[LegacyUG] When will Legacy 9 disks & manuals ship?

[hwedhlor]

It's now been a couple of weeks since I ordered Legacy 9 on 
disk and with a printed manual.  I'm aware that I can 
download both the program and the manual, however there was 
no indication in my order receipt as to when the product 
might actually ship.  Has the new version shipped yet on 
disk and with the printed manual, and if not, when might I 
expect it to ship?


Thanks,

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

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Re: [LegacyUG] Re: [LUG] Legacy8.lng File - Offlist

[hwedhlor]

The quote is by Martin Luther King, Jr., from /The
Autobiography of Martin Luther King, Jr./

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 29-Apr-15 12:44 PM, Howlanddavisii wrote:
> "On some positions, Cowardice asks the question ‘Is it safe?'





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Re: [LegacyUG] Separating lines

[hwedhlor]

Hi Cathy,

Yes, I did Refresh.  I don't believe going to the furthest
away ancestor of each line would provide the separation I
need because an overlapping link would exist for my spouses
and our children.

As I mentioned to Wendy, I am a strong proponent of keeping
a single database under most circumstances.  Unfortunately
that is not practical when dealing with people searching a
surname list for common ancestors after they have shown up
as DNA matches.  If any of the surnames in my database are
not genetically linked to me then they are liable to
perceive a genetic link to a surname line where non exists.
The more I examine this issue the more I'm convinced that I
must create a database that includes no members who are not
genetically linked to me.  I believe the overlap is with my
descendants, and with my wife's lines, as they would show up
in both trees unless I unlink myself from my children and my
wife long enough to delete the adoptive tree from the
database that I wish to include only genetically-linked
folks.  I can then delete the adoptive tree, then re-link
myself to my descendants and my wife in the biological tree.

I understand your inclination to keep a single file, but
that is not practical when dealing with a single list of
relatives and attempting to identify surnames with a DNA
connection.  People who match my DNA at any level would look
at the list of surnames with the assumption that the names
there were all genetically connected to me, when that is not
the case.  Therefore I must divide the tree in order to
produce a separate list for export to DNA sites.

Once the separate biological database has been created I can
re-link myself to my descendants in an adoptive database as
well. I will then maintain the two trees separately in order
to support the needs of DNA matching.  Maintaining separate
trees also makes it easier to provide information to
adoptive tree researchers and biological tree researchers
and to support separate trees on Ancestry, for example.

John

John Zimmerman
Mesa, Arizona

On 10-Jan-15 11:37 PM, Cathy Pinner wrote:
> Hi John,
> When you went to the Tree View, did you Refresh? If not it
> was showing the information for the last time you looked
> at it.
> If you did refresh, it suggests there is more than this
> one link between the trees
>
> Another way of separating lines that are linked more than
> once is to go to the furtherest away ancestors of each
> line and tag their descendants so that the adoptive lines
> are tagged on one number and the biological on another.
>
> I wouldn't keep two files but separate them when necessary
> for a specific purpose. Much easier to separate lines then
> merge them. Difficult to keep people updated in more than
> one file. The only exception I'd make is if there is no
> overlap at all.
>
> Cathy
>
> hwedhlor wrote:
>>
>> Hi Wendy,
>>
>> I have no problem with continuing with one file for
>> myself and my
>> wife's families, a nd I'm a very strong advocate of that
>> sort of single
>> database.  It's not so convenient however when dealing
>> with
>> biological and adoptive lines.  For one thing it
>> doesn't work on
>> Ancestry or any of the DNA sites, as anyone attempting to
>> compare DNA
>> matches with my tree and looking at surnames gets the
>> impression that
>> all the surnames listed are related genetically to me.Â
>> That's not
>> the case with any of the adoptive lines, so they must be
>> purged from
>> such listings.
>>
>> I did start by unlinking my adoptive parents from myself,
>> under the
>> assumption that doing so would create two trees.  One
>> with only
>> biological relatives and the other with only adoptive
>> relatives.Â
>> However when I viewed the tree list there was no new
>> adoptive-only
>> tree.  After unlinking my adoptive father from myself I
>> highlighted
>> his name, then went to View/Tree Finder and Refresh, but
>> there was
>> only the tree for myself with 5051 individuals there.
>>
>> Any further suggestions would be much appreciated.
>>
>> John
>>
>> John Zimmerman
>> Mesa, Arizona
>>
>> On 10-Jan-15 10:46 PM, Wendy Howard wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi John,
>>>
>>> If I were you, I would keep to the one file, and extract
>>> the desired
>>> information when needed - but that's me, having started
>>> with two files -
>>> one each for myself and my partner - and eventually
>>> merging them into
>>> one file. I know you've been around here long enough to
>>> have put some
>>> thought into it,

Re: [LegacyUG] Separating lines

[hwedhlor]

Hi Wendy,

I have no problem with continuing with one file for myself
and my wife's families, and I'm a very strong advocate of
that sort of single database.  It's not so convenient
however when dealing with biological and adoptive lines.
For one thing it doesn't work on Ancestry or any of the DNA
sites, as anyone attempting to compare DNA matches with my
tree and looking at surnames gets the impression that all
the surnames listed are related genetically to me.  That's
not the case with any of the adoptive lines, so they must be
purged from such listings.

I did start by unlinking my adoptive parents from myself,
under the assumption that doing so would create two trees.
One with only biological relatives and the other with only
adoptive relatives.  However when I viewed the tree list
there was no new adoptive-only tree.  After unlinking my
adoptive father from myself I highlighted his name, then
went to View/Tree Finder and Refresh, but there was only the
tree for myself with 5051 individuals there.

Any further suggestions would be much appreciated.

John

John Zimmerman
Mesa, Arizona

On 10-Jan-15 10:46 PM, Wendy Howard wrote:
> Hi John,
>
> If I were you, I would keep to the one file, and extract the desired
> information when needed - but that's me, having started with two files -
> one each for myself and my partner - and eventually merging them into
> one file. I know you've been around here long enough to have put some
> thought into it, so not going to try and persuade you to change your
> mind. :-)
>
> Unlinking is the first step towards creating the two files. Now you need
> to make a copy of the file, and in one delete the tree containing the
> adoptive side (so it only contains the 'biologicals'), and in the other
> file delete the tree containing the 'biologicals' (so it only contains
> the adoptive side).
>
> It's fairly quick to remove an entire tree from a file that contains
> more than one tree. First identify an unused Tag you can use for this
> project. Then go to Tree Finder (View > Trees), Refresh, then locate the
> tree to be removed and click on it. Next, select the tag you're going to
> use, then click on the button "Tag the Entire Tree of the Highlighted
> Individual".
>
> Now you're ready to go to Advanced Deleting (Tools > Advanced Deleting)
> where you can delete everyone who has that tag.
>
> Do make a backup of your file before you start, and to be extra cautious
> you may even like to make two copies of the file and work with those so
> your original file remains unchanged. That way, if you make a mistake or
> change your mind about what you want to do, you've still got that file
> to go back to if needed.
>
> Hope this helps. :-)
>
> Wendy
>
> hwedhlor wrote on 11/01/2015 17:33:
>> I have a legacy database created in 7.5. The database includes both my
>> biological and adoptive relatives.  There are 5265 individuals in the
>> database and 1776 families.  For several years I have worked on all
>> lines from within this single database without complications,
>> switching between biological and adoptive lines by clicking on the
>> margin to the side of my parents.  Now I find it desirable to separate
>> the two lines in order to more conveniently interface with relatives
>> from one side or the other.  I am also moving to Legacy 8.
>>
>> I would like to separate the two lines (biological and adoptive) by
>> creating two new databases.  I would like the name index lists for the
>> biological database to include only biological relatives, and vice
>> versa.  I had hoped that by unlinking myself from my adoptive parents
>> in the original database I could save the biological lines to a new
>> database and the name index would not inlcude any of the adoptive
>> lines.  That was not the case.
>>
>> How can I create a biological database without having to manually
>> delete all the adoptive names, and vice versa?
>>
>> John Zimmerman
>> Mesa, Arizona
>
>
>
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[LegacyUG] Separating lines

[hwedhlor]

I have a legacy database created in 7.5.  The database
includes both my biological and adoptive relatives. There
are 5265 individuals in the database and 1776 families.  For
several years I have worked on all lines from within this
single database without complications, switching between
biological and adoptive lines by clicking on the margin to
the side of my parents.  Now I find it desirable to separate
the two lines in order to more conveniently interface with
relatives from one side or the other.  I am also moving to
Legacy 8.

I would like to separate the two lines (biological and
adoptive) by creating two new databases.  I would like the
name index lists for the biological database to include only
biological relatives, and vice versa.  I had hoped that by
unlinking myself from my adoptive parents in the original
database I could save the biological lines to a new database
and the name index would not inlcude any of the adoptive
lines.  That was not the case.

How can I create a biological database without having to
manually delete all the adoptive names, and vice versa?

John Zimmerman
Mesa, Arizona




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[LegacyUG] Mapping program pin icon precision

[hwedhlor]

One of my consistent observations about various map display
programs that use a pushpin or map tack icon to indicate
locations, is that those icons regularly associate map
locations with the body of the pin icons, rather than with
the point of the pin icons.  How can anyone trust the
locations determined by programs like that? How can such
imprecise visual locations be compared from one mapping
program to another when it is impossible to know where on
the pin icon the designated map location may be found?

When I have asked the various manufacturers of such programs
about the imprecise nature of the pin locations they have
invariably told me that if I would simply zoom in on the
location the pins would be more precise.  I have not found
that to be true, however and wonder what impressions others
have of such programs, and whether anyone has found a
mapping program that uses the pin icon pinpoints to
designate locations?

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ




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Re: [LegacyUG] CORRECTION: Legacy 8 User Manual

[hwedhlor]

Ron,

Having worked with computers since 1964 when many still had
vacuum tube amplifiers, and having worked as a programmer,
senior technical writer, systems engineer and database
manager, among other duties, as well as acting as a beta for
a wide variety of software manufacturers, I feel that I am
very familiar with the software industry.

You obviously did not read carefully what I wrote.  I did
not advocate, nor mention, providing program updates to
Millennia's software at no cost to the customer. I only
speculated on alternative means of providing more current
versions of documentation to Millennia's customers who had
already paid for the program and its documentation.  In the
case of the PDF manual version I fail to see where offering
a free download update to that PDF file to those customers
who had already purchased a PDF manual would represent any
significant added cost to Millennia if they are udating that
PDF version regularly anyway.  Naturally such customers
would have to provide their customer number to validate
their entitlement to the updated PDF manual.

I am always amazed at how people manage to comment on other
people's writing without reading that writing.  Any software
firm is faced with a juggling act between holding production
costs at bay while also supporting their customer base with
adequate documentation.  My suggestions were made with both
concerns in mind, and I feel they offered options that might
satisfy both needs.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 04-Jan-14 1:06 PM, Ron Bernier wrote:
>
> On Sat, Jan 4, 2014 at 2:01 PM, hwedhlor  <mailto:hwedh...@cox.net>> wrote:
>
> I can understand the need for lead time in producing a
> printed manual.  I can also understand that things
> change after a printed manual is produced.  Perhaps a
> better, or alternative way of providing the Legacy
> printed reference manual would be for Millennia to use
> an on-demand publishing service, such as Lulu.  That
> way they could provide the publisher with updates on a
> regular basis and customers purchasing a printed
> manual would get the latest version when they buy.
>
> The PDF version of the Legacy reference manual should
> be constantly updated along with the Help files.
> Those who purchased a PDF Legacy manual should be
> provided with a means of downloading the latest
> version of the PDF manual whenever it is updated, and
> at no cost to the customer. Updates to the PDF manual
> could be provided to an on-demand publisher of the
> printed version to keep that version in sync with the
> PDF version and the Help files.
>
> I am a huge fan of Geoff Rasmussen's Legacy webinars,
> and have attended almost every one of them.  Although
> Geoff's book, "Unlocking Legacy 8" is very useful and
> enjoyable to read, because it is patterned after the
> "Watch Geoff Live" webinar presentations it is not
> well-suited for use as a easy reference work because
> it lacks an index.  One must be willing to read
> through an entire chapter in search of a particular
> setting or partial process.
>
> John Zimmerman
> Mesa, AZ
>
>
> On 04-Jan-14 8:25 AM, Randy Clark wrote:
>> The manual was a waste of money as it's in the help
>> file and there was no way to know this in advance.
>
>
> Legacy/Millennia already provides free upgrades to their
> software - most of those free upgrades have
> been substantial updates to the software that many
> companies would have called a new version and charged
> customers for an update.  Millennia has not done that.
> Updating the user manual every time there has been a
> change to the software could and would become an expensive
> undertaking for Millennia, yet you think that they should
> undertake this additional cost - free of charge to their
> customers.  The help files are kept updated and I
> personally think that is sufficient.
>
> I'd be curious to know what other software
> company/companies update their manual (whether printed or
> pdf) every time they have an update to their software.  I
> am always amazed at how people have this mentality that a
> company has bottomless pockets and therefore being a
> customer entitles them to all the freebies they can get
> regardless of the cost to the company.
>
> Ron Bernier
> Woonsocket, RI
>
>
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> Online techni

Re: [LegacyUG] CORRECTION: Legacy 8 User Manual

[hwedhlor]

I can understand the need for lead time in producing a
printed manual.  I can also understand that things change
after a printed manual is produced.  Perhaps a better, or
alternative way of providing the Legacy printed reference
manual would be for Millennia to use an on-demand publishing
service, such as Lulu.  That way they could provide the
publisher with updates on a regular basis and customers
purchasing a printed manual would get the latest version
when they buy.

The PDF version of the Legacy reference manual should be
constantly updated along with the Help files.  Those who
purchased a PDF Legacy manual should be provided with a
means of downloading the latest version of the PDF manual
whenever it is updated, and at no cost to the customer.
Updates to the PDF manual could be provided to an on-demand
publisher of the printed version to keep that version in
sync with the PDF version and the Help files.

I am a huge fan of Geoff Rasmussen's Legacy webinars, and
have attended almost every one of them.  Although Geoff's
book, "Unlocking Legacy 8" is very useful and enjoyable to
read, because it is patterned after the "Watch Geoff Live"
webinar presentations it is not well-suited for use as a
easy reference work because it lacks an index.  One must be
willing to read through an entire chapter in search of a
particular setting or partial process.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 04-Jan-14 8:25 AM, Randy Clark wrote:
> The manual was a waste of money as it's in the help file
> and there was no way to know this in advance.
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 4, 2014 at 9:34 AM, Gene Wheeler
> mailto:bridge...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Yes, I purchased both the hard copy and the pdf
> download, and they are now out of date!  I won't make
> that mistake again.
>
> Gene
> ==
>
> At 11:02 PM 1/3/2014, you wrote:
>> There is a Legacy 8 manual available as either
>> hard-copy or pdf download at the Legacy Store. There
>> is also GeoffâEUR^(TM)s book Unlocking Legacy 8,
>> which is based on his Geoff Live webinars.
>>
>> As Sherry pointed out, even the new manual
>> canâEUR^(TM)t keep up with all the latest fixes and
>> additions, but the Help files are continually updated.
>>
>>
>> *From:* Gene Wheeler [mailto:bridge...@gmail.com
>> ]
>> *Sent:* Friday, January 03, 2014 5:46 PM
>> *To:* LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
>> *Subject:* [LegacyUG] CORRECTION: Legacy 8 User Manual
>>
>> I have the First Edition, Last revised: 26 April
>> 2013.  With all the changes made to the program since
>> then, I would like to know if there is a more recent
>> version that can be downloaded to replace this first
>> edition?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Gene
>>
>>
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>> 21 2009:
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>> (http://www.facebook.com/LegacyFamilyTree
>> ) and on
>> our blog (http://news.LegacyFamilyTree.com
>> ).
>>
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>>
>>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Lifespan, and other, statistics

[hwedhlor]

David,

I note that there has not been a single response to your
question from the Legacy staff.  I would have thought it a
simple thing for them to have supplied the answer to your
question, yet they have not done so.  Additionally I believe
there should be an appendix to the Legacy manual that
provides both the logic, and the formulas used for all
calculated numeric data.  Just like unsourced entries in our
databases, unexplained statistics are useless!

So, Legacy staff, what are the answers your customers are
asking for?

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 16-Dec-13 5:04 AM, David Newton wrote:
> Could one of you explain to me how the statistics are calculated?
>
> In my family file the average lifespan by century never exceeds 17 years
> whereas the average male and female lifespans are around 53 and 48
> respectively. These figures seem to be inconsistent with each other but
> in the absence of how the calculations are done I cannot be sure what it
> is telling me.
>
> David
>
>
>
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>
>
>




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Re: [LegacyUG] Surnames

[hwedhlor]

Hi Sue,

I would enter the surname into Legacy as it was entered on
whatever record I find. If I find the same person with
multiple spellings of their surname in different records,
then I will pick the one that was either most used, or that
the person was generally known by (if I know that), and use
that spelling, making an entry in notes indicating the
alternate spellings, and usually entering an AKA as well.

One place where I definitely use the same surname spelling
every time is in naming image files. I choose a "standard"
spelling for a surname line and use that spelling for every
image file name for members of that line. That way they all
sort in an orderly fashion, making it easier for me to find
a particular image, or document. So a digital image of a
birth record document for both a SMITH and a SMYTHE (who
were in the same line) would be named in my folders as

"SMITH_John_James_Birth_Rec_1879_Aug_10_Lawrence_Twp_Lawrence_Co_OH"


and

"SMITH_George_Birth_Rec_1838_May_4_Ironton_Lawrence_Co_OH"

I would likely add a -SMYTHE- to the second record with the
leading and trailing dashes indicating an alternative
spelling, so that the record would look like this:

"SMITH_-SMYTHE-_George_Birth_Rec_1838_May_4_Ironton_Lawrence_Co_OH"

That way a search with Windows Explorer would find the
record no matter which way I spelled it in the search field.

I have developed a standard for naming image files that has
served me very well over man years, even when dealing with
thousands of image files. I have documented that standard in
a PDF paper ("Describe Your Photos In Their Filenames.pdf")
which I will be happy to send to any subscriber if they
request it in a private e-mail. The last time I made the
offer to send the standard I received well over 100
requests, so please do not send such requests via this
e-mailing list as they really clutter up the mail. :-)

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ



On 10-Sep-13 12:16 PM, Sue Anderson wrote:
> Can I ask for guidance on surnames?
> Is it better to stick to a general surname for a family
> and put all others in akas or should I put what is
> actually on each record as the main name. Index view would
> be difficult.
> For example one English parish has
> 1608 Eliz d Simon Ayres
> 1611 William s Symon Aires
> 1617 Simon son of Simon Eire
> 1673 William son William Eyre
> In the same register there is Air, Aire, Ayre, Ayer, Eire,
> Eyre, Eyer + s on some and even Hare! Legacy gives the
> father’s name so should I leave that for children and put
> the others in akas?
> Sue Anderson
>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Never married option in Legacy 8

[hwedhlor]

Hi Jenny,

Of course people are concerned about words.  Words are how
we communicate, for the most part.  Most words have
definitions that are accepted widely enough to be included
in current dictionaries.

In the strictest of definitions of biological "genealogy"
the primary purpose of entering the names of two individuals
of opposite gender in our databases is to identify one as
the biological father, and the other as the biological
mother of a child.  Not to identify any residential, social,
civil or religious associations.  However, tagging all
sexual relationships that resulted in offspring as
"marriages" is ridiculous.

Those other relationships however are important to defining
the "family" environments that existed, and they are
important to us as family historians in both recording, and
researching our family histories.  For example, in my case I
was raised by loving, adoptive parents, and for the first
decade of my life the only "family" I knew were members of
that extended adoptive family. They are, and will remain,
family to me.  Conversely once I discovered my biological
relations I expanded my definition of "family" to include
each and every one of them, with whom I am also blessed with
having a loving relationship.  All of those "family"
members, biological and adoptive, are in my database, and I
have identified the relationship between myself and my
biological and adoptive parents so that I can easily switch
between the lines within Legacy Family Tree.

The primary definition of "relationship" is simply "the
quality or state of being related; connection."  If two
people create a child then by definition they had a
relationship in that creation, no matter how fleeting, or
involuntary that relationship might have been.  No matter
what the nature, or duration of the relationship, if it
resulted in offspring then one of the two people involved
was the father, and the other was the mother.  Conversely as
genealogists we have no interest in documenting the dating
history of our family members.  If a relationship that did
not result in offspring was acknowledged by civil or
religious documentation, or was recognized by family and/or
society as a "marriage" that relationship belongs in our
databases if we are recording family history.  I'm sure
there are additional relationships that I've overlooked, and
short of same-sex relationships the end-user is free to
document those in Legacy Family Tree to their hearts content.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 20-Jun-13 6:22 AM, Jenny M Benson wrote:
> On 18/06/2013 17:10, John Zimmerman wrote:
>> Why not simply rename the "Marriage Indormation Window" to call it the 
>> "Relationship Information Window"?
> Because then people would quibble over the meaning of the word
> "Relationship" and say that a "one-night-stand" or AI or rape or
> whatever does not constitute a "Relationship".
>
> It has long been my opinion that people (not specifically Legacy users)
> get far too hung up on actual words, rather than the intended meaning of
> a word or phrase.
>




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Re: [LegacyUG] Organization of Photos, Scanned Documents and etc.

[hwedhlor]

After many years of organizing image files I find there is
good reason to have a Places folder, and in that folder I
keep images of places and things (homes, headstones,
cemetery entrances, etc).  Most of the files in my Places
sub-folder, are named beginning with the surname they are
associated with (works for headstones, homes, businesses,
vehicles, etc.), but there are some categories of place and
thing images that lend themselves to being grouped together
with a common leading term.  A good example is photos of
cemetery entrances, for which I start the filename with
"Cemetery_" followed by the name of the cemetery followed by
the geographic locations.  For example
"Cemetery_Woodlawn_Cemetery_Detroit_MI".  That groups all
the cemetery entrance images together and sorts them
alphabetically by cemetery name.  Another category is
"Aviation_" which I use to preface photos of aircraft,
flight simulators, etc.  Yet another category with its own
preface is "Structure_" which groups all photos of
buildings, bridges, etc. together.  The idea is that photos
of anything that is not associated with a specific surname
will benefit from being grouped with other, like things.

I enter all surnames in all uppercase letters, and do the
same for state name abbreviations, and I separate each
component of a filename with an underscore (_).  Making all
surnames uppercase allows other preface entries to stand out
in a list and separating components with an underscore gives
visual separation to those components, making them easier to
read.

All photos of individuals are kept in the topmost image
folder.  In Legacy that is currently the Pictures
sub-folder.  I have three subfolders under Pictures.  They
are Docs, Groups and Places.  Docs contain all images of
documents.  Groups contain all images of two or more people,
and Places contain images of places and things. This system
has worked for me for many years in dealing with thousands
of image files.  It allows for easy lookups and minimizes
the number of folders and therefore the complexity of filing
and of hard drive searching.  If I need to copy, or move,
the entire collection I can do so by copying, or moving, the
topmost folder (Pictures) and all subfolders.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 11-May-13 2:51 PM, Syble Glasscock wrote:
> Glad to be of help, I don't think you'll regret using the
> Surname approach, yes, I too have some "Places" folders
> becasuse of various reason.
> Syble
> Families Researching: /Cline/Klein, Daniel, Newton,
> Witherspoon, Perryman, Gilbreath, Lindsey,  Brown,
> Foote, Curry, Fleming, Glasscock, Edwards, Waters, Wheat/
>
> *From:* Paula Ryburn 
> *To:* LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> *Sent:* Saturday, May 11, 2013 1:46 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [LegacyUG] Organization of Photos,
> Scanned Documents and etc.
>
> Thanks, Syble, for your feedback.  After pondering the
> decision quite a bit, I use the surname-first approach
> & you've made me sigh in relief. ;)  I've just
> recently added a folder for "places" that aren't
> really linked to an individual.  Otherwise, all
> documents and photos are named for the primary person.
> --Paula in Texas
> Researching: Adair Baker Beasley Benson Betz Bigley
> Blagrave Burton Chapman Clement Clough Coppernoll
> Costine Daulton Dinwiddie Doody Ellis Exline Field
> Floran Floyd Gates Goodale Gordon Gump Hale Harbaugh
> Hind Hopkins Hughes Hurdle Jones Klein Koyle Laswell
> McDonald Misner Passwaters Pelton Roberts Roche Ryburn
> Sanford Short Singer Sullivan Weller Williams
>
>
> *From:* Syble Glasscock 
> *To:* LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> *Sent:* Sat, March 16, 2013 9:44:20 AM
> *Subject:* Re: [LegacyUG] Organization of Photos,
> Scanned Documents and etc.
>
> 
> A word of caution, when I started, I'd name the
> document, i.e.:  wwi_draft_curry_james, thinking this
> would be good to have all WWI Draft Registration
> together, but as the years have gone by, how I wish,
> I'd named everything with the surname first that way
> all items for that particular individual would have
> been together.
> Now, with having my own website, it would be a lot of
> trouble renaming all items.
> Hope this helps, consider all ideas, but try as best
> you can to plan for many more items attached to Legacy.
> Syble
> 
>
>
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>  

Re: [LegacyUG] GraphicsMagick

[hwedhlor]

Wm,

I concur about FastStone Image Viewer being an outstanding
program.  FastStone Capture is another of their programs
that is outstanding.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 27-Apr-13 6:24 PM, Wm Voss wrote:
> FastStone is the best general use editor available, free or not. I have
> PSCS6 with all the bells, but have used FastStone for years and every day.
>
> Wm Voss
>
> On 27-Apr-13 6:11 PM, Virginia Dunham wrote:
>> I have used FastStone Image Viewer with very good results...also a
>> "freebie".
>> Â
>> Virginia
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Apr 27, 2013 at 8:29 PM, Priscilla Glasow
>> mailto:priscilla.gla...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>>  I'm trying to save files in TIFF format as recommended in the
>>  Legacy training videos.  I can save files from Ancestry in JPG,
>>  but not TIFF. (I was taking the long way around to do this, as
>>  evidenced by my last post - thank you all for your quick responses!)
>>  Â
>>  I came across info on the GraphicsMagick tool, which is free and
>>  can apparently convert graphics and images across format types.Â
>>  Has anyone used this and recommends it before I start converting
>>  all of my Legacy images with it?
>>  Â
>>  Many thanks in advance,
>>  Priscilla Glasow
>>  Â
>>  Â
>>
>>
>>  Legacy User Group guidelines:
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>>  (http://www.facebook.com/LegacyFamilyTree) and on our blog
>>  (http://news.LegacyFamilyTree.com).
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>>
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
>
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>
>
>




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Re: [LegacyUG] Clipboard Enhancements

[hwedhlor]

Jenny,

FreeClip is an extremely capable free program.  Thank you
for recommending it.

