AUTO: Victor Boyarintsev is out of the office. (returning 20.09.2010)

[Victor Boyarintsev]

I am out of the office until 20.09.2010.

I will respond to your message when I return.
In urgent cases please contact my manager, Sergey Ludushkin.


Note: This is an automated response to your message  "IBMVM Digest - 14 Sep
2010 to 15 Sep 2010 (#2010-237)" sent on 16/9/10 9:12:45.

This is the only notification you will receive while this person is away.

Re: VSM - TCPIP

[Jim Bohnsack]

 IBM-I've Been Moved---even if not relocated.

Jim

On 9/15/2010 9:28 PM, Chip Davis wrote:

And I guess Scott has the honor of the last IBMVM problem solved by
Alan as a developer... :-/

I hope Alan enjoys the "deeper, more direct experience" he's going to
have with us.  If it weren't for all the traveling...

-Chip-


--
James Bohnsack
(972) 596-6377 home/office
(972) 342-5823 cell

Re: VSM - TCPIP

[Chip Davis]

And I guess Scott has the honor of the last IBMVM problem solved by 
Alan as a developer... :-/


I hope Alan enjoys the "deeper, more direct experience" he's going to 
have with us.  If it weren't for all the traveling...


-Chip-

On 9/16/10 00:30 Scott Rohling said:
Ok - #1 helps a little (but I'm assuming a real user can end up by 
itself on a line too)  - #2 a bit more (yes, sneaky) - #3 even more, but 
probably going a little far unless I'm going for 6 Sigma or something  
:-)Probably will stick with tossing VSM user cuz I'm a lazy old cuss. 

The good news for me is now I know why it's there and why I'm excluding 
it ...   so..  thanks again...


Scott Rohling 



On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 6:10 PM, Alan Altmark > wrote:


On Wednesday, 09/15/2010 at 07:46 EDT, Scott Rohling
mailto:scott.rohl...@gmail.com>> wrote:
 > Ok - so this is about linemode sessions.   And yeah - I get the
crickets
- who
 > the heck uses linemode?   I suppose it fits.   I always have a
grin on
my face
 > when I explain virtual reader/punch/printer to non-z/VM folk.
 >
 > The consistency factor is me expecting the first word in front of the
dash (-)
 > to be a guest name.   So I still think Q VSM would be better than
stuffing it
 > into Q NAMES where I'm looking for guest names and their status.
  But
no one
 > asked me..  hmmph
 >
 > Sounds like I get my list of running guests by ignoring VSM..  
 Keeping

my
 > fingers crossed no one names a guest VSM until I retire   :-)

Perhaps it would help to know that all VSMs
1. Appear on a separate line of output on QUERY NAMES
2. Have the '-' in column 9.  User IDs have it in column 10.  (Sneaky,
huh?)
3. Can be seen via "CP QUERY IUCV *CCS"

Alan Altmark
z/VM Development (T minus 3h 50m)
IBM Endicott

Re: VSM - TCPIP

[Scott Rohling]

Ok - #1 helps a little (but I'm assuming a real user can end up by itself on
a line too)  - #2 a bit more (yes, sneaky) - #3 even more, but probably
going a little far unless I'm going for 6 Sigma or something  :-)
Probably will stick with tossing VSM user cuz I'm a lazy old cuss.

The good news for me is now I know why it's there and why I'm excluding it
...   so..  thanks again...

