Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 08:06:52 -0400 From: Gennadiy Tsygan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Deleting cookies or temp files will not give you Blue screen. The worst effect of loosing cookies will be that web sites remembering you login and preferences will forget them until you login manually next time. I had the Blue screen because Windows page file was damaged by hibernation. Deleting cookies will not save any significant amount of space anyway. - Original Message - From: Renita Herrmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Libretto [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, April 26, 2002 1:56 AM Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2002 22:55:28 -0700 From: Renita Herrmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 I just have to say, I stomped 6 dozen cookies and no bsod. No chocolate chips, they all had to go. Really, though, no problems. I went back and counted them (still in the recycle bin, I'm am superstitious! That was 3 weeks ago. R - Original Message - From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Libretto [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2002 2:41 PM Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 21:40:06 + From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 22:30:39 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 The critical thing being though (I suspect) that you were stomping them when the system was running, rather than pausing it mid-operation, stomping them, and completing the operation. Enquiring minds want to know... You're dead right. I'm not thinking there could never be a glitch - just that my hunch is it would never be terminal, and that as it would be restricted to IE, cookies, history, and other temporary Internet files, nothing would be lost that's of any value to me. I think you may be thinking optimistically - if you build a separate partition, there must be a file system data structure - the FAT - and if you stomp that, then you *will* get a bsod, if not then, then next time the files are accessed. _ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest ** ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest ** ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 13:38:44 + From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 08:06:52 -0400 From: Gennadiy Tsygan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Deleting cookies or temp files will not give you Blue screen. The worst effect of loosing cookies will be that web sites remembering you login and preferences will forget them until you login manually next time. I had the Blue screen because Windows page file was damaged by hibernation. Deleting cookies will not save any significant amount of space anyway. My point is not that the cookies and temp files are required, but that you'll get a blue screen if you destroy the files system on which they are stored. If the FAT points to something that isn't there, it will read garbage back to the program - if it can parse it at all, it won't be happy with what it parses. If it can't it will probably crash - people don't seem to test things by throwing random numbers at them anymore :) If the fat is damaged, then it will in all likelyhood bluescreen when the file access occurs as the pointers will be all over the place. _ Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Sat, 27 Apr 2002 00:38:09 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Deleting cookies will not save any significant amount of space anyway. The suggestion was not just cookies, it was cookies + history + temporary Internet files ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Sat, 27 Apr 2002 00:38:03 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 My point is not that the cookies and temp files are required, but that you'll get a blue screen if you destroy the files system on which they are stored. If the FAT points to something that isn't there, it will read garbage back to the program - if it can parse it at all, it won't be happy with what it parses. If it can't it will probably crash - people don't seem to test things by throwing random numbers at them anymore :) If the fat is damaged, then it will in all likelyhood bluescreen when the file access occurs as the pointers will be all over the place. Is the FAT info always at the beginning of the partition? (ie, if the emergency harware-hibernate space fell in the *middle* of a cookies-history-temporary Internet files partition...) ? ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 18:06:51 + From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Date: Sat, 27 Apr 2002 00:38:03 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Is the FAT info always at the beginning of the partition? (ie, if the emergency harware-hibernate space fell in the *middle* of a cookies-history-temporary Internet files partition...) ? I believe so - still gonna complain if you trash a file though... _ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 19:57:19 + From: Matthew Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 From: Gennadiy Tsygan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Deleting cookies or temp files will not give you Blue screen. The worst effect of loosing cookies will be that web sites remembering you login and preferences will