date:20040212


I would be curious to know the memory size of the machines whose owners
are singing the praises of, or conversely complaining about, 2.6.
All my machines cept 1 are running on at least 512mb of ram ddr400 I 
think..? (dont usually watch exactly what I buy.. I just ask for the 
best atm).

I have in my arsenal:

1 Intel 2.6 Dell Inspiron 8500
1 AMD -XP 2500+
1 AMD -XP 2200+
1 AMD -XP 1800+
1 AMD Duron 1600
1 AMD Athlon 800
1 Intel PII 450
1 AMD K6/2 266
1 AMD K6/2 500
the Duron 1600 is the only one with over 512mb of ram (768mb)

I have 3 nforce chipset motherboards,(Asus A7N8X-Deluxe-E x-2 and a 
LeadTek Winfast)..and of course 2 Intel based mobos, umm.. definatley 1 
VIA chipset (Soyo Dragon Ultra) .. and IIRC

1. TYAN S1590S Trinity ATX
1. TYAN S1590S Trinity 100 AT
1. FIC SD11
I do see though that while compiling something.. I.E. I am in the final 
moments of an emerge -u xfree (currently using 2.6.3-rc2)..  on the Dell 
 laptop..

.. that stuff isnt quite as laggy.. but that is in comparison w/ another 
 2.6.X kernel.. not sure of which one..

My slowest box is the LeadTek WinFast.. (Out of the faster AMD systems) 
at least the hdparm output is the slowest.. 400 MB/sec compared to 700+ 
MB/sec on my other systems.

my /usr/src on my Dell laptop is populated with the following different 
kernels:

linux-2.4.23
linux-2.4.23-pre9
linux-2.4.24
linux-2.6.2
linux-2.6.2_rc3-love1
linux-2.6.3-rc1-mm1
linux-2.6.3-rc2
My AMD CFLAGS in my /etc/make.conf are:

CFLAGS="-O3 -march=athlon-xp -funroll-loops -fprefetch-loop-arrays -pipe"

My Intel CFLAGS in my /etc/make.conf are:

CFLAGS="-O3 -mcpu=pentium4 -funroll-loops -pipe"

Hope that helps

Thank you

Sincerely,

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Re: [gentoo-user] Mail confirmation requests

2004-02-12 Thread Kevin Hanson

Grendel wrote:

On Fri, 13 Feb 2004, The awesome and feared Peter Ruskin commented thusly,

 

On Friday 13 Feb 2004 1:45 am, Grendel wrote:
   

You have pushed this once too often and are showing your utter
immaturity noro, so I am adding you to my killfilter.
 

and you, grendel, have been added to mine.  I think this list would be 
better without you and your nasty comments
   

I didnt have to even bother to add you, with your last post you
automatically triggered my killfilter. I really am considering releasing
the source for this killfilter as it learns quite well, as it would have
studied your posts and marked you out as a likely candidate long before
your current post. 

Currently going over the logs I see it has added 3 people to the kill
filter and has a high probability of adding 2 more soon.
The only reason I joined this list is because that I have been hearing of
how a superb user friendly list etc etc, and it has been apart from minor
annoyances.  I want to help linux users from my years of linux experience
otherwise I have more valuable things to do with my time.
If anyone else feels that I am not wellcome in the list then I will remove 
myself.

Grendel



 

Any chance your kill filter will automatically add you?  I bet your 
killfilter program would peg you as the number 1, most likely candidate 
to be added.

Cheers,
Kevin
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Re: [gentoo-user] Mail confirmation requests

2004-02-12 Thread Kevin Hanson

Grendel wrote:

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, Norbert Kamenicky howled,

 

IMHO bigger problem are individuals which like to start
new thread by reply of another one.
noro
   

You have pushed this once too often and are showing your utter immaturity
noro, so I am adding you to my killfilter. 

Usually my killfilters bayesian model identifies people who are likely to
be added to my killfile in advance based on my previous selections and the
offenders postings and automatically adds them to save me the touble, but 
noro seems to have escaped detection and is turning to be annoying. 

So I will add him myself.

*plonk*

Grendel

 

Grendel,

You are a jerk.  Go away.

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Re: [gentoo-user] Which kernel version to select?

On Fri, 13 Feb 2004, [EMAIL PROTECTED] uttered the following immortal words,

> 
> I'm going to find something to torture test this thing with and see if I
> can lock it next week. If I can nail the problems to something, fine, I
> can fix that, otherwise I will end up sending the board back. It's got a
> warranty, and no one else seems to be having this issue. 

There is a utility called cpuburn to run the CPU at full load, it will 
stress test your system.  Its a good tool to run.
 
Grendel


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Re: [gentoo-user] Which kernel version to select?

2004-02-12 Thread nealbirch

On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 06:47:39 +0600 (LKT)
Grendel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, The awesome and feared [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> commented...
> 
> > 
> > well, I went back into the bios and took the drives off "auto" and
> > put the settings in manually, and I haven't had a problem yet, but I
> > haven't been able to duplicate the damn thing at all up to this
> > point. It's locked after a reboot, 
>  
> All the above point out that the machine fails while under load,
> several possibilites exist the common one is bad ram, please download
> memtest86 and try checking your memory.

Yeah, I knew I should have mentioned that I ran memtest86 for well over
12 hrs with no errors... =)

> As for the disk you can check
> it and see if there is a problem, but its unlikely todays IDE drives
> seem reliable beasts. 

I'm going to find something to torture test this thing with and see if I
can lock it next week. If I can nail the problems to something, fine, I
can fix that, otherwise I will end up sending the board back. It's got a
warranty, and no one else seems to be having this issue. 

-- 
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Each one serves until they screw up, at which point they rotate.
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Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4 B.S.!!!!!

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:51:43 -0500
Kurt Bechstein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

[ snips ]

> Now having said that I'll throw out my $.02 here.  The first thing
> I've noticed is that there is quite a difference between the 2.4
> kernels depending on what you are using.  

< Keep in mind the
> major improvements in 2.6 were not to make your mozilla launch faster.
>  
> 
> However, using vanilla-sources-2.4.24 versus stock 2.6.2 I see huge
> improvements in performance and responsiveness on my system.  For
> example I started running some compiles on my system which taxed the
> system fairly well.  Running vanilla-2.4.24 doing anything was pretty
> painful.  Starting up the same compiles under 2.6.2 and then trying to
> do other things is a whole different story.  I couldn't even tell I
> was running the compile which is nice.  So I guess that is where I see
> major improvement under 2.6.x, that being when the system is under
> heavy load.
> 

Unfortunately, I've been running 2.5/2.6 too long now to remember 2.4
results all that well, but I can certainly echo your description of the
compile process.  I'm running an 'emerge -e system' to a clone of my
system in a chroot right now.  Idle time is consistently near 0%, but I
scarcely notice that when reading email or browsing in another window.

One of the things to keep in mind is that any system runs better with
more memory.  This machine is faster (P4 2.4 Gz) than my other (AthlonXP
1800+), but I have just under 256MB memory available, so I don't get
quite as good results as on the Athlon (512MB).  That machine (also a
2.6 system) positively screams through compiles.

I would be curious to know the memory size of the machines whose owners
are singing the praises of, or conversely complaining about, 2.6.

-- 
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Gentoo stable kernel 2.6.3-rc2

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Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4 B.S.!!!!!

2004-02-12 Thread Kurt Bechstein

First off take a deap breath here everyone.  No need for name calling or anything
of that sort here.  We are all here for the same reason and on the same side
so to speak.  You are totally entitled to your opinion and I have no problem 
with that at all, but calling kernel developers named and what not is a little
much.  

Now having said that I'll throw out my $.02 here.  The first thing I've noticed
is that there is quite a difference between the 2.4 kernels depending on what
you are using.  If you are using the gentoo-sources or the gaming-sources I
notice quite significant improvements over vanilla-sources.  I believe the
gentoo-sources and gaming-sources include the -ck patches among others which
boost performance quite a bit.  Using gaming sources I do see very similar 
performance to the 2.6 series in simple benchmarks.  Keep in mind the major
improvements in 2.6 were not to make your mozilla launch faster.  

However, using vanilla-sources-2.4.24 versus stock 2.6.2 I see huge improvements in
performance and responsiveness on my system.  For example I started running
some compiles on my system which taxed the system fairly well.  Running
vanilla-2.4.24 doing anything was pretty painful.  Starting up the same
compiles under 2.6.2 and then trying to do other things is a whole 
different story.  I couldn't even tell I was running the compile which is
nice.  So I guess that is where I see major improvement under 2.6.x, that being
when the system is under heavy load.


Here are a few links for you to check out as well.  I know you didn't have
some good words to say about Robert Love, but the Linux journal article about
I/O schedulers is by him.  Try the tests he mentions under a stock 2.4 kernel
and then a stock 2.6 kernel and see what you find.  I found huge differences
all in favor of 2.6.  

Links:
http://www.linuxjournal.com/article.php?sid=6931
http://www.infoworld.com/infoworld/article/04/01/30/05FElinux_1.html


> 

> Umm... that is complete bull, I think the list is open for such topics 
> of discussion. I have not had problems with other kernels say on my 
> Slackware 9.1 boxes/servers..or other computers that I install certain 
> distros of Linux on.. ? (And I install quite a few systems each month).
> 
> Other people have already piped in and agreed with me also.
> 
> How can you say it isnt a Gentoo user list issue?
> 
> I am using Gentoo, quite happily.. on 8 systems!
> 
> And if you have followed any of my posts, You would have seen that I 
> have pointed out exactly what is going wrong, hoping someone who knows 
> better can post a fix.
> 
> I quote:
> 
> "you want someone to be held accountable for a product buy closed source,
> buy Microsoft where you are guaranteed to get the same every time and
> have some one to have a go at."
> 
> /\ that above my friend is complete bull, are you some kid or something?
> I am a President of a Linux Users Group and I help people out with Linux 
>   everyday, I contribute to open source and to even try and tell me to
> "buy Microsoft" is another complete line of bull also.
> 
> What gives you the right to even say something like that is beyond me.
> 
> I am not looking for someone to "be held accountable" I am looking for 
> an answer to my problem, of which is "Gentoo" related. The sources I get 
> are from Gentoo ebuilds. So that makes it a "Gentoo" issue.
> 
> I will gladly post my complaints and rants to the kernel mailing list, 
> if that is what it takes.
> 
> So what happens next? Are you going to have me banned from the list, 
> because of my opinions?
> 
> Get off your high horse and get a clue.
> 
> Thank you
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> -- 
> TriKster Abacus
> irc.freenode.net #cllug #gentoo #linuxfriends
> irc.cotse.com #linux
> http://www.cllug.org
> http://www.trikster.homelinux.org
> http://www.trikster.homelinux.org/contact.html
> 
> 
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Re: [gentoo-user] Synaptics touchpad, kernel 2.6, XFree 3.3

2004-02-12 Thread Mathew L Alexander

I too am having problems, I'm able to use the mouse but I can't double
tap the pad and the cursor select the item. I have to use the buttons :(
Any ideas?





