Re: Re: [IceHorses] Pictures of Fjóla
Judy Ryder [EMAIL PROTECTED] kirjoitti: Today I got the first pictures of Fjóla. She looks really good! How tall is she? She was advertised as about 136 cm but might be smaller (I was also told my former horse was 136 cm and he was taller) You'll have to get some pictures of you riding her, and maybe some video of her gait! If I can get someone to film us :-) Also have to get a new saddle and someone to trim her to see what she really does. Although if I could get someone to film us now and then later it would be interesting to compare... Krisse
RE: [IceHorses] Hands:who would want one?
--- Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Typically it is American culture it seems that believes Ponies are for children Judging from the number of HUGE warmbloods, Friesians, Drafts, Draft crosses, Friesians, and Irish Draughts, etc. I see from Europe, I don't think that's uniquely American. In fact, a lot of the working QH/stock types the cowboys ride have typically been 14-15H - bigger than Icelandic's but certainly not huge. Karen Well its just my experience with meeting people from Europe and talking with them onlineit just seems like they have a more open attitude with adults riding ponies. Just last month a german woman (There are a lot of german people in hawaii...) who was interested in Icelandics, went ahead and bought a gypsy cob pony.and well lets just say she is not a small woman, nor is she short. She said a lot of adults in germany ride ponies for pleasure, for trail riding, for everyday use..it just my experience, not a scientific study. And if Icelandics were taller I would have an easier time selling them to adults. Some adults are put off because they are so short, and the ones who are not, well they get it and love them dearly. Of course I see it as a very good positive trait, as I am not off on a waring adventure with my horse, or want to go over 5 foot jumps. Skye Fire Island Farms Breeding Quality Icelandic Trail Horses Certified Farrier Services 'Natural Balance' Shoeing and Trimming. Founder, Navicular options for your horse. 808-640-6080
Re: [IceHorses] Sloping Shoulder / Skye
a sloping big shoulder and a neck that connects to the back of the withers Skye, do you have a picture of a sloping shoulder? What degree of slope is it? Well I do not have the degree, its in my eye. I know when I see it. I can send you pics of some horses over here...but I am working for the next 3 days and will not have tome until Sunday, then I would actually have to reminder on top of that. I will try. OK, looking forward to seeing pictures. It's hard for us to tell, thru email, just words, if we are all meaning the same thing. Having the picture and video medium is great! Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Hands: Pony or Horse
Height is not the determining factor as to whether it is a pony or not, just want to be sure that we're all on the same page with that. The almost 16 hand Icelandic is still a pony, and the 13 hand RMH is still a horse. http://iceryder.net/pony.html Ok then, would an adult be able to show their 13 hand RMH in a show? Probably not.I understand that height is not the determing factor, however it is what is used in our culture a lot. Skye Fire Island Farms Breeding Quality Icelandic Trail Horses Certified Farrier Services 'Natural Balance' Shoeing and Trimming. Founder, Navicular options for your horse. 808-640-6080
Re: [IceHorses] Hands: Pony or Horse
I'm not sure about current rules, but back in the day, adults were certainly showing both Arabs and Quarter Horses that did not stand 14.2. I had a friend who was very successful in both dressage and hunter classes on a tiny Arab mare and there was a retiree at a nearby boarding facility that had been a very successful show horse. I doubt ths little Arab was 13.3. I do know that there were adults showing animals that were ponies both by genetics and measurement at a recent Welsh Nationals. Our pony was one of many ridden by a small adult. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] EZ ride Tapadero pictures
. They really work. Another thing that really works to keep warm (I can't believe I'm even discussing this when the temps around her refuse to go below 90 during the day) is to use those Therma Wrap back wraps - they really keep your core warm all day. -- Laree What a horse does under compulsion is done without understanding, and there is no beauty in it either, any more than if one should whip or spur a dancer. -Xenophon
RE: [IceHorses] Raud
I also inquired about this horse and was told that he has spent a month at Monty Roberts. This horse had a bucking problem two years ago, and at that time he'd never been to Monty Roberts. I don't think we can blame Monty Roberts for this one...not that I'm a big Monty Roberts fan. Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] Come on!!!