forget them until you login manually next time. I had the Blue screen because Windows page file was damaged by hibernation. Deleting cookies will not save any significant amount of space anyway. From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] The critical thing being though (I suspect) that you were stomping them when the system was running, rather than pausing it mid-operation, stomping them, and completing the operation. Neil, I'm not quite sure what you mean when you say, ..stomping them when the system was running, rather than pausing it mid-operation... I've deleted cookies many many times during a Windows session by just clicking in the Windows Explorer frame with the list of cookies, doing a CTRL-A to select-all, and SHIFT-DEL to delete permanently. But what do you mean by. ..rather than pausing it mid-operation...? You obviously have something nefarious up your sleeve in Gatesian terms. Just what are you intending to pause mid-operation? Matt (I'll probably find you've already addressed this by the time I get through all of today's many posts!) _ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 20:02:39 + From: Matthew Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] If the fat is damaged, then it will in all likelyhood bluescreen when the file access occurs as the pointers will be all over the place. And what did you have in mind to do that would cause this to happen? M. _ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 22:38:45 + From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 20:02:39 + From: Matthew Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] If the fat is damaged, then it will in all likelyhood bluescreen when the file access occurs as the pointers will be all over the place. And what did you have in mind to do that would cause this to happen? Oh, just chewin' the fat... I'm not doing anything, but it's been proposed to put a temp filesystem into the hibernation area. _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 22:42:34 + From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 19:57:19 + From: Matthew Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 From: Gennadiy Tsygan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Deleting cookies or temp files will not give you Blue screen. The worst effect of loosing cookies will be that web sites remembering you login and preferences will forget them until you login manually next time. I had the Blue screen because Windows page file was damaged by hibernation. Deleting cookies will not save any significant amount of space anyway. From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] The critical thing being though (I suspect) that you were stomping them when the system was running, rather than pausing it mid-operation, stomping them, and completing the operation. Neil, I'm not quite sure what you mean when you say, ..stomping them when the system was running, rather than pausing it mid-operation... I've deleted cookies many many times during a Windows session by just clicking in the Windows Explorer frame with the list of cookies, doing a CTRL-A to select-all, and SHIFT-DEL to delete permanently. But what do you mean by. ..rather than pausing it mid-operation...? You obviously have something nefarious up your sleeve in Gatesian terms. Just what are you intending to pause mid-operation? Matt See the earlier reply - the proposal is to share a filesystem with cookies and temp files on it and the hibernation partition. file system accesses should be atomic (i.e. they start, complete, and stop and nothing happens to the structure of the filesystem while they do it) but the hibernation can interrupt the process between (say) a read and a write, or between a write and a FAT update. Or, the data that the FAT points to *after* the hibernation is not the same as was there before. This is generally a Bad Thing[tm] _ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Sat, 27 Apr 2002 10:13:44 +0800 From: Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 At 06:41 AM 26/04/2002 -0700, you wrote: Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 13:38:44 + From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 08:06:52 -0400 From: Gennadiy Tsygan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Deleting cookies or temp files will not give you Blue screen. The worst effect of loosing cookies will be that web sites remembering you login and preferences will forget them until you login manually next time. I had the Blue screen because Windows page file was damaged by hibernation. Deleting cookies will not save any significant amount of space anyway. My point is not that the cookies and temp files are required, but that you'll get a blue screen if you destroy the files system on which they are stored. If the FAT points to something that isn't there, it will read garbage back to the program - if it can parse it at all, it won't be happy with what it parses. If it can't it will probably crash - people don't seem to test things by throwing random numbers at them anymore :) If the fat is damaged, then it will in all likelyhood bluescreen when the file access occurs as the pointers will be all over the place. Actually, I don't think this is a valid point because as long as the first few meg of the disk isn't affected, the FAT will be intact. Its just that some things that it points at will be stuffed. This actually caused me a few problems working with a Compaq machine once ... I deleted the existing (whole disk) partition, re-created it a few meg up (in preparation to add the diagnostics partition at the beginning of the disk) but things stuffed up ... ran a disk diagnostics tool and it picked up the OLD copy of the FAT (because I hadn't erased the beginning of the disk yet) ... *sigh* file systems do weird things don't they? - Raymond P.S. I'm running a bit behind on the list, apologies if I'm answering questions that have already been answered! --- /~\ | | Does fuzzy logic tickle?