Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[clay via Mercedes]

And this is why I am torn.  The SDL will not amass miles enough to gain an 
advantage using M1 in the manner that Gump did.  I expect to hit under 1k  per 
annum in the car, and it took butt loads of miles to get goodness in my other 
cars.  IT has been four years of driving the R107 for it to be running nicely 
with M1.  Ten thousand miles on that old car.  It would be a decade in the SDL 
to get enough time running M1 in the OM603 to get it cleaned up.

Classic plates limit my miles on the SDL.  I would need to drive to Colorado 
and back over a weekend to rack up enough miles, then head down to Disneyland 
or LegoLand a few times.  Maybe if I drove to Disneyworld and tossed in a visit 
with Poos/MacDan to rig up my MacPro 1,1 to run el Crapitan on my mega, 
extended road trip of Parade, mechanic visits would I be able to build up the 
mileage and oil changes

clay


> On Sep 20, 2016, at 5:53 AM, Dan--- via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> Agreed, but your observations are correct.
> 
> Cars I have changed to synthetic, specifically Mobil 1, seem to run smoother 
> and quieter after 2-3 oil changes.
> 
> The former S500 coupe was a good example of this. It had a mild lifter tick 
> at idle that was not due to leaking oiler tubes, as it often is in the M119 
> engine.  After a couple of changes with M1 the lifter tick disappeared, never 
> to be heard again.
> 
> Dan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On Sep 20, 2016, at 2:33 AM, clay via Mercedes  wrote:
>> 
>> I am torn on tossing synth into the SDL.  When I used M1 in Gump, the first 
>> three changes did not seem to have much impact.  The fourth change (15k 
>> miles) everything was running much smoother and quieter.  Lots of the kruft 
>> that had taken up residence in the engine seemed to have been washed away by 
>> the M1.  Maybe I see if I get the same impact with this car.  But I am only 
>> going to be putting 1k on the clock annually.  Would be a huge waste of cash 
>> using M1 for that short a driving period.
>> 
>> clay
>> 
>>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 1:05 PM, rogerhga--- via Mercedes 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I would add to this that the 3K oil change is more important to a diesel 
>>> than a gas engine. When I changed my diesels at 3K, I felt good about 
>>> getting all the dirt and soot out of the engine. So, while it might be 
>>> marketing, it was worth it to me. And the engines are still going strong 
>>> after many years and many miles. 
>>> Best Wishes, 
>>> Roger 
>>> Roger Hale 
>>> Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
>>> Monroe, Ga. 
>>> 770-267-0850 
>>> www.dinnerwareclassics.com 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>> 
>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>> 
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> 
>> 
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>> 
> 
> 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

If you want to feel really put down, check out the words used in the late
rounds of recent national spelling bees.

On Wed, Sep 21, 2016 at 11:26 AM, G Mann via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com
> wrote:

> If I may say so, the current election cycle leaves me..
>
> "Nugatory lubricious"
>
> On Wed, Sep 21, 2016 at 8:20 AM, Donald Snook via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > I did not know there was a meaning other than relating to lubrication (in
> > a machine type sense not in a sexual sense).  So, I didn't learn a new
> > word, but I learned a new definition for that word!
> >
> > I like interesting words. Especially words that can actually be used in
> > normal conversation.  Obviously there are lots of weird technical words
> for
> > things that I would never use and that is an enormous list, but that's a
> > lot more difficult than finding words that can be used conversationally.
> > For example:
> >
> > Simultaneity -- Learned that one in law school in a Wills and Estate
> class
> > where the fact pattern involved a married couple each with a Will and we
> > had to analyze the simultaneity of their deaths Legerdemain -- opposing
> > counsel used this in a brief to describe the sleight of hand of my legal
> > argument -- I was a little insulted, but I won!
> > Jocular
> > Assiduous
> > Abjure
> > Corpulent
> > Brobdingnagian - I heard this on Big Bang Theory and read of review of
> the
> > new Ford Super Duty truck and they used it too!
> > Antediluvian
> > Superannuated
> > Enmity
> > Vitriol (or vitriolic)
> > Axiomatic (I use this often!)
> > Piscatorial -- don't tell an Oklahoma fisherman that you admire his
> > piscatorial aptitude unless you know him.  He might think those are
> > fighting words!
> > Truculent
> > Nadir
> > Predilection
> > Commensalism
> >
> > One of my favorite sounding words is exsanguinate. Of course, it sounds
> > interesting, but its meaning is pretty awful.
> >
> > I did learn a lesson in making sure I know what a word means before I use
> > it.  I heard the word pederast before and I knew it was some sort of an
> > insult.  But, I once called someone that without knowing what it really
> > meant.   Be careful, that's a real insult.
> >
> > Don Snook
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: arche...@embarqmail.com [mailto:arche...@embarqmail.com]
> > Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2016 11:57 AM
> > To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> > Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
> >
> >
> > Donald Snook wrote:
> > > I am just impressed that you used the word "lubricious" !
> >
> > It's no wonder you're impressed. Here's the primary definition:
> >
> > lu·bri·cious
> > [lo͞oˈbriSHəs]
> > ADJECTIVE
> > "Offensively displaying or intended to arouse sexual desire."
> >
> > https://www.bing.com/search?q=lubricious+definition=MOZI=MOZSPG
> >
> > ~
> > > From: Dan Penoff
> > > It also implies my motivation is coming from the idea that I know
> better
> > - I don’t, nor do I profess to.  It’s more a matter of overcompensation
> and
> > fiscal analysis on my part - Yes, the oil probably isn’t
> > bad/worn/exhausted/sooted up at this point, but I want the peace of mind
> > that the oil in my car is as clean and lubricious as possible, and I’m
> > willing to spend a little extra for that assurance.
> > >
> > > So it’s not a matter of, “I’m smarter than the guys who designed this
> to
> > begin with.”
> > >
> > > But thanks for suggesting it, Marshall.
> > >
> > > 
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > On Sep 19, 2016, at 5:24 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes <
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > > > By changing the oil more often you're saying "I know better than MB
> > engineers". Please submit proof that you know better than MB engineers.
> > >
> > > > Boy that sounds like a Marshall post don't it?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -Curt
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ___
> > > http://www.okiebenz.com
> > >
> > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> > >
> > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > > http://mail.

Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[G Mann via Mercedes]

If I may say so, the current election cycle leaves me..

"Nugatory lubricious"

On Wed, Sep 21, 2016 at 8:20 AM, Donald Snook via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I did not know there was a meaning other than relating to lubrication (in
> a machine type sense not in a sexual sense).  So, I didn't learn a new
> word, but I learned a new definition for that word!
>
> I like interesting words. Especially words that can actually be used in
> normal conversation.  Obviously there are lots of weird technical words for
> things that I would never use and that is an enormous list, but that's a
> lot more difficult than finding words that can be used conversationally.
> For example:
>
> Simultaneity -- Learned that one in law school in a Wills and Estate class
> where the fact pattern involved a married couple each with a Will and we
> had to analyze the simultaneity of their deaths Legerdemain -- opposing
> counsel used this in a brief to describe the sleight of hand of my legal
> argument -- I was a little insulted, but I won!
> Jocular
> Assiduous
> Abjure
> Corpulent
> Brobdingnagian - I heard this on Big Bang Theory and read of review of the
> new Ford Super Duty truck and they used it too!
> Antediluvian
> Superannuated
> Enmity
> Vitriol (or vitriolic)
> Axiomatic (I use this often!)
> Piscatorial -- don't tell an Oklahoma fisherman that you admire his
> piscatorial aptitude unless you know him.  He might think those are
> fighting words!
> Truculent
> Nadir
> Predilection
> Commensalism
>
> One of my favorite sounding words is exsanguinate. Of course, it sounds
> interesting, but its meaning is pretty awful.
>
> I did learn a lesson in making sure I know what a word means before I use
> it.  I heard the word pederast before and I knew it was some sort of an
> insult.  But, I once called someone that without knowing what it really
> meant.   Be careful, that's a real insult.
>
> Don Snook
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: arche...@embarqmail.com [mailto:arche...@embarqmail.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2016 11:57 AM
> To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
>
>
> Donald Snook wrote:
> > I am just impressed that you used the word "lubricious" !
>
> It's no wonder you're impressed. Here's the primary definition:
>
> lu·bri·cious
> [lo͞oˈbriSHəs]
> ADJECTIVE
> "Offensively displaying or intended to arouse sexual desire."
>
> https://www.bing.com/search?q=lubricious+definition=MOZI=MOZSPG
>
> ~
> > From: Dan Penoff
> > It also implies my motivation is coming from the idea that I know better
> - I don’t, nor do I profess to.  It’s more a matter of overcompensation and
> fiscal analysis on my part - Yes, the oil probably isn’t
> bad/worn/exhausted/sooted up at this point, but I want the peace of mind
> that the oil in my car is as clean and lubricious as possible, and I’m
> willing to spend a little extra for that assurance.
> >
> > So it’s not a matter of, “I’m smarter than the guys who designed this to
> begin with.”
> >
> > But thanks for suggesting it, Marshall.
> >
> > 
> >
> >
> >
> > > On Sep 19, 2016, at 5:24 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > > By changing the oil more often you're saying "I know better than MB
> engineers". Please submit proof that you know better than MB engineers.
> >
> > > Boy that sounds like a Marshall post don't it?
> > >
> > >
> > > -Curt
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
>
>
> --
> arche...@embarqmail.com <arche...@embarqmail.com>
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
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>
>
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>
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>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Donald Snook via Mercedes]

I did not know there was a meaning other than relating to lubrication (in a 
machine type sense not in a sexual sense).  So, I didn't learn a new word, but 
I learned a new definition for that word!  

I like interesting words. Especially words that can actually be used in normal 
conversation.  Obviously there are lots of weird technical words for things 
that I would never use and that is an enormous list, but that's a lot more 
difficult than finding words that can be used conversationally.  For example:  

Simultaneity -- Learned that one in law school in a Wills and Estate class 
where the fact pattern involved a married couple each with a Will and we had to 
analyze the simultaneity of their deaths Legerdemain -- opposing counsel used 
this in a brief to describe the sleight of hand of my legal argument -- I was a 
little insulted, but I won! 
Jocular
Assiduous
Abjure
Corpulent
Brobdingnagian - I heard this on Big Bang Theory and read of review of the new 
Ford Super Duty truck and they used it too! 
Antediluvian
Superannuated
Enmity
Vitriol (or vitriolic)
Axiomatic (I use this often!)
Piscatorial -- don't tell an Oklahoma fisherman that you admire his piscatorial 
aptitude unless you know him.  He might think those are fighting words! 
Truculent
Nadir
Predilection
Commensalism 
 
One of my favorite sounding words is exsanguinate. Of course, it sounds 
interesting, but its meaning is pretty awful. 

I did learn a lesson in making sure I know what a word means before I use it.  
I heard the word pederast before and I knew it was some sort of an insult.  
But, I once called someone that without knowing what it really meant.   Be 
careful, that's a real insult. 

Don Snook 


-Original Message-
From: arche...@embarqmail.com [mailto:arche...@embarqmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2016 11:57 AM
To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry


Donald Snook wrote:
> I am just impressed that you used the word "lubricious" !  

It's no wonder you're impressed. Here's the primary definition:

lu·bri·cious
[lo͞oˈbriSHəs]
ADJECTIVE
"Offensively displaying or intended to arouse sexual desire."

https://www.bing.com/search?q=lubricious+definition=MOZI=MOZSPG

~
> From: Dan Penoff
> It also implies my motivation is coming from the idea that I know better - I 
> don’t, nor do I profess to.  It’s more a matter of overcompensation and 
> fiscal analysis on my part - Yes, the oil probably isn’t 
> bad/worn/exhausted/sooted up at this point, but I want the peace of mind that 
> the oil in my car is as clean and lubricious as possible, and I’m willing to 
> spend a little extra for that assurance.
> 
> So it’s not a matter of, “I’m smarter than the guys who designed this to 
> begin with.”
> 
> But thanks for suggesting it, Marshall.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> > On Sep 19, 2016, at 5:24 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
> > <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > By changing the oil more often you're saying "I know better than MB 
> > engineers". Please submit proof that you know better than MB engineers.
> 
> > Boy that sounds like a Marshall post don't it?
> > 
> > 
> > -Curt
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

Blues Brothers. Can Calloway at the beginning of the show at the Palace Hotel 
ballroom.

Elwood: What kind of music do you usually have here? 
Claire: Oh, we got both kinds. We got country *and* western. 


Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 20, 2016, at 5:36 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
> I once knew a hooker named Minnie Mazola
> 
> 
>  From: Floyd Thursby via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> To: mercedes@okiebenz.com 
> Cc: Floyd Thursby <buggeredbenzm...@gmail.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2016 1:37 PM
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
> 
> That reminds me of a girlfr never mind.
> 
> --FT
> 
> 
>> On 9/20/16 12:56 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes wrote:
>> Donald Snook wrote:
>>> I am just impressed that you used the word "lubricious" !
>> It's no wonder you're impressed. Here's the primary definition:
>> 
>> lu·bri·cious
>> [lo͞oˈbriSHəs]
>> ADJECTIVE
>> "Offensively displaying or intended to arouse sexual desire."
>> 
>> https://www.bing.com/search?q=lubricious+definition=MOZI=MOZSPG
>> 
>> ~
>>> From: Dan Penoff
>>> It also implies my motivation is coming from the idea that I know better - 
>>> I don’t, nor do I profess to.  It’s more a matter of overcompensation and 
>>> fiscal analysis on my part - Yes, the oil probably isn’t 
>>> bad/worn/exhausted/sooted up at this point, but I want the peace of mind 
>>> that the oil in my car is as clean and lubricious as possible, and I’m 
>>> willing to spend a little extra for that assurance.
>>> 
>>> So it’s not a matter of, “I’m smarter than the guys who designed this to 
>>> begin with.”
>>> 
>>> But thanks for suggesting it, Marshall.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 5:24 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>>>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>>> By changing the oil more often you're saying "I know better than MB 
>>>> engineers". Please submit proof that you know better than MB engineers.
>>>> Boy that sounds like a Marshall post don't it?
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -Curt
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>> 
>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>> 
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>> 
>> 
> 
> -- 
> --FT
> 
> 
> ___
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> 
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> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

I once knew a hooker named Minnie Mazola


  From: Floyd Thursby via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Floyd Thursby <buggeredbenzm...@gmail.com>
 Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2016 1:37 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
   
That reminds me of a girlfr never mind.

--FT


On 9/20/16 12:56 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes wrote:
> Donald Snook wrote:
>> I am just impressed that you used the word "lubricious" !
> It's no wonder you're impressed. Here's the primary definition:
>
> lu·bri·cious
> [lo͞oˈbriSHəs]
> ADJECTIVE
> "Offensively displaying or intended to arouse sexual desire."
>
> https://www.bing.com/search?q=lubricious+definition=MOZI=MOZSPG
>
> ~
>> From: Dan Penoff
>> It also implies my motivation is coming from the idea that I know better - I 
>> don’t, nor do I profess to.  It’s more a matter of overcompensation and 
>> fiscal analysis on my part - Yes, the oil probably isn’t 
>> bad/worn/exhausted/sooted up at this point, but I want the peace of mind 
>> that the oil in my car is as clean and lubricious as possible, and I’m 
>> willing to spend a little extra for that assurance.
>>
>> So it’s not a matter of, “I’m smarter than the guys who designed this to 
>> begin with.”
>>
>> But thanks for suggesting it, Marshall.
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 5:24 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>> By changing the oil more often you're saying "I know better than MB 
>>> engineers". Please submit proof that you know better than MB engineers.
>>> Boy that sounds like a Marshall post don't it?
>>>
>>>
>>> -Curt
>>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>
>

-- 
--FT


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[WILTON via Mercedes]

I "caught" it.

W

- Original Message - 
From: "Dan--- via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>

To: "Mercedes Discussion List" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2016 12:59 PM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry



I wondered if anyone would catch that

Dan

Sent from my iPad

On Sep 20, 2016, at 12:56 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes 
<mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:



Donald Snook wrote:

I am just impressed that you used the word "lubricious" !


It's no wonder you're impressed. Here's the primary definition:

lu·bri·cious
[lo͞oˈbriSHəs]
ADJECTIVE
"Offensively displaying or intended to arouse sexual desire."

https://www.bing.com/search?q=lubricious+definition=MOZI=MOZSPG

~

From: Dan Penoff
It also implies my motivation is coming from the idea that I know 
better - I don’t, nor do I profess to.  It’s more a matter of 
overcompensation and fiscal analysis on my part - Yes, the oil probably 
isn’t bad/worn/exhausted/sooted up at this point, but I want the peace 
of mind that the oil in my car is as clean and lubricious as possible, 
and I’m willing to spend a little extra for that assurance.


So it’s not a matter of, “I’m smarter than the guys who designed this to 
begin with.”


But thanks for suggesting it, Marshall.





On Sep 19, 2016, at 5:24 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
<mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
By changing the oil more often you're saying "I know better than MB 
engineers". Please submit proof that you know better than MB engineers.



Boy that sounds like a Marshall post don't it?


-Curt




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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Floyd Thursby via Mercedes]

That reminds me of a girlfr never mind.

--FT


On 9/20/16 12:56 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes wrote:

Donald Snook wrote:

I am just impressed that you used the word "lubricious" !

It's no wonder you're impressed. Here's the primary definition:

lu·bri·cious
[lo͞oˈbriSHəs]
ADJECTIVE
"Offensively displaying or intended to arouse sexual desire."

https://www.bing.com/search?q=lubricious+definition=MOZI=MOZSPG

~

From: Dan Penoff
It also implies my motivation is coming from the idea that I know better - I 
don’t, nor do I profess to.  It’s more a matter of overcompensation and fiscal 
analysis on my part - Yes, the oil probably isn’t bad/worn/exhausted/sooted up 
at this point, but I want the peace of mind that the oil in my car is as clean 
and lubricious as possible, and I’m willing to spend a little extra for that 
assurance.

So it’s not a matter of, “I’m smarter than the guys who designed this to begin 
with.”

But thanks for suggesting it, Marshall.






On Sep 19, 2016, at 5:24 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes  
wrote:
By changing the oil more often you're saying "I know better than MB engineers". 
Please submit proof that you know better than MB engineers.
Boy that sounds like a Marshall post don't it?


-Curt




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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[rogerhga--- via Mercedes]

Curt, yes I know how fast the new oil turns black. I should clarify that when I 
remove the filter, it is really cruddy looking. Again, I just feel better about 
longevity with a shorter oil change. Granted, the oil may not be that worn out, 
but both the oil and the filter look really bad. 
Best Wishes, 
Roger 
Roger Hale 
Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
Monroe, Ga. 
770-267-0850 
www.dinnerwareclassics.com 


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Donald Snook via Mercedes]

I can definitely confirm this.  When I worked at the dealership, we had a 
customer that brought in a 124 diesel.  It was a former Oldsmobile and current 
Honda dealership.  He had a coupon for the oil change.  We changed it and he 
brought it back about 15 minutes later and was ranting and raving about the oil 
change and claimed that we didn't change the oil.  So, I went out to the car 
where he was going to prove to me that we didn't change the oil.  He pulled the 
dipstick and the oil was pretty dark.  I explained to him that it was a diesel 
and oil will turn dark (not quite black) very quickly.  He was still accusing 
of us of not changing the oil.  I was starting to get upset, but decided it was 
also a little humorous.  So, I pulled the car back in and let him watch him 
watch us drain all the oil. We even let it sit for 10 minutes to make sure we 
got as much out as possible.   Then, he watched us fill it back it up and start 
it up.  After waiting a few minutes, we checked the oil and 
 (no surprise) when we checked the oil on the dipstick it was very dark.   He 
was still adamant that we had pulled something over on him even though he 
watched everything.  At that point, I gave him his $10 back (it was a generous 
coupon) and escorted him out.   I still wonder whether he was crazy or for some 
reason just wanted to see if he could get a free oil change.  Or maybe he just 
wanted to try an oil flush.  

Don Snook 

-Original Message-
From: Curt Raymond [mailto:curtlud...@yahoo.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2016 10:12 AM
To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

Are you equating "dirty" with "black"?
You know its black about 1 second after you start the car right? Black oil 
isn't automatically dirty. If you haven't done oil analysis you don't know if 
the oil is dirty or not. The dirt is so small and its floating in the black oil 
that you can't see it...
-Curt

  From: rogerhga--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: "List, Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: roger...@comcast.net
 Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2016 3:49 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
   
Well, I'll say this slightly tongue in cheek. I do know more than MB engineers 
because I would NEVER have put a Chrysler servo in an MB car. After have 
replaced that item many times in my 80 300SD, I have to wonder "what were they 
thinking"? Again, when I look at how dirty the oil is at 3K, I'm ok with the 
extra expense of a shorter change interval. And with no engine problems at 
425,000 miles, I consider it a cheap price to keep the engine internals, IP, 
etc. working ok. 
Best Wishes, 
Roger 
Roger Hale 
Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
Monroe, Ga. 
770-267-0850 
www.dinnerwareclassics.com 


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

However, I did use it correctly if you look at the Latin use. At least in 
context.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 20, 2016, at 12:59 PM, Dan--- via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> I wondered if anyone would catch that
> 
> Dan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On Sep 20, 2016, at 12:56 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Donald Snook wrote:
>>> I am just impressed that you used the word "lubricious" !  
>> 
>> It's no wonder you're impressed. Here's the primary definition:
>> 
>> lu·bri·cious
>> [lo͞oˈbriSHəs]
>> ADJECTIVE
>> "Offensively displaying or intended to arouse sexual desire."
>> 
>> https://www.bing.com/search?q=lubricious+definition=MOZI=MOZSPG
>> 
>> ~
>>> From: Dan Penoff
>>> It also implies my motivation is coming from the idea that I know better - 
>>> I don’t, nor do I profess to.  It’s more a matter of overcompensation and 
>>> fiscal analysis on my part - Yes, the oil probably isn’t 
>>> bad/worn/exhausted/sooted up at this point, but I want the peace of mind 
>>> that the oil in my car is as clean and lubricious as possible, and I’m 
>>> willing to spend a little extra for that assurance.
>>> 
>>> So it’s not a matter of, “I’m smarter than the guys who designed this to 
>>> begin with.”
>>> 
>>> But thanks for suggesting it, Marshall.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 On Sep 19, 2016, at 5:24 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
  wrote:
 By changing the oil more often you're saying "I know better than MB 
 engineers". Please submit proof that you know better than MB engineers.
>>> 
 Boy that sounds like a Marshall post don't it?
 
 
 -Curt
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>> 
>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>> 
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> arche...@embarqmail.com 
>> 
>> ---
>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>> 
>> 
>> ___
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>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

I wondered if anyone would catch that

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 20, 2016, at 12:56 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Donald Snook wrote:
>> I am just impressed that you used the word "lubricious" !  
> 
> It's no wonder you're impressed. Here's the primary definition:
> 
> lu·bri·cious
> [lo͞oˈbriSHəs]
> ADJECTIVE
> "Offensively displaying or intended to arouse sexual desire."
> 
> https://www.bing.com/search?q=lubricious+definition=MOZI=MOZSPG
> 
> ~
>> From: Dan Penoff
>> It also implies my motivation is coming from the idea that I know better - I 
>> don’t, nor do I profess to.  It’s more a matter of overcompensation and 
>> fiscal analysis on my part - Yes, the oil probably isn’t 
>> bad/worn/exhausted/sooted up at this point, but I want the peace of mind 
>> that the oil in my car is as clean and lubricious as possible, and I’m 
>> willing to spend a little extra for that assurance.
>> 
>> So it’s not a matter of, “I’m smarter than the guys who designed this to 
>> begin with.”
>> 
>> But thanks for suggesting it, Marshall.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 5:24 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>>>  wrote:
>>> By changing the oil more often you're saying "I know better than MB 
>>> engineers". Please submit proof that you know better than MB engineers.
>> 
>>> Boy that sounds like a Marshall post don't it?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -Curt
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> 
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 
> 
> -- 
> arche...@embarqmail.com 
> 
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
> 
> 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[archer75--- via Mercedes]

Donald Snook wrote:
> I am just impressed that you used the word "lubricious" !  

It's no wonder you're impressed. Here's the primary definition:

lu·bri·cious
[lo͞oˈbriSHəs]
ADJECTIVE
"Offensively displaying or intended to arouse sexual desire."

https://www.bing.com/search?q=lubricious+definition=MOZI=MOZSPG

~
> From: Dan Penoff
> It also implies my motivation is coming from the idea that I know better - I 
> don’t, nor do I profess to.  It’s more a matter of overcompensation and 
> fiscal analysis on my part - Yes, the oil probably isn’t 
> bad/worn/exhausted/sooted up at this point, but I want the peace of mind that 
> the oil in my car is as clean and lubricious as possible, and I’m willing to 
> spend a little extra for that assurance.
> 
> So it’s not a matter of, “I’m smarter than the guys who designed this to 
> begin with.”
> 
> But thanks for suggesting it, Marshall.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> > On Sep 19, 2016, at 5:24 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
> >  wrote:
> > By changing the oil more often you're saying "I know better than MB 
> > engineers". Please submit proof that you know better than MB engineers.
> 
> > Boy that sounds like a Marshall post don't it?
> > 
> > 
> > -Curt
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

Something we always impressed upon our kids - build a big vocabulary, and more 
importantly, use it!

