a basis for their rulings. So no judges want to be seen as following other judges in this area, not yet. It's sort of an alpha-dog/beta-dog fight among the judges, in my opinion. Either that or they simply have no clue and decide in favor of the one they like the looks of better or the one with what the judge thinks is the nicer song. So George Harrison singing about Hare Krishna didn't have a snowball's chance in hell in a court where the judge goes to a christian church on Sundays. -- David H. Bailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] OT: piano part names
shirling neueweise wrote: At 13:49 +0100 3/4/07, Michael Cook wrote: Have a look here: http://www.concertpitchpiano.com/DiagramsAndImages.html yes, this is exactly the kind of detail i was hoping for, but there isn't a diagramme of the actual frame and string parts (treble bridge pin hitches etc.) http://www.concertpitchpiano.com/GrandActionModel.html any other links? cheers, jef Try this: (the link may not put you at the top of the page, but if you scroll up you'll find a picture you can click on to learn more about each section of the piano. http://www.musicplay.com/piano/vrpiano.html#anchorsound -- David H. Bailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German
On 4 Mar 2007 at 16:06, Michael Cook wrote: I've never seen the word Schlufslied. Could this be a misreading of Schlaflied, meaning lullaby? Given the mistranscription of fließend why not Schlußlied? -- David W. Fentonhttp://dfenton.com David Fenton Associates http://dfenton.com/DFA/ ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] HP Laserjet 5000 Duplexer
To all HP 5000n users: I thought, like many others on the list, that this part was no longer produced. What a surprise then to find a new one listed on the HP (French) site. It shipped yesterday. Coded as part C4113-69001 it said it was to replace the C4113A and was definitely listed for the 5000 and the 5000n printers. Maybe they have decided to start making them again? Cost: 550 euros incl. shipping and tax. Expensiveyes, but I hope it will give me a few more years out of the printer which is still going strong. Jonathan ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German
fliebend has to be fließend, meaning fluently; (it's not a b, but the German ß or ss) Schlufslied = song of the rooster; BTW, a Kaspertheater is a theatre show with from outside manipulated dolls. HTH Hans Op 04 mrt 2007 om 15:52 heeft Christopher Smith het volgende geschreven: On Mar 4, 2007, at 7:57 AM, Lawrence David Eden wrote: munter Lively Leicht bewegt Moving easily (not the best translation if you want to put an English marking) Langsam, jedoch fliebend Slowly, but (sorry don't know this word!) Vorspiel prelude or overture, before the story. (Can it even mean foreplay? Or am I being to literal? A friend of mine at school also used it to refer to a pre-game barbecue before the big soccer matches.) ruhig calmly Musik zum Kaspertheater Music for the Puppet Theater, whatever that is Tanz der Holzpuppen Dance of the Wood Dolls. Maybe Toy Dolls or just Dolls would be better English. Wiegenlied Lullabye (literally, cradle song) Schlufslied Sleep song? Sorry, you got me. (No, it doesn't mean that!) 8-) You will excuse me for any typo's due to a visual handicap. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German
I agree, Schlußlied is another possibility. And where I wrote in my previous post: a Kaspertheater is a theatre show with from outside manipulated dolls I would thinking on a Puppet on a string, bot there are other methods for playing this kind of theater. Hans === On 04 mrt 2007, at 16:24, David W. Fenton wrote: On 4 Mar 2007 at 16:06, Michael Cook wrote: I've never seen the word Schlufslied. Could this be a misreading of Schlaflied, meaning lullaby? Given the mistranscription of fließend why not Schlußlied? -- David W. Fentonhttp://dfenton.com David Fenton Associates http://dfenton.com/DFA/ ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale You will excuse me for any typo's due to a visual handicap. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] 6/4 3/2
Chuck Israels wrote: On Mar 3, 2007, at 5:50 PM, David W. Fenton wrote: How do you resolve those things without endless rehearsal? What if two players have the same passage but interpret the notation slightly differently? Or in contradictory ways? Ah, I think that happens often, and sometimes produces unexpectedly beautiful results. One of the charms of this method of music making. The conflicts are always resolved on the main pulses. The pushes and pulls are a big part of the thrill of the music. Chuck Yo, Chuck BF My viol consort spends tons of time deciding how to interpret passages that have implied rhythmic structures that are not notated. If we didn't, our playing would be incredibly boring (like 99% of the viol consorts you've probably heard), but it *does* take a great deal of time. --David W. Fentonhttp://dfenton.com David Fenton Associates http://dfenton.com/DFA/ ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Chuck Israels 230 North Garden Terrace Bellingham, WA 98225-5836 phone (360) 671-3402 fax (360) 676-6055 www.chuckisraels.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German
I agree, Schlußlied is another possibility. end song!? more likely schlaflied, as was suggested elsewhere. And where I wrote in my previous post: a Kaspertheater is a theatre show with from outside manipulated dolls I would thinking on a Puppet on a string, bot there are other methods for playing this kind of theater. these would be marionettes, no? although i'm not sure if the term would be used (in english) in this context, probably puppet show is the right term. -- shirling neueweise ... new music publishers mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] :.../ http://newmusicnotation.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] OT: piano part names
At 10:03 -0500 3/4/07, dhbailey wrote: http://www.musicplay.com/piano/vrpiano.html#anchorsound yeah, getting there! it's still missing tons of info though. well, i just ordered a couple of books on restoring pianos, hopefully there are some good diagrammes in them... thanks, jef -- shirling neueweise ... new music publishers mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] :.../ http://newmusicnotation.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] 6/4 3/2