Do all Icelandic Horses gait? No, they do not. its not an icelandic thing its a gaited horse thing. not all gaited horses gait. some gaited horses will gait great and then sold never gait again, which is an indication of saddlefit/rider complications. Some rackers walk, some walkers rack, some foxtrotters rack, some walkers foxtrot, some iceys tolt, some foxtrot, rack, runningwalk whatever, all mine I have ever had or seen canter, at liberty, everywhere. The only reason people try to say a particular breed will only do the signature gait of that breed is because they are either showers or trying to make money selling or breeding etc. All gaited horses can do a particular easy gait and it isnt necessarily the signature gait of that particular breed. But some gaited horses never do any easy gait. for whatever reason. Its a mystery. janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Hands: Pony or Horse
i dont know about RMHs show rules but i do know as a rule they are built sorta dainty, around 14hh and not stocky built. I know in the TWHBEA rules they have classes for 14hh and under but they dont call them ponies i dont think. and walkers are not generally thought of as a small breed whereas rockies are sorta on the small side i think. I have seen some humungous Mountain pleasure Horses but every purebred rocky or KMSH I have seen was small boned and around 14hh or less. About the height of most pasos but not even as large boned as most pasos. Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] dreamhorse
On 9/23/07, Nancy Sturm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We had a very nice POA here for a while. We were told he had bucked and unseated a five year old boy and was looking for a new home. We also knew he'd been a lesson pony over jumps in a posh California barn and had been sent to Oregon to retire (age 17). We were a little careful with him at first. Our daughter weighs in at about 115 soaking wet, so she rode him both in the ring and on trail before we put the little girls on him. He was really a nice pony. A teenage boy who feeds for us when we're away got on him twice bareback and got bucked off twice. Haven't a clue what this means, just an anecdote. Nancy In situations of what i would call normal bucking, not a bucking problem per se, just a horse that bucks now and then from something, I have seen horses that bucked when transitioning to canter, and I am like you nancy, I dont know what that means--- and when going up and/or down a hill, which I suspect could be pain or maybe even just exhuberance? also balance adjustment. My Jaspar, most deadbroke horse on the planet offered a little halfhearted buck with me twice, once in a spring tree icelandic saddle ironically. I didnt even own an icey at the time but it looked like a cool saddle, and was affordable so I bought it. The spring must have pinched is all I can think of, and also too narrow probably... and then the second time was when he had a fistula coming on and I took him over a series of small sandy hills (piles really) and he started wringing his tail and at the last one when he started down he threw his butt up and then stopped dead, refusing to go on. And that was from extreme pain (my shame). For a horse to be a bucker for buckings sake, a problem bucker, I would also agree riding it out is not a solution. For one thing even a great rider can get killed that way and for another, the horse may be beaten by it then but it will show up again I believe. I know someone who bought a horse at auction that was drugged and sold as a horse a child can ride (which hello, a child can ride anything) turned out to be a horse that bucked off everyone that ever got on him. this horse was in a paddock next to my horses and something was WRONG with that horse. and I think it was stomach trouble. because he colicked like clockwork and sometimes I would arrive to feed and he'd be laid out like he was dead and it would take vet work and hours of work to save him, constant sand colic treatment etc. And then he died mysteriously. Was found in the morning dead, had torn out the fence, skid marks showed he had been racing around and then tracks looked like he had just run full blown into the fence. No one knows if he broke his neck or died of pain. But something made him just run right into the fence. Tivar would wring his tail and walk backwards and stamp his feet and turn to bite at my stirrup when he had a girth pinching him etc. I bet if he had saddle pain he woulda tried to buck. He tried to buck before but not with me. So he had a history of bucking, but I can tell you he is not or was never a renegade bronco bucking horse like this one sounds. But what caused it. he needs a couple of years pasture rest at a loving home and then after that, starting over like a horse that has never been worked with at all, from the ground up. jmo. Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Raud
On 9/23/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I also inquired about this horse and was told that he has spent a month at Monty Roberts. The lady never mentioned that he has a bucking problem, just that he needs a lot of hours in the saddle. Wonder what Monty did to him?!? If he were not so far away I would love him for a pasture ornament since he is beautiful. Renee monty did his roundpen/join up thing which probably made raudi feel intimidated enough to take whatever he had to and endure it. I bet monty didnt get on him! He most likely had one of his workers get on him after he had been roundpenned to a level of being tired, had submitted to monty's dominance and was afraid of acting bad, then ridden around a little roundpen while the audience clapped and cheered enthusiastically. Then he probably couldnt wait to get home and buck again. I bet if whoever took him there had said he needs a month of riding? How about I pay you to do it Monty would not have accepted that challenge. I just bet. Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Hackamores (Bitless)
i did not watch this all the way thru... it was boring :) But I would like to point out I have heard people say hackamores do not work with some gaited horses, especially a bosal because it will have an unintentional effect of discouraging gait, that when a horse head nods or has gaited head energy/motion the hack will go bump bump bump on the nose and they will alter gait from it. I would not use this on a gaited horse. I use a sidepull, but if using a bosal like this I would first consider a jaquima like the paso people use altho i hesitate to even say that since altho they are ok for the horse maybe they are miserable to use. My cousin gave me a very expensive jaquima cause it was too large for his pasos and it had like a 30 ft piece of hard woven stiff rawhide woven right into the headstall part so you had to wrap it and hang it from your saddle at all times. Also the rawhide was so ungodly stiff it would take months of working it with oil to get it anywhere near soft as leather. But it was nice, looked nice, worked like a sidepull etc. But jeez a sidepull is cheaper and nicer and softer. A hackamore or bosal is not something I would use with a gaited horse. Even jaspar who does not headnod much, when he gets going good in his stepping pace I feel that a bosal would constantly knock his nose. jmo Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Bosal?
On 9/23/07, Nancy Sturm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Judy, are you planning to use a bosal when you start Charm? Nancy hahaha i would like to see THAT :) I bet she is started in a rope halter. I just bet Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Polygraph tests for Staff at TWH Celebration
hmmm, a redneck lie detector test his lips are moving. haha Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
[IceHorses] Re: Saddle up! This pony's a smooth ride
That bouncing back and forth makes it feel like your entrails are being rearranged, for the amateur rider. Having one's entrails rearranged is a graphic description. The horses must have a hard pace instead of a tolt! Who would want an Icelandic with this description? Yikes... -Kristen in upper MI
Re: [IceHorses] Leslie Desmond yesterday
On 9/21/07, Nancy Sturm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ...horse doesn't make an intellectual decison... Bless the woman. I am so sick of reading (not on this list, ladies) that my horse tried to do (fill in the blank) to me. We have plans. Horses really don't. Nancy what does it meant then, if its instinctual... Tivar wants always to be first in line on a ride. When he's not first he always looks for the first opening to pass and make his way back to first. We ride frequently in an area that is a narrow trail. On one ride, out of the blue, he started whacking my right knee into a tree now and then. I thought that was a heads up of something wrong. that maybe he was veering right. I got off, adjusted things, all seemed fine. We started on. whack. I started watching for in BEFORE it happened. I started realizing it ALWAYS happened within seconds after me reining him in when he wanted to pass/be first. As an experiment I allowed him to pass and be first. No more whacks. In fact, at one point we were trotting really fast and he did a hairpin between two saplings. no whack. a horse passed us and he flattened his ears. I scolded. we went on. He tried to pass. I scolded. whack. So what instinct is that? I'm sorry, I just have seen it too much... horses do act bratty, and sneaky, with each other, and with us. Its almost comical. it is comical. to me :) Like Jaspar snatching bites of weeds on the trail. If I unwind the crop from the saddle and put it on my hand, he stops. If I put it away, he starts. what instinct is that, the trail munchie instinct :) or the I am gonna work around mamas rules instinct. to me that is intellectual. But its not just bratty behavior, I have seen many many cases of intellectual behavior both with each other and with people. Or maybe I am misunderstanding intellectual? I saw stonewall do something intellectual recently, and also ethical, a demonstration of being a good person morally I thought. traveller had been mean to him and they were doing their usual mock-war-fighting and Traveller cow kicked at him as he went by then went to graze. Stonewall sneaked up on him. Backed up, kept looking over his shoulder, lining himself up, stepping his back feet for just the right position to let him have it, and he waited. he waited til Traveller lifted his head from grazing and saw it coming and wham, he let him have it. He did not sucker punch him. He did not sneak attack him altho they do that too. He was following some policy rule I think :) But isnt that intellectual?? or is it? Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Come on!!!