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 20, 2016, at 11:06 AM, Donald Snook <d...@snooklawllc.com> wrote:
> 
> I am just impressed that you used the word "lubricious" !  
> 
> Don Snook 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Dan Penoff [mailto:d...@penoff.com] 
> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 8:16 PM
> To: Mercedes List <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
> 
> It also implies my motivation is coming from the idea that I know better - I 
> don’t, nor do I profess to.  It’s more a matter of overcompensation and 
> fiscal analysis on my part - Yes, the oil probably isn’t 
> bad/worn/exhausted/sooted up at this point, but I want the peace of mind that 
> the oil in my car is as clean and lubricious as possible, and I’m willing to 
> spend a little extra for that assurance.
> 
> So it’s not a matter of, “I’m smarter than the guys who designed this to 
> begin with.”
> 
> But thanks for suggesting it, Marshall.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 5:24 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> By changing the oil more often you're saying "I know better than MB 
>> engineers". Please submit proof that you know better than MB engineers.
> 
>> Boy that sounds like a Marshall post don't it?
>> 
>> 
>> -Curt
> 
> 
> 


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Are you equating "dirty" with "black"?
You know its black about 1 second after you start the car right? Black oil 
isn't automatically dirty. If you haven't done oil analysis you don't know if 
the oil is dirty or not. The dirt is so small and its floating in the black oil 
that you can't see it...
-Curt

  From: rogerhga--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: "List, Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: roger...@comcast.net
 Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2016 3:49 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
   
Well, I'll say this slightly tongue in cheek. I do know more than MB engineers 
because I would NEVER have put a Chrysler servo in an MB car. After have 
replaced that item many times in my 80 300SD, I have to wonder "what were they 
thinking"? Again, when I look at how dirty the oil is at 3K, I'm ok with the 
extra expense of a shorter change interval. And with no engine problems at 
425,000 miles, I consider it a cheap price to keep the engine internals, IP, 
etc. working ok. 
Best Wishes, 
Roger 
Roger Hale 
Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
Monroe, Ga. 
770-267-0850 
www.dinnerwareclassics.com 


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

I think the "change every year" advice is bunk, especially in a diesel. 
Synthetic oil has such a high TBN to start with the acids produced by sitting 
aren't the concern they were in yesteryear. With the super low sulphur in 
today's diesel I don't think its a concern at all on diesels. Let it sit, if 
you get real worried get a magnetic block heater and warm the oil up once a 
year/quarter/month/whatever to drive out any moisture which is a larger 
concern.Then change every 2 or 3 years.

-Curt

  From: clay via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: clay <redgh...@comcast.net>
 Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2016 2:33 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
   
I am torn on tossing synth into the SDL.  When I used M1 in Gump, the first 
three changes did not seem to have much impact.  The fourth change (15k miles) 
everything was running much smoother and quieter.  Lots of the kruft that had 
taken up residence in the engine seemed to have been washed away by the M1.  
Maybe I see if I get the same impact with this car.  But I am only going to be 
putting 1k on the clock annually.  Would be a huge waste of cash using M1 for 
that short a driving period.

clay

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 1:05 PM, rogerhga--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> I would add to this that the 3K oil change is more important to a diesel than 
> a gas engine. When I changed my diesels at 3K, I felt good about getting all 
> the dirt and soot out of the engine. So, while it might be marketing, it was 
> worth it to me. And the engines are still going strong after many years and 
> many miles. 
> Best Wishes, 
> Roger 
> Roger Hale 
> Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
> Monroe, Ga. 
> 770-267-0850 
> www.dinnerwareclassics.com 
> 
> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
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> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Donald Snook via Mercedes]

I am just impressed that you used the word "lubricious" !  

Don Snook 

-Original Message-
From: Dan Penoff [mailto:d...@penoff.com] 
Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 8:16 PM
To: Mercedes List <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

It also implies my motivation is coming from the idea that I know better - I 
don’t, nor do I profess to.  It’s more a matter of overcompensation and fiscal 
analysis on my part - Yes, the oil probably isn’t bad/worn/exhausted/sooted up 
at this point, but I want the peace of mind that the oil in my car is as clean 
and lubricious as possible, and I’m willing to spend a little extra for that 
assurance.

So it’s not a matter of, “I’m smarter than the guys who designed this to begin 
with.”

But thanks for suggesting it, Marshall.





> On Sep 19, 2016, at 5:24 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> By changing the oil more often you're saying "I know better than MB 
> engineers". Please submit proof that you know better than MB engineers.

> Boy that sounds like a Marshall post don't it?
> 
> 
> -Curt
> 



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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Dwight,
I've had good luck finding 5w40 at Autozone but its in a different section from 
the normal oils, usually off to one side theres a diesel section with M1 5w40, 
Rotella, Delo and such.
Yesterday I did an experiment. I poured some 15w40 conventional, 10w40 
conventional, M1 15w50 and Liqui Moly 5w40 into 1" pipe caps and dipped a match 
into each one so I could observe how the oil coated the match and how it 
dripped off. Then I froze them for an hour. Our upright freezer holds to about 
-10F. Then I repeated the match test. In this example the 15w40 was, as I 
figured, like honey. The 10w40 was obviously thinner, the 15w50 was similar to 
the 10w40 and the 5w40 was of course thinnest of all.Interestingly both 
synthetic oils had a little white "stuff" in the center of the sample. I think 
its moisture but I'm not sure how it got there any why its only in the 
synthetic...
Anyway, I took video of the whole process, I'll finish that today and get it up 
on YouTube.
-Curt

  From: Dwight Giles via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: Dwight Giles <dwight.gi...@gmail.com>
 Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:05 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
   
Dan,
I run 15w-50 on my OM 602 year round. Starts fine but since I drive 70
miles commute I like the 50. 5w-40 diesel is NLA  here.

Dwight Giles Jr.
1982 300CD
1990 300D
Wickford RI

On Sep 19, 2016 10:14 AM, "Dan--- via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
wrote:

> Curt,
>
> Do you have that backwards? I can't imagine running 15W-50 in the winter
> in your neck of the woods. It would be like molasses, I would think.
>
> I currently run Delo 15W-40 in the SDL with 3000 mile changes. I believe
> strongly in the interval more than the oil, so it doesn't make a lot of
> sense to use something like M1 in the car with that short of an interval.
>
> A 2-1/2 gallon jug is around $26 at Wallyworld. Add $10 for a filter and
> an oil change costs me roughly $30. I will probably change oil 2-3 times
> this year.
>
> Dan
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> > On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:49 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > Why so hot for 20-50? I ran 15w40 in my 240Ds all summer and switched to
> 15w50 M1 in the winter for easier cold starts.
> > In a 60x engine you can do synthetic and change the oil less often but
> IIRC you don't drive that much. If I ran conventional oil back when I used
> to commute all the time I'd have had to change the oil every other month...
> > -Curt
> >
> >      From: clay via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> > To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> > Cc: clay <redgh...@comcast.net>
> > Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2016 11:12 PM
> > Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
> >
> > I had the oil debate over Polei.  I figured that all the extra pennies
> for full synth would not be economical in the SDL, and standard diesel oil
> would be fine.  The 20-50 is like hen’s teeth now.  FLAPS guy said the call
> for something that thick is waning.  Used only in diesels.  My response was
> of the DUH! sort, as I was purchasing Diesel oil at the time and wanted to
> know if the 20-40 was going to be good enough
> >
> > clay
> >
> >
> >> On Sep 18, 2016, at 6:43 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> I would also be curious about comparing to Delo full synthetic which is
> what I have been using in the 606
> >>
> >> Sent from my iPhone
> >>
> >>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 8:23 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Larry,
> >>>
> >>> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic
> compares to M1?  I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if the
> performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the Merkun
> engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called synthetic, I
> am not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.  My 616s get so few miles that I
> leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.
> >>>
> >>> uhOh!  Nuther oel thread
> >>>
> >>> ___
> >>> http://www.okiebenz.com
> >>>
> >>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >>>
> >>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> >>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >>
> >>
> >> ___
> >> http://www.okiebenz.com
> >

Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

Agreed, but your observations are correct.

Cars I have changed to synthetic, specifically Mobil 1, seem to run smoother 
and quieter after 2-3 oil changes.

The former S500 coupe was a good example of this. It had a mild lifter tick at 
idle that was not due to leaking oiler tubes, as it often is in the M119 
engine.  After a couple of changes with M1 the lifter tick disappeared, never 
to be heard again.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 20, 2016, at 2:33 AM, clay via Mercedes  wrote:
> 
> I am torn on tossing synth into the SDL.  When I used M1 in Gump, the first 
> three changes did not seem to have much impact.  The fourth change (15k 
> miles) everything was running much smoother and quieter.  Lots of the kruft 
> that had taken up residence in the engine seemed to have been washed away by 
> the M1.  Maybe I see if I get the same impact with this car.  But I am only 
> going to be putting 1k on the clock annually.  Would be a huge waste of cash 
> using M1 for that short a driving period.
> 
> clay
> 
>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 1:05 PM, rogerhga--- via Mercedes 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I would add to this that the 3K oil change is more important to a diesel 
>> than a gas engine. When I changed my diesels at 3K, I felt good about 
>> getting all the dirt and soot out of the engine. So, while it might be 
>> marketing, it was worth it to me. And the engines are still going strong 
>> after many years and many miles. 
>> Best Wishes, 
>> Roger 
>> Roger Hale 
>> Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
>> Monroe, Ga. 
>> 770-267-0850 
>> www.dinnerwareclassics.com 
>> 
>> 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

Hear Here!


Nor would I force all Merkuns to buy ACC.  But then THAT decision was 
not made by any engineer, it was made by the marketing bowties.



rogerhga--- via Mercedes 
September 20, 2016 at 2:49 AM
Well, I'll say this slightly tongue in cheek. I do know more than MB 
engineers because I would NEVER have put a Chrysler servo in an MB 
car. After have replaced that item many times in my 80 300SD, I have 
to wonder "what were they thinking"? Again, when I look at how dirty 
the oil is at 3K, I'm ok with the extra expense of a shorter change 
interval. And with no engine problems at 425,000 miles, I consider it 
a cheap price to keep the engine internals, IP, etc. working ok.

Best Wishes,
Roger
Roger Hale
Dinnerware Classics, Inc.
Monroe, Ga.
770-267-0850
www.dinnerwareclassics.com



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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[rogerhga--- via Mercedes]

Well, I'll say this slightly tongue in cheek. I do know more than MB engineers 
because I would NEVER have put a Chrysler servo in an MB car. After have 
replaced that item many times in my 80 300SD, I have to wonder "what were they 
thinking"? Again, when I look at how dirty the oil is at 3K, I'm ok with the 
extra expense of a shorter change interval. And with no engine problems at 
425,000 miles, I consider it a cheap price to keep the engine internals, IP, 
etc. working ok. 
Best Wishes, 
Roger 
Roger Hale 
Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
Monroe, Ga. 
770-267-0850 
www.dinnerwareclassics.com 


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[clay via Mercedes]

I am torn on tossing synth into the SDL.  When I used M1 in Gump, the first 
three changes did not seem to have much impact.  The fourth change (15k miles) 
everything was running much smoother and quieter.  Lots of the kruft that had 
taken up residence in the engine seemed to have been washed away by the M1.  
Maybe I see if I get the same impact with this car.  But I am only going to be 
putting 1k on the clock annually.  Would be a huge waste of cash using M1 for 
that short a driving period.

clay

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 1:05 PM, rogerhga--- via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> I would add to this that the 3K oil change is more important to a diesel than 
> a gas engine. When I changed my diesels at 3K, I felt good about getting all 
> the dirt and soot out of the engine. So, while it might be marketing, it was 
> worth it to me. And the engines are still going strong after many years and 
> many miles. 
> Best Wishes, 
> Roger 
> Roger Hale 
> Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
> Monroe, Ga. 
> 770-267-0850 
> www.dinnerwareclassics.com 
> 
> 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

>
> The low-pressure spec on OM61x is 0.5 bar; I don't know what it is on M119.


Me either.  But it's also 0.5 bar on M116/M117.

-- Jim
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Craig via Mercedes]

On Mon, 19 Sep 2016 10:56:13 -0400 Dan--- via Mercedes
 wrote:

> I understand, since it's a synthetic I'm sure it flows far better in
> cold temps than a conventional oil.
> 
> In the higher mileage M119s I've had I run 15W-50 M1 and change every
> 7500, maybe 10k in the older son's car, since his mileage is almost all
> highway. The only reason for using the higher viscosity oil is to keep
> idle pressures up in high temperatures. In both M119s with over 275k
> the idle pressure drops perilously close to 1.0 bar during the hottest
> times of the year with everything turned on.  If I use the 15W-50 idle
> pressures are more like 1.5 bar under similar conditions.

The low-pressure spec on OM61x is 0.5 bar; I don't know what it is on
M119.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dwight Giles via Mercedes]

Dan,
I run 15w-50 on my OM 602 year round. Starts fine but since I drive 70
miles commute I like the 50. 5w-40 diesel is NLA  here.