At 09:55 -0500 3/4/07, David W. Fenton wrote: Sorry, but I can't believe that the tight ensemble I hear in the best recordings comes from following the lead player, but instead comes from careful rehearsal and well-marked parts, along with the highest level of musical skill and good ears. well, a lot of the classic jazz discs were more or less sight read in the recording studio. a couple of run-throughs, couple of comments, and a count-in. many re-issues where band leader comments are NOT edited out have appeared in recent years, giving some interesting insight into performance/recording praxis in jazz's classic period. one great example, coltrane talking to williams (i think?) on dearly beloved (on sun ship) is something like: no i think it would be better if you can just keep... you know... keep the thing happening [something else incomprehensible]... but you can [...???]... ready? and then they blow like hell. and that was the released cut! i don't recall seeing heavily marked charts before, but other jazz musicians can clarify; i don't think this is nearly as common a practice as with classical musicians. If you have limited rehearsal time and/or less than stellar players, why would clearer parts *not* be a real time-saver? there are things that are immediately clear to jazz players that no classical player would ever take (dare) for granted; mostly because they don't have the same on-the-fly flexibility in performance as jazz players. there is a huge difference in the nature of the training, and in where the levels of interpretation lie for the jazz vs classical player. in my experience, i've found that jazz musicians can also remember performance details better without taking notes. this is for many reasons. for example, jazz charts are typically far shorter than, for example, string quartet scores, but also because of the differences in training. most classical musicians freeze up when you take their scores away, even though they've been readong from them for months. guitarists are perhaps the only classical musicians who as a group **regularly** play by memory (with the obvious exception of concerto performers), despite the fact that their parts are often more complicated (because of fingerings, positions etc.) than other classical musicians. the rehearsals also happen on stage, to an extent, a situation which is fundamentally different than with classical performers. david, you seem to be trying to force classical notation and performance practice protocol onto a fundamentally different area of musicality, and there are simply inherent incompatibilities. (and back to the discussion of meter...) christopher already mentioned rhythmic dissonance: comments about accents vs beaming i think is the key to this discussion. from a classical perspective, the accents in jazz are not metric, and while in some cases are intended to give a feel of another meter, are usually not intended to firmly establish this new meter. the feel of a 3/2 meter during a 6/4 passage would be interpreted fundamentally different than an actual change to a 3/2 meter in a 6/4 section. i'm no jazz expert, but my understanding is that the specificities of timing the attacks (as a group) - on, slightly before/after the real (notated) metric position - are derived through an understanding of the felt vs. notated measures, and that such things are typical of the jazz musician's training, whether in class/lessons or on stage. -- shirling neueweise ... new music publishers mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] :.../ http://newmusicnotation.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] HP Laserjet 5000 Duplexer
On Mar 4, 2007, at 10:08 AM, Jonathan Smith wrote: To all HP 5000n users: I thought, like many others on the list, that this part was no longer produced. What a surprise then to find a new one listed on the HP (French) site. It shipped yesterday. Coded as part C4113-69001 it said it was to replace the C4113A and was definitely listed for the 5000 and the 5000n printers. Maybe they have decided to start making them again? This is very interesting! I wonder if the new version is more durable than the original duplexer, which was only good for a few years before beginning to break down. Andrew Stiller Kallisti Music Press http://www.kallistimusic.com/kallisti.html ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German
As long as we're on this subject, I'd like to ask the list's German speakers to vet a few lines of a translation of mine. In a 19th-c. oratorio text, the poetry at one point says (of the poet's soul): Wenn sie im Staube sich vergisst, / So trag' sie mit Geduld. Which I have rendered as: Even when it lies forgetful in the dust, / Still it abides in patience. --but this doesn't quite feel right to me. Have I gone astray somehow, or is this basically correct? Andrew Stiller Kallisti Music Press http://www.kallistimusic.com/kallisti.html ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German
On Mar 4, 2007, at 11:47 AM, shirling neueweise wrote: I agree, Schlußlied is another possibility. end song!? more likely schlaflied, as was suggested elsewhere. End song is an awkward translation. Concluding Song or Final Song is more idiomatic, and makes perfect sense. Andrew Stiller Kallisti Music Press http://www.kallistimusic.com/kallisti.html ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German
As literal as possible: When it forgets itself in dust,/ Bear it with patience On 4 Mar 2007, at 18:30, Andrew Stiller wrote: As long as we're on this subject, I'd like to ask the list's German speakers to vet a few lines of a translation of mine. In a 19th-c. oratorio text, the poetry at one point says (of the poet's soul): Wenn sie im Staube sich vergisst, / So trag' sie mit Geduld. Which I have rendered as: Even when it lies forgetful in the dust, / Still it abides in patience. --but this doesn't quite feel right to me. Have I gone astray somehow, or is this basically correct? Andrew Stiller Kallisti Music Press http://www.kallistimusic.com/kallisti.html ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German