Scott Rohling


On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 6:10 PM, Alan Altmark wrote:

> On Wednesday, 09/15/2010 at 07:46 EDT, Scott Rohling
>  wrote:
> > Ok - so this is about linemode sessions.   And yeah - I get the crickets
> - who
> > the heck uses linemode?   I suppose it fits.   I always have a grin on
> my face
> > when I explain virtual reader/punch/printer to non-z/VM folk.
> >
> > The consistency factor is me expecting the first word in front of the
> dash (-)
> > to be a guest name.   So I still think Q VSM would be better than
> stuffing it
> > into Q NAMES where I'm looking for guest names and their status.   But
> no one
> > asked me..  hmmph
> >
> > Sounds like I get my list of running guests by ignoring VSM..Keeping
> my
> > fingers crossed no one names a guest VSM until I retire   :-)
>
> Perhaps it would help to know that all VSMs
> 1. Appear on a separate line of output on QUERY NAMES
> 2. Have the '-' in column 9.  User IDs have it in column 10.  (Sneaky,
> huh?)
> 3. Can be seen via "CP QUERY IUCV *CCS"
>
> Alan Altmark
> z/VM Development (T minus 3h 50m)
> IBM Endicott
>

Re: VSM - TCPIP

[Rich Smrcina]

 On 09/15/2010 05:57 PM, Alan Altmark wrote:

Alan Altmark
z/VM Development (T minus 05h 05m 42s and counting...)
IBM Endicott


Hours?  How time flies...

--
Rich Smrcina
Velocity Software, Inc.
Mobile: 414-491-6001
Office: 262-392-3717
http://www.velocitysoftware.com

Catch the WAVV! http://www.wavv.org
WAVV 2011 - April 15-19, 2011 Colorado Springs, CO

Re: VSM - TCPIP

[Alan Altmark]

On Wednesday, 09/15/2010 at 07:46 EDT, Scott Rohling 
 wrote:
> Ok - so this is about linemode sessions.   And yeah - I get the crickets 
- who 
> the heck uses linemode?   I suppose it fits.   I always have a grin on 
my face 
> when I explain virtual reader/punch/printer to non-z/VM folk.
> 
> The consistency factor is me expecting the first word in front of the 
dash (-) 
> to be a guest name.   So I still think Q VSM would be better than 
stuffing it 
> into Q NAMES where I'm looking for guest names and their status.   But 
no one 
> asked me..  hmmph
> 
> Sounds like I get my list of running guests by ignoring VSM..Keeping 
my 
> fingers crossed no one names a guest VSM until I retire   :-)

Perhaps it would help to know that all VSMs
1. Appear on a separate line of output on QUERY NAMES
2. Have the '-' in column 9.  User IDs have it in column 10.  (Sneaky, 
huh?)
3. Can be seen via "CP QUERY IUCV *CCS" 

Alan Altmark
z/VM Development (T minus 3h 50m)
IBM Endicott

Re: VSM - TCPIP

[Scott Rohling]

Ok - so this is about linemode sessions.   And yeah - I get the crickets -
who the heck uses linemode?   I suppose it fits.   I always have a grin on
my face when I explain virtual reader/punch/printer to non-z/VM folk.

The consistency factor is me expecting the first word in front of the dash
(-) to be a guest name.   So I still think Q VSM would be better than
stuffing it into Q NAMES where I'm looking for guest names and their
status.   But no one asked me..  hmmph

Sounds like I get my list of running guests by ignoring VSM..Keeping my
fingers crossed no one names a guest VSM until I retire   :-)

Thanks David and Alan --  as always - I keep learning from you -

Scott Rohling


On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 4:57 PM, Alan Altmark wrote:

> On Wednesday, 09/15/2010 at 06:35 EDT, Scott Rohling
>  wrote:
> > Just wondering if anyone else sees the value in finding "VSM -
> TCPIP" as an
> > entry when doing a 'CP QUERY NAMES'.
>
> I do, I do!
>
> > This is described as being the users of
> > the VTAM service machine ...   As someone who often writes system
> utilities
> > which do a QUERY NAMES to find the active users - this is always
> something I
> > have to code around.  I know there are still SNA users out there, but
> have
> > always wondered if it's still relevant or even consistent to list it
> under
> > QUERY NAMES (rather than say, a QUERY VSM cmd)?Always interested in
> > learning from other listers...  I'm sure I'm missing something that
> pulls it
> > all together.
>
> VM TCP/IP uses the same *CCS interface for linemode telnet sessions as
> VTAM does for its terminal sessions.  The VM book "VSM" references were
> all added back in VM/SP R4, and so predate any VM "recognition"
> (politically) of TCP/IP.  To make it a bit worse, CP can't really tell the
> difference between VTAM and TCP/IP in this regard.
>
> But *I* know what VSMs "VTAM" and "TCPIP" do and so know how to interpret
> the users I see following each VSM.
>
> I mean, haven't you thought it a bit strange that CP DISABLE SNA will stop
> linemode telnet sessions?!?  Haven't you?   Hello?  
>
> Alan Altmark
> z/VM Development (T minus 05h 05m 42s and counting...)
> IBM Endicott
>