In the area of screen capture programs I can recommend
FastStone Capture, which is capable of capturing not only an
entire screen, or part of a screen, but also of scrolling
down, and capturing an entire web page, then cropping what
the user wishes to retain, and annotating the results.
There is a free version, and a for-fee version.  I've  used
it for years with excellent results.  It may be seen and
obtained at:

http://www.faststone.org/

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ




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Re: [LegacyUG] Questions regarding Source Type

[hwedhlor]

Brian,

I applaud your defense of "commemorative" records.  In my
opinion, the "worth" to the researcher of what are termed
commemorative certificates, should be held at least as
valuable as entries in a family Bible, or those held in
"official" repositories, in that they are created by
participants in the event at the time of that event.

In years when most of our research was conducted either in
person at record repositories, or via the mail communicating
with those repositories, I would have deemed such artifacts
less valuable due to the very limited access by remote
researchers to those commemorative documents.  However
today, when such documents may be easily scanned for
dissemination to other researchers, and certainly when such
scanned documents are accompanied by the written testimony
of those whose life events they document, I see no reason
why they should ever be doubted any more than, and in many
cases less than, those records reposing in "official"
vaults.  How often have we seen errors in "official"
records?  I suggest that the likelihood of errors in
documents created "on-the-spot", and in the presence of
those to whom they pertain, is less than those created by
"official" record-keepers, who often only transcribed
records created by churches and the like.

Although we rightly place great store in recording sources
available to other researchers it is my opinion that our
goal should be the accurate determination of names, dates,
places and events, and the veracity of a record should count
more than its place of repose, or its "official" nature.
Certainly a marriage certificate "freely handed out by
ministers" was sufficient proof of marriage to those being
wed, and was certainly enough to allow them to register at a
hotel, or to prove the legality of their matrimonial bond to
others in their families or community.

Sometimes I think we demean recording what we know to be
true in favor of recording what is "acceptable" to remote
researchers.  The attitude that if our source isn't
"official" it doesn't count smacks of the tail wagging the dog.

Ironically today such commemorative documents are
insufficient evidence to establish, for example, a Social
Security Number.  The bureaucracies only acknowledge the
"legality" of documents issued by their fellow
bureaucracies.  The written testimony of those who performed
the delivery of a baby, or the ceremony of marriage, counts
for nothing. :-)

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 2/15/2013 12:15 PM, Brian L. Lightfoot wrote:
> I absolutely agree with them being considered as "Artifacts, privately held". 
> The keys words to all of these documents are "commemorative" and "in my 
> possession". Otherwise, where would any other researcher now or in the future 
> go to see these documents. The answer is only to the original poster of the 
> question.
>
> And yes, I'll also be the first to admit that many people blur the lines 
> between "commemorative" and "official". I've seen many supposed birth 
> certificates from researchers that are in effect only the commemorative 
> certificate issued by the hospital and not the official record of birth 
> recorded by the local government agency. The same applies to those marriage 
> certificates that are freely handed out by ministers. But then as I grow 
> older and more forgiving, I have to ask myself, what is the difference? If a 
> person records one of these commemorative certificates as an official 
> document but adds notes something to the effect that it was issued by the 
> hospital, or minister, and is in their possession, that seems close enough 
> for me. At least the dates and locations are correct and those would be a 
> good pointer for looking for any official documents if so desired. Yeah, I 
> know --- I'll take a lot of heat for this. So what. One has to be thick 
> skinned to be on the LUG anyhow. :-)
>
>
> Brian in CA
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Gene Young [mailto:n2...@cfl.rr.com]
> Sent: Friday, February 15, 2013 10:45 AM
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] Questions regarding Source Type
>
> On 2/15/2013 1:24 PM, Sentz wrote:
>> Okay, I'll run the following up the flag pole again, since no one
>> responded a while ago.
>> How should one record the following in Legacy using the Source Writer.
>> I was trying to understand how to classify types of documents/data and
>> find the appropriate source type using the "What kind of source" data
>> field.
>> A child received "The Blessing of Little Children" rather than being
>> Christened or baptized as an infant. The name of the child, parents,
>> birthdate, church and date of blessing along with the names of the
>> officiating ministers are recorded in a commemorative card/pamphlet
>> that was given to the parents. Didn't see anything that was
>> appropriate in the big list of source types.  Would this be a generic source?
>> The parents of a child received a certificate of birth from the
>> hospital. This is sup

Re: [LegacyUG] Webinar Wednesday - Scotland wills, testaments, and land records

[hwedhlor]

Geoff,

Every security authority I deal with is advising that we
remove, or disable, Java on every computer we have.  This is
a serious security issue and I was concerned that it might
cause me to stop attending Legacy Webinars, which would be a
huge disappointment to me.  In order to determine the facts
I contacted the GoToWebinar folks technical support staff a
few minutes ago and asked them if Java were required to
attend webinars supported by their software?  The explained
to me that Java was no longer a requirement to attend a
webinar supported by them.  That answer is contrary to what
they post on their website under System Requirements, so I
pressed for more detail.  Their support engineer advised me
that I could download their software, then launch that
software manually, with Java disabled on my computer. If for
any reason that manual launching did not work they said to
reload their software and that should allow me to connect
and attend the Legacy webinars.

Considering the global concerns about Java, and the thought
that my explanation might not be the best to cover this
issue, it might be a good idea for Millennia to contact
GoToWebinar directly to obtain a set of directions about
this issue for posting on the Legacy website, and
distribution for potential webinar attendees.  That would go
a long way towards relieving concerns about Java. :-)

Best regards,

John

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 1/28/2013 11:42 AM, Geoff Rasmussen wrote:
>
> If you have Scottish ancestry, don't miss Webinar
> Wednesday presented by Marie Dougan. In "Inheritance in
> Scotland: Wills, Testaments, and Land Records," Marie will
> explore these records which are all useful in providing
> further evidence and documentation for your Scottish
> ancestors. She will be presenting from Glasgow, Scotland -
> you'll love her accent!
>
> Join us for the live webinar on Wednesday, January 30,
> 2013 at 2pm Eastern U.S. Register today to reserve your
> virtual seat. Registration is free but space is limited to
> the first 1,000 people to join that day. Before joining,
> please visit www.java.com  to ensure
> you have the latest version of Java which our webinar
> software requires. When you join, if you receive a message
> that the webinar is full, you know we've reached the 1,000
> limit, so we invite you to view the recording which should
> be published to the webinar archives within an hour or two
> of the event's conclusion.
>
> Registerbut 
>
> *Test Your Webinar Connection*
>
> To ensure that your webinar connection is ready to go,
> click here
>  and then
> click on the "Test Your GoToWebinar Connection" link.
>
> *About the presenter*
>
> Dougan-100
> Marie
> Dougan is a professional genealogist based in Scotland who
> holds a Post Graduate Diploma in Genealogical Studies from
> the University of Strathclyde in Glasgow. She has been
> involved in researching genealogy for over 14 years. Marie
> has an extensive background in education and provides a
> variety of training courses in genealogy, including the
> courses she teaches at the University of Strathclyde. She
> has a particular interest in the applications of
> technologies to assist in genealogical research. Marie is
> the owner of Ancestral Consultants
>  which provides a
> range of professional genealogy services.
>
> She is also the author of:
>
>   * Researching Your Scottish Ancestors
> 
> 
>  webinar-on-CD
>
> *Add it to your Google Calendar*
>
> With our Google Calendar button, you will never forget our
> upcoming webinars. Simply click the button to add it to
> your calendar. You can then optionally embed the webinar
> events (and even turn them on and off) into your own
> personal calendar. If you have already added the calendar,
> you do not have to do it again - the new webinar events
> will automatically appear.*
> *
>
> 
>
> *Webinar time*
>
> The webinar will be live on Wednesday, January 30, 2013 at:
>
>   * 2pm Eastern (U.S.)
>   * 1pm Central
>   * 12pm Mountain/Arizona
>   * 11am Pacific
>   * 7pm GMT
>
> Or use this Time Zone Converter
> .
>
> *Here's how to attend:*
>
>  1. Register at www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/webinars.asp
>  today.
> It's free!
>  2. You will receive a confirmation email containing a
> link to the webinar.
>  3. You will receive a reminder email during the week
> prior to the webinar.
>  4. Calculate your time zone by clicking

Re: [LegacyUG] Webinar_ Irish Ancestors

[hwedhlor]

Geoff,

I want to preface this with the comment that the
Legacy-sponsored webinars have been wonderful assets for the
genealogy community, and I appreciate them very much.  I've
attended nearly 90 of them and will continue to attend them.

Having said that I must say that the issue of the handouts
is a relatively minor annoyance for me.  When I have
attended seminars in person, either free or for a fee, there
have often been handouts provided by the presenters.  Those
handouts were often intended to give attendees material they
could glean from listening to the speakers and taking
notes.  By providing the detailed information on paper the
speakers did the attendees a service by reducing the need to
take detailed notes of things like web and mailing
addresses, book titles, etc.  That also allowed the
attendees could pay more close attention to the speaker,
thereby reducing the number of questions during, and after
the presentation.  It was pretty much a win/win situation.
Sometimes the handouts also included supplementary
information not spoken by the presenter.

My impression of the nature of the handout material
associated with Legacy-hosted webinars is that it comprises
considerable information that is not presented verbally or
on screen by the presenters. Offering such additional
information in the for-purchase-only handouts gives
customers additional incentive to purchase the webinar CDs,
and I certainly understand the financial logic for such a
marketing decision.  However, I am not fond of devoting an
hour-and-a-half listening to a presentation spiked with
remarks advising me that there is significant additional
information available only in the handouts.

That is particularly objectionable because those attending
the webinars contribute to the content of the CD by asking
questions and making comments during each presentation.  As
an attendee of an original broadcast of a webinar my
objection to having to buy the CD to get the handout is
heightened by the fact that I am often given little idea of
what I am getting in the handouts for the price of a CD
recording of a presentation that I have already sat
through!  Often all I know about the handouts is that they
comprise a certain number of pages.  At least when I attend
a seminar in person I can view the handouts and decide
whether I wish to take a copy away with me, or purchase them
if there is a fee.

I can understand charging a fee to those who did not attend
a webinar, but those of us who attended, it seems a bit much
to expect us to pay the price of a CD full of information we
have already heard, merely to get pages of unknown
information. Perhaps Legacy could offer webinar attendees
the option to buy the handouts separately as PDF downloads
for a more reasonable fee, and without the CD?

Thanks,

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 12/6/2012 11:44 AM, Geoff Rasmussen wrote:
> Interesting discussion everyonethere have only been a
> small handful of webinars where we have given away the
> handouts for free. Nearly all webinars include the
> handouts on the CD only. This decision allows us to
> partially pay for the costs (not inexpensive) of
> marketing, hosting, and producing each webinar and
> permitting them to be viewed for free. Your discussion has
> caused me to rethink the term handouts - I guess the term
> implies that they are free, so many we need to come up
> with a better term. If you have any good suggestions,
> please email me at ge...@legacyfamilytree.com.
>
> Thanks,
> Geoff Rasmussen
> Millennia Corporation
> ge...@legacyfamilytree.com 
> www.LegacyFamilyTree.com 
>
>
>
> On Thu, Dec 6, 2012 at 10:59 AM, Ronald Bernier
>  > wrote:
>
> I'm curious has anybody had the courtesy to ask
> Legacy/Geoff directly about the handouts?  Maybe it's
> just easier to have a mob action to slam Milennia on a
> public forum.
>
> Ron Bernier
> Woonsocket, RI
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Dec 6, 2012, at 12:56 PM, "Wes"  > wrote:
>
> > On 06-Dec-2012 12:42 PM, Brian L. Lightfoot wrote:
> >> You and several thousand other participants have
> now learned that Millennia and Judy Wight have managed
> to redefine the word "handout" to mean available for
> purchase instead of its historical meaning, i.e.
> freely given. The next real seminar that I attend in
> person, I think I'll interrupt the speaker and ask
> "How much are these free handouts here at the back of
> the room?"
> >>
> >> Why or why did they did just not say that the
> additional information was available on the CD which
> is available for purchase? Then there would have been
> no questions.
> >>
> >> Brian in CA
> >> (PS - Just like you, I followed the link during the
> live webinar for the "handouts" and found myself on
> the Millennia web page where one c

Re: [LegacyUG] Latest Webinar not working?

[hwedhlor]

Sherry,

The Google Chrome browser is not the problem.  I just tested
viewing "Breaking Down Your Irish Brick Wall" on two systems
and it worked beautifully on both.  One was running Windows
XP Pro 32 bit and Chrome and the other was running Windows 7
Pro 64 bit and Chrome.  I was able to view the webinar on
both, accessing them via Chrome and the Legacy Family Tree
website.  The triangle Play icon was present on both as well.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 11/2/2012 8:34 AM, Sherry/Support wrote:
> Are you using the Chrome browser or do you have Chrome installed?
> There seems to be some incompatibility with the webinar videos and
> Chrome
>
> Sincerely,
> Sherry
> Technical Support
> Legacy Family Tree
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 8:26 AM, Marg Strong  wrote:
>> No triangle. Nothing on the page but the large black square, a white square
>> with some webinar details and that all surrounded with black. I tried
>> randomly clicking in the black square, in case, but it didn't work. All
>> other web pages look as they should.
>> Peggy
>
>




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Re: [LegacyUG] Using uppercase letters in file names

[hwedhlor]

Thank you.  You're absolutely right.  The default setting is
"Convert to lowercase letters", but options are provided to
"Convert to UPPERCASE" and "Don't change case".

John

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 10/15/2012 12:44 PM, bgsu1...@gmail.com wrote:
> hwedhlor  proclaimed:
>
>> When Legacy creates
>> a web page ALL image file names (as well as folder names)
>> are converted to lower case
> I believe the Filenames option on the Web Page Creation Formatting tab
> controls this. So don't assume Legacy does this automatically.
>




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[LegacyUG] Concerning Google and underscores

[hwedhlor]

Brian,

Thanks for the link. Interesting reading, but not something
that has much impact for me in naming image files. Google is
concerned primarily with searching out keywords, and many
folks would like each word in a series of words to be
"searchable." That's not a concern for me in placing an
image file in a web page. If Google tries to search a web
page of genealogical data there are plenty of instances of
the various surnames on a web page for Google to "find"
without having to search through the image file names.
Google apparently treats words connected by underscores as a
single word (e.g. "This_is_a_single_word_to_Google"). That's
not a concern when it comes to image file names, and
changing to hyphens between the works degrades readability
considerably, so I'll stick with underscores until such time
as they cause a real problem.

John

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 10/15/2012 12:25 PM, Brian L. Lightfoot wrote:
>
> And just to show that the entire Internet is still in its
> infancy, along comes Google and changes the ground rules
> for the underscore. Interesting reading here…
>
> http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/2006/04/of-spaces-underscores-and-dashes.html
>
> OK, at the risk of this entire thread getting off-topic,
> it does bear some importance to Legacy users who want to
> put their files on the Web. But I think the moderator is
> about to pull the plug on this anyhow.
>
> Brian in CA
>
>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical files after death of compi ler

[hwedhlor]

Excellent point, Paula.

John

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 10/15/2012 11:34 AM, Paula Ryburn wrote:
> Remember, though, the nightmare you will cause yourself in
> relinking files to Legacy if you use a bulk renaming
> utility outside Legacy.
> Support recommends renaming photo files in the Picture Center.
> There is no short-cut, though, for files linked to
> sources/citations.
> --Paula
>
>
> ----
> *From:* hwedhlor 
> *To:* LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> *Sent:* Mon, October 15, 2012 1:04:13 AM
> *Subject:* Re: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical
> files after death of compi ler
>
> Windows will allow spaces, as well as a host of symbols in
> file names, and it's true that you can use programs to
> search and replace spaces (and other characters).  I'm
> partial to one called The Rename, by Herve Thouzard.  Having
> said that I find the underscore to provide the visual
> separation necessary to make file names both readable, and
> useable in both Windows and on a website under HTML or XML.
> By using the underscore between components in my file names
> I feel that I get the best of both worlds and won't have to
> make changes at a later date.
>
> John Zimmerman
> Mesa, AZ
>
> On 10/14/2012 5:33 PM, JLB wrote:
> > I have thousands of file names with spaces in them
> because I like the
> > look of it better. IF I should ever decide to put them
> online, a free
> > program called Bulk Rename Utility can change the names
> of files (i.e.
> > add hyphens or underscores) in a matter of minutes to
> tens of thousands
> > of files at once, so don't be paranoid on this issue.
> > --
> > JL Beeken
> > JLog - simple computer technology for genealogists
> > http://www.jgen.ws/jlog/
> >
> > On 10/14/2012 5:16 PM, Ron Ferguson wrote:
> >> Bob,
> >>
> >> Just a quick piece of advice for those who may at some
> time consider creating a website - do not have spaces in
> your file names, use an underscore or hyphen instead,
> otherwise they may well not work.
> >>
> >> In fact it is best only to use alpha-numeric characters
> in addition to the above two.
> >> Ron Ferguson
> >> http://www.fergys.co.uk/
> >> GOONS #5307
> >>
> >>
> >> "Robert Austen" <mailto:rgaus...@telus.net>> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Hi Ellen,
> >>>
> >>> Regarding photos... please remember that the RIN# only
> means something if the person looking at it has YOUR
> Legacy file - even then the number can be changed.  You
> also need your Legacy file, and the Legacy program, to
> look up the number.  This applies to MRIN #'s as well.
> Have a look at John Zimmerman's recent posts about naming
> - well presented and good food for thought.  I file photos
> by birth name - "last name, given names, dates - other
> info" such as "Adams, Marjorie Alice 1896-1962 - Birth
> Certificate" Anyone can find their way through my file
> without a program or an index.  I also make good use of
> the IPTC info section embedded in digital photos for
> additional info.
> >>>
> >>> Congratulations on the work you are doing.  I am the
> unofficial 'keeper of the tree' in my family.  I have a
> couple boxes of poorly organized documents however,
> everything has been scanned and everything is kept
> digitally in my file and reasonably well organized.  I
> also am aware that the DVD's that my data is stored on
> will one day be obsolete and the data could be lost.  Most
> of my family is fairly interested in some of the
> information but not genealogy per se.  My wife had a great
> system of filling paper documents but had over seventy 4"
> binders with about 1500 family members.  I know my small
> local public library would NOT be interested in them even
> though we have a great genealogy section (about one half
> of one floor).  I have close to 30,000 family members in
> my file, 18,000 items in my picture file, and 26,000 in my
> document file.  How does one do a paper system for that?
> I would need the whole library to store my data on paper!
> >>>
> >>> A few years ago we had a 'family reunion' with about
> 20 members.  My (limited, at that time) genealogy info and
> charts were a great hit.  I had also asked most to give me
> a short story, or testimonial, about themselves and many
> responded - some at great length.  I think it's time to
> send the request out again!
> >>>
> >>> Keep up the good work.  Regardless of wher

Re: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical files after death of compi ler

[hwedhlor]

Paula,

You are very welcome.  It would be a shame if the work we
have dedicated so many years to were never shared, or worse,
discarded out of hand by those who didn't know, or care what
it represented.

John

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 10/15/2012 11:21 AM, Paula Ryburn wrote:
> John, Thank you for your thoughtful response, especially
> this bit...
> --Paula i
>
>
> 
> *From:* hwedhlor 
> *To:* LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> *Sent:* Fri, October 12, 2012 5:57:07 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical
> files after death of compi ler
>
> 
>
> Don't let the "unfinished" nature
> of your research keep you from distributing what you already
> have.  Better to publish some of your incomplete, or poorly
> sourced research than to let it be lost if you die
> suddenly.
> 
>
>
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[LegacyUG] Using uppercase letters in file names

[hwedhlor]

Doc types aside, whether you are using HTML, XML or the
various versions of XHTML, you may still use image file
names with uppercase, or mixed case, so long as those file
names are enclosed in quotation marks.  If any of those web
languages could not accept entries enclosed in quotation
marks that included uppercase letters, then they would not
be able to display simple text sentences, which they
obviously can do.

One further note.  Legacy has no problem creating a web page
using image file names that contain underscores, hyphens or
ampersands, nor does it balk at using image file names that
contain some, or all uppercase letters.  When Legacy creates
a web page ALL image file names (as well as folder names)
are converted to lower case and stored in the location of
your choosing.  No further manipulation of those file names
is conducted by Legacy.  It does not strip away any
underscore, hyphen or ampersand symbols from those file
names, nor is it unable to display image files whose file
names contain any of those symbols.

Image files for Legacy-created web pages are kept in a
Pictures folder location that can be designated by the user
at the time the web page code is generated.  Since I choose
to use some uppercase letters in my image file names I would
designate a separate Pictures folder location for web file
images.  As the image files I use for Legacy are contained
in the following folder structure:

C:\Legacy7\Pictures

And since there are three subfolders (Docs, Groups and
Places) under that main Pictures folder, I would take care
that I directed Legacy to place image files for any web page
it created in another place. For example:

C:\Legacy7\web\zimmerman_web_page\webpictures

That way my original picture files would retain their
uppercase characteristics.  The additional image files
created by Legacy for use with the web page take up very
little disk space as Legacy reduces the size of the
originals for use on the web.  Those file sizes are
determined by the size you choose for the displayed images
in the web page.  As an example, an image file that was 42KB
and 238x258 pixels in my Legacy Pictures folder was reduced
to only 5KB and 161x231 pixels when converted for use on a
web page where I chose to display images in Medium size.
The entire array of 218 images for that web page took up
1.13MB of disk space in the web page webpictures folder.

I notice that one alteration was made to six image file
names.  Each of them were of Schmidt family members and the
file names were converted to lowercase and preceded by the
letter "b" followed by an underscore.  I have been unable to
determine how those six image files differed in any way from
the remaining 212 image files.

Out of curiosity I altered an image file in the webpictures
folder to all uppercase letters.  I also altered the HTML
code associated with displaying that image file so that the
filename it contained was also all uppercase letters.  The
result was that the image was displayed without incident.

I am aware that many Legacy users are not fond of the web
pages created by Legacy, but for those of you who choose to
use Legacy to create a web page there is no need to alter
your image files to make them all lowercase, or to remove
underscores, hyphens or ampersands.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 10/15/2012 9:30 AM, R G Strong-genes wrote:
> Ron,
> It depends on the doc type for the website and whether you wish the site to
> be compliant to that doc type. For example if the website is just HTML
> coding the ampersand has no problems, however some of the newer types are to
> be XHTML compliant and are encoded with PHP coding both of which do have
> problems with the ampersand and other characters that should be spelled out
> with their code. Also with XHTML everything should be in lowercase.
> Russ
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Robert Austen
> Sent: Sunday, October 14, 2012 9:19 PM
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical files after death of
> compi ler
>
> Hi Ron,
>
> Thanks for this.  John also showed everything connected with underscores. I
> appreciate the comment regarding creating a website.  Time to go back and
> fill in the spaces.  John also recommended only the hyphen, underscore and
> 'ampersand'.  I am very inexperienced in HTML coding but I thought I had
> heard of problems with the ampersand, particularly in a url unless it's
> written as '&'.  I suppose the phot file name could show up in a url.
>
> Your thoughts?
>
> Bob
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Ron Ferguson [mailto:ronfergy@tiscali.co.uk]
> Sent: Sunday, October 14, 2012 5:16 PM
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical files after death of
> compi ler
>
> Bob,
>
> Just a quick piece of advice for those who may at some time consider
> creating a website - do not have spaces in your file names, use an
> underscore or hyphen instead, otherwise th

[LegacyUG] Using symbols in image file names

[hwedhlor]

I have never had any difficulties with the underscore (_),
hyphen (-) or ampersand (&) characters in file names on
websites.  The only reason I have inserted the ampersand
character in file names at all is that it provided a more
readable separation between the names of married couples for
entry of a marriage record and it saved the space that would
have been used by two more characters if I had used "and"
for the connector, thereby lengthening the file name.  The
hyphen has provided a useful means of indicating either
maiden names, or married names, as well as a means of
depicting birth and death years when naming a file depicting
a headstone (e.g.
SMITH_JOHN_W_HEADSTONE_1857-1944_GRANDLAWN_CEM_DETROIT_MI.JPG).
Windows has no objection to any of the three symbols in file
names, so Legacy does not either.

The file names I have discussed using on websites are all
image files, usually JPG files. HyperText Markup Language
(HTML) uses a variety of symbols as instructions.  If one of
those symbols were entered in a line of HTML code by itself
they would cause trouble because HTML would try to follow
the instructions the symbol represented.  However filenames
of images for display are entered into HTML code in a very
distinctive manner that avoids the issue of how to interpret
symbols.  Such file names are preceded by code that tells
HTML that what follows will be the location and file name of
file for display.  The location and name of the file are
then enclosed in quotation marks.  HTML then simply looks
for the file name in the appropriate folder.

A typical HTML entry for a marriage record image might look
like this:



Here is an explanation of the components of the entry above:

1.   - tells the browser that is the end of the image
source information.

Such an image file instruction might also be preceded by
instructions on how to align the images on the page or
within a table as a cell.