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Re: [gentoo-user] where to define shell aliases?

add it to .bashrc

brendan

On Thu, 2004-02-12 at 22:32, Sven Köhler wrote:
> hi,
> 
> till now i still write my aliases to /etc/portage, but shouldn't there 
> be a better way?
> 
> i remember a distro where /etc/portage included some file like 
> /etc/aliases which containes the common aliases like
>alias ls=ls --color
> or such stuff.
> 
> so what do you think?
> should this be improved?
> 
> 
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Brendan Sullivan
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

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[gentoo-user] apologies

Ok.

For the past few days I have been doing some serious ranting about the 
2.6.X series kernel. My intentions were not to start a "flame" war, but 
to draw attention to the fact that certain things did not work as 
"advertised"

I made every attempt to show my situation, and to post results that were 
not made up or falsely attained.

I really wanted to get more input about this situation, though I have 
generated some good/positive replies. (I.E. 1, which was good about 
waiting for the 2.6.X kernel to mature a bit more.. ) .. That was fair.

Anyhow, please if you are having issues, try some of the things I have 
tried and get the results. If this continues to be an issue I will 
definatley bring this to the attention of the kernel maintainers and 
developers. I just want to see Linux advance without all the false 
benchmarks and negative advertising .. about how great it is proportedly 
supposed to be. That is just like Micro$oft's nefarious ways..

I am seriously angry though, because I have done my research, and 
everything has pointed me to discussions and interviews with these 
maintainers that say 2.6.X as a desktop kernel outperforms a 2.4.X 
kernel by over 3-X's. and yes.. I am positive they said "Desktop" not, 
servers.. yes I know that the servers running say apache are supposed to 
be awesome, I am not hear to benchmark apache.. I run gaming clients.. 
and I want speed and performance.. I have barely anything in my kernel, 
and if I do it is probably modularized. I dont wish to overclock.. but 
that is a different story..

Anyhow..

I have seen different... and like I said before.. this is across a 
network with multiple Linux clients, and a plethora of different 
processors and makes/models.

As I get results.. even from newer ... less "mature" kernels, I will 
post my results and try to get to the bottom of this issue to maybe join 
the ranks of others who proclaim the power of the 2.6.X kernels.

Please bear with me.

Once again.. I apologize.. I am dreadfully sorry.

Thank you

Sincerely,

P.S.  sorry if my spelling is so poor.. Thunderbird only picks up so 
much.. 8-)

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Re: [gentoo-user] where to define shell aliases?

2004-02-12 Thread Chris van der Pennen





Um, i hope you mean /etc/profile.

Anyway, you can use ~/.bashrc if you're using bash.  Other shells, you'll have to read the man page to see where they keep their per-user profile.

Chris

On Fri, 2004-02-13 at 15:02, Sven Köhler wrote:

hi,

till now i still write my aliases to /etc/portage, but shouldn't there 
be a better way?

i remember a distro where /etc/portage included some file like 
/etc/aliases which containes the common aliases like
   alias ls=ls --color
or such stuff.

so what do you think?
should this be improved?


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for scratch space after they are finished calling them?








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Re: [gentoo-user] where to define shell aliases?

2004-02-12 Thread Brett I. Holcomb

I put my aliases, environment variables, etc. in /etc/bash.rc and I 
modified /etc/skel/.bash_profile to source this file.  Thus users get 
whatever is in /etc/bash.rc.

Sven Köhler wrote:
hi,

till now i still write my aliases to /etc/portage, but shouldn't there 
be a better way?

i remember a distro where /etc/portage included some file like 
/etc/aliases which containes the common aliases like
  alias ls=ls --color
or such stuff.

so what do you think?
should this be improved?
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Re: [gentoo-user] where to define shell aliases?

2004-02-12 Thread blade-

I put mine in my .bashrc

Sven Köhler wrote:

hi,

till now i still write my aliases to /etc/portage, but shouldn't there 
be a better way?

i remember a distro where /etc/portage included some file like 
/etc/aliases which containes the common aliases like
  alias ls=ls --color
or such stuff.

so what do you think?
should this be improved?
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[gentoo-user] where to define shell aliases?

2004-02-12 Thread Sven Köhler

hi,

till now i still write my aliases to /etc/portage, but shouldn't there 
be a better way?

i remember a distro where /etc/portage included some file like 
/etc/aliases which containes the common aliases like
  alias ls=ls --color
or such stuff.

so what do you think?
should this be improved?
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Re: [gentoo-user] Mail confirmation requests

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, The awesome and feared Collins Richey commented thusly,

> On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:41:37 +0600 (LKT)
> Grendel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> > On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, The awesome and feared Glenn Johnson commented
> > thusly,
> > 
> 
> > 
> > So the killfilter which i use is a bayesian filter, ie it has been
> > trained to recognise people in email lists who have a annoying
> > potential,
> 
> Unfortunately, Grendel, many of your recent responses (not your
> technical queries) are prime candidates for your own killfilter,
> namely supremely annoying.

Fortunately the owners email addreses are excempt from the killfilter, 
otherwise as you quite correctly pointed out I would be in trouble too :-) 

On a side note if anyone is interested in trying bayesian mail filtering 
it is very easy to setup. I would recommend getting bmf (bayesian mail 
filter) from sourceforge.

extract the sources and compile and install it.

Now you have to train it, first of all feed a folder containing a group of 
your normal email to it so that it recognises what is your normail email.

bmf -n -i normal_email_folder

Now download some spam from spamarchive.org and feed it to bmf
bmf -s -i 315.r2

Now edit your ~/.procmailrc and have the following in it,

# Invoke bmf as a filter
:0 fw
| bmf -p

# Filter spam
:0:
*^X-Spam-Status: Yes
mail/spam

Now as your mail gets delivered through procmail it will get scanned and 
if it is spam it will go to the mail/spam folder.

If you receive a mail which is not spam but recognised as spam, then 
export it as say message.txt and invoke

bmf -N -i message.txt

If you receive a spam which does nto get caught, then export it as say 
message.txt

then 
bmf -S -i message.txt

It gets better with time.

Grendel

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Re: [gentoo-user] How to set Gtk2 themes/fonts

On Thu, 2004-02-12 at 21:24, Jens Mayer wrote:
> * On Thu, Feb 12, 2004 at 21:11:46 -0600, Brendan Sullivan wrote:
> 
> > Hey everyone, I've been running Enlightenment for a while now with gtk2
> > themes and system fonts set by running the 'gnome-settings-daemon' at
> > startup. I'm pretty convinced I like Enlightenment a lot more than
> > Gnome, and kindof need to clear out some space on my root partition (in
> > the form of unmerging Gnome and other unused programs)
> 
> > How else can i set gtk2 and fonts (console) besides these Gnome tools?
> 
> Maybe you want to give gtk-theme-switch a try:
> 
> , [ emerge -s gtk-theme-switch ]
> |
> | *  x11-themes/gtk-theme-switch
> |   Latest version available: 2.0.0_rc2-r1
> |   Latest version installed: 2.0.0_rc2-r1
> |   Size of downloaded files: 13 kB
> |   Homepage:http://www.muhri.net/nav.php3?node=gts
> |   Description: Application for easy change of GTK-Themes
> |   License: GPL-2
> |
> `
> 
> Regards,
> Jens

that was perfect! thank you very much.

now the only other problem i have is that my fonts are a bit too large
when enlightenment starts. Again, the 'gnome-settings-daemon' was taking
care of this and I can't figure out how to set it in any config files.

Please advise.

FWIW, running 1600x1200 on a 19" crt.

Thanks
-- 
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<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

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Re: [gentoo-user] Safe? Multiple simultaneous emerge package-x

On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:44:14 +0800
"senectus" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Just out of interest.. 
> Is it smart enough on a multi processor machine to dedicate one CPU
> for each emerge/compile? 
> 
> Also would it do a similar trick for "hyper threaded" CPU's?
> 

If by "it," you mean emerge, then no.  Allocation of CPU's to processes
is totally under control of the kernel dispatching routines.

-- 
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Gentoo stable kernel 2.6.2-rc1

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Re: [gentoo-user] Mail confirmation requests

On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:41:37 +0600 (LKT)
Grendel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, The awesome and feared Glenn Johnson commented
> thusly,
> 

> 
> So the killfilter which i use is a bayesian filter, ie it has been
> trained to recognise people in email lists who have a annoying
> potential,

Unfortunately, Grendel, many of your recent responses (not your
technical queries) are prime candidates for your own killfilter,
namely supremely annoying.

-- 
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Gentoo stable kernel 2.6.3-rc2

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Re: [gentoo-user] Mail confirmation requests

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, The awesome and feared Glenn Johnson commented thusly,

> On Fri, Feb 13, 2004 at 08:12:22AM +0600, Grendel wrote:
> 
> > I didnt have to even bother to add you, with your last post you
> > automatically triggered my killfilter. I really am considering
> > releasing the source for this killfilter as it learns quite well,
> > as it would have studied your posts and marked you out as a likely
> > candidate long before your current post.
> 
> I hate to interject here, but how does a killfilter work?

Well its like this, in the good old days you had a killfile, ie a file 
that you put all the email addreses that you dont want mail from. Now when 
say you receive a email a program checks the killfile and if the senders 
email is present it takes appropriate action, it can save it to a seperate 
folder like mail/pests or send it to /dev/null.

One method this was used for was to remove spam, ie put the list of known 
spamers email addreses and you will not get mail from those addreses. Also 
if you dont like email from someone in this group you add his/her email 
address to the kill file and you wont be troubled by him/her anymore.

Now of course the trend for spam is to use a bayesian filter like bmf or 
bogofilter. How these filters work is that at the start you train them by 
feeding them a database of emails and tell them that this is what spam 
looks like. Then you feed them your normal email and tell then this is 
what my normal mail is. Now you run the program. 

Now when thee bayesian filter receives a email it searches its database 
for strings in the email and calculates a probability whether this mail is 
spam or not. Then it adds the latest information from the email to its 
database. So as you can see the more spam it receives the better it 
becomes at detecting spam. Of course if it flags a normal mail as spam, 
then you can instruct it that this mail is not spam, its a genuine 
message. So it will learn and not make the mistake again. trust me that 
bmf and bogofilter are better than spamassasin. I tested that with the 
last 1000 emails I recevied 200 were spam, and only 1  got through. 
Freshmeat has more about this in the spam-filter review on the main page.

So the killfilter which i use is a bayesian filter, ie it has been trained
to recognise people in email lists who have a annoying potential, for
example people who use bad words, it also analyses the replies to my posts
and ranks a persons reply as hostile or friendly. It also analyses my
replies to users and decides if my reply is hostile or friendly and thus
grades people in the list. 

All this is done through bayesian studies so the more I correspond the
better it gets at detecting people. So based on things like the above it
gueses in advance whether a user should be added to the killfile and his
email being sent to /dev/null and does it.

Grendel

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RE: [gentoo-user] Safe? Multiple simultaneous emerge package-x

2004-02-12 Thread senectus

Just out of interest.. 
Is it smart enough on a multi processor machine to dedicate one CPU for each
emerge/compile? 

