[Flightgear-devel] ATC control
What it ATC... ? My plan is to work with Mr Master ATC in Frakfurt.. But how do we do that... AFAIK the sid and star and kind of the recipie.. So Stutggart is an atraction because of that... My questiion is how do we make it a hand over of control of observer The enviroment is created by jommo.. but we need many jommos.. What this leads to is an enviroment where u eitheer aare in ATC control Or not.. I would like myself with a frankfurt... to create a kinda ATC course.. The vision though is to take jommo a bit further.. iE FROM LOCAL AIRPORT CONTROL TO SECTORS.. This would be a good change.. Now I am really interested in this and I think is a cool way to introduce the whole envirement... This is crucial to the sucess fo FG in my head,... The chat line and the stability of fg recplaing vatsim.. Big question to my mind is... Can someone explain the difference between vatsim and the otherss..?? Server wise I ussed to un biasva.com.. but the pilot is so stubbord I am not allowed to get near theaaricraft i wanna fix.. the idea kindaa,.. Mass ditrib and de central atmo for example.. -- See everything from the browser to the database with AppDynamics Get end-to-end visibility with application monitoring from AppDynamics Isolate bottlenecks and diagnose root cause in seconds. Start your free trial of AppDynamics Pro today! http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=48808831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC and radio signal attenuation
On Monday, September 05, 2011 20:01:29 Durk Talsma wrote: I'm a little pressed for time this week, so I have to keep my response a little on the short side. In essence, I think that this would be any extremely cool feature to have. Do you already have a working copy that you would consider merging with flightgear/next? If so, I would like to do so and give it a shot (after having tried it locally and after ensuring that everything works okay). So far, I only have one humble request, which is an option to conditionally disable it. Although I haven't really had the need to listen to distant stations yet, I can imagine that certain situations will arise where I need to be able to follow ATC messages across larger distances. Given that during the development cycle I would rather concentrate on debugging than on deciphering a radio message, I think that an option to conditionally disable ATC signal attenuation would be very welcome. Cheers, Durk Hi Durk, Yes I have it working, you can test it by cloning locally g...@gitorious.org:~kantooon/fg/kantooons-flightgear.git and building branch radio-att. To test, you need a) an airport with ground traffic when you start and b) some hilly/mountainous terain arround that will affect the signal. Given the fact that I don't have a signal strength instrument, I am printing to stderr various information about the signal. The code does make a difference between ground transmissions and aircraft transmissions, so don't be surprised if you can hear tower and can't hear the aircraft on ground. In the future, I would also like to differentiate radio equipment in large aircraft from small, portable, airband transceivers you can find on light craft. If any of you guys that are also pilots can provide me with ERP values for various types of transceivers, including ATC ones, this would be also very useful, since I am basing my current values on some estimations. Since the model does 40 MHz to 20 GHz, calculations for frequencies out of the civilian VHF airband will yield different results, including military airband and radar (establishing a link budget for a radar emission is a whole different issue though). It also can account for the type of terrain underneath (based on surface impedance values). It would be useless though for shortwave SSB radio, since propagation at those frequencies is different. However, in the current state it's kind of a hack job, being on top of FGATCController and all. As Torsten and Martin have mentioned, there could be multiple uses for this, navradio, voice comms etc., so I think making this a stand-alone radio subsystem is a must. I have started doing just that, but I still need suggestions from you on how to integrate this with the rest of the code. So far, I think exposing a receive_text() function to the ATC system, callable with the position of the sender, frequency used, message string, and type of transmission would cover the ATC/AI territory. This would be complemented with a transmit_text() for the pilot-ATC interaction. As far as disabling/enabling it, should probably be enabled by a switch like realistic radio on/off. Still regarding radio and ATC, I have a problem with the AI being told to switch to an arbitrary number freq by Ground after startup. After digging around, I had found what seems like an out-of-bounds array reading in dynamics.cxx : https://gitorious.org/~kantooon/fg/kantooons- flightgear/commit/c69c91769e15d550d8cff48aec09edbd2a562e7a This seems to happen when the airport has only one ground frequency. Could you please verify that my patch is correct? Cheers, Adrian -- Special Offer -- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! And you'll get a free Love Thy Logs t-shirt when you download Logger. Secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsisghtdev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC and radio signal attenuation
Hi Adrian, So far, only ground to AI aircraft and AI aircraft to ground is implemented, as part of the FGATCController class. This system, if proven functional, should probably be split into a separate module and applied to all comunication, including player-to-ground and player- to-player. All code is available in my clone, branch radio-att. I'm a little pressed for time this week, so I have to keep my response a little on the short side. In essence, I think that this would be any extremely cool feature to have. Do you already have a working copy that you would consider merging with flightgear/next? If so, I would like to do so and give it a shot (after having tried it locally and after ensuring that everything works okay). So far, I only have one humble request, which is an option to conditionally disable it. Although I haven't really had the need to listen to distant stations yet, I can imagine that certain situations will arise where I need to be able to follow ATC messages across larger distances. Given that during the development cycle I would rather concentrate on debugging than on deciphering a radio message, I think that an option to conditionally disable ATC signal attenuation would be very welcome. Cheers, Durk -- Special Offer -- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! And you'll get a free Love Thy Logs t-shirt when you download Logger. Secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsisghtdev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC and radio signal attenuation
If you know the phone number of the ATC facility, you should be able to enter it into a popup that looks like a satphone and communicate with them without the attenuation constraint. Oh, and extend the ATC dialog to understand say phone number and on landing call interactions. On Mon, Sep 5, 2011 at 10:01 AM, Durk Talsma durkt...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Adrian, So far, only ground to AI aircraft and AI aircraft to ground is implemented, as part of the FGATCController class. This system, if proven functional, should probably be split into a separate module and applied to all comunication, including player-to-ground and player- to-player. All code is available in my clone, branch radio-att. I'm a little pressed for time this week, so I have to keep my response a little on the short side. In essence, I think that this would be any extremely cool feature to have. Do you already have a working copy that you would consider merging with flightgear/next? If so, I would like to do so and give it a shot (after having tried it locally and after ensuring that everything works okay). So far, I only have one humble request, which is an option to conditionally disable it. Although I haven't really had the need to listen to distant stations yet, I can imagine that certain situations will arise where I need to be able to follow ATC messages across larger distances. Given that during the development cycle I would rather concentrate on debugging than on deciphering a radio message, I think that an option to conditionally disable ATC signal attenuation would be very welcome. Cheers, Durk -- Special Offer -- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! And you'll get a free Love Thy Logs t-shirt when you download Logger. Secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsisghtdev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel -- Special Offer -- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! And you'll get a free Love Thy Logs t-shirt when you download Logger. Secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsisghtdev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC and radio signal attenuation
Adrian Musceac wrote: I have started to implement radio signal attenuation into the ATC subsystem, with the goal to later move this to it's own location. I'm pretty certain that future will show us many possible uses for a generic implementation (just think of FGCom). Nice to hear about it, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- Special Offer -- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! And you'll get a free Love Thy Logs t-shirt when you download Logger. Secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsisghtdev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC and radio signal attenuation
Hi, This message is mostly meant for Durk, but I expect suggestions from anyone who knows the scenery subsystem of Flightgear. I have started to implement radio signal attenuation into the ATC subsystem, with the goal to later move this to it's own location. I have chosen the Irregular Terrain Model (ITM) developed by Longley-Rice in the 70's for several reasons: 1. the software was developed by an US government agency and is therefore public domain. Original code and documentation: http://flattop.its.bldrdoc.gov/itm.html 2. a more recent version of the software is available from the developers of Splat!, a GPL radio-propagation tool used by professionals and amateurs. This version is just a rewrite of the original C++ code that removes DLL-isms and adds useful comments. More information on Splat! and example use-cases can be found at: http://www.qsl.net/kd2bd/splat.html 3. this propagation model is extremely configurable and I have verified via experimental results it's precision (when fed with appropriate data). It is capable of computing line-of-sight atmospheric loss, troposcatter loss for non LOS endpoints, simple and double diffraction loss when terrain is a factor between the transceiver and the receiver. It does not calculate reflection on terrain features, and it's diffraction routines, especially for large knife-edge angles, have been verified to be inaccurate. Nevertheless, important improvements have been added by Sid Shumate et al. in the last few years, that increase the precision by a large number. These improvements, however, are limited by a non-commercial clause, so if there is a need for great accuracy one must compile his own ITM. His progress and detailed explanations on limitations and advantages of ITM can be tracked at the IEEE Broadcast Technology Society Newsletter. http://bts.ieee.org/ieee-broadcast-technology-society-newsletter.html This radio propagation model ensures that terrain between the station transmitting and the station receiving (the pilot) will block communication under the right circumstances, close to reality. The earth curvature is also taken into account and has an effect on signal quality. Apart from cutting off the transmission, I am also mangling the radio text if the signal-to-noise ratio is below a certain value. Coupled with festival voice, the results are interesting, but more could be done. The key point of the implementation is sampling of terrain elevation between the two radio terminals. This may require some scenery tile loading, but I leave that to the experts. So far, only ground to AI aircraft and AI aircraft to ground is implemented, as part of the FGATCController class. This system, if proven functional, should probably be split into a separate module and applied to all comunication, including player-to-ground and player- to-player. All code is available in my clone, branch radio-att. 73, Adrian, YO8RZZ -- Special Offer -- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! And you'll get a free Love Thy Logs t-shirt when you download Logger. Secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsisghtdev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC and radio signal attenuation
