Re: REXX USS directory list
Hi If you issue a REXX readdir, in the optional stem2 you got the fstat structure I'm using from this the st_ctime and st_mtime and convert via the gmtime function On 01.06.2012 21:54, Roger Wasley wrote: Afternoon I have been attempting to use SYSCALL READDIR and the fstat according to the manual but there seems to be no way to gath the DATE a USS file was accessed. based on fstat st_type I knwo if it is a directory or file but not the date it was last accessed. I looked at the mtime field but either I misread it or it is no good has anyone been able to do the READDIR or any other REXX SYSCALL and get the modfication date? Many thanks -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
REXX USS directory list
Afternoon I have been attempting to use SYSCALL READDIR and the fstat according to the manual but there seems to be no way to gath the DATE a USS file was accessed. based on fstat st_type I knwo if it is a directory or file but not the date it was last accessed. I looked at the mtime field but either I misread it or it is no good has anyone been able to do the READDIR or any other REXX SYSCALL and get the modfication date? Many thanks -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS File Integrity
flockfile seems to be a C thing and locks the file from other tasks. That will not help me. First this is a Java application and second I want to share the file between tasks of the same program. I allocate the file in the Java application. I do not specify a DD. All I do is open the file in the program but if I could specify the disp on a path that would solve my problem. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS File Integrity
On Fri, 20 Apr 2012 11:18:45 +0800, David Crayford dcrayf...@gmail.com wrote: Of course, fcntl() can be used to implement byte-range-locking. So in theory you could use it to implement row-level locking in a dictionary library. ENQ is not that granular. ENQ is as granular as the application wants to make it, depending on how clever the application programmer is at encoding information into the RNAME the application will use. The key point about UNIX files, though, is that all the locking is advisory, and controlled by the applications that use the file. If they all implement the same locking mechanism (whatever that may be), the locking will work. If they don't, it won't work. -- Walt -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS File Integrity
The OP originally stated that he had two STC processes that updated the same z/Unix file at the same time and wanted to prevent this. Are two STC's both considered z/Unix processes under the same kernel when they are running on the same LPAR? If so, ISTM that locking and unlocking the file around the write code will work as a mechanism to prevent simultaneous writes. But what about two STC's running on different LPAR's in the same sysplex? Does z/Unix file locking work across LPAR's, or only within the same LPAR? Just curious. ISTR that simultaneous writes to a common file are classically solved in most unix systems by implementing a daemon process that is the only process allowed to write to the file, and other processes send messages to the daemon to accomplish the write function, like the syslog daemon for system messages. The new question is whether Java on z/Unix provides access to any file locking mechanism at all, as the OP also just said it was a Java application and he wants to share the file among tasks of the *same* program. That would argue that using whatever the Java equivalent of the C flockfile function is would be the solution to use. But can z/Unix Java do that? Or does he have to write a JNI function to be called from his z/Unix Java code to implement a file lock? Or should he just implement a third process/task under the same program for the file writes and have both of the other tasks just send messages to the write process? Peter -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Walt Farrell Sent: Friday, April 20, 2012 8:27 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: USS File Integrity On Fri, 20 Apr 2012 11:18:45 +0800, David Crayford dcrayf...@gmail.com wrote: Of course, fcntl() can be used to implement byte-range-locking. So in theory you could use it to implement row-level locking in a dictionary library. ENQ is not that granular. ENQ is as granular as the application wants to make it, depending on how clever the application programmer is at encoding information into the RNAME the application will use. The key point about UNIX files, though, is that all the locking is advisory, and controlled by the applications that use the file. If they all implement the same locking mechanism (whatever that may be), the locking will work. If they don't, it won't work. -- This message and any attachments are intended only for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If the reader of the message is not the intended recipient or an authorized representative of the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail and delete the message and any attachments from your system. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS File Integrity
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Farley, Peter x23353 Sent: Friday, April 20, 2012 8:02 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: USS File Integrity The OP originally stated that he had two STC processes that updated the same z/Unix file at the same time and wanted to prevent this. Are two STC's both considered z/Unix processes under the same kernel when they are running on the same LPAR? If so, ISTM that locking and unlocking the file around the write code will work as a mechanism to prevent simultaneous writes. But what about two STC's running on different LPAR's in the same sysplex? Does z/Unix file locking work across LPAR's, or only within the same LPAR? Just curious. ISTR that simultaneous writes to a common file are classically solved in most unix systems by implementing a daemon process that is the only process allowed to write to the file, and other processes send messages to the daemon to accomplish the write function, like the syslog daemon for system messages. The new question is whether Java on z/Unix provides access to any file locking mechanism at all, as the OP also just said it was a Java application and he wants to share the file among tasks of the *same* program. That would argue that using whatever the Java equivalent of the C flockfile function is would be the solution to use. I will disagree with you on this point. I would use the z/OS ENQ facility. It is fully supported by the ZFILE portion of the JZOS software, which is a part of the IBM supplied Java language on z/OS. And we all, hopefully, know that using ENQ allows for sysplex-wide serialization. http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/java/zos/javadoc/jzos/index.html But can z/Unix Java do that? Or does he have to write a JNI function to be called from his z/Unix Java code to implement a file lock? Or should he just implement a third process/task under the same program for the file writes and have both of the other tasks just send messages to the write process? Yes, it can: http://docs.oracle.com/javase/6/docs/api/java/nio/channels/FileLock.html Of possible interest is the statement: This file-locking API is intended to map directly to the native locking facility of the underlying operating system. Thus the locks held on a file should be visible to all programs that have access to the file, regardless of the language in which those programs are written. Peter -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS File Integrity
Synchronizing file access between threads in a single program in java is trivial. Java has a built-in synchronized methods to implement critical sections. I'm not sure how well it would scale though as I guess there implemented by calling the pthread API. On 20/04/2012, at 9:01 PM, Farley, Peter x23353 peter.far...@broadridge.com wrote: The OP originally stated that he had two STC processes that updated the same z/Unix file at the same time and wanted to prevent this. Are two STC's both considered z/Unix processes under the same kernel when they are running on the same LPAR? If so, ISTM that locking and unlocking the file around the write code will work as a mechanism to prevent simultaneous writes. But what about two STC's running on different LPAR's in the same sysplex? Does z/Unix file locking work across LPAR's, or only within the same LPAR? Just curious. ISTR that simultaneous writes to a common file are classically solved in most unix systems by implementing a daemon process that is the only process allowed to write to the file, and other processes send messages to the daemon to accomplish the write function, like the syslog daemon for system messages. The new question is whether Java on z/Unix provides access to any file locking mechanism at all, as the OP also just said it was a Java application and he wants to share the file among tasks of the *same* program. That would argue that using whatever the Java equivalent of the C flockfile function is would be the solution to use. But can z/Unix Java do that? Or does he have to write a JNI function to be called from his z/Unix Java code to implement a file lock? Or should he just implement a third process/task under the same program for the file writes and have both of the other tasks just send messages to the write process? Peter -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Walt Farrell Sent: Friday, April 20, 2012 8:27 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: USS File Integrity On Fri, 20 Apr 2012 11:18:45 +0800, David Crayford dcrayf...@gmail.com wrote: Of course, fcntl() can be used to implement byte-range-locking. So in theory you could use it to implement row-level locking in a dictionary library. ENQ is not that granular. ENQ is as granular as the application wants to make it, depending on how clever the application programmer is at encoding information into the RNAME the application will use. The key point about UNIX files, though, is that all the locking is advisory, and controlled by the applications that use the file. If they all implement the same locking mechanism (whatever that may be), the locking will work. If they don't, it won't work. -- This message and any attachments are intended only for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If the reader of the message is not the intended recipient or an authorized representative of the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail and delete the message and any attachments from your system. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS File Integrity
I know CA-MIM , if memory serves me correctly works across Plexes and Lpars. I am not sure if it works across Unix file systems in a similar manner Scott Ford Senior Systems Engineer www.identityforge.com On Apr 20, 2012, at 9:43 AM, David Crayford dcrayf...@gmail.com wrote: Synchronizing file access between threads in a single program in java is trivial. Java has a built-in synchronized methods to implement critical sections. I'm not sure how well it would scale though as I guess there implemented by calling the pthread API. On 20/04/2012, at 9:01 PM, Farley, Peter x23353 peter.far...@broadridge.com wrote: The OP originally stated that he had two STC processes that updated the same z/Unix file at the same time and wanted to prevent this. Are two STC's both considered z/Unix processes under the same kernel when they are running on the same LPAR? If so, ISTM that locking and unlocking the file around the write code will work as a mechanism to prevent simultaneous writes. But what about two STC's running on different LPAR's in the same sysplex? Does z/Unix file locking work across LPAR's, or only within the same LPAR? Just curious. ISTR that simultaneous writes to a common file are classically solved in most unix systems by implementing a daemon process that is the only process allowed to write to the file, and other processes send messages to the daemon to accomplish the write function, like the syslog daemon for system messages. The new question is whether Java on z/Unix provides access to any file locking mechanism at all, as the OP also just said it was a Java application and he wants to share the file among tasks of the *same* program. That would argue that using whatever the Java equivalent of the C flockfile function is would be the solution to use. But can z/Unix Java do that? Or does he have to write a JNI function to be called from his z/Unix Java code to implement a file lock? Or should he just implement a third process/task under the same program for the file writes and have both of the other tasks just send messages to the write process? Peter -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Walt Farrell Sent: Friday, April 20, 2012 8:27 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: USS File Integrity On Fri, 20 Apr 2012 11:18:45 +0800, David Crayford dcrayf...@gmail.com wrote: Of course, fcntl() can be used to implement byte-range-locking. So in theory you could use it to implement row-level locking in a dictionary library. ENQ is not that granular. ENQ is as granular as the application wants to make it, depending on how clever the application programmer is at encoding information into the RNAME the application will use. The key point about UNIX files, though, is that all the locking is advisory, and controlled by the applications that use the file. If they all implement the same locking mechanism (whatever that may be), the locking will work. If they don't, it won't work. -- This message and any attachments are intended only for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If the reader of the message is not the intended recipient or an authorized representative of the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail and delete the message and any attachments from your system. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
USS File Integrity
I just ran two STCs that updated the same z/OS USS file at the same time. How do I stop multiple processes from updating the same z/OS USS file at the same time? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS File Integrity
On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 9:39 AM, Donald Likens dlik...@infosecinc.comwrote: I just ran two STCs that updated the same z/OS USS file at the same time. How do I stop multiple processes from updating the same z/OS USS file at the same time? lists...@bama.ua.edu I think my father served on that vessel in WWII! -- zMan -- I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS File Integrity
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 08:39:12 -0500, Donald Likens wrote: I just ran two STCs that updated the same z/OS USS file at the same time. How do I stop multiple processes from updating the same z/OS USS file at the same time? flockfile()? http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/edclb1c0/3.284 -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS File Integrity
Donald Likens wrote: I just ran two STCs that updated the same z/OS USS file at the same time. How do I stop multiple processes from updating the same z/OS USS file at the same time? Paul gave you a very good answer, but I wonder how was that USS file allocated in the first place? Dynamic Alloc, JCL DD statement, other method perhaps? Does it (allocation method) matters despite usage of flockfile()? Just curious of course. zMan: I think your father WWII ship is still sailing somewhere ( near that lovesick whale? :-D ) because of the constant disagreement about *true unfathomable* meaning of USS!!! :-D Groete / Greetings Elardus Engelbrecht -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS File Integrity