Also would it do a similar trick for "hyper threaded" CPU's?

-Original Message-
From: Collins Richey [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Friday, 13 February 2004 11:30 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Safe? Multiple simultaneous emerge package-x

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:24:12 -0500
Kevin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Is it safe to do multiple emerge commands (emerge package1 and emerge 
> package2) simultaneously in different xterms or virtual consoles?  Any
> 
> exclusive locks on files or anything?
> 

In general, it's ok; just be sure that you don't try to emerge the same
package in parallel!  Do an 'emerge -pv ...' first.  If there are no
duplicates, fire away.

Of course, you may slow everything down unless you have a very fast cpu.

-- 
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Re: [gentoo-user] Safe? Multiple simultaneous emerge package-x

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:24:12 -0500
Kevin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Is it safe to do multiple emerge commands (emerge package1 and emerge 
> package2) simultaneously in different xterms or virtual consoles?  Any
> 
> exclusive locks on files or anything?
> 

In general, it's ok; just be sure that you don't try to emerge the same
package in parallel!  Do an 'emerge -pv ...' first.  If there are no
duplicates, fire away.

Of course, you may slow everything down unless you have a very fast cpu.

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[gentoo-user] kong & cache

2004-02-12 Thread Chris

where does konq cache eveything from the web?
-- 

Chris P. Carter
<--->
 The smallest and even the dumbest of questions can lead to enlightenment.
 
 True wisdom is knowing when to listen, when to speak, when act and when to 
but out.
<--->
Gentoo Linux - KDE 3.2 (and proud of it)


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Re: [gentoo-user] How to set Gtk2 themes/fonts

2004-02-12 Thread Jens Mayer

* On Thu, Feb 12, 2004 at 21:11:46 -0600, Brendan Sullivan wrote:

> Hey everyone, I've been running Enlightenment for a while now with gtk2
> themes and system fonts set by running the 'gnome-settings-daemon' at
> startup. I'm pretty convinced I like Enlightenment a lot more than
> Gnome, and kindof need to clear out some space on my root partition (in
> the form of unmerging Gnome and other unused programs)

> How else can i set gtk2 and fonts (console) besides these Gnome tools?

Maybe you want to give gtk-theme-switch a try:

, [ emerge -s gtk-theme-switch ]
|
| *  x11-themes/gtk-theme-switch
|   Latest version available: 2.0.0_rc2-r1
|   Latest version installed: 2.0.0_rc2-r1
|   Size of downloaded files: 13 kB
|   Homepage:http://www.muhri.net/nav.php3?node=gts
|   Description: Application for easy change of GTK-Themes
|   License: GPL-2
|
`

Regards,
Jens

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Re: [gentoo-user] Mail confirmation requests

2004-02-12 Thread Glenn Johnson

On Fri, Feb 13, 2004 at 08:12:22AM +0600, Grendel wrote:

> I didnt have to even bother to add you, with your last post you
> automatically triggered my killfilter. I really am considering
> releasing the source for this killfilter as it learns quite well,
> as it would have studied your posts and marked you out as a likely
> candidate long before your current post.

I hate to interject here, but how does a killfilter work?

-- 
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Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4 - A-FRIGGIN-Men!

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:18:16 -0800
Ian Truelsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:05:09 -0600
> TriKster Abacus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> > This just goes to prove that I am not the only one seeing this
> > bullsh*ty "ooohooohhhh ... 2.6.X is so great!" crap
> > 
> Excuse me for interrupting, but does it make a lot of sense to be
> benchmarking what is essentially a development kernel? 

I imagine IBM did the benchmarks to get a feel for the improvements in
the enterprise (i.e. multi-cpu server) support for 2.6.  This is not to
say that it won't imrove more after .10, etc.

> 
> For the record, I have seen a slight downgrade in X performance with
> 2.6, but not much of one. However, I am not running 2.6 for speed, but
> to help in the development in whatever small way that I can. 
> 
> I am giving them a good 10 releases before I expect to see the same or
> better performance.
> 

I have noticed little difference in performance, and on my measly
desktop, nothing but rock-solid stability for six months of 2.5/2.6.

Be patient my son.

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Re: [gentoo-user] Which kernel version to select?

2004-02-12 Thread blade-

It means that all the kernel versions above that have been masked. You 
can use: ACCEPT_KEYWORDS="~x86" emerge 
/usr/portage/sys-kernel/gentoo-dev-sources/
gentoo-dev-sources-2.6.2.ebuild

I will compile my own kernel from the source.  my query was is there a way 
to ask emerge to get me the kernel-2.6.2 vanilla sources? emerge 
gentoo-dev-sources gives me 2.6.1-rc1 

 

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[gentoo-user] How to set Gtk2 themes/fonts

Hey everyone, I've been running Enlightenment for a while now with gtk2
themes and system fonts set by running the 'gnome-settings-daemon' at
startup. I'm pretty convinced I like Enlightenment a lot more than
Gnome, and kindof need to clear out some space on my root partition (in
the form of unmerging Gnome and other unused programs)

How else can i set gtk2 and fonts (console) besides these Gnome tools?

Sorry for the newbie question...I just suddenly went to do it and
realized i had no earthly clue where to start, and google isn't being
very helpful either.

Thanks for any suggestions
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Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4 B.S.!!!!!

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:10:50 -0600
TriKster Abacus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Gentoo Lists wrote:
> > I don't want to feed this but what it really comes down to is if
> > your not happy use the 2.4 kernels or make friendly constructive
> > comments on the Kernel mailing lists 
> Umm... that is complete bull, 
> So what happens next? Are you going to have me banned from the list, 
> because of my opinions?
> 
> Get off your high horse and get a clue.
> 

[ lots of drivel deleted ]

If I didn't know better, I would say it's full of the moon.  Maybe both
of you could ride a little lower on the horse.

-- 
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Re: [gentoo-user] Safe? Multiple simultaneous emerge package-x

2004-02-12 Thread blade-

I remember reading on the forums that it can mess up the dependency tree 
or something, it may have chnaged since then but I would not until 
someone confirms its ok.

Kevin wrote:

Is it safe to do multiple emerge commands (emerge package1 and emerge 
package2) simultaneously in different xterms or virtual consoles?  Any 
exclusive locks on files or anything?

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Re: [gentoo-user] Which kernel version to select?

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, The awesome and feared Collins Richey commented thusly,


> Got it in one.  Gentoo was not designed for the unexperienced, but a lot
> of unexperienced users have made the grade.

yes, thats a tribute to the good support from this list more than anything 
else. If I didnt have this list I dont know where I would be. Anyway I 
certainly wont be going back to mandrake I managed to get kde 3 running 
and it looks good. Certainly everything seems much faster even on my 
athlon-xp machine. 

> This is (merely) a matter of understanding the USE variables.  Always do
> an 'emerge -pv packagename' to understand what USE variables are
> recognized by the package.  An example: xfce will drag in all of kde and
> gnome, if those USE variables are in effect!

Thanks. 

> Don't have a clue.  genkernel has created more grief for more people
> than any other gentoo feature.  I wouldn't touch it with a fork.

I will compile my own kernel from the source.  my query was is there a way 
to ask emerge to get me the kernel-2.6.2 vanilla sources? emerge 
gentoo-dev-sources gives me 2.6.1-rc1 


 

bye,
Grendel 

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Re: [gentoo-user] Which kernel version to select?

On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:22:43 +0600 (LKT)
Grendel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, The awesome and feared Collins Richey commented
> thusly,
> 

> Yes, but I dont know if I am missing something here, but still this
> means that you need a lot of patience and a extremely high level of
> linux experience to install gentoo.

Got it in one.  Gentoo was not designed for the unexperienced, but a lot
of unexperienced users have made the grade.

> 
> Also there are annying things like something simple as emerge emu10k1 
> trying to download aumix and all its dependencies like xf86 :(

This is (merely) a matter of understanding the USE variables.  Always do
an 'emerge -pv packagename' to understand what USE variables are
recognized by the package.  An example: xfce will drag in all of kde and
gnome, if those USE variables are in effect!
> 
> But all in all I like it, its just the installation process that sux.
> 
> Currently I got the 2.6 kernel installed, but genkernel asks me to
> pass the options "boot=/dev/ram0 real_boot=/dev/hda6", I tried but it
> dont work so I switched back to 2.4.20.
> 
> Is there a way to get newer kernels ?
> 

Don't have a clue.  genkernel has created more grief for more people
than any other gentoo feature.  I wouldn't touch it with a fork.

-- 
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[gentoo-user] gcc-config

2004-02-12 Thread Mike

I have three versions of gcc installed on my system: 2.95.3, 3.2.3, and
3.3.2. I'm using gcc-config to select a version.  gcc-3.3.2 was recently
installed. But, I'm still using gcc-3.2.3 most of the time and
experimenting with gcc-3.3.2. Now, after ever package emerge portage
wants to unmerge gcc-3.3.2. If I switch compilers to gcc-3.3.2 then
portage will try to unmerge gcc-3.2.3. How can I tell portage to keep
all three versions? 

Thanks in advance,
Mike

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RE: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4 B.S.!!!!!

2004-02-12 Thread Gentoo Lists

No I am not going to have you banded because this is your own opinion.
Your allowed to have one, I actually value that you have your own
opinion cause if you didn't this would be a very bland and borring
world. 

You talk about me getting off my high horse but you jump so quickly I
wonder if you think about what your saying let alone what you are
reading. Claiming that you are God, Emperor or General of a Linux group
sounds like someone who has had their feathers ruffled and wants to feel
good about themselves. I have read your previous posts and they read
like rants and not common questions. 

I don't doubt your claims cause I haven't tested them either way and
with the way computers are things can differ so drastically I am not
going to get involved cause I am happy with the way my machines and
network perform when running Gentoo or any other distro. 

To sum up. I don't mind if you post your kernel problems here but what
to me seems like trying to start an army to fix these problems is not
the way of doing things. 

Personally I don't see a lot of difference between my 2.4 kernel
machines and my 2.6 when running as a desktop because running 1/2 dozen
threads really doesn't tax the machine or its software systems. A lot of
this can be put down to my poor human brain and eyes can't capture the
difference. 

You really need to think about how you say things rather than what. 

Get off the age thing, telling someone that they sound like a kid is
just pathetic and a sign of someone who insecure in themselves. Learn to
take a little criticism especially when it isn't at you but what you are
doing. 

Cheers
Simon

-Original Message-
From: TriKster Abacus [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Friday, 13 February 2004 15:11
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4 B.S.!