I hope this helps clear up some questions.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 10/14/2012 6:19 PM, Robert Austen wrote:
> Hi Ron,
>
> Thanks for this.  John also showed everything connected with underscores. I 
> appreciate the comment regarding creating a website.  Time to go back and 
> fill in the spaces.  John also recommended only the hyphen, underscore and 
> 'ampersand'.  I am very inexperienced in HTML coding but I thought I had 
> heard of problems with the ampersand, particularly in a url unless it's 
> written as '&'.  I suppose the phot file name could show up in a url.
>
> Your thoughts?
>
> Bob
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Ron Ferguson [mailto:ronfergy@tiscali.co.uk]
> Sent: Sunday, October 14, 2012 5:16 PM
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical files after death of 
> compi ler
>
> Bob,
>
> Just a quick piece of advice for those who may at some time consider creating 
> a website - do not have spaces in your file names, use an underscore or 
> hyphen instead, otherwise they may well not work.
>
> In fact it is best only to use alpha-numeric characters in addition to the 
> above two.
> Ron Ferguson
> http://www.fergys.co.uk/
> GOONS #5307
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Legacy User Group guidelines:
> http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
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> our blog (http://news.LegacyFamilyTree.com).
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>
>
>




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Re: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical files after death of compi ler

[hwedhlor]

arding genealogy files, our one side of the family has a duly elected 
>>> Family Historian along with other officers for the Reunion Committee.  When 
>>> the last Family Historian was dying of cancer, she quietly had a relative 
>>> help her to bring boxes and boxes of info to local genealogical and 
>>> historical societies.  She didn't like genealogy software but wanted 
>>> everything in Microsoft Word using the family's old numbering system.  We 
>>> have corrected so many mistakes that now that numbering system is obsolete 
>>> and irrelevant since it was based upon birth order, some of which were very 
>>> wrong.
>>>
>>> However, she also had 17 boxes of uncomputerized, unsorted, unfiled, 
>>> unorganized mess leftover.  Her grandson gave it to the President of the 
>>> Family Reunion Committee.  I was elected the new Family Historian and have 
>>> been influencing and connecting with others in the family who use Legacy.  
>>> Those switching over to Legacy are amazed.  My predecessor never "worked 
>>> with people."  She felt threatened by others.  However, my first step was 
>>> reaching out to others and forming a committee which is working on 
>>> finalizing a book after my being elected in August of 2009.  I still have 
>>> about 12-13 boxes to go through, but we have compiled all the prior 
>>> published research into the computer, worked on LOTS and LOTS of 
>>> corrections of info, run Potential Problems Reports as well, and solicited 
>>> updates from everyone possible with a promise of a free print out of their 
>>> grandparents on down.  Next year is the 280th anniversary of our first male 
>>> immigrant's arrival in the colonies, and we exp
> ect to have the book ready just 4 years after being elected.  Hopefully we 
> can have much more of the articles and things scanned and in the next book in 
> 2020.  Forty years is way to long for people to wait for a book with the last 
> 15 years having someone in charge who doesn't even own a computer.
>>> Our Family Reunion is actually a genealogy fest.  LOTS of very distant 
>>> relatives have been working on research so we know no dearth of interest.  
>>> We even have a few minutes of storytelling by the Family Historian as well 
>>> as a report of the deaths/births/marriages since the prior year.  With so 
>>> many sad stories, I thought it would be great to tell one fairly good 
>>> story.  We will have to check out what was given away, but I have plenty to 
>>> keep me busy for a long time even without whatever she gave away.
>>>
>>> God bless,
>>> Ellen
>>>
>>> On Oct 14, 2012, at 1:47 AM, hwedhlor wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Ron,
>>>>
>>>> That's a fair comment, and one with which I completely agree.  I
>>>> should have ask those requesting copies to contact me offlist, and
>>>> would have done so if I expected such a large response.  My apologies
>>>> to the list.
>>>>
>>>> Anyone requesting copies of my file naming documents please contact me
>>>> offlist.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> John Zimmerman
>>>> Mesa, AZ
>>>>
>>>> On 10/13/2012 10:18 AM, Ron Bernier wrote:
>>>>> Could all of these "Me too" posts please be taken off line.  Rather
>>>>> than clog up the list with non Legacy "me too" posts, it would be
>>>>> much more considerate of other Legacy subscribers if folks were to
>>>>> contact the original poster via his personal email address.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ron Bernier
>>>>> Woonsocket, RI
>>>>>
>>>>> On Saturday, October 13, 2012, Lee Bruch wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>  I too would be interested in receiving copies.
>>>>>  Thanks
>>>>>  Lee Bruch
>>>>>
>>>>>  -Original Message-
>>>>>  From: hwedhlor [mailto:hwedh...@cox.net]
>>>>>  Sent: Friday, October 12, 2012 11:56 PM
>>>>>  To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
>>>>>  Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical
>>>>>  files after death of compi ler
>>>>>
>>>>>  JLB and Robert Austen,
>>>>>
>>>>>  Thank you both for your kind remarks.
>>>>>
>>>>>  On the further subject of archiving images in Legacy

Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy on Ipad, how is it?

[hwedhlor]

Hi MJ,

I run the Families app on an iPad 2 and enjoy using it very
much. I served as a beta for the app on iPhone and iPad and
can vouch for the intelligent and responsive attitude of
TelGen.  The Families will allow you to work on your family
tree on the iPad, or on an Android-based tablet.  Data from
your Legacy database is synced to the tablet and if changes
are made to the database on that tablet they may be synced
back to Legacy your computer. Photos may be displayed on the
iPad and you can search on surnames or given names, RINs and
by location.  Display modes include individual, family,
pedigree, descendant and timeline.  There is a photo gallery
and photos may be displayed as thumbnails or full-screen.
You may also view and edit your data, including events and
sources.  Relationship may also be viewed.

Of course if you have access to Ancestry you can sign on to
their website with the browser on the iPad and search there
with the iPad.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 10/14/2012 6:12 PM, MJ SA wrote:
> I would like to be able to work on my family tree, like fixing my
> sources, on the app on the ipad.  I will be on bed rest for a few
> weeks, that is why I am thinking the IPAD maybe the way to go, but
> when Ancestry told me you can't do any research on it, just to view
> your tree, it made me think, what other programs can't be used
> properly  on the IPAD.
>
> On Sun, Oct 14, 2012 at 8:26 PM, Paul Gray  wrote:
>> Actually the app is from a third party supplier Tel Gen, and it's called
>> Families.
>>
>> I use the Android version, but it's virtually identical to the IPAD version.
>> In my opinion, it's great for viewing your data (including multimedia) on a
>> portable device. Although some will disagree, although it allows input of
>> new data, I find that part of it a bit awkward, but that might just be my
>> unfamiliarity using the on screen keybord.
>>
>> Paul Gray
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Oct 14, 2012, MJ SA  wrote:
>>
>> I am thinking of getting an Ipad. Ancestry told me that they have an
>> app, you can view your family tree, but you can't do much searching.
>> I know Legacy has an app, does anyone use it for the Ipad, are there
>> any restrictions?
>>
>>
>>
>> Legacy User Group guidelines:
>> http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
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>>
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
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>
>
>




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Re: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical files after death of compi ler

[hwedhlor]

Hi Ellen,

Thank you for posting the story of your work as the Family
Historian!  I very much enjoyed reading of the work you are
doing and applaud your sensible approach to organizing the
data you were provided, to gathering more and to making it
available to others in your family.

Keep up the great work,

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 10/14/2012 10:42 AM, Ellen wrote:
> Regarding photos AND what to do with files after death of compiler.
>
> Regarding photos, we have too many people of the same name so I use the RIN # 
> in the name of the photo.
>
> Regarding genealogy files, our one side of the family has a duly elected 
> Family Historian along with other officers for the Reunion Committee.  When 
> the last Family Historian was dying of cancer, she quietly had a relative 
> help her to bring boxes and boxes of info to local genealogical and 
> historical societies.  She didn't like genealogy software but wanted 
> everything in Microsoft Word using the family's old numbering system.  We 
> have corrected so many mistakes that now that numbering system is obsolete 
> and irrelevant since it was based upon birth order, some of which were very 
> wrong.
>
> However, she also had 17 boxes of uncomputerized, unsorted, unfiled, 
> unorganized mess leftover.  Her grandson gave it to the President of the 
> Family Reunion Committee.  I was elected the new Family Historian and have 
> been influencing and connecting with others in the family who use Legacy.  
> Those switching over to Legacy are amazed.  My predecessor never "worked with 
> people."  She felt threatened by others.  However, my first step was reaching 
> out to others and forming a committee which is working on finalizing a book 
> after my being elected in August of 2009.  I still have about 12-13 boxes to 
> go through, but we have compiled all the prior published research into the 
> computer, worked on LOTS and LOTS of corrections of info, run Potential 
> Problems Reports as well, and solicited updates from everyone possible with a 
> promise of a free print out of their grandparents on down.  Next year is the 
> 280th anniversary of our first male immigrant's arrival in the colonies, and 
> we expect to have the book ready just 4 years after being elected.  Hopefully 
> we can have much more of the articles and things scanned and in the next book 
> in 2020.  Forty years is way to long for people to wait for a book with the 
> last 15 years having someone in charge who doesn't even own a computer.
>
> Our Family Reunion is actually a genealogy fest.  LOTS of very distant 
> relatives have been working on research so we know no dearth of interest.  We 
> even have a few minutes of storytelling by the Family Historian as well as a 
> report of the deaths/births/marriages since the prior year.  With so many sad 
> stories, I thought it would be great to tell one fairly good story.  We will 
> have to check out what was given away, but I have plenty to keep me busy for 
> a long time even without whatever she gave away.
>
> God bless,
> Ellen
>
> On Oct 14, 2012, at 1:47 AM, hwedhlor wrote:
>
>> Hi Ron,
>>
>> That's a fair comment, and one with which I completely
>> agree.  I should have ask those requesting copies to contact
>> me offlist, and would have done so if I expected such a
>> large response.  My apologies to the list.
>>
>> Anyone requesting copies of my file naming documents please
>> contact me offlist.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> John Zimmerman
>> Mesa, AZ
>>
>> On 10/13/2012 10:18 AM, Ron Bernier wrote:
>>> Could all of these "Me too" posts please be taken off
>>> line.  Rather than clog up the list with non Legacy "me
>>> too" posts, it would be much more considerate of other
>>> Legacy subscribers if folks were to contact the original
>>> poster via his personal email address.
>>>
>>> Ron Bernier
>>> Woonsocket, RI
>>>
>>> On Saturday, October 13, 2012, Lee Bruch wrote:
>>>
>>> I too would be interested in receiving copies.
>>> Thanks
>>> Lee Bruch
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: hwedhlor [mailto:hwedh...@cox.net ]
>>> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2012 11:56 PM
>>> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
>>> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical
>>> files after death of compi ler
>>>
>>> JLB and Robert Austen,
>>>
>>> Thank you both for your kind remarks.
>>>
>>> On the further subject of archiving images in Legacy
>>> and else

Re: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical files after death of compi ler

[hwedhlor]

Hi Ron,

That's a fair comment, and one with which I completely
agree.  I should have ask those requesting copies to contact
me offlist, and would have done so if I expected such a
large response.  My apologies to the list.

Anyone requesting copies of my file naming documents please
contact me offlist.

Thanks,

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 10/13/2012 10:18 AM, Ron Bernier wrote:
> Could all of these "Me too" posts please be taken off
> line.  Rather than clog up the list with non Legacy "me
> too" posts, it would be much more considerate of other
> Legacy subscribers if folks were to contact the original
> poster via his personal email address.
>
> Ron Bernier
> Woonsocket, RI
>
> On Saturday, October 13, 2012, Lee Bruch wrote:
>
> I too would be interested in receiving copies.
> Thanks
>     Lee Bruch
>
> -Original Message-
> From: hwedhlor [mailto:hwedh...@cox.net ]
> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2012 11:56 PM
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical
> files after death of compi ler
>
> JLB and Robert Austen,
>
> Thank you both for your kind remarks.
>
> On the further subject of archiving images in Legacy
> and elsewhere,
>
> 
>
> If anyone is interested I will be happy to send them a
> five-page rationale and a one-page quick reference
> sheet, both in MS Word format, or to publish that
> rationale here if there is sufficient demand.
>
> John Zimmerman
> Mesa, AZ
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Ron Bernier
> Woonsocket, RI
>
>
> Legacy User Group guidelines:
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> (http://www.facebook.com/LegacyFamilyTree) and on our blog
> (http://news.LegacyFamilyTree.com).
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Re: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical files after death of compi ler

[hwedhlor]

Hi Confused,

I'm glad you enjoyed the post and that it has you thinking
about image storing, etc.

All the best,

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 10/13/2012 10:13 AM, Confused wrote:
> On 10/12/2012 4:55 PM, hwedhlor wrote:
>> I had a friend who spent a lifetime researching and writing
>> his family history.
> John. Excellent post. This has much value and things to think about. I
> am thoroughly impressed on the work he had done, then the preservation
> you have taken. I need to re-think my storage. Thank you.
>




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Re: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical files after death of compi ler

[hwedhlor]

JLB and Robert Austen,

Thank you both for your kind remarks.

On the further subject of archiving images in Legacy and
elsewhere, while I was working through the thousands of
documents, articles and images a lady delivered to my friend
a pair of cardboard boxes, each measuring about two feet on
each side. Both boxes were filled to the brim with beautiful
photographs, mostly from the last quarter of the 19th
century, though some were as late as the 1920s from the
styles of clothing, and some were early cabinet photos from
the 1860s. They were all extremely well preserved and
unblemished, mounted in mats and folders. The product of a
variety of studios in a variety of geographic locations. The
lady who brought them had no idea who they were, or to whom
they might be related. She knew that we were doing some
fairly intensive work on family history and thought we might
be able to identify some of them or find descendants who
might like to have them. Unfortunately not a single
photograph had any identifying markings. Those photos should
have been scanned and posted on web sites for others to view
and possibly identify. I have no idea what the disposition
of those photos was. What a tragic loss to the families of
those in the photos.

I urge all of you to mark the photos you have with names,
dates, places and circumstances where know, and also to scan
each image and develop a file naming standard that will
allow anyone viewing the file names to know who, what, when
and where they were taken. Paper, or electronic filing
systems that tag photos and image files with numbers and
require separate index lists to identify those in the
photos, or systems that place photos and image files in
folders by surname, but only use given names on the photos
themselves, often end up with the index lists disappearing,
or the photos being separated from the surname folders. Each
individual photo, or electronic image file should bear
enough information to identify the people in the image,
along with the date, place and ideally the circumstances of
that photo or image file.

I strongly urge that your file naming standard be based on
surnames rather than on dates. Our goal is to document the
lives of people, not the happenings of years. Those who come
after us may not have a clue what year look at for a
particular image, but they will recognize the surnames, and
often the given names, of those whose image they seek in a
list of electronic file names. There is much more that can
be done to develop a useful file naming standard, and I have
documented such a standard in previous submissions to this
list. I developed my personal standard over a period of
years working with thousands of photographs of other peoples
families. Having such a file naming standard allowed me to
organize those images so that I could find anyone easily in
seconds. That standard us now fairly well-established,
though minor changes continue to evolve as needs arise. One
of the additional benefits of the file naming standard I use
is that it allows me to keep all of my electronic images of
individuals in a single folder, and images of groups (2 or
more people in a photo), documents and places & things in
three sub-folders. That makes it very easy to both back up
those image files, or to move them if the need arises. If
anyone is interested I will be happy to send them a
five-page rationale and a one-page quick reference sheet,
both in MS Word format, or to publish that rationale here if
there is sufficient demand.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 10/12/2012 4:14 PM, Robert Austen wrote:
>
> I have witnessed similar ‘tragedies’ of lost files and
> work. On the brighter side I discovered a binder, with all
> handwritten notes, in a small town ‘research’ center that
> contained info on a relative. The archivist knew the
> person who donated it, called them immediately, we met and
> all enjoyed the ‘family reunion’. She also gave much more
> info and photos, and was grateful to hear/receive other
> info on the family even though she would not be doing any
> research.
>
> My file is much too large to print everything out but I do
> share the complete Legacy file with a cousin thereby
> safeguarding the information. We both spend a great deal
> of time each day on research and can work through the
> problems/walls that arise. It is great to have someone to
> share/do that with. However, neither one of us has a close
> family member that is keen on genealogy so our tree may
> die with us!
>
> John Zimmerman’s later post is well taken.
>
> Bob
>
> *From:*gcr...@juno.com [mailto:gcr...@juno.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, October 11, 2012 2:23 PM
> *To:* LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> *Subject:* RE: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical
> files after death of compi ler
>
> Lets be honest and face it. No matter what format our
> life's work is in it becomes questionable as to whether it
> will survive us, especially if what we do is not
> appreciated in anyway by our survivors.
>

Re: [LegacyUG] What to do with genealogical files after death of compi ler

[hwedhlor]

I had a friend who spent a lifetime researching and writing
his family history.  He kept a daily journal, entering 1,500
words each day for over 67 years and taking thousands of
photographs.  My friend privately published six volumes of
400+ pages each, 9"x12" hardbound and had 100 copies printed
of each of the six volumes.  A few copies were given to the
local LDS Family History Centers and to the one in Salt Lake
City, as well as to local libraries where he lived and where
he grew up, but most of the libraries to which he offered
his work declined his offer because of space restrictions.
At the point when I became involved my friend had 14 more 3"
ring binders full of information and photos which he
intended to have published in the same format as the
previous six volumes.  The estimated cost of printing the
remaining volumes of his work was $80,000.00.  I suggested
that he consider publishing his work on CD which would
include the contents of his previous six volumes as well as
his unpublished work, and that he print only a few paper
volumes of the new work.  My friend agreed and asked me to
undertake that task.

Much of my friend's work had been recorded on hard drives
and floppy disks, but the two old original IBM PCs in which
the hard drives were installed no longer ran.  I had to
install new BIOS chips to get them running.  Then we
discovered that the programs he had used (word processors
and genealogical database software) to record and organize
his data would no longer run either, and the backup copies
he had made were not readable by current versions of his
software.  A third, more modern PC also would not run and
had to be resurrected.  He had two running PCs and both were
shakey at best.  We bought a new PC, and updated software,
and over a period of three years I was able to recover the
electronic versions of all what my friend had so laboriously
written.

The completed CD included the previously printed six volumes
as well as much of the later data and was automated to run
on any then-current PC under several contemporary browsers
and on a variety of screen sizes.  All of the text was
searchable, and the photos were integrated into the text of
many articles, genealogical histories, journal entries and
various charts and reports.  The photos were also available
in an indexed photo gallery. When my friend and his wife
passed away a few years later not a single one of his
children wanted the CD.  The remaining books (a few hundred
copies) were boxed up and hauled away to an unknown fate.

The one lesson I took from having helped with that project
is that it pays to disseminate your data as widely as
possible, and in as many formats as possible, while you are
living.  Make paper copies.  Publish online.  Make CDs.
Give away copies of your files to relatives and other
researchers as you work.  Don't let the "unfinished" nature
of your research keep you from distributing what you already
have.  Better to publish some of your incomplete, or poorly
sourced research than to let it be lost if you die
suddenly.  Try not to let possessiveness overcome
willingness to share.  We all like to be credited with what
we've discovered, but it's better to disclose information we
have rather than to risk it being lost forever because we
fear those receiving it won't mention us when they publish.

One last thought.  No electronic format is permanent.  They
all deteriorate, and they will all become obsolete
eventually.  If you choose to use an eletronic format you
should also commit to keeping that format up-to-date.  Don't
stick with an old version of the software you're using
simply because you like the old version, or because you're
comfortable using it.  Keep your hardware and software up to
date!  If not immediately when it's released, at least
within say a year of that release. Stagnation can mean your
data will no longer be useable to those who come after you.
Even paper copies can burn, or be thrown out, so diversify
and distribute!

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ




On 10/12/2012 12:36 PM, JLB wrote:
> You win the prize for writing the most depressing post I've ever read.
>
> I don't agree with the paper thing either. First of all, mine is way too
> much to print and it's no guarantee anyway.
>
> Share while you can. If your close relatives are boobs at least it's all
> somewhere else and has a fighting chance.
> ---
> JL Beeken
> JLog - simple computer technology for genealogists
> http://www.jgen.ws/jlog/
>
> On 10/11/2012 2:23 PM, gcr...@juno.com wrote:
>> Lets be honest and face it. No matter what format our life's work is in
>> it becomes questionable as to whether it will survive us, especially if
>> what we do is not appreciated in anyway by our survivors.
>>
>> I personally knew of a situation where a friend and fellow genealogist
>> who helped me get started had all his research PAPERS (including
>> correspondence spanning several years) PITCHED when his 'loving
>> children' thought he was on his death b

Re: [LegacyUG] problem with unmarried

[hwedhlor]

Biology 101:  In human reproduction there is always an egg
and a sperm!  Whether the contributors were married,
cohabited outside of marriage, had consensual sex, used
artificial insemination, or any other means of bringing the
egg and sperm together, there was still a female who
contributed the egg and a male who contributed the sperm.
That means there were names of those contributors to enter
into Legacy, though they may not always be available to us
as researchers.  How we label the relationship between the
two contributors is optional, but the method of
fertilization being something other than the classic sexual
relationship between two married heterosexual adults does
not make either contributor go away, no matter how we think
of them.  There was always a mother and a father, or if you
insist, a male and a female contributor. :-)

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 9/28/2012 11:01 AM, Pat Hickin wrote:
> Brian wrote, "there must have been a relationship between
> a man and a woman to have a child."
>
> But with /in vitro/ fertilization I don't think there has
> to be a relationship.
>
> Not what I would call a relationship anyway.
>
> Pat
>
>
>
> Legacy User Group guidelines:
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Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy Help problems

[hwedhlor]

Sounds like something the English version could benefit from.

John

On 9/2/2012 11:42 PM, Evert van Dijken wrote:
> When we generate the Dutch .chm help file we also add a Table of contents (we 
> have four tabs) that makes it somewhat easier to find the main subjects.
> Link to the Dutch help file: 
> http://legacynederlands.com/downloadv7/legacy7-nederlands.zip
> Evert
>
> -Oorspronkelijk bericht-
> Van: hwedhlor [mailto:hwedh...@cox.net]
> Verzonden: zondag 2 september 2012 20:10
> Aan: LegacyUserGroup@legacyusers.com
> Onderwerp: Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy Help problems
>
> Hi Evert,
>
> The three tabs are labeled "Index", "Search" and "Favorites"
> in English.
>
> You're right that searching on "How to Document Your Information" in quotes 
> gives that entry as the first finding on the result list.  However, for 
> someone new to Legacy (and perhaps not familiar with the use of quotation 
> marks in
> searches) to make the multiple mental leaps from looking for "sources" in the 
> first tab (Index), moving to the second tab (Search), then composing the 
> phrase "How to Document Your Information" (or at lease "document your 
> information" or "how to document", etc.), and enclosing that in quotes, 
> that's presupposing quite a lot. Incidentally leaving the quotes out in the 
> Search tab search field gives "What's New in the Deluxe Edition".
>
> It's easy for those of us who already know that the heading, "How to Document 
> Your Information" exists to figure out how to find that phrase by searching 
> on it (or part of it) enclosed in quotes in the Search tab, but not so simple 
> when one is not even aware that phrase is significant in finding useful 
> information about source entry.
>
> The sad part of all this is that the information is there, and in a very 
> useful format, but not easily "findable".
>
> John
>
> --
> John Zimmerman
> Mesa, AZ
>
>
> On 9/2/2012 1:48 AM, Evert van Dijken wrote:
>> Forgot to write that I used the Search Tab and not the Index Tab in
>> Help (not sure about the English words on the Tab in Dutch the three
>> Tabs are Index | Zoeken | Favorieten) Evert
>>
>> Onderwerp: RE: [LegacyUG] Legacy Help problems
>>
>> If I enter "How to Document Your Information" (notice it's between " ") this 
>> item is the first in the list of found pages in the Help file.
>> Evert
>>
>>
>> Onderwerp: Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy Help problems
>>
>> Denise,
>>
>> Just a quick note to thank you for mentioning the Tutorial Lessons, which I 
>> had neglected to do. They are indeed a high point in Legacy documentation 
>> and I can heartily recommend them as they provide a concise, item-by-item 
>> description of most processes. They even include images of the icons to 
>> which they refer, as does the printed Legacy Family Tree manual.
>>
>> It is a shame that the various sections within the Tutorials are not indexed 
>> by their titles within the Help System. For example, you cannot enter "How 
>> to Document Your Information"
>> (one of the segment headings within the Tutorials) in the Keyword index 
>> field and go to that page within the Tutorials.
>>
>> I am in agreement with you concerning the apparent absence of an experienced 
>> technical writer on the Legacy Staff.
>> Historically technical writers are often added to a staff last, and let go 
>> first.
>>
>> All the best,
>>
>> John Zimmerman
>> Mesa, AZ
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>> our blog (http://news.LegacyFamilyTree.com).
>> To unsubscribe: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
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> Online technical 

Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy Help problems

[hwedhlor]

Hi Evert,

The three tabs are labeled "Index", "Search" and "Favorites"
in English.

You're right that searching on "How to Document Your
Information" in quotes gives that entry as the first finding
on the result list.  However, for someone new to Legacy (and
perhaps not familiar with the use of quotation marks in
searches) to make the multiple mental leaps from looking for
"sources" in the first tab (Index), moving to the second tab
(Search), then composing the phrase "How to Document Your
Information" (or at lease "document your information" or
"how to document", etc.), and enclosing that in quotes,
that's presupposing quite a lot. Incidentally leaving the
quotes out in the Search tab search field gives "What's New
in the Deluxe Edition".

It's easy for those of us who already know that the heading,
"How to Document Your Information" exists to figure out how
to find that phrase by searching on it (or part of it)
enclosed in quotes in the Search tab, but not so simple when
one is not even aware that phrase is significant in finding
useful information about source entry.

The sad part of all this is that the information is there,
and in a very useful format, but not easily "findable".

John

--
John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 9/2/2012 1:48 AM, Evert van Dijken wrote:
> Forgot to write that I used the Search Tab and not the Index Tab in Help (not 
> sure about the English words on the Tab in Dutch the three Tabs are Index | 
> Zoeken | Favorieten)
> Evert
>
> Onderwerp: RE: [LegacyUG] Legacy Help problems
>
> If I enter "How to Document Your Information" (notice it's between " ") this 
> item is the first in the list of found pages in the Help file.
> Evert
>
>
> Onderwerp: Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy Help problems
>
> Denise,
>
> Just a quick note to thank you for mentioning the Tutorial Lessons, which I 
> had neglected to do. They are indeed a high point in Legacy documentation and 
> I can heartily recommend them as they provide a concise, item-by-item 
> description of most processes. They even include images of the icons to which 
> they refer, as does the printed Legacy Family Tree manual.
>
> It is a shame that the various sections within the Tutorials are not indexed 
> by their titles within the Help System. For example, you cannot enter "How to 
> Document Your Information"
> (one of the segment headings within the Tutorials) in the Keyword index field 
> and go to that page within the Tutorials.
>
> I am in agreement with you concerning the apparent absence of an experienced 
> technical writer on the Legacy Staff.
> Historically technical writers are often added to a staff last, and let go 
> first.
>
> All the best,
>
> John Zimmerman
> Mesa, AZ
>
>
>
>
>
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>
>
>




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Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy Help problems

[hwedhlor]

Denise,

Just a quick note to thank you for mentioning the Tutorial
Lessons, which I had neglected to do. They are indeed a high
point in Legacy documentation and I can heartily recommend
them as they provide a concise, item-by-item description of
most processes. They even include images of the icons to
which they refer, as does the printed Legacy Family Tree
manual.