Dwight Giles Jr.
1982 300CD
1990 300D
Wickford RI

On Sep 19, 2016 10:14 AM, "Dan--- via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
wrote:

> Curt,
>
> Do you have that backwards? I can't imagine running 15W-50 in the winter
> in your neck of the woods. It would be like molasses, I would think.
>
> I currently run Delo 15W-40 in the SDL with 3000 mile changes. I believe
> strongly in the interval more than the oil, so it doesn't make a lot of
> sense to use something like M1 in the car with that short of an interval.
>
> A 2-1/2 gallon jug is around $26 at Wallyworld. Add $10 for a filter and
> an oil change costs me roughly $30. I will probably change oil 2-3 times
> this year.
>
> Dan
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> > On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:49 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > Why so hot for 20-50? I ran 15w40 in my 240Ds all summer and switched to
> 15w50 M1 in the winter for easier cold starts.
> > In a 60x engine you can do synthetic and change the oil less often but
> IIRC you don't drive that much. If I ran conventional oil back when I used
> to commute all the time I'd have had to change the oil every other month...
> > -Curt
> >
> >  From: clay via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> > To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> > Cc: clay <redgh...@comcast.net>
> > Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2016 11:12 PM
> > Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
> >
> > I had the oil debate over Polei.  I figured that all the extra pennies
> for full synth would not be economical in the SDL, and standard diesel oil
> would be fine.  The 20-50 is like hen’s teeth now.  FLAPS guy said the call
> for something that thick is waning.  Used only in diesels.  My response was
> of the DUH! sort, as I was purchasing Diesel oil at the time and wanted to
> know if the 20-40 was going to be good enough
> >
> > clay
> >
> >
> >> On Sep 18, 2016, at 6:43 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> I would also be curious about comparing to Delo full synthetic which is
> what I have been using in the 606
> >>
> >> Sent from my iPhone
> >>
> >>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 8:23 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Larry,
> >>>
> >>> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic
> compares to M1?  I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if the
> performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the Merkun
> engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called synthetic, I
> am not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.  My 616s get so few miles that I
> leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.
> >>>
> >>> uhOh!  Nuther oel thread
> >>>
> >>> ___
> >>> http://www.okiebenz.com
> >>>
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> >>>
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> >>
> >>
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

It also implies my motivation is coming from the idea that I know better - I 
don’t, nor do I profess to.  It’s more a matter of overcompensation and fiscal 
analysis on my part - Yes, the oil probably isn’t bad/worn/exhausted/sooted up 
at this point, but I want the peace of mind that the oil in my car is as clean 
and lubricious as possible, and I’m willing to spend a little extra for that 
assurance.

So it’s not a matter of, “I’m smarter than the guys who designed this to begin 
with.”

But thanks for suggesting it, Marshall.





> On Sep 19, 2016, at 5:24 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> By changing the oil more often you're saying "I know better than MB 
> engineers". Please submit proof that you know better than MB engineers.

> Boy that sounds like a Marshall post don't it?
> 
> 
> -Curt
> 


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[OK Don via Mercedes]

An oil analysis from Larry is the cheap insurance I use. My OM603 engine
has a MB limit of 2% soot - at 12,000 miles on M1 the analysis showed 1.5%
soot - but I'd already changed it by then. I did slowly creep up to 12,000
miles with analysis telling me that I could still go longer. I also then
had a wear record of the engine via the analysis - nothing going on at all.
IIRC, it had over 200,000 at that time.
On the other hand, I've changed the oil three times already on the F150
that only has 7,000 miles on it - due to time, not miles (once a year).

On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 3:33 PM, Dan--- via Mercedes 
wrote:

> Thanks for weighing in Roger.
>
> While the 3000 mile interval may be dated or anecdotal, I feel the same
> way about getting the crud out of the engine.
>
> And again, it's a very small price to pay as far as I'm concerned.
>
> Dan
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> > On Sep 19, 2016, at 4:05 PM, rogerhga--- via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > I would add to this that the 3K oil change is more important to a diesel
> than a gas engine. When I changed my diesels at 3K, I felt good about
> getting all the dirt and soot out of the engine. So, while it might be
> marketing, it was worth it to me. And the engines are still going strong
> after many years and many miles.
> > Best Wishes,
> > Roger
> > Roger Hale
> > Dinnerware Classics, Inc.
> > Monroe, Ga.
> > 770-267-0850
> > www.dinnerwareclassics.com
> >
> >
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-- 
OK Don

*“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of
our people need it sorely on these accounts.”* – Mark Twain

"There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
for themselves."

WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
2013 F150, 18 mpg
2012 Passat TDI DSG, 44 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Larry T via Mercedes]

I bought 2 gallons of Synthetic 15W40 OE Diesel Oil 2 41.90 total plus $9.85 
for shipping and $3.42 sales tax for a total of $55.17 or $6.89/qt. The 
franchise fee varies but I usually get their special 6 months for $10. because 
that works for me when I need to place orders. 
So, grand total including the fee is $65.17/8= $8.14/qt. 

Prices go down with quantities. The AmsOil business works well with my Oil 
Analysis business IMO  oil changes for the 911 takes 4 gal of oil! But I 
don;t put the miles on very quickly. ;-) 

That's a great deal on the LiquiMoly! 

Larry 

- Original Message -

From: "Curt Raymond via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
To: "Mercedes Discussion List" <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: "Curt Raymond" <curtlud...@yahoo.com> 
Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 1:14:47 PM 
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry 

Larry, 
How much does the price drop? The European 5w40 for my VWs is $11.30/qt retail 
price.Liqui Moly 4100 5w40 from Amazon is only $8 with free shipping. 
-Curt 

From: Larry Turnercatalina$27 via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
To: Curley McLain <126die...@gmail.com>; Mercedes Discussion List 
<mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: Larry Turnercatalina$27 <l02tur...@comcast.net> 
Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 1:02 PM 
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry 

Hey Curley! 

I'm afraid I cannot be much help. Over the past 5 years I have gone 
totally to AmsOil products and am extremely happy with them. I use 
AmsOil full Synthetics in my Porsche 911 and 91 300D, but of course, I 
still see people who use all kinds of oils. BTW, recent oil tests on 
all my vehicles and the tests came back extremely clean. I was thrilled 
with the reports ;-) 

The oil business is always playing with their formulas and I cannot keep 
up with them. Sorry - I know nothing about Castrol's Synthetic and 
can't help there either. 

Valvoline makes a great product but if you want to try something 
different I recommend Amsoil - I can sell it to you or you can get an 
inexpensive "dealership" which cuts your cost dramatically. Shipping is 
very reasonable as well. I am very happy with it - it holds up well 
and does not seem to drop viscosity when the engine gets up to full temp. 

Here's some info on the Amsoil Base Stocks: 

http://knowledgebase.amsoil.com/KnowledgebaseArticle50176.aspx?Keywords=base+stocks
 

I don't like to appear to be advertising on this forum so I will reply 
privately to future comments. I can help with pricing as well. 

Have a great day! 



On 9/18/2016 9:23 PM, Curley McLain wrote: 
> Larry, 
> 
> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic 
> compares to M1? I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if 
> the performance is similar. I think I will use the Valvoline in the 
> Merkun engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called 
> synthetic, I am not sure I want to try it in an OM603. My 616s get 
> so few miles that I leave them on Mobil Dino oil. 
> 
> uhOh! Nuther oel thread 

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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curley McLain via Mercedes]

Some people are weird that way.  just because they don't want it, they 
don't want anyone else to get use out of whatever they throw away.  Same 
people chase away people picking up cans or dumpster diving or picking 
up things at the curb.



Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
September 19, 2016 at 4:24 PM
Some years ago a co-worker was using Mobil 1 in his Mercury Marauder 
and changing at 2,500 miles. He wasn't using the car hard or racing it 
or anything, he gave the typical "Its cheap insurance" argument. I 
asked him if I could have the old oil. I told him I'd put it in the 
Ranger, that the oil was just barely broken in. That caused him to 
actually read the manual and change to the official Mercury OCI of 
7500 miles.
He seemed genuinely offended when I asked for the oil, I find that 
strange, it was something he was going to throw out anyway...



-Curt


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

MB says you can have 2% soot in the oil with no ill effects, the oil can carry 
the soot around, it doesn't hurt anything. Dirt on the other hand mostly gets 
trapped in the filter. MB said 5000 miles for a diesel and 7500 miles for a 
gasser.
By changing the oil more often you're saying "I know better than MB engineers". 
Please submit proof that you know better than MB engineers.
Boy that sounds like a Marshall post don't it?
In the end you do whatever you what to do, its your car after all. 
Some years ago a co-worker was using Mobil 1 in his Mercury Marauder and 
changing at 2,500 miles. He wasn't using the car hard or racing it or anything, 
he gave the typical "Its cheap insurance" argument. I asked him if I could have 
the old oil. I told him I'd put it in the Ranger, that the oil was just barely 
broken in. That caused him to actually read the manual and change to the 
official Mercury OCI of 7500 miles.
He seemed genuinely offended when I asked for the oil, I find that strange, it 
was something he was going to throw out anyway...


-Curt

  From: Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com>
 Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 4:33 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
   
Thanks for weighing in Roger. 

While the 3000 mile interval may be dated or anecdotal, I feel the same way 
about getting the crud out of the engine.

And again, it's a very small price to pay as far as I'm concerned.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 4:05 PM, rogerhga--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> I would add to this that the 3K oil change is more important to a diesel than 
> a gas engine. When I changed my diesels at 3K, I felt good about getting all 
> the dirt and soot out of the engine. So, while it might be marketing, it was 
> worth it to me. And the engines are still going strong after many years and 
> many miles. 
> Best Wishes, 
> Roger 
> Roger Hale 
> Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
> Monroe, Ga. 
> 770-267-0850 
> www.dinnerwareclassics.com 
> 
> 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

Possibly, but I was schooled in MB oil pressure years ago that anything less 
than 1.0 bar at idle was undesirable or indicated excessive engine wear.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 4:05 PM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Dan, this line from your email caught my attention:
> 
> On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 10:56 AM, Dan--- via Mercedes > wrote:
> 
>> The only reason for using the higher viscosity oil is to keep idle
>> pressures up in high temperatures. In both M119s with over 275k the idle
>> pressure drops perilously close to 1.0 bar during the hottest times of the
>> year with everything turned on.  If I use the 15W-50 idle pressures are
>> more like 1.5 bar under similar conditions.
> My understanding after reading through the "Motor Oil University" material
> on Bob is the Oil Guy ( https://bobistheoilguy.com/motor-oil-101/ ) is that
> engine oil is serving two purposes, lubrication AND cooling, and in order
> to cool it needs to flow, at the rate of flow that the MB engineers
> calculated.  Increasing the viscosity will slow down the flow (less
> cooling).  You may be using the wrong metric (hot idle oil pressure) to
> guide your choice in oil.
> 
> -
> Max
> Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

Thanks for weighing in Roger. 

While the 3000 mile interval may be dated or anecdotal, I feel the same way 
about getting the crud out of the engine.

And again, it's a very small price to pay as far as I'm concerned.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 4:05 PM, rogerhga--- via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> I would add to this that the 3K oil change is more important to a diesel than 
> a gas engine. When I changed my diesels at 3K, I felt good about getting all 
> the dirt and soot out of the engine. So, while it might be marketing, it was 
> worth it to me. And the engines are still going strong after many years and 
> many miles. 
> Best Wishes, 
> Roger 
> Roger Hale 
> Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
> Monroe, Ga. 
> 770-267-0850 
> www.dinnerwareclassics.com 
> 
> 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[rogerhga--- via Mercedes]

I would add to this that the 3K oil change is more important to a diesel than a 
gas engine. When I changed my diesels at 3K, I felt good about getting all the 
dirt and soot out of the engine. So, while it might be marketing, it was worth 
it to me. And the engines are still going strong after many years and many 
miles. 
Best Wishes, 
Roger 
Roger Hale 
Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
Monroe, Ga. 
770-267-0850 
www.dinnerwareclassics.com 


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

Dan, this line from your email caught my attention:

On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 10:56 AM, Dan--- via Mercedes  wrote:

> The only reason for using the higher viscosity oil is to keep idle
> pressures up in high temperatures. In both M119s with over 275k the idle
> pressure drops perilously close to 1.0 bar during the hottest times of the
> year with everything turned on.  If I use the 15W-50 idle pressures are
> more like 1.5 bar under similar conditions.
>
>
My understanding after reading through the "Motor Oil University" material
on Bob is the Oil Guy ( https://bobistheoilguy.com/motor-oil-101/ ) is that
engine oil is serving two purposes, lubrication AND cooling, and in order
to cool it needs to flow, at the rate of flow that the MB engineers
calculated.  Increasing the viscosity will slow down the flow (less
cooling).  You may be using the wrong metric (hot idle oil pressure) to
guide your choice in oil.

-
Max
Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

I found this: 
http://w124-zone.com/downloads/MB%20CD/W124/w124CD1/Program/Maintenance/sheets86_97.pdfwhich
 suggests every 5,000 miles for diesels '86-'97, 7,500 for gassers.
-Curt

  From: Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: Mercedes List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com>
 Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 2:04 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
   
I have a 8 quart model of this:

http://www.liquivac.com

So, as an oil guy, you're saying that I could go longer than 3000 miles between 
changes without concerns? This doesn't surprise me at all, but I would also be 
curious to see what Mercedes used to recommend for change intervals on the 
OM603. I realize their info would be dated, but it would be interesting to know 
just for the heck of it.