On Sunday, September 04, 2011 17:09:43 Torsten Dreyer wrote: Hi Adrian, this all sounds very interesting and not only for AI Aircraft but also for the navigation radios. I am currently refactoring the navradio code and I'd really like to have a better propagation model than our current distance-squared or hard-cutoff model. Torsten Hi Torsten, the details of the implementation are as follows: - hard cut-off at 400km, - yet to be done: LOS mode with first Fresnel zone clearance (skips the point_to_point subroutine) - between user's aircraft and traffic/ATC within the 400 km zone, attenuation is calculated with point_to_point(): Line-Of-Sight Mode, Single Horizon, Double Horizon, Diffraction Dominant, Troposcatter Dominant. - the main issue is the fact that if the transmitter radio is located outside of the tile cache area, there will be no elevation profiles. I do not know how to handle this yet, but I know you probably do. - a link budget is established based on (yet) hardcoded values for transmitter power, receiver sensitivity and antenna gain at both ends. These are separated for ground stations and aircraft for obvious reasons. - loss is substracted from the link budget (working with dBm here). If resultant signal is lower then receiver treshhold, the communication is discarded. If the signal is within a zone where SNR has a great influence on reception, parts of the message are garbled. - this is all inside the trafficcontrol.cxx file, but it should probably be made independent. For me it was just a test run, to confirm that Durk's new ATC code works fine with this - and it does. I could see this applying to navradios too, except that in that case we have mostly continuous/repetitive transmissions, and this model relies on extracting an elevation profile between receiver and transceiver. Thus, optimizations to my code will most likely be necessary to use with navradios. Anyway, in all my tests terrain is blocking transmissions as expected and within the limits of the charts I have pre-generated and calibrated with physical signal-level readings. 73, Adrian, YO8RZZ -- Special Offer -- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! And you'll get a free Love Thy Logs t-shirt when you download Logger. Secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsisghtdev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC ground network display
Hi Adrian, On 01 Sep 2011, at 05:09, Adrian Musceac wrote: Hi, I have noticed that when enabled, the ground network is displayed above the airport, at a variable height, depending on the airport's elevation above sea level. This is mostly due to the fact that the elevation is in feet instead of meters. I have attached a patch that corrects this behaviour and takes into account sloping terrain at airports. Now the network is displayed for both pilot and AI aicraft at 0.5 meters above ground. Let me know if this is helpful. Thanks, Adrian Incidentally, I had been working on a similar patch last weekend. I decided to try a slightly different approach by collecting elevation information on the fly (i.e. as an aircraft was taxiing along a given route), and storing the information collected in a cache file. I've not been entirely satisfied with my own results yet. Just from a quick look, your patch seems to complement my work pretty well, so I hope I can integrated your patch with my development tree. As with other AI activities, I'll try to schedule some time for that this weekend. Thanks, Durk -- Special Offer -- Download ArcSight Logger for FREE! Finally, a world-class log management solution at an even better price-free! And you'll get a free Love Thy Logs t-shirt when you download Logger. Secure your free ArcSight Logger TODAY! http://p.sf.net/sfu/arcsisghtdev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC ground network display
Hi,
I have noticed that when enabled, the ground network is displayed above the
airport, at a variable height, depending on the airport's elevation above sea
level. This is mostly due to the fact that the elevation is in feet instead of
meters.
I have attached a patch that corrects this behaviour and takes into account
sloping terrain at airports. Now the network is displayed for both pilot and
AI aicraft at 0.5 meters above ground.
Let me know if this is helpful.
Thanks,
Adrian
diff --git a/src/ATC/trafficcontrol.cxx b/src/ATC/trafficcontrol.cxx
index 8025fe6..e47f65a 100644
--- a/src/ATC/trafficcontrol.cxx
+++ b/src/ATC/trafficcontrol.cxx
@@ -1278,6 +1278,10 @@ void FGStartupController::render(bool visible)
}
if (visible) {
group = new osg::Group;
+
+FGScenery * local_scenery = globals-get_scenery();
+double elevation_meters = 0.0;
+double elevation_feet = 0.0;
//for ( FGTaxiSegmentVectorIterator i = segments.begin(); i != segments.end(); i++) {
double dx = 0;
@@ -1304,8 +1308,18 @@ void FGStartupController::render(bool visible)
osg::Matrix obj_pos;
osg::MatrixTransform *obj_trans = new osg::MatrixTransform;
obj_trans-setDataVariance(osg::Object::STATIC);
-
-WorldCoordinate( obj_pos, center.getLatitudeDeg(), center.getLongitudeDeg(), parent-getElevation()+8+dx, -(heading) );
+
+//get HAAT from scenery
+SGGeod center2 = center;
+center2.setElevationM(SG_MAX_ELEVATION_M);
+ if (local_scenery-get_elevation_m( center2, elevation_meters, NULL )) {
+ elevation_feet = elevation_meters * SG_METER_TO_FEET + 0.5;
+ elevation_meters += 0.5;
+ }
+ else
+ elevation_meters = parent-getElevation()+8+dx;
+
+WorldCoordinate( obj_pos, center.getLatitudeDeg(), center.getLongitudeDeg(), elevation_meters, -(heading) );
obj_trans-setMatrix( obj_pos );
//osg::Vec3 center(0, 0, 0)
@@ -1339,7 +1353,16 @@ void FGStartupController::render(bool visible)
osg::MatrixTransform *obj_trans = new osg::MatrixTransform;
obj_trans-setDataVariance(osg::Object::STATIC);
FGTaxiSegment *segment = parent-getGroundNetwork()-findSegment(k);
-WorldCoordinate( obj_pos, segment-getLatitude(), segment-getLongitude(), parent-getElevation()+8+dx, -(segment-getHeading()) );
+
+SGGeod center2=segment-getGeod();
+center2.setElevationM(SG_MAX_ELEVATION_M);
+if (local_scenery-get_elevation_m( center2, elevation_meters, NULL )) {
+ elevation_feet = elevation_meters * SG_METER_TO_FEET + 0.5;
+ elevation_meters += 0.5;
+}
+ else
+ elevation_meters = parent-getElevation()+8+dx;
+WorldCoordinate( obj_pos, segment-getLatitude(), segment-getLongitude(), elevation_meters, -(segment-getHeading()) );
obj_trans-setMatrix( obj_pos );
//osg::Vec3 center(0, 0, 0)
diff --git a/src/Airports/groundnetwork.cxx b/src/Airports/groundnetwork.cxx
index a642a77..c63c0a3 100644
--- a/src/Airports/groundnetwork.cxx
+++ b/src/Airports/groundnetwork.cxx
@@ -1155,7 +1155,9 @@ void FGGroundNetwork::render(bool visible)
}
if (visible) {
group = new osg::Group;
-
+FGScenery * local_scenery = globals-get_scenery();
+double elevation_meters = 0.0;
+double elevation_feet = 0.0;
//for ( FGTaxiSegmentVectorIterator i = segments.begin(); i != segments.end(); i++) {
double dx = 0;
for (TrafficVectorIterator i = activeTraffic.begin(); i != activeTraffic.end(); i++) {
@@ -1174,6 +1176,16 @@ void FGGroundNetwork::render(bool visible)
double coveredDistance = length * 0.5;
SGGeod center;
SGGeodesy::direct(start, heading, coveredDistance, center, az2);
+
+//get HAAT from scenery
+SGGeod center2 = center;
+center2.setElevationM(SG_MAX_ELEVATION_M);
+ if (local_scenery-get_elevation_m( center2, elevation_meters, NULL )) {
+ elevation_feet = elevation_meters * SG_METER_TO_FEET + 0.5;
+ elevation_meters += 0.5;
+ }
+ else
+ elevation_meters = parent-getElevation()+8+dx;
//cerr Active Aircraft : Centerpoint = ( center.getLatitudeDeg() , center.getLongitudeDeg() ). Heading = heading endl;
///
// Make a helper function out of this
@@ -1181,7 +1193,7 @@ void FGGroundNetwork::render(bool visible)
osg::MatrixTransform *obj_trans = new
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC-AI interaction code (part 1) committed
Durk Still some problems. You seem to have just copied ATCDialog to ATCDialogOld, leaving the original ATCDialog in place. Also in ATCDialogOld.cxx, #include ATCDialog.hxx should probably be modified to #include ATCDialogOld.hxx, and anywhere else that this include is needed. Until the MSVC project files are updated in Git, to compile under windows it is necessary to drag ATCDialogOld.cxx/hxx into the ATCDL project and delete ATCDialog.cxx/hxx. In the ATC project drag in the atc_mgr and atcdialog files. Alan -- Storage Efficiency Calculator This modeling tool is based on patent-pending intellectual property that has been used successfully in hundreds of IBM storage optimization engage- ments, worldwide. Store less, Store more with what you own, Move data to the right place. Try It Now! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51427378/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC-AI interaction code (part 1) committed
On 25 Jul 2011, at 11:46, Alan Teeder wrote: Also in ATCDialogOld.cxx, #include ATCDialog.hxx should probably be modified to #include ATCDialogOld.hxx, and anywhere else that this include is needed. Looks like I missed pushing part of my local changes onto gitorious. It should be working now (apart from updating hte MSVC build files). Cheers, Durk -- Storage Efficiency Calculator This modeling tool is based on patent-pending intellectual property that has been used successfully in hundreds of IBM storage optimization engage- ments, worldwide. Store less, Store more with what you own, Move data to the right place. Try It Now! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51427378/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC-AI interaction code (part 1) committed
Okay, I wish I could do that myself, but I'm a little rusty on the windows build environment. If anybody could enlighten me which build files should be changed, I'd be happy to do so (last year I touched the windows build files, in response to James' Hudson server, but the results were somewhat mixed, IIRC. Done that for the VC90 project file. Torsten -- Storage Efficiency Calculator This modeling tool is based on patent-pending intellectual property that has been used successfully in hundreds of IBM storage optimization engage- ments, worldwide. Store less, Store more with what you own, Move data to the right place. Try It Now! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51427378/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC-AI interaction code (part 1) committed
Hi All,
Thanks to the miserable weather in North Western Europe, and due to the fact
that we are at the beginning of a new release cycle, I managed to fix the last
remaining issues of my current AI/ATC work. Although the current code is still
a little rough, I believe that it shouldn't interfere with normal flightgear
activities if you don't use it. The new code allows the user aircraft to
interact with the AI traffic system. Currently, I have included support for
requesting startup permission, as well as push-back and taxi clearance issues.