But Schlufslied exists as a Song of the rooster. I don't know the context, neither the age, neither the place of this song in the whole opus, but IF it's the end, I'd agree with something like Ending or Final Song, BUT if it's not the end, I'll say it *could* be a Rooster Song. Hans --- You will excuse me for any typo's due to a visual handicap. On 04 mrt 2007, at 18:26, dc wrote: shirling neueweise écrit: I agree, Schlußlied is another possibility. end song!? more likely schlaflied, as was suggested elsewhere. Why more likely? Schlaflied means there are two typos, Schlusslied only one... Dennis ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Outgoing mail checked by Norton Antivirus ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] 6/4 3/2
On Mar 4, 2007, at 5:47 AM, David W. Fenton wrote: On 3 Mar 2007 at 18:09, Chuck Israels wrote: On Mar 3, 2007, at 5:50 PM, David W. Fenton wrote: How do you resolve those things without endless rehearsal? What if two players have the same passage but interpret the notation slightly differently? Or in contradictory ways? Ah, I think that happens often, and sometimes produces unexpectedly beautiful results. One of the charms of this method of music making. The conflicts are always resolved on the main pulses. The pushes and pulls are a big part of the thrill of the music. While I can see that in cases where players are passing motives back and forth, if they are playing in unison rhythm, particularly in faster passages, is it not a problem? Fast or slow - unison rhythm needs unified interpretation, for sure. But jazz musicians do not look to time signatures for much of the information they need to align their interpretations. In fact, for jazz musicians, the information provided by the time signature is a relatively small amount. As a person with some training in both camps, the way I experience it is this: people from both camps can be overly quick to say, This is the right way of representing information, if you want this result. And my interpretation of that, from either camp, is that that's just the way you are used to interpreting the symbols. I mean, are you arguing that it's *always* better to have loose ensemble because the notation doesn't specify a particular interpretation? Come on David, I didn't even come close to implying that. What I am saying is the more of the information in notation is in the eye of the beholder than many of us can comfortably admit. That doesn't mean one should not try for clarity and consensus, but so much depends on the habits of the interpreter that hard and fast rules are difficult to come by. Lots of music requires study to figure out the composer's intention, and other music seems (Elliot Carter) to include every nuance, and it's hard to get a good performance of any of it, it's just different kind of work that's required. Chuck -- David W. Fentonhttp://dfenton.com David Fenton Associates http://dfenton.com/DFA/ ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Chuck Israels 230 North Garden Terrace Bellingham, WA 98225-5836 phone (360) 671-3402 fax (360) 676-6055 www.chuckisraels.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] 6/4 3/2
On Mar 4, 2007, at 6:55 AM, dhbailey wrote: But the very nature of the music welcomes that sort of interpretation and any attempt to make the notation more precise and exact only gets in the way. My friend, the fine composer/arranger, David Berger would agree. He is sometimes critical of my notation habits because of this. If I had his band to play my music, I'd write fewer details. I need to write in order to communicate with the particular people who are playing the music, and I believe there is much historical precedent for that. I am beginning to be bored with the idea that there is only one clear way of communicating information. The recent posts here asking for English translations of German terms is a case in point. I need those translations (some of them anyway). Johannes does not, so does that make the composer wrong for not making his intentions clear to me? That viewpoint would seem a little parochial. Ellington, for example, would not always write out the various parts (from what I've read of his composing and arranging style) note-for-note from start to finish, but would rather put sketches and leave the actual sounds up to his trusted players. Very little in the bass parts - minimal chord symbols with only the necessary extensions. Chuck -- David H. Bailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Chuck Israels 230 North Garden Terrace Bellingham, WA 98225-5836 phone (360) 671-3402 fax (360) 676-6055 www.chuckisraels.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] 6/4 3/2
On Mar 4, 2007, at 7:09 AM, Darcy James Argue wrote: On 04 Mar 2007, at 9:55 AM, David W. Fenton wrote: If you have limited rehearsal time and/or less than stellar players, why would clearer parts *not* be a real time-saver? David, As I have said before, in the specific situation Bob was asking about, having a different meter in, e.g., the saxophones vs. the brass does *not* constitute clearer parts and would most definitely not be a time saver. One of the things that's throwing you is that jazz doesn't have pronounced downbeat accents. The first note in the bar is rarely the most accented note in the bar, even if no accents are indicated. In 4/4, an entrance or short note on beat two or four is going to be played more forcefully than one on beat 3. Using time signature changes to indicate accents, or internal accent patterns, doesn't work the way you seem to expect it to work. And Stravinsky, hearing those non-downbeat accents as if they were downbeats, notated L'Histoire in a way that makes little sense to a jazz musician. There is a story that Stravinsky, upon seeing some jazz notation, said that he'd gotten it all wrong. Chuck I think you're having some trouble wrapping your head around the idea that jazz is *deliberately* under-notated (at least, compared to a lot of 20th-century classical music) in order to leave a certain amount of flexibility in the hands of the players. Yes, it takes time for section players to get accustomed to the way the lead player phrases, but not *that* much time -- the best players will internalize most of the lead player's habits within a couple of rehearsals, at most. Over-notated parts won't help mediocre players swing harder. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Chuck Israels 230 North Garden Terrace Bellingham, WA 98225-5836 phone (360) 671-3402 fax (360) 676-6055 www.chuckisraels.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] How much can I quote?