Re: VSM - TCPIP

[Alan Altmark]

On Wednesday, 09/15/2010 at 06:35 EDT, Scott Rohling 
 wrote:
> Just wondering if anyone else sees the value in finding "VSM - 
TCPIP" as an 
> entry when doing a 'CP QUERY NAMES'.

I do, I do!

> This is described as being the users of 
> the VTAM service machine ...   As someone who often writes system 
utilities 
> which do a QUERY NAMES to find the active users - this is always 
something I 
> have to code around.  I know there are still SNA users out there, but 
have 
> always wondered if it's still relevant or even consistent to list it 
under 
> QUERY NAMES (rather than say, a QUERY VSM cmd)?Always interested in 
> learning from other listers...  I'm sure I'm missing something that 
pulls it 
> all together.

VM TCP/IP uses the same *CCS interface for linemode telnet sessions as 
VTAM does for its terminal sessions.  The VM book "VSM" references were 
all added back in VM/SP R4, and so predate any VM "recognition" 
(politically) of TCP/IP.  To make it a bit worse, CP can't really tell the 
difference between VTAM and TCP/IP in this regard.

But *I* know what VSMs "VTAM" and "TCPIP" do and so know how to interpret 
the users I see following each VSM.

I mean, haven't you thought it a bit strange that CP DISABLE SNA will stop 
linemode telnet sessions?!?  Haven't you?   Hello?   

Alan Altmark
z/VM Development (T minus 05h 05m 42s and counting...)
IBM Endicott

Re: VSM - TCPIP

[David Boyes]

VM Tcp uses the VTAM linemode console support to do linemode telnet (not 
tn3270) support. Do a telnet to your VM system and log in, then do a q names. 
You'll see 

user - TCPIPn

as a 'terminal id'.

At the time that code was written, I don't think LDEVs did line mode and there 
was a requirement to support plain telnet so they grabbed the SNA console 
support which did, thus the VSM indicator.

It's handy for doing system automation stuff - much easier to drive from 
Programs than LDEVs.







On Sep 15, 2010, at 6:40 PM, "Scott Rohling"  wrote:

> Just wondering if anyone else sees the value in finding "VSM - TCPIP" as 
> an entry when doing a 'CP QUERY NAMES'.   This is described as being the 
> users of the VTAM service machine ...   As someone who often writes system 
> utilities which do a QUERY NAMES to find the active users - this is always 
> something I have to code around.  I know there are still SNA users out there, 
> but have always wondered if it's still relevant or even consistent to list it 
> under QUERY NAMES (rather than say, a QUERY VSM cmd)?Always interested in 
> learning from other listers...  I'm sure I'm missing something that pulls it 
> all together.
> 
> Scott Rohling

Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests

[Dave Jones]

Hi, Daniel.

The answer to your first question is to use the CP FORCE command (HELP
CP FORCE will tell you all about it.) The VM user id issuing the FORCE
command needs to have privilege class A as well.  Usually this is done
from either MAINT or OPERATOR.

The answer to your second question is a bit more difficult, I'm afraid.
As Marcy has already suggested, what does a Q SRM command show? My first
guess would be that your SLES11 guest is falling into Q3 and never given
an opportunity to run.