And yes, I'm all too familiar with the marketing efforts of the oil places to 
push the "every 3000 miles" stuff. My understanding of it is far more dated, 
and goes back to the 1980s.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 1:16 PM, Larry T <l02tur...@comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> Is that a store bought or a home built pumping system?  
> Thx
> LarryT
> 
> From: "Dan--- via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> To: "Mercedes Discussion List" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com>
> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:56:13 AM
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
> 
> I understand, since it's a synthetic I'm sure it flows far better in cold 
> temps than a conventional oil.
> 
> In the higher mileage M119s I've had I run 15W-50 M1 and change every 7500, 
> maybe 10k in the older son's car, since his mileage is almost all highway. 
> The only reason for using the higher viscosity oil is to keep idle pressures 
> up in high temperatures. In both M119s with over 275k the idle pressure drops 
> perilously close to 1.0 bar during the hottest times of the year with 
> everything turned on.  If I use the 15W-50 idle pressures are more like 1.5 
> bar under similar conditions.
> 
> Time isn't an issue for me. If it's one of my cars, I just pull it into the 
> garage, get out the vacuum extractor, pump it up, stick in the hose and go 
> off to do something else. 30 minutes later I'll come back, swap the filter, 
> fill it up with fresh oil and check levels. I spend 15 minutes total changing 
> oil, if that.
> 
> Dan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> > On Sep 19, 2016, at 10:21 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
> > <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > 
> > You'd think that until you play with both oils in the cold. The 15w40 
> > conventional oil is almost solid at 0F, the 15w50 has barely changed, its a 
> > little thicker but not much. I forget who gave me the idea, maybe Marshall 
> > but its true.
> > Hmm, maybe I should make a video about it...
> > I'm exactly the opposite, having done some oil analysis I see no reason to 
> > change the oil before its used up, it seems like a waste of money and a 
> > waste of time, mostly the later actually. With both of my 190Ds analysis 
> > showed the oil was still doing fine at 12,000 miles at which point I always 
> > got chicken. It'd also tend to thicken a bit at that point and I could hear 
> > a difference in cold starts.
> > From a money perspective you're paying say $90/yr plus your time. Mobil 1 
> > 5w40 at Autozone here is $29/gal full price so you'd be almost 3 times the 
> > cost in oil but 1/3 the cost in filters and 1/3 the time which for me is 
> > the most valuable part.
> > Of course you don't have to worry about cold starts, at 0F with 15w40 
> > conventional oil forget it, just plug the car in and wait. With synthetic 
> > give it an extra few seconds after the car starts and drive away...
> > -Curt
> > 
> >      From: Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> > To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> > Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com>
> > Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:13 AM
> > Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
> > 
> > Curt,
> > 
> > Do you have that backwards? I can't imagine running 15W-50 in the winter in 
> > your neck of the woods. It would be like molasses, I would think.
> > 
> > I currently run Delo 15W-40 in the SDL with 3000 mile changes. I believe 
> > strongly in the interval more than the oil, so it doesn't make a lot of 
> > sense to use something like M1 in the car with that short of an interval.
> > 
> > A 2-1/2 gallon jug is around $26 at Wallyworld. Add $10 for a filter and an 
> > oil change costs me roughly $30. I will probably ch

Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

> On September 19, 2016 at 1:24 PM Larry T via Mercedes 
> wrote:
> 
> 
> Ditto's - But I guess it's common knowledge on this forum that the old "Change
> at 3000" was an advertising gimmick with no basis in fact. 

I think of it as historical basis. 
It was probably a very good idea with a non-feedback carburetor and API SE grade
oil. By the end of the 1980s, all the manufacturers were recommending 7500 miles
on most cars, and all the service managers were promising you swift engine death
if you dared follow factory recommendations, they either had their heads stuck
in their 40 years of professional experience with obsolete cars and oils, or
were worried about losing half their oil change business. 

I'm driving a 2007 Saturn a lot now. It's the only time I've had an oil life
monitor which does not give the driver a clue as to the oil status until the
'change oil now' notice appears. It's still happy that I changed the oil 9
months and 10,000+ miles ago. I prefer the other GM cars that give a percent of
life remaining (the local Chevy dealer has convinced my father that you have to
change it when the monitor reads 50%), or the MB way of giving an estimate of
remaining miles on the oil life. 

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

I have a 8 quart model of this:

http://www.liquivac.com

So, as an oil guy, you're saying that I could go longer than 3000 miles between 
changes without concerns? This doesn't surprise me at all, but I would also be 
curious to see what Mercedes used to recommend for change intervals on the 
OM603. I realize their info would be dated, but it would be interesting to know 
just for the heck of it.

And yes, I'm all too familiar with the marketing efforts of the oil places to 
push the "every 3000 miles" stuff. My understanding of it is far more dated, 
and goes back to the 1980s.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 1:16 PM, Larry T <l02tur...@comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> Is that a store bought or a home built pumping system?  
> Thx
> LarryT
> 
> From: "Dan--- via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> To: "Mercedes Discussion List" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com>
> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:56:13 AM
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
> 
> I understand, since it's a synthetic I'm sure it flows far better in cold 
> temps than a conventional oil.
> 
> In the higher mileage M119s I've had I run 15W-50 M1 and change every 7500, 
> maybe 10k in the older son's car, since his mileage is almost all highway. 
> The only reason for using the higher viscosity oil is to keep idle pressures 
> up in high temperatures. In both M119s with over 275k the idle pressure drops 
> perilously close to 1.0 bar during the hottest times of the year with 
> everything turned on.  If I use the 15W-50 idle pressures are more like 1.5 
> bar under similar conditions.
> 
> Time isn't an issue for me. If it's one of my cars, I just pull it into the 
> garage, get out the vacuum extractor, pump it up, stick in the hose and go 
> off to do something else. 30 minutes later I'll come back, swap the filter, 
> fill it up with fresh oil and check levels. I spend 15 minutes total changing 
> oil, if that.
> 
> Dan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> > On Sep 19, 2016, at 10:21 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
> > <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > 
> > You'd think that until you play with both oils in the cold. The 15w40 
> > conventional oil is almost solid at 0F, the 15w50 has barely changed, its a 
> > little thicker but not much. I forget who gave me the idea, maybe Marshall 
> > but its true.
> > Hmm, maybe I should make a video about it...
> > I'm exactly the opposite, having done some oil analysis I see no reason to 
> > change the oil before its used up, it seems like a waste of money and a 
> > waste of time, mostly the later actually. With both of my 190Ds analysis 
> > showed the oil was still doing fine at 12,000 miles at which point I always 
> > got chicken. It'd also tend to thicken a bit at that point and I could hear 
> > a difference in cold starts.
> > From a money perspective you're paying say $90/yr plus your time. Mobil 1 
> > 5w40 at Autozone here is $29/gal full price so you'd be almost 3 times the 
> > cost in oil but 1/3 the cost in filters and 1/3 the time which for me is 
> > the most valuable part.
> > Of course you don't have to worry about cold starts, at 0F with 15w40 
> > conventional oil forget it, just plug the car in and wait. With synthetic 
> > give it an extra few seconds after the car starts and drive away...
> > -Curt
> > 
> >  From: Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> > To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> > Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com>
> > Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:13 AM
> > Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
> > 
> > Curt,
> > 
> > Do you have that backwards? I can't imagine running 15W-50 in the winter in 
> > your neck of the woods. It would be like molasses, I would think.
> > 
> > I currently run Delo 15W-40 in the SDL with 3000 mile changes. I believe 
> > strongly in the interval more than the oil, so it doesn't make a lot of 
> > sense to use something like M1 in the car with that short of an interval.
> > 
> > A 2-1/2 gallon jug is around $26 at Wallyworld. Add $10 for a filter and an 
> > oil change costs me roughly $30. I will probably change oil 2-3 times this 
> > year.
> > 
> > Dan
> > 
> > 
> > Sent from my iPad
> > 
> >> On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:49 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
> >> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >> 
> >> Why so hot for 20-50? I ran 15w40 in my 240Ds all summer and switched to 
> >> 15w50 M1 in the winter for easier cold starts.
> >> In a 60x eng

Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Mine is a combination, I've got a Topsider that I hook my vacuum cleaner to had 
to make an adapter out of a soda can.
I probably won't use it the next time I change oil in the Golf, I put a 
magnetic drain plug in and I want to see what its caught if anything. Want to 
change the transmission oil while I'm down there so the belly pan has to come 
off anyway.
-Curt

  From: Larry T via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: Floyd Thursby via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: Larry T <l02tur...@comcast.net>
 Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 1:16 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
   
Is that a store bought or a home built pumping system? 
Thx 
LarryT 

- Original Message -

From: "Dan--- via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
To: "Mercedes Discussion List" <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com> 
Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:56:13 AM 
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry 

I understand, since it's a synthetic I'm sure it flows far better in cold temps 
than a conventional oil. 

In the higher mileage M119s I've had I run 15W-50 M1 and change every 7500, 
maybe 10k in the older son's car, since his mileage is almost all highway. The 
only reason for using the higher viscosity oil is to keep idle pressures up in 
high temperatures. In both M119s with over 275k the idle pressure drops 
perilously close to 1.0 bar during the hottest times of the year with 
everything turned on. If I use the 15W-50 idle pressures are more like 1.5 bar 
under similar conditions. 

Time isn't an issue for me. If it's one of my cars, I just pull it into the 
garage, get out the vacuum extractor, pump it up, stick in the hose and go off 
to do something else. 30 minutes later I'll come back, swap the filter, fill it 
up with fresh oil and check levels. I spend 15 minutes total changing oil, if 
that. 

Dan 


Sent from my iPad 

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 10:21 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: 
> 
> You'd think that until you play with both oils in the cold. The 15w40 
> conventional oil is almost solid at 0F, the 15w50 has barely changed, its a 
> little thicker but not much. I forget who gave me the idea, maybe Marshall 
> but its true. 
> Hmm, maybe I should make a video about it... 
> I'm exactly the opposite, having done some oil analysis I see no reason to 
> change the oil before its used up, it seems like a waste of money and a waste 
> of time, mostly the later actually. With both of my 190Ds analysis showed the 
> oil was still doing fine at 12,000 miles at which point I always got chicken. 
> It'd also tend to thicken a bit at that point and I could hear a difference 
> in cold starts. 
> From a money perspective you're paying say $90/yr plus your time. Mobil 1 
> 5w40 at Autozone here is $29/gal full price so you'd be almost 3 times the 
> cost in oil but 1/3 the cost in filters and 1/3 the time which for me is the 
> most valuable part. 
> Of course you don't have to worry about cold starts, at 0F with 15w40 
> conventional oil forget it, just plug the car in and wait. With synthetic 
> give it an extra few seconds after the car starts and drive away... 
> -Curt 
> 
> From: Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com> 
> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:13 AM 
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry 
> 
> Curt, 
> 
> Do you have that backwards? I can't imagine running 15W-50 in the winter in 
> your neck of the woods. It would be like molasses, I would think. 
> 
> I currently run Delo 15W-40 in the SDL with 3000 mile changes. I believe 
> strongly in the interval more than the oil, so it doesn't make a lot of sense 
> to use something like M1 in the car with that short of an interval. 
> 
> A 2-1/2 gallon jug is around $26 at Wallyworld. Add $10 for a filter and an 
> oil change costs me roughly $30. I will probably change oil 2-3 times this 
> year. 
> 
> Dan 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad 
> 
>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:49 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: 
>> 
>> Why so hot for 20-50? I ran 15w40 in my 240Ds all summer and switched to 
>> 15w50 M1 in the winter for easier cold starts. 
>> In a 60x engine you can do synthetic and change the oil less often but IIRC 
>> you don't drive that much. If I ran conventional oil back when 


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Larry T via Mercedes]

Ditto's - But I guess it's common knowledge on this forum that the old "Change 
at 3000" was an advertising gimmick with no basis in fact. Depending on driving 
style, where you drive/temps and speeds over regular distances such as a 30 min 
drive on the interstate Vs 30 min of stop light to stop light stuff, regular 
oil is good for 5-6K and synthetics 8-9000 mi. (Although some will naturally 
drive more miles IMO. 
LarryT 

. 
- Original Message -

From: "Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
To: "Mercedes Discussion List" <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: "Kaleb C. Striplin" <ka...@striplin.net> 
Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:19:07 AM 
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry 

Even with regular oil you should be able to easily go 5k miles. 