At 1:00 AM -0500 3/4/07, Raymond Horton wrote: This sounds to me, already, like a dumb question, but here goes anyway: Is there any guideline established as to how much I can quote of a copyrighted piece of music without getting into trouble? This is not legal advice!!! No, there is nothing in the law and nothing in the Fair Use Guidelines that suggests you don't have to ask for permission to use any percentage or any number of seconds or of measures. (Actually there is something in Fair Use about the amount of music that can be copied for classroom use, but that doesn't apply to plagiarism.) Anything that suggests otherwise is pure urban legend, and would not hold up for a moment in court. As far as I know. This is where the new career path of forensic musicologist comes into play, as expert witnesses as to whether a particular 5-note motive (or whatever) is immediately recognizable as plagiarism of a copyrighted work. But since jazz improv does not exist in fixed form, you can quote How High The Moon without worrying about it! Like we were supposed to learn in kindergarten, if you want to play with someone else's property, ask permission!!! However, I seem to recall something with legal precedence about parody being all right. I may be wrong about that. John -- John Susie Howell Virginia Tech Department of Music Blacksburg, Virginia, U.S.A 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] 6/4 3/2
At 8:47 AM -0500 3/4/07, David W. Fenton wrote: I mean, are you arguing that it's *always* better to have loose ensemble because the notation doesn't specify a particular interpretation? Of course there are styles in which this is not only permitted but expected. There's even a term for it: heterophony. Intrinsic to Celtic bands and to medieval performances based on the same esthetic. Also, I would say, quite acceptable in jazz, and even to be encouraged. Would not work, of course, in a Beethoven string quartet! John -- John Susie Howell Virginia Tech Department of Music Blacksburg, Virginia, U.S.A 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Re: 6/4 3/2
This topic has touched on a huge interest of mine - the psychology of notation. Different musicians will react to and interpret beat durations very differently depending on what context they're performing in - if a composer decides to have the beat at something other than the quarter-note (or dotted quarter-note), they may get the feel they want but they're gonna need extra rehearsal time to get it right. I started out as a jazz arranger/composer for many years before I got into film scoring and finally concert composing, which is what I'm mainly up to these days. A few years ago, I was commissioned to write an arrangement for the jazz singer Kitty Margolis. The tune was a blues, but with a 12/8 feel so there were a lot of places where you had 2 against 3, of course. I had been immersing myself in 20th century compositional techniques for a few years so I went against my jazz intuition and wrote the whole thing in 12/8. The rehearsal fell flat on its face. That night I re-scored the entire chart in 4/4 and made a note that it should be a 12/8 feel. The change was night and day - the players were much more comfortable with it. I also had to make sure I didn't over-articulate either - stuff like that just frustrates good jazz performers (I knew this intuitively years before but it became more difficult with all the new techniques I had learned). -- Dr. Rob Deemer Composer/Conductor www.robdeemer.com www.myspace.com/robdeemer ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] 6/4 3/2
At 10:09 AM -0500 3/4/07, Darcy James Argue wrote: Over-notated parts won't help mediocre players swing harder. Now THAT should be done in cross-stitch and turkeywork and hung on the wall!!! John P.S. I arrange and sometimes compose for our Community Band, and it's a real problem. 99% of the players have NO swing in their playing, and coming even close to what jazz pros would do automatically depends on having the right lead trombone, lead trumpet, and lead alto playing and really leading their sections. Jazz really is a different musical world, where the same notation leads to a different dialect or even a different musical language. And yes, you have to write for your target market. But string players are even worse!! -- John Susie Howell Virginia Tech Department of Music Blacksburg, Virginia, U.S.A 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] How much can I quote?