To find out *why* the guest is not able to run, you need the services of
a good z/VM performance monitor.IBM offers the Performance Monitor
(it comes bundles with z/VM, but it's an extra cost offering) and
Velocity Software (http://www.velocity-software.com/) has a very good
suite of products as well. IMHO it' practically impossible to run a
modern production grade z/VM-zLinux system without a good performance
monitor to help solve issues like the one your having now.

On 09/15/2010 05:14 PM, Daniel Tate wrote:
> We're starting to run apps on the servers now.  From time to time a
> guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not
> respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11).   not
> even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged.   from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD
> shows no appreciable load.
> 
> Two questions from this:
> 
> 1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user?  Is this possible?
> 2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization
> as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be?
> 

-- 
Dave Jones
V/Soft Software
www.vsoft-software.com
Houston, TX
281.578.7544

VSM - TCPIP

[Scott Rohling]

Just wondering if anyone else sees the value in finding "VSM - TCPIP" as
an entry when doing a 'CP QUERY NAMES'.   This is described as being the
users of the VTAM service machine ...   As someone who often writes system
utilities which do a QUERY NAMES to find the active users - this is always
something I have to code around.  I know there are still SNA users out
there, but have always wondered if it's still relevant or even consistent to
list it under QUERY NAMES (rather than say, a QUERY VSM cmd)?Always
interested in learning from other listers...  I'm sure I'm missing something
that pulls it all together.

Scott Rohling

Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests

[Mike At HammockTree]

When you do the IND LOAD  (or just IND), does the E3 field have any non-zero 
number?
If yes, then you have formed a Eligible list.  You should investigate and 
understand the implications, but the "quick fix" is to set a more 
"reasonable" SRM STORBUFF value, for example:

CP SET SRM STORBUFF 300%  250%  200%
might be a reasonable starting point.  Use with a bit of caution as this may 
invite high paging rates if you have significantly overcommitted storage.


Mike

- Original Message - 
From: "Daniel Tate" 

To: 
Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2010 6:14 PM
Subject: CP unresponsive on certain guests



We're starting to run apps on the servers now.  From time to time a
guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not
respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11).   not
even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged.   from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD
shows no appreciable load.

Two questions from this:

1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user?  Is this 
possible?

2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization
as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be?

Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests

[Marcy Cortes]

Q SRM 

And let us know what that says.
 

-Original Message-
From: The IBM z/VM Operating System [mailto:ib...@listserv.uark.edu] On Behalf 
Of Daniel Tate
Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2010 3:15 PM
To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU
Subject: [IBMVM] CP unresponsive on certain guests

We're starting to run apps on the servers now.  From time to time a
guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not
respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11).   not
even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged.   from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD
shows no appreciable load.

Two questions from this:

1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user?  Is this possible?
2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization
as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be?

Re: CP unresponsive on certain guests

[McBride, Catherine]

FORCE username entered from another user name works well providing
"another user name" has the correct privileges. 

-Original Message-
From: The IBM z/VM Operating System [mailto:ib...@listserv.uark.edu] On
Behalf Of Daniel Tate
Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2010 5:15 PM
To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU
Subject: CP unresponsive on certain guests

We're starting to run apps on the servers now.  From time to time a
guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not
respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11).   not
even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged.   from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD
shows no appreciable load.

Two questions from this:

1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user?  Is this
possible?
2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization as
a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be?

CP unresponsive on certain guests

[Daniel Tate]

We're starting to run apps on the servers now.  From time to time a
guest will become unresponsive - to be more precise, ,the CP will not
respond to commands, and neither will the guest OS (SLES11).   not
even #CP LOGOFF is acknowledged.   from another login, CP INDIIC LOAD
shows no appreciable load.

Two questions from this:

1) how would I force a logoff of a user from another user?  Is this possible?
2) if we are not paging and the IFLs are not loaded (2-3% utilization
as a matter of fact) what could the bottleneck be?