I do not agree to Paul's answer. flockfile() only relates to file descriptors. Opening another file descriptor for the same file will not be in scope of that particular lock. Instead you might consider BPX1FCT with the BPXYBRLK mapping structure. However, as found in the important note of v_lockctl description in PFS File System Interface Reference, all locking mechanisms are just convention for well-behaving processes and do not guarantee exclusive use. IMHO, POSIX and common Unix implementations just don't offer exclusive control as found in MVS (i.e. GRS). May be you can use ISGENQ to obtain an enqueue for Unix resources -- but beware of being overconfident. Cheers Michael Von:Elardus Engelbrecht elardus.engelbre...@sita.co.za An: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Datum: 2012-04-19 16:13 Betreff:Re: USS File Integrity Gesendet von: IBM Mainframe Discussion List IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Donald Likens wrote: I just ran two STCs that updated the same z/OS USS file at the same time. How do I stop multiple processes from updating the same z/OS USS file at the same time? Paul gave you a very good answer, but I wonder how was that USS file allocated in the first place? Dynamic Alloc, JCL DD statement, other method perhaps? Does it (allocation method) matters despite usage of flockfile()? Just curious of course. zMan: I think your father WWII ship is still sailing somewhere ( near that lovesick whale? :-D ) because of the constant disagreement about *true unfathomable* meaning of USS!!! :-D Groete / Greetings Elardus Engelbrecht -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS File Integrity
How are you updating the UNIX (not USS, for I live in terror of Chris Mason's rants) file? Via JCL? JCL does not do any ENQ on a DD when it allocates via a PATH. You could single thread by allocating a dataset which is vaguely related to the UNIX file. What I might do would be something like: //STEP EXEC PGM=SOMEPGM //REALDD DD PATH='/some/path/filename',PATHOPTS=...,FILEDATA=TEXT //ENQDDSN DD DISP=OLD,DSN=some.zos.dsn, // UNIT=SYSDA,VOL=REF=SYS1.MACLIB //* OTHER DSNS If you are not opening a DSN, but actually specifying the PATH in the code, such as with an open() or fopen() in C, then you'll need to do the ENQ yourself. I would suggest doing an ISPF compatable lock as describe here: http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/ispzpc90/APPENDIX1.1.4 However, I have found an error in this documentation. Where it says the last byte of the enq is 0x01 when OextSysplexAct is ON), the actual value is 0x20. IBM has accepted an RCF on this. You can get most of the infomation you need from the C lstat() function. However, there is no way in C to do an ENQ that I can see. I have code which gets the OextSysplexAct, but in HLASM: MVC OnOFF,initOnOFF L R1_32,CVTPTR USING CVT,R1_32 L R1_32,CVTECVT DROP R1_32 USING ECVT,R1_32 L R1_32,ECVTOEXT DROP R1_32 USING OEXT,R1_32 * * set the OMVS Sysplex indicator MVC SPFenq+11,OEXTFLG1 DROP R1_32 * Isolate the single bit NISPFenqTo,OEXTSYSPLEXACTV Or do a lockf() in your code http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/EDCLB1B0/3.563 UNIX does not do any sort of automatic locking the way that z/OS does ENQing of legacy data sets. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Donald Likens Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2012 8:39 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: USS File Integrity I just ran two STCs that updated the same z/OS USS file at the same time. How do I stop multiple processes from updating the same z/OS USS file at the same time? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS File Integrity
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 16:50:44 +0200, Michael Klaeschen wrote: locking mechanisms are just convention for well-behaving processes and do not guarantee exclusive use. IMHO, POSIX and common Unix implementations just don't offer exclusive control as found in MVS (i.e. GRS). May be you can use ISGENQ to obtain an enqueue for Unix resources -- but beware of being overconfident. Likewise, MVS ENQ via GRS is just a convention for well-behaving address spaces. I can do an IEBCOPY compress with the data set allocated SHR while other jobs also have it SHR. That's been suggested to me when I can't get the other job to free it. I avoid doing it; I don't consider it well-behaving. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS File Integrity
On 19/04/2012 10:50 PM, Michael Klaeschen wrote: I do not agree to Paul's answer. flockfile() only relates to file descriptors. Opening another file descriptor for the same file will not be in scope of that particular lock. Instead you might consider BPX1FCT with the BPXYBRLK mapping structure. However, as found in the important note of v_lockctl description in PFS File System Interface Reference, all locking mechanisms are just convention for well-behaving processes and do not guarantee exclusive use. BPX1FCT = fcntl() right? IMHO, POSIX and common Unix implementations just don't offer exclusive control as found in MVS (i.e. GRS). May be you can use ISGENQ to obtain an enqueue for Unix resources -- but beware of being overconfident. Of course, fcntl() can be used to implement byte-range-locking. So in theory you could use it to implement row-level locking in a dictionary library. ENQ is not that granular. Cheers Michael Von:Elardus Engelbrechtelardus.engelbre...@sita.co.za An: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Datum: 2012-04-19 16:13 Betreff:Re: USS File Integrity Gesendet von: IBM Mainframe Discussion ListIBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Donald Likens wrote: I just ran two STCs that updated the same z/OS USS file at the same time. How do I stop multiple processes from updating the same z/OS USS file at the same time? Paul gave you a very good answer, but I wonder how was that USS file allocated in the first place? Dynamic Alloc, JCL DD statement, other method perhaps? Does it (allocation method) matters despite usage of flockfile()? Just curious of course. zMan: I think your father WWII ship is still sailing somewhere ( near that lovesick whale? :-D ) because of the constant disagreement about *true unfathomable* meaning of USS!!! :-D Groete / Greetings Elardus Engelbrecht -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS YORKTOWN(was Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet)
Hal Merritt wrote: Sorry, but that's classified :-D You're in big trouble! The mere *fact* there is at least one lovesick whale somewhere in the ocean is *classified*! If that whale swallows you, I will not be sorry... ;-D ;-D8-D:-D Groete / Greetings Elardus Engelbrecht -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS YORKTOWN(was Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet)
I believe it has something to do with access to a tight seal. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS YORKTOWN(was Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet)
Neale, The next question is how do you get the seal tight? Use the Chief's home brew or would the seal be smart enough to require something better? :-) Lloyd - Original Message From: Neale Ferguson ne...@sinenomine.net To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Sent: Wed, April 11, 2012 10:07:20 AM Subject: Re: USS YORKTOWN(was Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet) I believe it has something to do with access to a tight seal. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS YORKTOWN(was Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet)
I read about such, um, issues a while back. Seems that there were more and more shipboard systems, but each was evolving on its own way lacking a common strategy. That means the systems were often fundamentally incompatible and therefore unable to communicate. Sounds silly, but I think an example was that neither the radars nor the sonar could send target information to the guns. Say what you will about Windows, but it at least offered some potential solution. While we laugh about Windows on warships giving a whole new meaning of the BSOD, I believe that it behooved the military to give it a try. Of course, the military doesn't like to talk about how its weapons systems work and I guess we'll never know for sure what really happened. But I can envision the Navy wanting a integrated situation where the OIC could point to a target and click 'kill'. The ship would then use all of its resources optimally to attack and destroy while, at the same time, defending itself from everything from missiles to a lovesick whale. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Dave Day Sent: Friday, April 06, 2012 2:20 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: USS YORKTOWN(was Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet) It's hard for me to imagine the navy allowing itself to get into a situation where the operation of the ship's main engines and steering would be completely subject to some PC, or number of PC's on a network within the ship. I put just shy of 3yrs. in an engine room aboard a navy ship, back in the 1960's. The ship had redundancy built into practically every piece of equipment that was needed to maintain steerage, even down to manual pumps to pump hydraulic fluid thru the steering gear. If you are dead in the water, you are a sitting duck. They just don't build 'em like that. They may have waited some period of time before going to manual systems to get underway, but I doubt seriously if a network crash would would have prevented complete movement. --Dave On 4/6/2012 1:54 PM, Mike Schwab wrote: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Yorktown_(CG-48) On 21 September 1997, while on maneuvers off the coast of Cape Charles, Virginia, a crew member entered a zero into a database field causing a divide by zero error in the ship's Remote Data Base Manager which brought down all the machines on the network, causing the ship's propulsion system to fail.[5] [deleted[ Atlantic Fleet officials also denied the towing, reporting that Yorktown was dead in the water for just 2 hours and 45 minutes.[6] [deleted] On Fri, Apr 6, 2012 at 8:32 AM, McKown, John john.mck...@healthmarkets.com wrote: Probably, given how we do things anymore, it would likely run Windows. I dread the day that we lose a war because our weapons blue screened. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN NOTICE: This electronic mail message and any files transmitted with it are intended exclusively for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. The message, together with any attachment, may contain confidential and/or privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, printing, saving, copying, disclosure or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately advise the sender by reply email and delete all copies. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS YORKTOWN(was Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet)
On Tue, 10 Apr 2012 15:27:29 +, Hal Merritt wrote: I read about such, um, issues a while back. Seems that there were more and more shipboard systems, but each was evolving on its own way lacking a common strategy. That means the systems were often fundamentally incompatible and therefore unable to communicate. Sounds silly, but I think an example was that neither the radars nor the sonar could send target information to the guns. Say what you will about Windows, but it at least offered some potential solution. ... The solution is not Windows per se, but uniformity. There are specialized OSes used in, for example spacecraft, simpler and more robust which should be more suitable for embedded software. We seem to be back to the Bad Old Days of No one ever lost his job for recommending IBM! C 'IBM' 'Microsoft' ALL -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS YORKTOWN(was Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet)
On Tue, Apr 10, 2012 at 11:27 AM, Hal Merritt hmerr...@jackhenry.comwrote: But I can envision the Navy wanting a integrated situation where the OIC could point to a target and click 'kill'. The ship would then use all of its resources optimally to attack and destroy while, at the same time, defending itself from everything from missiles to a lovesick whale. OK, I gotta ask -- how DO you defend against a lovesick whale? -- zMan -- I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS YORKTOWN(was Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet)
Sorry, but that's classified :-D -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of zMan Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2012 11:05 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: USS YORKTOWN(was Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet) On Tue, Apr 10, 2012 at 11:27 AM, Hal Merritt hmerr...@jackhenry.comwrote: But I can envision the Navy wanting a integrated situation where the OIC could point to a target and click 'kill'. The ship would then use all of its resources optimally to attack and destroy while, at the same time, defending itself from everything from missiles to a lovesick whale. OK, I gotta ask -- how DO you defend against a lovesick whale? -- zMan -- I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN NOTICE: This electronic mail message and any files transmitted with it are intended exclusively for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. The message, together with any attachment, may contain confidential and/or privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, printing, saving, copying, disclosure or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately advise the sender by reply email and delete all copies. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
In the spirit by which this conversation was started Acronym An abbreviation formed from the initial letters of other words and pronounced as a word z/OS Unix is not an acronym. It is at best a short version of the entire phrase z/OS Unix System Services or might be considered the real name... but still is not an acronym. zUSS would qualify, by definition, as an acronym. And I think I am ready to cede providing it will shutup, gag, disable pedantic feature, put a stake in this conversation, quit filling up my inbox, and otherwise cease this very much a waste of my valuable time posting on this subject. But as he has already disputed this shortened version... even though it conflicts with the definition of acronym... this will continue with no shore in site and only postings of people with time to waste on such trivial musings. Rob Schramm Senior Systems Consultant Imperium Group On Sat, Apr 7, 2012 at 1:06 AM, Pommier, Rex R. rex.pomm...@cnasurety.com wrote: John, For the most part I agree with you, except in the first line of his actual post, the original poster made it quite obvious to anybody which of the two USS's he was referring to, which makes this current argument all the more stupid. I think this whole thing is painfully silly, as Mr. Mason will never give up on his crusade to stop anybody from using USS to refer to Unix stuff, and a few others seem to take delight in needling him on, and the vast majority of us would prefer the whole thing just dry up. No amount of cajoling will get either side to change their respective minds, but unfortunately apparently no amount of begging them to just give it up will make that happen either. And it's too bad, because I have been the recipient on a couple occasions of some of Mr. Mason's wisdom in regards to a VTAM issue that I was having. Unfortunately the gems get lost in the bickering. Like you, this will be my last (and in my case my first) post on the subject. Rex -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of McKown, John Sent: Friday, April 06, 2012 2:03 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet Well, possibly to the relief of all, I will hencefore ignore any and all posts to this forum which include the letters USS which do not also explicitly say UNIX or VTAM. I'm simply to old and tired to bother any more. In this particular thread, I will agree that USS could be confusing since telnet could refer to either accessing a z/OS UNIX shell prompt via historic telnet, or to accessing an LU2 VTAM application via TN3270E which is also a special encoded 3270 data stream using the telnet protocol. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN The information contained in this e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information and is intended for the sole use of the intended recipient. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any unauthorized use, disclosure, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited and that you will be held responsible for any such unauthorized activity, including liability for any resulting damages. As appropriate, such incident(s) may also be reported to law enforcement. If you received this e-mail in error, please reply to sender and destroy or delete the message and any attachments. Thank you. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