Gentoo Lists wrote:
> I don't want to feed this but what it really comes down to is if your
> not happy use the 2.4 kernels or make friendly constructive comments
on
> the Kernel mailing lists where a developer who has given many many
hours
> to bring you this nice new kernel can answer and maybe resolve your
> issues. Remember all this is free and comes from the love and time of
a
> select few people who have the knowledge and time to do something like
> this. 
> 
> Ranting and raving on a Gentoo user list is going to get you nowhere.
If
> you want someone to be held accountable for a product buy closed
source,
> buy Microsoft where you are guaranteed to get the same every time and
> have some one to have a go at.
> 
> Open source is about choice. If you don't like one choice make
another.
> Maybe go to a BSD instead of Linux if it doesn't rock your boat
> properly.
> 
> Cheers
> Simon

Umm... that is complete bull, I think the list is open for such topics 
of discussion. I have not had problems with other kernels say on my 
Slackware 9.1 boxes/servers..or other computers that I install certain 
distros of Linux on.. ? (And I install quite a few systems each month).

Other people have already piped in and agreed with me also.

How can you say it isnt a Gentoo user list issue?

I am using Gentoo, quite happily.. on 8 systems!

And if you have followed any of my posts, You would have seen that I 
have pointed out exactly what is going wrong, hoping someone who knows 
better can post a fix.

I quote:

"you want someone to be held accountable for a product buy closed
source,
buy Microsoft where you are guaranteed to get the same every time and
have some one to have a go at."

/\ that above my friend is complete bull, are you some kid or something?
I am a President of a Linux Users Group and I help people out with Linux

  everyday, I contribute to open source and to even try and tell me to
"buy Microsoft" is another complete line of bull also.

What gives you the right to even say something like that is beyond me.

I am not looking for someone to "be held accountable" I am looking for 
an answer to my problem, of which is "Gentoo" related. The sources I get

are from Gentoo ebuilds. So that makes it a "Gentoo" issue.

I will gladly post my complaints and rants to the kernel mailing list, 
if that is what it takes.

So what happens next? Are you going to have me banned from the list, 
because of my opinions?

Get off your high horse and get a clue.

Thank you

Sincerely,

-- 
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irc.freenode.net #cllug #gentoo #linuxfriends
irc.cotse.com #linux
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Re: [gentoo-user] Which kernel version to select?

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, The awesome and feared Collins Richey commented thusly,


> 1) There are one or more projects underway to automate the install
> process.  Search the archives or in forum.  Most of us don't mind the
> manual process because normally you only need to do it once, then update
> forever.

Yes, but I dont know if I am missing something here, but still this means 
that you need a lot of patience and a extremely high level of linux 
experience to install gentoo.

Also there are annying things like something simple as emerge emu10k1 
trying to download aumix and all its dependencies like xf86 :(

But all in all I like it, its just the installation process that sux.

Currently I got the 2.6 kernel installed, but genkernel asks me to pass 
the options "boot=/dev/ram0 real_boot=/dev/hda6", I tried but it dont work 
so I switched back to 2.4.20.

Is there a way to get newer kernels ?

 
> 2) I disagree.  I've gotten better installation support from this mail
> group and from the gentoo forum users than any other distro I've worked
> with, bar none.

Agreed.

Grendel


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[gentoo-user] Safe? Multiple simultaneous emerge package-x

2004-02-12 Thread Kevin

Is it safe to do multiple emerge commands (emerge package1 and emerge 
package2) simultaneously in different xterms or virtual consoles?  Any 
exclusive locks on files or anything?

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Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4 - A-FRIGGIN-Men!

2004-02-12 Thread Ian Truelsen

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:05:09 -0600
TriKster Abacus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> This just goes to prove that I am not the only one seeing this
> bullsh*ty "ooohooohhhh ... 2.6.X is so great!" crap
> 
Excuse me for interrupting, but does it make a lot of sense to be
benchmarking what is essentially a development kernel? I would think
that when they are in the single digits in releases, they are simply
trying to make sure that everything works. Once the 2.6 tree has been
around for a while they will work on speed tweaks. 

For the record, I have seen a slight downgrade in X performance with
2.6, but not much of one. However, I am not running 2.6 for speed, but
to help in the development in whatever small way that I can. 

I am giving them a good 10 releases before I expect to see the same or
better performance.

-- 
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Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4 B.S.!!!!!

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, The awesome and feared TriKster Abacus commented thusly,

My advice to everyone is to wait a bit till the kernel becomes at least 
2.6.5 (preferably 2.6.10) as we then only assume that a kernel has become 
really stable. Till then stick with kernel 2.4.x

Grendel


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Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4 B.S.!!!!!

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:19:21 -0600
TriKster Abacus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> 
> >>From what I have read, the major performance gains are for MP
> >machines. 

> 
> Ya, but the issue here is.. a desktop system, running basic programs..
> 
> I.E. X, xchat-2, mozilla, [your favorite email client here], fluxbox, 
> kde < whatever.. and a few Eterms/xterms
> 
> There is not any noticeable improvement on speeds.
> 

Exactly my point.  For the average desktop user there may be little or
no improvement until the kernel developers have fine tuned the product a
little more.  Right now (only .3 release), they're still pretty much in
cleanup mode.

-- 
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Gentoo stable kernel 2.6.2-rc1

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Re: [gentoo-user] Mail confirmation requests

On Fri, 13 Feb 2004, The awesome and feared Peter Ruskin commented thusly,

> On Friday 13 Feb 2004 1:45 am, Grendel wrote:
> > You have pushed this once too often and are showing your utter
> > immaturity noro, so I am adding you to my killfilter.
> 
> and you, grendel, have been added to mine.  I think this list would be 
> better without you and your nasty comments

I didnt have to even bother to add you, with your last post you
automatically triggered my killfilter. I really am considering releasing
the source for this killfilter as it learns quite well, as it would have
studied your posts and marked you out as a likely candidate long before
your current post. 

Currently going over the logs I see it has added 3 people to the kill
filter and has a high probability of adding 2 more soon.

The only reason I joined this list is because that I have been hearing of
how a superb user friendly list etc etc, and it has been apart from minor
annoyances.  I want to help linux users from my years of linux experience
otherwise I have more valuable things to do with my time.

If anyone else feels that I am not wellcome in the list then I will remove 
myself.

Grendel

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RE: [gentoo-user] OT: Win NT & 2k

2004-02-12 Thread senectus

I didn't say that it IS a hoax.. I said I believe it's a hoax.. 
If you want a copy of the file list.. yell out.. I'm pretty confident that
if you look at it you discount it as a load or carp.. (fishy ;-) 

For the record.. I don't have the source.. I'm not interested in obtaining
the source.. and I would know what to do with it if I had it anyway.. :-P

-Original Message-
From: Michiel ten Hagen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Friday, 13 February 2004 10:31 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] OT: Win NT & 2k

How do you know its a hoax? Do you know what the real source looks like?

I must admit it looks like an hoax but maybe its true. Just wait and well
see.



On Friday 13 February 2004 01:20, senectus wrote:
> Pffft..
> I've got a copy of the "list of files" in .txt format (ie no source code..
> just a list of the names of the files they claim to be the source code..)
> and it looks completely bogus..
> I'm kinda surprised that /. Even mentioned it.. especially with the
quality
> of some of the comments on that sites forum.. bunch of Lusers... :-P
>
> It's a hoax.. and not a very good one I believe..
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Spider [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Friday, 13 February 2004 7:35 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] OT: Win NT & 2k
>
> begin  quote
> On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 00:10:16 +0100
>
> Jakub Krajcovic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Hi guys, i know this is totally OT, but if you don't mind, check out
> > slashdot concernig %subject
>
>  I hope that you all display enough common sense not
> to download it, even if you just want to gloat a bit at the comments.
>
> The vision of a set of cute lawsuits (SCO style) from MS targetted at
> various OSS/FS projects with a wide range of assaults, where the
> evidence is simply ISP logs showing an IP downloading said source is
> pretty frightening.
>
>  Imagine the reprecautions for projects like
> Samba, Gnome, KDE, and other technologies that can be seen as
> "infringing" on some of MS turf. Its an easy, blunt lega weapon to weild
> against whole projects, stating that all progress past this point is
> only because you copied MS sources, weilding a large batch of patents,
> tradesecrets and copyright infringement claims and slamming large and
> wide.
>
>   please, dont fall for the temptation.
> //Spider

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Re: [gentoo-user] Making cdrecord work

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:08:36 +0600 (LKT)
Grendel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


> No the cvs version of cdrdao works fine with ATAPI drives. 
> cdrdao write --device /dev/hdd vice_city.toc
> works fine. I burned a lot of .bin files using it and had no problem.
> 

Good to know.  I haven't used it.


-- 
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Re: [gentoo-user] Mail confirmation requests

Peter Ruskin wrote:
On Friday 13 Feb 2004 1:45 am, Grendel wrote:

You have pushed this once too often and are showing your utter
immaturity noro, so I am adding you to my killfilter.


and you, grendel, have been added to mine.  I think this list would be 
better without you and your nasty comments

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Hell, you haven't seen nothing yet, I actually got an email from someone 
called: [EMAIL PROTECTED] claiming to be "Gentoo Lists"

Talk about pushing around

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irc.cotse.com #linux
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Re: [gentoo-user] Which kernel version to select?

On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 06:55:18 +0600 (LKT)
Grendel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I managed to get gentoo running, the installation was the worst
> experience i had since I installed debian. You know some of the things
> I have to do are so common that why anyone cant write a intereactive
> install script to automate some aspects of the things is beyond me.
> 
> Fortunately the harrowing aspefct of the installation is offsetted 
> somewhat by the speed increase and good package management I see. I
> never understand why distros which have the best package management
> (gentoo, debian) have almost non existant installation support :(
> 

A couple of thoughts:

1) There are one or more projects underway to automate the install
process.  Search the archives or in forum.  Most of us don't mind the
manual process because normally you only need to do it once, then update
forever.

2) I disagree.  I've gotten better installation support from this mail
group and from the gentoo forum users than any other distro I've worked
with, bar none.

3) You will catch more bears with honey than vinegar.

-- 
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Gentoo stable kernel 2.6.3-rc2

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Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4 B.S.!!!!!

Gentoo Lists wrote:
I don't want to feed this but what it really comes down to is if your
not happy use the 2.4 kernels or make friendly constructive comments on
the Kernel mailing lists where a developer who has given many many hours
to bring you this nice new kernel can answer and maybe resolve your
issues. Remember all this is free and comes from the love and time of a
select few people who have the knowledge and time to do something like
this. 

Ranting and raving on a Gentoo user list is going to get you nowhere. If
you want someone to be held accountable for a product buy closed source,
buy Microsoft where you are guaranteed to get the same every time and
have some one to have a go at.
Open source is about choice. If you don't like one choice make another.
Maybe go to a BSD instead of Linux if it doesn't rock your boat
properly.
Cheers
Simon


Umm... that is complete bull, I think the list is open for such topics 
of discussion. I have not had problems with other kernels say on my 
Slackware 9.1 boxes/servers..or other computers that I install certain 
distros of Linux on.. ? (And I install quite a few systems each month).

Other people have already piped in and agreed with me also.

How can you say it isnt a Gentoo user list issue?

I am using Gentoo, quite happily.. on 8 systems!

And if you have followed any of my posts, You would have seen that I 
have pointed out exactly what is going wrong, hoping someone who knows 
better can post a fix.