It is a shame that the various sections within the Tutorials
are not indexed by their titles within the Help System. For
example, you cannot enter "How to Document Your Information"
(one of the segment headings within the Tutorials) in the
Keyword index field and go to that page within the Tutorials.

I am in agreement with you concerning the apparent absence
of an experienced technical writer on the Legacy Staff.
Historically technical writers are often added to a staff
last, and let go first.

All the best,

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 9/1/2012 11:20 AM, Denise Moss-Fritch wrote:
>
> A few more thoughts if I may about ‘how-to’ information in
> Legacy.
>
> First, how many are aware of the tutorial topics available
> in Legacy’s help system? To find the list of tutorial
> topics, do the following:
>
> 1.Click the Help icon in the toolbar.
>
> 2.From the Legacy Help Contents page, click Tutorial Lessons.
>
> 3.Select from the list on the Examples and Demos topic.
>
> One writer suggested multiple versions of the same help
> file, for example, novice, intermediate, and advanced.
> Please understand that a user is not all novice, or all
> advanced in their use or understanding of legacy. You
> might rarely use one feature of Legacy, being a novice
> with that feature, while an expert with another feature
> you constantly use.
>
> There are methods of writing multiple levels of
> instruction into one help topic by “hiding” detailed
> explanations within the procedure. Those ‘hidden’ sections
> can be displayed to provide greater details.
>
> However, the structure of a typical Legacy help topic
> suggests that the Legacy staff does not include an
> experienced technical writer. Again, Legacy’s staff is
> just too small. A check of the About information on the
> help file shows the help authoring tool being used is
> Microsoft’s HTML Control Version 6.1 (a basic help
> authoring system) and (of course) the standard help
> compiler from Microsoft.
>
> Please remember too that a help system is linked by topic
> flow, not sequential information flow as with a book.
> Creating a help system is far more complex than writing a
> book, since with a help system you can link any topic
> (page) to any other topic. That linkage is something that
> cannot be duplicated with a book.
>
> Best,
>
> Denise L. Moss-Fritch
>
>
>




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Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy Help problems - repost with (hopefully) more easily readable lists

[hwedhlor]

My apologies to all. The two lists I attempted to include
with my previous e-mail did not display well, even though I
kept to plain text and spaces, rather than tabs to separate
them. Here are those two lists one above the other in hopes
that they will be easier to read. I have included the
content of my original post to make it easier for everyone
to associate the lists with the text of my e-mail. Sorry
about any inconvenience.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ



Pat and Marnie,

I am in complete accord with you on Legacy Help screens, and
to a great extent on the Legacy 7 manual as well.Entries
tend to present the user with a multitude of exceptions
rather than on the most simple, straight forward procedures
that are liable to be sought after by first time Legacy
novices.The Legacy Help System Keyword Search presents
information in a convoluted, and non-intuitive fashion that
can be daunting to use by even a seasoned Legacy enthusiast.


Let's examine "Sources" as an example.This mailing list
probably discusses sources more than any other subject.
Partly because we all tend to enter sources differently from
person to person, so much verbiage is expended on this list
diagramming, justifying and rebutting one-another’s source
citing philosophies. However at least as much energy is
expended explaining things that new Legacy users should be
able to find using the Help System. Unfortunately they
cannot find those explanations because the Help System is
not very well organized.

If I click on “Help/Show Help Index” then key in “Sources” I
am presented with a list of 32 sub-headings under the word
"Sources".With "Sources" highlighted in the resulting
Keyword List I am invited to click on a "Display" button at
the bottom right of the list, and if I click on that button
in hopes that the large screen area to the right of the
Keyword List will fill with information about Sources I am
sorely disappointed, for instead I am presented with yet
another list! The "Topics Found List" is only 23 items, but
surprisingly four of them duplicate entries on the Keyword
List of sub-headings (see the two lists below). The oddities
of capitalization in the lists are taken directly from the
Help System.
Keyword List

Sources
Adding when exporting GEDCOMs
Advanced source citations
Assignment when importing
Author
Citation report
Citations
citations (advance)
citations to groups
Clipboard
Clipboard loading
Comments
Definition
Description
Detail
Detail Comments
Detail options
Details
Entry system
in Notes
Marriage information
Name
Name options
on Reports
Options
Options for books
Search for missing
SourceWriter
Tab on name list
Templates
Text
Type
which system to use


Topics Found List

Adding Source Types
Advanced Source Citations
AutoSource - Export
Book Source Options
Citing the Sources of Your Information
Define or Edit a Master Source
Defining Master Sources
How to Document Your Information
Importing a GEDCOM File
Information Screen
Marriage Information
Master Source List
Master Source Type List
Missing Sources Search
Name List
Report Options
Source Citation Report
Source Clipboard
Source Detail
Source Detail Comments
Sources Tab
SourceWriter
Which Source System to Use



To my way of thinking when a user highlights “Sources” in
the Keyword List, then clicks on “Display,” they should be
presented with some text in the right window that explains
the fundamentals of citing sources as well as explaining
that there are two systems in Legacy (Basic and
SourceWriter) for citing sources. If the user is a little
savvy about genealogy they will be able to figure out that
“Citing the Sources of Your Information” will probably
provide some basic information, and indeed it does, but I’d
like to know why “Citing the Sources of Your Information” is
not one of the items on the Keyword List and why clicking
"Display" while "Sources" is highlighted on the original
list the user does not trigger that same information about
citing sources instead of getting another list?

If the organization of the Keyword List is not confusing
enough, throughout the Help system the text refers to icons
by their name. A new user is not going to be familiar with
what those icons look like. The Help system should show
pictures of those icons when they are referenced.

To sum up, the Legacy Help system is full of information,
but it is presented in such a convoluted, non-intuitive
fashion as to put off the user, rather than lead them down
the path to knowledge.


John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ



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Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy Help problems

[hwedhlor]

Pat and Marnie,

I am in complete accord with you on Legacy Help screens, and
to a great extent on the Legacy 7 manual as well.Entries
tend to present the user with a multitude of exceptions
rather than on the most simple, straight forward procedures
that are liable to be sought after by first time Legacy
novices.The Legacy Help System Keyword Search presents
information in a convoluted, and non-intuitive fashion that
can be daunting to use by even a seasoned Legacy enthusiast.


Let's examine "Sources" as an example.This mailing list
probably discusses sources more than any other subject.
Partly because we all tend to enter sources differently from
person to person, so much verbiage is expended on this list
diagramming, justifying and rebutting one-another’s source
citing philosophies. However at least as much energy is
expended explaining things that new Legacy users should be
able to find using the Help System. Unfortunately they
cannot find those explanations because the Help System is
not very well organized.

If I click on “Help/Show Help Index” then key in “Sources” I
am presented with a list of 32 sub-headings under the word
"Sources".With "Sources" highlighted in the resulting
Keyword List I am invited to click on a "Display" button at
the bottom right of the list, and if I click on that button
in hopes that the large screen area to the right of the
Keyword List will fill with information about Sources I am
sorely disappointed, for instead I am presented with yet
another list! The "Topics Found List" is only 23 items, but
surprisingly four of them duplicate entries on the Keyword
List of sub-headings (see the two lists below). The oddities
of capitalization in the lists are taken directly from the
Help System.

_Keyword List__Topics Found List_


Sources

Adding when exporting GEDCOMsAdding Source Types

_Advanced source citations__Advanced Source Citations_

Assignment when importingAutoSource - Export

AuthorBook Source Options

Citation reportCiting the Sources of Your Information

CitationsDefine or Edit a Master Source

citations (advanced)Defining Master Sources

citations to groupsHow to Document Your Information

ClipboardImporting a GEDCOM File

Clipboard loadingInformation Screen

Comments_Marriage Information_

DefinitionMaster Source List

DescriptionMaster Source Type List

DetailMissing Sources Search

Detail CommentsName List

Detail optionsReport Options

DetailsSource Citation Report

Entry systemSource Clipboard

in NotesSource Detail

_Marriage information_Source Detail Comments

NameSources Tab

Name options_SourceWriter_

on Reports_Which Source System to Use_

Options

Options for books

Search for missing

_SourceWriter_

Tab on name list

Templates

Text

Type

_which system to use_

To my way of thinking when a user highlights “Sources” in
the Keyword List, then clicks on “Display,” they should be
presented with some text in the right window that explains
the fundamentals of citing sources as well as explaining
that there are two systems in Legacy (Basic and
SourceWriter) for citing sources. If the user is a little
savvy about genealogy they will be able to figure out that
“Citing the Sources of Your Information” will probably
provide some basic information, and indeed it does, but I’d
like to know why “Citing the Sources of Your Information” is
not one of the items on the Keyword List and why clicking
"Display" while "Sources" is highlighted on the original
list the user does not trigger that same information about
citing sources instead of getting another list?

If the organization of the Keyword List is not confusing
enough, throughout the Help system the text refers to icons
by their name. A new user is not going to be familiar with
what those icons look like. The Help system should show
pictures of those icons when they are referenced.

To sum up, the Legacy Help system is full of information,
but it is presented in such a convoluted, non-intuitive
fashion as to put off the user, rather than lead them down
the path to knowledge.


John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ



On 8/30/2012 8:58 PM, Pat Hickin wrote:
> Brian,
>
> That's it -- that's precisely the problem! I expect Legacy
> to give me instructions/directions in the order in which I
> must do them -- not in more or less reverse order. I get
> discouraged when I cannot even understand the very first
> sentence.
>
> If that last paragraph "Ancestor Options help" was placed
> immediately after the first paragraph, then the
> explanation that follows would be easy to understand.
>
> Does Legacy ever have (or has Legacy ever had) someone who
> is new to Legacy help with the editing of your "Help"
> explanations?
>
> I think that could help make Legacy "Help" more helpful!! :-)
>
> Thanks for your explanation!
>
> I think that will prove useful when I encounter similar
> problems in the future!!
>
> Pat
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 30, 2012 at 3:27 PM, Brian/Support
>  > wrote:
>
> Look at the last lin

[LegacyUG] Master Location List Display Problem & Solution

[hwedhlor]

A few days ago I attempted to display the Master Location
List by selecting "View" from the menu across the top of the
Legacy screen, then selecting "Master Lists", followed by
"Location."  I expected to see the Master Location List
window pop up in the center of the screen.  Instead I was
presented with a window in the upper-left quadrant of the
Legacy screen.  The bulk of that window was blank white with
areas around the top and right sides where the underlying
Legacy screen showed through. Moving the cursor around the
top 20% of the window caused various buttons to show up that
would ordinarily be a part of the Master Location List
window.  One group was arranged horizontally and consisted
of "Add, Edit, Combine, Sort, Edit" and "List Options." The
other group was arranged vertically and consisted of
"Select, Close, Options" and "Help."  Nowhere in the window
were any locations displayed.  I found that Legacy was no
longer responsive to any other input, and I had to use
Ctrl-Alt-Del to bring up Windows Task Manager, then select
"Legacy" and "End Task" to exit the program.

In attempting to correct the display of the Master Location
List I tried restarting Legacy to no avail.  I confirmed
that I was running the most recent update (in this case
7.5.0.201 dated 25 June, 2012).  I contacted Legacy Support
via e-mail and received a reply from Jim, who advised me to
first try resetting my display to default values by clicking
on "Options" on the menu bar, then "Customize" and at the
bottom of the screen clicking on the button "Reset to
Defaults."  Jim's second suggestion was that if resetting to
defaults didn't work, then close Legacy and delete the
following files from the Legacy root folder (In my case that
was "C:\Legacy7").  The five files are listed with their
content types after the equal signs.

Legacy2.usr = Customized Form Size and Location settings

Legacy5.usr = Customized List Column settings

Legacy6.usr = Customized View Column settings

Legacy7.usr = Customized Column settings

Legacy8.usr = Customized Descendant View Column settings


Jim's first suggestion solved the issue, but I was curious
as to whether any of the five .USR files he'd listed would
have done the job without completely resetting my display to
the default values.   I had taken the trouble to save all of
my .USR files to a backup location previously.  Now I
decided to replace each of the five files one at a time to
see if the "old" copy of one of them would trigger the
faulty Master Location List.  One of them, "Legacy2.usr",
did in fact trigger the faulty display.  The other four had
no impact on this issue. Here are some my testing results.

1.  Once the "bad" display was up the only way I could
recover was to bring up the Task Manager screen and force a
shutdown of Legacy.

2.  Simply replacing the Legacy2.usr file with the default
file of that name DID NOT solve the problem. Only deleting
the offending Legacy2.usr file resulted in the proper
display of the Master Location List.

3.  Restoring the other four LegacyX.usr files also restored
their various functions/settings without causing issues with
the display of the Master Location List.

I hope others find my experience in correcting the faulty
Master Display List of use.  My thanks again to Jim of
Legacy Support for his effective suggestions.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ




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Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy > Dropbox > Syncback

[hwedhlor]

Sorry I wasn't that clear the first time, Charani.  Maybe
it's the heat here, which is around 116ºF/46.1ºC in the
afternoon, and drops to a mere 90ºF/32.2ºC during the night.
:-)  Good job the humidity seldom climbs above 20%. :-)
Dropbox is a good secondary storage area, and can provide a
convenient means of transferring files, but I would never
use it as the primary storage location for anything, even if
I chose to pay for a higher level of service to eliminate
the threat of files expiring and being erased by Dropbox staff.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 8/10/2012 2:37 AM, Charani wrote:
> hwedhlor wrote:
>> Perhaps I should have been more clear on my philosophy for
>> using Dropbox.  I consider any Dropbox folder to be part of
>> the Dropbox server system, even if that folder resides on my
>> local drive.  The Dropbox sub-folder under My Documents on
>> you hard drive will certainly be emptied if Dropbox deletes
>> your files due to account activity.  Given that fact it
>> would be foolish for anyone to make Dropbox the sole
>> repository of their genealogical database.  They should
>> always keep a copy in another "local" drive.
> Ah, now *that* makes much more sense.
>
> Thank you for the clarification.
>
>




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Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy > Dropbox > Syncback

[hwedhlor]

Perhaps I should have been more clear on my philosophy for
using Dropbox.  I consider any Dropbox folder to be part of
the Dropbox server system, even if that folder resides on my
local drive.  The Dropbox sub-folder under My Documents on
you hard drive will certainly be emptied if Dropbox deletes
your files due to account activity.  Given that fact it
would be foolish for anyone to make Dropbox the sole
repository of their genealogical database.  They should
always keep a copy in another "local" drive.

Having said that I should add that Dropbox also makes it
possible to recover deleted files ifyou reinstate your
account within 30 days.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 8/9/2012 3:51 PM, JLB wrote:
> The My Dropbox folder on your computer is synced to Dropbox on their
> server. If you log into your account and delete a file/folder, as would
> happen if they killed your account, it IS going to disappear from the My
> Dropbox folder on any of your computers. That's what syncing means.
>
> The files are only 'local' on your computer as long as you have a
> Dropbox account.
> ---
> JL Beeken
> JLog - simple computer technology for genealogists
> http://www.jgen.ws/jlog/
>
> On 8/9/2012 3:46 PM, Paul Gray wrote:
>> The copy in the cloud (i.e. on Dropbox's servers) is just there for
>> backup and synchronisation. You still retain your own copy of the file
>> on each and every computer linked to your account. For example, if you
>> have a desktop and a laptop, you have three complete copies of the
>> files, one on each computer and one in Dropbox.
>>
>> When you are working in Legacy, you are not working with the file in the
>> cloud. You are working with the local copy on whichever computer you are
>> using.
>>
>> After you update the file on your local PC, it is uploaded to the cloud
>> (for backup and for synchronisation), and then downloaded to your other
>> PC(s).
>>
>> So, deleting the server copy doesn't have to delete the two local
>> copies. I doubt that it does, because I believe the local PC initiates
>> uploads and downloads with the server, not the other way around, but if
>> anyone is concerned they should contact Dropbox.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Aug 9, 2012, mvmc...@aol.com wrote:
>>
>>  Isn't that only if you back it up on your computer? If you are
>>  storing it on DropBox doesn't it disappear if they delete it?
>>  No attachments this time.
>>  Marie
>>
>>  Marie Varrelman Melchiori, CG, CGL/
>>  Melchiori Research Services, L.L.C./
>>  ---
>>  CG, Certified Genealogist and CGL, Certified Genealogical Lecturer
>>  are service marks of the Board for Certification of Genealogists ® ,
>>  used under license by Board-certified associates after periodic
>>  competency evaluations.
>>  In a message dated 8/9/2012 2:57:52 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
>>  hwedh...@cox.net writes:
>>
>>  The inactivity to which I referred was to the overall
>>  account, and the files deleted would not be deleted from the
>>  subscriber's computer, but from the provider's server. These
>>  services do not have access to our computers.
>>
>>  John
>>
>>  John Zimmerman
>>  Mesa, AZ
>>
>>
>>  On 8/9/2012 6:45 AM, Charani wrote:
>>  >  Paul Gray wrote:
>>  > > The one thing I'm a bit confused about is whether
>>  "inactivity" refers to the
>>  > > individual file, or to the account in general. I have
>>  activity on my Dropbox
>>  > > account virtually daily, but certain files (e.g. multimedia)
>>  have been dormant
>>  > > for more than ninety days and nothing has ever been deleted.
>>  >  As I understand it, it's inactivity on the *account* rather than
>>  >  individual files.
>>  >
>>  >  If you're using the account on a daily basis or thereabouts,
>>  you won't
>>  >  have to worry.
>>  >
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>  Legacy User Group guidelines:
>>  http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
>>  Archived messages after Nov. 21 2009:
>>  http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/
>>  Archived messages from old mail server - before Nov. 21 2009:
>>  http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/
>>  Online technical support: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp
>>  Follow Legacy on Facebook
>>  (http://www.facebook.com/LegacyFamilyTree) and on our blog
>>  (http://news.LegacyFamilyTree.com).
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>>
>>
>>
>>  Legacy User Group guidelines:
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>>  http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/
>>  Archived messages from old mail 

Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy > Dropbox > Syncback

[hwedhlor]

The inactivity to which I referred was to the overall
account, and the files deleted would not be deleted from the
subscriber's computer, but from the provider's server. These
services do not have access to our computers.

John

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 8/9/2012 6:45 AM, Charani wrote:
> Paul Gray wrote:
>> The one thing I'm a bit confused about is whether "inactivity" refers to the
>> individual file, or to the account in general. I have activity on my Dropbox
>> account virtually daily, but certain files (e.g. multimedia) have been 
>> dormant
>> for more than ninety days and nothing has ever been deleted.
> As I understand it, it's inactivity on the *account* rather than
> individual files.
>
> If you're using the account on a daily basis or thereabouts, you won't
> have to worry.
>




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Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy > Dropbox > Syncback

[hwedhlor]

Hi Ian,

Nearly all of the services such as Dropbox have an
expiration date for files kept there. Those expiration dates
are generally either 30 or 90 days. Inactivity on the app is
the usual trigger for deletion of files by the provider.
Only Amazon's cloud service does not have an expiration
date, so far as I know. I would very much recommend that
anyone contemplating the use of a cloud service first view
the Legacy Webinar, "The Genealogy Cloud - by Thomas
MacEntee" which is available for purchase from the Legacy
website.

John

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 8/8/2012 7:32 PM, Ian GARDENER wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> I currently have all my legacy files, both multimedia &
> data, in my dropbox.
>
> I have also just become aware that if I don’t access my
> dropbox for 90 days, the dropbox people may
>
> delete my files from their server. If I then use my pc,
> dropbox will automatically delete the files on my pc too.
>
> This has all been verified to me by the dropbox help
> people. SCARY !!
>
> So I still like the idea of dropbox but what I’m thinking
> of doing now is moving all my legacy files back into a
>
> normal docs folder and then using syncback to keep an
> updated copy of those files in my dropbox. That way
>
> even if they got deleted from the dropbox folder, I still
> have my totally up to date files. Does anyone see any
>
> problems with this? I couldn’t imagine it will muck up
> legacy in any way.
>
> ALSO before anyone brings it up, yes it is highly possible
> I could be away from my pc for extended times. I
>
> Have an ongoing battle with recurring brain tumours and
> last time I was in hospital for 7 months learning to
>
> use my limbs again.
>
> As I say, I don’t forsee any problems but I fugure it’s
> safer to throw it out there to see what other legacy users
> think.
>
> Cheers
>
> Ian GARDENER
>
> Australia
>
>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Webinars

[hwedhlor]

Sherry,

My apologies for the typo I made this morning that said the
webinar would be at 2 pm Arizona time. It’s at 3 pm Arizona
time.

Arizona does not follow Daylight Saving Time. At present
Arizona time is the same as Pacific Daylight Time, and we
are 3 hours different from Eastern time, so the webinar that
starts at 6 pm Eastern time will begin at 3 pm Arizona (and
California) time.

On November 4^th 2012 most of the country will “fall back”
an hour, but Arizona will not, so then Arizona will be on
Mountain Standard Time, or two hours different than Eastern
time.

On March 10^th 2013, most of the country will “spring
forward” an hour, and Arizona will not, so at that time
Arizona will again be on Pacific Standard Time, or three
hours different than Eastern time.

John Zimmerman

Mesa, AZ



On 8/1/2012 8:44 AM, Sherry/Support wrote:
> All you need to know is that you're Mountain Standard Time. When you
> register for the webinar, just set the time option to Mountain time
> and your confirmation and reminders will be in your time zone.
>
> Sincerely,
> Sherry
> Technical Support
> Legacy Family Tree
>
>
> On Wed, Aug 1, 2012 at 8:33 AM, Larry  wrote:
>> I live in AZ and still get confused about the time zone difference. I just 
>> google "current time New York City". With that answer I compare to my 
>> current local time to know if there is a 2 or 3 hour difference. Works every 
>> time!
>>
>> Larry Lee
>>
>> Richard Young  wrote:
>>
>>> This is only correct when the rest of the country is NOT on daylight 
>>> savings time. Right now we are 2 hours behind Central. We are on Mountain 
>>> Time, but it is Mountain Standard Time year round, except for the Navajo 
>>> Reservation which is another story.
>>>
>>> When registering for Legacy Webinars, and the rest of the country is on 
>>> daylight savings time, use the Pacific time.
>>>
>>> Richard
>>> Mesa
>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Webinars

[hwedhlor]

Cynthia,

I just noticed that I had entered 2 pm as the time for the
webinar. That's a typo!! It's at 3 pm.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 8/1/2012 7:04 AM, Cynthia wrote:
> Thank you John
>
> -Original Message-
> From: John Zimmerman [mailto:hwedh...@cox.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2012 7:02 AM
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] Webinars
>
> Cynthia,
>
> The webinar is at 2 pm Arizona time.
>
> John Zimmeeman
> Mesa, AZ
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Aug 1, 2012, at 6:41 AM, "Cynthia"  wrote:
>
>> That would help except for the fact that since I do not live in a time zone 
>> like that I don't know the difference.  I don't need to know on a day to day 
>> thing. So to know the difference between Arizona and central time I don’t 
>> know.
>>
>> Cynthia
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Charani [mailto:charan...@gmail.com]
>> Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2012 6:35 AM
>> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
>> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] Webinars
>>
>> Cynthia wrote:
>>
>>> I know there is a webinar today and would like to register.
>>> However, I live in Arizona and we do not change our time ever.  I
>>> know that Michigan is 3 hours ahead of us but, I don't know what time
>>> it will be here when the webinar starts.  Can anyone tell me this?
>> All the details are here:
>>
>> http://www.legacyfamilytree.com/webinars.asp
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Charani (UK)
>> OPC for Walton, Ashcott, Shapwick,
>> Greinton and Clutton, SOM
>> http://wsom-opc.org.uk
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] creating passport pictures for Legacy

[hwedhlor]

Bernhard,

Do you intend to disclose the name of the tool which you
have found?  We've been reading submissions on this topic ad
nauseum, and would at least like some closure in knowing the
name of the tool you have chosen. :-)

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 7/18/2012 10:05 PM, Bernhard Scholz wrote:
> JL,
>
> I'd like to close this topic.
>
> Have found a tool with which I'm very happy with and it does exactly what I
> wanted.
> Other image tools are in my opinion too cumbersome.
>
> Why always think of the 7/9 proportion when I have a tool giving me a window
> which does it for me and at the same time the possibility of panning and
> zooming.
>
> Bernhard
>
> -Original Message-
> From: JLB [mailto:j...@jgen.ws]
> Sent: Thursday, July 19, 2012 1:26 AM
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] creating passport pictures for Legacy
>
> You don't need a calculator! You set 'selection size' or 'selection ratio' in
> your graphics program to 7/9 proportion. I use a different proportion and it
> also works fine in Legacy. I don't know where you got the idea that Legacy
> prefers a particular ratio.
>
> Whatever the ratio is, Legacy will set the exact dimensions itself based on
> small, medium or large.
> ---
> JL Beeken
> JLog - simple computer technology for genealogists http://www.jgen.ws/jlog/
>
> On 7/18/2012 1:29 PM, Bernhard Scholz wrote:
>> JL,
>>
>> I think we have major problems of missunderstandings!!
>>
>> 1.   I wasn't looking for a standardized print but for screen captures.
>> 2.   the european passport size of 35x45mm was a good example as it fitted
>> best in Leacy.
>> 3.   using a proportion 7/9 could fit to 35/45mm but why should I need
>> everytime a calculator
>>  to check if it fits depending on the no. of pixels.
>> 4.   I never said I wanted to print a picture as 34x45mm but just save it in
>>
>> that size.
>>  Legacy prints what it has and this size seems to fit very well.
>>
>>
>> Bernhard
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: JLB [mailto:j...@jgen.ws]
>> Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2012 8:10 PM
>> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
>> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] creating passport pictures for Legacy
>>
>> I don't understand but that's OK. 35mm x 45mm is a proportion of 35/45 or 
>> 7/9.
>>
>> I've never had a problem with Legacy except to do with consistent 
>> proportions.
>> If they're not consistent, the charts print out with photos different
>> shapes, so I picked my standard: 1/1.618 which I put into my cropping
>> program and that's what comes out.
>>
>> That has nothing to do with pixels. It depends on the overall size of the
> photo.
>> It's just a proportion. Re-sizing will bring it down to exact pixels,
>> although that's not required in Legacy as it seems to set the dimensions
> automatically.
>> If you're wanting to print at exactly 35mm x 45mm that's something else.
>> I don't think Legacy will do that anyway as it gives the options, as
>> you said, of small, medium and large. And not being a beer drinker
>> (yuck!) I totally
>>
>> missed that connection.
>>
>> JL Beeken
>> JLog - simple computer technology for genealogists
>> http://www.jgen.ws/jlog/
>>
>> On 7/18/2012 10:45 AM, Bernhard Scholz wrote:
>>> JL,
>>>
>>> I agree the picture is more than outdated.
>>> It's from 1947. Proportions are correct due to my new tool.
>>>
>>> The problem was I couldn't find a tool helping me to make a
>>> standardized pictures of an individual in a very short time.
>>> Most programs work with pixel or percentage. That means needing a
>>> calculator everytime.
>>>
>>> My experience was that Legacy works with a format which is very like
>>> the European passport format 35mm x 45mm but there is no information
>>> in Leagcy
>>>
>>> saying what they use.
>>> BTW. The present US format is 2" x 2" or 50.8mm x 50.8mm which
>>> doesn't fit in Legacy at all.
>>>
>>> Why customize my printer when I can only choose in Legacy the picture 
>>> options
>>> small
>>> medium
>>> large
>>> custom pic. area and can only change the width.
>>>
>>> BTW. The first three options sound like ordering a beer ;-).
>>>
>>> I try to use standards as they make life easier and the best is when
>>> they fit in Legacy.
>>>
>>>
>>> Perhaps you understand me now.
>>>
>>>
>>> Bernhard
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: JLB [mailto:j...@jgen.ws]
>>> Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2012 7:03 PM
>>> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
>>> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] creating passport pictures for Legacy
>>>
>>> OK, I'm lost for sure. Why does it matter that pictures are an exact
>>> mm measurement for Legacy? Surely not for passports themselves? The
>>> attached photo is a little outdated for passports. As long as the
>>> proportions are correct they can be printed to an exact mm size; just
>> customize your printer settings.
>>> Anyway, glad he found what he was looking for.
>>> ---
>>> JL Beeken
>>> JLog - simple computer technology for genealogists

Re: [LegacyUG] Race

[hwedhlor]

It is my impression (and that of the majority of Western
biological and anthropological researchers) that
biologically there is but a single human race. All the other
"racial" terms are sociocultural constructs. With the advent
of frequent travel between continents, and the resultant
interbreeding of previously isolated populations, the
differences of hair texture, eye shape, nose shape, etc. can
no longer be used to identify recent geographical, or even
ethnic origins.