| | ___ | My HDD has no reverse. How do I backup? | | /__/ +---| | / \ a y b o t | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | | HTTP://www.raybot.net| | ICQ: 31756092 | Need help? Visit #Windows98 on DALNet! | \~/ ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Sat, 27 Apr 2002 10:10:55 +0800 From: Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 At 05:11 AM 26/04/2002 -0700, you wrote: Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 08:06:52 -0400 From: Gennadiy Tsygan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Deleting cookies or temp files will not give you Blue screen. The worst effect of loosing cookies will be that web sites remembering you login and preferences will forget them until you login manually next time. I had the Blue screen because Windows page file was damaged by hibernation. Deleting cookies will not save any significant amount of space anyway. I don't think the problem is deleting the cookies or temp files. That in itself isn't a problem because Windows will just recreate them as necessary or whatnot. The danger is if they're corrupted. Windows sees the file there, it sees that the header is intact (which is quite possible) so it might just assume the file is fine ... then it hits the corruption. Written properly, it should just junk the file and start again however you don't know what might happen ... especially if the file is mainly text (such as a cookie) and gets partially overwritten with text (quite possible if you've got a lot of text in RAM). Its a bit like the good ol' C programmer's nightmare ... you've got a pointer which is wrong but you don't know it and it gives you the right answer most of the time because it just so happens to point to stuff that looks awful similar to what it was supposed to point to so your program doesn't actually realize anything is wrong until you have to demonstrate it to your boss ... - Raymond P.S. I'm running a bit behind on the list, apologies if I'm answering questions that have already been answered! --- /~\ | | Does fuzzy logic tickle?| | ___ | My HDD has no reverse. How do I backup? | | /__/ +---| | / \ a y b o t | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | | HTTP://www.raybot.net| | ICQ: 31756092 | Need help? Visit #Windows98 on DALNet! | \~/ ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Sat, 27 Apr 2002 10:36:42 +0800 From: Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 At 01:01 PM 26/04/2002 -0700, you wrote: Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 19:57:19 + From: Matthew Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 From: Gennadiy Tsygan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Deleting cookies or temp files will not give you Blue screen. The worst effect of loosing cookies will be that web sites remembering you login and preferences will forget them until you login manually next time. I had the Blue screen because Windows page file was damaged by hibernation. Deleting cookies will not save any significant amount of space anyway. From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] The critical thing being though (I suspect) that you were stomping them when the system was running, rather than pausing it mid-operation, stomping them, and completing the operation. Neil, I'm not quite sure what you mean when you say, ..stomping them when the system was running, rather than pausing it mid-operation... I've deleted cookies many many times during a Windows session by just clicking in the Windows Explorer frame with the list of cookies, doing a CTRL-A to select-all, and SHIFT-DEL to delete permanently. But what do you mean by. ..rather than pausing it mid-operation...? You obviously have something nefarious up your sleeve in Gatesian terms. Just what are you intending to pause mid-operation? Like you say, Neil has probably answered this but I might as well add my bit ... when its partway through writing something, it expects what it just wrote to still be there when it gets back to writing it after a hibernation. If it isn't then once it finishes it goes back to check or analyze something, it finds what it wrote to be missing and it freaks. Now being the well written software that it is, Internet Explorer is likely to start swearing at you before stomping its feet and walking out, knocking the whole setup over as it goes. - Raymond P.S. I'm running a bit behind on the list, apologies if I'm answering questions that have already been answered! --- /~\ | | Does fuzzy logic tickle?