I quote:

"you want someone to be held accountable for a product buy closed source,
buy Microsoft where you are guaranteed to get the same every time and
have some one to have a go at."
/\ that above my friend is complete bull, are you some kid or something?
I am a President of a Linux Users Group and I help people out with Linux 
 everyday, I contribute to open source and to even try and tell me to
"buy Microsoft" is another complete line of bull also.

What gives you the right to even say something like that is beyond me.

I am not looking for someone to "be held accountable" I am looking for 
an answer to my problem, of which is "Gentoo" related. The sources I get 
are from Gentoo ebuilds. So that makes it a "Gentoo" issue.

I will gladly post my complaints and rants to the kernel mailing list, 
if that is what it takes.

So what happens next? Are you going to have me banned from the list, 
because of my opinions?

Get off your high horse and get a clue.

Thank you

Sincerely,

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Re: [gentoo-user] 1394 modules under Gentoo

2004-02-12 Thread Mark Knecht

On Thu, 2004-02-12 at 17:44, Jose González Gómez wrote:
> I think you should modify /etc/modules.autoload.d/kernel-2.x 
> instead.

Good idea! Didn't think of that. Thanks!

>  Or emerge hotplug, rc-update add hotplug default.

That I have done, but it doesn't get the modules loaded. You cannot see
the hotplug event on the 1394 bus without the modules loaded. 

Thanks,
Mark
> 
> Regards
> Jose
> 

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Re: [gentoo-user] Synaptics touchpad, kernel 2.6, XFree 3.3

2004-02-12 Thread Tom Syroid

Jose,

--On Friday, February 13, 2004 01:32:59 +0100 Jose González Gómez 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Hi there,

Is there anybody out there with a laptop with kernel 2.6, XFree 3.3
and a working Synaptics touchpad? I've found the following links:
I do. What, specifically, is it your looking for? Kernel conf? X config? 
It's all kinda inter-related ;-)

I'll give you what I can, but you have to start by providing some feedback 
on how far you're got, where you're stuck, etc.

One item of note: Cursor movement is still a little wild; haven't found the 
right tweak yet. But the configuration is workable.

/tom



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Re: [gentoo-user] Mail confirmation requests

2004-02-12 Thread Peter Ruskin

On Friday 13 Feb 2004 1:45 am, Grendel wrote:
> You have pushed this once too often and are showing your utter
> immaturity noro, so I am adding you to my killfilter.

and you, grendel, have been added to mine.  I think this list would be 
better without you and your nasty comments

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RE: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4 B.S.!!!!!

2004-02-12 Thread Gentoo Lists

I don't want to feed this but what it really comes down to is if your
not happy use the 2.4 kernels or make friendly constructive comments on
the Kernel mailing lists where a developer who has given many many hours
to bring you this nice new kernel can answer and maybe resolve your
issues. Remember all this is free and comes from the love and time of a
select few people who have the knowledge and time to do something like
this. 

Ranting and raving on a Gentoo user list is going to get you nowhere. If
you want someone to be held accountable for a product buy closed source,
buy Microsoft where you are guaranteed to get the same every time and
have some one to have a go at.

Open source is about choice. If you don't like one choice make another.
Maybe go to a BSD instead of Linux if it doesn't rock your boat
properly.

Cheers
Simon

-Original Message-
From: TriKster Abacus [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Friday, 13 February 2004 14:19
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4 B.S.!

>>From what I have read, the major performance gains are for MP
machines. 
> Check the recent IBM benchmarks that report a 5-1 gain in web pages
> served for a 24 hour test on an 8-processor machine!
> 
>
http://www-106.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-web26/index.html?c
a=dgr-lnxw02KernCompare

Ya, but the issue here is.. a desktop system, running basic programs.. 
I.E. X, xchat-2, mozilla, [your favorite email client here], fluxbox, 
kde < whatever.. and a few Eterms/xterms

There is not any noticeable improvement on speeds.

See here: http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic.php?t=116183

And I QUOTE:

"Lovechild wrote:
Love-sources was mainly meant to get a good 2.6 kernel for
the desktop. we ship runtime selectable IO schedulers, the Nick
Piggin Scheduler Policy patch and a few other goodies - it's
based on the -mm kernel so it has all the goodies Andrew is
shipping as well as any patches flowing around on lkml right
after an -mm release to handle compile problems, etc."

So c'mon.. we are all tired of this bull crap.. let us see some hard 
evidence that these kernels, esp. the 2.6.X series.. PERIOD are any 
better than a 2.4.X kernel

A few of us have solid proof that the 2.6.X kernels actually are very, 
very much poorer in performance than the 2.4.X kernels!!

Our hdparm, glxgears and other things to test speed improvements are all

  very bad.

And please dont ask me for my outputs.. I spent quite awhile on this 
message:

Re: [gentoo-user] bulloney 2.6.X benchmarks (more!)

posted on 02/12/04 @ 13:09 CST - USA

Thank you

Sincerely,

-- 
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Re: [gentoo-user] Mail confirmation requests

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, Norbert Kamenicky howled,


> IMHO bigger problem are individuals which like to start
> new thread by reply of another one.
> 
> noro

You have pushed this once too often and are showing your utter immaturity
noro, so I am adding you to my killfilter. 

Usually my killfilters bayesian model identifies people who are likely to
be added to my killfile in advance based on my previous selections and the
offenders postings and automatically adds them to save me the touble, but 
noro seems to have escaped detection and is turning to be annoying. 

So I will add him myself.

*plonk*

Grendel


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Re: [gentoo-user] 1394 modules under Gentoo

2004-02-12 Thread Jose González Gómez

   I think you should modify /etc/modules.autoload.d/kernel-2.x 
instead. Or emerge hotplug, rc-update add hotplug default.

   Regards
   Jose
Mark Knecht escribió:

Hi,
  My home boxes use 1394 built into the kernel so I don't have this
issue. Some new machines at work have 1394 built as modules. 

  What's the right way to load these modules under Gentoo?

  Should I create some arbitrary file like /etc/modules.d/ohci , name
them in there and then run modules-update?
  What's the right way to do this?

Thanks,
Mark
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Re: [gentoo-user] OT: Win NT & 2k

2004-02-12 Thread Michiel ten Hagen

How do you know its a hoax? Do you know what the real source looks like?

I must admit it looks like an hoax but maybe its true. Just wait and well see.



On Friday 13 February 2004 01:20, senectus wrote:
> Pffft..
> I've got a copy of the "list of files" in .txt format (ie no source code..
> just a list of the names of the files they claim to be the source code..)
> and it looks completely bogus..
> I'm kinda surprised that /. Even mentioned it.. especially with the quality
> of some of the comments on that sites forum.. bunch of Lusers... :-P
>
> It's a hoax.. and not a very good one I believe..
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Spider [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Friday, 13 February 2004 7:35 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] OT: Win NT & 2k
>
> begin  quote
> On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 00:10:16 +0100
>
> Jakub Krajcovic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Hi guys, i know this is totally OT, but if you don't mind, check out
> > slashdot concernig %subject
>
>  I hope that you all display enough common sense not
> to download it, even if you just want to gloat a bit at the comments.
>
> The vision of a set of cute lawsuits (SCO style) from MS targetted at
> various OSS/FS projects with a wide range of assaults, where the
> evidence is simply ISP logs showing an IP downloading said source is
> pretty frightening.
>
>  Imagine the reprecautions for projects like
> Samba, Gnome, KDE, and other technologies that can be seen as
> "infringing" on some of MS turf. Its an easy, blunt lega weapon to weild
> against whole projects, stating that all progress past this point is
> only because you copied MS sources, weilding a large batch of patents,
> tradesecrets and copyright infringement claims and slamming large and
> wide.
>
>   please, dont fall for the temptation.
> //Spider

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Re: [gentoo-user] net-wireless/linux-wlan-ng-0.2.1_pre17-r1

2004-02-12 Thread Octavio Ruiz (Ta^3)


Let me guess, you are using Kernel series 2.6?

Remove sandbox or usersandbox in your make.conf before merging linux-wlan-ng
with 2.6 sources.

Mauro Arnoldi, who happens to be smarter than you, thinks:
> Hi! When I try to emerge this package I obtain this error:
> 
> /var/tmp/portage/linux-wlan-ng-0.2.1_pre17-r1/work/linux-wlan-ng-0.2.1-pre17/src/p80211/p80211netdev.c:1038:
>  
> warning: `dev_get' is deprecated (declared at include/linux/netdevice.h:512)
>   LD 
> [M]  
> /var/tmp/portage/linux-wlan-ng-0.2.1_pre17-r1/work/linux-wlan-ng-0.2.1-pre17/src/p80211/p80211.o
>   Building modules, stage 2.
>   MODPOST
> ACCESS DENIED  open_wr:   /usr/src/linux-2.6.3-rc1/.__modpost.cmd
> /bin/sh: line 1: ./.__modpost.cmd: Permission denied
> make[4]: *** [__modpost] Error 1
> make[3]: *** [modules] Error 2
> make[3]: Leaving directory `/usr/src/linux-2.6.3-rc1'
> make[2]: *** [default] Error 2
> make[2]: Leaving directory 
> `/var/tmp/portage/linux-wlan-ng-0.2.1_pre17-r1/work/linux-wlan-ng-0.2.1-pre17/src/p80211'
> make[1]: *** [all] Error 2
> make[1]: Leaving directory 
> `/var/tmp/portage/linux-wlan-ng-0.2.1_pre17-r1/work/linux-wlan-ng-0.2.1-pre17/src'
> make: *** [all] Error 2
> 
> !!! ERROR: net-wireless/linux-wlan-ng-0.2.1_pre17-r1 failed.
> !!! Function src_compile, Line 93, Exitcode 2
> !!! failed compiling
> 
> --- ACCESS VIOLATION SUMMARY 
> ---
> LOG FILE = 
> "/tmp/sandbox-net-wireless_-_linux-wlan-ng-0.2.1_pre17-r1-10098.log"
> 
> open_wr:   /usr/src/linux-2.6.3-rc1/.__modpost.cmd
> 
> 
> 
> Can you understand the reason?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Mauro
> 
> --
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
> 

-- 
try again

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Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4 B.S.!!!!!

From what I have read, the major performance gains are for MP machines.
Check the recent IBM benchmarks that report a 5-1 gain in web pages
served for a 24 hour test on an 8-processor machine!
http://www-106.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-web26/index.html?ca=dgr-lnxw02KernCompare
Ya, but the issue here is.. a desktop system, running basic programs..
I.E. X, xchat-2, mozilla, [your favorite email client here], fluxbox,
kde < whatever.. and a few Eterms/xterms

There is not any noticeable improvement on speeds.

See here: http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic.php?t=116183

And I QUOTE:

"Lovechild wrote:
Love-sources was mainly meant to get a good 2.6 kernel for
the desktop. we ship runtime selectable IO schedulers, the Nick
Piggin Scheduler Policy patch and a few other goodies - it's
based on the -mm kernel so it has all the goodies Andrew is
shipping as well as any patches flowing around on lkml right
after an -mm release to handle compile problems, etc."
So c'mon.. we are all tired of this bull crap.. let us see some hard
evidence that these kernels, esp. the 2.6.X series.. PERIOD are any
better than a 2.4.X kernel

A few of us have solid proof that the 2.6.X kernels actually are very,
very much poorer in performance than the 2.4.X kernels!!