I appreciate Chris' knowledge of most things, especially VTAM. But apparently he has a thing about USS. And also appears to believe that if he continues to be bothersome about the misuse of the term USS, that either: (a) people will be educated and will voluntarily change or (b) will become tired of hearing the rants and so change their usage just to shut him up. I doubt that either will occur. IMO, in most cases the meaning of USS is easily recognizable from the context. If it is not, then the email is likely so vague or poorly written that trying to understand what is needed is a waste of my time, and I ignore it. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2012 11:45 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet On Thu, 5 Apr 2012 09:31:57 -0500, Chris Mason wrote: However, there are indications you have been seduced by the incorrect use of the abbreviation for what started out as VTAM's Unformatted System Services at least two decades before UNIX System Services appeared on the IBM scene. Don't badger the novice. Vaunting your superiority is unseemly. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
So if our navy ever launches a ship called USS VTAM, what type of software would it use? Sorry, it's Friday. ;-) -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of McKown, John Sent: Friday, April 06, 2012 8:10 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet I appreciate Chris' knowledge of most things, especially VTAM. But apparently he has a thing about USS. And also appears to believe that if he continues to be bothersome about the misuse of the term USS, that either: (a) people will be educated and will voluntarily change or (b) will become tired of hearing the rants and so change their usage just to shut him up. I doubt that either will occur. IMO, in most cases the meaning of USS is easily recognizable from the context. If it is not, then the email is likely so vague or poorly written that trying to understand what is needed is a waste of my time, and I ignore it. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2012 11:45 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet On Thu, 5 Apr 2012 09:31:57 -0500, Chris Mason wrote: However, there are indications you have been seduced by the incorrect use of the abbreviation for what started out as VTAM's Unformatted System Services at least two decades before UNIX System Services appeared on the IBM scene. Don't badger the novice. Vaunting your superiority is unseemly. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
Probably, given how we do things anymore, it would likely run Windows. I dread the day that we lose a war because our weapons blue screened. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Tony's Comcast account Sent: Friday, April 06, 2012 8:23 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet So if our navy ever launches a ship called USS VTAM, what type of software would it use? Sorry, it's Friday. ;-) -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of McKown, John Sent: Friday, April 06, 2012 8:10 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet I appreciate Chris' knowledge of most things, especially VTAM. But apparently he has a thing about USS. And also appears to believe that if he continues to be bothersome about the misuse of the term USS, that either: (a) people will be educated and will voluntarily change or (b) will become tired of hearing the rants and so change their usage just to shut him up. I doubt that either will occur. IMO, in most cases the meaning of USS is easily recognizable from the context. If it is not, then the email is likely so vague or poorly written that trying to understand what is needed is a waste of my time, and I ignore it. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2012 11:45 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet On Thu, 5 Apr 2012 09:31:57 -0500, Chris Mason wrote: However, there are indications you have been seduced by the incorrect use of the abbreviation for what started out as VTAM's Unformatted System Services at least two decades before UNIX System Services appeared on the IBM scene. Don't badger the novice. Vaunting your superiority is unseemly. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
On 4/6/2012 6:09 AM, McKown, John wrote: I appreciate Chris' knowledge of most things, especially VTAM. But apparently he has a thing about USS. And also appears to believe that if he continues to be bothersome about the misuse of the term USS, that either: (a) people will be educated and will voluntarily change or (b) will become tired of hearing the rants and so change their usage just to shut him up. I chose option (c). ;-) -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 310-338-0400 x318 edja...@phoenixsoftware.com http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
Edward I chose option (c). That'll be don't misuse the abbreviation in the first place and use it only for the IBM context for which it was first coined - I suppose. Chris Mason On Fri, 6 Apr 2012 09:31:32 -0700, Edward Jaffe edja...@phoenixsoftware.com wrote: On 4/6/2012 6:09 AM, McKown, John wrote: ... (a) people will be educated and will voluntarily change or (b) will become tired of hearing the rants and so change their usage just to shut him up. ... I chose option (c). ;-) -- Edward E Jaffe -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
Get a life! -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Chris Mason Sent: Friday, April 06, 2012 12:45 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet Edward I chose option (c). That'll be don't misuse the abbreviation in the first place and use it only for the IBM context for which it was first coined - I suppose. Chris Mason On Fri, 6 Apr 2012 09:31:32 -0700, Edward Jaffe edja...@phoenixsoftware.com wrote: On 4/6/2012 6:09 AM, McKown, John wrote: ... (a) people will be educated and will voluntarily change or (b) will become tired of hearing the rants and so change their usage just to shut him up. ... I chose option (c). ;-) -- Edward E Jaffe -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN This e-mail may contain confidential or privileged information. If you think you have received this e-mail in error, please advise the sender by reply e-mail and then delete this e-mail immediately. Thank you. Aetna -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
John ... he appears to believe that if he continues to be bothersome about the misuse of the term USS, ... Did you not notice the extreme provocation which led to last month's post? One of the redbook authors actually had the temerity to claim that the misuse was official! Since my riposte referred to some IBM-MAIN traffic - in addition to the consolidation of the reasons why it was so wrong - it seemed only polite to pass on the text to the subscribers. IMO, in most cases the meaning of USS is easily recognizable from the context. Most is not all. And it is in the difference between most and all that the *immediate* ambiguity/confusion can arise. In these cases, as in this thread, TELNET will be involved. For novices, the problem is a delayed ambiguity. As I'm sure I've said recently, probably more than once, a novice will become bamboozled with the repeated misuse and will suffer when and if presented with the genuine article in an easily imagined scenario. Howard Rifkind - bless him - is the living - I hope - proof! It is, of course, so totally unnecessary since IBM in its wisdom back when it was decided to change OpenEdition to UNIX System Services so thoughtfully provided the abbreviation OS/390 UNIX - which naturally needed to morph into z/OS UNIX - which incidentally, even under provocation, you adopt. If it is not, then the email is likely so vague or poorly written that trying to understand what is needed is a waste of my time, and I ignore it. It's also not too easy what you are trying to say here. It has the aura of a bit of a wriggle! Finally, if I have reason to participate in a thread and the post to which I am replying contains the misuse, I reserve the right - against all the rants of the spittle-flecked[2] - to insert a correction, if only to maintain credibility! - Anyhow I'm pleased that your efforts and mine and Mark Zelden's probably provided Chokalingam Thangavelu with all he needed to know. - [1] I hope he forgives the reference but it so precisely illustrates my point and he was brave enough to express his confusion. I expect many another has suffered - and will suffer - in silence. Thread: Mainframe hacking Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 05:36:28 -0700 [2] If there's any ranting going on, it is inevitably the spittle-flecked who start it and I feel obliged to respond in kind in order to give no possibility of credence to the falsehoods expressed. In the case you quoted, it was the Gilmartin character - and I didn't even get round to rubbishing the total lack of logic in his final comment. - Chris Mason On Fri, 6 Apr 2012 08:09:53 -0500, McKown, John john.mck...@healthmarkets.com wrote: I appreciate Chris' knowledge of most things, especially VTAM. But apparently he has a thing about USS. And also appears to believe that if he continues to be bothersome about the misuse of the term USS, that either: (a) people will be educated and will voluntarily change or (b) will become tired of hearing the rants and so change their usage just to shut him up. I doubt that either will occur. IMO, in most cases the meaning of USS is easily recognizable from the context. If it is not, then the email is likely so vague or poorly written that trying to understand what is needed is a waste of my time, and I ignore it. -- John McKown -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
Garrulousity personified On Fri, 6 Apr 2012 12:48:02 -0400, Veilleux, Jon L veilleu...@aetna.com wrote: Get a life! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
I prefer to keep my comments succinct rather than ramble on about inane complaints about acronym usage. You must have too much time on your hands to waste so much of it on useless bickering, ergo, you need to get a life. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Chris Mason Sent: Friday, April 06, 2012 1:28 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet Garrulousity personified On Fri, 6 Apr 2012 12:48:02 -0400, Veilleux, Jon L veilleu...@aetna.com wrote: Get a life! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN This e-mail may contain confidential or privileged information. If you think you have received this e-mail in error, please advise the sender by reply e-mail and then delete this e-mail immediately. Thank you. Aetna -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
John, Frankly I've never understood Chris's problem with USS, except that he may suffer from some sort of OCD reaction when he sees those letters. We all know that USS stands for Unix System Services, and any other employment of the acronym with the Mainframe community should spell out that it is not using this accepted, commonplace, default meaning. VTAM Unformatted System Services is one good example, where authors should discipline themselves to explain that they are not referring to Unix System Services rather than confusing everyone by hijacking this acronym. And as for naming boats, how would HMAS ever get confused with USS? Is this the appropriate place for the :-) Ron -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of McKown, John Sent: Friday, April 06, 2012 6:10 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet I appreciate Chris' knowledge of most things, especially VTAM. But apparently he has a thing about USS. And also appears to believe that if he continues to be bothersome about the misuse of the term USS, that either: (a) people will be educated and will voluntarily change or (b) will become tired of hearing the rants and so change their usage just to shut him up. I doubt that either will occur. IMO, in most cases the meaning of USS is easily recognizable from the context. If it is not, then the email is likely so vague or poorly written that trying to understand what is needed is a waste of my time, and I ignore it. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2012 11:45 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet On Thu, 5 Apr 2012 09:31:57 -0500, Chris Mason wrote: However, there are indications you have been seduced by the incorrect use of the abbreviation for what started out as VTAM's Unformatted System Services at least two decades before UNIX System Services appeared on the IBM scene. Don't badger the novice. Vaunting your superiority is unseemly. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Yorktown_(CG-48) On 21 September 1997, while on maneuvers off the coast of Cape Charles, Virginia, a crew member entered a zero into a database field causing a divide by zero error in the ship's Remote Data Base Manager which brought down all the machines on the network, causing the ship's propulsion system to fail.[5] [deleted[ Atlantic Fleet officials also denied the towing, reporting that Yorktown was dead in the water for just 2 hours and 45 minutes.[6] [deleted] On Fri, Apr 6, 2012 at 8:32 AM, McKown, John john.mck...@healthmarkets.com wrote: Probably, given how we do things anymore, it would likely run Windows. I dread the day that we lose a war because our weapons blue screened. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV -- Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
No amount of discussion has or will ever quell this battle. Declare your own victory and do as I have: a) Don't use USS to refer to z/OS Unix System Services b) Don't correct someone who does c) Filter emails from Chris Mason. A pity that 5% of his voluminous posts are valuable, but not worth the rest. Unfortunately, there isn't an official acronym for z/OS Unix System Services. Until such time as there is, maybe we should use zUSS or maybe Xeus :-) Kirk Wolf Dovetailed Technologies http://dovetail.com On Fri, Apr 6, 2012 at 12:50 PM, Veilleux, Jon L veilleu...@aetna.comwrote: I prefer to keep my comments succinct rather than ramble on about inane complaints about acronym usage. You must have too much time on your hands to waste so much of it on useless bickering, ergo, you need to get a life. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
Well, possibly to the relief of all, I will hencefore ignore any and all posts to this forum which include the letters USS which do not also explicitly say UNIX or VTAM. I'm simply to old and tired to bother any more. In this particular thread, I will agree that USS could be confusing since telnet could refer to either accessing a z/OS UNIX shell prompt via historic telnet, or to accessing an LU2 VTAM application via TN3270E which is also a special encoded 3270 data stream using the telnet protocol. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
USS plus useful content - Read fully USS acronym wars --Plonk! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS YORKTOWN(was Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet)