At 10:11 AM -0500 3/4/07, dhbailey wrote: One thing I find amusing among all these apparently conflicting decisions is that the newer era of intellectual property and copyright law is still a wide-open frontier and all the judges are trying to come up with the definitive ruling, paying less attention to case law than other older, more well established areas of the law. Each judge wants to be the one who all future cases turn to and all future judges use as a basis for their rulings. So no judges want to be seen as following other judges in this area, not yet. It's sort of an alpha-dog/beta-dog fight among the judges, in my opinion. Sure, there's some of that. It's just human nature. But I suspect it's also human nature that no judge wants to be slapped on the wrist by a higher appeals court, so they CAN'T ignore the law. With luck, checks and balances actually do work. It may seem weird, but I draw a parallel with the world of beauty pageants. The judges in the Miss Virginia pageant don't just want to pick the best Miss Virginia, they want to pick the person who will be the next Miss America because that's where the prestige is. And in order for that precedent-setting ruling to be solidly established, it has to convince the appeals courts all the way up to and including the Supremes. That's how our multi-level court system is SUPPOSED to work! And a rash of contradictory lower court rulings is part of the process. John -- John Susie Howell Virginia Tech Department of Music Blacksburg, Virginia, U.S.A 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] 6/4 3/2 - articulations - Bill duncan's motto
Hi All; After reading your thoughts on the above subject, I have put my whole piece is 6/4. If it has a feeling based on 2 dotted half notes, I'll notated it that way. If it feels like 3 half notes then I will notated it that way. This is a jazz piece and must be treated that way. The whole subject came up because I asked a studio copiest. The subject of articulations was brought up. If I don't have all of the articulations shown, then it can take a lot of time answering questions. There are times when I will write 2 quarter notes. some of the band will have long-short. Others will have short-long. I love to do this on unisons. However, it does cause a lot of questions. I usually tell everyone up front that the articulations are correct. For me it comes down to Bill Duncan's rule. Be impossible to misunderstand. Thank you all for a wonderful response. Bob Florence ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Non-powers of two denominators
On my blog, and in some private emails, I've had some discussion recently about the lengthy kludges that are required to notate with non-powers-of-two-denominators, so that the counting units are not limited to wholes, halves, quarters, eighth, etc., but also include other rational units, such as triplets (thirds), quintuplets (fifths) etc.. (Please let's not get into a lengthy argument or flame war about why one should or shouldn't want to do this; some of us do it, probably beginning with Henry Cowell, and we do it for legitimate musical reasons. Basta.) The usual solution is to set up a metre that is as close in length as possible as the metre desired, enter the notes and rhythms we like and then hide the metre. A new metre notation is then inserted as a text or graphic into a space created especially for the metre notation. This is unwieldy, especially since it seems like there could be a much easier solution. Time signature - Options - Use another time signature for display already allows the presentation of a time signature that is, as far as Finale is concerned, fictional. Given the fictional nature of the notation, does anyone know if there is any structural reason why Use another time signature for display should be limited to powers-of-two? It seems like making only a small change in this feature (allowing other whole numbers in the denominator) would be an easy way for Finale to acquire a larger stake in the experimental/complexity niche. Daniel Wolf ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] German
To those of you who responded to my post: thanks for the German lesson. All of the translations make perfect sense in the context of the music. This List is a treasure trove of valuable information! ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Non-powers of two denominators
It seems like making only a small change in this feature (allowing other whole numbers in the denominator) would be an easy way for Finale to acquire a larger stake in the experimental/complexity niche. your comments make sense, and i agree; i don't know anything about the underlying programming though. in any case, you should send it to the support people, and if you get back anything other than the stock phrase thanks, i have sent this on to our developers. let me know if there is anything else i can do for you, please let us know 8^) -- shirling neueweise ... new music publishers mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] :.../ http://newmusicnotation.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German
On Mar 4, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Hans Swinnen wrote: And where I wrote in my previous post: a Kaspertheater is a theatre show with from outside manipulated dolls I would thinking on a Puppet on a string, bot there are other methods for playing this kind of theater. Best English translation for this (came to me later): Puppet Show. Christopher ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] 6/4 3/2
On Mar 4, 2007, at 12:21 PM, shirling neueweise wrote: many re-issues where band leader comments are NOT edited out have appeared in recent years, giving some interesting insight into performance/recording praxis in jazz's classic period. one great example, coltrane talking to williams (i think?) on dearly beloved (on sun ship) is something like: no i think it would be better if you can just keep... you know... keep the thing happening [something else incomprehensible]... but you can [...???]... ready? and then they blow like hell. and that was the released cut! Ha ha! Well, that is TOTALLY illuminating! Coltrane's comments obviously MADE that track shine! Christopher (I didn't understand a thing he said, either.) 8-) ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German