Our hdparm, glxgears and other things to test speed improvements are all
very bad.

And please dont ask me for my outputs.. I spent quite awhile on this
message:

Re: [gentoo-user] bulloney 2.6.X benchmarks (more!)

posted on 02/12/04 @ 13:09 CST - USA

Thank you

Sincerely,

--
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irc.freenode.net #cllug #gentoo #linuxfriends
irc.cotse.com #linux
http://www.cllug.org
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RE: [gentoo-user] OT: Win NT & 2k

2004-02-12 Thread senectus

Pffft.. 
I've got a copy of the "list of files" in .txt format (ie no source code..
just a list of the names of the files they claim to be the source code..)
and it looks completely bogus.. 
I'm kinda surprised that /. Even mentioned it.. especially with the quality
of some of the comments on that sites forum.. bunch of Lusers... :-P

It's a hoax.. and not a very good one I believe..

-Original Message-
From: Spider [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Friday, 13 February 2004 7:35 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] OT: Win NT & 2k

begin  quote
On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 00:10:16 +0100
Jakub Krajcovic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Hi guys, i know this is totally OT, but if you don't mind, check out
> slashdot concernig %subject
> 

 I hope that you all display enough common sense not
to download it, even if you just want to gloat a bit at the comments.  

The vision of a set of cute lawsuits (SCO style) from MS targetted at
various OSS/FS projects with a wide range of assaults, where the
evidence is simply ISP logs showing an IP downloading said source is
pretty frightening.   

 Imagine the reprecautions for projects like
Samba, Gnome, KDE, and other technologies that can be seen as
"infringing" on some of MS turf. Its an easy, blunt lega weapon to weild
against whole projects, stating that all progress past this point is
only because you copied MS sources, weilding a large batch of patents,
tradesecrets and copyright infringement claims and slamming large and
wide.

  please, dont fall for the temptation.
//Spider

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Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Hey!

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, The awesome and feared Spider commented thusly,

> > Just dont think that you know the best and dont criticise others
> > openly, learn a lesson for once in your miserable life and read about
> > a bit before criticising other peoples comments and people themselves.
> 
> *Sigh*
> As I tried previously, I attacked your statement, not the person behind
> it, and your decision to portrude this to private mail in an effort to
> spark responses portrays you fairly negatively.
 
Well calling me "greentoe", is not attacking statements is it. I 
privately mailed you because I dont want to clatter this list with OT 
discussions. Instead you go and pst this to a public list. Well if this is 
the way you want publicity then you shall have it. 

> But, instead of using google to dig up the first and shiniest link,
> using the popularity gained on /. and blogging, I'd suggest you actually
> take the time to lean back and read lkml and other lists where the
> actual responsetimes are shown.

You wanted facts and I gave you facts, what is a better benchmark that to 
see how a kernel compile takes on different platform. There were other 
tests done and after all a benchmark is a benchmark, the fact that this 
link is popular changes nothing, even if it were less popular the 
benchmark statys the same.

Well I read the article you pointed too but the review himself never 
recommend that ext3 be used in any situation correct? For exery aspect ie 
low cpu, high throughput he recommended every other journalling FS other 
than ext3. So if this so called ext3 is so good why the review not mention 
it?
 
> When it comes to regards of benchmark quality, I wouldn't call something
> a "benchmark" when the sk. "benchmark" doesn't document what kernel it
> is that is being "benchmarked".  ( Note for the readers, according to
> referenced article (by grendel) comments, it was kernel 2.4.3-xfs that
> was tested, which would put it about 3 years ago. )

> Now, if you can show me a throughput vs. latency benchmark during a
> paralell ( ncpu * 2 ) C++ compile on a memory-strained system (48 Mb RAM
> or so), where you'd actually measure filesystem performance and not
> BufferCache performance (that, means "RAM" performance). 

How many machines in the real life pratically fit your specification, it
would be hard getting a 2.6 (even a 2.4)kernel running on a 48mb machine,
there would be a lot of swapping going on to render any file system 
bechmarks test pointless.
 
Every decent server that has a lot of file access going is going to have 
at least 256mb ram. So your example maybe good for a theretical situation, 
but it is of little practicle use in the real world.

ext3 and ext2's problem is that they dont scale well, btree based FS like 
reiserfs scale very well. So that is why they are superior to ext2 in 
every way. I would have been happier if the folks at redhat had decided to 
make ext3 a completely rewritten file system rather than trying to ensure 
ext2 compatibility. 


Grendel

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[gentoo-user] access violation during emerge pcmcia-cs

2004-02-12 Thread Roger


Emerge -uv pcmcia-cs  is failing with this error:


make[2]: Nothing to be done for `all'.
make[2]: Leaving directory
`/var/tmp/portage/pcmcia-cs-3.2.5-r1/work/pcmcia-cs-3.2.5/etc/cis'
make[1]: Leaving directory
`/var/tmp/portage/pcmcia-cs-3.2.5-r1/work/pcmcia-cs-3.2.5/etc'
--- ACCESS VIOLATION SUMMARY
---
LOG FILE = "/tmp/sandbox-sys-apps_-_pcmcia-cs-3.2.5-r1-3524.log"

open_wr:   /proc/sys/kernel/tainted
open_wr:   /proc/sys/kernel/tainted
open_wr:   /proc/sys/kernel/tainted



Tried googling for the answer, checked the forum, but haven't seen this.



Any pointers?
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Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4 - A-FRIGGIN-Men!

Guy,

ROFLMAO!

You haven't been following my posts have you?

I have been having the same issues.. and have been testing every kernel 
since 2.4.23 up to 2.6.3-rc2 including the mm-sources and love-sources.

This just goes to prove that I am not the only one seeing this bullsh*ty 
"ooohooohhhh ... 2.6.X is so great!" crap

I am really disappointed about this.

My posts are named: "bulloney 2.6.X benchmarks"

Though from the looks of it.. it sure looks like you have gotten a bit 
further as far as replies go.

Anyhow.. still messing with these 2.6.X kernels..  atm I am upgrading my 
 xfree to xfree-4.3.99.902-r1 to see if that might boost my glxgears at 
all.

I did though.. make a new 2.6.3-rc2 kernel, with everything possible 
"modularized" .. and well... it still did not make a difference.

Keep me posted on what your findings are!!

Right now, the way I feel, I might just have to drop a line to mr. "mm" 
and mr "love" and tell them they are full of crap. .. and anyone else 
that seems to think that 2.6.X is better/faster.

Oh, also.. to help backup my/our claims.. I have 8 computers running a 
mix-mash of 2.6.X kernels.. everything from portage/gentoo kernels on to 
kernel.org 2.6.X kernels.. and various systems.. all the way from a 
266Mhz AMD-k6/2 on up to a Intel 2600 !

Nothing is faster... it has to be in their heads.

You can also test the speed of your programs by starting them from the 
cmd. line, like with mozilla: "time mozilla"

Let it start up fully and do it's stuff, then kill it off, close it.
Then back in the terminal you launched it from, you will see 3 different 
times those being:

real
user
sys
So for instance.. (already had mozilla running) I did:

time gftp

and got:

real0m2.875s
user0m0.087s
sys 0m0.022s
I would say, Quake 3 timedemo, glxgears, hdparm and time, are all very 
good ways to do a simple benchmark of your system.

Though I guess if you really wanted to get valid proof, you could go 
into: /usr/portage/app-benchmarks/

and emerge one of those programs..

Either way, these 2.6.X zealots are full of crap!

Also to help keep this thread goin, please post your output of the 
following:

time (using like firebird, or mozilla) I have firebird 0.7 and mozilla 1.6b
glxgears
hdparm
You can browse my posts to see what hardware I am using, and what 
settings I currently have.

Keep in touch!

Thank you

Sincerely,

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Re: [gentoo-user] Which kernel version to select?

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, The awesome and feared Norbert Kamenicky commented thusly,

> Grendel,
> 
> be so kind and do not start new topic in the middle of another one, please!!!
> i.e. Do not start new thread by replaying another and changing header.

Thank you for your words of wisdom. No the reason I started a new thread 
was because the old problem related to XFS was over. And I had a 
successfull installation and now I neeed to customise it.
 
> noro
> 
> PS.
> This is the 2.nd time u does it today.

I would have been even happier if a man as experienced as you would 
have been kind enough to help me in my problem but I probably am 
expecting too much. It doesnt matter I will figure it out anyway. 

I managed to get gentoo running, the installation was the worst experience
i had since I installed debian. You know some of the things I have to do
are so common that why anyone cant write a intereactive install script to
automate some aspects of the things is beyond me.

Fortunately the harrowing aspefct of the installation is offsetted 
somewhat by the speed increase and good package management I see. I never 
understand why distros which have the best package management (gentoo, 
debian) have almost non existant installation support :(

Grendel



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Re: [gentoo-user] Which kernel version to select?

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, The awesome and feared [EMAIL PROTECTED] commented...

> 
> well, I went back into the bios and took the drives off "auto" and put
> the settings in manually, and I haven't had a problem yet, but I haven't
> been able to duplicate the damn thing at all up to this point. It's
> locked after a reboot, on the console logon screen; once while loading a
> pdf file in phoenix/mozilla-firebird, once while loading mail
> (sylpheed-claws) with the browser open, once while building a kernel,
> once while emerging openoffice, etc. I repeat the steps and it works
> fine. go figure. I am thinking maybe it's disk access related at this
> point, but that's a guess.
 
All the above point out that the machine fails while under load, several 
possibilites exist the common one is bad ram, please download memtest86 
and try checking your memory. As for the disk you can check it and see if 
there is a problem, but its unlikely todays IDE drives seem reliable 
beasts. 


Grendel
 

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Re: [gentoo-user] my sound went away

2004-02-12 Thread Thomas T. Veldhouse

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Thursday 12 February 2004 03:27 pm, Nickolay Savchenko wrote:

> You've misunderstood. Gnome sound works, but ocassionaly it becomes
> muted. I think the problem is related to permissions. 5 minutes ago my
> father logged out from his gnome session and I logged in. And there is
> an error:
>

Every user that wants to use sound needs to be a member of group "audio".  Is 
your Father a member of group "audio"?

Tom Veldhouse
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux)

iD8DBQFALBzIARgTFXYf0wARArr0AKCB+OUYcjTPFZxxd73yVyYmuLX49QCgm9BN
Sf5JzjaSy5m/LuM+V2geikU=
=SnAx
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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[gentoo-user] Synaptics touchpad, kernel 2.6, XFree 3.3

2004-02-12 Thread Jose GonzÃlez GÃmez

   Hi there,

   Is there anybody out there with a laptop with kernel 2.6, XFree 3.3 
and a working Synaptics touchpad? I've found the following links:
  http://w1.894.telia.com/~u89404340/touchpad/index.html
  http://www.geocities.com/dt_or/gpm/gpm.html
  http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=gentoo-user&m=106915782604397&w=2

   So I'm really lost here. Is the 2.6 kernel supposed to have a device 
driver for the Synaptics touchpad? Or maybe you just have to activate 
the event input interface? Is there anything to do in XFree? Do you need 
to have the 3.4 version of XFree to have support for the touchpad using 
kernel 2.6? Is there any patch missing in the gentoo-dev-sources that 
should be included to have support for this touchpad?

   Thanks in advance, regards
   Jose
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Re: [gentoo-user] New Install

2004-02-12 Thread Jose González Gómez

   Rob,

   Maybe you could take a look at genkernel. Although it's a bit 
inmature, it's supposed to do all the dirty stuff for you, and you only 
have to edit the grub configuration file with the parameters provided by 
genkernel.

   About the kernel being corrupted, are you sure you are pointing grub 
to the right place? Maybe you have copied the wrong file? Don't worry 
about the size of the kernel, it depends on the things you compile into 
it, the more options you include, the bigger the kernel.

   Regards
   Jose
Rob Barnett escribió:

Jose,

I am using a manual compilation. It creates the kernel and System.map.
I have set it up correctly with Grub just like the first compile that I did.
When I boot, it says the file is corrupt. Unfortunately, I am not near my
computer to see the exact message. The kernel is twice the size as the
original kernel. I even tried to compile with the orignal setting to get
a kernel that matched the original, but to no success.
Gracias,
Rob
- Original Message -
From: "Jose González Gómez" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2004 10:57 AM
Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] New Install


   Rob,

   Manual compilation or using genkernel? What about error messages?
Have you double checked everything is fine in /boot?
   Regards
   Jose
Rob Barnett escribió:

 

I have a dell Inspiron 8500 notebook.

I have installed using gentoo-dev-sources using stage-1.  Everything
worked great
I booted into it and discovered that I did not configure my network
card or a file
system that was required by 2.6.  I tryed to do another make as before
but
when I try to boot into it, it would not. Is there something I missed
with the kernel
to compress it or something so that grub will boot using it.  I can
only boot using
the original kernel that I created.
Thanks,
Rob
   



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Re: [gentoo-user] Dell Inspiron 8500

2004-02-12 Thread Jose González Gómez

   Rob,

   I don't know about those specific devices, but you could take a look 
at http://www.linux-on-laptops.com/dell.html or 
http://tuxmobil.org/dell.html, there are a few articles on Inspiron 
8500. They're not for Gentoo, but you may learn a lot from them, and 
then apply to Gentoo. Anyway, you may also search in the kernel options 
for those devices.

   Regards
   Jose
Rob Barnett escribió:

Does 2.6 support the following?
How do I set the kernel to support them?
1) 64MB Nvidia GeForce4 4200 Go video
2) Dell 1300 WLAN (802.11)
3) SigmaTel C-Major Audio
4) Broadcom 440x 10/100 ethernet
Thanks,
Rob
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Re: [gentoo-user] still portage update problem

2004-02-12 Thread Marius Mauch

On 02/13/04  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> Hello,
> 
> After some portage 2.0.50 problems I resolved my open_rw errors by 
> recreating sandbox. After that emerge went fine for a while, until it 
> emerged portage 2.0.50 again. Now I'm back to:
> 
> -- start --
> Traceback (most recent call last):
>   File "/usr/bin/emerge", line 14, in ?
> import portage
>   File "/usr/lib/portage/pym/portage.py", line 6128, in ?
> settings.regenerate() # XXX: Regenerate use after we get a vartree
> -- GLOBAL
>   File "/usr/lib/portage/pym/portage.py", line 1392, in regenerate
> self.configdict["auto"]["USE"]=autouse(db[root]["vartree"],use_ca
> che=use_cache)
>   File "/usr/lib/portage/pym/portage.py", line 1121, in autouse
> myresult=dep_check(mydep,myvartree.dbapi,None,use="no",use_cache=
> use_cache)
>   File "/usr/lib/portage/pym/portage.py", line 3309, in dep_check
> mylist=flatten(dep_listcleanup(dep_zapdeps(mysplit,mysplit2)))
>   File "/usr/lib/portage/pym/portage.py", line 3052, in dep_zapdeps
> myresult=dep_zapdeps(unreduced[x],reduced[x])
>   File "/usr/lib/portage/pym/portage.py", line 3038, in dep_zapdeps
> elif myportapi.match(x):
> AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'match'
> 
> -- end --
> 
> Anyone any idea how to solve this one?

It's under investigation, see bug 40831.

Marius

-- 
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Re: [gentoo-user] Gentoo facing other source distros

2004-02-12 Thread nealbirch

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:45:16 +0100
Jérôme Bouat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Le jeu 12/02/2004 à 23:28, Matthias F. Brandstetter a écrit :
> > I would suggest you visit http://www.distrowatch.org/
> 
> I already saw it but could not see source based comparaison involving
> Gentoo.
> 
> I though I could find former users of Source Mage, Sorcerer, Lunar or
> Onebase here.

Sorcerer was forked by lunar, at which point Kylee (Sorcerer's founder)
tried to pull the distro, with little fanfare and much uproar. A group
of folks took what was available thanks to opensource, and kept sorcerer
alive until Kylee came to get his ball back because he didn't want
people to play with it, as far as I could tell. Since he had open
sourced it, that wasn't possible, so the 2nd fork, SourceMage spun off.
Not sure where Onebase fits in, is that a fork of Lunar? 

I don't know about Sorcery anymore, after Kylee's acting out, I didn't
trust it or him and went with the SourceMage folks for a while. I worked
some with the init files, hopefully they have cleaned them up since
then. =), since they needed help maintaining/rewriting the code base
and the packages, which they called "spells", which are written in bash.
I even wrote a few "spells" I was proud of, the one for nethack was
originally mine. I learnt a lot about bash and linux.

However, the cutesy names started getting to me, and I had been looking
at Gentoo for a while. The dependency checking is very elegant after
dealing with Redhat, Slackware, Suse, Sorcery and then SourceMage. Also
the use flags and compiler options rock! 

Also, read the Gentoo philosophy web-page, and I think the clincher for
me were these 3 articles by D. Robbins:

http://www-106.ibm.com/developerworks/library/l-dist1.html
http://www-106.ibm.com/developerworks/library/l-dist2.html
http://www-106.ibm.com/developerworks/library/l-dist3.html

neal

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Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4

2004-02-12 Thread Hemmann, Volker Armin

On Thursday 12 February 2004 23:07, Guy Van Sanden wrote:
> I'm testing using kernel 2.6.3 (mm-sources rc2).
> On my system, everything is a little slower under 2.6 then it used to be
> in 2.4.
> measurable performance is only slightly worse (like dvdrip getting 2 fps
> less, 20 fps less for glxgears), but desktop responsiveness is noticably
> down under high loads.
>
> I tried with acpi on and off (no differnce) and I have preemtive
> enabled.
>
> So far, 2.6 is disappointing, specially since I heard it would be great
> performance-wise...
>
> Am I missing something?

I hope you have not reniced X!
With 2.6 renicing X to -10 will slow X down.

Glück Auf
Volker
-- 
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Federation like a bug. Accept it. -Michael Wong

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Re: [gentoo-user] OT: Win NT & 2k

2004-02-12 Thread Spider

begin  quote
On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 00:10:16 +0100
Jakub Krajcovic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Hi guys, i know this is totally OT, but if you don't mind, check out
> slashdot concernig %subject
> 

 I hope that you all display enough common sense not
to download it, even if you just want to gloat a bit at the comments.  

The vision of a set of cute lawsuits (SCO style) from MS targetted at
various OSS/FS projects with a wide range of assaults, where the
evidence is simply ISP logs showing an IP downloading said source is
pretty frightening.   

 Imagine the reprecautions for projects like
Samba, Gnome, KDE, and other technologies that can be seen as
"infringing" on some of MS turf. Its an easy, blunt lega weapon to weild
against whole projects, stating that all progress past this point is
only because you copied MS sources, weilding a large batch of patents,
tradesecrets and copyright infringement claims and slamming large and
wide.

  please, dont fall for the temptation.
//Spider

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[gentoo-user] still portage update problem

2004-02-12 Thread henkg

Hello,

After some portage 2.0.50 problems I resolved my open_rw errors by 
recreating sandbox. After that emerge went fine for a while, until it 
emerged portage 2.0.50 again. Now I'm back to:

-- start --
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/usr/bin/emerge", line 14, in ?
import portage
  File "/usr/lib/portage/pym/portage.py", line 6128, in ?
settings.regenerate() # XXX: Regenerate use after we get a vartree -- GLOBAL
  File "/usr/lib/portage/pym/portage.py", line 1392, in regenerate
self.configdict["auto"]["USE"]=autouse(db[root]["vartree"],use_cache=use_cache)
  File "/usr/lib/portage/pym/portage.py", line 1121, in autouse
myresult=dep_check(mydep,myvartree.dbapi,None,use="no",use_cache=use_cache)
  File "/usr/lib/portage/pym/portage.py", line 3309, in dep_check
mylist=flatten(dep_listcleanup(dep_zapdeps(mysplit,mysplit2)))
  File "/usr/lib/portage/pym/portage.py", line 3052, in dep_zapdeps
myresult=dep_zapdeps(unreduced[x],reduced[x])
  File "/usr/lib/portage/pym/portage.py", line 3038, in dep_zapdeps
elif myportapi.match(x):
AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'match'

-- end --

Anyone any idea how to solve this one?

thanks.

Henk,


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[gentoo-user] So does 2.6 do sata ataraid yet

2004-02-12 Thread phil

if anyone has got 2.6 to work with sata ataraid can they let me know, i 
spent many days on the first release trying to get it to work but 
couldnt, my setup is ,
nf7-s v2
2x seagate 80gb disks on raid0 array
TIA

p.marples

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Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4

On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:07:36 +0100
Wazow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> 
> 
> Guy Van Sanden wrote:
> > I'm testing using kernel 2.6.3 (mm-sources rc2).
> > On my system, everything is a little slower under 2.6 then it used
> > to be in 2.4.
> > measurable performance is only slightly worse (like dvdrip getting 2
> > fps less, 20 fps less for glxgears), but desktop responsiveness is
> > noticably down under high loads.
> > 
> > I tried with acpi on and off (no differnce) and I have preemtive
> > enabled.
> > 
> > So far, 2.6 is disappointing, specially since I heard it would be
> > great performance-wise...
> > 
> > Am I missing something?
> 
> No clue. I do not know what are the measurements but GUI
> responsiveness wise I do have an opposite impression...
> 

>From what I have read, the major performance gains are for MP machines. 
Check the recent IBM benchmarks that report a 5-1 gain in web pages
served for a 24 hour test on an 8-processor machine!

http://www-106.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-web26/index.html?ca=dgr-lnxw02KernCompare

-- 
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Gentoo stable kernel 2.6.2-rc1

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[gentoo-user] OT: Win NT & 2k

2004-02-12 Thread Jakub Krajcovic

Hi guys, i know this is totally OT, but if you don't mind, check out
slashdot concernig %subject

GPG public keys available at pgp.mit.edu


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Re: [gentoo-user] udev & devfs - possible conflict?

2004-02-12 Thread Jakub Krajcovic

Well, i couldn't wait for your reply so i learned the hard way... After
unmerging devfsd and merging udev, i could not connect using ppp (ISDN)
- and whoa: *user* panic. and since i know nothing about udev config, i
came back to devfs.


On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:43:58 +0100
Arne Vogel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Jakub Krajcovic wrote:
> 
> >Ok, thanks a lot, that really helped. But now the question is: do i
> >get udev wortking by just emergeing it, unmerging devfs and rebooting
> >the computer?
> >  
> >
> Well, from my experience, I would say no... important device nodes
> will be missing
> (e.g. on my system /dev/ppp, which adsl requires, and /dev/nvidia*,
> even /dev/dsp).
> It would be easy for me to create them with mknod (possibly in an init
> script) with the
> same major/minor as used by devfs, but I don't think that's the 
> preferred solution,
> adding them to the udev configuration would be much better.
> 
> For now, I'll just use devfs since I don't use my PC in a way where
> udev would be really
> helpful (e.g. using a lot of USB mass storage devices simultaneously).
> 
> 
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> 


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Re: [gentoo-user] Unmerging group of packages

2004-02-12 Thread phil



Andrew Gaffney wrote:

EvgGad wrote:

Sven Vermeulen wrote:

On Thu, Feb 12, 2004 at 06:38:51PM +0200, EvgGad wrote:

I've such a question, how can I unmerge some group of packages for 
example kde. Some time ago I merged kde and gnome, but I don't use 
them anymore. How can I unmerge all of the packages they merged? Is 
there any possibilities to do it like "emerge unmerge --some_keys 
gnome"?




Unmerge the kde/gnome packages themselves, then run "emerge -p 
depclean" to
see if this would remove only packages you don't need anymore. If 
you agree,
run "emerge depclean".

You will see that "emerge -p depclean" and "emerge depclean" provide 
you with
a big, nice warning IN CAPITALS, so please don't just ignore what it 
sais :)

Wkr,
Sven Vermeulen
I know about depclean ;) , but sometimes it gives really strange 
results... :(


That was the whole reason I wrote my script in the first place. 
Instead of looking at all packages, it just considers packages that 
are listed when you do 'emerge -ep [gnome|kde]' and ignores all 
packages that are listed when you do 'emerge -ep system'. That way, it 
only considers packages that were installed as a result of the 
original 'emerge [gnome|kde]'.

try this line it has been posted before on forums and here i think

qpkg -I -nc |grep gnome |xargs emerge unmerge -p

of course replace gnome with kde and so on, worked quite well for me 
when i wanted to get rid of gnome :P

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Re: [gentoo-user] how to rebuild /etc/pam.d

Lloyd H. Meinholz wrote:
Some files seem to have been damaged in my /etc/pam.d directory. How can
I rebuild the files that are in here? Remerging pam and baselayout don't
seem to do the trick. Thanks,
Try this:

emerge $(epm -qf /etc/pam.d)

noro

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Re: [gentoo-user] Alsa & 2.6.1

2004-02-12 Thread David Stevenson

Wazow wrote:
Why do you emerge alsasound? I use the 2.6.1 native alsa drivers with 
alsa sound installed from previous kernel.
I emerged alsa when I was on 2.4.22 and it worked fine.
Now I am on 2.6.1 I use the kernel modules and have the problem.
Andrzej

David Stevenson wrote:

I started with 2.4.22, emerged alsa sound and it worked fine.
Then I emerged 2.6.1-mm1 and lost alsa.
I have now been through menuconfig adding alsa-oss modules, and 
redoing make modules modules_install and now it looks like it is 
working, but no music.
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Re: [gentoo-user] Mail confirmation requests

Ted Ozolins wrote:
It would be really nice if those individuals requesting confirmations of 
mail receipts would stop. Why would anyone use that on a list? You are 
not conversing with a single end user,so why do you need confirmation??? 
This practice sucks!!

I disabled confirmation in MUA by default, so it can't poison me.
IMHO bigger problem are individuals which like to start
new thread by reply of another one.
noro

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[gentoo-user] 1394 modules under Gentoo

2004-02-12 Thread Mark Knecht

Hi,
   My home boxes use 1394 built into the kernel so I don't have this
issue. Some new machines at work have 1394 built as modules. 

   What's the right way to load these modules under Gentoo?

   Should I create some arbitrary file like /etc/modules.d/ohci , name
them in there and then run modules-update?

   What's the right way to do this?

Thanks,
Mark


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Re: [gentoo-user] Gentoo facing other source distros

2004-02-12 Thread Jérôme Bouat

Le jeu 12/02/2004 à 23:28, Matthias F. Brandstetter a écrit :
> I would suggest you visit http://www.distrowatch.org/

I already saw it but could not see source based comparaison involving
Gentoo.

I though I could find former users of Source Mage, Sorcerer, Lunar or
Onebase here.


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Re: [gentoo-user] udev & devfs - possible conflict?

2004-02-12 Thread Arne Vogel

Jakub Krajcovic wrote:

Ok, thanks a lot, that really helped. But now the question is: do i get
udev wortking by just emergeing it, unmerging devfs and rebooting the
computer?
 

Well, from my experience, I would say no... important device nodes will 
be missing
(e.g. on my system /dev/ppp, which adsl requires, and /dev/nvidia*, even 
/dev/dsp).
It would be easy for me to create them with mknod (possibly in an init 
script) with the
same major/minor as used by devfs, but I don't think that's the 
preferred solution,
adding them to the udev configuration would be much better.

For now, I'll just use devfs since I don't use my PC in a way where udev 
would be really
helpful (e.g. using a lot of USB mass storage devices simultaneously).

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Re: [gentoo-user] perfomance 2.6.3 <= 2.4

On Thu, 2004-02-12 at 16:07, Guy Van Sanden wrote:
> I'm testing using kernel 2.6.3 (mm-sources rc2).
> On my system, everything is a little slower under 2.6 then it used to be
> in 2.4.
> measurable performance is only slightly worse (like dvdrip getting 2 fps
> less, 20 fps less for glxgears), but desktop responsiveness is noticably
> down under high loads.
> 
> I tried with acpi on and off (no differnce) and I have preemtive
> enabled.
> 
> So far, 2.6 is disappointing, specially since I heard it would be great
> performance-wise...
> 
> Am I missing something?

Well, i started downloading the gentoo-dev-sources 2.6.3_rc2 kernel to
play with a bit just a couple minutes ago... but i've been using 2.6.2
for a few weeks now with few issues. Only thing i've really had a
problem with is that my mouse (Logitech MX700) seems to act up
sometimes...which i cant duplicate...seems to be quite random. I've
noticed a decent GUI responsiveness increase (Entrance login,
Enlightenment WM, gtk2 themes) from 2.4, and i also use pre-emptive
kernels (like i saw someone else say) haven't done any benchmarks, but
just in daily use, 2.6 feels faster to me

-- 
Brendan Sullivan
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

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[gentoo-user] Re: Hey!

2004-02-12 Thread Spider

begin  quote
On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 02:09:33 +0600 (LKT)
Grendel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> 
> Hey SpiderI am still waiting for your reply about my link showing
> the  benchmarks showing that XFS and reiserfs performed better than
> ext2:-)

Why do you wait?  So far i didn't see anything in your posts to that
thread that were even worth a reply past the one I gave.

> 
> Why did you shuttup all of a sudden when I showed that link eh? I said
>  ext2/ext3 are badly designed because they dont scale well to large
> data, unlike btree based systems like reiserfs :)
>
> 
> Just dont think that you know the best and dont criticise others
> openly, learn a lesson for once in your miserable life and read about
> a bit before criticising other peoples comments and people themselves.

*Sigh*
As I tried previously, I attacked your statement, not the person behind
it, and your decision to portrude this to private mail in an effort to
spark responses portrays you fairly negatively.

But, instead of using google to dig up the first and shiniest link,
using the popularity gained on /. and blogging, I'd suggest you actually
take the time to lean back and read lkml and other lists where the
actual responsetimes are shown.

When it comes to regards of benchmark quality, I wouldn't call something
a "benchmark" when the sk. "benchmark" doesn't document what kernel it
is that is being "benchmarked".  ( Note for the readers, according to
referenced article (by grendel) comments, it was kernel 2.4.3-xfs that
was tested, which would put it about 3 years ago. )

Now, if you can show me a throughput vs. latency benchmark during a
paralell ( ncpu * 2 ) C++ compile on a memory-strained system (48 Mb RAM
or so), where you'd actually measure filesystem performance and not
BufferCache performance (that, means "RAM" performance).  Of course, any
such tests would have to be executed on an atime mounted system, as well
as spark a difference between throughput, read, write and sync access.

Regards,
   Spider

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Re: [gentoo-user] dual booting problems

2004-02-12 Thread Mike Adolf


- Original Message - 
From: "Barry Marler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2004 12:08 PM
Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] dual booting problems


> On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:35:46 -0800
> "Mike Adolf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Greetings,
> >
> > This is my first exposure to gentoo.  The 2CD GRP install went
> > smoothly until I got to the lilo configuration.  The lilo.conf file
> > example wanted to install lilo in the MBR of hda (my window disk, I
> > have a second disk with gentoo).  I don't want this, so I quit the
> > install.  I would like to use NTLDR, windows boot manager.  It is very
> > simple, you just run bootpart to add a second boot to boot.ini.  I
> > know this because I used it when I tried Debian. Does any know how to
> > use NTLDR with Gentoo?
>
> But the NT boot loader was not booting linux; it was just handing
> off to your linux boot loader.  You'll still have to install LILO (or
> GRUB, etc.). Installl LILO on your other hd, and use bootpart.
>
> -- 
> Barry Marler
> Information Analyst II
> Center for Applied Genetic Technologies
> University of Georgia
> Athens, GA
> USA
>
I booted off the live CD, mounted the new gentoo partitions, and chroot to
new install. My lilo.conf is:
###
boot=/dev/hdb
map=/boot/map
install=/boot/boot.b
prompt
timeout=50
lba32
default=linux
image=/boot/kernel-2.4.20-gentoo-r6
  label=gk_linux
  root=/dev/hdb3
  initrd=/boot/initrd-2.4.20-gentoo-r6
  append="root=/dev/hdb3 init=/linuxrc"


When I ran it (/sbin/lilo), I got:


Warning /dev/hdb/ is not the first drive
Warning Unable to determine video adapter in use in present system
Addes gk_linux
Fatal: No images have been defined or default image doesen't exist.


I don't understand the Fatal since "kernel-2.4.20-gentoo-r6" IS in /boot
??
mike

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Re: [gentoo-user] Which kernel version to select?

Grendel,

be so kind and do not start new topic in the middle of another one, please!!!
i.e. Do not start new thread by replaying another and changing header.
noro

PS.
This is the 2.nd time u does it today.
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Re: [gentoo-user] install problem