--- JR [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Do all Icelandic Horses gait? I had a women tell me that there is no way my Jakey can be an Icelandic because he doesn't tolt, pace, and he will canter. She said that Icelandics don't canter. Both my Iceys canter. I am pretty sure they are Icelandic. I haven't tolted them yet. Lorraine Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story. Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games. http://sims.yahoo.com/
Re: [IceHorses] Come on!!!
HI JR and Jakey no all icelandic´s don´t don´t do soft gait´s but almost all 99% do canter and almost all can trot thou that theese that are 5+ gaited have a 4 beaten trot or have a hard time to do it under rider but often at freedom they do a fine trot and canter. about the canter we have galopp race´s here and and most horses do a fine canter without any dressagetraining under rider. hope you both are doing fine Regards Malin in Iceland www.kolugil.tk
[IceHorses] Re: Hands: Pony or Horse
--- In IceHorses@yahoogroups.com, Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: a small breed whereas rockies are sorta on the small side i think. Out here they are usually on the short side, maybe around 14.2. I have seen some humungous Mountain pleasure Horses but every purebred rocky or KMSH I have seen was small boned and around 14hh or less. I'll probably be shot:), I've gotten in trouble for this before, but I really don't think there is actually a lot of difference between the mountain breeds, people in California would like to think so, but around here, people say they are all the same. I don't think my mare is so unusual, I have until November to get her registered grade Rocky, which I am not doing, I don't want to ride her for the certification at two years old, and I have longer to get her registered full KMSH. She is really 1/2 TWH, dam double registerd TWH and KMSH, father RMH and KMSH. I don't really think she is fine boned, she has some decent bone. Some are finer boned. Maybe it's just the breeder I got her from, they have some butt kicking mares out there, with good bone:) Kim
Re: [IceHorses] Leslie Desmond yesterday
So what instinct is that? I'm sorry, I just have seen it too much... horses do act bratty, and sneaky, with each other, and with us. Its almost comical. it is comical. to me :) Janice - I find it comical, too, because Doppa does the same exact thing. If she doesn't get her way about something - whack - there goes my knee into a tree. I thought I was just imagining it, but afer close observation, realized this was a definite on purpose thing. Now I know to be prepared and not let it happen. Laree What a horse does under compulsion is done without understanding, and there is no beauty in it either, any more than if one should whip or spur a dancer. -Xenophon
Re: [IceHorses] Bosal?
Judy, are you planning to use a bosal when you start Charm? No, probably the rope halter, altho I started Vinur with absolutely nothing. What I'd do with him, is walk down to the end of the driveway to pick up the mail. He'd be in his pasture, but follow along. Then I'd climb the fence, and ask him to come over to it, and slide onto him, and he'd take me back up to the house. http://iceryder.net/vinurvideo.html I could try something similar with Charm. We'll see when the time comes. The bosal is not so good for working with gaited horses and gait, but the reason I don't use it at all is that it's kind of stiff and I want something more pliable for the horse's face. Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Raud
I am the one that sent that note signed by Rene. Guess I deleted my name and left hers on after deleting the message. Sorry. Anyway, I wrote tho woman again and mentioned the bucking and she was adamant that he had only bucked once and then was thrown into a round pen for a year and a half, At Monty's he bucked twice and never again. Previously he had been ridden only as a trail horse. Maybe it is not the same horse. She sent me some fantastic photos of him. Looks the same. Not what I am looking for though. I did e mail the Andi the Icelandic gal though but go no response. I just want someone for Djangi to play with and friends to ride. The mare that my friends ride now is 21 and a great horse but she has so much go that she does not realize when she is tired. It was OK when she was young but I would like to have her go on sensible rides now and not up and down hills. Ann
[IceHorses] Re: Leslie Desmond yesterday
--- In IceHorses@yahoogroups.com, Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: He tried to pass. I scolded. whack. So what instinct is that? I'm sorry, I just have seen it too much... horses do act bratty, and sneaky, with each other, and with us. Its almost comical. it is comical. to me :) Like Jaspar snatching bites of weeds on the trail. If I unwind the crop from the saddle and put it on my hand, he stops. If I put it away, he starts. what instinct is that, the trail munchie instinct :) You have a great ability to bring space to a situation:) I think I understand what Leslie is saying, I think, and I also understand what you are saying. I think it could be both ways. This really made me laugh because, having owned ponies for so long, I know exactly what you are talking about. My childhood pony would get his chance and bend his little knees, go under the single rail arena and rub kids off of his back, never did it to me, but I was ready. I believe I recall him trying to rub me off under tree limbs, never happened, I was ready. He did buck one child off, I told her to stop it! He did not like it when she was pretending she was a cowboy, whooping and swinging her arms around, when she didn't listen to me, Sequoia took care of her, or really took care of himself and dumped her. That pony, ditched me in the middle of the San Diego river, we got in the water, he got all slippery and wet and then saw his chance, he got rid of me and bailed, went home to his corral. Believe me, Dari will do what he wants if I am not after him, if he sees the chance, he will go left, when I want to go right, ponies are always plotting. The instinct part, I just think it is dangerous to blame the horse for a lot of things, like bucking, like any of their behavior really. It's one thing to see that they can give input, and I think Leslie lets the horse have plently of input, but we've seen how many times blaming the horse, when really if we fine tune how we relate to them, they will do better, still allowing them to feel their fears, to give input. It's somewhere in the middle for me. Kim