Sent from my iPhone 

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:13 AM, Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> wrote: 
> 
> Curt, 
> 
> Do you have that backwards? I can't imagine running 15W-50 in the winter in 
> your neck of the woods. It would be like molasses, I would think. 
> 
> I currently run Delo 15W-40 in the SDL with 3000 mile changes. I believe 
> strongly in the interval more than the oil, so it doesn't make a lot of sense 
> to use something like M1 in the car with that short of an interval. 
> 
> A 2-1/2 gallon jug is around $26 at Wallyworld. Add $10 for a filter and an 
> oil change costs me roughly $30. I will probably change oil 2-3 times this 
> year. 
> 
> Dan 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad 
> 
>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:49 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: 
>> 
>> Why so hot for 20-50? I ran 15w40 in my 240Ds all summer and switched to 
>> 15w50 M1 in the winter for easier cold starts. 
>> In a 60x engine you can do synthetic and change the oil less often but IIRC 
>> you don't drive that much. If I ran conventional oil back when I used to 
>> commute all the time I'd have had to change the oil every other month... 
>> -Curt 
>> 
>> From: clay via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
>> To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
>> Cc: clay <redgh...@comcast.net> 
>> Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2016 11:12 PM 
>> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry 
>> 
>> I had the oil debate over Polei. I figured that all the extra pennies for 
>> full synth would not be economical in the SDL, and standard diesel oil would 
>> be fine. The 20-50 is like hen’s teeth now. FLAPS guy said the call for 
>> something that thick is waning. Used only in diesels. My response was of the 
>> DUH! sort, as I was purchasing Diesel oil at the time and wanted to know if 
>> the 20-40 was going to be good enough 
>> 
>> clay 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 6:43 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
>>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: 
>>> 
>>> I would also be curious about comparing to Delo full synthetic which is 
>>> what I have been using in the 606 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone 
>>> 
>>>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 8:23 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>>>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: 
>>>> 
>>>> Larry, 
>>>> 
>>>> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic 
>>>> compares to M1? I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if the 
>>>> performance is similar. I think I will use the Valvoline in the Merkun 
>>>> engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called synthetic, I 
>>>> am not sure I want to try it in an OM603. My 616s get so few miles that I 
>>>> leave them on Mobil Dino oil. 
>>>> 
>>>> uhOh! Nuther oel thread 
>>>> 
>>>> ___ 
>>>> http://www.okiebenz.com 
>>>> 
>>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ 
>>>> 
>>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: 
>>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ___ 
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>>> 
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: 
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com 
>> 
>> 
>> ___ 
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>> 
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>> 
>> To Unsubscri

Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Larry,
How much does the price drop? The European 5w40 for my VWs is $11.30/qt retail 
price.Liqui Moly 4100 5w40 from Amazon is only $8 with free shipping.
-Curt

  From: Larry Turnercatalina$27 via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: Curley McLain <126die...@gmail.com>; Mercedes Discussion List 
<mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: Larry Turnercatalina$27 <l02tur...@comcast.net>
 Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 1:02 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
   
Hey Curley!

I'm afraid I cannot be much help.  Over the past 5 years I have gone 
totally to AmsOil products and am extremely happy with them.  I use 
AmsOil full Synthetics in my Porsche 911 and 91 300D, but of course, I 
still see people who use all kinds of oils.  BTW, recent oil tests on 
all my vehicles and the tests came back extremely clean.  I was thrilled 
with the reports ;-)

The oil business is always playing with their formulas and I cannot keep 
up with them.  Sorry - I know nothing about Castrol's Synthetic and 
can't help there either.

Valvoline makes a great product but if you want to try something 
different I recommend Amsoil - I can sell it to you or you can get an 
inexpensive "dealership" which cuts your cost dramatically. Shipping is 
very reasonable as well.  I am very happy with it - it holds up well 
and does not seem to drop viscosity when the engine gets up to full temp.

Here's some info on the Amsoil Base Stocks:

http://knowledgebase.amsoil.com/KnowledgebaseArticle50176.aspx?Keywords=base+stocks

I don't like to appear to be advertising on this forum so I will reply 
privately to future comments.  I can help with pricing as well.

Have a great day!



On 9/18/2016 9:23 PM, Curley McLain wrote:
> Larry,
>
> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic 
> compares to M1?  I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if 
> the performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the 
> Merkun engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called 
> synthetic, I am not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.  My 616s get 
> so few miles that I leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.
>
> uhOh!  Nuther oel thread

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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Larry T via Mercedes]

Is that a store bought or a home built pumping system? 
Thx 
LarryT 

- Original Message -

From: "Dan--- via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
To: "Mercedes Discussion List" <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com> 
Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:56:13 AM 
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry 

I understand, since it's a synthetic I'm sure it flows far better in cold temps 
than a conventional oil. 

In the higher mileage M119s I've had I run 15W-50 M1 and change every 7500, 
maybe 10k in the older son's car, since his mileage is almost all highway. The 
only reason for using the higher viscosity oil is to keep idle pressures up in 
high temperatures. In both M119s with over 275k the idle pressure drops 
perilously close to 1.0 bar during the hottest times of the year with 
everything turned on. If I use the 15W-50 idle pressures are more like 1.5 bar 
under similar conditions. 

Time isn't an issue for me. If it's one of my cars, I just pull it into the 
garage, get out the vacuum extractor, pump it up, stick in the hose and go off 
to do something else. 30 minutes later I'll come back, swap the filter, fill it 
up with fresh oil and check levels. I spend 15 minutes total changing oil, if 
that. 

Dan 


Sent from my iPad 

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 10:21 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: 
> 
> You'd think that until you play with both oils in the cold. The 15w40 
> conventional oil is almost solid at 0F, the 15w50 has barely changed, its a 
> little thicker but not much. I forget who gave me the idea, maybe Marshall 
> but its true. 
> Hmm, maybe I should make a video about it... 
> I'm exactly the opposite, having done some oil analysis I see no reason to 
> change the oil before its used up, it seems like a waste of money and a waste 
> of time, mostly the later actually. With both of my 190Ds analysis showed the 
> oil was still doing fine at 12,000 miles at which point I always got chicken. 
> It'd also tend to thicken a bit at that point and I could hear a difference 
> in cold starts. 
> From a money perspective you're paying say $90/yr plus your time. Mobil 1 
> 5w40 at Autozone here is $29/gal full price so you'd be almost 3 times the 
> cost in oil but 1/3 the cost in filters and 1/3 the time which for me is the 
> most valuable part. 
> Of course you don't have to worry about cold starts, at 0F with 15w40 
> conventional oil forget it, just plug the car in and wait. With synthetic 
> give it an extra few seconds after the car starts and drive away... 
> -Curt 
> 
> From: Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com> 
> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:13 AM 
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry 
> 
> Curt, 
> 
> Do you have that backwards? I can't imagine running 15W-50 in the winter in 
> your neck of the woods. It would be like molasses, I would think. 
> 
> I currently run Delo 15W-40 in the SDL with 3000 mile changes. I believe 
> strongly in the interval more than the oil, so it doesn't make a lot of sense 
> to use something like M1 in the car with that short of an interval. 
> 
> A 2-1/2 gallon jug is around $26 at Wallyworld. Add $10 for a filter and an 
> oil change costs me roughly $30. I will probably change oil 2-3 times this 
> year. 
> 
> Dan 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad 
> 
>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:49 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: 
>> 
>> Why so hot for 20-50? I ran 15w40 in my 240Ds all summer and switched to 
>> 15w50 M1 in the winter for easier cold starts. 
>> In a 60x engine you can do synthetic and change the oil less often but IIRC 
>> you don't drive that much. If I ran conventional oil back when 


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Larry T via Mercedes]

I start getting nervous at oil change intervals above 8000 or 9000. I have been 
changing the synthetic oil in both the 911 and the 91 300D at 8000 miles. So 
far, the oil analysis are showing I am seeing slow wear rates. Also, we've had 
a lot of 90+ temps - it seemed like all of August was above 90 - and I have a 
water tempo issue I am fighting so I don't want to push the oil further than 
needed. 
LarryT 

- Original Message -

From: "Curt Raymond via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
To: "Mercedes Discussion List" <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: "Curt Raymond" <curtlud...@yahoo.com> 
Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 11:03:42 AM 
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry 

With a gas car I bet you could go to 15k easily, especially if the miles are 
all on the highway. Oil analysis would tell you for sure, it would also give 
you a good idea whats going on inside the engine. 
My '85 190D had high iron levels in the oil when I bought it so I shortened the 
OCI (oil change interval) for the first couple changes. As the iron levels 
steadily dropped in each change I lengthened the OCI to 10k miles. Without 
analysis I wouldn't have known about the iron and wouldn't have known what OCI 
I could use. 
-Curt 

From: Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com> 
Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:56 AM 
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry 

I understand, since it's a synthetic I'm sure it flows far better in cold temps 
than a conventional oil. 

In the higher mileage M119s I've had I run 15W-50 M1 and change every 7500, 
maybe 10k in the older son's car, since his mileage is almost all highway. The 
only reason for using the higher viscosity oil is to keep idle pressures up in 
high temperatures. In both M119s with over 275k the idle pressure drops 
perilously close to 1.0 bar during the hottest times of the year with 
everything turned on. If I use the 15W-50 idle pressures are more like 1.5 bar 
under similar conditions. 

Time isn't an issue for me. If it's one of my cars, I just pull it into the 
garage, get out the vacuum extractor, pump it up, stick in the hose and go off 
to do something else. 30 minutes later I'll come back, swap the filter, fill it 
up with fresh oil and check levels. I spend 15 minutes total changing oil, if 
that. 

Dan 


Sent from my iPad 

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 10:21 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: 
> 
> You'd think that until you play with both oils in the cold. The 15w40 
> conventional oil is almost solid at 0F, the 15w50 has barely changed, its a 
> little thicker but not much. I forget who gave me the idea, maybe Marshall 
> but its true. 
> Hmm, maybe I should make a video about it... 
> I'm exactly the opposite, having done some oil analysis I see no reason to 
> change the oil before its used up, it seems like a waste of money and a waste 
> of time, mostly the later actually. With both of my 190Ds analysis showed the 
> oil was still doing fine at 12,000 miles at which point I always got chicken. 
> It'd also tend to thicken a bit at that point and I could hear a difference 
> in cold starts. 
> From a money perspective you're paying say $90/yr plus your time. Mobil 1 
> 5w40 at Autozone here is $29/gal full price so you'd be almost 3 times the 
> cost in oil but 1/3 the cost in filters and 1/3 the time which for me is the 
> most valuable part. 
> Of course you don't have to worry about cold starts, at 0F with 15w40 
> conventional oil forget it, just plug the car in and wait. With synthetic 
> give it an extra few seconds after the car starts and drive away... 
> -Curt 
> 
> From: Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com> 
> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:13 AM 
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry 
> 
> Curt, 
> 
> Do you have that backwards? I can't imagine running 15W-50 in the winter in 
> your neck of the woods. It would be like molasses, I would think. 
> 
> I currently run Delo 15W-40 in the SDL with 3000 mile changes. I believe 
> strongly in the interval more than the oil, so it doesn't make a lot of sense 
> to use something like M1 in the car with that short of an interval. 
> 
> A 2-1/2 gallon jug is around $26 at Wallyworld. Add $10 for a filter and an 
> oil change costs me roughly $30. I will probably change oil 2-3 times this 
> year. 
> 
> Dan 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad 
> 
>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:49 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: 
>> 
>> Why so hot for 20-50? I ran 15w40 in my 240Ds all summer and switched to 
>> 

Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Larry Turnercatalina$27 via Mercedes]

Hey Curley!

I'm afraid I cannot be much help.  Over the past 5 years I have gone 
totally to AmsOil products and am extremely happy with them.   I use 
AmsOil full Synthetics in my Porsche 911 and 91 300D, but of course, I 
still see people who use all kinds of oils.  BTW, recent oil tests on 
all my vehicles and the tests came back extremely clean.  I was thrilled 
with the reports ;-)


The oil business is always playing with their formulas and I cannot keep 
up with them.  Sorry - I know nothing about Castrol's Synthetic and 
can't help there either.


Valvoline makes a great product but if you want to try something 
different I recommend Amsoil - I can sell it to you or you can get an 
inexpensive "dealership" which cuts your cost dramatically. Shipping is 
very reasonable as well.   I am very happy with it - it holds up well 
and does not seem to drop viscosity when the engine gets up to full temp.


Here's some info on the Amsoil Base Stocks:

http://knowledgebase.amsoil.com/KnowledgebaseArticle50176.aspx?Keywords=base+stocks

I don't like to appear to be advertising on this forum so I will reply 
privately to future comments.  I can help with pricing as well.


Have a great day!



On 9/18/2016 9:23 PM, Curley McLain wrote:

Larry,

do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic 
compares to M1?   I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if 
the performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the 
Merkun engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called 
synthetic, I am not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.   My 616s get 
so few miles that I leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.


uhOh!  Nuther oel thread


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

I sure miss the $6/gallon prices for Delo at Costco.

-- Jim
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

With a gas car I bet you could go to 15k easily, especially if the miles are 
all on the highway. Oil analysis would tell you for sure, it would also give 
you a good idea whats going on inside the engine.
My '85 190D had high iron levels in the oil when I bought it so I shortened the 
OCI (oil change interval) for the first couple changes. As the iron levels 
steadily dropped in each change I lengthened the OCI to 10k miles. Without 
analysis I wouldn't have known about the iron and wouldn't have known what OCI 
I could use.
-Curt

  From: Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com>
 Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:56 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
   
I understand, since it's a synthetic I'm sure it flows far better in cold temps 
than a conventional oil.

In the higher mileage M119s I've had I run 15W-50 M1 and change every 7500, 
maybe 10k in the older son's car, since his mileage is almost all highway. The 
only reason for using the higher viscosity oil is to keep idle pressures up in 
high temperatures. In both M119s with over 275k the idle pressure drops 
perilously close to 1.0 bar during the hottest times of the year with 
everything turned on.  If I use the 15W-50 idle pressures are more like 1.5 bar 
under similar conditions.

Time isn't an issue for me. If it's one of my cars, I just pull it into the 
garage, get out the vacuum extractor, pump it up, stick in the hose and go off 
to do something else. 30 minutes later I'll come back, swap the filter, fill it 
up with fresh oil and check levels. I spend 15 minutes total changing oil, if 
that.

Dan


Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 10:21 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
> You'd think that until you play with both oils in the cold. The 15w40 
> conventional oil is almost solid at 0F, the 15w50 has barely changed, its a 
> little thicker but not much. I forget who gave me the idea, maybe Marshall 
> but its true.
> Hmm, maybe I should make a video about it...
> I'm exactly the opposite, having done some oil analysis I see no reason to 
> change the oil before its used up, it seems like a waste of money and a waste 
> of time, mostly the later actually. With both of my 190Ds analysis showed the 
> oil was still doing fine at 12,000 miles at which point I always got chicken. 
> It'd also tend to thicken a bit at that point and I could hear a difference 
> in cold starts.
> From a money perspective you're paying say $90/yr plus your time. Mobil 1 
> 5w40 at Autozone here is $29/gal full price so you'd be almost 3 times the 
> cost in oil but 1/3 the cost in filters and 1/3 the time which for me is the 
> most valuable part.
> Of course you don't have to worry about cold starts, at 0F with 15w40 
> conventional oil forget it, just plug the car in and wait. With synthetic 
> give it an extra few seconds after the car starts and drive away...
> -Curt
> 
>      From: Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com>
> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:13 AM
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
> 
> Curt,
> 
> Do you have that backwards? I can't imagine running 15W-50 in the winter in 
> your neck of the woods. It would be like molasses, I would think.
> 
> I currently run Delo 15W-40 in the SDL with 3000 mile changes. I believe 
> strongly in the interval more than the oil, so it doesn't make a lot of sense 
> to use something like M1 in the car with that short of an interval.
> 
> A 2-1/2 gallon jug is around $26 at Wallyworld. Add $10 for a filter and an 
> oil change costs me roughly $30. I will probably change oil 2-3 times this 
> year.
> 
> Dan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:49 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Why so hot for 20-50? I ran 15w40 in my 240Ds all summer and switched to 
>> 15w50 M1 in the winter for easier cold starts.
>> In a 60x engine you can do synthetic and change the oil less often but IIRC 
>> you don't drive that much. If I ran conventional oil back when


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

The Delo 400 LE in the 2.5 gallon jugs at Dead Sam's is more than adequate. At 
around $26/jug it's not expensive, either.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 18, 2016, at 11:12 PM, clay via Mercedes  wrote:
> 
> I had the oil debate over Polei.  I figured that all the extra pennies for 
> full synth would not be economical in the SDL, and standard diesel oil would 
> be fine.  The 20-50 is like hen’s teeth now.  FLAPS guy said the call for 
> something that thick is waning.  Used only in diesels.  My response was of 
> the DUH! sort, as I was purchasing Diesel oil at the time and wanted to know 
> if the 20-40 was going to be good enough
> 
> clay
> 
> 
>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 6:43 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I would also be curious about comparing to Delo full synthetic which is what 
>> I have been using in the 606
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 8:23 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Larry,
>>> 
>>> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic 
>>> compares to M1?   I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if the 
>>> performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the Merkun 
>>> engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called synthetic, I 
>>> am not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.   My 616s get so few miles that 
>>> I leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.
>>> 
>>> uhOh!  Nuther oel thread
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>> 
>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>> 
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> 
>> 
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>> 
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> 
> 
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> 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

I understand, since it's a synthetic I'm sure it flows far better in cold temps 
than a conventional oil.

In the higher mileage M119s I've had I run 15W-50 M1 and change every 7500, 
maybe 10k in the older son's car, since his mileage is almost all highway. The 
only reason for using the higher viscosity oil is to keep idle pressures up in 
high temperatures. In both M119s with over 275k the idle pressure drops 
perilously close to 1.0 bar during the hottest times of the year with 
everything turned on.  If I use the 15W-50 idle pressures are more like 1.5 bar 
under similar conditions.

Time isn't an issue for me. If it's one of my cars, I just pull it into the 
garage, get out the vacuum extractor, pump it up, stick in the hose and go off 
to do something else. 30 minutes later I'll come back, swap the filter, fill it 
up with fresh oil and check levels. I spend 15 minutes total changing oil, if 
that.

Dan


Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 10:21 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
> You'd think that until you play with both oils in the cold. The 15w40 
> conventional oil is almost solid at 0F, the 15w50 has barely changed, its a 
> little thicker but not much. I forget who gave me the idea, maybe Marshall 
> but its true.
> Hmm, maybe I should make a video about it...
> I'm exactly the opposite, having done some oil analysis I see no reason to 
> change the oil before its used up, it seems like a waste of money and a waste 
> of time, mostly the later actually. With both of my 190Ds analysis showed the 
> oil was still doing fine at 12,000 miles at which point I always got chicken. 
> It'd also tend to thicken a bit at that point and I could hear a difference 
> in cold starts.
> From a money perspective you're paying say $90/yr plus your time. Mobil 1 
> 5w40 at Autozone here is $29/gal full price so you'd be almost 3 times the 
> cost in oil but 1/3 the cost in filters and 1/3 the time which for me is the 
> most valuable part.
> Of course you don't have to worry about cold starts, at 0F with 15w40 
> conventional oil forget it, just plug the car in and wait. With synthetic 
> give it an extra few seconds after the car starts and drive away...
> -Curt
> 
>  From: Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com>
> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:13 AM
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
> 
> Curt,
> 
> Do you have that backwards? I can't imagine running 15W-50 in the winter in 
> your neck of the woods. It would be like molasses, I would think.
> 
> I currently run Delo 15W-40 in the SDL with 3000 mile changes. I believe 
> strongly in the interval more than the oil, so it doesn't make a lot of sense 
> to use something like M1 in the car with that short of an interval.
> 
> A 2-1/2 gallon jug is around $26 at Wallyworld. Add $10 for a filter and an 
> oil change costs me roughly $30. I will probably change oil 2-3 times this 
> year.
> 
> Dan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:49 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Why so hot for 20-50? I ran 15w40 in my 240Ds all summer and switched to 
>> 15w50 M1 in the winter for easier cold starts.
>> In a 60x engine you can do synthetic and change the oil less often but IIRC 
>> you don't drive that much. If I ran conventional oil back when


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Roger, 
I think you've got a little extra in your oil description. Mobil 1 Delvac is 
5w40 synthetic oil. 
Mobil Delvac (no 1) is 15w40 conventional oil.
I think you mean the latter. If you were changing the former at 3K you were 
wasting oil for no reason.
In a 61x engine I never went over 8,000 miles, the soot levels would force a 
change. Thats why I ran conventional oil in the summer time. In the winter I 
needed the superior cold starts synthetic gave me so I used synthetic and 
changed at 8k.
I don't miss changing oil in the winter time. Both VWs are getting due for a 
change, I'll have an oil change party in October and do both. We're not driving 
as much as we used to this should last me a year. Actually the Jetta I'll 
probably be early on but I don't want to do it in February...
-Curt

  From: rogerhga--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: "List, Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: roger...@comcast.net
 Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:25 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
   
I'll add my usual different opinion on oil. I've used Mobil 1 Delvac 15x40 in 
my two old 617s for around 20 years. Neither one has had the head off nor any 
engine problems. One has around 425,000 miles and the other around 360,000 
miles. I tried the other oils at first (Delo, Shell, etc.), but Delvac kept the 
oil pressure slightly higher when hot, was fine in the Winter (although I live 
in the Atlanta area, but have seen some cold), and really keeps the soot and 
dirt in circulation so it all drains out at the oil change. I always encourage 
people to use what works for them. I'm just passing on what has worked for 
years for me. And yes I used to drive a lot so I changed oil every 3K and that 
was sometimes every 1.5-2 months. 
Best Wishes, 
Roger 
Roger Hale 
Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
Monroe, Ga. 
770-267-0850 
www.dinnerwareclassics.com 


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

You'd think that until you play with both oils in the cold. The 15w40 
conventional oil is almost solid at 0F, the 15w50 has barely changed, its a 
little thicker but not much. I forget who gave me the idea, maybe Marshall but 
its true.
Hmm, maybe I should make a video about it...
I'm exactly the opposite, having done some oil analysis I see no reason to 
change the oil before its used up, it seems like a waste of money and a waste 
of time, mostly the later actually. With both of my 190Ds analysis showed the 
oil was still doing fine at 12,000 miles at which point I always got chicken. 
It'd also tend to thicken a bit at that point and I could hear a difference in 
cold starts.
From a money perspective you're paying say $90/yr plus your time. Mobil 1 5w40 
at Autozone here is $29/gal full price so you'd be almost 3 times the cost in 
oil but 1/3 the cost in filters and 1/3 the time which for me is the most 
valuable part.
Of course you don't have to worry about cold starts, at 0F with 15w40 
conventional oil forget it, just plug the car in and wait. With synthetic give 
it an extra few seconds after the car starts and drive away...
-Curt

  From: Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: "d...@penoff.com" <d...@penoff.com>
 Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 10:13 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
   
Curt,

Do you have that backwards? I can't imagine running 15W-50 in the winter in 
your neck of the woods. It would be like molasses, I would think.

I currently run Delo 15W-40 in the SDL with 3000 mile changes. I believe 
strongly in the interval more than the oil, so it doesn't make a lot of sense 
to use something like M1 in the car with that short of an interval.

A 2-1/2 gallon jug is around $26 at Wallyworld. Add $10 for a filter and an oil 
change costs me roughly $30. I will probably change oil 2-3 times this year.

Dan


Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:49 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
> Why so hot for 20-50? I ran 15w40 in my 240Ds all summer and switched to 
> 15w50 M1 in the winter for easier cold starts.
> In a 60x engine you can do synthetic and change the oil less often but IIRC 
> you don't drive that much. If I ran conventional oil back when I used to 
> commute all the time I'd have had to change the oil every other month...
> -Curt
> 
>      From: clay via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> Cc: clay <redgh...@comcast.net>
> Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2016 11:12 PM
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
> 
> I had the oil debate over Polei.  I figured that all the extra pennies for 
> full synth would not be economical in the SDL, and standard diesel oil would 
> be fine.  The 20-50 is like hen’s teeth now.  FLAPS guy said the call for 
> something that thick is waning.  Used only in diesels.  My response was of 
> the DUH! sort, as I was purchasing Diesel oil at the time and wanted to know 
> if the 20-40 was going to be good enough
> 
> clay
> 
> 
>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 6:43 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> 
>> I would also be curious about comparing to Delo full synthetic which is what 
>> I have been using in the 606
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 8:23 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Larry,
>>> 
>>> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic 
>>> compares to M1?  I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if the 
>>> performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the Merkun 
>>> engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called synthetic, I 
>>> am not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.  My 616s get so few miles that I 
>>> leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.
>>> 
>>> uhOh!  Nuther oel thread
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[rogerhga--- via Mercedes]

I'll add my usual different opinion on oil. I've used Mobil 1 Delvac 15x40 in 
my two old 617s for around 20 years. Neither one has had the head off nor any 
engine problems. One has around 425,000 miles and the other around 360,000 
miles. I tried the other oils at first (Delo, Shell, etc.), but Delvac kept the 
oil pressure slightly higher when hot, was fine in the Winter (although I live 
in the Atlanta area, but have seen some cold), and really keeps the soot and 
dirt in circulation so it all drains out at the oil change. I always encourage 
people to use what works for them. I'm just passing on what has worked for 
years for me. And yes I used to drive a lot so I changed oil every 3K and that 
was sometimes every 1.5-2 months. 
Best Wishes, 
Roger 
Roger Hale 
Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
Monroe, Ga. 
770-267-0850 
www.dinnerwareclassics.com 


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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

Old habits die hard, and with the limited mileage I do, an extra change a year 
isn't a significant cost.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 10:19 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
> Even with regular oil you should be able to easily go 5k miles.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:13 AM, Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Curt,
>> 
>> Do you have that backwards? I can't imagine running 15W-50 in the winter in 
>> your neck of the woods. It would be like molasses, I would think.
>> 
>> I currently run Delo 15W-40 in the SDL with 3000 mile changes. I believe 
>> strongly in the interval more than the oil, so it doesn't make a lot of 
>> sense to use something like M1 in the car with that short of an interval.
>> 
>> A 2-1/2 gallon jug is around $26 at Wallyworld. Add $10 for a filter and an 
>> oil change costs me roughly $30. I will probably change oil 2-3 times this 
>> year.
>> 
>> Dan
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:49 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Why so hot for 20-50? I ran 15w40 in my 240Ds all summer and switched to 
>>> 15w50 M1 in the winter for easier cold starts.
>>> In a 60x engine you can do synthetic and change the oil less often but IIRC 
>>> you don't drive that much. If I ran conventional oil back when I used to 
>>> commute all the time I'd have had to change the oil every other month...
>>> -Curt
>>> 
>>>From: clay via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
>>> To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
>>> Cc: clay <redgh...@comcast.net>
>>> Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2016 11:12 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
>>> 
>>> I had the oil debate over Polei.  I figured that all the extra pennies for 
>>> full synth would not be economical in the SDL, and standard diesel oil 
>>> would be fine.  The 20-50 is like hen’s teeth now.  FLAPS guy said the call 
>>> for something that thick is waning.  Used only in diesels.  My response was 
>>> of the DUH! sort, as I was purchasing Diesel oil at the time and wanted to 
>>> know if the 20-40 was going to be good enough
>>> 
>>> clay
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 6:43 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
>>>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> I would also be curious about comparing to Delo full synthetic which is 
>>>> what I have been using in the 606
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> 
>>>>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 8:23 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>>>>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Larry,
>>>>> 
>>>>> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic 
>>>>> compares to M1?  I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if the 
>>>>> performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the Merkun 
>>>>> engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called synthetic, I 
>>>>> am not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.  My 616s get so few miles that 
>>>>> I leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.
>>>>> 
>>>>> uhOh!  Nuther oel thread
>>>>> 
>>>>> ___
>>>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>>>> 
>>>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>>>> 
>>>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>>> 
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>>>> 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