Schlufslied is a word I've never come across. My big Duden German dictionary was no help: could you give a source for this word? Michael On 4 Mar 2007, at 19:27, Hans Swinnen wrote: But Schlufslied exists as a Song of the rooster. I don't know the context, neither the age, neither the place of this song in the whole opus, but IF it's the end, I'd agree with something like Ending or Final Song, BUT if it's not the end, I'll say it *could* be a Rooster Song. Hans --- You will excuse me for any typo's due to a visual handicap. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Forced enclosures on measure numbers
Sorry this has been answered before, but I can't find where I put the response nor can I find where it is discussed in the manual. FinMac2006d. I am trying to force enclosed measure numbers to show up at double bars, in addition to the unenclosed ones at the beginning of lines. I set the default enclosure in Measure Numbers, and to show up only on selected measures. This means the measures I opt-click on, doesn't it? In the score, I opt-click the measure I want to force the measure number on, and it shows up, but it DOESNT show up with an enclosure. What did I do wrong? How do I force the enclosure automatically without making it enclosed at the start of the line? I don't have to make two regions, do I? Will the forced measure numbers show up on ALL extracted parts, even if I have only forced them on the top staff of the score? I would like to know this. Also, while clicking around, I opt-sh clicked a measure, and got forced measure numbers at the tops of my percussion and string sections (not the staff I clicked on) but NOT on the top staff! Thanks for the help. A direction to the relevant chapter of the docs would be fine, too. Christopher ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] mass mover - partial measure
Well I did it. I dragged a section of music with partial measure left on. Everything is off one beat. This is from 278 - 299. Is there a quick fix. I WILL NEVER USE PARTIAL MEASURE AGAIN Bob Florence MacFin 2007c ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
AW: [Finale] German
As a german native speaker I would prefer Schlusslied = Schlußlied against the maybe heavily misspelled Schlaflied. Oliver Schlufslied is a word I've never come across. My big Duden German dictionary was no help: could you give a source for this word? Michael On 4 Mar 2007, at 19:27, Hans Swinnen wrote: But Schlufslied exists as a Song of the rooster. I don't know the context, neither the age, neither the place of this song in the whole opus, but IF it's the end, I'd agree with something like Ending or Final Song, BUT if it's not the end, I'll say it *could* be a Rooster Song. Hans --- You will excuse me for any typo's due to a visual handicap. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German Kaspertheater
Kaspertheater or Kasperletheater is a puppet show with small dolls wrapped around the players hand, what means three of his fingers move head and the two arms of the puppet. It's a very famous childrens game, maybe found in every home of german families. Pictures: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaspertheater Oliver And where I wrote in my previous post: a Kaspertheater is a theatre show with from outside manipulated dolls I would thinking on a Puppet on a string, bot there are other methods for playing this kind of theater. these would be marionettes, no? although i'm not sure if the term would be used (in english) in this context, probably puppet show is the right term. -- shirling neueweise ... new music publishers mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] :.../ http://newmusicnotation.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German
Yes, this should be the best translation! Michael Cook: As literal as possible: When it forgets itself in dust,/ Bear it with patience On 4 Mar 2007, at 18:30, Andrew Stiller wrote: As long as we're on this subject, I'd like to ask the list's German speakers to vet a few lines of a translation of mine. In a 19th-c. oratorio text, the poetry at one point says (of the poet's soul): Wenn sie im Staube sich vergisst, / So trag' sie mit Geduld. Which I have rendered as: Even when it lies forgetful in the dust, / Still it abides in patience. --but this doesn't quite feel right to me. Have I gone astray somehow, or is this basically correct? Andrew Stiller Kallisti Music Press http://www.kallistimusic.com/kallisti.html ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Take 6
Hello, I have to transcribe O Thou That Tellest Good Tidings to Zion sung by Take6 on Handels Messiah/A Soulful Celebration. Does anybody have experiences with Take6-style? You also may contact me off-list. Thanks, Oliver [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] mass mover - partial measure
maybe you can just shift the passage back/forwards a beat? I WILL NEVER USE PARTIAL MEASURE AGAIN bob, just double-click to select the entire measure for the individual staff; triple-click to select the entire measure across ALL staves. -- shirling neueweise ... new music publishers mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] :.../ http://newmusicnotation.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] mass mover - partial measure
Really? Well, if you use it correctly, it works great. I wish there was a way to have a keyboard toggle or hot key to tell Finale select partial or full..other than that, it is a great feature. Bob Florence wrote: Well I did it. I dragged a section of music with partial measure left on. Everything is off one beat. This is from 278 - 299. Is there a quick fix. I WILL NEVER USE PARTIAL MEASURE AGAIN Bob Florence MacFin 2007c ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] mass mover - partial measure