Re: [IceHorses] dreamhorse
Tivar would wring his tail and walk backwards and stamp his feet and turn to bite at my stirrup when he had a girth pinching him etc. I bet if he had saddle pain he woulda tried to buck. When I got my first Sensation and Skito dryback, I was at Robyn's in Canada. I put it on Tivar and went for a trailride. He was great going on the flat and up the hills but when we started down, he squealed, wrung his tail and kicked up his back legs ( I would not call it a buck). I checked the saddle and the pad was jabbed into his shoulder pads. I got off and walked him down and mounted again on the flat where he was fine. We tried nearly all the saddles Robyn had on him after that as he was grumpy. He let us know that he hated them all until I went back to my old Tuend ( like a Torsion) and he relaxed and became the old Tivar. Peggy Cummings called him the princess and the pea Later in the year he must have gotten pretty sore from the ulcers because he did buck with a friend riding ( I did not see it and never saw him buck) I did have a friend jump on him with a halter though and he squealed and kicked up his heels. My vet tried and tried to figure what was wrong, but never came up with ulcers. I not longer have her. He tried to buck before but not with me. So he had a history of bucking, but I can tell you he is not or was never a renegade bronco bucking horse like this one sounds. Nope, don't think he ever even strung two bucks together. it is funny the things that Janice finds not to be a problem with Tivar (nipping when the cinch was too tight, shaking his head or whatever) frustrated me horrible, I kept thinking he was very unhappy with me and did not like me. Guess he has found the right home, though we all miss the guy. Ann Ann
[IceHorses] Bitless
From Pat on GaitedHorse about bitless: I had bit issues with my current horse, Dakota, not gaited. I tried a couple of bits, but we do not have the vast array of bit types to try here in Mexico. Everyone said the curb bit used was not severe, but I just felt reluctance in movement and after about an hour, headtossing. I had teeth floated and wolf teeth pulled. Always felt I was doing something wrong. Finally sent him to a trainer, one who is soft. Even he had some of the same problems. The horse did not want to work and tried to jump out of the ring. At that time, trainer was using a snaffle. I still felt something was wrong. One day a very reputable vet was there for another horse and I asked him to check mine over. Dakota had just come back from a ride in the hills with the trainer's son. That's when we discovered a very severe cut on the tongue from the snaffle and bad handling from the kid. He had to be stitched. The vet said that he had Trigeminal Neuralgia and said the horse was dangerous and that I should look for another horse. Said it was incurable. I, formerly a chiropractor, knew what that was, but didn't buy into the diagnosis, because I could touch him all over the head without issue. I went home and after crying my eyes out, hit the internet and typed in trigeminal neuralgia in horses. The first thing that came up pertained exactly to this issue and was a world of information. Everything that was discussed was what had transpired with Dakota. It explained how all the different bit types worked. I spent hours on this site. The upshot of all this is I ended up ordering a bitless bridle. Since then, my horse has done just fine and I know that his mouth will never be hurt again. My new gaited horse has been using a Tom Thumb bit, but when he finally gets here and we have spent time together and adjust to one another, I may even consider going bitless with him as well. Pat
Re: [IceHorses] dreamhorse
Nope, don't think he ever even strung two bucks together. it is funny the things that Janice finds not to be a problem with Tivar (nipping when the cinch was too tight, shaking his head or whatever) frustrated me horrible, I kept thinking he was very unhappy with me and did not like me. Guess he has found the right home, though we all miss the guy. Ann the thing he does with me that drives me nuts is his impatience. He can be so impatient. If you have to stand around waiting while a ride is about to start he starts prancing, dancing, wanting to go, acting bratty, I have to make him do circles. Then at the vet he had to stand tied to the trailer for two hours. he got so impatient he started pawing and when my husband scolded and gave him a little smack on the knee as he was pawing he reached and tried to bite off the running light on the trailer bumper haha. what a brat. yes, we all have things we can put up with and things we can't. I feel like Tivar and I are a perfect match and have binded so well, but he is not adapting well to the bugs here and is scratching himself so bad I have to keep him covered in a fly sheet etc. so this is a consideration. I am taking him to karens in two weeks to actually ride him in the Liz clinic, I am excited about that, and if his skin is real horrible I may leave him there for a while but I am praying not. he has turned out to be such a good solid guy for me! I love the way he is not spooky even tho you can tell he's very afraid, you dont ever have to worry he is gonna freak out and jump sideways or run or anything. he can be a very opinionated grump tho haha. I sometimes think they can tell what bugs you and learn how to push buttons. maybe I taught him if he acts impatient enough I will let him go and be first, which he loves. because one time I thought well, I'll just go and see how he likes that, riding down the road all by himself! well he loved it. go figure :) Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Bosal?
speaking of, Parelli has this series on RFDTV now, I am really enjoying it. Now he is working with pedro, a problem Firesian. Well, he rode his horse driving pedro in drive lines, but not to a bit, to a rope halter. It was awesome! What amazed me is this Pedro had never been driven, had no bit, and the way the drive lines were he was moving off just the slight pressure of the drive line dropping against his shoulder/side. very interesting! Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] E-Z Ride Stirrups
in a tapadero you would still have a hole at your toe :) Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Hands: Pony or Horse
I'll probably be shot:), I've gotten in trouble for this before, but I really don't think there is actually a lot of difference between the mountain breeds, people in California would like to think so, but around here, people say they are all the same. I don't think my mare is so unusual, I have until November to get her registered grade Rocky, which I am not doing, I don't want to ride her for the certification at two years old, and I have longer to get her registered full KMSH. i think thats true Kim as far as KMSH and RMSH but I have noticed Mountain Pleasure horses seem to be bigger, larger boned, and mostly a color with a cream gene whereas KMSH and RMSH are black base, silver dapple, bay, black, liver chestnut (SD bay) etc. I think the Mountain Pleasure Horse has some different foundation DNA in the mix maybe? I just know I have never seen a 17hh RMSH or KMSH and I have seen plenty of huge Mountain Pleasure horses like that but i am probably generalizing again :) Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Leslie Desmond yesterday
That reminded me of my Stella who is now 24 with Cushings. Years ago I would let some male friends ride her once in awhile that really did not know about horses. When my back was turned for an instant one was on the ground. He said she bucked him off. another time friends were out in the pasture and a guy jumped on her bareback and without a halter or bridle or asking me. I saw him later in the pasture lying flat with his legs wailing around. I thought it was a seizure but when I got here he was laughing and said Stella had bucked him off. These were macho guys and I said good for Stella. Luckily no one was harmed. She would take care of anyone I put on her but don't let someone try and cowboy her. I have never seen her buck a day in her life but she does think and have opinions about how things are done.. I had another Icey mare who always bucked a couple of times when we started to canter. I suspect it was the saddle. Those were my ignorant days about saddle fit. Ann
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Saddle up! This pony's a smooth ride
On 9/24/07, djakni1 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That bouncing back and forth makes it feel like your entrails are being rearranged, for the amateur rider. Having one's entrails rearranged is a graphic description. The horses must have a hard pace instead of a tolt! Who would want an Icelandic with this description? Yikes... -Kristen in upper MI no what she is saying is that icelandics are smooth but other breeds are not. that was my understanding. I think tho a gaited horse that doesnt gait smooth can be useful and exceptional in many many other ways tho. My best most reliable and safe trail horses are not well gaited. my smoothest gaited horses are my scariest :) just the way it is for now... janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Hackamores (Bitless)
The first I ever started I rode in a traditional Californio bosal with that extra (on mine soft cotton) long lead goody that went to the saddle. It's the only time I've ever used one and the whole process actually went beautifully. I never did put her in a bit. I think probably for a beginning trainer it was a good choice. As for not riding gaited horses in a hackamore, the one we use has a soft biothane piece over the nose and very short s-curved shanks, so it's not the awful Western roping type hackamore. No one knew to tell me it wouldn't work on gaited horses. Hunter does his entire range of gaits, whatever the heck they are. We tried several mild bits on him. He was never happy in anything. He became much less fussy in every way after we threw the bit back in the tackroom. Nancy
[IceHorses] The Cry of Censorship
As previously noted, there would have to be someone with their own agenda who would cry censorship. Look, we had people complaining about others being rude. List management tried to do something about it. Now the ones who were complaining are complaining about something being done! List managers can never win! There'll always be cry-babies, people who think the rules don't apply to them, people who aren't up to being politcally correct, and spoiled selfish self-centered brats. Get over it! Advertising is not freely allowed on the list. It has never been freely allowed. Trying to sneak in a word about your product every other message is not nice; it's not playing by the rules, and is selfish. Grow up; stop already. Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Leslie Desmond yesterday
On 24/09/2007, Ann Cassidy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I had another Icey mare who always bucked a couple of times when we started to canter. I suspect it was the saddle. Those were my ignorant days about saddle fit. I know I have had few ignorant days myselfand I fully expect to have many more. I find I can just never learn enough...there is always something new around the corner that has me puzzled. Wanda
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Leslie Desmond yesterday
When my back was turned for an instant one was on the ground. He said she bucked him off. another time friends were out in the pasture and a guy jumped on her bareback and without a halter or bridle or asking me. I saw him later in the pasture lying flat with his legs wailing around. and said Stella had bucked him off. I think it's probably fair for horses to buck off people that haven't asked to ride; made the proper prior introductions, spent the required time in riding foreplay (grooming, tacking,etc.). Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
[IceHorses] Re: Saddle up! This pony's a smooth ride
no what she is saying is that icelandics are smooth but other breeds are not. that was my understanding. I think tho a gaited horse that Thanks Janice - I guess I read it wrong this morning. I have never felt like I was bouncing back and forth in a diagonal gait..it always feels more vertical to me. Deacon prefers to trot and I have to post to be comfortable. However, my Arabian mare has a trot I could sit all day. -Kristen
[IceHorses] Trailer
Look at this trailer! http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/showthread.php?t=206698 V
RE: [IceHorses] Trailer
Look at this trailer! http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/showthread.php?t=206698 V Oh my god!! That's plain crazy! Cherie
Re: [IceHorses] dreamhorse
I will be real curious to see how he does at the clinic. when I sent him off of two months of training to see if he had tolt, I was told that he did but it was a bit difficult for him until he got the right muscling. he came home and only tolted for months. We/he let it slide and the saddle I had was a problem fit, probably. I got a treeless when he was 6 1/2 or so and that all improved. He was probably 5 1/2-6 with the bad saddle and then one day stopped doing much of anything, got real bratty. When I got the treeless, first a bob marshall then a torsion, he did fine, we went on lots of trail rides and he was pretty good except for the bratty episodes that really vexed me. The bucking did not start until after we went to Robyn's and he was great trailering up there but I wonder if it did not cause the ulcers. When I used him in the tuend he was very relaxed and happy but I remember him kicking me in the head when I reached under to grab the cinch. Maybe my head touched his flanks, I knew he hated me then and just started crying. Its funny, I do not remember anything about him being touchy about the muzzle. It is funny is it not what you remember and what you don't. We don't have bugs here, occasional flies in the fall. I saw one horsefly this summer only. there are sometime mosquitos by the creek but Tivar and his Mom Litla both would seem to get bites when the others did not. Perhaps he is more sensitive, wonder what you can do. Have you tried the B vitamin that is supposed to repel insects? In humans at least, we took it in Alaska. Keep me updated what Liz says in the clinic. have a mare that had tolt as her strongest gait and now only trots. Is it me? Ann
[IceHorses] OT-HomeMade Horse Trailer
HumIMHO...some folks are clueless. http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/showthread.php?t=206698 I'm surprised the troopers never pulled him over. Geez! Raven Lucy Molly, the Girl Doggies Huginn Dixie Chick, the Back Behind the Barn Ponies Respect ALL Earthlings. We are all animals of this planet. We are all creatures.
[IceHorses] Huginn Update 9/25
Hello, Just a short update on Huginn. There are days...that I think he is 100% back to himself and then there are days that I see a few problems. For the most part he is doing so much better, but he is still having some issues swallowing. Then we'll have a few days...when he eats just fine and then..yesterday, I was watching him eat his dinner and he was having a hard time swallowing. Oh...I did get to ride him a few weeks ago. The day was hotclose to 100, we rode for a few hours. He was spunky when I hit the saddle, he gave me one small buck as I asked him to walk away from the trailer and his buddies. After that, he settled in and was just fine. The trail was sandy...deep in some spots. So he had a good work out. When we got back to the barn...he kicked up his hooves as he ran to Dixie, gave a buck and a fart, so he must have had soem energy left over. Darn...should have ridden longer. HAHA! The last month has been a crazy month for usif I get more time this week, I'll post more. Thank you for your continue thoughts, prayers and healing light. Raven Lucy Molly, the Girl Doggies Huginn Dixie Chick, the Back Behind the Barn Ponies Respect ALL Earthlings. We are all animals of this planet. We are all creatures.
[IceHorses] Re: Come on!!!
Have we seen pictures of him? Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com If you go under the group pictures, look under Jakey. Sorry his head is on the ground but fresh grass can be pretty tempting. He is only 13'2 hands and build like a tank. He does seem to have this weird trot. He only does it under saddle. Kind of like an extended trot. He is a spunky little guy for thirty. Canters off on the correct lead. I don't even need a halter on him, he walks in from the field to his stall and waits for me to close the door and feed him then I just open the door when he is done and he follows me back out to the field. His cough is still pretty wet but he seems to be perking up again. I still need to get his teeth done. Have you ever heard of a horse with almost no top teeth??? What is left can't be much bigger then your finger nails. JR and Loona Bolti (Jakey)
Re: [IceHorses] dreamhorse
Tivar does a nice animated foxwalk but when asked for speed moves into a trot. At the last Liz clinic Liz said he had conformation to trot, and was built so he had exceptional weight carrying ability. But when I sent her a pic of him recently doing his foxwalk she said a foxtrot might be lurking in there somewhere. He does not like horse shows I found :) So dont know how he will behave :) but I am takling my pacey jaspar too. Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
RE: [IceHorses] The Cry of Censorship
Advertising is not freely allowed on the list. It has never been freely allowed. Trying to sneak in a word about your product every other message is not nice; it's not playing by the rules, and is selfish. I really appreciate the fact that advertising is limited on some of the lists, particularly this one. The treeless saddles list has a policy to allow distributors and manufacturers to answer questions about the products they sell, but occasionally a few of the dealers get overly zealous, and the list turns into one big annoying info-mercial. I think, given that that the treeless list is a product/genre-centric list, it makes sense to have some vendors on it, since they may know the answer to some reader's questions more completely than the non-vendors. But, this is a HORSES list, so I appreciate that product advertising is very limited. That just gets annoying, trying to separate the sales pitches from the genuinely unsolicited testimonials - especially when you see the same product hawked on 3-4 lists. I like the treeless list a lot, but without some moderation, I'm afraid it would get out of hand quickly. The moderator is pretty good about keeping the posts on topic there. I'm thankful, because I get plenty of junk r-mail ads as it is! What should we do, Judy, if one of us has a single-item type horsey something-or-other that we'd like to sell? Should we just drop a note to you, asking if a short e-mail to the list is suitable? Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.30/1025 - Release Date: 9/23/2007 1:53 PM
Re: [IceHorses] The Cry of Censorship
What should we do, Judy, if one of us has a single-item type horsey something-or-other that we'd like to sell? Should we just drop a note to you, asking if a short e-mail to the list is suitable? Sure, if there's any question, just ask. I don't think anyone has been refused to advertise an individual item, one time, for personal sale. Businesses are different. The note that I sent the other day said: ...if you have good information to input to the list, be sure that it doesn't include detrimental or discourteous comments about the list or to our listees as it will be deleted. Dawn evidently didn't understand this, or chose to ignore it in her recent post, which included a paragraph of criticism of the list, that was returned to her with the option of deleting that particular section. Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Saddle up! This pony's a smooth ride
which parts of the article may not be exactly correct? Icelandic horse a rare breed Icelandic Horses are not a rare breed. A rare breed numbers less than 10,000 globally. The ride is so smooth there are events where riders race around a track while holding a mug of beer. And they don't spill a drop, In this video, champagne glasses are used, not filled fully with liquid, and the liquid in the glasses sure bounces around alot. http://www.hestafrettir.is/veftv/default.asp?MovieID=292CategoryID=30 Is there a video somewhere of beer mugs being used with nothing spilled? The Icelandic horse's tölt, which is very fast at 20 kilometres per hour, is a running walk where one foot is always on the ground. No, the tolt is not a running walk. A breeder should know this. Many traits make Icelandic horses special. They are more like dogs than horses in the way they bond with owners if treated right. Interesting comment and phrasing! How should we treat them right to get them to bond like dogs with their owners? They tend to have very even temperaments and don't spook. Is that true, or should we say some of them don't spook very much. And they are not indifferent about going riding like some horses. They love it. And some of them, like Raudi, Rodi, Landi, Baersi, etc., do not like it; don't care for people, and will never be reliable mounts. They are small and technically a pony, but very powerful. True! They are a pony! They have perhaps the most gorgeous mane of any horse. They look like they just left the beauty parlour or used too much mousse because their hair is so lusciously thick. Gorgeous manes are... gorgeous! The horse was brought to Iceland 1,200 years ago by Viking settlers. Several breeds were brought to Iceland, being cross-bred, and the resultant horse became the Icelandic. They can extract a lot of energy from just a tiny bit of hay. They will eat fish if there's nothing else to eat. Some of the horses are easy keepers and some are not. Each horse should receive good nutritrion, and enough food to keep him healthy. Icelandic horses are also one of the most purebred horse in the world. No other horses are allowed into Iceland. They have only been purebred for a 1,000 years. Arabians and other breeds have been purebred much longer. Genetic purity is a little different and we can say that the Icelandics have a certain amount of genetic purity because of the isolation on the island. They are hungry to learn from people and work with them, which trainers often don't recognize. That's why they often have special trainers. Does that make sense? I think most of the Icelandics are hungry to learn from people and very interested in people. But why would they need a special trainer? Ohm, 23, is the fifth specialized trainer Arnason has brought over from Iceland into Ohm attending Holar University in Iceland to become a specialized trainer. She will return to Holar in three months to complete her third and final year of training. While this is a wonderful experience, going from country to country and learning new languages. Holar is not producing *horsemanship* in their students. I think they like to use the word, but it's not the same definition that we have come to understand its meaning. Horsemanship has an implied meaning of good in learning to work positively with the horse's naturalness. Horse riders, horse owners, horse trainers, horse controllers (those who use mechanical aids, adding nosebands on top of bits, boots on top of shoes, force from the hands and arms on the reins, etc.) are not horsemen. Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
[IceHorses] More pics
Now I'm trying to send multiple pics but I don't think I got this right Laree
Re: [IceHorses] Saddle up! This pony's a smooth ride
In 2003, Arnason imported 83 of them from Iceland. They came to Manitoba by Icelandair and Air Canada. Many of those were for other people in places like New Mexico, New Jersey, and Montana, This was Huginn's shipment! Huginn was one of the 83.he was lucky enough to find his forever home. I wonder where the other ponies ended up, Raven Lucy Molly, the Girl Doggies Huginn Dixie Chick, the Back Behind the Barn Ponies Respect ALL Earthlings. We are all animals of this planet. We are all creatures.
Re: [IceHorses] Huginn Update 9/25
On 9/24/07, Raven [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, Just a short update on Huginn. There are days...that I think he is 100% back to himself and then there are days that I see a few problems. For the most part he is doing so much better, but he is still having some issues swallowing. So great to hear, Raven. Gene and I went horse camping last week at a place in Magalia (Sierra Foothills) called Doon Grade Ranch. Had a really great time. Only 7 miles from town, so I didn't have to cook!!! Ferne
RE: [IceHorses] Picture experimenting
I am experimenting to see if I figured out this Picassa thing There should be a picture of Doppa and Mura overseeing the construction of their run in shed - How did I do? You get an A! Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.30/1025 - Release Date: 9/23/2007 1:53 PM
[IceHorses] Re: Saddle up! This pony's a smooth ride now Mistrustful Horses
--- In IceHorses@yahoogroups.com, Judy Ryder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And some of them, like Raudi, Rodi, Landi, Baersi, etc., do not like it; don't care for people, and will never be reliable mounts. I like to think that maybe even horses like this can maybe learn to trust one person. I had a horse for 14 years, not long enough, and when I got her, I know she felt no special love for people. She was like those horses you see on a rental string, sort of zoned out. She would do what she needed to, but she did not particularly feel anything for people. She was already and older horse when I got her, she had sores on the corners of her lips, from people pulling too hard on the bit. Her mouth was hard, pulling didn't stop her. It really took many years for her to really, really open up to me. She would buck, she loved to go fast, it wasn't right for everyone, basically she bucked if you wouldn't let her go fast, and she also bucked when she got to going as fast as she could, that was for fun, I really believe, a very energetic horse. When she was turned out, she would run, and run and run and buck, for a long time:) She started to have physical problems, she grew a tumor on her leg, and the first time I really remember her really making a connection with me, I mean totally, the way all my horses do now, was when I went to pick her up after surgery, when she heard my voice, she started calling out and just went into a frenzy, she was very high strung, not always terribly cooperative about anything, just wanting to keep on the move. I really think she started to trust me and understand how I felt when I cared for her after surgery, finally opening up. After that, she would lay her head on my shoulder in the afternoon and rest, it just all changed. Of course this took years, I think I may have had her 8 years when this happened. Everything good is worth waiting for. It was the most amazing relationship with my horse after that. It's not going to happen in 30 day, or even 3 years maybe, who has a lifetime? It may take that long. Kim
RE: [IceHorses] Picture experimenting
You got it! Cherie -Original Message- From: IceHorses@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Laree Shulman Sent: Monday, September 24, 2007 8:59 PM To: icehorses Subject: [IceHorses] Picture experimenting I am experimenting to see if I figured out this Picassa thing There should be a picture of Doppa and Mura overseeing the construction of their run in shed - How did I do? Laree IceHorses Community for Photos and Videos: http://kickapps.com/icehorses The greatest enemy of the truth very often is not the lie- deliberate, contrived and dishonest -- but the myth -- persistent, persuasive and unrealistic. All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident. ~ Arthur Schopenhauer [] Lee Ziegler http://leeziegler.com [] Liz Graves http://lizgraves.com [] Lee's Book Easy Gaited Horses http://tinyurl.com/7vyjo [] IceHorses Map http://www.frappr.com/IceHorses Yahoo! Groups Links