It's hard for me to imagine the navy allowing itself to get into a situation where the operation of the ship's main engines and steering would be completely subject to some PC, or number of PC's on a network within the ship. I put just shy of 3yrs. in an engine room aboard a navy ship, back in the 1960's. The ship had redundancy built into practically every piece of equipment that was needed to maintain steerage, even down to manual pumps to pump hydraulic fluid thru the steering gear. If you are dead in the water, you are a sitting duck. They just don't build 'em like that. They may have waited some period of time before going to manual systems to get underway, but I doubt seriously if a network crash would would have prevented complete movement. --Dave On 4/6/2012 1:54 PM, Mike Schwab wrote: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Yorktown_(CG-48) On 21 September 1997, while on maneuvers off the coast of Cape Charles, Virginia, a crew member entered a zero into a database field causing a divide by zero error in the ship's Remote Data Base Manager which brought down all the machines on the network, causing the ship's propulsion system to fail.[5] [deleted[ Atlantic Fleet officials also denied the towing, reporting that Yorktown was dead in the water for just 2 hours and 45 minutes.[6] [deleted] On Fri, Apr 6, 2012 at 8:32 AM, McKown, John john.mck...@healthmarkets.com wrote: Probably, given how we do things anymore, it would likely run Windows. I dread the day that we lose a war because our weapons blue screened. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
Kirk Wolf: Unfortunately, there isn't an official acronym for z/OS Unix System Services. Until such time as there is, maybe we should use zUSS or maybe Xeus :-) Since you insisted: http://www-03.ibm.com/systems/z/os/zos/features/unix/ Regards, Steve Thompson Opinions expressed by this poster do not necessarily reflect those of poster's employer. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
On 4/6/2012 1:18 PM, Steve Thompson wrote: Kirk Wolf: Unfortunately, there isn't an official acronym for z/OS Unix System Services. Until such time as there is, maybe we should use zUSS or maybe Xeus :-) Since you insisted: http://www-03.ibm.com/systems/z/os/zos/features/unix/ Regards, Steve Thompson And if you click on the 'Education' tab ... -- Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. 303-355-2752 http://www.trainersfriend.com * To get a good Return on your Investment, first make an investment! + Training your people is an excellent investment * Try our tool for calculating your Return On Investment for training dollars at http://www.trainersfriend.com/ROI/roi.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS YORKTOWN(was Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet)
I came into work one morning and the office was staring out my window into San Francisco Bay. The Carl Vincent had run aground trying to return to it's berth at Alameda Naval Air Station. All the Crowley tugs were pushing and pulling, but they finally had to wait for a 'high tide' about 36 hrs. Long story short the Captain had ordered the pilot to proceed-during the court marshal was relieved of command. Hundreds of thousands to clean and recertify the props and impellers. In a message dated 4/6/2012 3:25:08 P.M. Central Daylight Time, david...@consolidated.net writes: It's hard for me to imagine the navy allowing itself to get into a situation where the operation of the ship's main engines and steering would be completely -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS YORKTOWN(was Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet)
Yea, running one of 'em aground is a big no-no for a captains career. --Dave On 4/6/2012 3:34 PM, Ed Finnell wrote: I came into work one morning and the office was staring out my window into San Francisco Bay. The Carl Vincent had run aground trying to return to it's berth at Alameda Naval Air Station. All the Crowley tugs were pushing and pulling, but they finally had to wait for a 'high tide' about 36 hrs. Long story short the Captain had ordered the pilot to proceed-during the court marshal was relieved of command. Hundreds of thousands to clean and recertify the props and impellers. In a message dated 4/6/2012 3:25:08 P.M. Central Daylight Time, david...@consolidated.net writes: It's hard for me to imagine the navy allowing itself to get into a situation where the operation of the ship's main engines and steering would be completely -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
Ron When were you born? Was it in 1997 or 1977? If it was 1997, you would now be 20 years older than if it was 1977 - according to your logic. Frankly I've never understood Chris's problem with USS, ... Now you know! Chris Mason P.S. Please take the trouble actually to read through the initial post of the still active thread A z/OS Redbook Corrected - just about!, Wed, 21 Mar 2012 07:34:55 -0500. On Fri, 6 Apr 2012 11:54:33 -0700, Ron Hawkins ronjhawk...@sbcglobal.net wrote: John, Frankly I've never understood Chris's problem with USS, except that he may suffer from some sort of OCD reaction when he sees those letters. We all know that USS stands for Unix System Services, and any other employment of the acronym with the Mainframe community should spell out that it is not using this accepted, commonplace, default meaning. VTAM Unformatted System Services is one good example, where authors should discipline themselves to explain that they are not referring to Unix System Services rather than confusing everyone by hijacking this acronym. ... Ron -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
Hook, line, and sinker... -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Chris Mason Sent: Friday, April 06, 2012 3:33 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet Ron When were you born? Was it in 1997 or 1977? If it was 1997, you would now be 20 years older than if it was 1977 - according to your logic. Frankly I've never understood Chris's problem with USS, ... Now you know! Chris Mason P.S. Please take the trouble actually to read through the initial post of the still active thread A z/OS Redbook Corrected - just about!, Wed, 21 Mar 2012 07:34:55 -0500. On Fri, 6 Apr 2012 11:54:33 -0700, Ron Hawkins ronjhawk...@sbcglobal.net wrote: John, Frankly I've never understood Chris's problem with USS, except that he may suffer from some sort of OCD reaction when he sees those letters. We all know that USS stands for Unix System Services, and any other employment of the acronym with the Mainframe community should spell out that it is not using this accepted, commonplace, default meaning. VTAM Unformatted System Services is one good example, where authors should discipline themselves to explain that they are not referring to Unix System Services rather than confusing everyone by hijacking this acronym. ... Ron -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
John, For the most part I agree with you, except in the first line of his actual post, the original poster made it quite obvious to anybody which of the two USS's he was referring to, which makes this current argument all the more stupid. I think this whole thing is painfully silly, as Mr. Mason will never give up on his crusade to stop anybody from using USS to refer to Unix stuff, and a few others seem to take delight in needling him on, and the vast majority of us would prefer the whole thing just dry up. No amount of cajoling will get either side to change their respective minds, but unfortunately apparently no amount of begging them to just give it up will make that happen either. And it's too bad, because I have been the recipient on a couple occasions of some of Mr. Mason's wisdom in regards to a VTAM issue that I was having. Unfortunately the gems get lost in the bickering. Like you, this will be my last (and in my case my first) post on the subject. Rex -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of McKown, John Sent: Friday, April 06, 2012 2:03 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet Well, possibly to the relief of all, I will hencefore ignore any and all posts to this forum which include the letters USS which do not also explicitly say UNIX or VTAM. I'm simply to old and tired to bother any more. In this particular thread, I will agree that USS could be confusing since telnet could refer to either accessing a z/OS UNIX shell prompt via historic telnet, or to accessing an LU2 VTAM application via TN3270E which is also a special encoded 3270 data stream using the telnet protocol. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN The information contained in this e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information and is intended for the sole use of the intended recipient. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any unauthorized use, disclosure, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited and that you will be held responsible for any such unauthorized activity, including liability for any resulting damages. As appropriate, such incident(s) may also be reported to law enforcement. If you received this e-mail in error, please reply to sender and destroy or delete the message and any attachments. Thank you. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
Hi, I am unable to access the Unix system services thru Telnet and could not find below configurations in USS files. 1. Could not find 'otelnet in file /etc/services' which points to the port of the USS telnet. 2. There is no otelnetd daemon or the configured inetd is running on the system 3. Could not fine INET in /etc/inet.conf Please let me know how to define above TELNET configurations and access USS thru TELNET. Regards, Chokalingam Please do not print this email unless it is absolutely necessary. The information contained in this electronic message and any attachments to this message are intended for the exclusive use of the addressee(s) and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately and destroy all copies of this message and any attachments. WARNING: Computer viruses can be transmitted via email. The recipient should check this email and any attachments for the presence of viruses. The company accepts no liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email. www.wipro.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
Unless you're dead set on using telnet (which is a bad idea) you should setup the ssh daemon and use it to connect to the OMVS environment. Mark Jacobs On 04/05/12 09:51, Chokalingam Thangavelu wrote: Hi, I am unable to access the Unix system services thru Telnet and could not find below configurations in USS files. 1. Could not find 'otelnet in file /etc/services' which points to the port of the USS telnet. 2. There is no otelnetd daemon or the configured inetd is running on the system 3. Could not fine INET in /etc/inet.conf Please let me know how to define above TELNET configurations and access USS thru TELNET. Regards, Chokalingam Please do not print this email unless it is absolutely necessary. The information contained in this electronic message and any attachments to this message are intended for the exclusive use of the addressee(s) and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately and destroy all copies of this message and any attachments. WARNING: Computer viruses can be transmitted via email. The recipient should check this email and any attachments for the presence of viruses. The company accepts no liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email. www.wipro.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- Mark Jacobs Time Customer Service Tampa, FL Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope for tomorrow. The important thing is to not stop questioning. - Albert Einstein -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
I agree with Mark. IBM Ported Tools for z/OS - OpenSSH is free, and works well to encrypt your connections. With most recent PTFs, it is not possible to use ICSF and CPACF to enable hardware acceleration of the ciphers and macs, which allows for much less CPU usage. Kirk Wolf Dovetailed Technologies http://dovetail.com On Thu, Apr 5, 2012 at 9:00 AM, Mark Jacobs mark.jac...@custserv.comwrote: Unless you're dead set on using telnet (which is a bad idea) you should setup the ssh daemon and use it to connect to the OMVS environment. Mark Jacobs On 04/05/12 09:51, Chokalingam Thangavelu wrote: Hi, I am unable to access the Unix system services thru Telnet and could not find below configurations in USS files. 1. Could not find 'otelnet in file /etc/services' which points to the port of the USS telnet. 2. There is no otelnetd daemon or the configured inetd is running on the system 3. Could not fine INET in /etc/inet.conf Please let me know how to define above TELNET configurations and access USS thru TELNET. Regards, Chokalingam Please do not print this email unless it is absolutely necessary. The information contained in this electronic message and any attachments to this message are intended for the exclusive use of the addressee(s) and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately and destroy all copies of this message and any attachments. WARNING: Computer viruses can be transmitted via email. The recipient should check this email and any attachments for the presence of viruses. The company accepts no liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email. www.wipro.com --**--** -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- Mark Jacobs Time Customer Service Tampa, FL Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope for tomorrow. The important thing is to not stop questioning. - Albert Einstein --**--**-- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
Chokalingam What your subject line could be taken to suggest is that you should use the following reference in order to use USS with the SNA-oriented TELNET server, identified in the manuals as TN3270E: Section 2.2.1.4.15, Using the Telnet solicitor or USS logon screen in the z/OS Communications Server IP Configuration Guide http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/f1a1b3b0/2.2.1.4.15 However, there are indications you have been seduced by the incorrect use of the abbreviation for what started out as VTAM's Unformatted System Services at least two decades before UNIX System Services appeared on the IBM scene. That being so, the TELNET server you really need is *not* the SNA-oriented TELNET Server but the UNIX-oriented TELNET Server documented as follows: Section 2.2.2, Configuring the z/OS UNIX Telnet server in the z/OS Communications Server IP Configuration Guide http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/F1A1B3B0/2.2.2 If you find all this a bit puzzling, please review my very recent post right here in IBM-MAIN with the following Subject line: A z/OS Redbook Corrected - just about! http://www.mail-archive.com/ibm-main@bama.ua.edu/msg151511.html - Incidentally, reviewing your post, it looks as if you may simply need to edit the files on your system so that they look like the files in the documentation I have given you. - Chris Mason On Thu, 5 Apr 2012 13:51:45 +, Chokalingam Thangavelu thangavelu.chokalin...@wipro.com wrote: Hi, I am unable to access the Unix system services thru Telnet and could not find below configurations in USS files. 1. Could not find 'otelnet in file /etc/services' which points to the port of the USS telnet. 2. There is no otelnetd daemon or the configured inetd is running on the system 3. Could not fine INET in /etc/inet.conf Please let me know how to define above TELNET configurations and access USS thru TELNET. Regards, Chokalingam -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