I hope that I'm able, in the next 6 months, to fine tune and expand the current
system. As an example of what is currently possible, you should be able to run
the following sequence:
Start FlightGear using the following command line
fgfs --aircraft=747-400 --parkpos=G5 --airport=EHAM
(In the following, I am using the call sign PH-DRK, the exact interactions
may vary depending on time of day, aircraft, etc etc). The the AI system
currently uses a few defaults that assume you want to do an IFR flight from
your current airport to your current airport).
Press the apostrophe (') key. This will bring up the ATC Communication dialog
box.
Press the v key to switch to external views.
Press the select the second entry on the dialog menu (by clicking it, or
pressing the 2 key). This will toggle a graphical representation of the
ground network routes, as they are currently programmed. You can activate or
deactivate this ground network visibility to your own liking, but since EHAM
has a relatively poor correspondence between the layout of the ground network
and the current underlying terrain, we leave it on for now. ATC expects you to
follow the ground network rather closely.
Okay, we're ready to go: Press the first option 1 PH-DRK Ready to Start up.
This is just a pre-announcement. No further action is required. Once the
message is processed, the contents of the ATC Dialog will be cleared.
Next: Request permission for start-up: select the message: Schiphol-ground,
This is PH-DRK. Position G5. Information delta. IFR to Schiphol. Request
start-up.
ATC will respond by giving you startup clearance. Acknowledge your startup
permission by selecting the message: Schiphol-Ground. Startup-approved. delta
correct, runway 24, Spijkerboor departure, squawk 4126. For push-back and taxi
clearance call 121.80. PH-DRK.
Now, set the transponder to 4126, and set the standby comm frequency to 121.8,
and execute the startup procedure.
Sign off from the startup procedure controller by selecting the message:
Switching to Schiphol-ground at 121.8.
Switch com1 selected frequency to 121.8 by switching active and standby
frequencies.
Announce your position to the controller by selecting message Schiphol-ground:
PH-DRK, with you.
(the ground controller will acknowledge your request by saying Roger)
Request push back clearance: Select Schiphol-ground. Request push-back.
PH-DRK.
(usually the ground controller wil acknowlegde your request: PH-DRK, push-back
approved, Schiphol-ground)
select the pushback vehicle: (Menu - Boeing 747-400 - pushback) and execute
a push back. For better visual reference, use an external view. Steer the
aircraft as closely as possible to the end of the push-back route. Once you get
near, a new message will be selectable from the ATC Dialog, to announce you're
ready for taxiing. Disconnect the push-back truck and announce you're ready to
taxi. Select the Schiphol-ground. Ready to Taxi. PH-DRK message.
(ATC will give you taxi clearance). Acknowledge clearance by selecting the
Message Schiphol-ground. Cleared to Taxi. PH-DRK..
Follow the indicated taxi route: If you have enabled the groundnetwork
visualization: Just followed the red orange taper lines.
If you are lucky (on unlucky, depending on your point of view), there will be
other traffic you need to interact with. Watch out for ATC Hold position
instructions (NOTE that the latter possibly doesn't work with 100% reliability
yet).
Please let me know if you run into any major issues. I tried catching the most
obvious errors, but it's impossible to for see all possible contingencies. I'll
try to fix any major issues as soon as possible.
cheers, and enjoy,
Durk
--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC-AI interaction code (part 1) committed
There are now files named ATCDialog.cxx/hxx in Lib-ATCDL and
atcdialog.cxx/hxx in Lib_ATC.
MS-Windows does not like this ;-(
Alan
-Original Message-
From: Durk Talsma
Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2011 12:13 PM
To: FlightGear developers discussions
Subject: [Flightgear-devel] ATC-AI interaction code (part 1) committed
Hi All,
Thanks to the miserable weather in North Western Europe, and due to the fact
that we are at the beginning of a new release cycle, I managed to fix the
last remaining issues of my current AI/ATC work. Although the current code
is still a little rough, I believe that it shouldn't interfere with normal
flightgear activities if you don't use it. The new code allows the user
aircraft to interact with the AI traffic system. Currently, I have included
support for requesting startup permission, as well as push-back and taxi
clearance issues. I hope that I'm able, in the next 6 months, to fine tune
and expand the current system. As an example of what is currently possible,
you should be able to run the following sequence:
Start FlightGear using the following command line
fgfs --aircraft=747-400 --parkpos=G5 --airport=EHAM
(In the following, I am using the call sign PH-DRK, the exact interactions
may vary depending on time of day, aircraft, etc etc). The the AI system
currently uses a few defaults that assume you want to do an IFR flight from
your current airport to your current airport).
Press the apostrophe (') key. This will bring up the ATC Communication
dialog box.
Press the v key to switch to external views.
Press the select the second entry on the dialog menu (by clicking it, or
pressing the 2 key). This will toggle a graphical representation of the
ground network routes, as they are currently programmed. You can activate or
deactivate this ground network visibility to your own liking, but since EHAM
has a relatively poor correspondence between the layout of the ground
network and the current underlying terrain, we leave it on for now. ATC
expects you to follow the ground network rather closely.
Okay, we're ready to go: Press the first option 1 PH-DRK Ready to Start
up. This is just a pre-announcement. No further action is required. Once
the message is processed, the contents of the ATC Dialog will be cleared.
Next: Request permission for start-up: select the message: Schiphol-ground,
This is PH-DRK. Position G5. Information delta. IFR to Schiphol. Request
start-up.
ATC will respond by giving you startup clearance. Acknowledge your startup
permission by selecting the message: Schiphol-Ground. Startup-approved.
delta correct, runway 24, Spijkerboor departure, squawk 4126. For push-back
and taxi clearance call 121.80. PH-DRK.
Now, set the transponder to 4126, and set the standby comm frequency to
121.8, and execute the startup procedure.
Sign off from the startup procedure controller by selecting the message:
Switching to Schiphol-ground at 121.8.
Switch com1 selected frequency to 121.8 by switching active and standby
frequencies.
Announce your position to the controller by selecting message
Schiphol-ground: PH-DRK, with you.
(the ground controller will acknowledge your request by saying Roger)
Request push back clearance: Select Schiphol-ground. Request push-back.
PH-DRK.
(usually the ground controller wil acknowlegde your request: PH-DRK,
push-back approved, Schiphol-ground)
select the pushback vehicle: (Menu - Boeing 747-400 - pushback) and
execute a push back. For better visual reference, use an external view.
Steer the aircraft as closely as possible to the end of the push-back route.
Once you get near, a new message will be selectable from the ATC Dialog, to
announce you're ready for taxiing. Disconnect the push-back truck and
announce you're ready to taxi. Select the Schiphol-ground. Ready to Taxi.
PH-DRK message.
(ATC will give you taxi clearance). Acknowledge clearance by selecting the
Message Schiphol-ground. Cleared to Taxi. PH-DRK..
Follow the indicated taxi route: If you have enabled the groundnetwork
visualization: Just followed the red orange taper lines.
If you are lucky (on unlucky, depending on your point of view), there will
be other traffic you need to interact with. Watch out for ATC Hold
position instructions (NOTE that the latter possibly doesn't work with 100%
reliability yet).
Please let me know if you run into any major issues. I tried catching the
most obvious errors, but it's impossible to for see all possible
contingencies. I'll try to fix any major issues as soon as possible.
cheers, and enjoy,
Durk
--
Magic Quadrant for Content-Aware Data Loss Prevention
Research study explores the data loss prevention market. Includes in-depth
analysis on the changes within the DLP market, and the criteria used to
evaluate the strengths and weaknesses of these DLP solutions.
http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC-AI interaction code (part 1) committed
On 24 Jul 2011, at 18:40, Alan Teeder wrote: There are now files named ATCDialog.cxx/hxx in Lib-ATCDL and atcdialog.cxx/hxx in Lib_ATC. MS-Windows does not like this ;-( Alan Okay, I've renamed ATCDialog.[ch]xx (in ATCDCL) to ATCDialogOld.[ch]xx You might still need to modify the MSVC build files (haven't done so yet), in order to pick up the new names. I'll try to find out which files I need to change for that. Cheers, Durk -- Magic Quadrant for Content-Aware Data Loss Prevention Research study explores the data loss prevention market. Includes in-depth analysis on the changes within the DLP market, and the criteria used to evaluate the strengths and weaknesses of these DLP solutions. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51385063/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC client
Eftychios Eftychiou wrote: On Tue, Nov 30, 2010 at 11:03 PM, Martin Spott martin.sp...@mgras.netwrote: I'm surprised to read that they're actually now having source code on offer, do you have a pointer to the code ? You will need to sign up at http://forge.osor.eu/projects/albadisp/ and join the project to get the code. Mmmmh it's not my understanding of Open Source Community when you have to sign a license agreement, in which you basically waive all your rights, before you're permitted to _read_ the source code. It's also quite interesting that they care that much about patenting clauses, is their software covered by patents they don't want to share with the public ? [...] I just suggested that there might not be a need to re-invent the wheel when there is solution out there already. Exactly my intention - considering the fact that OpenRADAR had seen life years before SkyGuide made their first announcement ;-) Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- Increase Visibility of Your 3D Game App Earn a Chance To Win $500! Tap into the largest installed PC base get more eyes on your game by optimizing for Intel(R) Graphics Technology. Get started today with the Intel(R) Software Partner Program. Five $500 cash prizes are up for grabs. http://p.sf.net/sfu/intelisp-dev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC client
On Wed, Dec 1, 2010 at 10:39 AM, Martin Spott martin.sp...@mgras.netwrote: Eftychios Eftychiou wrote: On Tue, Nov 30, 2010 at 11:03 PM, Martin Spott martin.sp...@mgras.net wrote: I'm surprised to read that they're actually now having source code on offer, do you have a pointer to the code ? You will need to sign up at http://forge.osor.eu/projects/albadisp/ and join the project to get the code. Mmmmh it's not my understanding of Open Source Community when you have to sign a license agreement, in which you basically waive all your rights, before you're permitted to _read_ the source code. It's also quite interesting that they care that much about patenting clauses, is their software covered by patents they don't want to share with the public ? The code is there and available released under GNU 2. [...] I just suggested that there might not be a need to re-invent the wheel when there is solution out there already. Exactly my intention - considering the fact that OpenRADAR had seen life years before SkyGuide made their first announcement ;-) As I mentioned earlier, they are two different animals. I am not suggesting dropping openradar altogether however adding functionality to FG based on industry standards would be beneficial to the project overall. Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- Increase Visibility of Your 3D Game App Earn a Chance To Win $500! Tap into the largest installed PC base get more eyes on your game by optimizing for Intel(R) Graphics Technology. Get started today with the Intel(R) Software Partner Program. Five $500 cash prizes are up for grabs. http://p.sf.net/sfu/intelisp-dev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel -- Increase Visibility of Your 3D Game App Earn a Chance To Win $500! Tap into the largest installed PC base get more eyes on your game by optimizing for Intel(R) Graphics Technology. Get started today with the Intel(R) Software Partner Program. Five $500 cash prizes are up for grabs. http://p.sf.net/sfu/intelisp-dev2dev___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC client
Eftychios Eftychiou wrote: On Wed, Dec 1, 2010 at 10:39 AM, Martin Spott martin.sp...@mgras.netwrote: Eftychios Eftychiou wrote: You will need to sign up at http://forge.osor.eu/projects/albadisp/ and join the project to get the code. Mmmmh it's not my understanding of Open Source Community when you have to sign a license agreement, in which you basically waive all your rights, before you're permitted to _read_ the source code. It's also quite interesting that they care that much about patenting clauses, is their software covered by patents they don't want to share with the public ? The code is there and available released under GNU 2. Please show it to me - if I have to sign a dubious agreement first, then the point is rather weak. As I mentioned earlier, they are two different animals. I am not suggesting dropping openradar altogether however adding functionality to FG based on industry standards would be beneficial to the project overall. Exactly this is what OpenRADAR does: Implementing a user interface in compilance with industry standards (EUROCONTROL EEC references in this case). In fact, when you look at real-life RADAR operators' screens (been there, done that), you'll find, to put it mildly, a certain variety, even within a single European country. There is not just one standard, but more and more European countries are introducing frontends which are in compilance with EEC user interface guidelines. Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- Increase Visibility of Your 3D Game App Earn a Chance To Win $500! Tap into the largest installed PC base get more eyes on your game by optimizing for Intel(R) Graphics Technology. Get started today with the Intel(R) Software Partner Program. Five $500 cash prizes are up for grabs. http://p.sf.net/sfu/intelisp-dev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC client
There is already an open source radar display screen http://www.albatross.aero/ It can take as input asterix formated data ( http://www.eurocontrol.int/asterix/public/subsite_homepage/homepage.html) If FG or MPserver can provide an asterisk stream then it can be easily fed to albatross. Regards, Efty On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 10:35 PM, Pep Ribal pepri...@gmail.com wrote: El 29/11/10 20:44, Martin Spott escribió: Pep Ribal wrote: I've seen that there are plans to develop an ATC client for Flightgear. I'm very interested in this profect, and so I'm offering my help. Whoever is involved, please get in touch. http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php/FlightGear_Newsletter_October_2010#OpenRadar Cheers, Martin. I would gladly mantain, or port to C++. But who can I contact? There's no contact information available in the websites. Regards. Pep. -- Increase Visibility of Your 3D Game App Earn a Chance To Win $500! Tap into the largest installed PC base get more eyes on your game by optimizing for Intel(R) Graphics Technology. Get started today with the Intel(R) Software Partner Program. Five $500 cash prizes are up for grabs. http://p.sf.net/sfu/intelisp-dev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel -- Increase Visibility of Your 3D Game App Earn a Chance To Win $500! Tap into the largest installed PC base get more eyes on your game by optimizing for Intel(R) Graphics Technology. Get started today with the Intel(R) Software Partner Program. Five $500 cash prizes are up for grabs. http://p.sf.net/sfu/intelisp-dev2dev___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC client
Eftychios Eftychiou wrote: There is already an open source radar display screen http://www.albatross.aero/ I'm surprised to read that they're actually now having source code on offer, do you have a pointer to the code ? It can take as input asterix formated data ( http://www.eurocontrol.int/asterix/public/subsite_homepage/homepage.html) Well, OpenRADAR is going the opposite direction: It already provides FlightGear MP (plus HLA RTI via a side project), ASTERIX could be done as well by changing swapping another interface in ;-) I'm surprised to realize that a lot of people don't spare effort for discussing new ATC clients while a slightly rudimentary but rather functional system is already available Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- Increase Visibility of Your 3D Game App Earn a Chance To Win $500! Tap into the largest installed PC base get more eyes on your game by optimizing for Intel(R) Graphics Technology. Get started today with the Intel(R) Software Partner Program. Five $500 cash prizes are up for grabs. http://p.sf.net/sfu/intelisp-dev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC client
On Tue, Nov 30, 2010 at 11:03 PM, Martin Spott martin.sp...@mgras.netwrote: Eftychios Eftychiou wrote: There is already an open source radar display screen http://www.albatross.aero/ I'm surprised to read that they're actually now having source code on offer, do you have a pointer to the code ? You will need to sign up at http://forge.osor.eu/projects/albadisp/ and join the project to get the code. It can take as input asterix formated data ( http://www.eurocontrol.int/asterix/public/subsite_homepage/homepage.html ) Well, OpenRADAR is going the opposite direction: It already provides FlightGear MP (plus HLA RTI via a side project), ASTERIX could be done as well by changing swapping another interface in ;-) I'm surprised to realize that a lot of people don't spare effort for discussing new ATC clients while a slightly rudimentary but rather functional system is already available I am not sure what you mean by the above. I did not try openradar with FG, but tried out albatross which is indeed a professional grade radar display. In any case albatross and openradar are two different animals. I just suggested that there might not be a need to re-invent the wheel when there is solution out there already. Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- Increase Visibility of Your 3D Game App Earn a Chance To Win $500! Tap into the largest installed PC base get more eyes on your game by optimizing for Intel(R) Graphics Technology. Get started today with the Intel(R) Software Partner Program. Five $500 cash prizes are up for grabs. http://p.sf.net/sfu/intelisp-dev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel Regards, Efty -- Increase Visibility of Your 3D Game App Earn a Chance To Win $500! Tap into the largest installed PC base get more eyes on your game by optimizing for Intel(R) Graphics Technology. Get started today with the Intel(R) Software Partner Program. Five $500 cash prizes are up for grabs. http://p.sf.net/sfu/intelisp-dev2dev___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC client
I've seen that there are plans to develop an ATC client for Flightgear. I'm very interested in this profect, and so I'm offering my help. Whoever is involved, please get in touch. Cheers. Pep. -- Increase Visibility of Your 3D Game App Earn a Chance To Win $500! Tap into the largest installed PC base get more eyes on your game by optimizing for Intel(R) Graphics Technology. Get started today with the Intel(R) Software Partner Program. Five $500 cash prizes are up for grabs. http://p.sf.net/sfu/intelisp-dev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC client
Pep Ribal wrote: I've seen that there are plans to develop an ATC client for Flightgear. I'm very interested in this profect, and so I'm offering my help. Whoever is involved, please get in touch. http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php/FlightGear_Newsletter_October_2010#OpenRadar Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- Increase Visibility of Your 3D Game App Earn a Chance To Win $500! Tap into the largest installed PC base get more eyes on your game by optimizing for Intel(R) Graphics Technology. Get started today with the Intel(R) Software Partner Program. Five $500 cash prizes are up for grabs. http://p.sf.net/sfu/intelisp-dev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC client
El 29/11/10 20:44, Martin Spott escribió: Pep Ribal wrote: I've seen that there are plans to develop an ATC client for Flightgear. I'm very interested in this profect, and so I'm offering my help. Whoever is involved, please get in touch. http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php/FlightGear_Newsletter_October_2010#OpenRadar Cheers, Martin. I would gladly mantain, or port to C++. But who can I contact? There's no contact information available in the websites. Regards. Pep. -- Increase Visibility of Your 3D Game App Earn a Chance To Win $500! Tap into the largest installed PC base get more eyes on your game by optimizing for Intel(R) Graphics Technology. Get started today with the Intel(R) Software Partner Program. Five $500 cash prizes are up for grabs. http://p.sf.net/sfu/intelisp-dev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC
Hello Durk, I'd like to start working on ATC and AI with you. Not today and probably not this month, but soon. I currently don't have a lot of time so let me make this short and quote from IRC (hope you could manage to get on there). My actual point being the following - I know this sounds a kind of supervisorish given that I've yet to contribute something but I think I'm the kind of guy who is good at keeping the overview and I consider myself a very clean and structured coder and abstract thinker, so give my opinion a chance, will you: What you have achieved so far is very good I think, but it's right what its needed and where we need to stop at. I'll explain this statement later. Given two building blocks * Airports Good job there. My info comes mostly from the wiki. I agree that one airport should be one distinct chunk that contains it all. All includes ** Ground Networks (already fully implemented) ** Airspace specs, Navaids of the AP (I learned there is no such thing yet) ** Buildings/Geometry Right here, the important thing is to define the specs and leave implementation open so far. Again, my understaning is limited and solely based upon the wiki but I find that ground networks is just the way it should be: A precise and self-contained description of the ground network which defines details which are of use to future extensions. Airspace specs / navaids holding patterns / approach plates - well I know rather nothing about how this is handled so far. I assume the data exists but I'm pretty sure it's damn difficult to get this specified. I know microsoft managed in their FSX so we will sure as hell manage, too. A remark: I think MS FS(X) has, despite its shortcomings quite a few properties we might closely align ourselves too. This topic being one of them. Check the garmin/GPS of FSX and you'll know what I mean. I think screetshots will already be impressive. Back to topic: As with groundnetworks, I find that arirports should contain all their airspace data. After all a airport could be considered an overlay over global air corridors and such. Right here, its all specification again. How is the data stored and provided. --Example : approach plates are pretty well formalized already so they could be copied as-is into xml files, referencing ndbs vors etc where needed and defining holding patterns as vector data-- --Example : Airspace specs can go in a distinct file. One airport-package can define an abritrary amount of airspaces and have difference frequencies/controlers handle them-- But let's not go into the details too much. This was building block one: Airport specification, including ground, airspace and the actual look (geometry) Second building block: AI * AI AI now refers to the actual IMPLEMENTATION of AI, however on a rather crude and low level. AI driven planes should provide an interface to receive a set of instructions. Given ahead: These functions should again be called from an encompassing AI engine which interfaces with ATC - see later **Highlevel - on ground: GOTO __adjacent__ (and adjacent only) ground network node - plane travels thereFREEZE right there - plane brakes and wont move **Highlevel - airborne: GOTO vor/ndb/etc - plane changes heading and heads straight for the navpoint GOTO position - plane heads straight for that position HEIGHT height + sinkrate - plane changes FL or height with given sinkrate **Lowlevel: CONTROL control - plane performs a maneuver (like pitch by 2 deg or increase thrust) ACTION - plane performs an action (like lower gears) These are fundamental AI functions, of course just a rough set of examples to make my point clear. Here we have two building blocks which already fairly well implemented. The point is to realize that those two are the foundations of a much bigger framework. And since this foundation has to support a big third building block, which is actually more like the hosue itsself, its crucial that the two former building blocks are matured and thought-out. I'm proposing to clearly say that these two buildings blocks are then finshed, polished and self-contained. they may lay arround useless for a while, all on their own, but its important to maintain this very self-containment and not reach out further from there. Instead, in order to achieve a much bigger and visionary goal we will step back, walk arround the problem and now tackle it from another side, another perspective and we will eventually converge to our final goal from two sides. With the two rather fundamental (yet powerful - i admider the groundnetwork) building blocks on one side of the issue, the third massive building block lies on the other side: * ATC ATC - the singleton - mama and papa to the two other building blocks is where the real work starts. So far, we have specs, no implementation (apart from an orphaned rather low-level AI implementation). the ATC is, again, rather a house and for the sake
[Flightgear-devel] ATC chatter
Hey Group; This appears to be a FlightGear2 problem. I have openSuSE 11.4M2 and KDE4.#. The sound comes from a very recent Flightgear, the engine and stall indicator work. However, no ATC chatter is heard. It is enabled in two menu places and the volume is up. I have also selected the /dev/ -- 73 de Donn Washburn 307 Savoy Street Email: n5...@comcast.net Sugar Land, TX 77478 LL# 1.281.242.3256 Ham Callsign N5XWB HAMs : n5...@arrl.net VoIP via Gizmo: bmw_87kbike / via Skype: n5xwbg BMW MOA #: 4146 - Ambassador http://counter.li.org #279316 -- Nokia and ATT present the 2010 Calling All Innovators-North America contest Create new apps games for the Nokia N8 for consumers in U.S. and Canada $10 million total in prizes - $4M cash, 500 devices, nearly $6M in marketing Develop with Nokia Qt SDK, Web Runtime, or Java and Publish to Ovi Store http://p.sf.net/sfu/nokia-dev2dev ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC
Peter Morgan wrote: although there are a few atc client around such as 1) ATC 2) ATC2 3) ATCML - fav I don't know any of these. so is there a way to create an ATC client without FG ? Depends on what you're looking for - ATC client is a very vague description. There's something like a standalone RADAR screen which connects to MP servers. I don't have a current screenshot, so feel free to look at these old ones to get an idea: http://foxtrot.mgras.net/bitmap/FGFS/KSFO_large.png http://foxtrot.mgras.net/bitmap/FGFS/KSFO_closeup.png Coastlines, lakes, airfield layouts and airspaces (at least the 2D part) are being read from Shapefiles. Source is available here: http://mapserver.flightgear.org/git/gitweb.pl?p=openradar The project is currently in search for a new maintainer Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- ThinkGeek and WIRED's GeekDad team up for the Ultimate GeekDad Father's Day Giveaway. ONE MASSIVE PRIZE to the lucky parental unit. See the prize list and enter to win: http://p.sf.net/sfu/thinkgeek-promo ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC
Thanks for that Martin, I'd never seen OpenRadar before. Been dabbling in Java recently (the lazy mans attempt at CrossPlatform ;) ) might be something to have a tinker with! Thanks again. Alex On 22 Jun 2010, at 09:36, Martin Spott wrote: Peter Morgan wrote: although there are a few atc client around such as 1) ATC 2) ATC2 3) ATCML - fav I don't know any of these. so is there a way to create an ATC client without FG ? Depends on what you're looking for - ATC client is a very vague description. There's something like a standalone RADAR screen which connects to MP servers. I don't have a current screenshot, so feel free to look at these old ones to get an idea: http://foxtrot.mgras.net/bitmap/FGFS/KSFO_large.png http://foxtrot.mgras.net/bitmap/FGFS/KSFO_closeup.png Coastlines, lakes, airfield layouts and airspaces (at least the 2D part) are being read from Shapefiles. Source is available here: http://mapserver.flightgear.org/git/gitweb.pl?p=openradar The project is currently in search for a new maintainer Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- ThinkGeek and WIRED's GeekDad team up for the Ultimate GeekDad Father's Day Giveaway. ONE MASSIVE PRIZE to the lucky parental unit. See the prize list and enter to win: http://p.sf.net/sfu/thinkgeek-promo ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel -- ThinkGeek and WIRED's GeekDad team up for the Ultimate GeekDad Father's Day Giveaway. ONE MASSIVE PRIZE to the lucky parental unit. See the prize list and enter to win: http://p.sf.net/sfu/thinkgeek-promo ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC
I've been tinkering around with a JEE ATC support web app concept, the idea is to support ATC controllers using one of the ATC aircraft or perhaps the OpenRadar app, by having a central place to file flight plans (virtual airline websites could post data through a REST or XML/HTTP interface perhaps) and share information between controllers in a FIR, but I keep running out of spare time, though have some basics done. But I'd be interested to join up with someone to help define some requirements and coding as long as the coding was in Java or PHP (I've only just started learning Ruby on Rails). S. On Tue, 2010-06-22 at 10:07 +0100, Alexander Barrett wrote: Thanks for that Martin, I'd never seen OpenRadar before. Been dabbling in Java recently (the lazy mans attempt at CrossPlatform ;) ) might be something to have a tinker with! Thanks again. Alex On 22 Jun 2010, at 09:36, Martin Spott wrote: Peter Morgan wrote: although there are a few atc client around such as 1) ATC 2) ATC2 3) ATCML - fav I don't know any of these. so is there a way to create an ATC client without FG ? Depends on what you're looking for - ATC client is a very vague description. There's something like a standalone RADAR screen which connects to MP servers. I don't have a current screenshot, so feel free to look at these old ones to get an idea: http://foxtrot.mgras.net/bitmap/FGFS/KSFO_large.png http://foxtrot.mgras.net/bitmap/FGFS/KSFO_closeup.png Coastlines, lakes, airfield layouts and airspaces (at least the 2D part) are being read from Shapefiles. Source is available here: http://mapserver.flightgear.org/git/gitweb.pl?p=openradar The project is currently in search for a new maintainer Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- ThinkGeek and WIRED's GeekDad team up for the Ultimate GeekDad Father's Day Giveaway. ONE MASSIVE PRIZE to the lucky parental unit. See the prize list and enter to win: http://p.sf.net/sfu/thinkgeek-promo ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel -- ThinkGeek and WIRED's GeekDad team up for the Ultimate GeekDad Father's Day Giveaway. ONE MASSIVE PRIZE to the lucky parental unit. See the prize list and enter to win: http://p.sf.net/sfu/thinkgeek-promo ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel -- ThinkGeek and WIRED's GeekDad team up for the Ultimate GeekDad Father's Day Giveaway. ONE MASSIVE PRIZE to the lucky parental unit. See the prize list and enter to win: http://p.sf.net/sfu/thinkgeek-promo___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC
the current ATC clients are deformed in some ways... although there are a few atc client around such as 1) ATC 2) ATC2 3) ATCML - fav so if can explain my local situation.. I'm training some crew ie kids of all ages to understand some IFR/ATC, and indeed the scenario changes with that.. indeed.. some issues i have are that 1) the font dont look right, its a blur.. 2) I use the ATC client for comms and chat, but otherwsie mpmap 3) this without FGcom so is there a way to create an ATC client without FG ? ie speaking to the mp port, but with a netbook etc? ie a new client with a socket and map I have already slaved the chat with a telnet port, but its a long long and gets longersand longerand longer and longer string.. Also is there a way the airspeed of the aircraft can be part of the telnet output?? pete -- ThinkGeek and WIRED's GeekDad team up for the Ultimate GeekDad Father's Day Giveaway. ONE MASSIVE PRIZE to the lucky parental unit. See the prize list and enter to win: http://p.sf.net/sfu/thinkgeek-promo___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC
PM: So ATC is restricted to a few 10's of NM to location Well: with the new FGCOM.Gui http://code.google.com/p/fgcomgui/w/list the range is equal to MPchat range (99 mi) -- about 200 mi range for the control circle! Same is true for ATC-model: also ATC-ML (and others) cover maximal 100 mi (MPchat-range). Normal Radar does not do more! PM: This doth not work with sector control, however frivolous that may be.. If you find a point to locate you Center in the center of EHAM-EGGL - (in the North see - e.g. a Helicopter Oil-Platform?) fine. But for Sector-Control it probably works better with MPmap. PM: Ideally I can be ATC for EGLL, EHAM and all in one.. Please do not overdo it: If pilots do get bad experiences once -- they might not come back -- and all our/my goal is to get more and more people to like flying controlled and use FGCOM!! I do a lot of ATC in EDDF. Out of experience I can say: If there are about 5 pilots in the area out of which 3 are unexperienced (and thus misunderstand a lot) and 2 are youngsters who want to have fun and talks - and some others tend to talk longer because of personality -- then you get a whole lot of problems handling just 1 locations - just trying to find a time-slot to issue a command! And because you like the ATC-ML you know you are not talking only FGCOM - but also more than 50% MPchat typing! I would not try that if business runs good! (Did you ever try to enforce a controlled environment at KSFO!?!? Controlling only 1 out of 10 is not the idea!) And: you have your ATC-tool always at one location! We do a similar task at EDDF if there is not much to do: Control EDDF traffic till 100mi out - and get them to ILS/Visual approach in EDDK or EDFH via MPmap. That works pretty good - if there is time enough! Also see TGA-event experience: There are scheduled about 1 APR + 1 Dep all 5 min (e.g. per 20 Min Ctrl-cycle = avg 4-6 active!) -- and all use FGCOM -- that already makes it tough on the non professional ATC and Pilots -- they/we use 2 ATCs (twr/gnd and Apr/dep). PM: Also ATC_ML is cool and why is this not in git pps ... CVS ? Thanks: That ATC_ML is mine -- guess it is stable enough now for general use -- if someone tells me how to get it into CVS - OK. joe (jomo) -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC
So ATC is restricted to a few 10's of NM to location This doth not work with sector control, however frivolous that may be.. Ideally I can be ATC for EGLL, EHAM and all in one.. Can we tweak it that way? Also ATC_ML is cool and why is this not in git pps ... CVS ? pete -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC messages dialog box
Hello all, I posted a message about this on the forums and since the next Flight Gear release is near, I wanted to contact developers directly to see if you can do something. Its about the ATC message dialog box. When the Enable ATC option is checked, I get the tower frequency (120.50 at KSFO for example), I set my COM1 to it, there is the Not currently tuned to any ATC service message when I hit the ' key. I tried that with many airports tower frequency, the dialog box which contains the preset messages never appear. Apparently, Im not the only one with that issue, so I guess its not a problem on my end. I got the latest Freds binaries from January 17th with the matching CVS data. Im using Windows XP SP3. Maybe this can be fixed for the upcoming release? Thanks, Etienne Bourque -- Throughout its 18-year history, RSA Conference consistently attracts the world's best and brightest in the field, creating opportunities for Conference attendees to learn about information security's most important issues through interactions with peers, luminaries and emerging and established companies. http://p.sf.net/sfu/rsaconf-dev2dev___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC Tower Simulator
Hello Everyone, I have been following the list discussion for the past few days and went through the archives to see to what extent and exactly what FG supports in regards to ATC simulation. To my understanding unless there were other posts which I missed FG only supports ATC through the ATC plane and communication with real pilot players. I would like to investigate the posibility of using FG as a tower simulator that can be used to train ATCOs. There are numerous requirements to the above but initially it should support the following a) Ability to issue commands to simulated traffic. To my understanding simulated traffic can be accomplished via the AI logic, however there is no way to talk to the AI module and innstruct it eg to climb/descend, change heading etc. b) Ability for multiple users to control a subset of the above simulated traffic. Eg 10 aircraft in the vicinity cannot be controlled by a single person. c) Ability to easily create scenarios to be used for training d) Stop/Start/Accelerate simulation e) Ability to add traffic during the simulation f) Simulate emergencies such as landing gear problems, engine failures etc g) Ability to define the a/c ground movement folowing specific instructions before after landing(guess could be part of a) h) 360 view (supported pls confirm) i) Tower controller (ATC a/c) should hear landing/departing a/c I guess the above would be a start. My intention is to investigate the possibility of using/modifying FG to support the above. I am willing and able to assist in the effort of modifying FG to support some if not all of the above. What I am asking is a fruitful discussion regarding the feasibility of the above. Eg Could this be accomplished via the mp server? Ie have another simulator connecting to mp and just sending position reports? Or it would be easier to just enhance the AI module to accept manual commands via an eg telnet session? Regards, Eftychios -- Throughout its 18-year history, RSA Conference consistently attracts the world's best and brightest in the field, creating opportunities for Conference attendees to learn about information security's most important issues through interactions with peers, luminaries and emerging and established companies. http://p.sf.net/sfu/rsaconf-dev2dev___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC services for FSWeekend...
Hello all -- sorry about my abrupt exit this morning -- especially to you, Jomo, whom I feel I left holding the reins. To be honest, the level of chaos was just too much for me. I'm happy to volunteer ATC services for events where the participants are all attempting to work within the system, but when it becomes a free-for-all I just don't feel like I can manage. I apologize to anyone whom I may have let down and hope that the rest of the event goes well. I will probably participate as a pilot at some point. Sorry again, and thanks. Sincerely, -R. (MD-Terp) Robert M. Shearman, Jr. Transit Operations Supervisor, University of Maryland Department of Transportation also known as rm...@umd.edu -- Let Crystal Reports handle the reporting - Free Crystal Reports 2008 30-Day trial. Simplify your report design, integration and deployment - and focus on what you do best, core application coding. Discover what's new with Crystal Reports now. http://p.sf.net/sfu/bobj-july___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC services for FSWeekend...
On Sat, 7 Nov 2009 04:55:54 -0800 (PST), Jr. wrote in message 128049.27129...@web46402.mail.sp1.yahoo.com: Hello all -- sorry about my abrupt exit this morning -- especially to you, Jomo, whom I feel I left holding the reins. To be honest, the level of chaos was just too much for me. I'm happy to volunteer ATC services for events where the participants are all attempting to work within the system, but when it becomes a free-for-all I just don't feel like I can manage. I apologize to anyone whom I may have let down and hope that the rest of the event goes well. I will probably participate as a pilot at some point. Sorry again, and thanks. Sincerely, -R. (MD-Terp) Robert M. Shearman, Jr. Transit Operations Supervisor, University of Maryland Department of Transportation also known as rm...@umd.edu ..sounds like ATC needs to be able to use AAA to bring down EA in a boring way to EAP's and in an eminently satisfying way to ATC. ;o) -- ..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt... ;o) ...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry... Scenarios always come in sets of three: best case, worst case, and just in case. -- Let Crystal Reports handle the reporting - Free Crystal Reports 2008 30-Day trial. Simplify your report design, integration and deployment - and focus on what you do best, core application coding. Discover what's new with Crystal Reports now. http://p.sf.net/sfu/bobj-july ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC Chatter live
Hi all, if you like some extra level of reality, tune your browser to http://www.liveatc.net/ where you get live atc from interesting places like KJFK, EHAM, LSZH, VHHH and many others. Enjoy - Torsten - This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2005. http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse012070mrt/direct/01/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC communication
I've found that it's impossible to communicate with the tower (by pressing the apostrophe key) until they tell you you're clear off their airspace, before that it just says no transmissions available. I thought it'd be nice to extend the communications possibilities a little bit (like permission for taxiing to the other end of runway when it's desirable to do so due to wind direction, the tower telling you what altitude/flight level to mantain etc. I'm no expert on ATC conventions (like when to contact the tower, what to report, what not to report..) but you get the idea). Not that it was a very important feature - I just thought it'd feel more real. Michal __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --- This SF.Net email is sponsored by xPML, a groundbreaking scripting language that extends applications into web and mobile media. Attend the live webcast and join the prime developer group breaking into this new coding territory! http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=110944bid=241720dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC
Justin Smithies writes: Not sure of whos in charge of the ATC but would love to be able to contact tower to take off etc. Hi Justin, I wrote most of what currently passes for ATC in FG, certainly most of the tower stuff. I'm afraid that I'm unlikely to implement calling tower for take-off in the near future. I always start off at the end of the runway ready to go. I just can't be bothered with starting on the apron and taxiing out and all that - lifes too short, and this is a *flight* sim, after all ;-) At the end of the runway, ready to go, it's a reasonable assumption that one has already contacted ATC, and has possibly already been cleared to take-off, so if the plane is detected on the runway at ATC init then the state is set as cleared to depart, and options presented accordingly (ie. none!, although return to airfield, and circuit-relevent options ought to be added. I *think* it tries to detect if you start flying a circuit and will offer the downwind call as an option, but won't swear by it.) Anyway, what I'm trying to say is that there's only so much time in the day, and *loads* that could be done with the AI/ATC system. Stuff that adds a representative pilot workload in flight, such as better intelligent interaction with the AI, the ability to request or be requested to use a different runway than the default, IFR ATC vectors and clearances, those are higher priority for me. Sorry! P.S Worked out how ATC works flew from dundee to dyce and tower gave me runway to land and said to follow cessna in etc. :) Excellent - I'm glad folk use it :-) The addition of Festival voice support by John/Melchior has made a fantastic difference to it recently, and motivated me to move some improvements to it higher up the TODO list. Cheers - Dave --- This SF.Net email is sponsored by xPML, a groundbreaking scripting language that extends applications into web and mobile media. Attend the live webcast and join the prime developer group breaking into this new coding territory! http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=110944bid=241720dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC
Not sure of whos in charge of the ATC but would love to be able to contact tower to take off etc. P.S Worked out how ATC works flew from dundee to dyce and tower gave me runway to land and said to follow cessna in etc. :) Justin Smithies --- This SF.Net email is sponsored by xPML, a groundbreaking scripting language that extends applications into web and mobile media. Attend the live webcast and join the prime developer group breaking into this new coding territory! http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=110944bid=241720dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC Speech
Is it possible to make the speech louder than the aircraft noise ? Does festival have a setting to increase the volume ? Regards, Justin Smithies --- This SF.Net email is sponsored by xPML, a groundbreaking scripting language that extends applications into web and mobile media. Attend the live webcast and join the prime developer group breaking into this new coding territory! http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=110944bid=241720dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC Speech
--- Justin Smithies wrote: Is it possible to make the speech louder than the aircraft noise ? Does festival have a setting to increase the volume ? festival will be using a completely separate I/O to FGFS, so is independant of the FGFS sound level. Simply reduce the sound level using the Sound Properties dialog, and turn up the general volume on your system... -Stuart ___ NEW Yahoo! Cars - sell your car and browse thousands of new and used cars online! http://uk.cars.yahoo.com/ --- This SF.Net email is sponsored by xPML, a groundbreaking scripting language that extends applications into web and mobile media. Attend the live webcast and join the prime developer group breaking into this new coding territory! http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=110944bid=241720dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC voices
I have tried KSFO and heard the speech , but do any of the UK airports have this too ? I have enabled atc and a density of 3 , even tried 1 but when leaving EGPD my home airport i never get anything from the tower etc ? Help Justin Smithies --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnkkid=103432bid=230486dat=121642 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
RE: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
Curt -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:flightgear- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of is L. Olson Sent: 09 January 2006 18:41 To: FlightGear developers discussions Subject: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS I just committed a set of atc background chatter wav files to the base package in data/ATC/Chatter/UK These are from around Heathrow. I've set things up so it's relatively easy to drop additional sets from different areas in sibling directories. So everything to hear background chatter in FlightGear is now committed to cvs. After you update cvs from simgear/flightgear/flightgear-base and recompile, just run flightgear and select ATC Chatter from the File - Sound Configuration dialog box. Some of the files are louder/more understandable than others ... but it's background chatter and useless ear candy so you are better off not trying to understand and pay attention to what is really being said anyway. But it's fun useless ear candy. :-) Nice try - perfectly understandable transmissions here :-). It runs under Cygwin for a while, then fails with: next chatter in 37 seconds OpenAL error (AL_INVALID_VALUE): bind_source (alGenSources) Failed to generate audio source. Vivian --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7637alloc_id=16865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
Vivian Meazza schrieb: Nice try - perfectly understandable transmissions here :-). It runs under Cygwin for a while, then fails with: next chatter in 37 seconds OpenAL error (AL_INVALID_VALUE): bind_source (alGenSources) Failed to generate audio source. Vivian Hi Vivian, hi Curtis! Ok, after a longer testflight (autopilot, I was not present) I also had these error messages (FG latest CVS compile, Cygwin) when returning to the PC. So I cannot say when ATC chatter broke, but I think it worked here longer than 10 minutes: Error messages: playing /fg-cvs/data/ATC/Chatter/UK / ukatc30.wav next chatter in 32 seconds OpenAL error (AL_ILLEGAL_COMMAND): set_pitch update atc chatter ukatc31.wav playing /fg-cvs/data/ATC/Chatter/UK / ukatc31.wav next chatter in 32 seconds OpenAL error (AL_INVALID_VALUE): bind_source (alGenSources) Failed to generate audio source. update atc chatter ukatc32.wav playing /fg-cvs/data/ATC/Chatter/UK / ukatc32.wav next chatter in 39 seconds OpenAL error (AL_INVALID_VALUE): bind_source (alGenSources) Failed to generate audio source. update atc chatter ukatc33.wav playing /fg-cvs/data/ATC/Chatter/UK / ukatc33.wav next chatter in 38 seconds OpenAL error (AL_INVALID_VALUE): bind_source (alGenSources) Failed to generate audio source. ... Regards Georg EDDW --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7637alloc_id=16865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