Even with regular oil you should be able to easily go 5k miles.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:13 AM, Dan--- via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> Curt,
> 
> Do you have that backwards? I can't imagine running 15W-50 in the winter in 
> your neck of the woods. It would be like molasses, I would think.
> 
> I currently run Delo 15W-40 in the SDL with 3000 mile changes. I believe 
> strongly in the interval more than the oil, so it doesn't make a lot of sense 
> to use something like M1 in the car with that short of an interval.
> 
> A 2-1/2 gallon jug is around $26 at Wallyworld. Add $10 for a filter and an 
> oil change costs me roughly $30. I will probably change oil 2-3 times this 
> year.
> 
> Dan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:49 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Why so hot for 20-50? I ran 15w40 in my 240Ds all summer and switched to 
>> 15w50 M1 in the winter for easier cold starts.
>> In a 60x engine you can do synthetic and change the oil less often but IIRC 
>> you don't drive that much. If I ran conventional oil back when I used to 
>> commute all the time I'd have had to change the oil every other month...
>> -Curt
>> 
>> From: clay via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
>> To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
>> Cc: clay <redgh...@comcast.net>
>> Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2016 11:12 PM
>> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
>> 
>> I had the oil debate over Polei.  I figured that all the extra pennies for 
>> full synth would not be economical in the SDL, and standard diesel oil would 
>> be fine.  The 20-50 is like hen’s teeth now.  FLAPS guy said the call for 
>> something that thick is waning.  Used only in diesels.  My response was of 
>> the DUH! sort, as I was purchasing Diesel oil at the time and wanted to know 
>> if the 20-40 was going to be good enough
>> 
>> clay
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 6:43 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
>>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I would also be curious about comparing to Delo full synthetic which is 
>>> what I have been using in the 606
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 8:23 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>>>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Larry,
>>>> 
>>>> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic 
>>>> compares to M1?  I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if the 
>>>> performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the Merkun 
>>>> engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called synthetic, I 
>>>> am not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.  My 616s get so few miles that 
>>>> I leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.
>>>> 
>>>> uhOh!  Nuther oel thread
>>>> 
>>>> ___
>>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>>> 
>>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>>> 
>>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>> 
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>>> 
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> 
>> 
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>> 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dan--- via Mercedes]

Curt,

Do you have that backwards? I can't imagine running 15W-50 in the winter in 
your neck of the woods. It would be like molasses, I would think.

I currently run Delo 15W-40 in the SDL with 3000 mile changes. I believe 
strongly in the interval more than the oil, so it doesn't make a lot of sense 
to use something like M1 in the car with that short of an interval.

A 2-1/2 gallon jug is around $26 at Wallyworld. Add $10 for a filter and an oil 
change costs me roughly $30. I will probably change oil 2-3 times this year.

Dan


Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 19, 2016, at 9:49 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
> Why so hot for 20-50? I ran 15w40 in my 240Ds all summer and switched to 
> 15w50 M1 in the winter for easier cold starts.
> In a 60x engine you can do synthetic and change the oil less often but IIRC 
> you don't drive that much. If I ran conventional oil back when I used to 
> commute all the time I'd have had to change the oil every other month...
> -Curt
> 
>  From: clay via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> Cc: clay <redgh...@comcast.net>
> Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2016 11:12 PM
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
> 
> I had the oil debate over Polei.  I figured that all the extra pennies for 
> full synth would not be economical in the SDL, and standard diesel oil would 
> be fine.  The 20-50 is like hen’s teeth now.  FLAPS guy said the call for 
> something that thick is waning.  Used only in diesels.  My response was of 
> the DUH! sort, as I was purchasing Diesel oil at the time and wanted to know 
> if the 20-40 was going to be good enough
> 
> clay
> 
> 
>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 6:43 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> 
>> I would also be curious about comparing to Delo full synthetic which is what 
>> I have been using in the 606
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 8:23 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Larry,
>>> 
>>> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic 
>>> compares to M1?  I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if the 
>>> performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the Merkun 
>>> engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called synthetic, I 
>>> am not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.  My 616s get so few miles that I 
>>> leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.
>>> 
>>> uhOh!  Nuther oel thread
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>> 
>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>> 
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> 
>> 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Why so hot for 20-50? I ran 15w40 in my 240Ds all summer and switched to 15w50 
M1 in the winter for easier cold starts.
In a 60x engine you can do synthetic and change the oil less often but IIRC you 
don't drive that much. If I ran conventional oil back when I used to commute 
all the time I'd have had to change the oil every other month...
-Curt

  From: clay via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: clay <redgh...@comcast.net>
 Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2016 11:12 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry
   
I had the oil debate over Polei.  I figured that all the extra pennies for full 
synth would not be economical in the SDL, and standard diesel oil would be 
fine.  The 20-50 is like hen’s teeth now.  FLAPS guy said the call for 
something that thick is waning.  Used only in diesels.  My response was of the 
DUH! sort, as I was purchasing Diesel oil at the time and wanted to know if the 
20-40 was going to be good enough

clay


> On Sep 18, 2016, at 6:43 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
> I would also be curious about comparing to Delo full synthetic which is what 
> I have been using in the 606
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 8:23 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Larry,
>> 
>> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic 
>> compares to M1?  I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if the 
>> performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the Merkun 
>> engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called synthetic, I am 
>> not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.  My 616s get so few miles that I 
>> leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.
>> 
>> uhOh!  Nuther oel thread
>> 
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> 
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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>> 
> 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Valvoline is the only oil I can buy that meets the VW standard for Angie's '05 
Golf TDI. I suspect like any company they make good stuff and they make crap. 
The stuff that meets the VW standard is the good stuff.
It appears to me that since most Americans don't know anything about cars and 
seem to value their ignorance that we get only crap options for things like 
oil. I order in Lubro moly 4100 for the Golf...
-Curt

  From: Curley McLain via Mercedes 
 To: Mercedes Discussion List  
Cc: Curley McLain <126die...@gmail.com>
 Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2016 9:23 PM
 Subject: [MBZ] Q for Larry
   
Larry,

do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic 
compares to M1?  I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if 
the performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the 
Merkun engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called 
synthetic, I am not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.  My 616s get so 
few miles that I leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.

uhOh!  Nuther oel thread

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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

Oil forum (and diesel pickup forum, and IIRC the late Doktor Booth) wisdom says
Delo 400 is the best 'conventional' 15W40 diesel oil, with Delvac 1300 maybe
ahead of Rotella. Delo "Iso-Syn" has some of the sorta synthetic group III base
stock that they've been using to dilute the group IV base in M1 in recent
decades. 

I've got a few shiny steel cans of original M1 somewhere. The additive package
might not be as good as the new stuff, but I bet the base stock is better than
anything you can find at FLAPS today. I've been saving it for shelf decoration
when/if I ever build my dream workshop. 
Mitch. 

> On September 19, 2016 at 5:43 AM archer75--- via Mercedes
>  wrote:
> Years ago you would see cases of Delo lined up against the wall at the
> Wildwood truck stop. Nowadays you see Shell Rotella lined up against the wall
> and only a few quarts of Delo on the shelf. Do the truckers know something we
> don't know?

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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[archer75--- via Mercedes]

The early RPM Delo and later (Chevron Delo?) had fantastic solvents and 
cleaners.
My first 1958 Beetle was missing on one cylinder (why I got it for $275).
After two weeks  with Delo in the CC, it was hitting on all 4 and continued to 
do so for over 100K.
Years later when I switched to M1, the formula had changed; possibly for the 
worse. If the Delo sat on the shelf for a few months, there would be a 
precipitate in the bottom of the jug. I shook it up and used it with no ill 
effects, but buyers who didn't see the precipitate may have been missing part 
of the additives.
Years ago you would see cases of Delo lined up against the wall at the Wildwood 
truck stop. Nowadays you see Shell Rotella lined up against the wall and only a 
few quarts of Delo on the shelf. Do the truckers know something we don't know?
Gerry

> I had the oil debate over Polei.  I figured that all the extra pennies for 
> full synth would not be economical in the SDL, and standard diesel oil would 
> be fine.  The 20-50 is like hen’s teeth now.  FLAPS guy said the call for 
> something that thick is waning.  Used only in diesels.  My response was of 
> the DUH! sort, as I was purchasing Diesel oil at the time and wanted to know 
> if the 20-40 was going to be good enough
> 
> clay
> 
> 
> > On Sep 18, 2016, at 6:43 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
> >  wrote:
> > 
> > I would also be curious about comparing to Delo full synthetic which is 
> > what I have been using in the 606
> > 
> > Sent from my iPhone
> > 
> >> On Sep 18, 2016, at 8:23 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
> >>  wrote:
> >> 
> >> Larry,
> >> 
> >> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic 
> >> compares to M1?   I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if the 
> >> performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the Merkun 
> >> engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called synthetic, I 
> >> am not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.   My 616s get so few miles that 
> >> I leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.
> >> 
> >> uhOh!  Nuther oel thread
> >> 
> >> ___
> >> http://www.okiebenz.com
> >> 
> >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >> 
> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >> 
> > 
> > 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[clay via Mercedes]

I had the oil debate over Polei.  I figured that all the extra pennies for full 
synth would not be economical in the SDL, and standard diesel oil would be 
fine.  The 20-50 is like hen’s teeth now.  FLAPS guy said the call for 
something that thick is waning.  Used only in diesels.  My response was of the 
DUH! sort, as I was purchasing Diesel oil at the time and wanted to know if the 
20-40 was going to be good enough

clay


> On Sep 18, 2016, at 6:43 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> I would also be curious about comparing to Delo full synthetic which is what 
> I have been using in the 606
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Sep 18, 2016, at 8:23 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Larry,
>> 
>> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic 
>> compares to M1?   I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if the 
>> performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the Merkun 
>> engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called synthetic, I am 
>> not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.   My 616s get so few miles that I 
>> leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.
>> 
>> uhOh!  Nuther oel thread
>> 
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> 
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>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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> 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

Hmm, my beloved 0W40 got thinner and less TBN:

http://www.gtrlife.com/forums/topic/177466-new-formulation-mobil-1-fs-0w-40-oil-does-not-meet-gt-r-specifications/

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4028326/Mobil_1_M1_0W-40_%22FS%22#Post4028326

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3001485/1

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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

> On September 18, 2016 at 9:43 PM "Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes"
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> I would also be curious about comparing to Delo full synthetic which is what I
> have been using in the 606
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> > On Sep 18, 2016, at 8:23 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes
> >  wrote:
> > 
> > Larry,
> > 
> > do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic
> > compares to M1?   I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if the
> > performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the Merkun
> > engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called synthetic, I am
> > not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.   My 616s get so few miles that I
> > leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.
> > 
> > uhOh!  Nuther oel thread
> > 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

Wow, look what I just found from several years ago:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat=1305596

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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

I would also be curious about comparing to Delo full synthetic which is what I 
have been using in the 606

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 18, 2016, at 8:23 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Larry,
> 
> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic compares 
> to M1?   I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if the performance 
> is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the Merkun engines, but 
> after the bad experience with castrol so-called synthetic, I am not sure I 
> want to try  it in an OM603.   My 616s get so few miles that I leave them  on 
> Mobil Dino oil.
> 
> uhOh!  Nuther oel thread
> 
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Re: [MBZ] Q for Larry

[Dwight Giles via Mercedes]

I love oil threads. Larry can I still send an oil sample using that test
kit I got from you?

Dwight Giles Jr.
1982 300CD
1990 300D
Wickford RI

On Sep 18, 2016 9:23 PM, "Curley McLain via Mercedes" 
wrote:

> Larry,
>
> do you have any info or insight on how the valvoline full synthretic
> compares to M1?   I am curious if the base stocks are similar, and if the
> performance is similar.  I think I will use the Valvoline in the Merkun
> engines, but after the bad experience with castrol so-called synthetic, I
> am not sure I want to try  it in an OM603.   My 616s get so few miles that
> I leave them  on Mobil Dino oil.
>
> uhOh!  Nuther oel thread
>
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>
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