| | ___ | My HDD has no reverse. How do I backup? | | /__/ +---| | / \ a y b o t | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | | HTTP://www.raybot.net| | ICQ: 31756092 | Need help? Visit #Windows98 on DALNet! | \~/ ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2002 23:58:50 -0400 From: Gennadiy Tsygan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 I need to stress that my experiences are based solely on my L110 running WinXP. With XP and Win2000 hibernation is controlled by the OS, so hardware hibernation is a rare, emergency occasion. That's why an occasional blue screen is acceptable. The risk of ruining filesystem exists, but it didn't happen in my test on NTFS. System bluescreened , I rebooted and everything worked fine. Cookies and temp files just don't take enough room to count for useable savings. Of course, you can assign 80 MB temp files, but it will be a waste itself. I found that even 5MB is adequate. To fill out the hibernation space I will use a swapfile or some files I don't mind loosing, like copies of MP3's from my home PC. With MP3 files no blue screen should happen. This is how my partitions look like. -8.3GB C:\--140MB E:\3.5GB D:\-- My point is not that the cookies and temp files are required, but that you'll get a blue screen if you destroy the files system on which they are stored. If the FAT points to something that isn't there, it will read garbage back to the program - if it can parse it at all, it won't be happy with what it parses. If it can't it will probably crash - people don't seem to test things by throwing random numbers at them anymore :) If the fat is damaged, then it will in all likelyhood bluescreen when the file access occurs as the pointers will be all over the place. ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 13:20:59 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 May be the best way to approch partitioning with minimal waste of the useable space will be to make the hibernation space sized to safe 150 MB, create partition and put Windows pagefile on it (Optimal pagefile size = 2.5xRAM). I can't remember exactly, but I don't think that loss of the pagefile will cause damage to the OS. What is your opinion? If you hibernate, the OS gets stopped short. When it comes back, it will try and carry on where it left off, and will expect the swap files to be where it left them. Only you'll have just trashed them with the hibernate data... Blue screen of death seems a likely next option... I was about to (attempt to) say exactly the same thing. I wondered about using it for IE's Cookie/History/Temporary Internet files. ? ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 08:40:10 + From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 13:20:59 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 and carry on where it left off, and will expect the swap files to be where it left them. Only you'll have just trashed them with the hibernate data... Blue screen of death seems a likely next option... I was about to (attempt to) say exactly the same thing. I wondered about using it for IE's Cookie/History/Temporary Internet files. ? Though it would be nice to trash those cookies as a rule, I suspect that stomping on files that are in use either side of the hibernation event, no matter how useless they are, is probably going to cause hiccups. Might be a nice experiment for someone who uses IE? Neil _ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 19:50:35 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Though it would be nice to trash those cookies as a rule, I suspect that stomping on files that are in use either side of the hibernation event, no matter how useless they are, is probably going to cause hiccups. Might be a nice experiment for someone who uses IE? Before I got my 30GB HDD, and when my 4.3GB was fit to burst, I did a lot of Cookie/History/Temporary Internet file stomping; although it may not have been the most scientific of appraisals, it left me with a relatively confident hunch that they are unequivocally stompable (ie in a way that I know page/swap files are not). As far as I could tell, it's all stuff that IE looks for and, if it's been zapped, recreates a default setup. ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 14:49:09 + From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 19:50:35 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Though it would be nice to trash those cookies as a rule, I suspect that stomping on files that are in use either side of the hibernation event, no matter how useless they are, is probably going to cause hiccups. Might be a nice experiment for someone who uses IE? Before I got my 30GB HDD, and when my 4.3GB was fit to burst, I did a lot of Cookie/History/Temporary Internet file stomping; although it may not have been the most scientific of appraisals, it left me with a relatively confident hunch that they are unequivocally stompable (ie in a way that I know page/swap files are not). As far as I could tell, it's all stuff that IE looks for and, if it's been zapped, recreates a default setup. The critical thing being though (I suspect) that you were stomping them when the system was running, rather than pausing it mid-operation, stomping them, and completing the operation. Enquiring minds want to know... Neil _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 21:40:06 + From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 22:30:39 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 The critical thing being though (I suspect) that you were stomping them when