Georg Vollnhals schrieb: Vivian Meazza schrieb: Nice try - perfectly understandable transmissions here :-). It runs under Cygwin for a while, then fails with: next chatter in 37 seconds OpenAL error (AL_INVALID_VALUE): bind_source (alGenSources) Failed to generate audio source. Vivian Hi Vivian, hi Curtis! Ok, after a longer testflight (autopilot, I was not present) I also had these error messages (FG latest CVS compile, Cygwin) when returning to the PC. So I cannot say when ATC chatter broke, but I think it worked here longer than 10 minutes: Error messages: AND I HAVE TO ADD: After 25 minutes running (with these error messages) FlightGear had a CTD! Georg EDDW --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7637alloc_id=16865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
Vivian Meazza wrote: Nice try - perfectly understandable transmissions here :-). It runs under Cygwin for a while, then fails with: next chatter in 37 seconds OpenAL error (AL_INVALID_VALUE): bind_source (alGenSources) Failed to generate audio source. I committed a fix yesterday evening. That cures the one remaining problem that I was seeing. Curt. -- Curtis Olsonhttp://www.flightgear.org/~curt HumanFIRST Program http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/ FlightGear Project http://www.flightgear.org Unique text:2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7637alloc_id=16865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
Curtis L. Olson schrieb: Vivian Meazza wrote: Nice try - perfectly understandable transmissions here :-). It runs under Cygwin for a while, then fails with: next chatter in 37 seconds OpenAL error (AL_INVALID_VALUE): bind_source (alGenSources) Failed to generate audio source. I committed a fix yesterday evening. That cures the one remaining problem that I was seeing. Curt. Hi Curtis, I did a complete CVS rebuild some hours ago (when I tested whether your changes regarding the compile error works) and still having this described error (Cygwin). Regards Georg EDDW --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7637alloc_id=16865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
RE: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
Quoting Vivian Meazza : Nice try - perfectly understandable transmissions here :-). It runs under Cygwin for a while, then fails with: next chatter in 37 seconds OpenAL error (AL_INVALID_VALUE): bind_source (alGenSources) Failed to generate audio source. It seems that alDeleteSources is only called when SGSoundSample::stop() is called. Not when the sample is deleted ( the destructor only do alDeleteBuffers in that case ). I don't know if SGSoundSample::stop() is called in this case but this could be a problem. -Fred --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_idv37alloc_id865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
Frederic Bouvier wrote: Quoting Vivian Meazza : Nice try - perfectly understandable transmissions here :-). It runs under Cygwin for a while, then fails with: next chatter in 37 seconds OpenAL error (AL_INVALID_VALUE): bind_source (alGenSources) Failed to generate audio source. It seems that alDeleteSources is only called when SGSoundSample::stop() is called. Not when the sample is deleted ( the destructor only do alDeleteBuffers in that case ). I don't know if SGSoundSample::stop() is called in this case but this could be a problem. Interesting catch, thanks Fred. I made a small change to fg_fx.cxx to call the stop() function first. Perhaps that will cure the problem. In looking at this, I notice that the current sound system shows signs of being migrated from plib and perhaps isn't written optimally for openal ... At some point it might be worth getting an openal expert (or someone more familiar with openal than me) to take a pass through the code and see if there are places where things could be restructured or fixed up to reduce the chances of these sorts of problems. Regards, Curt. -- Curtis Olsonhttp://www.flightgear.org/~curt HumanFIRST Program http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/ FlightGear Project http://www.flightgear.org Unique text:2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7637alloc_id=16865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
Hi Curt, I don't have it running yet, just wondering; does the code contain any logic to filter the chatter based on radio frequency/location? Sitting on the ramp, tuned to ground control, you should not be hearing calls to an ARTCC. If your practicing VFR patterns at your local field, you should hear other VFR calls from the pattern, at FL310 you should hear calls between the Center and other A/C under positive control. Perhaps some sort of ID tag(s) on the msg to specify type and other charateristics and then set the ATC chatter filter based on selected radio frequency and/or flight conditions. Regards John W. --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7637alloc_id=16865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
John Wojnaroski wrote: Hi Curt, I don't have it running yet, just wondering; does the code contain any logic to filter the chatter based on radio frequency/location? Sitting on the ramp, tuned to ground control, you should not be hearing calls to an ARTCC. If your practicing VFR patterns at your local field, you should hear other VFR calls from the pattern, at FL310 you should hear calls between the Center and other A/C under positive control. Perhaps some sort of ID tag(s) on the msg to specify type and other charateristics and then set the ATC chatter filter based on selected radio frequency and/or flight conditions. Right now this is just dumb ear candy ... either always on or always off. It makes sense to tie it to the actual tuned frequency, tie the volume to the volume knob (which is modeled at least on the default cessna) and do a few other fancy things. But that was beyond the scope of my time available this past weekend. Regards, Curt. -- Curtis Olsonhttp://www.flightgear.org/~curt HumanFIRST Program http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/ FlightGear Project http://www.flightgear.org Unique text:2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7637alloc_id=16865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
RE: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
Curt Frederic Bouvier wrote: Quoting Vivian Meazza : Nice try - perfectly understandable transmissions here :-). It runs under Cygwin for a while, then fails with: next chatter in 37 seconds OpenAL error (AL_INVALID_VALUE): bind_source (alGenSources) Failed to generate audio source. It seems that alDeleteSources is only called when SGSoundSample::stop() is called. Not when the sample is deleted ( the destructor only do alDeleteBuffers in that case ). I don't know if SGSoundSample::stop() is called in this case but this could be a problem. Interesting catch, thanks Fred. I made a small change to fg_fx.cxx to call the stop() function first. Perhaps that will cure the problem. In looking at this, I notice that the current sound system shows signs of being migrated from plib and perhaps isn't written optimally for openal ... At some point it might be worth getting an openal expert (or someone more familiar with openal than me) to take a pass through the code and see if there are places where things could be restructured or fixed up to reduce the chances of these sorts of problems. That fixed it - Fred does it again :-) Thanks for some a nice enhancement. Vivian --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7637alloc_id=16865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
Vivian Meazza wrote: That fixed it - Fred does it again :-) Thanks for some a nice enhancement. Someone find out how much we are paying Fred, and then double it. :-) Curt. -- Curtis Olsonhttp://www.flightgear.org/~curt HumanFIRST Program http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/ FlightGear Project http://www.flightgear.org Unique text:2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7637alloc_id=16865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
Christian Mayer wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Curtis L. Olson schrieb: If you ever come to visit Minnesota, I'll make sure you don't die of thirst. :-) Are your cooking skills that bad? What I cook, I cook very well thank you. :-) Unfortunately I don't know how to cook very many healthy day-to-day things so I went and got myself married. Unfortunately, that only doubled my dining out costs which wasn't the intended outcome. :-) Curt. -- Curtis Olsonhttp://www.flightgear.org/~curt HumanFIRST Program http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/ FlightGear Project http://www.flightgear.org Unique text:2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7637alloc_id=16865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
On Tue, 2006-01-10 at 17:28 +, Martin Spott wrote: Curtis L. Olson wrote: Someone find out how much we are paying Fred, and then double it. :-) We should invite him to a couple of free flights over nice looking terrain ;-) Send Fred an invite to the next virtual fly-in. :-) Any ideas for location? Regards George --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7637alloc_id=16865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
I just committed a set of atc background chatter wav files to the base package in data/ATC/Chatter/UK These are from around Heathrow. I've set things up so it's relatively easy to drop additional sets from different areas in sibling directories. So everything to hear background chatter in FlightGear is now committed to cvs. After you update cvs from simgear/flightgear/flightgear-base and recompile, just run flightgear and select ATC Chatter from the File - Sound Configuration dialog box. Some of the files are louder/more understandable than others ... but it's background chatter and useless ear candy so you are better off not trying to understand and pay attention to what is really being said anyway. But it's fun useless ear candy. :-) Curt. -- Curtis Olsonhttp://www.flightgear.org/~curt HumanFIRST Program http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/ FlightGear Project http://www.flightgear.org Unique text:2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7637alloc_id=16865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATC background chatter in CVS
It might be fun to include some of the old classic ATC conversations: http://www.avweb.com/cgi-bin/texis/scripts/avweb-search/search.html?query=shortpublication=avflashcategory=shortfinal http://www.businessballs.com/airtrafficcontrollersfunnyquotes.htm It would be good fun to have an AI C150 circling near the location of FGFS and say Unknown airport with Cessna 150 circling overhead ... Identify yourself! on UNICOM! :) Andras --- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=7637alloc_id=16865op=click ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