Having said that I must add that possible "racial" origin is
certainly significant to the genealogical researcher as it
gives us a clue about where to look for records and
relatives. Assuming genealogical research is eventually
taken to its logical conclusion all genealogists will
ultimately be searching for matching DNA somewhere in
Africa. :-)

John

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 7/5/2012 5:33 PM, David C Abernathy wrote:
>
> Try this
>
> “A *race* is a biological construct, of a more or less
> distinct population with anatomical traits that
> distinguish it clearly from other races. The anatomical
> traits usually refer to the color of the skin, shape of
> the eyes or the nose. For example, in India the people in
> the southern parts are quite different anatomically from
> the people in the northern parts, because the people from
> the south belong to the Dravidian race and the people from
> the north belong to the Aryan race. *The three major races
> of the world are the Caucasian, the Mongoloid and the
> Negroid*.
>
> *Ethnicity*refers to the cultural factors of the racial
> group, especially religion, food habits, dressing and life
> style and occupations. Ethnicity refers to a subset within
> race. For example not all the Caucasians of the world
> follow the same religious or cultural practices.
>
> In short, Race is genetically determined by Nature”
>
> So in today’s World, with so many cross breading of the
> different Races, what are the real Races?
>
> From http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Race
>
> “*race^“ *
>
> /n./
>
> *1. *A local geographic or global human population
> distinguished as a more or less distinct group by
> genetically transmitted physical characteristics.
>
> *2. *A group of people united or classified together on
> the basis of common history, nationality, or geographic
> distribution: /the German race./
>
> *3. *A genealogical line; a lineage.
>
> *4. *Humans considered as a group.
>
> *5. */Biology/
>
> *a. *An interbreeding, usually geographically isolated
> population of organisms differing from other populations
> of the same species in the frequency of hereditary traits.
> A race that has been given formal taxonomic recognition is
> known as a subspecies.
>
> *b. *A breed or strain, as of domestic animals.
>
> *6. *A distinguishing or characteristic quality, such as
> the flavor of a wine.
>
> Thanks,
> David C Abernathy
> Email disclaimers
> 
> This message represents the official view of the voices in
> my head.
> 
> http://www.SchmeckAbernathy.com
> 
> == All outgoing and incoming mail is scanned by F-Prot
> Antivirus ==
>
> *From:*Ron Bernier [mailto:ronaldbern...@bernfrin.net]
> *Sent:* Thursday, July 05, 2012 5:11 PM
> *To:* LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> *Subject:* Re: [LegacyUG] Race
>
> David is the second person that has commented on this
> thread, saying that people need to be careful not to
> "confuse" race with nation of origin. This totally baffles
> me as to how anyone wouldn't know what the difference
> between a person's race and their nation of origin.
> American and South African are nationalities. Caucasian is
> a race. How would someone confuse the two? Japanese is a
> nationality. Asian is a race. Again, how do you confuse
> the two?
>
> Ron Bernier
> Sent from my iPad
>
>
> On Jul 5, 2012, at 7:26 PM, David Abernathy
>  > wrote:
>
> Only some of them (census) had contained race.
>
> Also one needs to careful as to what is a race and not
> a nation of origin.
>
> Sent from my Kindle Fire
> In God We Trust
>
>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Race -

[hwedhlor]

Bill,

Please refrain from generalizing about what "many Americans"
think, or do not think.  I've lived in the United States of
America for nearly 69 years, and have never met a single
American who thinks Africa is a country, and not a
continent.  Such generalizations are just as inaccurate as
the term African American. :-)

John

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 7/5/2012 5:33 PM, runolf...@aol.com wrote:
> African American in considered by some as a race but
> anyone born in Africa and now in America would fit that
> description. Not all people from Africa are black. That is
> where some confusion can come in. Many Americans think
> Africa is a country, it is a continent, of many nations
> and people. It comes down to education, accuracy, and
> being proud of who you and your family are. I have family
> members that try to recreate our family, drives me crazy.
> I go for accuracy.
> Bill
> In a message dated 7/5/2012 5:11:33 P.M. Pacific Daylight
> Time, ronaldbern...@bernfrin.net writes:
>
> David is the second person that has commented on this
> thread, saying that people need to be careful not to
> "confuse" race with nation of origin.  This totally
> baffles me as to how anyone wouldn't know what the
> difference between a person's race and their nation of
> origin. American and South African are nationalities.
>  Caucasian is a race.  How would someone confuse the
> two?  Japanese is a nationality.  Asian is a race.
>  Again, how do you confuse the two?
>
> Ron Bernier
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Jul 5, 2012, at 7:26 PM, David Abernathy
>  > wrote:
>
>> Only some of them (census) had contained race.
>>
>> Also one needs to careful as to what is a race and
>> not a nation of origin.
>>
>> Sent from my Kindle Fire
>> In God We Trust
>>
>
>
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> 21 2009:
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Re: [LegacyUG] Lockup when Locations icon is selected

[hwedhlor]

Thanks, Jenny and Jack.  I'll post any new information I
discover.

John

On 6/23/2012 12:47 PM, Jack Earnshaw wrote:
> John
>
> Just tried and it works fine for me. Took a little while (10 seconds ish) to 
> complete the opening the first time, but then pretty instant
>
> Jack
>
> -Original Message-
> From: hwedhlor [mailto:hwedh...@cox.net]
> Sent: 23 June 2012 19:44
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: [LegacyUG] Lockup when Locations icon is selected
>
> I am finding that Legacy 7.5.0.200 locks up consistently
> when I click on the Locations icon.  The Master Location
> list never appears on the screen though the upper-left
> border is drawn and a white rectangle is produced that
> covers about 1/6th of the screen.  This happens consistently
> and is recoverable only by shutting down Legacy via Task
> Manager.  I have run File Maintenance for both Master List
> Cleanup and Check/Repair.
>
> Is anyone else experiencing this issue?
>
> John Zimmerman
> Mesa, AZ
>
>
>
>
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>
>
> -
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 2012.0.2180 / Virus Database: 2437/5087 - Release Date: 06/22/12
> -
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 2012.0.2180 / Virus Database: 2437/5087 - Release Date: 06/22/12
>
>
>
>
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>
>
>




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[LegacyUG] Lockup when Locations icon is selected

[hwedhlor]

I am finding that Legacy 7.5.0.200 locks up consistently
when I click on the Locations icon.  The Master Location
list never appears on the screen though the upper-left
border is drawn and a white rectangle is produced that
covers about 1/6th of the screen.  This happens consistently
and is recoverable only by shutting down Legacy via Task
Manager.  I have run File Maintenance for both Master List
Cleanup and Check/Repair.

Is anyone else experiencing this issue?

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ




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Re: [LegacyUG] Webinar By Megan Smolenyak(2)

[hwedhlor]

I was able to view the Megan Smolenyak webinar, as well as
the recent presentation by Lisa Also using both Google
Chrome version 18.0.1025.168 and Mozilla Firefox version
12.0.  I noted a definite "echo" in the sound when Geoff
Rasmussen was speaking in the beginning under both Chrome
and Firefox.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 5/5/2012 1:40 PM, Naomi SMITH BLACK wrote:
> I use Firefox and have not had any trouble with any of the
> webinars
> /*
>
>
> Naomi Lee SMITH BLACK
> Marietta, GA.*/
>
> AERNI, SUTTER, SMITH, GIFFORD, ZELUFF, WINGATE, BLACK,
> CARDER, MOORE, MORRISON, RAWLS, ROE, BROOKSHIRE
>
> taphophilia, noun, from the Greek word taphos meaning
> grave; a love for funerals, graves, cemeteries
>
> www.LegacyFamilyTree.com 
>
>
> On Fri, May 4, 2012 at 5:55 PM, Linda Hauley
> mailto:lhau...@rogers.com>> wrote:
>
> I had the same problem and was using Google Chrome to
> access the video.  When I changed to IE, I had no
> problems.
>
> *Linda J. Hauley *
>
> */Guild Of One Name Studies #4335/*
>
> */- Canada East Regional Rep./*
>
> */- VODDEN One Name Study/*
>
> *From:*Howlanddavisii [mailto:howlanddavi...@aol.com
> ]
> *Sent:* May 4, 2012 3:36 PM
> *To:* LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> *Subject:* Re: [LegacyUG] Webinar By Megan Smolenyak(2)
>
> I shut the computer down and reastarted and all seems
> to be well; at least I am past the fiorst stopping point.
>
>
> Howland Davis
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Howlanddavisii  >
> To: LegacyUserGroup  >
> Sent: Fri, May 4, 2012 3:24 pm
> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] Webinar By Megan Smolenyak(2)
>
> Are there problems with Megan Smolenyak's webinar?  I
> have tried twice to watch it.  The first time, just
> before the second question, the screen turned green
> and 'static' was heard. Also the clock showing
> the program time jumped ahead.  The second time just
> as Geoff started to speak an exclamation point inside
> a circle appeared on my screen.
>
> Any suggestions to solve the problem or are there
> problems at Legacy?
>
> Howland Davis
>
>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Danish Question

[hwedhlor]

Hi Larry,

My cousin, Amy Kimball Stoddard, has lived and worked in
Denmark for many years and she is also an enthusiastic
genealogist.  I was also curious about how Denmark divided
the country for governing, and I sent your questions along
to Amy.  I recognize that your research in Denmark may be
limited to that one person who was the U.S. Ambassador, but
figured you, and possibly others may gain something from
Amy's explanation about the history of Danish political
boundaries.  Here is what Amy replied.

"On the subject of Danish government:
The "AMT" does not exist anymore.  About 5-6 years ago they
reformed the map to centralize government.  I guess that an
AMT could be like a prefecture.  Then that includes a whole
lot of KOMMUNEs. which might be like a county.  Think there
are 5 major REGIONs now, down from 13 AMTs.  For example, I
used to live in Fyns Amt, Middelfart Kommune.  Fyn is an
island and had its own AMT.  Now we are a part of a large
REGION SYDDANMARK that links us to the mainland, Jutland.
København kan mean quite a few things, depending on what you
are searching for and when.  Of course, it is our capital.
København also was an AMT and also had Københavns Kommune
that was at the core and it functioned like an AMT in itself
(probably due to the size of the population).  Now the whole
area is called REGION HOVEDSTADEN (capital) and Bornholm is
also part of it.  The rest of the island of Sjælland is
called REGION SJÆLLAND.
If this person needs to find some location/whatever, then
just say the word."

Additionally Amy supplied links to three separate Wikipedia
sites, two of them are in Danish, and the third is in
English.  I'm including them here not as links, but simply
as texual entries.

In English - Counties of Denmark at
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counties_of_Denmark

In Danish - Danmarks regioner  at
http://da.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danmarks_regioner

In Danish -Søgeresultater (Search Results) at
http://da.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speciel:S%C3%B8gning/Danmarks_amter_(1970-2006

I hope this is of use to you and others in pursuit of
information on Denmark,

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 5/3/2012 2:56 PM, Larry Lee wrote:
> At the Geni.com site,
> (http://www.geni.com/people/Ruth-Owen/66706122308),  I found
> the following information for Ruth Owen (Bryan) daughter of William
> Jennings Bryan. From 1933 to 1936 she was U.S. Ambassador to Denmark,
> appointed by President Franklin D. Roosevelt. Her death is listed as:
> July 26, 1954 in København, Hovedstaden, Danmark.
>
> One of my first discoveries outside the US! Now I have a quandary. I
> put København, Hovedstaden, Danmark for the place of death in the
> Individuals screen as found at Geni.com.
>
> Curiosity got the better of me so in the Geo Location Database I put:
> City, Exact = Copenhagen
> County = Blank
> State/Province = Blank
> Country, Exact = Denmark and it returns Copenhagen, , Københavns Amt, Denmark.
>
> Now I have three questions:
> 1) What does the Amt in  Københavns Amt mean?
> 2) Even though I use US English, I should still use Danmark, correct?
> 3) Should I put the English version in the Death Notes?
>
> Regards,
>
> Larry Lee
>
>
>
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>
>
>





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[LegacyUG] 1940 Census status - slightly off-topic

[hwedhlor]

Here's the status on the 1940 U.S. Federal Census at
Ancestry.com as of 5 p.m. EST.

_Completed_
American Samoa
Delaware
District of Columbia
Guam
Indiana
Maine
Nevada
Panama Canal Zone
Virgin Islands

_In Process_
California
New York
Pennsylvania
Rhode Island
Virginia

If you log on to the National Archives site they are posting
"Page not found" for the many, many states they have not yet
loaded.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ



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Re: [LegacyUG] Suggestion to add Relationship column to Index

[hwedhlor]

CE, that works beautifully!  Thank you for pointing out yet
another very useful option of which I was blissfully
unaware. :-)  As an old Aussie friend and artillery colonel
from Tasmania once said to me, "Yer bloods worth bottlin'!"

Thanks again,

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 2/29/2012 12:12 AM, CE WOOD wrote:
> That is already possible.  When in the Index view, click
> Options.  At the end of each Field Name, there is a box
> containing three dots.  Click on the box at the end of the
> first empty Field Name.   A list of Field Names to Display
> comes up.  Select Relationship from that list.  It will be
> added to your list of Field Names.  You can move any Field
> Name up and down to any position you wish.
>
>
> CE
> > From: hwedh...@cox.net
> > To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> > Subject: [LegacyUG] Suggestion to add Relationship
> column to Index
> > Date: Tue, 28 Feb 2012 22:58:40 -0700
> >
> > I just submitted a suggestion to add the option to
> display a
> > Relationship column to the Index view.
> >
> > John Zimmerman
> > Mesa, AZ
> >
> >
> >
> > Legacy User Group guidelines:
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> 2009:
> >
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> >
> >
>
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[LegacyUG] Suggestion to add Relationship column to Index

[hwedhlor]

I just submitted a suggestion to add the option to display a
Relationship column to the Index view.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ



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Re: [LegacyUG] Hand Held Devices for Legacy

[hwedhlor]

Hi John,

Several years ago my mobile device of choice was a Sony Clie
on which I ran GedStar Pro, by GHCS Software, and I liked it
GedStar Pro much.  When the Clie was discontinued I changed
over to an iPhone and iPad, and asked Doug Gordon, the
author of GedStar Pro, if he had any intention of porting
the program over to the Apple iOS devices.  Doug replied
that he would have to invest in some expensive Mac equipment
to do so, and that he was intending to retire after 40+
years writing software (this was in 2008), so I went looking
for alternative software.  I settled on Families, by Telgen
Software, and was fortunate to be involved in some testing
of that software both pre-release and subsequent to its
introduction.  I have been very happy with Families, and
with Telgen's responsiveness to input from their user base.
I highly recommend Families, which syncs with Legacy and not
only displays your data and photos, but will allow input via
your mobile device if you choose to do that, after which the
new data can be synced back to Legacy.  That capability can
be very handy if you find yourself in the field without your
laptop.

Understand however that Families is not Legacy, and does not
provide the entire range of features that Legacy provides,
which is not surprising considering that Families is
designed to run on a much lest robust platform than is
Legacy Family Tree.

All the best,

John

John Zimmerman
Mesa, Arizona


On 2/26/2012 3:28 AM, John Clifford wrote:
> I am picking up an old thread here.
>
> Can anyone advise me about the relative merits of Families and Gedstar for
> use on Android phones as a Legacy add-on?
>
> I have the impression that Millennia used to promote Gedstar but now
> Families (there is still a page on the website about Gedstar but no links to
> it as far as I can see)
>
> On the other hand this thread contains a few messages from Sherry saying she
> likes Gedstar.
>
> John
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>
>



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Re: [LegacyUG] Photographs

[hwedhlor]

There are programs that will convert image files from .jpg
to .tif in a batch process (that is many files at once).
That conversion will not improve the quality of the images,
but will change the format from a lossy format (.jpg) to a
lossless format (.tif).  My personal favorite program for
accomplishing batch conversions is FastStone Capture, which
is also an exceptionally useful image capture program.  You
can Google "FastStone Capture" to find the program.  Latest
version is 7.0

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 2/8/2012 12:18 PM, Dennis M. Kowallek wrote:
> On Wed, 8 Feb 2012 13:09:26 -0600, Robert Runion
> wrote:
>
>> Now - How do I get 4,000+ photographs I have scanned into .jpg reconfigured? 
>> :-)
> You don't ... not without rescanning them.
>


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Re: [LegacyUG] Two sourcing questions

[hwedhlor]

Tony,

An program capable of capturing a web page in its entirety,
including the part not seen without scrolling, is FastStone
Capture. The resulting image may then be cropped and the
result saved and/or annotated, etc. by the same program.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 11/14/2011 9:10 PM, Tony Rolfe wrote:
> Question 1.  I have a few streets in censuses which no longer appear on
> maps.  When I find out where the street used to be, I like to put that
> information into the notes field for the location.  However, there
> doesn't appear to be a way to add a source to the notes field.  In other
> words, when I go View>  master Lists>  Locations, select a location and
> edit it, there is no "source" button.  Am I missing something?
>
> Question two.  What is the best way to source a web page?  I know how to
> do the source, I'm more interested in the best way to ensure that the
> information doesn't disappear when the web page concerned is updated,
> deleted etc.
>
> One possibility would be to screen-print the page and attach the jpg to
> the source, but sometimes the information spreads over more than one
> physical screen or scrolls down and then screen prints aren't really useful.
>
> Any advice would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Tony
>
>
>
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>
>
>


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Re: [LegacyUG] How to enter census data into my Legacy records.

[hwedhlor]

Just a guess, but it may be something added to distinguish
between letters and numbers.  Do you see it anywhere else
where those letters are used?

John Zimmerman
Mesa, Arizona

On 9/18/2011 4:17 PM, Joan Kemp wrote:
> Experimenting, the 'illi' names only show yellow with Arial (screen)
> font set to 'automatic' or 8 point.  If I change the font to, say, Times
> New Roman, the yellow vanishes.
>
> Bizarre!  I think its something recent - I'm sure I'd have noticed it
> earlier.
>
> On 18/09/2011 23:40, Ron Bernier wrote:
>> Not seeing anything like that with my "illi" names
>>
>> Regards,
>> Ron Bernier
>> Woonsocket, RI
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Joan Kemp [mailto:jk...@yahoo.com]
>> Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2011 6:36 PM
>> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
>> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] How to enter census data into my Legacy records.
>>
>> Hi!
>>
>> The letters 'illi' in names such as William, Gillian, are coloured
>> yellow in Legacy (research tab)
>>
>> I've only just noticed this and think it has occurred very recently.
>>
>> Does anyone else have this problem?
>> Is it a technical issue with legacy or a weirdo on my pc?
>>
>> Many thanks
>>
>> Joan
>>
>>
>>
>> Legacy User Group guidelines:
>> http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
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>> our blog (http://news.LegacyFamilyTree.com).
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>>
>>
>>
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>>
>>
>>
>
>
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>
>
>


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Re: [LegacyUG] Techie DOS question

[hwedhlor]

FastStone Capture does all that Snagit does, but costs 60% less.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 9/1/2011 7:07 AM, M. Brenzel wrote:
> Snagit is a wonderful tool which allows for capturing a scrolling window.
>
> However, it's not free but well worth every penny.
>
> Mary
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Sep 1, 2011, at 8:31 AM, Mike Fry  wrote:
>
>> On 2011/09/01 13:47, Gene Young wrote:
>>> The simplest solution I have found is a free program called Greenshot.
>>> It captures whatever area of the screen you desire and opens the image
>>> in a built in editor which allows you to immediately annotate it then
>>> save in jpeg, gif, png or bmp format.
>> Yes. There are many tools like that. But they only capture the image of a 
>> window
>> or the screen. Information that has still to be scrolled into view is not 
>> captured.
>>
>> --
>> Regards,
>> Mike Fry
>> Johannesburg
>>
>>
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>> http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
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>> http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/
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>> our blog (http://news.LegacyFamilyTree.com).
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>>
>>
>
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>
>
>


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Re: [LegacyUG] Birth - Marriage Records / Registers

[hwedhlor]

  To me a register is typically a book where events are
"registered" by the agency tasked with keeping track of such
events.  Each time an event occurs the agency representative
make an entry in the registry.  I use an abbreviation for
register.

For example - JONES_GEORGE_BIRTH_REG_1965_JUN_12_DETROIT_MI.PDF

I use record when a document's sole purpose is to record a
single event, as opposed to listing several similar events.
Such records are most often transcriptions of the
information, in which case I add "_TRANS" to the end of the
file name so that I know the record is someone's
interpretation of what the original record showed.  I
abbreviate the entry for record.

For example -
JONES_GEORGE_BIRTH_REC_1965_JUN_12_DETROIT_MI_TRANS.PDF

If the document is an original certificate (marriage, death,
etc. typically with signatures of the authority issuing the
certificate) I add "CERT" as part of the file name.

For example -
JONES_GEORGE_&_SMITH_MARY_MARRIAGE_CERT_1910_JAN_14_IRONTON_OH.PDF

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 8/22/2011 2:40 PM, Jenny M Benson wrote:
> On 22/08/2011 21:31, Jerry wrote:
>> Does anyone on the list see any difference between a record and a
>> register?   My cousin researched some of our family and she is using
>> both terms for sources, but she has the original documentation, so I'm
>> not sure whether there are differences between the terms.  I realize a
>> difference could be argued for a certificate  or license vs. a record or
>> register.
> I use both terms in the names of Sources.  I use Register when I have
> seen an image of the actual Register and I use Record when all I have
> seen is a transcription.
>
> That's just my own interpretation, though:  I wouldn't expect everyone
> else to use the words in the same way.
>


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Re: [LegacyUG] iPad 2 and Legacy 7

[hwedhlor]

  Hi Gene,

I'm also running Families on my iPad 2 64GB, as well as on
an iPhone 3Gs 32GB.  Very much enjoy the app on both
devices.  The iPad 2 is much more practical from a
readability standpoint, but not so portable.  I'm toying
with the idea of buying a bluetooth keyboard and case for
the iPad 2, as it will be much more portable than my HP
TouchSmart Tm2 laptop.  Carrying an iPad 2 is somewhat
awkward without some sort of handle, and that's a priority
for me when I buy a case more enclosing than the magnetic
leather cover I bought with the device when it was new.
I've got jury duty the end of September, and plan on taking
it with me there, so I hope to have a new case, and probably
a keyboard by then, which will increase usefulness of the
iPad considerably.  There is some increased display ability
on the iPad versus the iPhone, with 5 generations visible in
pedigree view.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 8/16/2011 6:53 PM, Gene Wheeler wrote:
> Has anyone had any experience using "Families" app on iPad 2?  What
> do you think of it?
>
> Are they any other such apps for use with Legacy?
>
> Gene
>
>
>
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> http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
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> our blog (http://news.LegacyFamilyTree.com).
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>
>
>


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Re: [LegacyUG] Hand Held Devices for Legacy

[hwedhlor]

  The next version of the operating system for the
iPad/iPhone devices, iOS 5 (due to be released on 7 October
of 2011) will also provide a "split" keyboard option to
divide the screen-based keyboard into two segments similar
to an ergonomic keyboard, which might make input via the
screen-based keyboard more comfortable.

Prior to purchasing my iPhone and iPad I used GEDStar Pro
for quite some time on a Sony Clie Palm device, and liked it
very much, but when I asked the manufacturer of that program
if he intended to write a version for the iPhone/iPad he
said he intended to retire, so that would not happen.  I
tried FamViewer for a while on the iPhone and iPad, but
switched to the Families app and have never looked back.