RE: [IceHorses] More pics
Now I'm trying to send multiple pics but I don't think I got this right Oops, no attachments this time. Do you see the photo tray at the lower left corner of the Picassa screen? As you click on each picture, it will show up there. If you want to start accumulating pictures to send together, click on the Hold button, just to the right of the photo tray. When you get all the pictures in the tray you want to send together, all showing in the photo tray, then click the e-mail button, probably as you did with the first picture. You're almost there! Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.30/1025 - Release Date: 9/23/2007 1:53 PM
RE: [IceHorses] Re: Saddle up! This pony's a smooth ride now Mistrustful Horses
I like to think that maybe even horses like this can maybe learn to trust one person. I had a horse for 14 years, not long enough, and when I got her, I know she felt no special love for people. I've had Loftur for three years now. I think I made a lot of good progress with him the first year, finding the right professionals to help me isolate his physical problems. This last year, he hasn't had a lot of special attention. He gets petted and fed every day, with his feet done regularly, etc., so he's not neglected, but I have put some other horses in front of him, since I have so many. It was really hot yesterday, about 94, so it was too hot to ride. I got Loftur out to do some groundwork, and I saddled him. He was sweaty, so I wouldn't ask a fuzzy, out-of-shape horse to do TOO much...but I was quite impressed with his attitude. He was extremely relaxed, just sweet and cooperative, just as if it were yesterday when we last played together. I think people underestimate how long these horses remember things, and how long it may take for them to become truly comfortable. Loftur has been somewhat comfortable since the beginning, but I didn't realize how far he could progress until I saw it. I still don't think I'll ever part with him, considering all he's been through, but he really has continued to trust and settle more and more. Some of these horses simply need plenty of decompression time. They may also need other things - a reason to trust, medical care, new, well-fitting tack, etc. - but usually they also need plenty of TIME. I hate it when people try to fix these horses quickly, by trying to ride 'em through it. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.30/1025 - Release Date: 9/23/2007 1:53 PM
RE: [IceHorses] More pics
Now I'm trying to send multiple pics but I don't think I got this right Laree In Picasa, when you place a pic in the picture tray at the bottom, you have to push the hold button before clicking on the next photo. Cherie
[IceHorses] BillsBook highlighted stuff, starting with Author's Note: Bill Dorrance
By Jeanne, of the BillsBook List: It is near impossible to correlate a subject heading to a page in the book (True Horsemanship Through Feel: http://tinyurl.com/3bcrlw ) After returning from the Wilderness Ride in Sweden I took great pleasure in seeing what I had highlighted during previous study sessions. After applying practicum to the philosophy, I was never going to get it all on my own. There isn't enough time. and The important thing is learning how to feel of the horse, and then getting those horses responsive to your feel. Here I was, being outfitted with the most appropriate horse possible after some informal discussion of where I am at in my journey. This horse and I had to get together right now if we were to make the best of what was shaping up to be one heck of a ride. I had to read him and ride him while understanding he had nothing but feel available to him, too. We did not know each other. It was so helpful going at it with an attitude of checking each others' basics. Did the horse trust me? did he understand from the moment I went to catch him that I was on his side? I believe he did. He was in the moment and there for me. Page VI I had, a long time ago, highlighted The horse needs to have the person feel real sure about how to present what is expected of him in a way that he can understand. Gold, isn't it... I know I was very sure about what I was presenting to the horse that was selected for me. He told me in the way he would feel back to me that we would get along just fine. And we did. But as I make my way through the highlighted sections of the book and relate my Wilderness Ride to them I hope to capture for you (and for me) where things went wrong, where things got better, where the challenges came and how I was responsible for just about every mistake known to man. It's all about learning. And I learned a ton. To be continued... Jeanne
[IceHorses] Re: Saddle up! This pony's a smooth ride now Mistrustful Horses
--- In IceHorses@yahoogroups.com, Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I still don't think I'll ever part with him, considering all he's been through, but he really has continued to trust and settle more and more. And I didn't really let her go, it wasn't really my choice, she died, she was just the greatest horse to me, I didn't really want a different one, but I can see that to a lot of people, this would not have been a good match, I think she would have paid for it mostly. Kim
[IceHorses] Re: dreamhorse...now internal insect repellants
Regarding internal fly repellant the B vites...Humans can take high amounts of B1 (75-100mg) in an isolated form for a few days/weeks to repel insects, but long term taking of an isolated B Vite in humans is not recommended as it can imbalance the system. I would think it would also be true for horses. Out here in Calif., we have seen good results from feeding a garlic supplement like the one Springtime Farms sells. Many of my friends use garlic granules both for the immune system to repel insects. Hilton Herbs also markets a similar one through Chamisa Ridge. Some horses love it, some don't, but after it builds up in their systems, flyng insects seem to bother less. Of course your hay room horse smell like an Italian restaurant!! Kaaren Kaaren Jordan http://kaarenjordan.com