the system was running, rather than pausing it mid-operation, stomping them, and completing the operation. Enquiring minds want to know... You're dead right. I'm not thinking there could never be a glitch - just that my hunch is it would never be terminal, and that as it would be restricted to IE, cookies, history, and other temporary Internet files, nothing would be lost that's of any value to me. I think you may be thinking optimistically - if you build a separate partition, there must be a file system data structure - the FAT - and if you stomp that, then you *will* get a bsod, if not then, then next time the files are accessed. _ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2002 06:12:15 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 I think you may be thinking optimistically - if you build a separate partition, there must be a file system data structure - the FAT - and if you stomp that, then you *will* get a bsod, if not then, then next time the files are accessed. Agreed - so yes, the worst case scenario could be worse than I described. So, my revised hunch / further speculation... ;-) Everything on that partition is expendable - what would the worst case now be? That the partition needs formatting? I also suspect that might actually never happen - if the FAT is right at the beginning, and the hibernation data is written (starting) from the end of the partition, backwards - and the space you have to reserve (78MB) is several MB bigger than the amount of data actually written... ? ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 06:45:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Kevin McClelland [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 On Sun, 21 April 2002, Gennadiy Tsygan wrote Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2002 23:08:48 -0400 From: Gennadiy Tsygan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 I guess that Windows overrides the BIOS because selection has no effect while in Windows. I checked the power button before OS was loaded and it worked as you said. Still have no idea why hardwarehibernation doesn't work under Windows. I used a L100 before, it had WinXP loaded on a second partition. Once it went into hibernation and killed the XP completely. Bu my current L110 just doesn't hibernate. How hibernate works will also depend on your OS. Win9x uses BIOS hibernation to the hidden hibernation partition, while Win2K creates a file to hibernate, and ignores the BIOS. I think Win2K will only hibernate using BIOS when battery power is exhausted. The last time I installed Win9x on my L100, it took some time to get hibernation to even show up under power save settings. Had to make sure I had the correct power save drivers from Toshiba. - Get your free @Elvis e-mail account at Elvis.com! http://www.elvis.com ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 21:24:45 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 I think Win2K will only hibernate using BIOS when battery power is exhausted. As I understand it, Win'2K *cannot* do a BIOS hibernate. Also, Win'2K cannot intercept the hardware hibernate - no OS can. So, your Libretto gets too hot and does a thermal shutdown - there are no options for this, you can't configure it to do something else instead, and you can't disable it. It just hibernates where the BIOS thinks the end of the HDD is, even if that is actually in the middle of your drive, and no matter if that space is reserved for the hibernation dump or filled with your precious data. ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 23:05:57 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Yes, I understand the hibernation idea. I just found it strange that 100 hibernated when battery died (and screwed my OS in process), while 110 simply shuts down. Sounds like on the 100, both Win'2K(?) Alarm settings were disabled, plus the OS was using the space that the BIOS regards as the hibernation zone? On the later system, are you saying it won't attempt to hibernate, or that it tries to hibernate but does not succeed? BTW for me, the easiest way to do a BIOS hibernate (for hibernation space testing purposes, etc) is to boot from a floppy to a DOS prompt, then switch off with the power button in the lid. ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 01:51:58 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 I powered L110 off during the OS selection menu and it hibernated OK. Looks like I am safe, but to be sure I think, I will have to fill up both partitions, hibernate, and run scandisk. No! - Scandisk will only report problems if file system data is overwritten. What I suggest is:- Create first partition from DOS boot disk, and select size one step below the maximum available (so approx 8GB, less 7 MB). Install Win'2K. Create 7MB buffer partition (7MB FAT is smallest partition possible). Create 78MB partition (71MB proved too small on my L110/64MB RAM) Create another 7MB buffer partition Completely fill the 7MB and 78MB partitions with .JPG files. Power down; boot from floppy; hibernate. Re-boot to Win'2K. View the .JPG files (thumbnails in Windows Explorer). The .JPGs in the 78MB partition should be trashed. The .JPGs in the 7MB partitions should be OK. I still have doubts about the crash of the old L100. I had the largest possible first partition with Win98 and second partition with XP. After hibernation XP was dead. How big was the space you left between the partitions? But shouldn't the hibernation data be written in the end of the first partition, not in the beginning of the second one? I think the hibernation data is written from the end of the disk backwards, towards the beginning - so it's the same starting point for the write no matter how much memeory you have installed, and a different amount of space is reserved depending on how much memory you have installed. So yes, if it overwrites something, most likely is the beginning of the following partition. Or may be my first partition was a little smaller and second one started a little earlier? Check for evidence in the 7GB buffer partitions. ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 19:22:29 + From: Matthew Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 On Sun, 21 April 2002, Gennadiy Tsygan wrote Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2002 23:08:48 -0400 From: Gennadiy Tsygan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 I guess that Windows overrides the BIOS because selection has no effect while in Windows. I checked the power button before OS was loaded and it worked as you said. Still have no idea why hardwarehibernation doesn't work under Windows. I used a L100 before, it had WinXP loaded on a second partition. Once it went into hibernation and killed the XP completely. Bu my current L110 just doesn't hibernate. The fact that hibernation killed XP could possibly have been due to the L110's BIOS forcing hibernation on a HDD bigger than 8GB with drive overlay software set up to access the 8GB area. If you don't create a small 40MB-80MB hibernation partition at the 8GB boundry, the L110 BIOS will write over any data there that's there. If the L110 BIOS has some reason like loosing battery power, it can override settings in W2000 (am not sure about XP) to write hibernation at the end of the HDD, and will write it to the 8GB where it thinks the HDD space ends. Matt _ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 20:41:04 -0400 From: Gennadiy Tsygan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 May be the best way to approch partitioning with minimal waste of the useable space will be to make the hibernation space sized to safe 150 MB, create partition and put Windows pagefile on it (Optimal pagefile size = 2.5xRAM). I can't remember exactly, but I don't think that loss of the pagefile will cause damage to the OS. What is your opinion? ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 06:06:56 + From: neil barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 20:41:04 -0400 From: Gennadiy Tsygan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 May be the best way to approch partitioning with minimal waste of the useable space will be to make the hibernation space sized to safe 150 MB, create partition and put Windows pagefile on it (Optimal pagefile size = 2.5xRAM). I can't remember exactly, but I don't think that loss of the pagefile will cause damage to the OS. What is your opinion? If you hibernate, the OS gets stopped short. When it comes back, it will try and carry on where it left off, and will expect the swap files to be where it left them. Only you'll have just trashed them with the hibernate data... Blue screen of death seems a likely next option... Neil (I haven't tried this, but it seems likely) _ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110
Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2002 23:08:48 -0400 From: Gennadiy Tsygan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LIB] Hardware hibernation in L110 I guess that Windows overrides the BIOS because selection has no effect while in Windows. I checked the power button before OS was loaded and it worked as you said. Still have no idea why hardwarehibernation doesn't work under Windows. I used a L100 before, it had WinXP loaded on a second partition. Once it went into hibernation and killed the XP completely. Bu my current L110 just doesn't hibernate. I want to check if I partitioned my 12GB HD correctly and trying to invoke Libretto's hibernation by disabling Windows service and using discharged battery. I tried all power-up modes in BIOS (boot, hibernate, resume), but laptop simply shuts off when battery is depleted. It hibernated only when battery died while I was in BIOS. What is the way to control the hibernation? And what those power-up modes mean? Thanks Boot Starts the way a normal computer would. hibernate: Records all it needs to know to the Harddisk. You should get a nice image as it reads what it needs from the HD, or writes to it. resume: Power down all subsystem, but keep memory active Power button well send into each mode depending on how bios is configured. Pressing and holding the power button in will force a cold boot, if data on harddrive gets scrambled. Lid can also be configured in bios to start resume, or send it into resume mode. ** http://libretto.basiclink.com - Libretto mailing list http://www.silverace.com/libretto/ - Archives ---TO UNSUBSCRIBE--- Reply to any of the list messages. The reply mail should be addressed to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Then replace any text on the message's subject line: cmd:unsubscribe TO UNSUBSCRIBE DIGEST-- Do above but with this on subject line: cmd:unsubscribe digest **