Using SSH is, IMO, superior. But if you are dead set on using Telnet (perhaps due to lack of an SSH client - I suggest PuTTY), then you must be running the INETD daemon. And you must have a dedicated port number on z/OS to use. We use port 2023. In the /etc/inetd.conf file, you need a line like: 2023 stream tcp nowait BPXROOT /usr/sbin/otelnetd otelnetd -l -t -D login Replace the 2023 with the port you want to use. Then, to get a UNIX shell prompt, you telnet into that port number. This works for me. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Chokalingam Thangavelu Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2012 8:52 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet Hi, I am unable to access the Unix system services thru Telnet and could not find below configurations in USS files. 1. Could not find 'otelnet in file /etc/services' which points to the port of the USS telnet. 2. There is no otelnetd daemon or the configured inetd is running on the system 3. Could not fine INET in /etc/inet.conf Please let me know how to define above TELNET configurations and access USS thru TELNET. Regards, Chokalingam Please do not print this email unless it is absolutely necessary. The information contained in this electronic message and any attachments to this message are intended for the exclusive use of the addressee(s) and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately and destroy all copies of this message and any attachments. WARNING: Computer viruses can be transmitted via email. The recipient should check this email and any attachments for the presence of viruses. The company accepts no liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email. www.wipro.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
On 4/5/2012 8:44 AM, McKown, John wrote: Using SSH is, IMO, superior. But if you are dead set on using Telnet (perhaps due to lack of an SSH client - I suggest PuTTY), then you must be running the INETD daemon. And you must have a dedicated port number on z/OS to use. We use port 2023. In the /etc/inetd.conf file, you need a line like: 2023 stream tcp nowait BPXROOT /usr/sbin/otelnetd otelnetd -l -t -D login Replace the 2023 with the port you want to use. Then, to get a UNIX shell prompt, you telnet into that port number. This works for me. We don't have a port in our /etc/inted.conf file; in fact, the only non-comment line we have is: otelnet stream tcp nowait OMVSKERN /usr/sbin/otelnetd otelnetd I think this is because '23' is the default telnet server port, and we have that port allocated to telnet in our tcpparms profile. BTW, we use telnet because that's the way our system from Dallas is set up. We are not sysprogs so we try to minimize the systems programming work we need to do. (Oh, we do some, of course, to install new versions of products, etc., but these are driven by course needs, e.g.: setting up DB2 8 and 9 and 10 as needed; even then, the Dallas staff does most the work, we merely need to tailor things to our config). There doesn't seem to be much payback to go to ssh in return for the work. Our system is actually only in non-sleep mode a few days a month (well, it's erratic, depending on our current development work). -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Chokalingam Thangavelu Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2012 8:52 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet Hi, I am unable to access the Unix system services thru Telnet and could not find below configurations in USS files. 1. Could not find 'otelnet in file /etc/services' which points to the port of the USS telnet. 2. There is no otelnetd daemon or the configured inetd is running on the system 3. Could not fine INET in /etc/inet.conf Please let me know how to define above TELNET configurations and access USS thru TELNET. Regards, Chokalingam -- Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. 303-355-2752 http://www.trainersfriend.com * To get a good Return on your Investment, first make an investment! + Training your people is an excellent investment * Try our tool for calculating your Return On Investment for training dollars at http://www.trainersfriend.com/ROI/roi.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
We use a Dallas RDP system, and IBM installed IBM Ported Tools OpenSSH for us.I think that all I had to do was to customize the SSHD started task a bit. There isn't much payback for using ssh over tty telnet, until your password is snatched from an unencrypted telnet session :-) But if you are using unencrypted TN3270, its the same issue. BTW, we use telnet because that's the way our system from Dallas is set up. We are not sysprogs so we try to minimize the systems programming work we need to do. (Oh, we do some, of course, to install new versions of products, etc., but these are driven by course needs, e.g.: setting up DB2 8 and 9 and 10 as needed; even then, the Dallas staff does most the work, we merely need to tailor things to our config). There doesn't seem to be much payback to go to ssh in return for the work. Our system is actually only in non-sleep mode a few days a month (well, it's erratic, depending on our current development work). -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Chokalingam Thangavelu Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2012 8:52 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet Hi, I am unable to access the Unix system services thru Telnet and could not find below configurations in USS files. 1. Could not find 'otelnet in file /etc/services' which points to the port of the USS telnet. 2. There is no otelnetd daemon or the configured inetd is running on the system 3. Could not fine INET in /etc/inet.conf Please let me know how to define above TELNET configurations and access USS thru TELNET. Regards, Chokalingam -- Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. 303-355-2752 http://www.trainersfriend.com * To get a good Return on your Investment, first make an investment! + Training your people is an excellent investment * Try our tool for calculating your Return On Investment for training dollars at http://www.trainersfriend.com/**ROI/roi.htmlhttp://www.trainersfriend.com/ROI/roi.html --**--**-- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
And you must have a dedicated port number on z/OS to use. We use port 2023. Sorry John - not strictly true - unless there's a consideration of which I am unaware which prevents use of the well-documented technique I am about to propose as an alternative. The trick is to use virtual IP addresses (VIPAs) - decided on the IBMTCP-L list better to be described as virtual *interface* IP addresses - in combination with the BIND parameter of the relevant PORT statement list entries. Thus you have a PORT statement list entry for the SNA-oriented TELNET server and you have a PORT statement list entry for the UNIX-oriented TELNET server. Here's an example based on just how the BIND parameter works, the sample given in section 2.22.5, Configuring TSO and z/OS UNIX Remote Execution servers to use the same port in the z/OS Communications Server IP Configuration Guide, various other bits and pieces of information in the same manual and the Configuration Reference manual: Definition of VIPAs: VIPADYNAMIC VIPARANGE 255.255.255.255 10.1.1.1 VIPARANGE 255.255.255.255 10.1.1.2 ENDVIPADYNAMIC Extract of PORT statement: PORT ... 23 TCP TN3270E BIND 10.1.1.1 23 TCP OMVSBIND 10.1.1.2 ... Extract of /etc/services: ... otelnet 23/tcp ... Extract of inetd.conf: ... otelnet stream tcp nowait OMVSKERN /usr/sbin/otelnetd otelnetd ... For clients who wish to access the SNA-oriented TELNET server, ideally a name system entry will be available which specifies IP address 10.1.1.1 as the destination so that entry of the command telnet sna.my.lovely.system.com causes a TELNET connection to 10.1.1.1, port 23. For clients who wish to access the UNIX-oriented TELNET server, ideally a name system entry will be available which specifies IP address 10.1.1.2 as the destination so that entry of the command telnet unix.my.lovely.system.com causes a TELNET connection to 10.1.1.2, port 23. Thus neither of the TELNET servers need use a *dedicated* port number. Note that I prefer to propose VIPARANGE dynamic VIPA with the PORT statement list entry BIND parameter rather than static VIPA for server applications just as a matter of course. The reason is that the associated service will be advertised using whatever dynamic routing protocol is in use *only* when the service is available. - Incidentally, I'd be grateful if someone with a sandbox and a bit of time on their hands could verify this sample. - Chris Mason On Thu, 5 Apr 2012 09:44:39 -0500, McKown, John john.mck...@healthmarkets.com wrote: Using SSH is, IMO, superior. But if you are dead set on using Telnet (perhaps due to lack of an SSH client - I suggest PuTTY), then you must be running the INETD daemon. And you must have a dedicated port number on z/OS to use. We use port 2023. In the /etc/inetd.conf file, you need a line like: 2023 stream tcp nowait BPXROOT /usr/sbin/otelnetd otelnetd -l -t -D login Replace the 2023 with the port you want to use. Then, to get a UNIX shell prompt, you telnet into that port number. This works for me. -- John McKown -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
Steve We don't have a port in our /etc/inted.conf file; in fact, the only non-comment line we have is: otelnet stream tcp nowait OMVSKERN /usr/sbin/otelnetd otelnetd I think this is because '23' is the default telnet server port, and we have that port allocated to telnet in our tcpparms profile. You may recall that one of the items in Chokalingam's list was the following: 1. Could not find 'otelnet in file /etc/services' which points to the port of the USS telnet. This is where the association between the service name in the first position of the inetd.conf file and the port number is established. It is *not* taken from the PORT statement list entry. Chris Mason On Thu, 5 Apr 2012 09:06:11 -0600, Steve Comstock st...@trainersfriend.com wrote: ... -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
On 4/5/2012 9:56 AM, Chris Mason wrote: Steve We don't have a port in our /etc/inted.conf file; in fact, the only non-comment line we have is: otelnet stream tcp nowait OMVSKERN /usr/sbin/otelnetd otelnetd I think this is because '23' is the default telnet server port, and we have that port allocated to telnet in our tcpparms profile. You may recall that one of the items in Chokalingam's list was the following: 1. Could not find 'otelnet in file /etc/services' which points to the port of the USS telnet. This is where the association between the service name in the first position of the inetd.conf file and the port number is established. It is *not* taken from the PORT statement list entry. Chris Mason Ah, thanks for the clarification. On Thu, 5 Apr 2012 09:06:11 -0600, Steve Comstockst...@trainersfriend.com wrote: ... -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. 303-355-2752 http://www.trainersfriend.com * To get a good Return on your Investment, first make an investment! + Training your people is an excellent investment * Try our tool for calculating your Return On Investment for training dollars at http://www.trainersfriend.com/ROI/roi.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
My client has been using telnet long before openssh was available... and still does. The port is in /etc/services. My inetd.conf looks like this: #== # service | socket | protocol | wait/ | user | server | server program # name| type | | nowait| | program | arguments #== # otelnet stream tcp nowait OMVSKERN /usr/sbin/otelnetd otelnetd -l shell stream tcp nowait OMVSKERN /usr/sbin/orshd orshd -LV login stream tcp nowait OMVSKERN /usr/sbin/rlogind rlogind -m oexec stream tcp nowait OMVSKERN /usr/sbin/orexecd orexecd -LV ssh stream tcp nowait OMVSKERN /usr/sbin/sshd sshd -i /etc/services has a line like this added: otelnet nnn/tcp OMVS(nnn is the port - usually n23 or nn23) The PORT statement in TCPIP profile has it reserved as well: nnn TCP OMVS; OE TELNET SERVER Regards, Mark -- Mark Zelden - Zelden Consulting Services - z/OS, OS/390 and MVS mailto:m...@mzelden.com Mark's MVS Utilities: http://www.mzelden.com/mvsutil.html Systems Programming expert at http://expertanswercenter.techtarget.com/ On Thu, 5 Apr 2012 09:44:39 -0500, McKown, John john.mck...@healthmarkets.com wrote: Using SSH is, IMO, superior. But if you are dead set on using Telnet (perhaps due to lack of an SSH client - I suggest PuTTY), then you must be running the INETD daemon. And you must have a dedicated port number on z/OS to use. We use port 2023. In the /etc/inetd.conf file, you need a line like: 2023 stream tcp nowait BPXROOT /usr/sbin/otelnetd otelnetd -l -t -D login Replace the 2023 with the port you want to use. Then, to get a UNIX shell prompt, you telnet into that port number. This works for me. -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Chokalingam Thangavelu Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2012 8:52 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet Hi, I am unable to access the Unix system services thru Telnet and could not find below configurations in USS files. 1. Could not find 'otelnet in file /etc/services' which points to the port of the USS telnet. 2. There is no otelnetd daemon or the configured inetd is running on the system 3. Could not fine INET in /etc/inet.conf Please let me know how to define above TELNET configurations and access USS thru TELNET. Regards, Chokalingam Please do not print this email unless it is absolutely necessary. The information contained in this electronic message and any attachments to this message are intended for the exclusive use of the addressee(s) and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately and destroy all copies of this message and any attachments. WARNING: Computer viruses can be transmitted via email. The recipient should check this email and any attachments for the presence of viruses. The company accepts no liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email. www.wipro.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
On Thu, 5 Apr 2012 09:31:57 -0500, Chris Mason wrote: However, there are indications you have been seduced by the incorrect use of the abbreviation for what started out as VTAM's Unformatted System Services at least two decades before UNIX System Services appeared on the IBM scene. Don't badger the novice. Vaunting your superiority is unseemly. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Accessing USS on Mainframe thru Telnet
Mr Gilmartin As I have attempted to point out on numerous occasions - but you seem to hold my opinions in utter contempt - it is very precisely the *novice* who needs assistance in getting rid of the pernicious influence of this perpetuating travesty. You probably haven't taken the trouble to notice that, not only were we probably dealing with a novice, but that the topic under discussion was TELNET, the topic giving rise to the maximum likelihood of actual immediate ambiguity. On the contrary I am sure we would all appreciate some relief from the contentious drivel from your quarter. Have you managed to get rid of all the pieces of felt from between your teeth yet? Mason On Thu, 5 Apr 2012 11:44:39 -0500, Paul Gilmartin paulgboul...@aim.com wrote: On Thu, 5 Apr 2012 09:31:57 -0500, Chris Mason wrote: However, there are indications you have been seduced by the incorrect use of the abbreviation for what started out as VTAM's Unformatted System Services at least two decades before UNIX System Services appeared on the IBM scene. Don't badger the novice. Vaunting your superiority is unseemly. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS Education (Was: Calling all experts on SMFPRMxx SUBSYS)
Not really. Consider the source. -- Donald Grinsell State of Montana 406-444-2983 dgrins...@mt.gov We want a few mad people now. See where the sane ones have landed us! -- George Bernard Shaw (1856-1950) -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Ford Prefect Sent: Saturday, 07 January 2012 13:53 To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: USS Education (Was: Calling all experts on SMFPRMxx SUBSYS) Disturbing. On Fri, Jan 6, 2012 at 9:56 AM, Chris Mason chrisma...@belgacom.net wrote: -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Lack of full USS LOGOFF support in RFC 2355 (Was: USS Education ...)
Disturbed Disturbing. I am obliged to guess at what part of my post you found disturbing. I concluded it must be the point I raised regarding support for the LOGOFF command, no other point being available as a candidate. It is indeed a shame that Bill Kelly - to give a name to the author of RFC 2355 - didn't appreciate that there was a capability, enormously useful in support of a troubled - one might even say disturbed - end user when work is not progressing as hoped. That missed capability can be described in the following manner: 1. The end-user has established the TN3270E TCP connection concatenated to the SNA session with, for example, TSO with the aid of the LOGON command. 2. The end-user has become stuck in some way, no response from the application or the application is not behaving as he or she expected. Ideally, the following would be possible, with the end-used needing to have been trained only how to manage 3 and 4. 3. The end-user would invoke the SysReq function, single key or combination of keys with a tricky order of press. 4. The end-user would press enter.[1] 5. There would now be instructions over how to proceed which would include the number of the help desk, and a number of parameters specific to that end-users connection/session which the help desk would need properly to identify the end-user: - the client IP address - the client name obtained from the name server system [2] - the SNA-oriented TELNET server LU name Incidentally, also with what RFC 2355 allows in the implementation of the LOGON command, the variables are available for presentation at this time and, in case anyone is of the opinion that this is all some relic of a bygone age, there is - sound the trumpets! - support for IPv6 in the client IP address field. It appears that Bill Kelly - not having attended my classes! - was unaware of the possibility behind steps 3, 4 and 5 which has always existed for the case of the SNA end-to-end session - obviously just with regard to the LU name field - since the @@LUNAME variable was introduced. This is the great - and disturbing - shame! - [1] The message which appears here is number 5, Unsupported function. All this means is that, according to design, VTAM or, in this case, the SNA-oriented TELNET server, do not take any action relating to session management as a result of receiving no data - but, but, but - there is nothing whatsoever to prevent the canny system programmer using any or all of the available variables to populate the resulting message 5! [2] It is not actually made clear in the section 16.4.3, USSMSG macroinstruction of the z/OS Communications Server IP Configuration Reference where these fields are described that this field must be optional: http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/f1a1b4b0/16.4.3 The SNA-oriented TELNET server will only obtain the client host name from the name server system when (it thinks!) it needs so to do in order to map, for example, LU names to particular client work-stations by host name. As for the case of providing the name field in the CV X'64' information propagated to the application, this reference to the name server system can be induced by setting up, in effect, a dummy HNGROUP set of statements in the PROFILE data set. - Chris Mason On Sat, 7 Jan 2012 15:53:11 -0500, Ford Prefect ford...@gmail.com wrote: Disturbing. On Fri, Jan 6, 2012 at 9:56 AM, Chris Mason chrisma...@belgacom.net wrote: ... Incidentally, while scanning for the changes, I noticed some mendacity! It's actually not really the fault of the Communications Server developers that the SNA-oriented TELNET server can mimic the action of VTAM only for the *LOGON* command. Rather it is a deficiency of RFC 2355. In order completely to support the following claim: quote For ease of migration, Telnet simulates SNA USS processing very closely. /quote full implementation of the handling of the *LOGOFF* command would be required. Unfortunately, while having done a good job for the most part the author of RFC 2355 fell down very badly in the area of the USS LOGOFF command - more's the pity for end users and their help desk support. - Chris Mason -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Lack of full USS LOGOFF support in RFC 2355 (Was: USS Education ...)
Chris, What I find disturbing is your blind insistence that the use of USS has only one possible meaning, to the point of replying to a reference that was quite obviously about Unix System Services, but pretending that it was not. Then again, you are probably quite aware of what I meant, but have some need to continue playing your little game. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: USS Education (Was: Calling all experts on SMFPRMxx SUBSYS)
Disturbing. On Fri, Jan 6, 2012 at 9:56 AM, Chris Mason chrisma...@belgacom.net wrote: Barbara You know how ignorant I am about USS, don't you? Well, no, I didn't at all but, since you mention it, perhaps I can help, assuming you would like to be educated in USS. These days you most probably use USS as described in Chapter 11, Accessing remote hosts using Telnet of the z/OS Communications Server IP Configuration Guide, most specifically the section Using the Telnet solicitor or USS logon screen: http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/f1a1b3b0/2.2.1.4.15 If you want to know about the original USS created in the second half of the 1970s decade and still very much in use and which indeed your installation may use in conjunction with OSA features configured as an Integrated Console Controller (ICC) (CHPID OSC), the description is in the following sources: - Chapter 12, Establishing and controlling SNA sessions in the z/OS Communications Server SNA Network Implementation Guide, most specifically in section Logon and logoff requests from dependent logical units http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/F1A1B5B0/12.8 - Chapter 5, User-defined tables and data filter in the z/OS Communications Server SNA Resource Definition Reference section Unformatted system services tables: http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/f1a1b6c0/5.11 If you detect any conflicts between the IP and SNA sources, you should use the SNA (VTAM) version as authoritative. If you ever need help with the topic, please don't hesitate to submit a post with a title such as Help needed with USS or something clear and unambiguous like that. - Thanks to your comment, I noted that there had been changes in the description of USS as used by the SNA-oriented TELNET server in V1R13. However the changes were mostly extremely trivial - panel to screen, I ask you! - except for the addition of password phrase support - when you happen to use the Telnet solicitor rather than USS! - Incidentally, while scanning for the changes, I noticed some mendacity! It's actually not really the fault of the Communications Server developers that the SNA-oriented TELNET server can mimic the action of VTAM only for the *LOGON* command. Rather it is a deficiency of RFC 2355. In order completely to support the following claim: quote For ease of migration, Telnet simulates SNA USS processing very closely. /quote full implementation of the handling of the *LOGOFF* command would be required. Unfortunately, while having done a good job for the most part the author of RFC 2355 fell down very badly in the area of the USS LOGOFF command - more's the pity for end users and their help desk support. - Chris Mason On Thu, 5 Jan 2012 23:39:12 -0600, Barbara Nitz nitz-...@gmx.net wrote: ... You know how ignorant I am about USS, don't you? ... Barbara -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
USS Education (Was: Calling all experts on SMFPRMxx SUBSYS)
Barbara You know how ignorant I am about USS, don't you? Well, no, I didn't at all but, since you mention it, perhaps I can help, assuming you would like to be educated in USS. These days you most probably use USS as described in Chapter 11, Accessing remote hosts using Telnet of the z/OS Communications Server IP Configuration Guide, most specifically the section Using the Telnet solicitor or USS logon screen: http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/f1a1b3b0/2.2.1.4.15 If you want to know about the original USS created in the second half of the 1970s decade and still very much in use and which indeed your installation may use in conjunction with OSA features configured as an Integrated Console Controller (ICC) (CHPID OSC), the description is in the following sources: - Chapter 12, Establishing and controlling SNA sessions in the z/OS Communications Server SNA Network Implementation Guide, most specifically in section Logon and logoff requests from dependent logical units http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/F1A1B5B0/12.8 - Chapter 5, User-defined tables and data filter in the z/OS Communications Server SNA Resource Definition Reference section Unformatted system services tables: http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/f1a1b6c0/5.11 If you detect any conflicts between the IP and SNA sources, you should use the SNA (VTAM) version as authoritative. If you ever need help with the topic, please don't hesitate to submit a post with a title such as Help needed with USS or something clear and unambiguous like that. - Thanks to your comment, I noted that there had been changes in the description of USS as used by the SNA-oriented TELNET server in V1R13. However the changes were mostly extremely trivial - panel to screen, I ask you! - except for the addition of password phrase support - when you happen to use the Telnet solicitor rather than USS! - Incidentally, while scanning for the changes, I noticed some mendacity! It's actually not really the fault of the Communications Server developers that the SNA-oriented TELNET server can mimic the action of VTAM only for the *LOGON* command. Rather it is a deficiency of RFC 2355. In order completely to support the following claim: quote For ease of migration, Telnet simulates SNA USS processing very closely. /quote full implementation of the handling of the *LOGOFF* command would be required. Unfortunately, while having done a good job for the most part the author of RFC 2355 fell down very badly in the area of the USS LOGOFF command - more's the pity for end users and their help desk support. - Chris Mason On Thu, 5 Jan 2012 23:39:12 -0600, Barbara Nitz nitz-...@gmx.net wrote: ... You know how ignorant I am about USS, don't you? ... Barbara -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
SV: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
FWIW, I have a REXX function coded in asm for MD5 checksums running it in MVS (EBCDIC). (Coded by Leland Lucius) Regards, Thomas Berg _ Thomas Berg Specialist A M SWEDBANK -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
MD5 hash of a USS file ?
Hi, How do I obtain the md5sum of a file located in USS directory ? I have come across the CSNBOWH callable ICSF function. But, I am looking for a JCL job step type of solution. In the ported tools page, I see a link for sha command, but not for md5. Apology if this question sounds too basic; been a while since I have been away from z/OS. N -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
On Tue, 22 Nov 2011 22:54:23 +0530, #3240;#3262;#3223;#3271;#3254;#3277; #3256;#3265;#3244;#3277;#3248;#3257;#3277;#3246;#3235;#3277;#3247; (N wrote: Hi, How do I obtain the md5sum of a file located in USS directory ? I have come across the CSNBOWH callable ICSF function. But, I am looking for a JCL job step type of solution. In the ported tools page, I see a link for sha command, but not for md5. Apology if this question sounds too basic; been a while since I have been away from z/OS. The code is in the RFC. Compiles readily on z/OS. If you have a C compiler. Does CSNBOWH do MD5? CSNBOWH is callable from Rexx, but SMOP. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
Yes, CSNBOWH does MD5. In the syntax for this function, the input is to be provided is expected to be a string; not a file. N On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 11:03 PM, Paul Gilmartin paulgboul...@aim.comwrote: On Tue, 22 Nov 2011 22:54:23 +0530, #3240;#3262;#3223;#3271;#3254;#3277; #3256;#3265;#3244;#3277;#3248;#3257;#3277;#3246;#3235;#3277;#3247; (N wrote: Hi, How do I obtain the md5sum of a file located in USS directory ? I have come across the CSNBOWH callable ICSF function. But, I am looking for a JCL job step type of solution. In the ported tools page, I see a link for sha command, but not for md5. Apology if this question sounds too basic; been a while since I have been away from z/OS. The code is in the RFC. Compiles readily on z/OS. If you have a C compiler. Does CSNBOWH do MD5? CSNBOWH is callable from Rexx, but SMOP. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List
[mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of ?? ???
(Nagesh S)
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 11:24 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
Subject: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
Hi,
How do I obtain the md5sum of a file located in USS directory ?
I have come across the CSNBOWH callable ICSF function. But, I
am looking
for a JCL job step type of solution. In the ported tools
page, I see a link
for sha command, but not for md5.
Apology if this question sounds too basic; been a while since
I have been
away from z/OS.
N
Java comes with z/OS for no cost (other than the CPU to run it). A fast
Google search turned up this code:
import java.security.*;
import java.math.*;
public class MD5 {
public static void main(String args[]) throws Exception{
String s=This is a test;
MessageDigest m=MessageDigest.getInstance(MD5);
m.update(s.getBytes(),0,s.length());
System.out.println(MD5: +new BigInteger(1,m.digest()).toString(16));
}
}
Put it in a UNIX file named MD5.java and compile it with javac MD5.java.
The result is MD5.class, which you can execute as java MD5.class input.file
and it will print out the md5sum of the file. For batch, use JZOS, which comes
as part of IBM's Java installation. Example JCL is in:
/usr/lpp/java/J5.0/mvstools/samples/jcl
--
John McKown
Systems Engineer IV
IT
Administrative Services Group
HealthMarkets(r)
9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010
(817) 255-3225 phone *
john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com
Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or
proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact
the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the
insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance
Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The
MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM
--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO
Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
On Tue, 22 Nov 2011 23:15:07 +0530, #3240;#3262;#3223;#3271;#3254;#3277; #3256;#3265;#3244;#3277;#3248;#3257;#3277;#3246;#3235;#3277;#3247; (N wrote: Yes, CSNBOWH does MD5. In the syntax for this function, the input is to be provided is expected to be a string; not a file. I did say SMOP. There's a customary procedure for converting a file to a string; it's called read(). -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
I'm an idiot again. That is just an example. It doesn't actually process an
input file. But hopefully it is of some use for thinking about the problem.
John McKown
Systems Engineer IV
IT
Administrative Services Group
HealthMarkets(r)
9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010
(817) 255-3225 phone *
john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com
Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or
proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact
the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the
insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance
Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The
MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM
-Original Message-
From: McKown, John
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 11:57 AM
To: 'IBM Mainframe Discussion List'
Subject: RE: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List
[mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of ?? ???
(Nagesh S)
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 11:24 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
Subject: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
Hi,
How do I obtain the md5sum of a file located in USS directory ?
I have come across the CSNBOWH callable ICSF function. But, I
am looking
for a JCL job step type of solution. In the ported tools
page, I see a link
for sha command, but not for md5.
Apology if this question sounds too basic; been a while since
I have been
away from z/OS.
N
Java comes with z/OS for no cost (other than the CPU to run
it). A fast Google search turned up this code:
import java.security.*;
import java.math.*;
public class MD5 {
public static void main(String args[]) throws Exception{
String s=This is a test;
MessageDigest m=MessageDigest.getInstance(MD5);
m.update(s.getBytes(),0,s.length());
System.out.println(MD5: +new
BigInteger(1,m.digest()).toString(16));
}
}
Put it in a UNIX file named MD5.java and compile it with
javac MD5.java. The result is MD5.class, which you can
execute as java MD5.class input.file and it will print out
the md5sum of the file. For batch, use JZOS, which comes as
part of IBM's Java installation. Example JCL is in:
/usr/lpp/java/J5.0/mvstools/samples/jcl
--
John McKown
Systems Engineer IV
IT
Administrative Services Group
HealthMarkets(r)
9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010
(817) 255-3225 phone *
john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com
Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain
confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the
intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail
and destroy all copies of the original message.
HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten
and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets,
Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West
National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA
Life and Health Insurance Company.SM
--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO
Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
I wanted to use Java (http://code.google.com/p/guava-libraries/) as a last
resort. So, perhaps REXX calling CSNBOWH is the option to go.
If only md5um were also available as ported tools, it would have served my
purpose of checking the sums also.
SMOP...I didn't know it was internet acronym !
N
On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 11:37 PM, McKown, John
john.mck...@healthmarkets.com wrote:
I'm an idiot again. That is just an example. It doesn't actually process
an input file. But hopefully it is of some use for thinking about the
problem.
John McKown
Systems Engineer IV
IT
Administrative Services Group
HealthMarkets(r)
9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010
(817) 255-3225 phone *
john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com
Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or
proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please
contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original
message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and
issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake
Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of
TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM
-Original Message-
From: McKown, John
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 11:57 AM
To: 'IBM Mainframe Discussion List'
Subject: RE: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List
[mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of ?? ???
(Nagesh S)
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 11:24 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
Subject: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
Hi,
How do I obtain the md5sum of a file located in USS directory ?
I have come across the CSNBOWH callable ICSF function. But, I
am looking
for a JCL job step type of solution. In the ported tools
page, I see a link
for sha command, but not for md5.
Apology if this question sounds too basic; been a while since
I have been
away from z/OS.
N
Java comes with z/OS for no cost (other than the CPU to run
it). A fast Google search turned up this code:
import java.security.*;
import java.math.*;
public class MD5 {
public static void main(String args[]) throws Exception{
String s=This is a test;
MessageDigest m=MessageDigest.getInstance(MD5);
m.update(s.getBytes(),0,s.length());
System.out.println(MD5: +new
BigInteger(1,m.digest()).toString(16));
}
}
Put it in a UNIX file named MD5.java and compile it with
javac MD5.java. The result is MD5.class, which you can
execute as java MD5.class input.file and it will print out
the md5sum of the file. For batch, use JZOS, which comes as
part of IBM's Java installation. Example JCL is in:
/usr/lpp/java/J5.0/mvstools/samples/jcl
--
John McKown
Systems Engineer IV
IT
Administrative Services Group
HealthMarkets(r)
9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010
(817) 255-3225 phone *
john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com
Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain
confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the
intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail
and destroy all copies of the original message.
HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten
and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets,
Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West
National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA
Life and Health Insurance Company.SM
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Re: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
Another Google search turned up the fact that this code (actually some other
code that is very similar to this) would omit leading zeroes when it prints the
md5 hash. That information might also be of some use to anyone thinking of
using the code. Some strings that should produce a hash with a leading zero
are: minute, hash, a and shuttle. Thanks for posting the code. It gives
me something a lot more useful than a hello world program to toy around with
java with.
Bill
On Tue, 22 Nov 2011 12:07:18 -0600, John McKown wrote:
I'm an idiot again. That is just an example. It doesn't actually process an
input file. But hopefully it is of some use for thinking about the problem.
John McKown
-- snip --
Java comes with z/OS for no cost (other than the CPU to run
it). A fast Google search turned up this code:
import java.security.*;
import java.math.*;
public class MD5 {
public static void main(String args[]) throws Exception{
String s=This is a test;
MessageDigest m=MessageDigest.getInstance(MD5);
m.update(s.getBytes(),0,s.length());
System.out.println(MD5: +new
BigInteger(1,m.digest()).toString(16));
}
}
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Re: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
For your last resort, I found a Java program for this, that I have briefly tested on Linux and Windows. At this website: http://www.rgagnon.com/howto.html Click on Security, then click on Create a checksum Copy and paste the program to your editor. Change this line: System.out.println(getMD5Checksum(apache-tomcat-5.5.17.exe)); to this: System.out.println(getMD5Checksum(args[0])+ +args[0]); Save as MD5Checksum.java Compile javac MD5Checksum.java It will work kind of like md5sum, but only one file per run. java MD5Checksum file_name Bill On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 00:28:16 +0530, N wrote: I wanted to use Java (http://code.google.com/p/guava-libraries/) as a last resort. So, perhaps REXX calling CSNBOWH is the option to go. If only md5um were also available as ported tools, it would have served my purpose of checking the sums also. SMOP...I didn't know it was internet acronym ! N --snip-- -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of ?? ??? (Nagesh S) Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 11:24 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: MD5 hash of a USS file ? Hi, How do I obtain the md5sum of a file located in USS directory ? I have come across the CSNBOWH callable ICSF function. But, I am looking for a JCL job step type of solution. In the ported tools page, I see a link for sha command, but not for md5. Apology if this question sounds too basic; been a while since I have been away from z/OS. N -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: MD5 hash of a USS file ?
Hello Bill,
Thanks for the tip on the leading zeros part. Something to keep in mind
when using this code ...
N
On Wed, Nov 23, 2011 at 3:32 AM, Bill Godfrey yak36...@yahoo.com wrote:
Another Google search turned up the fact that this code (actually some
other code that is very similar to this) would omit leading zeroes when it
prints the md5 hash. That information might also be of some use to anyone
thinking of using the code. Some strings that should produce a hash with a
leading zero are: minute, hash, a and shuttle. Thanks for posting
the code. It gives me something a lot more useful than a hello world
program to toy around with java with.
Bill
On Tue, 22 Nov 2011 12:07:18 -0600, John McKown wrote:
I'm an idiot again. That is just an example. It doesn't actually process
an input file. But hopefully it is of some use for thinking about the
problem.
John McKown
-- snip --
Java comes with z/OS for no cost (other than the CPU to run
it). A fast Google search turned up this code:
import java.security.*;
import java.math.*;
public class MD5 {
public static void main(String args[]) throws Exception{
String s=This is a test;
MessageDigest m=MessageDigest.getInstance(MD5);
m.update(s.getBytes(),0,s.length());
System.out.println(MD5: +new
BigInteger(1,m.digest()).toString(16));
}
}
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Re: USS
On 19/11/2011 09:12 AM, Mike Schwab wrote: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Major_religious_groups 2 Billion Christians, 1.5 Billion Muslims, 1 Billion Hindus, 0.5 Billion Buddists, 0.5 Billion Chinese Folk religions, 0.5 Billion other Folk religions, 0.050 Billion Shinto, 0.025 Billion Sikhs, 0.015 Billion Jews, 0.011 Billion Jains, Several others under 0.010 Billion. Oddities: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rastafari_movement about 700,000 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pastafarianism maybe 10,000. Neither the 2 billion christians, (consider the Inquistation, the Roman vs Protestant in Ireland), nor 1.5 billion muslims (Sunni vs Shia) can be considered homogenous religous groupings . As I''ve probably offended many I will make the following comment. If you consider the 2 billion christians et al to be one grouping then in some lights you should aggregrate the various monotheistic christian, muslim and jewish sects into the same religion as basically the follow the same god. Ken -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: USS
On Sat, Nov 19, 2011 at 4:05 AM, Ken Brick kbr...@netspace.net.au wrote: On 19/11/2011 09:12 AM, Mike Schwab wrote: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Major_religious_groups 2 Billion Christians, 1.5 Billion Muslims, 1 Billion Hindus, 0.5 Billion Buddists, 0.5 Billion Chinese Folk religions, 0.5 Billion other Folk religions, 0.050 Billion Shinto, 0.025 Billion Sikhs, 0.015 Billion Jews, 0.011 Billion Jains, Several others under 0.010 Billion. Oddities: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rastafari_movement about 700,000 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pastafarianism maybe 10,000. Neither the 2 billion christians, (consider the Inquistation, the Roman vs Protestant in Ireland), nor 1.5 billion muslims (Sunni vs Shia) can be considered homogenous religous groupings . As I''ve probably offended many I will make the following comment. If you consider the 2 billion christians et al to be one grouping then in some lights you should aggregrate the various monotheistic christian, muslim and jewish sects into the same religion as basically the follow the same god. Ken http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abrahamic_religions Yep. I always like the scene in The Shoes of The Fisherman where Anthony Quinn playing the recently elected but unrecognized pope starts performing the Catholic last rites then switches to the Jewish version. -- Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: USS
On Sat, 19 Nov 2011 06:22:33 -0600, Mike Schwab wrote: ... Yep. I always like the scene in The Shoes of The Fisherman where Anthony Quinn playing the recently elected but unrecognized pope starts performing the Catholic last rites then switches to the Jewish version. Daaarrrennn! -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: USS
Ok, kill this thread now! I'm going to start setting folks to NOPOST status. Darren -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: USS
Thank you!!! --Original Message-- From: Darren Evans-Young Sender: IBM Mainframe Discussion List To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu ReplyTo: IBM Mainframe Discussion List Subject: Re: USS Sent: Nov 19, 2011 11:23 AM Ok, kill this thread now! I'm going to start setting folks to NOPOST status. Darren -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: USS
In 1321498401.83371.yahoomailmob...@web161405.mail.bf1.yahoo.com, on 11/16/2011 at 06:53 PM, Ed Gould ps2...@yahoo.com said: Shhh the acronym causes certain people to become rabid. Ted being one of them. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: USS
In 1839031969-1321497845-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-2050937286-@b11.c1.bise6.blackberry, on 11/17/2011 at 02:44 AM, Ted MacNEIL eamacn...@yahoo.ca said: Can't anybody give this a rest? Physician, heal thyself! What is 'official' John is official enough for me; he's certainly a more reliable source than you. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Terminology RE: USS
In a6b9336cdb62bb46b9f8708e686a7ea00b038bb...@nrhmms8p02.uicnrh.dom, on 11/18/2011 at 08:02 AM, McKown, John john.mck...@healthmarkets.com said: #! is normally pronounced shebang in UNIX. I guess a verbal slurring of hash bang together. I doubt it; my guiess is that the term is short for shell bang; it's used with the file of a shell or language processor, e.g., bash, Perl. #!/usr/bin/perl -W -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Terminology RE: USS
In blu0-smtp306b2a2bcc8f2e7c954f8cfb6...@phx.gbl, on 11/18/2011 at 07:57 AM, Ken Hume IBM kph...@live.com said: We always called the * a splat. I believe that is the norm in EUnix circles. Likewise bang for ! and shebang for #!. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Terminology RE: USS
Out --Original Message-- From: Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) Sender: IBM Mainframe Discussion List To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu ReplyTo: IBM Mainframe Discussion List Subject: Re: Terminology RE: USS Sent: Nov 19, 2011 7:17 PM In blu0-smtp306b2a2bcc8f2e7c954f8cfb6...@phx.gbl, on 11/18/2011 at 07:57 AM, Ken Hume IBM kph...@live.com said: We always called the * a splat. I believe that is the norm in EUnix circles. Likewise bang for ! and shebang for #!. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Terminology RE: USS
In CAPD5F5oUn2kUFagRyQ4CG8JGcNfhuVYF3M1=4dqff05kon7...@mail.gmail.com, on 11/18/2011 at 09:14 AM, John Gilmore johnwgilmore0...@gmail.com said: '' and '' are often called broken brackets. The ALGOL definition document, for example, uses this term, as do many descriptions of BNF. Neither REPORT ON THE ALGORITHMIC LANGUAGE ALGOL 60 nor Revised Report on ALGOL 60 use the term broken bracket. Perhaps you are confusing broken bracket with bracket. There is a term brocket in the Hacker's Dictionary that appears in a lot of other jargon files, but I found no sign of anybody actually using the term when defining a new language. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Terminology RE: USS
Out --Original Message-- From: Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) Sender: IBM Mainframe Discussion List To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu ReplyTo: IBM Mainframe Discussion List Subject: Re: Terminology RE: USS Sent: Nov 19, 2011 9:23 PM In CAPD5F5oUn2kUFagRyQ4CG8JGcNfhuVYF3M1=4dqff05kon7...@mail.gmail.com, on 11/18/2011 at 09:14 AM, John Gilmore johnwgilmore0...@gmail.com said: '' and '' are often called broken brackets. The ALGOL definition document, for example, uses this term, as do many descriptions of BNF. Neither REPORT ON THE ALGORITHMIC LANGUAGE ALGOL 60 nor Revised Report on ALGOL 60 use the term broken bracket. Perhaps you are confusing broken bracket with bracket. There is a term brocket in the Hacker's Dictionary that appears in a lot of other jargon files, but I found no sign of anybody actually using the term when defining a new language. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Terminology RE: USS
On 18 November 2011 11:01, John Gilmore johnwgilmore0...@gmail.com wrote: This 'Shebang'---There is of course another one--- is not just a verbal slurring of 'Hash Bang'. It has a much more elegant name. It is a conflation. Consider, just in English, to which they are not confined, o Edmund Spenser: wrizzled (wrinkled + frizzled) o Shakespeare: glaze (glare + gaze) o· Lewis Carroll: slithy (slimy, lithe), chortle (chuckle, snort), snark (snake, shark), galumph (gallop, triumph) They have a long, much (even too much) discussed literary history under this rubric, and Carroll talks about them repeatedly in his letters to Ellen Terry. I am surprised at conflation being used this way. I understand conflation to carry implication of at least some degree of error or confusion, intentional or otherwise. This etymology of Shebang may well involve conflation, but the word itself is surely better called by Carroll's now quite standard term portmanteau. Tony H. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: USS
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Graham Hobbs
What's a TLA?
In the context below, TLA is Three Letter Acronym.
-jc-
- Original Message -
[ snip ]
Brackets? Oh, you mean parentheses: ( )
Brackets are: [ ] (not square brackets, just brackets)
Braces are: { } (not curly braces, just braces)
Another common use for obscure terms.
When I was in high school English brackets was an acceptable term.
When I took FORTRAN brackets was an acceptable term.
When I took C square brackets and curly (brackets or braces) were
acceptable terms.
My profs used them.
Why, after almost 40 years, why do we have more retroactve
corrections?
Like that other TLA, that shall remain nameless, even though it was
used
for almost 15 years before some self-appointed pedants started
taking upon
themselves to preach.
-
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Re: Terminology RE: USS
John McKown writes: | I never heard of broken brackets for and . Just less than and greater than. Context is all! In such notation as decimal digit ::= 0|1|2|3|4|5|6|7|8|9 '' and '' are often called broken brackets. The ALGOL definition document, for example, uses this term, as do many descriptions of BNF. John Gilmore, Ashland, MA 01721 - USA -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Terminology RE: USS
I never knew how to call this sign correctly:
in Germany, it's simply called: und (that's: and)
or Kaufmanns und, that is, merchant's and.
Almost nobody here knows what an ampersand is.
But some day one of my co-workers called it Brezel -
you know, what a brezel is? Look here:
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brezel
This is very descriptive, IMO, so I now prefer to call it brezel,
which is kind of accepted in the community here :-)
Have a nice weekend,
regards
Bernd
Am 18.11.2011 15:02, schrieb McKown, John:
Since it is now Friday, how about
/ is a solidus, aka a slash
\ is a reverse solidus, aka a backslash
# is an octhothrope, aka a hash mark or pound sign. Not to be confused with pound
sterling sign.
! is a bang - I learned that long ago in college on a Xerox Sigma 7 system.
#! is normally pronounced shebang in UNIX. I guess a verbal slurring of hash
bang together.
When speaking, I often say square bracket and curly brace (open or close) just
because people often don't know a brace from a bracket from a parenthesis. And let's not even talk about
carets ^. And what is the proper word for that PL/1 not sign ¬ ?
I never heard of broken brackets for and. Just less than and greater
than.
--
John McKown
Systems Engineer IV
IT
Administrative Services Group
HealthMarkets®
9151 Boulevard 26 . N. Richland Hills . TX 76010
(817) 255-3225 phone .
john.mck...@healthmarkets.com . www.HealthMarkets.com
Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or
proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact
the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
HealthMarkets® is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the
insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance
Company®, Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA
Life and Health Insurance Company.SM
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List
[mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Ted MacNEIL
Sent: Thursday, November 17, 2011 4:36 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
Subject: Re: USS
Brackets? Oh, you mean parentheses: ( )
Brackets are: [ ] (not square brackets, just brackets)
Braces are: { } (not curly braces, just braces)
Another common use for obscure terms.
When I was in high school English brackets was an acceptable term.
When I took FORTRAN brackets was an acceptable term.
When I took C square brackets and curly (brackets or braces)
were acceptable terms.
My profs used them.
Why, after almost 40 years, why do we have more retroactve
corrections?
Like that other TLA, that shall remain nameless, even though
it was used for almost 15 years before some self-appointed
pedants started taking upon themselves to preach.
-
Ted MacNEIL
eamacn...@yahoo.ca
Twitter: @TedMacNEIL
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Re: Terminology RE: USS
We always called the * a splat.
Ken Hume
IBM PD Tools Client Advocate
(720)396-7776
kph...@us.ibm.com
On 11/18/2011 7:02 AM, McKown, John wrote:
Since it is now Friday, how about
/ is a solidus, aka a slash
\ is a reverse solidus, aka a backslash
# is an octhothrope, aka a hash mark or pound sign. Not to be confused with pound
sterling sign.
! is a bang - I learned that long ago in college on a Xerox Sigma 7 system.
#! is normally pronounced shebang in UNIX. I guess a verbal slurring of hash
bang together.
When speaking, I often say square bracket and curly brace (open or close) just
because people often don't know a brace from a bracket from a parenthesis. And let's not even talk about
carets ^. And what is the proper word for that PL/1 not sign ¬ ?
I never heard of broken brackets for and. Just less than and greater
than.
--
John McKown
Systems Engineer IV
IT
Administrative Services Group
HealthMarkets®
9151 Boulevard 26 . N. Richland Hills . TX 76010
(817) 255-3225 phone .
john.mck...@healthmarkets.com . www.HealthMarkets.com
Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or
proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact
the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
HealthMarkets® is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the
insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance
Company®, Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA
Life and Health Insurance Company.SM
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List
[mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Ted MacNEIL
Sent: Thursday, November 17, 2011 4:36 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
Subject: Re: USS
Brackets? Oh, you mean parentheses: ( )
Brackets are: [ ] (not square brackets, just brackets)
Braces are: { } (not curly braces, just braces)
Another common use for obscure terms.
When I was in high school English brackets was an acceptable term.
When I took FORTRAN brackets was an acceptable term.
When I took C square brackets and curly (brackets or braces)
were acceptable terms.
My profs used them.
Why, after almost 40 years, why do we have more retroactve
corrections?
Like that other TLA, that shall remain nameless, even though
it was used for almost 15 years before some self-appointed
pedants started taking upon themselves to preach.
-
Ted MacNEIL
eamacn...@yahoo.ca
Twitter: @TedMacNEIL
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Re: Terminology RE: USS
Since the point of this thread is pedantry, that's octothorpe, and PL/I. On Fri, Nov 18, 2011 at 9:02 AM, McKown, John john.mck...@healthmarkets.com wrote: Since it is now Friday, how about / is a solidus, aka a slash \ is a reverse solidus, aka a backslash # is an octhothrope, aka a hash mark or pound sign. Not to be confused with pound sterling sign. ! is a bang - I learned that long ago in college on a Xerox Sigma 7 system. #! is normally pronounced shebang in UNIX. I guess a verbal slurring of hash bang together. -- zMan -- I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: USS
John Chase wrote: | In the context below, TLA is Three Letter Acronym. and that is certainly true in the context that follows. The acronym---I very much like but will not repeat the nonce word anacronym', an anachronistic acronym?---TLA itself does, however, have the defect that it is also used as an acronym for Two-Letter Acronym, as in UK for United Kingdom or US for United States. Then, at the outer edge of usefulness, it can also stand for Ten-Letter Acronym, as in YMMVALITUS for Your Mileage May Vary At Least In The United States. (Twenty- and Thirty-Letter Acronyms need not, I think, detain us here. They are too hard to remember.) John Gilmore, Ashland, MA 01721 - USA -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: USS
USS - United Star Ship I've got a mainframe and I'm not afraid to use it TImOTHY Hillock EC/EDI PROGRAMMER/ANALYST Electronic Gateway Services (Tax ESD) -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Ken Brick Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2011 10:43 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: USS Folks, If people folllowed the principles used in academia et al, as I understand them, the first usage of a term is spelt out in full followed by in brackets the acromyn or abbreviation that will be used through the paper. For example Unix System Services (USS) United States Ship (USS) Then no one has a valid cause of complaint Ken -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Terminology RE: USS
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Bernd Oppolzer I never knew how to call this sign correctly: in Germany, it's simply called: und (that's: and) or Kaufmanns und, that is, merchant's and. Almost nobody here knows what an ampersand is. But some day one of my co-workers called it Brezel - you know, what a brezel is? Look here: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brezel In English we spell it pretzel. Frequently served with beer (bier?). The ampersand rather closely resembles a pretzel (brezel). :-) -jc- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Terminology RE: USS
John McKown writes: I never heard of broken brackets for and . Just less than and greater than. You probably never heard of Left Banana , Right Banana for ( and ) then? :-) Mike X, a great dba and all around great guy I worked with many years ago used to use those terms for (). scootchie left and scootchie right was his chosen terms for getting you to move the cursor. Ian. http://www.cicsworld.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: USS
Seeing that it is Friday, we can put the issue to vote and let the democratic process decide for us? Cast vote here : http://cicsworld.com/node/3827 Ian Folks, If people folllowed the principles used in academia et al, as I understand them, the first usage of a term is spelt out in full followed by in brackets the acromyn or abbreviation that will be used through the paper. For example Unix System Services (USS) United States Ship (USS) Then no one has a valid cause of complaint Ken -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Terminology RE: USS
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Ian Sent: Friday, November 18, 2011 10:51 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Terminology RE: USS John McKown writes: I never heard of broken brackets for and . Just less than and greater than. You probably never heard of Left Banana , Right Banana for ( and ) then? :-) Mike X, a great dba and all around great guy I worked with many years ago used to use those terms for (). scootchie left and scootchie right was his chosen terms for getting you to move the cursor. Ian. http://www.cicsworld.com No, I hadn't. But I __like__ it. Formal adoption in progress! -- John McKown Systems Engineer IV IT Administrative Services Group HealthMarkets(r) 9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010 (817) 255-3225 phone * john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. HealthMarkets(r) is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance Company(r), Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: USS
On 11/18/2011 10:04 AM, Ian wrote: Seeing that it is Friday, we can put the issue to vote and let the democratic process decide for us? Cast vote here : http://cicsworld.com/node/3827 Ah. The tyranny of the majority? You know, 50,000,000 Frenchmen (or any other nationality or group) _can_ be wrong. Ian Folks, If people folllowed the principles used in academia et al, as I understand them, the first usage of a term is spelt out in full followed by in brackets the acromyn or abbreviation that will be used through the paper. For example Unix System Services (USS) United States Ship (USS) Then no one has a valid cause of complaint Ken -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. 303-355-2752 http://www.trainersfriend.com * To get a good Return on your Investment, first make an investment! + Training your people is an excellent investment * Try our tool for calculating your Return On Investment for training dollars at http://www.trainersfriend.com/ROI/roi.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