On 04 Mar 2007, at 7:21 PM, Bob Florence wrote: Well I did it. I dragged a section of music with partial measure left on. Everything is off one beat. This is from 278 - 299. Is there a quick fix. Undo? Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] mass mover - partial measure
At 07:21 PM 3/4/2007, Bob Florence wrote: Well I did it. I dragged a section of music with partial measure left on. Everything is off one beat. This is from 278 - 299. Is there a quick fix. I think you should be able to leave partial measure on, select the section that's off, and drag it (or ctrl-click it) into the right position. Seems to work for me, unless I'm misunderstanding you. Aaron. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] mass mover - partial measure
On Mar 4, 2007, at 5:24 PM, Eric Dannewitz wrote: Really? Well, if you use it correctly, it works great. I wish there was a way to have a keyboard toggle or hot key to tell Finale select partial or full..other than that, it is a great feature. One of my mouse buttons is programmed to toggle that through QuicKeys. Very useful to me. Bob, Partial Measures works very well, but it does take understanding and a little practice. Chuck Bob Florence wrote: Well I did it. I dragged a section of music with partial measure left on. Everything is off one beat. This is from 278 - 299. Is there a quick fix. I WILL NEVER USE PARTIAL MEASURE AGAIN Bob Florence MacFin 2007c ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Chuck Israels 230 North Garden Terrace Bellingham, WA 98225-5836 phone (360) 671-3402 fax (360) 676-6055 www.chuckisraels.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
RE: [Finale] mass mover - partial measure
TGTools lets you assign a hot key to any Finale menu item (at least the Windows version does). I've been using hotkeys for partial measures and a couple of dozen other Finale commands for years, and it's a real productivity boost. Lee Actor Composer-in-Residence and Assistant Conductor, Palo Alto Philharmonic http://www.leeactor.com Really? Well, if you use it correctly, it works great. I wish there was a way to have a keyboard toggle or hot key to tell Finale select partial or full..other than that, it is a great feature. Bob Florence wrote: Well I did it. I dragged a section of music with partial measure left on. Everything is off one beat. This is from 278 - 299. Is there a quick fix. I WILL NEVER USE PARTIAL MEASURE AGAIN Bob Florence MacFin 2007c ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] mass mover - partial measure
Dang, just when I thought I knew all the features of TGTools...I'll have to check that out. Thanks! Lee Actor wrote: TGTools lets you assign a hot key to any Finale menu item (at least the Windows version does). I've been using hotkeys for partial measures and a couple of dozen other Finale commands for years, and it's a real productivity boost. Lee Actor Composer-in-Residence and Assistant Conductor, Palo Alto Philharmonic http://www.leeactor.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] mass mover - partial measure
I wish there was a way to have a keyboard toggle or hot key to tell Finale select partial or full iKeys -- shirling neueweise ... new music publishers mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] :.../ http://newmusicnotation.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] mass mover - partial measure
Windows only, Eric. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY On 04 Mar 2007, at 9:07 PM, Eric Dannewitz wrote: Dang, just when I thought I knew all the features of TGTools...I'll have to check that out. Thanks! Lee Actor wrote: TGTools lets you assign a hot key to any Finale menu item (at least the Windows version does). I've been using hotkeys for partial measures and a couple of dozen other Finale commands for years, and it's a real productivity boost. Lee Actor Composer-in-Residence and Assistant Conductor, Palo Alto Philharmonic http://www.leeactor.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] OT: screen capture high quality
i need to place an image of a max patch into a score legend, the image is what the technician will see onscreen (a max/MSP window) when performing the piece. the image i have is readable but not really of a satisfactory quality, and i would like to improve it somehow. doubt it makes a difference for this, but the patch is a standalone. anyone have any suggestions for the best way to do this? -- shirling neueweise ... new music publishers mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] :.../ http://newmusicnotation.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] OT: screen capture high quality
At 03:37 AM 3/5/2007 +0100, shirling neueweise wrote: i need to place an image of a max patch into a score legend, the image is what the technician will see onscreen (a max/MSP window) when performing the piece. the image i have is readable but not really of a satisfactory quality, and i would like to improve it somehow. doubt it makes a difference for this, but the patch is a standalone. anyone have any suggestions for the best way to do this? I don't have Max/MSP so don't know what the patch images look like. What's the problem with the patch image? If it's resolution, there are ways to give it the illusion of clarity through a variety of upsizing, blurring, sharpness masking, and even shadowing. Is the patch windows resizable? If it can be magnified, do a screen capture and then process it. Post a sample to your site. Dennis ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] mass mover - partial measure
Damn..I'll check out iKeys and Quickeys.. Darcy James Argue wrote: Windows only, Eric. Cheers, - Darcy ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Re: 6/4 3/2