Some of the "photographic" apps for the iPad/iPhone devices
use the built-in camera on those devices to capture an image
of documents, but also can do Optical Character Reading
(OCR) processing, and will produce PDF files that are
searchable, and editable.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 8/13/2011 11:36 AM, Cheryl Rothwell wrote:
> I wouldn't be taking notes longer than a text message on
> the iPhone/iPod. I find the keyboard useful on the iPad -
> honest, when you have one you will understand - but I also
> have a wireless keyboard for my iPad. It's like any other
> keyboard. You could type a will. There are attorneys who
> do only iPads in court where they may draft pleadings on
> the fly. In fact that's how I learned about the keyboard.
> It changed my use of the iPad from a toy to a workhorse.
>
> Coincidentally, today I did a demo of using the iPad to
> access FamilySearch. People were pretty impressed with how
> the keyboard worked when they tried it. I didn't have the
> bluetooth with me but I mentioned it. An 84 year old woman
> wants to buy an iPad! She used the keyboard and thought
> she wouldn't need the bluetooth version.
>
> If you are considering an iPad I strongly suggest waiting
> for the new one due out in 4-6 weeks I think. It is more
> wireless which would be nice. Also, the next iOS, ver. 5,
> will have more interaction with the iCloud which may
> affect how genealogy programs will work on them. We
> discussed here last week using Sugar Sync [or other] to
> hold the Legacy data file so it is always available in the
> latest incarnation.
>
>
> On Sat, Aug 13, 2011 at 8:43 AM, Connie Sheets
> mailto:clshee...@yahoo.com>> wrote:
>
> A "dumb question" here.  I can understand how an "app"
> like Families on an iPad, etc. can help with having
> your data handy on a research trip.  I can also
> understand how you could do some limited data entry.
>  What I don't understand is how one could reasonably
> do anything more than minimal data entry.  How in the
> world does one actually type on these things, i.e.
> write a paragraph or three (say transcribe a lengthy
> will) not just a tweet or text?  (I'm told by a
> 30-something niece that the virtual keyboard on an
> iPad isn't all that practical for real typing).
>
> And do source citations actually transfer back and
> forth seamlessly, without them becoming scrambled if
> they were written with SourceWriter?
>
> Connie
>
>
>
>
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> 21 2009:
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>
>
>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Hand Held Devices for Legacy

[hwedhlor]

  Sorry, I should have mentioned that the Families app is
also available for Android-based devices.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 8/12/2011 9:39 PM, hwedhlor wrote:
>The Families app for iPhone/iPod Touch/iPad is capable of
> displaying your Legacy databases in great detail, including
> photos, family and pedigree formats, and searches by
> surname, and can be used to enter data, then synced with
> your Legacy database on your PC.  The Families app is
> manufactured by TelGen and you may see screen shots, a
> description and user reviews at at
> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/families/id37961901?mt=8, or
> by Google search for "Families app".  I use Families on both
> my iPhone and iPad 2, and like it very much.  It saves me
> carrying a laptop on research trips.
>
> John Zimmerman
> Mesa, AZ
>
> On 8/12/2011 6:54 PM, Beth wrote:
>> I would like to use a hand held pad of some sort that
>> could handle Legacy software.  Not interested in the phone
>> features.  Any suggestions or is someone using one now?
>> Thanks,
>> Beth
>> www.Beth-website.net<http://www.Beth-website.net>
>>
>>
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>> http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/
>> Online technical support:
>> http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp
>> Follow Legacy on Facebook
>> (http://www.facebook.com/LegacyFamilyTree) and on our blog
>> (http://news.LegacyFamilyTree.com).
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>
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> our blog (http://news.LegacyFamilyTree.com).
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>
>
>


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Re: [LegacyUG] Hand Held Devices for Legacy

[hwedhlor]

  The Families app for iPhone/iPod Touch/iPad is capable of
displaying your Legacy databases in great detail, including
photos, family and pedigree formats, and searches by
surname, and can be used to enter data, then synced with
your Legacy database on your PC.  The Families app is
manufactured by TelGen and you may see screen shots, a
description and user reviews at at
http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/families/id37961901?mt=8, or
by Google search for "Families app".  I use Families on both
my iPhone and iPad 2, and like it very much.  It saves me
carrying a laptop on research trips.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 8/12/2011 6:54 PM, Beth wrote:
> I would like to use a hand held pad of some sort that
> could handle Legacy software.  Not interested in the phone
> features.  Any suggestions or is someone using one now?
> Thanks,
> Beth
> www.Beth-website.net 
>
>
> Legacy User Group guidelines:
> http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
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> http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/
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> Online technical support:
> http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp
> Follow Legacy on Facebook
> (http://www.facebook.com/LegacyFamilyTree) and on our blog
> (http://news.LegacyFamilyTree.com).
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Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy - Yvonne's "conflicted copy" warning

[hwedhlor]

  Yvonne,

I might suggest that leaving your computer running
constantly is also asking for trouble.  By doing so you
prevent some clearing of memory locations by programs that
behave poorly when you exit from those programs, thereby
opening your system to possible memory errors.

Additionally, you are preventing your system from becoming
aware of available updates.

I would suggest powering your system down regularly, perhaps
once a week as a minimum.  Additionally, I would always
power down, and consider disconnecting from your power
source by unplugging the power cord any time there is
electrical storm activity in your vicinity.

In working with computers for 45 years I have found that
periodic power cycling is far more beneficial than avoiding
any possible stress on a system from powering up and down.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 7/23/2011 4:42 PM, Yvonne Morehouse wrote:
> I am most appreciative of the techs who are involved with the Legacy
> Users Group.  And, I take your suggestions and cautions most seriously.
>
> Thanks both to Dennis and Rich.
>
> Yvonne
>
>
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>
>
>


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Re: [LegacyUG] New buttons?

[hwedhlor]

  I would suggest that if the buttons are to indicate the
user's level of interest it would be better if the most
interest were indicated by the number 1, and lesser interest
by higher numbers.  My reasoning is that the number display
shows only a single number, so unless they scroll through
the entire list of numbers, the user doesn't know if there
are 3, 10, or 98 numbers available to scale interest level.
If the highest level of interest is "1", then everything
else is less.  If the highest level of interest is something
higher the viewer has nothing to compare the displayed
number with, and as the highest level of interest is always
the most important level, the number 1 is the logical choice
for that award in a system that does not display all levels
available, along with a legend explaining the meaning of the
applied numeric values.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 7/23/2011 7:44 AM, Brian/Support wrote:
> Those are controlled by Options>  Customize>  Data Entry. If you want to
> see the buttons turn On the Ancestor/Descendant Interest option "Show on
> info screen". You only need to turn those on if you intend to use the
> Ancestor/Descendant Interest indicators.
>
> Brian
> Customer Support
> Millennia Corporation
> br...@legacyfamilytree.com
> http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com
>
> We are changing the world of genealogy!
> When replying to this message, please include all previous correspondence.
> Thanks.
>
> On 23/07/2011 10:37 AM, Lloyd Hite wrote:
>> I have 7.5.0.105 also and the buttons do not show on mine either.
>>
>> Lloyd
>
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>
>
>


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Re: [LegacyUG] DNA entry

[hwedhlor]

m both 
> sides, there is no apparent link at all. It seems almost impossible to 
> believe that our forefathers sired that many illegitimate children on 
> overseas visits!!!
>
> Is there areas where the DNA matching is simply not true?
>
> I would be most appreciative if you would be able to answer some of my 
> questions, or perhaps put me in contact with someone who can.
>
> Very Confused,
>
> Mike Bridgeford
> Plettenberg Bay
> South Africa
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: hwedhlor [mailto:hwedh...@cox.net]
> Sent: 17 July 2011 07:10 PM
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] DNA entry
>
>Richard,
>
> MtDNA is not reported as a complete set.  Each DNA testing
> company has different defined marker sets, but they all
> compare those sets to the Cambridge Reference Sequence
> (CRS), then report deviations from that sequence, not the
> entire list, which would include 569 values (bases) for
> HyperVariable Region 1 (HVR-1) and another 574 values for
> HVR-2 (Note that some testing companies define a 3rd HVR
> region, taking some values from the HVR-2 region and placing
> them in that third area).  Personally I'm not at all
> interested in entering 1143 values.  Instead I entered only
> "CRS" in the HVR-1 column for myself, as my HVR-1 values did
> not differ at all from the CRS values.  In HVR-2 I entered
> only my five values that differed from the CRS.  Allowing
> for 20 deviations from the CRS in each of the three
> recognized regions seems sufficient.  I can't speak for the
> rest of the Legacy user base, but I think it doubtful any of
> them would vary from the CRS by anything close to 20 values
> in each of the three HVR columns.
>
> As for the values for each entry field, typically an mtDNA
> value is a 4-digit entry.  That is three digits for the base
> location, plus a letter signifying the specific component
> (adenine, guanine, cytosine or thymine, represented by A, G,
> C or T).  For example, if the CRS at location 195 is T, and
> the person being tested has a component at 195 of C, then
> the deviation would be reported as "195C".  It is possible
> to have additional values (insertions) at a given location.
> In that case they would be reported using the base location
> (for example "195C") with the addition of a decimal and a
> number.  For example "195.1C".  Two insertions would be
> reported as 195.1C and 195.2T.  Deletions (missing base
> location values) are also possible.  In such cases the
> missing location is reported as a number followed by a minus
> sign.  For example "195-".  Using those notational standards
> it is highly unlikely that any give value would exceed 7
> digits, so 10 is more than adequate.
>
> Regards,
>
> John Zimmerman
> Mesa, AZ
>
> On 7/17/2011 7:46 AM, Richard Van Wasshnova wrote:
>> You can't input your complete mtDNA in v.7.5.0.98 anyway.
>> The template only goes up to 20 entries (of 10 letters) in each HVR.
>> We'll all have to wait for the next update.
>>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] DNA entry

[hwedhlor]

  Richard,

MtDNA is not reported as a complete set.  Each DNA testing
company has different defined marker sets, but they all
compare those sets to the Cambridge Reference Sequence
(CRS), then report deviations from that sequence, not the
entire list, which would include 569 values (bases) for
HyperVariable Region 1 (HVR-1) and another 574 values for
HVR-2 (Note that some testing companies define a 3rd HVR
region, taking some values from the HVR-2 region and placing
them in that third area).  Personally I'm not at all
interested in entering 1143 values.  Instead I entered only
"CRS" in the HVR-1 column for myself, as my HVR-1 values did
not differ at all from the CRS values.  In HVR-2 I entered
only my five values that differed from the CRS.  Allowing
for 20 deviations from the CRS in each of the three
recognized regions seems sufficient.  I can't speak for the
rest of the Legacy user base, but I think it doubtful any of
them would vary from the CRS by anything close to 20 values
in each of the three HVR columns.

As for the values for each entry field, typically an mtDNA
value is a 4-digit entry.  That is three digits for the base
location, plus a letter signifying the specific component
(adenine, guanine, cytosine or thymine, represented by A, G,
C or T).  For example, if the CRS at location 195 is T, and
the person being tested has a component at 195 of C, then
the deviation would be reported as "195C".  It is possible
to have additional values (insertions) at a given location.
In that case they would be reported using the base location
(for example "195C") with the addition of a decimal and a
number.  For example "195.1C".  Two insertions would be
reported as 195.1C and 195.2T.  Deletions (missing base
location values) are also possible.  In such cases the
missing location is reported as a number followed by a minus
sign.  For example "195-".  Using those notational standards
it is highly unlikely that any give value would exceed 7
digits, so 10 is more than adequate.

Regards,

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 7/17/2011 7:46 AM, Richard Van Wasshnova wrote:
> You can't input your complete mtDNA in v.7.5.0.98 anyway.
> The template only goes up to 20 entries (of 10 letters) in each HVR.
> We'll all have to wait for the next update.
>


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Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy Help files that are not very helpful!

[hwedhlor]

  CE is right on the money in every respect.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 7/5/2011 3:39 PM, CE WOOD wrote:
> Then Technical Writers need to write the Help files, that
> is, if they are supposed to be helpful rather than
> frustrating!
> Odd, though.  When beginning the study of programming, we
> are taught to begin at the beginning and give the precise
> steps needed to accomplish the task because computers know
> nothing they have not been told.  One would assume that
> programmers would be able to do this. if they are writing
> the Help files..
> If Technical Writers compose the Help files, they need to
> imagine they are not familiar with the lingo and procedures.
> CE
>
> - Original Message -
> *From:* Mike Fry 
> *To:* LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> 
> *Sent:* Tuesday, July 05, 2011 3:13 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy Help files that are
> not very helpful!
>
> On 2011/07/05 19:39, Cathy-0 wrote:
>
> > I've got a major problem with how programmers write
> the (un)-Help files.  And
> > the Legacy programmers are no exception.  I came
> across this example today.
>
> That's because we're Programmers and not Technical
> Writers!
>
> --
> Regards,
> Mike Fry
> Johannesburg
>
>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy Help files that are not very helpful!

[hwedhlor]

  Pardon me, but that information should be _first_ on the
help screen, not last!

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 7/5/2011 10:52 AM, Sherry/Support wrote:
> Cathy,
>
> You didn't read far enough.
>
> At the very bottom of the topic it says
>
> "The Advanced Tagging screen is reached by right-clicking on any tag
> box or by choosing Tag Records… from the Edit menu."
>
>
>
> Sincerely,
> Sherry
> Technical Support
> Legacy Family Tree
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jul 5, 2011 at 10:39 AM, Cathy-0  wrote:
>> I've got a major problem with how programmers write the (un)-Help files.
>> And the Legacy programmers are no exception.  I came across this example
>> today.
>>
>> I wanted to do some major tagging of my database so that I can review each
>> person's data and clean it up.  So, I decided to tag everyone in my file and
>> then untag each person when I completed the person's data review.
>>
>> So, I went to the Help files and looked up Advanced Tagging.  The Help File
>> reads as follows:  "The Advanced Tagging window is used to quickly tag or
>> untag families and other larger groups of related people.  Entire lines can
>> be tagged (or untagged) with the click of a button."
>>
>> Yet, no where does it tell the user of the software where to find the
>> Advanced Tagging window!  Why not?
>>
>> Well, I'm not a newbie but I don't always use some features like tagging.
>> So, after more than a half hour or so of reviewing past emails and  by
>> clicking around the program, I  finally found the Advanced Tagging window.
>> But why didn't the Help Files identify this in the first place?
>>
>> Sorry to vent so, but that's my pet peeve with the alleged Help files!
>>
>> Cathy-0
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Families iPhnoe app

[hwedhlor]

  The point being to check before visiting any facility to
determine what they allow.

John

On 5/11/2011 1:33 PM, Eliz Hanebury wrote:
> Good to know - here in Chester co you can't take a camera in and Moore
> Co NC doesn't allow cameras or camera phones. So it seems just as
> likely to allow as not allow.
>
>
> Eliz
>
> On Tue, May 10, 2011 at 9:56 PM, hwedhlor  wrote:
>>   I don't see any issue with phones or cameras in the courts
>> here.  My wife just served on a jury in Maricopa County
>> Superior Court, and was able to take her iPhone there.  More
>> than one other juror had an iPhone, and one, who happened to
>> be an attorney, had an iPad.  I've never had an issue with
>> my iPhones at the FHC in Mesa, which is the second largest
>> in the world.  Nor have I had a problem at the State
>> Archives.  Often I can use the CamScanner app, or JotNot
>> Pro, to photograph, and OCR documents on site.
>>
>> John
>>
>> On 5/10/2011 1:45 PM, Eliz H
>
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>
>
>


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Re: [LegacyUG] Families iPhnoe app

[hwedhlor]

  I don't see any issue with phones or cameras in the courts
here.  My wife just served on a jury in Maricopa County
Superior Court, and was able to take her iPhone there.  More
than one other juror had an iPhone, and one, who happened to
be an attorney, had an iPad.  I've never had an issue with
my iPhones at the FHC in Mesa, which is the second largest
in the world.  Nor have I had a problem at the State
Archives.  Often I can use the CamScanner app, or JotNot
Pro, to photograph, and OCR documents on site.

John

On 5/10/2011 1:45 PM, Eliz Hanebury wrote:
> Lovely explanation really great way to view it ,  I have been
> wondering if you have trouble at the library or court house or archive
> with your phone?
> Phones aren't allowed in many courts neither are cameras and most
> phones have them. We (I) need to know how to do this.
>
>
> Eliz
>
> On Tue, May 10, 2011 at 4:03 PM, hwedhlor  wrote:
>>   Gwen,
>>
>> I am running the Families app on both an iPhone 3Gs and an
>> iPad 2, and I heartily recommend it.  I was a beta for the
>> Families app when it was only available to run on the
>> iPhone.  Running it on the iPad 2 offers an even better
>> display, and easier access to features due to the larger
>> visual format.
> 
>
>
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>
>
>


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Re: [LegacyUG] Families iPhnoe app

[hwedhlor]

  Gwen,

I am running the Families app on both an iPhone 3Gs and an
iPad 2, and I heartily recommend it.  I was a beta for the
Families app when it was only available to run on the
iPhone.  Running it on the iPad 2 offers an even better
display, and easier access to features due to the larger
visual format.

Please do not think of Families as a "version" of Legacy
Family Tree.  Families was developed by an entirely
different company, to run under a completely different
operating system on totally different hardware than Legacy.
Having worked in the computer industry since 1965 I
understand that duplicating program features across hardware
and operating system boundaries is not a simple process.
The task is a bit like being asked to copy the Queen Mary,
but as a submarine, using plans written in a language you
don't speak or read.  Passengers from the Queen Mary want
visit the bottom of the ocean in your submarine, but they
expect the same amenities they were used to enjoying on the
Queen Mary!

Rather than concentrate on which Legacy features are
"missing" from the Families app, I celebrate the fact that I
can now do field research, and document findings, without
having to carry a laptop.  Navigating through my Legacy
databases with Families is done on a familiar user
interface, while the iPhone and iPad 2 allow me to
photograph documents found in the field.

Although Families will probably never duplicate the enormous
feature list of Legacy, Families does offer the user the
option to make fundamental data entries on the portable
Apple devices they choose to carry, then to update their
Legacy database to reflect all of those entries. The
creators of the Families app have proven to be very
supportive of their user base, and I look for them to add
features over time.

If you are a Legacy user, and own an iPhone, iPad, or iPod
Touch, you will find no better genealogy software than the
Families app for use on your Apple device.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 5/10/2011 12:03 AM, Kirsten Bowman wrote:
> Gwen:
>
> You don't actually create a GEDCOM from your Legacy database; rather, there's 
> a (free) Families Sync program that goes on your desktop computer and handles 
> the transfer of data to and from your mobile device.  And yes, you can edit 
> the data on your iPad but I don't find editing very convenient because the 
> small fields don't "unpinch" the way some sites or apps will, so extensive 
> editing would be (for me) fairly clumsy.  Also, the Families version doesn't 
> have all of the features of Legacy on the PC.  I'd love to clean up my 
> Locations list using the iPad, for example, but there's no "Show List" option 
> at the Master Location List and I'm hesitant to edit without knowing exactly 
> who I'm changing.  There are a few more of my favorite Legacy features 
> missing as well.  Families doesn't look or operate *exactly* like Legacy on 
> the PC but I still think it's a dandy little app and well worth the $15 even 
> if you just want to carry the data with you for reference as I do.
>
> Kirsten
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Noddie [mailto:7thw...@ihug.co.nz]
> Sent: Monday, May 09, 2011 10:12 PM
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] Families iPhnoe app
>
>
> I was also wondering about an app for the iPad 2 which I could use in
> conjunction with my Legacy family tree.
> Would I be right in saying that 'Families' could be the one I would
> use.  Would  it sync with my mac and my
> windows side where 'Legacy' is.
>
> I was hoping I could gedcom a file, and send it to my ipad and then be
> able to view and edit records from
> there?  The site for the software does not explain the use of it very
> well, it is only a viewer or a mobile
> user friendly program where I could transfer my data to and then
> transfer it back to my mac.
> Thanks for your time
>
> Gwen
>
>
> On 10/05/2011, at 4:04 PM, Kirsten Bowman wrote:
>
>> Joshua:
>>
>> I have Families for iPad and believe it's much the same as the app
>> for iPhone.  I love the convenience of always having my Legacy data
>> with me but I find the fields too small to do much in the way of
>> editing (which was my initial objective).  My favorite aspect is
>> being able to surf genealogical sites from anywhere in spare minutes
>> and quickly check my Legacy file to see if "hits" have any bearing
>> on my research.  Rather than update via Families and re-import to my
>> PC I usually e-mail the data to myself and update only the on the
>> PC.  I certainly don't regret spending the $15 for the app.
>>
>> Kirsten
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Joshua Crump [mailto:j...@joshuacrump.com]
>> Sent: Monday, May 09, 2011 7:42 PM
>> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
>> Subject: [LegacyUG] Families iPhnoe app
>>
>>
>> Legacy User Group,
>>
>> I am trying to decide if I want to buy the Families iPhone app and I
>> wanted to know if anyone in the group is using it and if it is worth
>> the
>> $15 they want for it.

Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy Charting Deluxe (7.5.125) bug?

[hwedhlor]

  Sounds like you can simply never satisfy people! ;^)
You'd think they'd understand that marking people as private
might keep them out of a chart or two. :-)

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 4/20/2011 7:30 PM, Sherry/Support wrote:
> We tried that once and we got a lot of complaints about people not
> showing up in the chart so we made it a default to be deselected.
>
> Sincerely,
> Sherry
> Technical Support
> Legacy Family Tree
>
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 20, 2011 at 2:56 PM, hwedhlor  wrote:
>>   Sherry,
>>
>> By nature, privacy options imply that the user has
>> information the wish to suppress.  Wouldn't it be more
>> logical for Legacy Charting to default to the "Suppress
>> Private Information" setting, rather than require the user
>> to make an additional selection (after already inserting
>> privacy brackets) to actually hide their private information?
>>
>> John Zimmerman
>> Mesa, AZ
>>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy Charting Deluxe (7.5.125) bug?

[hwedhlor]

  Sherry,

By nature, privacy options imply that the user has
information the wish to suppress.  Wouldn't it be more
logical for Legacy Charting to default to the "Suppress
Private Information" setting, rather than require the user
to make an additional selection (after already inserting
privacy brackets) to actually hide their private information?

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 4/20/2011 9:01 AM, Sherry/Support wrote:
> Laird,
>
> In Legacy Charting, did you click on the Privacy Options button to
> select the option to Suppress Private Information?
>
>
> Sincerely,
> Sherry
> Technical Support
> Legacy Family Tree
>
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 20, 2011 at 8:29 AM, Laird  wrote:
>> Hi,
>> In my Legacy (ver*. *7.5.0.67) database I have a birth date entered using
>> privacy brackets as [[5 April]] 2011.  In Legacy reports the privacy brackets
>> are respected.
>>
>> In Legacy Charting Deluxe version 7.5.125 the date is shown as [[5 April]]
>> 2011.  Can anyone reproduce this problem?
>>
>> Thanks, Laird
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Is there a status page to see what Enhancement/suggestions have been made

[hwedhlor]

  As satisfying as such a page would be to those of us who
make suggestions, such a page would tell Millennia
Corporation's competition what the customers are looking
for, and perhaps allow that competition to implement those
ideas before they could be implemented by Millennia.  The
competition might not have even thought of some of the
ideas.  I think it best to continue with things as they are,
and allow Millennia to track our suggestions, and to decide
when/if a given idea should be implemented in Legacy Family
Tree.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 3/21/2011 5:33 PM, leo macdonald wrote:
> Hi Sherry,
>
> In one way I do agree with you that the Legacy techs and Legacy staff would 
> not want the competition to know what they are working on for new updates or 
> a new version of Legacy.
>
> However, a status page for suggested enhancements and reported bugs could be 
> made available to Legacy owners to access by entering their customer number, 
> either through their Legacy program or through the Legacy home page.
>
> Each enhancement or bug could be listed by their reported date and not by 
> their priority as determined by the Legacy staff or Techs.
>
> If the status page would allow each customer the ability to cast one vote for 
> each enhancement or bug then the Legacy staff and Tech's would know just how 
> important that enhancement or bug is to their customers. The number of votes 
> cast would be known only to the Legacy staff.
>
> Once an enhancement or a bug has been made or fixed, then that item would be 
> removed from the list.
>
> This status page would inform us customers of what proposed enhancements have 
> been made and which bugs have been reported, but would not tell us or the 
> competition which items the Legacy staff are presently working on.
>
> Leo
>
>
>> From: she...@legacyfamilytree.com
>> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
>> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] Is there a status page to see what 
>> Enhancement/suggestions have been made
>> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2011 13:17:34 -0700
>>
>> No. The support techs don't even know what's coming up until new
>> things are released to the beta testers - and everyone's sworn to
>> secrecy until the update or new version is released.
>>
>> Why do we want to let the competition know what we're up to???
>>
>> Sincerely,
>> Sherry
>> Technical Support
>> Legacy Family Tree
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2011 at 12:29 PM, my genealogy email
>>   wrote:
>>> Sherry,
>>> Is there a status page where we can check to see what enhancements or
>>> suggestions have been made and when they will be implemented? I had made a
>>> suggestion for the source writer to use my personal info on some of the
>>> sources so I wouldn't have to keep entering it every time I entered a new
>>> source.
>>> Russ Strong
>>
>>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Dual Monitors - Split screen

[hwedhlor]

  Sherry,

Your setup is useful, but there is another option that you
might find more versatile.  My dual monitor setup is
configured so that each monitor displays a separate image of
whatever I choose, as opposed to automatically extending the
view of the active window across the boundaries between the
two monitors so that they appear as a single, large
monitor.  That setup does not preclude dragging the Legacy
window across the boundary between the two monitors, thereby
permitting display of (for example) 3 families across the
two monitors (two families in the leftmost monitor and
another in the rightmost monitor), with room remaining in
the rightmost monitor for Ancestry, or (in this case)
Mozilla Thunderbird.  Assuming that Legacy is opened in the
leftmost monitor, here is how I do that.

1. Using Windows Control Panel, Display (or in my case using
the NVIDIA Control Panel), set up the display so that each
monitor is configured independently from one-another (as
opposed to displaying one large horizontal desktop).

2. Using the Maximize button (middle button in the
upper-right corner of the screen), set the window in which
Legacy is displayed to allow resizing of that window.  If
that is correctly set the middle button will appear as two
overlapping boxes, rather than a single large box,
signifying that the active window will not necessarily fill
the entire screen.

 +-+
 | |
+-+   |
| |---+
| |
+-+

As opposed to . . .

++
||
||
||
++

3. Drag the corners of the Legacy display window to fill the
screen vertically.

4. Drag the right border of the Legacy window to the right,
across the leftmost monitor's right boundary, so that the
Legacy window then occupies all of the leftmost monitor, and
half of the rightmost monitor.

4. Proceed to open three split screen family windows within
Legacy.  Two of them will occupy the entire screen of the
leftmost monitor.  The third family will occupy the leftmost
half of the rightmost monitor, leaving room for another
program (in this case Mozilla Thunderbird) to occupy the
rightmost half of the rightmost monitor.

