[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
Daniel Iliev <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Exactly. So, MHO is that it would be better if all the output from > console apps was just plain text with the option for people who want > colors to enable and customize colors, wouldn't it? It might have been. But now that the stuff is all in IMO very nice and useful colors, I expect quite a lot of bugs and complaints to show up, if "all of a sudden" the output turns to "unreadable" no-color output. Alexander Skwar -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On 2007-04-04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Why do --nocolor and --color=n not work (sys-apps/portage-2.1.2.3)? > > Why does the damned thing default to thinking I want blaring bizarre > colors scattered all over my screen? Yea, nothing is quite as readible as yellow or bright green on a white background. I hate color output. I'm completely baffled that anybody thinks it should be the default. > I CAN'T EVEN DISABLE IT BY SETTING TERM TO vt100. > > And if ALL THESE CAPS distress you and you think I am shouting, well > goodness gracious, NOW YOU KNOW HOW I FEEL ABOUT COLORIZATION RUN AMUCK. Worse than emerge is that ls and other more commonly used utilities all default to utterly-illegible mode on Gentoo. -- Grant Edwards grante Yow! Eisenhower!! Your at mimeograph machine upsets visi.commy stomach!! -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On 2007-04-04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Wed, Apr 04, 2007 at 02:26:47PM +, Grant Edwards wrote: >> On 2007-04-04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> > Why do --nocolor and --color=n not work (sys-apps/portage-2.1.2.3)? >> > >> > Why does the damned thing default to thinking I want blaring bizarre >> > colors scattered all over my screen? >> >> Yea, nothing is quite as readible as yellow or bright green on >> a white background. I hate color output. I'm completely >> baffled that anybody thinks it should be the default. > >All you have to do is double your font size and they become > quite legible. > >> > I CAN'T EVEN DISABLE IT BY SETTING TERM TO vt100. >> > >> > And if ALL THESE CAPS distress you and you think I am shouting, well >> > goodness gracious, NOW YOU KNOW HOW I FEEL ABOUT COLORIZATION RUN AMUCK. >> >> Worse than emerge is that ls and other more commonly used >> utilities all default to utterly-illegible mode on Gentoo. > > At least ls's color comes from that damned alias. You can at least > use "/bin/ls" or prefix each command with "TERM=vt100" to get rid of > them temporarily, or "unalias -a" to get rid of them permanently per > login, or edit /etc/profile to get rid of them permanently forever. Except "forever" only lasts until the next emerge replaces /etc/profile. > At least the color options actually work. You've got a point there. :) -- Grant Edwards grante Yow! Here I am at the flea at market but nobody is buying visi.commy urine sample bottles... -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On 2007-04-04, Neil Walker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >> At least ls's color comes from that damned alias. You can at least >> use "/bin/ls" or prefix each command with "TERM=vt100" to get rid of >> them temporarily, or "unalias -a" to get rid of them permanently per >> login, or edit /etc/profile to get rid of them permanently forever. >> At least the color options actually work. > > Or, of course, you can simply edit /etc/DIR_COLORS and/or /etc/bashrc to > achieve any result you want. My point is that why should you have to edit something before you can get legible output from something as basic as "ls". Why not default to a _useful_ condition? -- Grant Edwards grante Yow! Yow! Those people at look exactly like Donnie visi.comand Marie Osmond!! -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
Hemmann, Volker Armin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > [ a lot of good replies ] > I am really disgusted. Very well said! Alexander Skwar -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
Grant Edwards <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Why not default to a _useful_ condition? But, it does! The colors are very useful! Alexander Skwar -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Here's my current favorite. emerge -f digikam. It downloads a > corrupted file No, it doesn't. >>> Emerging (6 of 6) media-gfx/digikam-0.9.1 to / Adjusting permissions recursively: '/Gentoo/Portage/distfiles/' >>> Downloading 'http://gentoo.supp.name/distfiles/digikam-0.9.1.tar.bz2' --09:10:01-- http://gentoo.supp.name/distfiles/digikam-0.9.1.tar.bz2 => `/Gentoo/Portage/distfiles/digikam-0.9.1.tar.bz2' Resolving gentoo.supp.name... 82.208.58.65 Connecting to gentoo.supp.name|82.208.58.65|:80... connected. HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 200 OK Length: 6'781'756 (6.5M) [application/x-tar] 100%[===>] 6'781'756330.41K/sETA 00:00 09:10:16 (429.62 KB/s) - `/Gentoo/Portage/distfiles/digikam-0.9.1.tar.bz2' saved [6781756/6781756] * digikam-0.9.1.tar.bz2 RMD160 ;-) ... [ ok ] * digikam-0.9.1.tar.bz2 SHA1 ;-) ... [ ok ] * digikam-0.9.1.tar.bz2 SHA256 ;-) ... [ ok ] * digikam-0.9.1.tar.bz2 size ;-) ... [ ok ] * checking ebuild checksums ;-) ... [ ok ] * checking auxfile checksums ;-) ... [ ok ] * checking miscfile checksums ;-) ... [ ok ] * checking digikam-0.9.1.tar.bz2 ;-) ... [ ok ] > and tries several times, with tons of colored output > which I have to copy and paste to read. If you don't like colors, you should disable them. Alexander Skwar -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On 2007-04-05, Alexander Skwar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Grant Edwards <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> Why not default to a _useful_ condition? > > But, it does! The colors are very useful! Only on certain terminals. They're quite unreadable on a white background (which has always been the default for xterm and it's descendants, right?). -- Grant Edwards grante Yow! Could I have a drug at overdose? visi.com -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On 2007-04-05, Neil Bothwick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 14:24:02 + (UTC), Grant Edwards wrote: > >> > But, it does! The colors are very useful! >> >> Only on certain terminals. They're quite unreadable on a white >> background (which has always been the default for xterm and >> it's descendants, right?). > > Those particular colours are less useful, because they are designed for a > black background, But the default background on terminals under X has always been white (at least as long as I remember). Are there really a lot of Gentoo users who just run on the console and don't use X? > but it is easy enough to change to a more suitable selection. My point was why default to something that isn't useful for the standard terminal emulators like xterm, aterm, rxvt, etc. Are there common terminal emulators that default to a black background? -- Grant Edwards grante Yow! ... I want to perform at cranial activities with visi.comTuesday Weld!! -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On 2007-04-05, Grant Edwards <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 2007-04-05, Alexander Skwar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Grant Edwards <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >>> Why not default to a _useful_ condition? >> >> But, it does! The colors are very useful! > > Only on certain terminals. They're quite unreadable on a white > background (which has always been the default for xterm and > it's descendants, right?). I did find one terminal emulator on my system that defaults to a black background (/usr/bin/Terminal, which belongs to the xfce-extras package). On a black background, it's not as bad, but some of the colors like blue on black are still hard to read. I guess I'm in the minority, though... -- Grant Edwards grante Yow! I just had my entire at INTESTINAL TRACT coated visi.comwith TEFLON! -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
"Boyd Stephen Smith Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Thursday 05 April 2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote about 'Re: > [gentoo-user] Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized > output?!?': > > 31334 > > I think you meant 31337. I thought he was estimating how many posters took his bait. -- »Q« -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On 2007-04-05, Neil Bothwick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 14:45:15 + (UTC), Grant Edwards wrote: > >> > Those particular colours are less useful, because they are designed >> > for a black background, >> >> But the default background on terminals under X has always been >> white (at least as long as I remember). Are there really a lot >> of Gentoo users who just run on the console and don't use X? > > Until recently, it was all Gentoo users, since the installation was done > fro a virtual console. Nah. I almost always do 90% of the install from an aterm (with a white bacground). -- Grant Edwards grante Yow! Life is a POPULARITY at CONTEST! I'm REFRESHINGLY visi.comCANDID!! -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On 2007-04-05, Tony Stohne <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Grant Edwards said the following on 2007-04-05 16:45: >| ... >| My point was why default to something that isn't useful for the >| standard terminal emulators like xterm, aterm, rxvt, etc. Are >| there common terminal emulators that default to a black >| background? >| > You always have the options of changing the colors in xterm/rxvt/aterm > etc to your preferred colors, background color included. That will change the colors that are used by 'ls' without breaking other programs that use color? > The first one is changing the /usr/share/X11/rgb.txt file. The > problem with changing it is that it usually gets overwritten > with every xorg-x11 update. > > I prefer changing the .Xdefaults file in my user & root > directories. That way any updates don't screw up my > preferences. > > To see my current .Xdefaults, please look at the attached file > - I have dropped Eterm & aterm. Rxvt is very resource > efficient :) I use xterm as a fallback. I used rxvt for many years until cut/paste stopped working for me a couple years back. > This should provide you with enough info on setting your preferred > colors. Getting a black (or any other color) background is not that > difficult, But I don't _want_ a black background. I want a white background and a black foreground. -- Grant Edwards grante Yow! YOW!!! I am having at fun!!! visi.com -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On Thursday 05 April 2007, Grant Edwards wrote: > I used rxvt for many years until cut/paste stopped working for > me a couple years back. Me too!! I was in love with rxvt... So I switched to (urxvt) x11-terms/rxvt-unicode, it is basically the same but fully functional. Ciao Francesco -- Linux Version 2.6.20-gentoo-r4, Compiled #1 PREEMPT Sun Mar 25 09:20:13 CEST 2007 One 2.2GHz AMD Athlon 64 Processor, 2GB RAM, 4408.89 Bogomips Total aemaeth -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On 2007-04-05, Neil Bothwick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello Grant Edwards, > >> > Until recently, it was all Gentoo users, since the installation was >> > done from a virtual console. >> >> Nah. I almost always do 90% of the install from an aterm (with >> a white bacground). > > Only if you're installing via SSH, Which is how I do all my installs. > A VC is always available, an xterm is usually available, so it makes > sense to base defaults on a VC. I would pick a default that works for both, but I guess I'm weird. -- Grant Edwards grante Yow! Is it 1974? What's at for SUPPER? Can I spend my visi.comCOLLEGE FUND in one wild afternoon?? -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
[This is a followup to the whole thread, not any particular posting] Something interesting just happened to me that I would like to share. I realized that I have a program called usetool that I must have installed some time. What is that i thought, so my first try to find out was to try 'man usetool'. ...No manpage. Ok, next try, 'usetool -h' ...Good it has documentation, unfortunately the coloring made it unreadable, but with a lot of effort and eye-strain I could at least see that it has the -nc option. Ok, next try, 'usetool -nc -h' ...Dissapointment, still unreadable! I just wanted to let you know since it has relevance in this quarrel. I realize that the correct way to report this is to the bugzilla, and I will do that. -- Christer -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On 2007-04-05, Neil Bothwick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 19:52:28 + (UTC), Grant Edwards wrote: > >> > Only if you're installing via SSH, >> >> Which is how I do all my installs. > > Even the first? Yup. >> > A VC is always available, an xterm is usually available, so it makes >> > sense to base defaults on a VC. >> >> I would pick a default that works for both, but I guess I'm >> weird. > > There aren't many colours that display clearly on both black and white > backgrounds :( Thay's why using colors by default can be a problem. -- Grant Edwards grante Yow! I'm dressing up in at an ill-fitting IVY-LEAGUE visi.comSUIT!! Too late... -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On 2007-04-07, Dan Farrell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Only on certain terminals. They're quite unreadable on a white >> background (which has always been the default for xterm and >> it's descendants, right?). > > Why this is the case, I don't think I'll ever understand. > White terminal backgrounds, aside from the invisible color > problem, also are hella ugly. Many people disagree. I think black backgrounds are "hella ugly" and hard to read for long periods of time. -- Grant Edwards grante Yow! ... I want FORTY-TWO at TRYNEL FLOATATION SYSTEMS visi.cominstalled withinSIX AND A HALF HOURS!!! -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
· Graham Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > Or why when run in a console the output stays on the screen when you > exit less, thus allowing you to refer to it when typing the next > command, but in an X terminal it 'collapses' to just the command > prompt on exit. That's because of certain features the terminal advertises in its "termcap". I don't know which, but I do know, that this is the reason. Alexander Skwar -- Leela: Oh no, there's no exhaust pipe. Project Satan: That's right. Thanks to Ed Begley Jr.'s electric motor, the most evil propulsion system ever conceived! -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
RE: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
I find the coloured output useful, as for me it adds readability. If you don't like the defaults edit them to no colour or something "more sane" for you. I agree with Alexander I predict a riot if the colour were removed by default. Cheers Wayn0 -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On Wed, Apr 04, 2007 at 02:26:47PM +, Grant Edwards wrote: > On 2007-04-04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Why do --nocolor and --color=n not work (sys-apps/portage-2.1.2.3)? > > > > Why does the damned thing default to thinking I want blaring bizarre > > colors scattered all over my screen? > > Yea, nothing is quite as readible as yellow or bright green on > a white background. I hate color output. I'm completely > baffled that anybody thinks it should be the default. All you have to do is double your font size and they become quite legible. > > I CAN'T EVEN DISABLE IT BY SETTING TERM TO vt100. > > > > And if ALL THESE CAPS distress you and you think I am shouting, well > > goodness gracious, NOW YOU KNOW HOW I FEEL ABOUT COLORIZATION RUN AMUCK. > > Worse than emerge is that ls and other more commonly used > utilities all default to utterly-illegible mode on Gentoo. At least ls's color comes from that damned alias. You can at least use "/bin/ls" or prefix each command with "TERM=vt100" to get rid of them temporarily, or "unalias -a" to get rid of them permanently per login, or edit /etc/profile to get rid of them permanently forever. At least the color options actually work. -- ... _._. ._ ._. . _._. ._. ___ .__ ._. . .__. ._ .. ._. Felix Finch: scarecrow repairman & rocket surgeon / [EMAIL PROTECTED] GPG = E987 4493 C860 246C 3B1E 6477 7838 76E9 182E 8151 ITAR license #4933 I've found a solution to Fermat's Last Theorem but I see I've run out of room o -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > At least ls's color comes from that damned alias. You can at least > use "/bin/ls" or prefix each command with "TERM=vt100" to get rid of > them temporarily, or "unalias -a" to get rid of them permanently per > login, or edit /etc/profile to get rid of them permanently forever. > At least the color options actually work. > Or, of course, you can simply edit /etc/DIR_COLORS and/or /etc/bashrc to achieve any result you want. Be lucky, Neil -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On Wed, Apr 04, 2007 at 05:56:07PM +, Grant Edwards wrote: > On 2007-04-04, Neil Walker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > >> At least ls's color comes from that damned alias. You can at least > >> use "/bin/ls" or prefix each command with "TERM=vt100" to get rid of > >> them temporarily, or "unalias -a" to get rid of them permanently per > >> login, or edit /etc/profile to get rid of them permanently forever. > >> At least the color options actually work. > > > > Or, of course, you can simply edit /etc/DIR_COLORS and/or /etc/bashrc to > > achieve any result you want. > > My point is that why should you have to edit something before > you can get legible output from something as basic as "ls". > Why not default to a _useful_ condition? Because the developers in charge at gentoo have a fresh and exciting slant on things and th erest of us should bow our heads in thanks for their wisdom? Because old farts who don't like color are dying out and will soon leave the smart young people alone? In other words, beats me. -- ... _._. ._ ._. . _._. ._. ___ .__ ._. . .__. ._ .. ._. Felix Finch: scarecrow repairman & rocket surgeon / [EMAIL PROTECTED] GPG = E987 4493 C860 246C 3B1E 6477 7838 76E9 182E 8151 ITAR license #4933 I've found a solution to Fermat's Last Theorem but I see I've run out of room o -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On Wed, 4 Apr 2007 17:55:20 + (UTC), Grant Edwards wrote: > Except "forever" only lasts until the next emerge replaces > /etc/profile. Emerge never replaces files in /etc unless you use dangerous, non-standard settings. -- Neil Bothwick Windows isn't a virus -- viruses do something! signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
Grant Edwards wrote: > My point is that why should you have to edit something before > you can get legible output from something as basic as "ls". > Why not default to a _useful_ condition? > It's VERY legible on all of the systems I administer - but, then, I use the text-based console, not some horrible imitation in X. The colours make text far more legible in such an environment, accentuating the important bits very well. I see that as a "useful condition". Anyone who uses an X-based "console" should expect to have to tweak things to suit their own requirements. Be lucky, Neil -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto: On Wed, Apr 04, 2007 at 02:26:47PM +, Grant Edwards wrote: On 2007-04-04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Why do --nocolor and --color=n not work (sys-apps/portage-2.1.2.3)? Why does the damned thing default to thinking I want blaring bizarre colors scattered all over my screen? Yea, nothing is quite as readible as yellow or bright green on a white background. I hate color output. I'm completely baffled that anybody thinks it should be the default. *slap on the forehead* Oh my god, now I understand it all. You are using a WHITE xterm background. The Gentoo colours make complete sense on a BLACK background. I do agree that they are insane on a white or otherwise light background. I was thinking you were quite mad :) ,however now I agree with your point (even if I don't agree with your ranting attitude: as repeated a TON of times, your options are 1)file bugs 2)become a gentoo dev 3)stop using Gentoo). m. -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On Wed, Apr 04, 2007 at 07:19:39PM +, Grant Edwards wrote: > On 2007-04-04, Neil Walker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Grant Edwards wrote: > >> My point is that why should you have to edit something before > >> you can get legible output from something as basic as "ls". > >> Why not default to a _useful_ condition? > >> > > > > It's VERY legible on all of the systems I administer - but, then, I use > > the text-based console, not some horrible imitation in X. The colours > > make text far more legible in such an environment, accentuating the > > important bits very well. I see that as a "useful condition". Anyone who > > uses an X-based "console" should expect to have to tweak things to suit > > their own requirements. > > I don't use an X-based console. I do however use a lot of > X-based terminal windows. Color output would be perfectly legible, or at least readable, if I doubled my X-terminal font size. But I want more lines and more characters on each line, not colors. I want the choice. Maybe I should accept crappy color for emerges and select a bigger font size for a special emerge-only xterm. But that's a Microserf solution. -- ... _._. ._ ._. . _._. ._. ___ .__ ._. . .__. ._ .. ._. Felix Finch: scarecrow repairman & rocket surgeon / [EMAIL PROTECTED] GPG = E987 4493 C860 246C 3B1E 6477 7838 76E9 182E 8151 ITAR license #4933 I've found a solution to Fermat's Last Theorem but I see I've run out of room o -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 14:24:02 + (UTC), Grant Edwards wrote: > > But, it does! The colors are very useful! > > Only on certain terminals. They're quite unreadable on a white > background (which has always been the default for xterm and > it's descendants, right?). Those particular colours are less useful, because they are designed for a black background, but it is easy enough to change to a more suitable selection. -- Neil Bothwick Das Internet is nicht fuer gefingerclicken und giffengrabben. Ist easy droppenpacket der routers und overloaden der backbone mit der spammen und der me-tooen. Ist nicht fuer gewerken bei das dumpkopfen. Das mausklicken sichtseeren keepen das bandwit-spewin hans in das pockets muss; relaxen und watchen das cursorblinken. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On Thu, Apr 05, 2007 at 02:45:15PM +, Grant Edwards wrote: > My point was why default to something that isn't useful for the > standard terminal emulators like xterm, aterm, rxvt, etc. Are > there common terminal emulators that default to a black > background? aterm on default settings has a black background for me, and I think Konsole does also. Ryan Curtin [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 14:45:15 + (UTC), Grant Edwards wrote: > > Those particular colours are less useful, because they are designed > > for a black background, > > But the default background on terminals under X has always been > white (at least as long as I remember). Are there really a lot > of Gentoo users who just run on the console and don't use X? Until recently, it was all Gentoo users, since the installation was done fro a virtual console. > > but it is easy enough to change to a more suitable selection. > > My point was why default to something that isn't useful for the > standard terminal emulators like xterm, aterm, rxvt, etc. Are > there common terminal emulators that default to a black > background? Not that I know of, but that's irrelevant. The defaults fit what *everyone* has, and can be so easily changed to suit the optional alternative. The important word here is "default", that's all it is, you can use whatever colours you want, or none at all. -- Neil Bothwick Failure is not an option...it is integrated with every Microsoft product. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Grant Edwards said the following on 2007-04-05 16:45: | ... | My point was why default to something that isn't useful for the | standard terminal emulators like xterm, aterm, rxvt, etc. Are | there common terminal emulators that default to a black | background? | You always have the options of changing the colors in xterm/rxvt/aterm etc to your preferred colors, background color included. The first one is changing the /usr/share/X11/rgb.txt file. The problem with changing it is that it usually gets overwritten with every xorg-x11 update. I prefer changing the .Xdefaults file in my user & root directories. That way any updates don't screw up my preferences. To see my current .Xdefaults, please look at the attached file - I have dropped Eterm & aterm. Rxvt is very resource efficient :) I use xterm as a fallback. ~ For further info & examples see: http://fluxbox-wiki.org/index.php/Howto_setup_Xdefaults http://dev.gentoo.org/~taviso/xdefaults.html http://gentoo-wiki.com/TIP_Linux_Colors_in_Aterm/rxvt http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic.php?t=68555 http://gentoo-wiki.com/Talk:TIP_Linux_Colors_in_Aterm/rxvt http://cvs.schmorp.de/rxvt-unicode/doc/rxvt.7.html#i_don_t_like_the_screen_colors__how_do_i_change_them http://www.fleiner.com/vim/xdefaults.linux http://invisible-island.net/xterm/xterm.faq.html#my_xdefaults For a nice xterm color palette, see http://mkaz.com/ref/xterm_colors.html ...and don't forget the man pages :) This should provide you with enough info on setting your preferred colors. Getting a black (or any other color) background is not that difficult, once you know how, and it's certainly helpful. You can set transparency, background image and more according to your taste and depending on what your preferred terminal supports. (For the moment I don't use Gentoo at all, due to a diskcrash :( Right now i'm stuck with Windoze xp (yuck). The only partitions working are the boot and the NTFS... disks are cheap but i'm between jobs right now :/) /Regards Tony -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (MingW32) iD8DBQFGFSBbJDzv6DN+QUkRAl2hAKCbpn1SGNFTPxkKYZgqeG3U6Q1XLwCeNicq pH2Pywp2Rxl09mptps6iNgY= =qmAE -END PGP SIGNATURE- Xft.dpi: 120 Xft.hinting: 1 Xft.hintstyle: hintfull Xft.antialias: 1 Xft.rgba: rgb Xcursor.theme:gentoo-silver xterm*loginShell: True xterm*vt100.translations: #override Home: scroll-back(100,page) End: scroll-forw(100,page) Prior: scroll-back(1,page) Next: scroll-forw(1,page) XTerm*highlightSelection: true XTerm*VT100.colorBDMode: on XTerm*VT100.colorBD: blue XTerm*VT100.colorULMode: on XTerm*VT100.colorUL: magenta XTerm*VT100.titeInhibit: true XTerm*VT100.colorMode:on XTerm*VT100.dynamicColors:on XTerm*VT100.underLine:off XTerm*internalBorder: 10 XTerm*externalBorder: 10 XTerm*eightBitInput: True XTerm*eightBitOutput: True XTerm*geometry: 132x30 XTerm*background: #00 XTerm*foreground: #7f7f7f XTerm*color0: #00 XTerm*color1: #9e1828 XTerm*color2: #aece92 XTerm*color3: #968a38 XTerm*color4: #414171 XTerm*color5: #963c59 XTerm*color6: #418179 XTerm*color7: #bebebe XTerm*color8: #66 XTerm*color9: #cf6171 XTerm*color10: #c5f779 XTerm*color11: #fff796 XTerm*color12: #4186be XTerm*color13: #cf9ebe XTerm*color14: #71bebe XTerm*color15: #ff urxvt.depth: 32 urxvt.urlLauncher: firefox urxvt*termName: rxvt-unicode urxvt*keysym.Home: \\e[1~ urxvt*keysym.End:\\e[4~ urxvt*colorBD: #FF urxvt*colorIT: #FF urxvt*font: xft:DejaVu Sans Mono:size=7:antialias=true urxvt*boldFont: xft:DejaVu Sans Mono:bold:size=7:antialias=true urxvt*italicFont:xft:DejaVu Sans Mono:italic:size=7:antialias=true:autohint=true urxvt*boldItalicFont:xft:DejaVu Sans Mono:bold:italic:size=7:antialias=true:autohint=true urxvt*secondaryScroll: true urxvt.cursorUnderline: 1 !urxvt.cursorBlink: 1 urxvt*inheritPixmap: True urxvt*scrollBar: False urxvt*scrollBar_right: False !urxvt*transpscroll: True urxvt*transparent: True urxvt*savelines: 32000 urxvt*visualBell:True urxvt*internalBorder:10 urxvt*externalBorder:10 urxvt*loginShell:True urxvt*fading:52 urxvt*fadeColor: BlueViolet urxvt*shading: 64 urxvt*geometry: 132x30 urxvt*tinting: True urxvt*tintColor: Sienna3 urxvt*borderLess:True urxvt*utmpInhibit: True urxvt*scrollTtyOutput: False urxvt*scrollWithBuffer: True urxvt*scrollTtyKeypress: True urxvt*cursorColor: #8a8a8a urxvt*background:#00 urxvt*foreground:#FF ! #7f7f7f urxvt*color0:#00 urxvt*color1:#9e1828 urxvt*color2:#aece92 urxvt*color3:#968a38 ur
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
Hello Grant Edwards, > > Until recently, it was all Gentoo users, since the installation was > > done from a virtual console. > > Nah. I almost always do 90% of the install from an aterm (with > a white bacground). Only if you're installing via SSH, otherwise 90% of the install was done before you could run an xterm. A VC is always available, an xterm is usually available, so it makes sense to base defaults on a VC. -- Neil Bothwick Another casualty of applied metaphysics. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Grant Edwards said the following on 2007-04-05 19:51: |> Grant Edwards said the following on 2007-04-05 16:45: |> | ... | That will change the colors that are used by 'ls' without | breaking other programs that use color? | The colors of any other program should be unaffected unless they are dependending on the console colors AFAIK. And yes, ls colors will change, as long as You use the xterminal which colors you have changed, eg xterm, rxvt and so on . I think there is a third alternative to rgb.txt and ~/.Xdefaults. bash DIRCOLORS is an option and it will affect ls. | I used rxvt for many years until cut/paste stopped working for | me a couple years back. | Hmmm... I never had that problem so I can't help you with that one :/ Maybe someone else has more knowledge/experience than me regarding this issue. |> This should provide you with enough info on setting your preferred |> colors. Getting a black (or any other color) background is not that |> difficult, | | But I don't _want_ a black background. I want a white | background and a black foreground. | As my previous posting stated, you can set whatever color (your preferred xterminal app supports) for background and foreground , ie you can choose white foreground on black background or any other combination you prefer: For instance XTerm*background: #ff XTerm*foreground: #00 in your ¨/.Xdefaults should set black on white as default values for any xterm you open (although portage could override it (?) since it's a python app(?) if my memory doesn't fail me. Right now i can't verify if it works or not because of my / disk crapping out on me.) I'm stuck Windoze again :( I'm surprised that turning off colors for portage/emerge doesn't work. It sounds like a very odd behaviour - it has always worked for me whenever I tried it (although I prefer using colors - a matter of personal taste - or lack thereof :) //Cheers Tony -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (MingW32) iD8DBQFGFT9GJDzv6DN+QUkRAubdAJ9/U6IlF1q4VfMqBwAnKuMcyPvqsgCfY8Ub DbF5xrreouE0BhP5JphKq1k= =KLL9 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Tony Stohne said the following on 2007-04-05 20:26: ... | I think there is a third alternative to rgb.txt and ~/.Xdefaults. | bash DIRCOLORS is an option and it will affect ls. | For clarification - dircolors ar not dependent of bash. It is supported in other shells as well, eg csh or bourne. The command dircolors -p should print out the default, ie compiled-in, colors and provides quite a bit of info on the possibilities. The output is actually a valid configuration. //T -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (MingW32) iD8DBQFGFUGwJDzv6DN+QUkRAqXAAKDAeD4SfdPyv3I62f2FzCefgkSm/QCg3sTU B5CxBLC9+atQRmw2wHntqY8= =BIbg -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Francesco Talamona said the following on 2007-04-05 20:33: | | Me too!! | I was in love with rxvt... So I switched to (urxvt) | x11-terms/rxvt-unicode, it is basically the same but fully functional. | Yes, urxvt is my choice too :) Amen to that! //Ciao ragazzo :) -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (MingW32) iD8DBQFGFURdJDzv6DN+QUkRAs3sAKDLYhofQg0AUA46RvRKP3DuBGGwJQCdGait HPqHso5KYufle78F30Myy5s= =beh4 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
Neil Bothwick ha scritto: Hello Grant Edwards, Until recently, it was all Gentoo users, since the installation was done from a virtual console. Nah. I almost always do 90% of the install from an aterm (with a white bacground). Only if you're installing via SSH, otherwise 90% of the install was done before you could run an xterm. Technically not (I installed my desktop box from a Knoppix cd instead of the Gentoo cd, chrooting etc.). However I like the black background and I always set that on my xterms, so I never noticed the problem. m. -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 19:52:28 + (UTC), Grant Edwards wrote: > > Only if you're installing via SSH, > > Which is how I do all my installs. Even the first? > > A VC is always available, an xterm is usually available, so it makes > > sense to base defaults on a VC. > > I would pick a default that works for both, but I guess I'm > weird. There aren't many colours that display clearly on both black and white backgrounds :( -- Neil Bothwick Clap on Clap off NO CARRIEþ®©¼ signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 21:41:12 + (UTC), Grant Edwards wrote: > Thay's why using colors by default can be a problem. Except you edit make.conf before you emerge anything and guess where you turn off the colours :) -- Neil Bothwick Top Oxymorons Number 20: Synthetic natural gas signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On Thursday 05 April 2007 19:36, Tony Stohne wrote: > Tony Stohne said the following on 2007-04-05 20:26: > ... > > | I think there is a third alternative to rgb.txt and ~/.Xdefaults. > | bash DIRCOLORS is an option and it will affect ls. > > For clarification - dircolors ar not dependent of bash. > It is supported in other shells as well, eg csh or bourne. > > The command > > dircolors -p > > should print out the default, ie compiled-in, colors and provides quite > a bit of info on the possibilities. The output is actually a valid > configuration. It seems to print out the contents of /etc/DIR_COLORS. -- Regards, Mick pgpNV9RENh7CT.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On Wednesday 04 April 2007 22:36, b.n. wrote: > *slap on the forehead* Oh my god, now I understand it all. You are using > a WHITE xterm background. > > The Gentoo colours make complete sense on a BLACK background. I do agree > that they are insane on a white or otherwise light background. > > I was thinking you were quite mad :) ,however now I agree with your > point (even if I don't agree with your ranting attitude: as repeated a > TON of times, your options are 1)file bugs 2)become a gentoo dev 3)stop > using Gentoo). or, 4)switch to a black background? What-ever floats you boat. -- Regards, Mick pgptXZlBQJ8sA.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Mick said the following on 2007-04-06 18:18: | | It seems to print out the contents of /etc/DIR_COLORS. It does, ie it shows the DIR_COLORS config. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (MingW32) iD8DBQFGFpM3JDzv6DN+QUkRAuj4AKCHJ15LzZqq+Omvqf22w8JetNC8iwCfXAsg 5HXvrSt+AsDMzJP1NDFl+Zg= =u0y+ -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 14:24:02 + (UTC) Grant Edwards <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 2007-04-05, Alexander Skwar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Grant Edwards <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > >> Why not default to a _useful_ condition? > > > > But, it does! The colors are very useful! > > Only on certain terminals. They're quite unreadable on a white > background (which has always been the default for xterm and > it's descendants, right?). > Why this is the case, I don't think I'll ever understand. White terminal backgrounds, aside from the invisible color problem, also are hella ugly. -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
Dan Farrell wrote: > > ...White > terminal backgrounds, aside from the invisible color problem, also are > hella ugly. When I look between reading printed papers or journals and the computer screen I like windows with white background (actually a little off-white) & black text. That way I can quickly look between the two without needing to get reaccustomed to different colors. No biggie either way, but everyone's needs are different. Mike -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
Hello Dan Farrell, > Why this is the case, I don't think I'll ever understand. White > terminal backgrounds, aside from the invisible color problem, also are > hella ugly. Many people find black on white far easier to read than white on black, for the same fonts and sizes. -- Neil Bothwick Memory Map - A sheet of paper showing location of computer store. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Why are gentoo people so in love with colorized output?!?
Neil Bothwick wrote: Hello Dan Farrell, Why this is the case, I don't think I'll ever understand. White terminal backgrounds, aside from the invisible color problem, also are hella ugly. Many people find black on white far easier to read than white on black, for the same fonts and sizes. Clearly, though, black on white uses less photons. Think of the children! -- -- Mike Still using IE? Get Firefox! http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&id=6492&t=1 -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