I thought I'd chime in here as an LA jazz musician who has actually worked with Bob Florence and played his charts. My recommendation would be to notate the entire chart in 6/4 and notate/beam the music accordingly to reflect the 6/4 or 3/2 pulse. This would make it easier to read and reduce rehearsal time. If it becomes a tedious exercise to manually change the beaming in 3/2 sections, you can set staves to have independent time sigs and then set certain passages to be in 3/2 (for easier entry) but display as 6/4 so that the time sig change will be invisible. I agree with those who assert that LA studio musicians have big ears, and much of how they play is dictated by the feel of the rhythm section and the lead players, rather than by the exact notation. Hope this helps, Brian Williams ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] OT: screen capture high quality
I'm not sure what platform you're on, but I place Max patches and symbols into scores and documents frequently straight from a screen capture. I just use Grab in Mac OS X 10.4.8. The resolution I get is acceptable for my use in scores/Word docs, etc. Grab is incredibly easy to use, if you do have a Mac. From within any program (you don't have to open Grab from the Utilities folder to use it): Command-Shift-3: Capture entire screen Command-Shift-4: Capture a selection Command-Shift-4, release and then press space bar: Capture the full size of any window, dialog box, menu bar, etc. that you click on after pressing space bar I don't know if this helps at all. If you'd like, I can contact Miller Puckette who wrote the original program and subsequent documentation (filled with visual examples) to see how he has done it. He's still writing Pd documentation, so I'm sure he'd be happy to help. --Brennon On Mar 4, 2007, at 6:37 PM, shirling neueweise wrote: i need to place an image of a max patch into a score legend, the image is what the technician will see onscreen (a max/MSP window) when performing the piece. the image i have is readable but not really of a satisfactory quality, and i would like to improve it somehow. doubt it makes a difference for this, but the patch is a standalone. anyone have any suggestions for the best way to do this? -- shirling neueweise ... new music publishers mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] :.../ http://newmusicnotation.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Brennon Bortz Teaching Assistant and Graduate Student - Music Composition University of California, Riverside [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] mass mover - partial measure
I've googled iKeys, but don't seem to come up with anything... Does anyone know the developer's name? And, can it automate things beyond keystrokes (like menu-clicks, etc.), in the same way that QuickKeys does? Thanks, Brennon On Mar 4, 2007, at 6:38 PM, Eric Dannewitz wrote: Damn..I'll check out iKeys and Quickeys.. Darcy James Argue wrote: Windows only, Eric. Cheers, - Darcy ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Brennon Bortz Teaching Assistant and Graduate Student - Music Composition University of California, Riverside [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] OT: screen capture high quality
Also, if you are using screen capture, you can expand the size of Max/ MSP/Jitter objects and the text inside of them. This would make for a more readable, crisp capture. This can be a real pain though, if you have a lot of objects. I haven't found a way to enlarge the text and resize objects for multiple objects at once. If you do, please do let me know off-list. Finally, I'd save a separate copy to make any visual modifications for screen capturing with. I'm sure you know, but Max only has one undo level. I've had this cause numerous headaches and late-nights. Always save a separate copy before you go screwing with a complicated patch... --Brennon On Mar 4, 2007, at 6:37 PM, shirling neueweise wrote: i need to place an image of a max patch into a score legend, the image is what the technician will see onscreen (a max/MSP window) when performing the piece. the image i have is readable but not really of a satisfactory quality, and i would like to improve it somehow. doubt it makes a difference for this, but the patch is a standalone. anyone have any suggestions for the best way to do this? -- shirling neueweise ... new music publishers mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] :.../ http://newmusicnotation.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Brennon Bortz Teaching Assistant and Graduate Student - Music Composition University of California, Riverside [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] OT: iKey, was mass mover - partial measure
http://www.scriptsoftware.com/ikey/ Brennon Bortz wrote: I've googled iKeys, but don't seem to come up with anything... Does anyone know the developer's name? And, can it automate things beyond keystrokes (like menu-clicks, etc.), in the same way that QuickKeys does? Thanks, Brennon ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] German Kaspertheater
There is also a tradition, albeit relatively rare today in Germany, of Kasperletheater using stringed marionettes. (The Augsburger Peppenkisten, for example, plays Kasperle as a marionette; in the Czech tradition, Kasparek is usually a marionette). This is usually a professional practice and comes rather directly from antecedents in marionettes based on figures from the Italian Commedia. The puppets for which Mozart composed his youthful puppet play were probably marionettes, as were the Kasperle puppets in the 19th century plays by Franz von Pocci. The handpuppets, on the the other hand are indeed now an ubiquitous children's toy in Germany as well as used by professionals, and while Kasperle is the direct relation of Punch in English-speaking countries or Jan Klassen in Holland and even the FRench language Grand Guignole figures, he (and his southern relation Hans Wurst) is now a rather benign, if not even sweet, figure in Germany Daniel Wolf Frankfurt. Oliver Pospiech wrote: Kaspertheater or Kasperletheater is a puppet show with small dolls wrapped around the players hand, what means three of his fingers move head and the two arms of the puppet. It's a very famous childrens game, maybe found in every home of german families. Pictures: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaspertheater Oliver ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