I would gladly have included a screenshot of my dual monitor
display if this mailing list permitted embedded graphics. :-)

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ



On 3/4/2011 10:11 AM, Sherry/Support wrote:
> You should update to the latest build 7.5.0.56.  I can't test an
> earlier build and problems experienced in an earlier build may have
> been resolved by now as each update contains many bug fixes.
>
> I recently saw a support email from someone who said they never get a
> message asking if they want to open a different file when opening a
> second window through View>  Split Screen.  I would suggest trying
> these steps:
>
> 1. With Legacy closed, go to the c:\Legacy folder on your hard drive
> and delete the Legacy2.usr file. It will be recreated when you restart
> Legacy.
>
> 2.  Uninstall Legacy (your Family Files and Settings will be
> preserved) and then reinstall with the most recent update from our
> website.
>
>
>
> With dual monitors you can move any active window between monitors.
> If the "window" is full screen, it can't be moved. I move windows back
> and forth all the time and find it really hard when I'm working on my
> laptop and can't move things out of the way this way!
>
> In Legacy, all windows are resizable by moving the mouse pointer to
> the corner of a window until the pointer becomes a double arrow - left
> click and drag.  You can drag from the sides or top/bottom also, but
> dragging from the corners maintains the ratio.
>
> I don't know a lot about dual monitor settings other than what I'm
> using, but I have mine set to extend my display between the two
> monitors. I don't think you can slide windows between monitors with
> any of the other settings.
>
> On our website at www.LegacyFamilyTree.com>  Help Center>  Tips,
> you'll find a couple of sections of articles on using Split Screen.
> You can also access these articles through Legacy by clicking on the
> "Tips from the Experts" link in the Support section of the Legacy Home
> tab.
>
>
> Sincerely,
> Sherry
> Technical Support
> Legacy Family Tree
>
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 8:24 AM, John Roose  wrote:
>> Sherry -
>>
>> FYI - I'm using v 7.4.0.6
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 11:08 AM, Sherry/Support
>>   wrote:
>>>
>>> You need to make sure Legacy is in a window and not full screen. A
>>> screen in full screen can't be moved around but one in "window" mode
>>> can be.  What I do is stretch my window to full screen to keep it
>>> movable rather than use the middle button in the upper right corner.
>>
>>
>> Dual Monitors: In full screen I can move ANY subscreen (such a word?) such
>> as "Event" or "Individual's Information" or when Individual is open, edit is
>> open and I open Assigned sources - I can slide the last opened one over to
>> the other monitor. I followed your suggestion and the split screen (just

Re: [LegacyUG] Webinars explained, please

[hwedhlor]

  Well, Helen, it was worth a try. :-)  Perhaps some sort of
speech-to-text device might help you.  I was able to view
the text of Geoff Rasmussen's voice delivery from one of the
webinars a few minutes ago when I played back the Real
Player video and recorded the voice with Dragon Dictation on
my iPhone.  The problem with that "solution" is that it's
not a real-time transcription, though it's pretty accurate.
There are also programs for the PC such as Express Scribe,
that allows voice input to be transcribed to text, and
Windows from XP on up has speech recognition built it, which
allows dictation, but it's very awkward to use.  There
should be a simple software switch to throw that provides
real-time captioning for voice on our PCs.  The technology
is not unknown.  If I find anything I'll let you know.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ



On 3/1/2011 4:42 PM, ci...@treadles.ca wrote:
> Thanks John but I also have a severe word recognition problem. Ever hear
> of the silly seniors' joke "It's windy today, isn't it?" "No, it's
> Thursday". That's me.
>
> Even when head phones are turned up loud enough for me, it's only just
> noise, for me and the rest of the room, but I can't understand what's
> being said. It's like I'm listening to a foreign language. Most frustrating!
>
> Helen
>
>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Webinars explained, please

[hwedhlor]

  Helen,

If you have some hearing you might consider listening to the
webinars with earphones, which in turn might allow you to
increase the volume high enough for you to hear what is
being said.  Additionally, some of the webinars have had
live video of the presenters, though that video typically
ceased once the first visual aid was displayed.

Just a thought,

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 3/1/2011 12:11 PM, ci...@treadles.ca wrote:
> Thank you all so much for your detailed explanations, especially Sherry.
> You've answered all my questions.
>
> First of all, I don't have computer speakers - don't need them, can't
> hear them. Haven't used a phone in 10 years - can't find one loud
> enough, heard of VOIP but no idea nor inclination of course, to find out
> how it works.
>
> I did go to the archived page and the first word I saw was "Listen"! But
> I persevered. Tried the "Tracing Women" one but it seemed very USA based
> - no use to me. So I went over to Data Cleanup. Lots of good pointers
> there but watching it was like watching wallpaper peel because I could
> only read each screen and not listen to any detailed explanation.
>
> The downloads should be handy though and I'll certainly go for them. But
> now that my suspicions are confirmed, at least I won't be depriving a
> hearing person of a place in a future Webinar.
>
> If they ever become close-captioned though, please let me know.
>
> Again, my grateful thanks to everyone and their lengthy, detailed
> messages - just what I wanted to know. And thank you for taking the time
> and trouble to reply.
>
> Helen
>
>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy and iPad?

[hwedhlor]

  Kirsten,

I participated in the beta testing of Families for iPhone
and one of the few things it cannot do besides print is
display relationships.  Other than that it is very capable,
excellent program that I can recommend very highly.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 12/30/2010 1:45 PM, Kirsten Bowman wrote:
> Geoff:
>
> It sounds like that's the option but I'm pretty hesitant to plunk down $600 
> for an iPad that would depend on a $15 application to be successful, 
> especially since that application is at version 1.0.  Hopefully someone will 
> respond who uses Legacy on an iPad via Families and tell us whether it's 
> simple and full-featured in real life.  I see a list of what Families *can* 
> do; what is there that it *doesn't* do--short of the obvious like print?
>
> Kirsten
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Geoff Rasmussen [mailto:ge...@legacyusers.com]
> Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2010 10:27 AM
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] Legacy and iPad?
>
>
> Kirsten,
>
> You can use the Families app. See 
> http://www.legacyfamilytreestore.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=FAM.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Geoff Rasmussen
> Millennia Corporation
> ge...@legacyfamilytree.com
> www.LegacyFamilyTree.com
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Kirsten Bowman [mailto:vik...@rvi.net]
> Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2010 11:17 AM
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: [LegacyUG] Legacy and iPad?
>
>
> My totally tech sons and daughter-in-law visited for a week at Christmas and
> of course there were iPads everywhere.  I'm s jealous I can't stand it,
> but I'm not about to give up Legacy.  Most of my research is online rather
> than at libraries or archives, but I'd love to be able to sit on the patio
> or at the local coffee shop and clean up my location list, sources, notes,
> and do some searching.  Does anyone use a Windows desktop as their main
> computer (with Legacy) and sync it somehow with an iPad?  If so, how is it
> done and what is required?  Is it a satisfactory arrangement for a
> non-technical person?
>
> Kirsten
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Copying Text into a Legacy Note

[hwedhlor]

  Gene,

Please publish a URL, or other reference, where "Transcript"
may be found.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 12/13/2010 10:24 AM, Gene Young wrote:
> On 12/13/2010 12:08 PM, William Boswell wrote:
>> I believe it started with Version 8 in the Pro version.  Version 9 does it 
>> too.  I don't know about Version 10.
>>
>>
> It was in Adobe v4 but it will only OCR an image PDF file so any other
> format would have to be converted to PDF first.
>
> I have found the best combination to be FreeOCR and a program called
> Transcript.  FreeOCR works better than any other free or paid program I
> have used and Transcript opens both the original image and the text
> output file from the OCR program in stacked windows for editing.
>
> At this point I believe we are getting rather far afield from Legacy and
> its add on's so we should continue this off list.
>



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Re: [LegacyUG] Families 1.1.1

[hwedhlor]

  Kathy,

Existing users are notified automatically via their iPhones
by the Apple Store.  I also received a notification via the
Google Group for Families.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ

On 11/10/2010 9:07 AM, Kathy Meyer wrote:
> When you make improvements like this, do you notify
> existing users and allow them to update to the newer
> version?  I don't have this now but have been considering
> it if I start using an iPod Touch.  Kathy
>
> On Wed, Nov 10, 2010 at 2:45 AM, Malcolm Green
> mailto:malc...@telgen.co.uk>> wrote:
>
> We are pleased to announce that Families 1.1.1 for
> iPhone, iPod Touch and
> iPad is now
> available in the App Store.  This includes the
> following changes:
>
> - Support search by surname, given name
> - Fix problems matching upper/lowercase Unicode characters
> - Fix problem with date with no year not being displayed
> - Improve image handling performance and memory usage
>
> Malcolm Green
> TelGen Limited
>
>
>
>
>
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>
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>
>
>
>
> --
> Kathy Meyer
> "To reach a goal you have never before attained, you must
> do things you have never before done."
> --Richard G. Scott, "Finding the Way Back," Ensign, May
> 1990, 74
>
> Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and
> expecting different results. ~ Albert Einstein
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Saturday's webinar

[hwedhlor]

  That's too early for me.  I'll have to watch the archived
version.

John

On 10/22/2010 11:55 AM, Geoff Rasmussen wrote:
> Saturday's webinar entitled "Evidence Analysis" with Karen Clifford has been
> rescheduled to 10:55AM Eastern time. I think that's 2:55PM GMT. Hope to see
> you all there. Karen will be teaching live at the ICAPGen seminar in Salt
> Lake City AND broadcasting it to our live webinar audience. Registration is
> available at www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/webinars.asp. As always, we'll have
> great door prizes and other gifts for our live attendees.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Geoff Rasmussen
> Millennia Corporation
> ge...@legacyfamilytree.com
> www.LegacyFamilyTree.com
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Families app for iPhone, iPad, iPod Touch - Support for Privacy Settings

[hwedhlor]

  Thanks for the supporting report, Wendy.  Sometimes we
simply can't trust these programs. ;^)

JohnZ

On 8/24/2010 5:45 PM, Wendy Howard wrote:
>Mike said
>
>> Thunderbird is already set in that fashion...
> That's my experience, too.  Sometimes Thunderbird honours the settings
> and sends a post in plain text, other times it doesn't.  I try to
> remember to manually set the email to plain text before sending to the
> LUG (Options>  Format) to ensure it happens.
>
> Wendy
>
>



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Re: [LegacyUG] Families app for iPhone, iPad, iPod Touch - Support for Privacy Settings

[hwedhlor]

Thanks for the tip, Tim.

Regards,

JohnZ


On 8/24/2010 6:09 PM, Tim Rosenlof wrote:
> I use TBird and a secret I learned was to hold down the shift key while
> pressing reply. Changes from html to text and visa 
>
> Regards,
> Tim Rosenlof
>
> On 8/24/2010 4:24 PM, Mike Fry wrote:
>> On 2010/08/24 22:12, hwedhlor wrote:
>>> I had been asked, in the Legacy Test mailing list, whether the
>>> Families app for iPhone, iPod Touch, and iPad, supported the Privacy
>>> model for Legacy?
>>
>> [BIG SNIP]
>>
>>> It is my opinion that the Families app supports the privacy model from
>>> Legacy.
>>>
>>> JohnZ
>>
>> John, I see that you used Thunderbird to post your message. May I
>> suggest that you get hold of the entry for the LUG that is in one or
>> more of your Address Books and set the option for 'Prefers to receive
>> messages formatted as' to 'Plain Text'. Thank you.
>>
>
>
>
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Re: [LegacyUG] Families app for iPhone, iPad, iPod Touch - Support for Privacy Settings

[hwedhlor]

  Hi Mike,

Thanks for your prompting.  Thunderbird is already set in
that fashion.  In Tools/Options/General/Send Options, under
"Plain Text Domains" is included
"LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com".  I just double-checked
that entry to ensure that Thunderbird had not reset the
entry as a result of recent upgrading, etc., but it was
still as it should be.  I also checked the Address Book
entries for both lists, and they also reflect Plain Text for
LUG and HTML for LegacyTest.  If my message came through in
HTML I apologize, as that was certainly not my intent for
this list.  I did send a similar message to the LegacyTest
list, and that list both permits, and encourages HTML, so
they are entered in my list of HTML Domains.

Regards,

JohnZ
Mesa, AZ

On 8/24/2010 3:24 PM, Mike Fry wrote:
> On 2010/08/24 22:12, hwedhlor wrote:
>>I had been asked, in the Legacy Test mailing list, whether the
>> Families app for iPhone, iPod Touch, and iPad, supported the Privacy
>> model for Legacy?
> [BIG SNIP]
>
>> It is my opinion that the Families app supports the privacy model from
>> Legacy.
>>
>> JohnZ
> John, I see that you used Thunderbird to post your message. May I
> suggest that you get hold of the entry for the LUG that is in one or
> more of your Address Books and set the option for 'Prefers to receive
> messages formatted as' to 'Plain Text'. Thank you.
>



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[LegacyUG] Families app for iPhone, iPad, iPod Touch - Support for Privacy Settings

[hwedhlor]

  I had been asked, in the Legacy Test mailing list, whether
the Families app for iPhone, iPod Touch, and iPad, supported
the Privacy model for Legacy?

I have done some fairly simple testing of how the Families
app handles Legacy privacy settings.  The testing was done
only on an individual marked "Private" then again on the
same individual marked "Invisible."

To lay some groundwork for my evaluation of how the Families
app handles "private" and "invisible" individuals I re-read
the definitions of "Private" and "Invisible" in the Legacy
Help Index.  In each case the Legacy Help Index stated that
marking an individual as either "Private" or "Invisible"
effected only how that individual was dealt with in Reports
or Web Pages.

The Families app does not produce reports, or web pages, and
is intended only as a portable means of carrying Legacy data
on an iPhone/iPod Touch/iPad.  Although the Families app can
display what it terms an "Individual" screen for a person,
and allows editing of the data presented on that screen,
Privacy Settings are not presented, nor editable.  Therefore
my only concern with privacy issues in relation to the
Families app was whether individuals marked as either
"Private" or "Invisible" within Legacy retained that status
when data was passed to the Families app, then back to
Legacy.  I checked that status both in the Privacy Settings
for the test individual, and within Reports and Web Pages
created from data that had been passed to the Families app,
then back to Legacy.

Before marking anyone as either "Private" or "Invisible" I
first exported the test database to Families and checked
that the individual chosen for testing was visible.  I also
checked that the test individual was marked as "Not Private"
in Legacy, and that they appeared normally on Reports, and
in Web Pages.  Once that baseline was established I did the
following tests:

*INDIVIDUAL MARKED "PRIVATE"*

1.  Opened a database in Legacy, selected an individual,
opened their Individual Information window, clicked on
Privacy Settings and selected "Private."

2.  Closed the Individual Information window, opened a
Family Report that would include that individual I had
marked as "Private," and viewed the report.  I confirmed
that person was presented as "Private (details suppressed
for this person)", though their parents were included, as
well as their spouse and children.

3.  Produced a Web Page that would include the test
individual.  Confirmed that the test individual appeared
only as "Private" on the Web Page, and did not appear on any
list of individuals.

4.  Synced the test database to the Families app and
confirmed that the test individual appeared in the database.

5.  Synced the test database back to Legacy under a
different file name from the original test database, and
confirmed that the test individual was still marked as
"Private."

6.  Produced a Family Report, confirmed that the test
individual appeared on that report as "Private (details
suppressed for this person)".  Also confirmed that the test
individual appeared only as "Private" on the Web Page, and
did not appear on any list of individuals.

*INDIVIDUAL MARKED "INVISIBLE"*

1.  Opened a database in Legacy, selected an individual,
opened their Individual Information window, clicked on
Privacy Settings and selected "Invisible."

2.  Closed the Individual Information window, opened a
Family Report that would include that individual I had
marked as "Invisible," and viewed the report.  I confirmed
that person was not shown in any way, though their spouse
and children were displayed.

3.  Produced a Web Page that would include the test
individual.  Confirmed that the test individual did not
appear on the Web Page.  As the individual selected for the
test happened to be the primary person for whom the Web Page
was created, there was no pedigree chart available on this
Web Page.

4.  Synced the test database to the Families app and
confirmed that the test individual appeared in the database.

5.  Synced the test database back to Legacy under a
different file name from the original test database, and
confirmed that the test individual was still marked as
"Invisible."

6.  Produced a Family Report, confirmed that the test
individual did not appear on that report.  Also confirmed
that the test individual did not appear on a Web Page
created from the newly synced database.

It is my opinion that the Families app supports the privacy
model from Legacy.

JohnZ
Mesa, AZ



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Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy (Families) program for iPhone

[hwedhlor]

  Hi Kathy,

I hope that you are not put off from the Families app by
some of the complexities encountered by new users.  Aside
from having participated in the beta testing of the Families
app, I have no affiliation with the TelGen firm, and as a
long-time genealogist, and someone who has worked with
computers since 1965, and computerized genealogy on personal
computers since applications were first available on 8-bit
systems such as the Apple IIe, I can say that Families is
the most useful application I have seen yet for handheld
devices.  Certainly it is head and shoulders above the other
apps available for the iPhone, iPad and iPod Touch.  Far
better than those apps that merely display data transferred
as GEDCOM files.

When Families is used to view, or edit Legacy data the user
is presented with many of the same amenities they enjoy when
using Legacy on their PCs, and TelGen has already begun to
expand those capabilities.  If you have an iPhone, iPad, or
iPod Touch there is simply no better Legacy-compatible app
available.

In evaluating the ease of use of the Families app it is
necessary to take in to consideration the wide range of
experience represented by the various users who have written
to LUG so far.  Gill is admittedly something of a novice in
a couple of areas, and therefore experienced considerable
frustration.  On the other end of the spectrum are users who
have many years of experience, and who found installation,
and use of Families to be relatively easy.  Nonetheless,
those experienced users still missed the fact that a WiFi
connection was required to transfer data between Legacy and
Families.  I am one of those experienced users who missed
that fact because I took the connection for granted, even
during testing.  When I pointed out the ease with which that
requirement could be overlooked to TelGen they immediately
made a change to the product description on the iTunes Store
site, and by immediate I'm talking hours, not days.  Any new
program will have growing pains.  The manufacturer, and the
beta testers, are often too close to the product to see gaps
in documentation, or functionality (the recent antenna faux
pas by Apple with their iPhone 4 is an excellent example).
What is significant about TelGen, and the Families app, is
that they acknowledged this recent shortcoming in their
description of the product, and fixed that right away, and
that has been their behavior consistently as long as I have
dealt with them. Such an attitude is something I have come
to value very highly in a lifetime of interaction with
software (and hardware) firms.

JohnZ
Mesa, AZ



On 8/18/2010 9:13 AM, Kathy Meyer wrote:
> I, for one, have been very interested in the string of comments about
> the families application; it's helping me decide if I want to use that
> in the future; I hope all of the comments will not be made privately
> because I'm learning an awful lot from other's difficulties as they
> get their own program running.  And I think the comment about
> transferring to TMG very on-topic beause I think a lot of people
> transfer files between programs for the same reasons - to accomodate
> other family members.  Let's not keep people from discussing their
> issues; we are all learning.
>
> Kathy
>
> On Wed, Aug 18, 2010 at 2:06 AM, Graham  wrote:
>> Hello John,
>>
>> Thanks for taking the time. I will ask one question of you regarding WiFi. 
>> My iPhone is not able to connect to the Internet, but it can connect via USB 
>> to the computer...so why can't it transfer the file that way rather than 
>> WiFi?
>>
>> Thank you,
>>
>> Graham
>>
>>
>> - Original Message -
>> From: hwedhlor
>> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
>> Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 4:56 PM
>> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy (Families) program for iPhone
>>Hi Graham,
>>
>> Sorry to hear of your frustrations in obtaining the Families
>> app, and getting it running.  Families is not a product of
>> Millennium, nor is it associated with their Legacy Family
>> Tree product other than it was designed to synchronize data
>> with Legacy.  Families is a product of TelGen, and any
>> difficulties you have in obtaining it should be addressed to
>> them, or to Apple via the App Store if the problem is with
>> purchasing the Families app. Unless you have "jailbroken"
>> your iPhone there are no apps available from any source
>> other than the iTunes App Store.
>>
>> Problems with using Families should be addressed directly to
>> TelGen.  You might consider joining the users forum for
>> Families at "www.telgen.co.uk/families/forum" where you can
>> voice your concern about needing a WiFi connection to Sync
>> your Legacy files w

Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy (Families) program for iPhone

[hwedhlor]

  Graham,

Not to worry, and no apology required.  I suspect there are
others on the LUG list who are interested in the exchange as
well. :-)

John


On 8/18/2010 2:51 AM, Graham wrote:
> Sorry, I'm going from bad to worse. That last post was supposed to go
> private.
>
> Appologies, Graham
>
>
>
>
> Legacy User Group guidelines:
>
> http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
>
> Archived messages after Nov. 21 2009:
>
> http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/
>
> Archived messages from old mail server - before Nov. 21 2009:
>
> http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergr...@legacyfamilytree.com/
>
> Online technical support: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp
>
> To unsubscribe: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
>
>
>
>



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Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy (Families) program for iPhone

[hwedhlor]

  Hi Graham,

Sorry that I didn't get back to you last night, but it was
rather late for me, and it had been a long day, so I retired
shortly after midnight, Arizona time.

Connecting your iPhone to your computer via the USB cable is
certainly possible, but performing a sync to the Families
app via that cable, using the Families Sync program on the
computer, is not possible because the software does not
allow for such a syncing method.  I have asked TelGen to
consider such an enhancement, but have no idea whether that
is a practical idea from their point of view.  In the
meantime they have added a note under the Description of
Families on the iTunes Store, advising that "Families
requires access to a WiFi network in order to transfer
family files between your device and your PC."

John


On 8/18/2010 2:06 AM, Graham wrote:
> Hello John,
> Thanks for taking the time. I will ask one question of you
> regarding WiFi. My iPhone is not able to connect to the
> Internet, but it can connect via USB to the computer...so
> why can't it transfer the file that way rather than WiFi?
> Thank you,
> Graham
>
> - Original Message -
> *From:* hwedhlor <mailto:hwedh...@cox.net>
> *To:* LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> <mailto:LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 18, 2010 4:56 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy (Families) program
> for iPhone
>
>   Hi Graham,
>
> Sorry to hear of your frustrations in obtaining the
> Families
> app, and getting it running.  Families is not a
> product of
> Millennium, nor is it associated with their Legacy Family
> Tree product other than it was designed to synchronize
> data
> with Legacy.  Families is a product of TelGen, and any
> difficulties you have in obtaining it should be
> addressed to
> them, or to Apple via the App Store if the problem is
> with
> purchasing the Families app. Unless you have "jailbroken"
> your iPhone there are no apps available from any source
> other than the iTunes App Store.
>
> Problems with using Families should be addressed
> directly to
> TelGen.  You might consider joining the users forum for
> Families at "www.telgen.co.uk/families/forum
> <http://www.telgen.co.uk/families/forum>" where you can
> voice your concern about needing a WiFi connection to
> Sync
> your Legacy files with the Families App.  If you go to
> that
> URL you will find the "User Forum" listed on the left
> side
> of the screen.  I have already posted a comment on that
> forum concerning the requirement for WiFi.
>
> In the meantime, perhaps there is a WiFi connection
> available in your neighborhood that you might use to
> transfer your files.
>
> I have the Families app, and have enjoyed using it.  I
> will
> be happy to help you in any way that I can, but
> suggest that
> you contact me directly via e-mail, rather than via
> the LUG
> list.
>
> JohnZ
> Mesa, AZ
>
> On 8/17/2010 9:46 PM, Graham wrote:
> > Hello all, and am I the only one having trouble with
> the Legacy
> > "Families" program?
> >
> > Maybe I've done it wrong, but I have just gone
> through many hours of
> > the most convoluted downloading procedure I have
> ever encounted.
> >
> > For starters, I received an email which stated "Use
> this coupon for
> > 10% off your entire order in the Legacy Family Tree
> Online store:
> > 10off". Underneath this it mentioned "Legacy for
> iPhones etc".
> >
> > That seemed like a good idea, I'll go buy it...but
> after much
> > searching I found out it is not at the store...it is
> at iTunes.
> >
> > That's where my trouble began, many hours of
> clicking, downloading,
> > and god knows what else, I finally ended up with the
> "Families"
> > program on my computer and on my iPhone. Now it
> wants me to wifi sync
> > or something, so as to put my Legacy file into
> 'Families' on my
> > iPhone. At the moment all I have in 'Families' is
> the Kennedy family.
> >
> > I don't have wifi...so does anybody know of another
> way to get Legacy
> > onto my iPhone using the USB?
> >
> > Hope this makes sense to someone, because I've just
> about lost all of
> > mine

Re: [LegacyUG] Legacy (Families) program for iPhone

[hwedhlor]

  Hi Graham,

Sorry to hear of your frustrations in obtaining the Families
app, and getting it running.  Families is not a product of
Millennium, nor is it associated with their Legacy Family
Tree product other than it was designed to synchronize data
with Legacy.  Families is a product of TelGen, and any
difficulties you have in obtaining it should be addressed to
them, or to Apple via the App Store if the problem is with
purchasing the Families app. Unless you have "jailbroken"
your iPhone there are no apps available from any source
other than the iTunes App Store.

Problems with using Families should be addressed directly to
TelGen.  You might consider joining the users forum for
Families at "www.telgen.co.uk/families/forum" where you can
voice your concern about needing a WiFi connection to Sync
your Legacy files with the Families App.  If you go to that
URL you will find the "User Forum" listed on the left side
of the screen.  I have already posted a comment on that
forum concerning the requirement for WiFi.

In the meantime, perhaps there is a WiFi connection
available in your neighborhood that you might use to
transfer your files.

I have the Families app, and have enjoyed using it.  I will
be happy to help you in any way that I can, but suggest that
you contact me directly via e-mail, rather than via the LUG
list.

JohnZ
Mesa, AZ

On 8/17/2010 9:46 PM, Graham wrote:
> Hello all, and am I the only one having trouble with the Legacy
> "Families" program?
>
> Maybe I've done it wrong, but I have just gone through many hours of
> the most convoluted downloading procedure I have ever encounted.
>
> For starters, I received an email which stated "Use this coupon for
> 10% off your entire order in the Legacy Family Tree Online store:
> 10off". Underneath this it mentioned "Legacy for iPhones etc".
>
> That seemed like a good idea, I'll go buy it...but after much
> searching I found out it is not at the store...it is at iTunes.
>
> That's where my trouble began, many hours of clicking, downloading,
> and god knows what else, I finally ended up with the "Families"
> program on my computer and on my iPhone. Now it wants me to wifi sync
> or something, so as to put my Legacy file into 'Families' on my
> iPhone. At the moment all I have in 'Families' is the Kennedy family.
>
> I don't have wifi...so does anybody know of another way to get Legacy
> onto my iPhone using the USB?
>
> Hope this makes sense to someone, because I've just about lost all of
> mine.
>
> Thanks, Graham
>
>
>
>
>
> Legacy User Group guidelines:
>
> http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
>
> Archived messages after Nov. 21 2009:
>
> http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/
>
> Archived messages from old mail server - before Nov. 21 2009:
>
> http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergr...@legacyfamilytree.com/
>
> Online technical support: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp
>
> To unsubscribe: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
>
>
>
>



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[LegacyUG] Families iPhone/iPad App for Legacy released yesterday

[hwedhlor]

Pardon this rather commercial-sounding message, but those of you who are
iPhone, or iPad users and are looking for an app that is compatible with
Legacy should have a look at TelGen Limited's "Families" app, which was
released late yesterday evening.  I participated in beta testing of
Families and can recommend it without reservation.

Families is capable of displaying great detail from your Legacy
databases, including Family View, Pedigree View, Index searchable by
Given Name, Surname or RIN, Events, To Do Lists, Master and Detail
Sources, Locations and Addresses with geolocation via Google Maps,
Alternate Names, Pictures, with the ability to add pictures from the
camera or photo album, Portrait and Landscape mode in all views, with
full screen support on the iPad.

Families will handle databases with over 300,000 records on the iPhone.
Data is completely editable, and syncs to, and from your PC using a free
Families Sync program downloadable from the vendor, TelGen.  I have
found Families to be a joy to use, and TelGen has been extremely
responsive to both questions and suggestions.

JohnZ
Mesa, Arizona



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Re: [LegacyUG] Source Names - standards

[hwedhlor]

I have been reading this thread with great interest, as a few years back
I was asked to create an automated CD of family history for a friend.
That work involved reviewing and processing several thousand photos
associated with surname lines with which I was only slightly familiar.
Each of the photos, as well as many documents, had to be scanned, named
and filed for use in both pdf documents and html code.  I found that
establishing both a standard folder structure, and a file-naming
standard, helped enormously in dealing with those images over the
three-year period in which I was involved in that effort.  Although I
eventually became intimately familiar with the photos and surname lines,
I realized that many of those who would view the results would be
totally unfamiliar with them.  It was clear to me that the folder
structure, and file-naming standards had to be as simple, and
self-explanatory as possible.  Though not perfect, the resulting
standards have stood me in good stead for several years now, and I am
currently writing an article on the experience of automating my friend's
family history, and the standards developed in support of that effort,
for publication in a genealogical periodical.

_FOLDER STRUCTURE_

The folder structure I settled on was very simple, and I use it to this
day in Legacy.  Only four folders were used; Pictures, Docs, Groups, and
Places. As Legacy already contained a Pictures folder it was enlisted as
the highest level folder, with the other three folders being created as
sub-folders to Pictures:

Legacy7
 Pictures
 Docs
 Groups
 Places

Pictures contained all photos that depicted one person.
Docs contained any image of a document.
Groups contained any image of two, or more people.
Places contained any image of a place, or thing.

Every image was filed in one of those four folders.  That kept the path
for each file reasonably short, and allowed me to move, or backup, the
entire folder structure easily. While I considered creating folders for
each surname, and even sub-folders for generations, or types of
documents, etc., it was apparent to me that using such a folder
structure would quickly expand the number of folders, require
differentiation between two (or more) unrelated, but identical surnames,
and make searches awkward for those not familiar with the various lines
and how they related to each other.  I felt, and still do feel, that the
issue of document types was better solved by inclusion of that
information within each file name.  After all I was documenting family
lines, not collections of census by year, or location.  Where multiple
families were contained on a given census document I found it easier to
simply duplicate that image, and to save each copy under the surname of
the family concerned.

_FILE NAMES

_Wherever possible file names began with the surname of the person
depicted, or for whom a document was created.  In the case of marriage
documents the surname of the male came first.  For census, or city
directories, the surname listed in the document came first.  Generally,
surnames were then followed by the (typically) two given names (or
whatever was known) of the individual.  For marriages the two surnames
were separated by "_&_". Dates were entered in the format _MMM_DD
because sorted file name lists would then automatically group years
together.

Abbreviations were used only when there could be no confusion as to
their meaning.  For example I spelled out "MARRIAGE" to avoid confusion
with the names.  As most of the locations were within the USA I decided
to use standard two-letter postal codes for US states, and to leave out
"USA", but to include abbreviated country names for other locations. My
primary purpose here was to avoid any confusion on the part of those
viewing a file name.  Although I could easily have created some
shorthand abbreviations for a number of things, doing so would have
meant that those not familiar with that shorthand might not understand
it when viewing the file names in future generations.

The greatest limitation is in the area of naming files of group photo.
In that area I try to name the file for the event depicted, which often
means using the principal surname of participants.  Individual name tags
are included in either captions, or by use of IPTC/XMP (International
Press Telecommunications Council/Extensible Metadata Platform) tagging.

The issue of upper/lower case file names was settled early on.  Because
I was dealing with large amounts of html code I found that naming images
in all uppercase made them stand out visually within that code.  Spaces
were normally replaced with underscores (_) because again that made
reading the file names less tedious visually.  Dashes were used where
year spans (e.g. 1892-1895, 40-YEAR) were part of a file name.
Parentheses were used to indicate a nickname.

Format:
SURNAME_GIVEN1_GIVEN2_IMAGE-OR-DOCTYPE__MMM_DD_CITY_ST_OTHER.FILETYPE

_INDIVIDUALS_

Exa

Re: [LegacyUG] Appropriate topics for the LUG

[hwedhlor]

Brian,

You are absolutely right about text based exchanges being easily
misunderstood.  That is why it is so important to read what is actually
written.  My reference to elitist forums was warning about what LUG
could become, not what I perceive it to be presently.  I said:

"It would be easy to turn the LUG into a forum inhabited solely by expert 
genealogists who were also expert computer users."

I then wrote:

"Such elitist forums abound, but they are typically hostile to newcomers, who 
are often timid by nature."

That sentence was clearly not pointing to LUG, but to forums that had
already gone down that unpleasant road.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 7/14/2010 10:56 AM, Brian L. Lightfoot wrote:
> Ummmis was a monitor of this group who posted the original message about 
> entering special characters.
>
> And while John Zimmerman's post and intent is all well and good, I'd like to 
> add that I can't recall ever seeing any post that smacked of elitism or "How 
> dare you ask the wizard...". I sincerely believe that all users on this group 
> are doing their best to add to the knowledge of all relating to how best to 
> use the Legacy program. The problem lies in the fact that this is a TEXT 
> based exchange and not a face-to-face exchange. A written message sometimes 
> loses the true intention of the writer or the reader of the message perceives 
> an attitude that was not intended by the writer. I think we all have to learn 
> to be a little more thick-skinned and not automatically read something into a 
> message that isn't really there. For example, when a few users posted that 
> they had no idea what a non-breaking space was, there were several replies 
> describing the special character and some posts pointing out that Wikipedia 
> was an easy place to find out all about it. I don't see that as elitism but 
> rather users helping other users get around a short-coming in the Legacy 
> program. There are many somewhat hidden aspects of the Legacy program that I 
> don't either use or have not yet discovered. When I read a message about any 
> one of those, I don't consider it elitism. I just consider myself getting 
> schooled. Just my 2 cents.
>
> Brian in CA




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Re: [LegacyUG] Appropriate topics for the LUG

[hwedhlor]

Gene,

One additional note concerning your admonition:

"If you search the archives you will see where the OFFICIAL list monitors
have stated that computer usage and training are NOT appropriate
subjects for this list.  Such discussions should be taken off list to an
appropriate forum."

You were so emphatic in your statement that, in an attempt to find some
official disapproval of discussion of either computer usage, or computer
training, I searched the archives for "computer usage" and "computer
training".  "Computer usage" returned 7 matches, and "Computer training"
returned 9 matches.  I viewed the messages through each thread
associated with those matches.  Only two messages contained were from a
Millennia representative.

In one case Brian of Support commented:

"I have fwd your message to our mail list administrator to have him
check that messages are being sent to your address."

In the other case Sherry of Support said:

"Ok - let's drop this before I have to call the list manager on you guys!"

That last was a clear reference to the rather heated tone of the
exchanges involved (one of which was your own), and Sherry's message
made no reference to Millennia disapproving of any discussion about
either computer usage or computer training.

I then searched on "computer" but that returned 547 matches.  Although I
viewed a few of them it was ridiculous to expect any user to review them
all with the intent of determining whether any line of discussion would
be permitted on the list.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ


On 7/14/2010 9:58 AM, Gene Young wrote:
> On 7/14/2010 12:38 PM, hwedhlor wrote:
>
>> Hi Ron,
>>
>> I have initiated a new thread to better describe the nature of this
>> discussion.
>>
>> Respectfully, whether you agree with my opinion is not at issue.  I did
>> not post the guidelines for the Legacy Users Group, Millennia did.  Once
>> again, those guidelines state:
>>
>> "The purpose of the LUG is to provide a forum for mutual help and the
>> friendly exchange of ideas related to the use of Legacy Family Tree and
>> its add-on programs, only."
>>
>> This forum is the Legacy User Group, not "the Legacy news list", and
>> certainly not the Legacy Genealogical Group.  A discussion of how to
>> enter special characters into a Legacy Family Tree record set by the
>> efficient use of the operating system, keyboard, and character mapping
>> charts (one chart of which is presented within Legacy itself), certainly
>> involves using Legacy, and is well within the posted guidelines.
>>
>> I dearly love the pursuit of family history, and have engaged in that
>> pursuit for well over 40 years, but if someone asked this forum how best
>> to use Legacy to track dog breeding, or successive builds of their
>> experimental aircraft, I would see no reason to protest their posting as
>> outside the LUG guidelines, as those guidelines do not state that this
>> forum is exclusively for postings concerning the use of Legacy to
>> document human genealogy.
>>
>> If the Ford Motor Company sponsored a Mustang Users Group, and the
>> guidelines for that group stated "The purpose of the MUG is to provide a
>> forum for mutual help and the friendly exchange of ideas related to the
>> use of the Mustang automobile only" I would not be surprised to find
>> messages there on how to drive a Mustang, including beginning driving so
>> long as it was driving a Mustang.
>>
>> It would be easy to turn the LUG into a forum inhabited solely by expert
>> genealogists who were also expert computer users.  Such elitist forums
>> abound, but they are typically hostile to newcomers, who are often timid
>> by nature.  Honest inquiries in such elitist forums are met with
>> invective that comes across as, "How dare you ask the Wizard such a
>> question?" effectively stifling the newcomers further participation in
>> those forums.
>>
>> That is not to say the LUG should suffer fools willingly.  Even
>> newcomers should be expected to help themselves by reading the manual
>> and help screens, but it's a big manual, and even the help screens have
>> some gaps.  I suggest that we be more charitable to those who are not so
>> knowledgeable as we are, and offer them a friendly helping hand, rather
>> than a slap on the wrist for being newcomers.
>>
>> John Zimmerman
>> Mesa, AZ
>>
> Respectfully,
>
> If you search the archives you will see where the OFFICIAL list monitors
> have stated that computer usage and training are NOT appropriate
> subjects for this list.  Such discu

Re: [LegacyUG] Appropriate topics for the LUG

[hwedhlor]

Gene,

Respectfully, if such discussions as entering special characters are not
appropriate to this list, then the list monitors should restate the
official guidelines, not expect users to search archives to find
exceptions to the posted guidelines.

Perhaps those monitors would care to chime in on that subject?

John Z

On 7/14/2010 9:58 AM, Gene Young wrote:
> On 7/14/2010 12:38 PM, hwedhlor wrote:
>
>> Hi Ron,
>>
>> I have initiated a new thread to better describe the nature of this
>> discussion.
>>
>> Respectfully, whether you agree with my opinion is not at issue.  I did
>> not post the guidelines for the Legacy Users Group, Millennia did.  Once
>> again, those guidelines state:
>>
>> "The purpose of the LUG is to provide a forum for mutual help and the
>> friendly exchange of ideas related to the use of Legacy Family Tree and
>> its add-on programs, only."
>>
>> This forum is the Legacy User Group, not "the Legacy news list", and
>> certainly not the Legacy Genealogical Group.  A discussion of how to
>> enter special characters into a Legacy Family Tree record set by the
>> efficient use of the operating system, keyboard, and character mapping
>> charts (one chart of which is presented within Legacy itself), certainly
>> involves using Legacy, and is well within the posted guidelines.
>>
>> I dearly love the pursuit of family history, and have engaged in that
>> pursuit for well over 40 years, but if someone asked this forum how best
>> to use Legacy to track dog breeding, or successive builds of their
>> experimental aircraft, I would see no reason to protest their posting as
>> outside the LUG guidelines, as those guidelines do not state that this
>> forum is exclusively for postings concerning the use of Legacy to
>> document human genealogy.
>>
>> If the Ford Motor Company sponsored a Mustang Users Group, and the
>> guidelines for that group stated "The purpose of the MUG is to provide a
>> forum for mutual help and the friendly exchange of ideas related to the
>> use of the Mustang automobile only" I would not be surprised to find
>> messages there on how to drive a Mustang, including beginning driving so
>> long as it was driving a Mustang.
>>
>> It would be easy to turn the LUG into a forum inhabited solely by expert
>> genealogists who were also expert computer users.  Such elitist forums
>> abound, but they are typically hostile to newcomers, who are often timid
>> by nature.  Honest inquiries in such elitist forums are met with
>> invective that comes across as, "How dare you ask the Wizard such a
>> question?" effectively stifling the newcomers further participation in
>> those forums.
>>
>> That is not to say the LUG should suffer fools willingly.  Even
>> newcomers should be expected to help themselves by reading the manual
>> and help screens, but it's a big manual, and even the help screens have
>> some gaps.  I suggest that we be more charitable to those who are not so
>> knowledgeable as we are, and offer them a friendly helping hand, rather
>> than a slap on the wrist for being newcomers.
>>
>> John Zimmerman
>> Mesa, AZ
>>
> Respectfully,
>
> If you search the archives you will see where the OFFICIAL list monitors
> have stated that computer usage and training are NOT appropriate
> subjects for this list.  Such discussions should be taken off list to an
> appropriate forum.
>
>
>



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   http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/

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[LegacyUG] Appropriate topics for the LUG

[hwedhlor]

Hi Ron,

I have initiated a new thread to better describe the nature of this
discussion.

Respectfully, whether you agree with my opinion is not at issue.  I did
not post the guidelines for the Legacy Users Group, Millennia did.  Once
again, those guidelines state:

"The purpose of the LUG is to provide a forum for mutual help and the
friendly exchange of ideas related to the use of Legacy Family Tree and
its add-on programs, only."

This forum is the Legacy User Group, not "the Legacy news list", and
certainly not the Legacy Genealogical Group.  A discussion of how to
enter special characters into a Legacy Family Tree record set by the
efficient use of the operating system, keyboard, and character mapping
charts (one chart of which is presented within Legacy itself), certainly
involves using Legacy, and is well within the posted guidelines.

I dearly love the pursuit of family history, and have engaged in that
pursuit for well over 40 years, but if someone asked this forum how best
to use Legacy to track dog breeding, or successive builds of their
experimental aircraft, I would see no reason to protest their posting as
outside the LUG guidelines, as those guidelines do not state that this
forum is exclusively for postings concerning the use of Legacy to
document human genealogy.

If the Ford Motor Company sponsored a Mustang Users Group, and the
guidelines for that group stated "The purpose of the MUG is to provide a
forum for mutual help and the friendly exchange of ideas related to the
use of the Mustang automobile only" I would not be surprised to find
messages there on how to drive a Mustang, including beginning driving so
long as it was driving a Mustang.

It would be easy to turn the LUG into a forum inhabited solely by expert
genealogists who were also expert computer users.  Such elitist forums
abound, but they are typically hostile to newcomers, who are often timid
by nature.  Honest inquiries in such elitist forums are met with
invective that comes across as, "How dare you ask the Wizard such a
question?" effectively stifling the newcomers further participation in
those forums.

That is not to say the LUG should suffer fools willingly.  Even
newcomers should be expected to help themselves by reading the manual
and help screens, but it's a big manual, and even the help screens have
some gaps.  I suggest that we be more charitable to those who are not so
knowledgeable as we are, and offer them a friendly helping hand, rather
than a slap on the wrist for being newcomers.

John Zimmerman
Mesa, AZ



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   http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp

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   http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/

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Re: [LegacyUG] RE: Problem with fixed report narrative

[hwedhlor]

Hi Jenny,

My apologies to the list moderator, but the written purpose of the LUG
does not state that we will only discuss the "use of Legacy in relation
to our genealogy/family history researches," but rather it states, "The
purpose of the LUG is to provide a forum for mutual help and the
friendly exchange of ideas related to the use of Legacy Family Tree and
its add-on programs, only."  Without further guidance than that it seems
to me that "ideas related to the use of Legacy Family Tree" must include
some aspects of computer knowledge, since Legacy is a computer program.

I've worked with computers since 1965 as an end-user, programmer,
builder, 2nd level support technician, systems engineer, and various
levels of management for everything from mainframes on down.  One of the
primary truths I have gleaned in those years is that there is plenty
that I don't know, and I'm an avid enthusiast! ;^)

Making Legacy work well involves a fairly complex base of knowledge,
part of which includes how to interface with our computers.  We all
travel different roads in using both Legacy Family Tree and our
hardware.  Exchanging our hard-won expertise is the very essence of the
reason this list exists, and I very much appreciate the contributions of
others in both area.  If learning things I don't know means I must
occasionally read things that I do, then so be it.  I gladly pay that price.

Respectfully, and with friendly intent,

John Z


On 7/13/2010 1:58 AM, Jenny M Benson wrote:
> CE Wood wrote
>
>> I reiterate, it is quite presumptuous to expect all users of Legacy to
>> be computer-savvy.  Actually, I thought Legacy was trying to appeal to
>> the masses, not just those well versed in computer terminology.
>>
> Legacy is a computer program.  Not surprisingly, therefore, you have to
> be able to operate a computer in order to use it.  People who find they
> are not "computer-savvy" enough to get the most out of Legacy should
> take appropriate steps to become more computer-savvy. (Which will no
> doubt benefit them in the use of many other applications.)  Legacy is
> all about genealogy and family history and this mailing list is to help
> the users make the best use of Legacy in relation to their
> genealogy/family history researches, not about teaching Computing.
>



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Re: [LegacyUG] RE: Problem with fixed report narrative

[hwedhlor]

Excellent points Brian.  Additionally, if a Legacy user places more than
one blank special character on the ribbon, then they have no way of
knowing which blank on the ribbon is which.

John Z

On 7/12/2010 10:49 PM, Brian L. Lightfoot wrote:
> Yes, the keystroke description is there in Legacy's rudimentary special 
> character window but it lacks any specific description of which character you 
> are selecting. As someone else pointed out, there are several "blank" 
> characters from which to choose; how do you know/remember that the 
> non-breaking space is the one with the 0160 keystroke code? And my whole idea 
> of using the Windows Character Map was that in order to find a needed 
> non-breaking space, the user need not remember the codes. Using your 
> suggestion of Legacy's character map, only one of the blank characters 
> confirms the ALT+0160 keystroke description. But if you already knew those 
> numbers, why would you need to use Legacy's character map in the first place; 
> you'd just type in the code. Plus the Windows character map lets you visit 
> the whole range of international characters and special symbols not found in 
> the Legacy map.
>
> And for those that are just beginning to figure out what a "non-breaking 
> space" is, it is nothing more than a special character that looks identical 
> to a regular space except it means "keep the word to the left and the word to 
> the right together".
>
> But as other users have posted, why should a non-computer-savvy person have 
> to learn all this and they are right in asserting that they shouldn't 
> have to. As I previously posted, this is a just a work-around for an existing 
> bug in Legacy. Normally you aren't expected to know this kind of stuff in 
> order to use Legacy. Discovering these little bugs is all part of the 
> refinement process of any software application. They may fix this problem in 
> the next release; then again it may be put on the back burner with the long 
> awaited Source Conversion Tool. In the meanwhile, you can use this technique 
> to keep your reports looking proper.
>
> Brian in CA
> -
> (original HTML post converted to plain text)
>
>
>
> From: david [mailto:da...@marys.co.nz]
> Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 9:10 PM
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] RE: Problem with fixed report narrative
>
>
> Keystroke description (Alt+0160) -  bottom right, same window.
>
>   Dave (NZ).
>
>
>
>
> 
> From: Wm Voss
> Sent: Tue 13/07/2010 16:01
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] RE: Problem with fixed report narrative
> Exactly -- but which is it? 127, 129, 141, 143, 144, 157, or 160? There
> is no mouse-over, there is no keystroke description. Even the MS map,
> considered a very base level tool, provides that information. You can't
> even click a character and have it added to your text, only to the
> pointless ribbon, so you are constantly having to redo selections.
>
> And I don't want to think how long we will have to wait for
> comprehension of OTF.
>
> Wm Voss
> On 12-Jul-10 7:41 PM, david wrote:
>
>> The "rudimentary" character map already contains it.  Fifth row down,
>> far left.
>>   Dave (NZ).
>>
>> 
>> *From:* Wm Voss
>> *Sent:* Tue 13/07/2010 13:35
>> *To:* LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [LegacyUG] RE: Problem with fixed report narrative
>>
>> Or Legacy could do a small courtesy to its users and improve the
>> rudimentary character map build into every note and event screen. Its
>> only been on the desire list for a decade or so.
>>
>>
>
>
>
> Legacy User Group guidelines:
>
> http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
>
> Archived messages after Nov. 21 2009:
>
> http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/
>
> Archived messages from old mail server - before Nov. 21 2009:
>
> http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergr...@legacyfamilytree.com/
>
> Online technical support: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp
>
> To unsubscribe: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
>
>
>
>
>



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Re: [LegacyUG] RE: Problem with fixed report narrative

[hwedhlor]

Amen!!

John Z

On 7/12/2010 8:03 PM, CE Wood wrote:
> Nice.
>
> But it would be infinitely more helpful if there was some way to know what 
> Alt+0160 does!  And, even knowing that it is a non-breaking space is no help 
> UNLESS you know why in the heck you would ever want to use it.
>
> Another case of people in the field not knowing how to explain things to 
> those trying to understand.  Computer manuals are the epitome of this 
> oblivion; medical terminology is a close second.  Having taught people in 
> both fields, I know how easy it is to not realize that the others haven't a 
> clue what you are talking about.
>
>
> CE
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: John S. Adams [mailto:oldbr...@hotmail.com]
> Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 7:39 PM
> To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] RE: Problem with fixed report narrative
>
> Actually Legacy does allow you to add the No Break space to the Special
> Characters Ribbon.  Click the small blue square at the top of the ribbon and
> the Character Map will appear.  The first character on the first line is the
> normal space.  The first character on the 5th line is the "No
> Break Space (ALT+0160)."  Double click on that and it will be added to the
> ribbon.  See Help for more detailed instructions.
>
> John S. Adams
> Hermosa Beach, CA
> --
> From: "Wm Voss"
> Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 6:35 PM
> To:
> Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] RE: Problem with fixed report narrative
>
>
>> Or Legacy could do a small courtesy to its users and improve the
>> rudimentary character map build into every note and event screen. Its
>> only been on the desire list for a decade or so.
>>
>> Wm Voss
>>
>> On 12-Jul-10 6:18 PM, Brian L. Lightfoot wrote:
>>
>>> While many of you are thinking "how the heck am I supposed to remember
>>> ALT+0160" every time or anytime I need to generate a non-breaking space
>>> in Legacy, relax. Windows offers an alternate method where you need not
>>> remember a bunch of mumbo-jumbo codes. All you have to do is remember
>>> "Character Map". It's a small little program that comes with Windows. It
>>> probably sits in your Start Menu buried away under Accessories but you
>>> can always get to it by just clicking on START, then RUN, and then type
>>> in CHARMAP.
>>>
>>> A small window will pop up usually showing the first Font set (probably
>>> Arial, most are similar in their structure). Look closely and you'll see
>>> it starts out with a few special characters, then the numbers, then
>>> Uppercase letters, followed by Lowercase letters, and then a few more
>>> special characters. Just 4 characters after the lowercase Z and in the
>>> middle of those special characters you'll see a blank box. Hover your
>>> mouse over it and it will say "Non-breaking space". If you click on that
>>> character, the little box will expand (in this case it's still empty.)
>>> However, look on the lower right of the window and it gives you the
>>> keystrokes necessary to manually enter a non-breaking space: ALT + 0160.
>>>
>>> Still having problems remembering the codes or problems typing them in?
>>> Just click on whatever character you want to enter, click on SELECT,
>>> click on COPY and then switch back over to whatever application you
>>> needed the character (i.e., Legacy), put the cursor wherever you want the
>>> character, and then PASTE it (CTRL-V).
>>>
>>> While you're playing around with CHARMAP, notice that all those foreign
>>> characters are right there also. Click on whichever you need and type the
>>> necessary keystrokes or use the copy/paste method.
>>>
>>> Brian in CA
>>> (normally I'd say this would be off-topic but since it provides a
>>> work-around to a shortcoming/bug in Legacy, maybe somebody will find it
>>> useful.)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
 -Original Message-
 From: Sherry/Support [mailto:she...@legacyfamilytree.com]
 Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 3:22 PM
 To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyUsers.com
 Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] RE: Problem with fixed report narrative

 As quoted by Ken

 "Hold down the Alt key while entering 0160 using the numeric keypad.
 A space will show up between the two words and the reports will print
 out correctly."

 Sincerely,
 Sherry
 Technical Support
 Legacy Family Tree



 On Mon, Jul 12, 2010 at 3:20 PM, CE Wood   wrote:


> hold down the Alt key while entering
> 0160 using the numeric keypad.  A space will show up between the two
>
>
 words and the reports


> will print out correctly.
>
>

>>>
>>>
>>> Legacy User Group guidelines:
>>>
>>>  http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
>>>
>>> Archived messages after Nov. 21 2009:
>>>
>>>  http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/
>>>
>>> Archived messages from old mail server - before Nov. 21 2009:
>>>
>>>  http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergr.