Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Fire, smoke, dust, clouds, plus you can advect particles with the fluids simulation :) No noncompressible fluids ie. water and similar stuff. Morten Den 23. maj 2014 kl. 19:49 skrev Sebastien Sterling : > is EmFluids also a fluids solver or more of a fire and smoke tool ? > > > On 23 May 2014 18:29, Matt Lind < ml...@carbinestudios.com > <mailto:ml...@carbinestudios.com> > wrote: > > > > > > Matt > > > > > > -Original Message- > > From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com > > <mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com> [mailto: > > softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com > > <mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com> ] On Behalf Of Luc-Eric > > Rousseau > > Sent: Friday, May 23, 2014 7:54 AM > > To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com > > <mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com> > > Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) > > Fluid was missing from that list IMHO.. and it's not something we have in > > Softimage. > > > > On Fri, May 23, 2014 at 10:11 AM, Leendert A. Hartog < hirazib...@live.nl > > <mailto:hirazib...@live.nl> > wrote: > > > Oh, I understand fully you can't compare without something to compare > > with. > > > ;) > > > My interpretation of many of the posts in this thread is that people > > > understandably still primarily compare it to Softimage. My question > > > was where its place was in this "post-Softimage" world. > > > Which is a tough (maybe even a silly?) question, I understand that. > > > But several posts have answered my question fully... > > > > > > Greetz > > > Leendert
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Well although not a factory functionality Mootzoids emFluid5 is excellent for doing fluids (gaseous) in Softimage. MB Den 23. maj 2014 kl. 16:53 skrev Luc-Eric Rousseau : > Fluid was missing from that list IMHO.. and it's not something we have > in Softimage. > > On Fri, May 23, 2014 at 10:11 AM, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > > Oh, I understand fully you can't compare without something to compare with. > > ;) > > My interpretation of many of the posts in this thread is that people > > understandably still primarily compare it to Softimage. My question was > > where its place was in this "post-Softimage" world. > > Which is a tough (maybe even a silly?) question, I understand that. > > But several posts have answered my question fully... > > > > Greetz > > Leendert
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
> On May 22, 2014, at 2:25 PM, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: If I had a nickel for questions starting with... "In Maya, can you..." The answer is always yes. Getting to that "yes" more often than not is really painful. Yes!!! Perfectly stated, Lu.
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Back to Maya's actual strengths; it does have a grease pencil tool for animation...I know that it sounds like a minor deal, but it is a huge help for animators. Hopefully Softimage will get a third party solution soon ;) -- -=T=-
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Thanks for the explanation... -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
RE: Maya strengts (anyone?)
It's just one of many ways one can decide to deal with ABI when they develop an API. I don't think the answer could be that simple, and it's a silly and long standing "legacy" of Maya. I'm sure it can be explained, it's hard to excuse it in modern days though. On 26 May 2014 06:46, "Leendert A. Hartog" wrote: > Is there a "simple" reason for this constant breaking of compatibility? > > ---------- > Date: Mon, 26 May 2014 06:33:14 +1000 > Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) > From: raffsxsil...@googlemail.com > To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com > > Maya breaks binary compatibility every major release. In layman terms you > have to recompile against each version when it comes out. > On 25 May 2014 20:50, "Leendert A. Hartog" wrote: > > As these NG skin tools do not yet seem to be available for Maya 2015, I > wonder, > why Maya plugins apparently do have to recompiled for every version, > while I am still running a commercial plugin for Softimage that was > created for XSI 5? > It would be nice, if someone could explain this in a few words (and > preferably gently). > Wouldn't qualify as a strength I'd say... > > Greetz > Leendert > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Absolutely no love. Just quasi functionality... A bit like communist architecture. On Sun, May 25, 2014 at 10:46 PM, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > Is there a "simple" reason for this constant breaking of compatibility? > > -- > Date: Mon, 26 May 2014 06:33:14 +1000 > > Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) > From: raffsxsil...@googlemail.com > To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com > > > Maya breaks binary compatibility every major release. In layman terms you > have to recompile against each version when it comes out. > On 25 May 2014 20:50, "Leendert A. Hartog" wrote: > > As these NG skin tools do not yet seem to be available for Maya 2015, I > wonder, > why Maya plugins apparently do have to recompiled for every version, > while I am still running a commercial plugin for Softimage that was > created for XSI 5? > It would be nice, if someone could explain this in a few words (and > preferably gently). > Wouldn't qualify as a strength I'd say... > > Greetz > Leendert > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > >
RE: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Is there a "simple" reason for this constant breaking of compatibility? Date: Mon, 26 May 2014 06:33:14 +1000 Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) From: raffsxsil...@googlemail.com To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com Maya breaks binary compatibility every major release. In layman terms you have to recompile against each version when it comes out. On 25 May 2014 20:50, "Leendert A. Hartog" wrote: As these NG skin tools do not yet seem to be available for Maya 2015, I wonder, why Maya plugins apparently do have to recompiled for every version, while I am still running a commercial plugin for Softimage that was created for XSI 5? It would be nice, if someone could explain this in a few words (and preferably gently). Wouldn't qualify as a strength I'd say... Greetz Leendert -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Maya breaks binary compatibility every major release. In layman terms you have to recompile against each version when it comes out. On 25 May 2014 20:50, "Leendert A. Hartog" wrote: > As these NG skin tools do not yet seem to be available for Maya 2015, I > wonder, > why Maya plugins apparently do have to recompiled for every version, > while I am still running a commercial plugin for Softimage that was > created for XSI 5? > It would be nice, if someone could explain this in a few words (and > preferably gently). > Wouldn't qualify as a strength I'd say... > > Greetz > Leendert > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
plugin longevity, wouldn't count as a strength ?! pardon the flames, but that is pretty good. On 25 May 2014 11:50, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > As these NG skin tools do not yet seem to be available for Maya 2015, I > wonder, > why Maya plugins apparently do have to recompiled for every version, > while I am still running a commercial plugin for Softimage that was > created for XSI 5? > It would be nice, if someone could explain this in a few words (and > preferably gently). > Wouldn't qualify as a strength I'd say... > > > Greetz > Leendert > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
As these NG skin tools do not yet seem to be available for Maya 2015, I wonder, why Maya plugins apparently do have to recompiled for every version, while I am still running a commercial plugin for Softimage that was created for XSI 5? It would be nice, if someone could explain this in a few words (and preferably gently). Wouldn't qualify as a strength I'd say... Greetz Leendert -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Cheers Raff, was not aware of that plugin, that may become useful in the future. :) On 25 May 2014 06:07, Raffaele Fragapane wrote: > For the record, unless you baked your own set of tools, NG skin tools are > sort of a must and quite popular and we'll maintained. > The out of the box experience is nothing short of atrocious. > > There are fundamental issues that need a considerable change or addition > to data sets and editor UIs to get anywhere within a mile of Soft, and no > amount of polish will deturd the default one, but NG beings it from > masochism to somewhat bearable for those who can't write their way out of > the bog. > On 24 May 2014 04:42, "Sebastien Sterling" > wrote: > >> Skinning, my god fix the skinning ! it's not reasonable to have to >> manually tick which bones you want or don't want to work on. >> >> >> On 23 May 2014 19:23, Mario Reitbauer wrote: >> >>> Luc you are still at AD right ? >>> >>> Would love to have an honest answer on that one. Is there any chance to >>> get workflow improvement features actually beeing added into maya in a >>> reasonable time if we report them ? >>> Simple stuff: >>> Flip muscle capsule (if you create your capsules out of a skinned mesh >>> you gonna need that, no idea why it's not there) >>> child- and constraint compensation >>> viewport selection update (this is were maya rly feels clunky, when it >>> comes to just selecting objects or components, if ur interested i would >>> love to tell you why, but i guess you know) >>> working with sets (remove object from set is only possible through >>> diving into that hierachy in a graph ?) >>> >>> This and more are the things which drive me nuts. It's just the small >>> things, not even features. >>> >>> So as long as artists are forced to write scripts for every single task >>> (visibility toggle on a hotkey anyone ? who uses 2 different hotkeys for >>> hiding and showing objects ?) I can't think of too many things which would >>> make maya beeing faster in actual production. >>> >>> >>> 2014-05-23 19:49 GMT+02:00 Sebastien Sterling < >>> sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com>: >>> >>> is EmFluids also a fluids solver or more of a fire and smoke tool ? >>>> >>>> >>>> On 23 May 2014 18:29, Matt Lind wrote: >>>> >>>>> Doesn't softimage have Lagoa fluids? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Matt >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -Original Message- >>>>> From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto: >>>>> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Luc-Eric >>>>> Rousseau >>>>> Sent: Friday, May 23, 2014 7:54 AM >>>>> To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com >>>>> Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) >>>>> >>>>> Fluid was missing from that list IMHO.. and it's not something we have >>>>> in Softimage. >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, May 23, 2014 at 10:11 AM, Leendert A. Hartog < >>>>> hirazib...@live.nl> wrote: >>>>> > Oh, I understand fully you can't compare without something to >>>>> compare with. >>>>> > ;) >>>>> > My interpretation of many of the posts in this thread is that people >>>>> > understandably still primarily compare it to Softimage. My question >>>>> > was where its place was in this "post-Softimage" world. >>>>> > Which is a tough (maybe even a silly?) question, I understand that. >>>>> > But several posts have answered my question fully... >>>>> > >>>>> > Greetz >>>>> > Leendert >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >>
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
For the record, unless you baked your own set of tools, NG skin tools are sort of a must and quite popular and we'll maintained. The out of the box experience is nothing short of atrocious. There are fundamental issues that need a considerable change or addition to data sets and editor UIs to get anywhere within a mile of Soft, and no amount of polish will deturd the default one, but NG beings it from masochism to somewhat bearable for those who can't write their way out of the bog. On 24 May 2014 04:42, "Sebastien Sterling" wrote: > Skinning, my god fix the skinning ! it's not reasonable to have to > manually tick which bones you want or don't want to work on. > > > On 23 May 2014 19:23, Mario Reitbauer wrote: > >> Luc you are still at AD right ? >> >> Would love to have an honest answer on that one. Is there any chance to >> get workflow improvement features actually beeing added into maya in a >> reasonable time if we report them ? >> Simple stuff: >> Flip muscle capsule (if you create your capsules out of a skinned mesh >> you gonna need that, no idea why it's not there) >> child- and constraint compensation >> viewport selection update (this is were maya rly feels clunky, when it >> comes to just selecting objects or components, if ur interested i would >> love to tell you why, but i guess you know) >> working with sets (remove object from set is only possible through diving >> into that hierachy in a graph ?) >> >> This and more are the things which drive me nuts. It's just the small >> things, not even features. >> >> So as long as artists are forced to write scripts for every single task >> (visibility toggle on a hotkey anyone ? who uses 2 different hotkeys for >> hiding and showing objects ?) I can't think of too many things which would >> make maya beeing faster in actual production. >> >> >> 2014-05-23 19:49 GMT+02:00 Sebastien Sterling < >> sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com>: >> >> is EmFluids also a fluids solver or more of a fire and smoke tool ? >>> >>> >>> On 23 May 2014 18:29, Matt Lind wrote: >>> >>>> Doesn't softimage have Lagoa fluids? >>>> >>>> >>>> Matt >>>> >>>> >>>> -Original Message- >>>> From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto: >>>> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Luc-Eric Rousseau >>>> Sent: Friday, May 23, 2014 7:54 AM >>>> To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com >>>> Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) >>>> >>>> Fluid was missing from that list IMHO.. and it's not something we have >>>> in Softimage. >>>> >>>> On Fri, May 23, 2014 at 10:11 AM, Leendert A. Hartog < >>>> hirazib...@live.nl> wrote: >>>> > Oh, I understand fully you can't compare without something to compare >>>> with. >>>> > ;) >>>> > My interpretation of many of the posts in this thread is that people >>>> > understandably still primarily compare it to Softimage. My question >>>> > was where its place was in this "post-Softimage" world. >>>> > Which is a tough (maybe even a silly?) question, I understand that. >>>> > But several posts have answered my question fully... >>>> > >>>> > Greetz >>>> > Leendert >>>> >>>> >>> >> >
RE: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Hello Mario, It would be foolish of me to promise that everything you report is going to get fixed in the timeframe you’d like, but we are looking at addressing some of your common obstacles, and especially the ones that would benefit all Maya users. Feel free to post your top issues to the Area Softimage Transition forum here: http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/Softimage-Workflow-Feature/bd-p/softimageworkflow. Constraint compensation – this came up somewhere else and I think it already exists: check ‘Maintain Offset’ in the Constraint dialog. Thanks, Jill (and yes Luc-Eric is thankfully still at AD and working on the Maya team.) From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Mario Reitbauer Sent: May-23-14 2:23 PM To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) Luc you are still at AD right ? Would love to have an honest answer on that one. Is there any chance to get workflow improvement features actually beeing added into maya in a reasonable time if we report them ? Simple stuff: Flip muscle capsule (if you create your capsules out of a skinned mesh you gonna need that, no idea why it's not there) child- and constraint compensation viewport selection update (this is were maya rly feels clunky, when it comes to just selecting objects or components, if ur interested i would love to tell you why, but i guess you know) working with sets (remove object from set is only possible through diving into that hierachy in a graph ?) This and more are the things which drive me nuts. It's just the small things, not even features. So as long as artists are forced to write scripts for every single task (visibility toggle on a hotkey anyone ? who uses 2 different hotkeys for hiding and showing objects ?) I can't think of too many things which would make maya beeing faster in actual production. <>
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
On Fri, May 23, 2014 at 1:29 PM, Matt Lind wrote: >> Fluid was missing from that list IMHO.. and it's not something we have in >> Softimage. > Doesn't softimage have Lagoa fluids? Lagoa fluid ICE particles-based, correct? maya has 2d and 3d grid-based and voxel-based fluids with the new Bifrost solvers, and good viewport visualization of them, grids caching, etc. Different results/workflows/etc.
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
+100. Maya has the WORST skinning system I've used in any application, bar none. It's a horrible nightmare to work with it. Sergio Muciño. Sent from my iPad. > On May 23, 2014, at 2:41 PM, Sebastien Sterling > wrote: > > Skinning, my god fix the skinning ! it's not reasonable to have to manually > tick which bones you want or don't want to work on. > > >> On 23 May 2014 19:23, Mario Reitbauer wrote: >> Luc you are still at AD right ? >> >> Would love to have an honest answer on that one. Is there any chance to get >> workflow improvement features actually beeing added into maya in a >> reasonable time if we report them ? >> Simple stuff: >> Flip muscle capsule (if you create your capsules out of a skinned mesh you >> gonna need that, no idea why it's not there) >> child- and constraint compensation >> viewport selection update (this is were maya rly feels clunky, when it comes >> to just selecting objects or components, if ur interested i would love to >> tell you why, but i guess you know) >> working with sets (remove object from set is only possible through diving >> into that hierachy in a graph ?) >> >> This and more are the things which drive me nuts. It's just the small >> things, not even features. >> >> So as long as artists are forced to write scripts for every single task >> (visibility toggle on a hotkey anyone ? who uses 2 different hotkeys for >> hiding and showing objects ?) I can't think of too many things which would >> make maya beeing faster in actual production. >> >> >> 2014-05-23 19:49 GMT+02:00 Sebastien Sterling : >> >>> is EmFluids also a fluids solver or more of a fire and smoke tool ? >>> >>> >>>> On 23 May 2014 18:29, Matt Lind wrote: >>>> Doesn't softimage have Lagoa fluids? >>>> >>>> >>>> Matt >>>> >>>> >>>> -Original Message- >>>> From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com >>>> [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Luc-Eric >>>> Rousseau >>>> Sent: Friday, May 23, 2014 7:54 AM >>>> To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com >>>> Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) >>>> >>>> Fluid was missing from that list IMHO.. and it's not something we have in >>>> Softimage. >>>> >>>> On Fri, May 23, 2014 at 10:11 AM, Leendert A. Hartog >>>> wrote: >>>> > Oh, I understand fully you can't compare without something to compare >>>> > with. >>>> > ;) >>>> > My interpretation of many of the posts in this thread is that people >>>> > understandably still primarily compare it to Softimage. My question >>>> > was where its place was in this "post-Softimage" world. >>>> > Which is a tough (maybe even a silly?) question, I understand that. >>>> > But several posts have answered my question fully... >>>> > >>>> > Greetz >>>> > Leendert >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Skinning, my god fix the skinning ! it's not reasonable to have to manually tick which bones you want or don't want to work on. On 23 May 2014 19:23, Mario Reitbauer wrote: > Luc you are still at AD right ? > > Would love to have an honest answer on that one. Is there any chance to > get workflow improvement features actually beeing added into maya in a > reasonable time if we report them ? > Simple stuff: > Flip muscle capsule (if you create your capsules out of a skinned mesh you > gonna need that, no idea why it's not there) > child- and constraint compensation > viewport selection update (this is were maya rly feels clunky, when it > comes to just selecting objects or components, if ur interested i would > love to tell you why, but i guess you know) > working with sets (remove object from set is only possible through diving > into that hierachy in a graph ?) > > This and more are the things which drive me nuts. It's just the small > things, not even features. > > So as long as artists are forced to write scripts for every single task > (visibility toggle on a hotkey anyone ? who uses 2 different hotkeys for > hiding and showing objects ?) I can't think of too many things which would > make maya beeing faster in actual production. > > > 2014-05-23 19:49 GMT+02:00 Sebastien Sterling < > sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com>: > > is EmFluids also a fluids solver or more of a fire and smoke tool ? >> >> >> On 23 May 2014 18:29, Matt Lind wrote: >> >>> Doesn't softimage have Lagoa fluids? >>> >>> >>> Matt >>> >>> >>> -Original Message- >>> From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto: >>> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Luc-Eric Rousseau >>> Sent: Friday, May 23, 2014 7:54 AM >>> To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com >>> Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) >>> >>> Fluid was missing from that list IMHO.. and it's not something we have >>> in Softimage. >>> >>> On Fri, May 23, 2014 at 10:11 AM, Leendert A. Hartog >>> wrote: >>> > Oh, I understand fully you can't compare without something to compare >>> with. >>> > ;) >>> > My interpretation of many of the posts in this thread is that people >>> > understandably still primarily compare it to Softimage. My question >>> > was where its place was in this "post-Softimage" world. >>> > Which is a tough (maybe even a silly?) question, I understand that. >>> > But several posts have answered my question fully... >>> > >>> > Greetz >>> > Leendert >>> >>> >> >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Luc you are still at AD right ? Would love to have an honest answer on that one. Is there any chance to get workflow improvement features actually beeing added into maya in a reasonable time if we report them ? Simple stuff: Flip muscle capsule (if you create your capsules out of a skinned mesh you gonna need that, no idea why it's not there) child- and constraint compensation viewport selection update (this is were maya rly feels clunky, when it comes to just selecting objects or components, if ur interested i would love to tell you why, but i guess you know) working with sets (remove object from set is only possible through diving into that hierachy in a graph ?) This and more are the things which drive me nuts. It's just the small things, not even features. So as long as artists are forced to write scripts for every single task (visibility toggle on a hotkey anyone ? who uses 2 different hotkeys for hiding and showing objects ?) I can't think of too many things which would make maya beeing faster in actual production. 2014-05-23 19:49 GMT+02:00 Sebastien Sterling : > is EmFluids also a fluids solver or more of a fire and smoke tool ? > > > On 23 May 2014 18:29, Matt Lind wrote: > >> Doesn't softimage have Lagoa fluids? >> >> >> Matt >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto: >> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Luc-Eric Rousseau >> Sent: Friday, May 23, 2014 7:54 AM >> To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com >> Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) >> >> Fluid was missing from that list IMHO.. and it's not something we have in >> Softimage. >> >> On Fri, May 23, 2014 at 10:11 AM, Leendert A. Hartog >> wrote: >> > Oh, I understand fully you can't compare without something to compare >> with. >> > ;) >> > My interpretation of many of the posts in this thread is that people >> > understandably still primarily compare it to Softimage. My question >> > was where its place was in this "post-Softimage" world. >> > Which is a tough (maybe even a silly?) question, I understand that. >> > But several posts have answered my question fully... >> > >> > Greetz >> > Leendert >> >> >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
is EmFluids also a fluids solver or more of a fire and smoke tool ? On 23 May 2014 18:29, Matt Lind wrote: > Doesn't softimage have Lagoa fluids? > > > Matt > > > -Original Message- > From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto: > softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Luc-Eric Rousseau > Sent: Friday, May 23, 2014 7:54 AM > To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com > Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) > > Fluid was missing from that list IMHO.. and it's not something we have in > Softimage. > > On Fri, May 23, 2014 at 10:11 AM, Leendert A. Hartog > wrote: > > Oh, I understand fully you can't compare without something to compare > with. > > ;) > > My interpretation of many of the posts in this thread is that people > > understandably still primarily compare it to Softimage. My question > > was where its place was in this "post-Softimage" world. > > Which is a tough (maybe even a silly?) question, I understand that. > > But several posts have answered my question fully... > > > > Greetz > > Leendert > >
RE: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Doesn't softimage have Lagoa fluids? Matt -Original Message- From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Luc-Eric Rousseau Sent: Friday, May 23, 2014 7:54 AM To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) Fluid was missing from that list IMHO.. and it's not something we have in Softimage. On Fri, May 23, 2014 at 10:11 AM, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > Oh, I understand fully you can't compare without something to compare with. > ;) > My interpretation of many of the posts in this thread is that people > understandably still primarily compare it to Softimage. My question > was where its place was in this "post-Softimage" world. > Which is a tough (maybe even a silly?) question, I understand that. > But several posts have answered my question fully... > > Greetz > Leendert
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Fluid was missing from that list IMHO.. and it's not something we have in Softimage. On Fri, May 23, 2014 at 10:11 AM, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > Oh, I understand fully you can't compare without something to compare with. > ;) > My interpretation of many of the posts in this thread is that people > understandably still primarily compare it to Softimage. My question was > where its place was in this "post-Softimage" world. > Which is a tough (maybe even a silly?) question, I understand that. > But several posts have answered my question fully... > > Greetz > Leendert
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Oh, I understand fully you can't compare without something to compare with. ;) My interpretation of many of the posts in this thread is that people understandably still primarily compare it to Softimage. My question was where its place was in this "post-Softimage" world. Which is a tough (maybe even a silly?) question, I understand that. But several posts have answered my question fully... Greetz Leendert -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
"I just wanted to find out what Maya's strengths were in this new post-Softimage world." You must understand that you can't very well depict an apps strengths without comparing it to its peers, past and present. Bottom line is that maya out of the box doesn't have any massive strengths that would make it a nobrainner decision to use. It's biggest asset is that it is the industry standard. And as previously mentioned, where other apps are way better in some areas, it at least gives you access to all areas in production. As an in house artist with TD's and Dev's on hand, it is functional As an independent user, it is an uphill struggle. Only time will tell if this trend is to be broken. On 23 May 2014 14:31, Andi Farhall wrote: > > thanks for that, when I can no longer pay my rent because of this can I > camp in your massive garden? > ... > http://www.hackneyeffects.com/ > https://vimeo.com/user4174293 > http://www.linkedin.com/pub/andi-farhall/b/496/b21 > > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/lord_hackney/ > http://spylon.tumblr.com/ > > This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are intended > solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed. Any views or > opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily > represent those of Hackney Effects Ltd. > > If you are not the intended recipient of this email, you must neither take > any action based upon its contents, nor copy or show it to anyone. > > Please contact the sender if you believe you have received this email in > error. > -------- > > > -- > Date: Fri, 23 May 2014 12:41:47 +0100 > > Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) > From: winder.t...@googlemail.com > To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com > > > Well from a companies point of view. > > There are MANY MANY times more high quality artists to employ, > which means no problems finding people, and the artists probably drive > down their own prices. > Ive worked at xsi places where they just couldn't find a freelancer at all > - because any good ones were permanent at other shops. > > At the moment this is never a a problem with Maya > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:46 PM, Emilio Hernandez wrote: > > Maybe we can submit tickets to AD... > > --- > Emilio Hernández VFX & 3D animation. > > > 2014-05-22 13:44 GMT-05:00 Sebastien Sterling < > sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com>: > > I think i mentioned before that if you have ten TD's waiting on you of > course, i assume the experience becomes a lot more fun. but most places > even medium businesses will not have that kind of work force. > > > > > On 22 May 2014 19:25, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: > > If I were a modeler, animator, or lighter, AND I was absolved of all TD > responsibilities, I would absolutely love Maya. This is the vast majority > of the artist experience. It is being in an established shop with tools > already in place to get your work done or a team of TDs to make said tools. > I'm surrounded by happy animators, modelers, and lighters. If they hit a > problem, they just submit a ticket and a magic email appears asking them to > restart Maya to receive the new goodies. > > For non-departmentalized facilities where one artist need to wear all hats > and FX artists, the Maya experience is a completely different one. > > Maya is the application I have the deepest knowledge in, but even with a > medium to shallow working knowledge in Softimage or Houdini, I find myself > being more productive over time in those application as a generalist/TD > than in Maya alone. > > If I had a nickel for questions starting with... "In Maya, can you..." > The answer is always yes. Getting to that "yes" more often than not is > really painful. > > -Lu > > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 10:31 AM, Sebastien Sterling < > sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Lol Lu > > It's amazing for this, this, this it sucks :) > > I believe qualoth has been discontinued. yes next person to offer a > feature rich cloth solution will be a rich man/woman, may the Fabric enginz > be with him. > > > On 22 May 2014 18:18, Halim Negadi wrote: > > +6 Lu > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:11 PM, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: > > I think the only failure of the node architecture was that it wasn't meant > to be used by artists. Had they had that in consideration, we would've had > something like ICE or close to
RE: Maya strengts (anyone?)
thanks for that, when I can no longer pay my rent because of this can I camp in your massive garden? ... http://www.hackneyeffects.com/https://vimeo.com/user4174293http://www.linkedin.com/pub/andi-farhall/b/496/b21 http://www.flickr.com/photos/lord_hackney/ http://spylon.tumblr.com/ This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are intended solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed. Any views or opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Hackney Effects Ltd.If you are not the intended recipient of this email, you must neither take any action based upon its contents, nor copy or show it to anyone.Please contact the sender if you believe you have received this email in error. Date: Fri, 23 May 2014 12:41:47 +0100 Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) From: winder.t...@googlemail.com To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com Well from a companies point of view. There are MANY MANY times more high quality artists to employ, which means no problems finding people, and the artists probably drive down their own prices. Ive worked at xsi places where they just couldn't find a freelancer at all - because any good ones were permanent at other shops. At the moment this is never a a problem with Maya On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:46 PM, Emilio Hernandez wrote: Maybe we can submit tickets to AD... --- Emilio Hernández VFX & 3D animation. 2014-05-22 13:44 GMT-05:00 Sebastien Sterling : I think i mentioned before that if you have ten TD's waiting on you of course, i assume the experience becomes a lot more fun. but most places even medium businesses will not have that kind of work force. On 22 May 2014 19:25, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: If I were a modeler, animator, or lighter, AND I was absolved of all TD responsibilities, I would absolutely love Maya. This is the vast majority of the artist experience. It is being in an established shop with tools already in place to get your work done or a team of TDs to make said tools. I'm surrounded by happy animators, modelers, and lighters. If they hit a problem, they just submit a ticket and a magic email appears asking them to restart Maya to receive the new goodies. For non-departmentalized facilities where one artist need to wear all hats and FX artists, the Maya experience is a completely different one. Maya is the application I have the deepest knowledge in, but even with a medium to shallow working knowledge in Softimage or Houdini, I find myself being more productive over time in those application as a generalist/TD than in Maya alone. If I had a nickel for questions starting with... "In Maya, can you..." The answer is always yes. Getting to that "yes" more often than not is really painful. -Lu On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 10:31 AM, Sebastien Sterling wrote: Lol Lu It's amazing for this, this, this it sucks :) I believe qualoth has been discontinued. yes next person to offer a feature rich cloth solution will be a rich man/woman, may the Fabric enginz be with him. On 22 May 2014 18:18, Halim Negadi wrote: +6 Lu On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:11 PM, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: I think the only failure of the node architecture was that it wasn't meant to be used by artists. Had they had that in consideration, we would've had something like ICE or close to it ages ago. There are still some cool thing you can do in the Hypershade today, but it's unwieldy compared to applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by artists. Maya strengths are still it's quick interactive ability to build stuff and animate. Since this is an XSI list, we've all had a taste of what animation could be due to some really nice "quality of life" features. However, XSI never in the time I've done 3D ever caught up in terms of animation performance. It is still king of interactive performance at the cost of shoddy user experience. Before, Maya was the do-it-all tookit and still can be today. And a lot of the early technology that went into the Maya side were far better implemented than in any other package. The strength was indeed ubiquity, and it was attractive to plug-in developers alongside 3DS max. Shave had more functionality in Maya before it was integrated into XSI. Syflex had more functionality in Maya than the XSI integration too. nCloth is still used in both conventional and unconventional ways because every other out of box cloth solver just isn't good. We still rely on nCloth heavily and it's second only to something like Qualoft. nCloth is definitely a strength to leverage. Also,
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Oh, and before everyone misunderstands my previous post: it was meant as a slightly "tongue in cheek" remark. -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
As a conclusion to my original question: to most it seems the wounds are still a bit too fresh. ;) But then I didn't want to compare Maya to Softimage, I just wanted to find out what Maya's strengths were in this new post-Softimage world. Greetz Leendert -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
yep, makes sense ha? :) On Fri, May 23, 2014 at 2:26 PM, Sebastien Sterling < sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: > so dumping all the xsi artist into a maya majority industry insures 1) > that the market is even more saturated 2) that having to start from scratch > X'xsi artists are at a crushing disadvantage 3) due to saturation we all > get payed like cashiers at a supermarket ? > > > On 23 May 2014 12:41, Toby Winder wrote: > >> Well from a companies point of view. >> >> There are MANY MANY times more high quality artists to employ, >> which means no problems finding people, and the artists probably drive >> down their own prices. >> Ive worked at xsi places where they just couldn't find a freelancer at >> all - because any good ones were permanent at other shops. >> >> At the moment this is never a a problem with Maya >> >> >> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:46 PM, Emilio Hernandez wrote: >> >>> Maybe we can submit tickets to AD... >>> >>> --- >>> Emilio Hernández VFX & 3D animation. >>> >>> >>> 2014-05-22 13:44 GMT-05:00 Sebastien Sterling < >>> sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com>: >>> >>> I think i mentioned before that if you have ten TD's waiting on you of course, i assume the experience becomes a lot more fun. but most places even medium businesses will not have that kind of work force. On 22 May 2014 19:25, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: > If I were a modeler, animator, or lighter, AND I was absolved of all > TD responsibilities, I would absolutely love Maya. This is the vast > majority of the artist experience. It is being in an established shop > with > tools already in place to get your work done or a team of TDs to make said > tools. I'm surrounded by happy animators, modelers, and lighters. If they > hit a problem, they just submit a ticket and a magic email appears asking > them to restart Maya to receive the new goodies. > > For non-departmentalized facilities where one artist need to wear all > hats and FX artists, the Maya experience is a completely different one. > > Maya is the application I have the deepest knowledge in, but even with > a medium to shallow working knowledge in Softimage or Houdini, I find > myself being more productive over time in those application as a > generalist/TD than in Maya alone. > > If I had a nickel for questions starting with... "In Maya, can you..." > The answer is always yes. Getting to that "yes" more often than not is > really painful. > > -Lu > > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 10:31 AM, Sebastien Sterling < > sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Lol Lu >> >> It's amazing for this, this, this it sucks :) >> >> I believe qualoth has been discontinued. yes next person to offer a >> feature rich cloth solution will be a rich man/woman, may the Fabric >> enginz >> be with him. >> >> >> On 22 May 2014 18:18, Halim Negadi wrote: >> >>> +6 Lu >>> >>> >>> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:11 PM, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: >>> I think the only failure of the node architecture was that it wasn't meant to be used by artists. Had they had that in consideration, we would've had something like ICE or close to it ages ago. There are still some cool thing you can do in the Hypershade today, but it's unwieldy compared to applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by artists. Maya strengths are still it's quick interactive ability to build stuff and animate. Since this is an XSI list, we've all had a taste of what animation could be due to some really nice "quality of life" features. However, XSI never in the time I've done 3D ever caught up in terms of animation performance. It is still king of interactive performance at the cost of shoddy user experience. Before, Maya was the do-it-all tookit and still can be today. And a lot of the early technology that went into the Maya side were far better implemented than in any other package. The strength was indeed ubiquity, and it was attractive to plug-in developers alongside 3DS max. Shave had more functionality in Maya before it was integrated into XSI. Syflex had more functionality in Maya than the XSI integration too. nCloth is still used in both conventional and unconventional ways because every other out of box cloth solver just isn't good. We still rely on nCloth heavily and it's second only to something like Qualoft. nCloth is definitely a strength to leverage. Also, Maya + Window = new tec
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
so dumping all the xsi artist into a maya majority industry insures 1) that the market is even more saturated 2) that having to start from scratch X'xsi artists are at a crushing disadvantage 3) due to saturation we all get payed like cashiers at a supermarket ? On 23 May 2014 12:41, Toby Winder wrote: > Well from a companies point of view. > > There are MANY MANY times more high quality artists to employ, > which means no problems finding people, and the artists probably drive > down their own prices. > Ive worked at xsi places where they just couldn't find a freelancer at all > - because any good ones were permanent at other shops. > > At the moment this is never a a problem with Maya > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:46 PM, Emilio Hernandez wrote: > >> Maybe we can submit tickets to AD... >> >> --- >> Emilio Hernández VFX & 3D animation. >> >> >> 2014-05-22 13:44 GMT-05:00 Sebastien Sterling < >> sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com>: >> >> I think i mentioned before that if you have ten TD's waiting on you of >>> course, i assume the experience becomes a lot more fun. but most places >>> even medium businesses will not have that kind of work force. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On 22 May 2014 19:25, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: >>> If I were a modeler, animator, or lighter, AND I was absolved of all TD responsibilities, I would absolutely love Maya. This is the vast majority of the artist experience. It is being in an established shop with tools already in place to get your work done or a team of TDs to make said tools. I'm surrounded by happy animators, modelers, and lighters. If they hit a problem, they just submit a ticket and a magic email appears asking them to restart Maya to receive the new goodies. For non-departmentalized facilities where one artist need to wear all hats and FX artists, the Maya experience is a completely different one. Maya is the application I have the deepest knowledge in, but even with a medium to shallow working knowledge in Softimage or Houdini, I find myself being more productive over time in those application as a generalist/TD than in Maya alone. If I had a nickel for questions starting with... "In Maya, can you..." The answer is always yes. Getting to that "yes" more often than not is really painful. -Lu On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 10:31 AM, Sebastien Sterling < sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: > Lol Lu > > It's amazing for this, this, this it sucks :) > > I believe qualoth has been discontinued. yes next person to offer a > feature rich cloth solution will be a rich man/woman, may the Fabric > enginz > be with him. > > > On 22 May 2014 18:18, Halim Negadi wrote: > >> +6 Lu >> >> >> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:11 PM, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: >> >>> I think the only failure of the node architecture was that it wasn't >>> meant to be used by artists. Had they had that in consideration, we >>> would've had something like ICE or close to it ages ago. There are >>> still >>> some cool thing you can do in the Hypershade today, but it's unwieldy >>> compared to applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with >>> by >>> artists. >>> >>> Maya strengths are still it's quick interactive ability to build >>> stuff and animate. Since this is an XSI list, we've all had a taste of >>> what animation could be due to some really nice "quality of life" >>> features. >>> However, XSI never in the time I've done 3D ever caught up in terms of >>> animation performance. It is still king of interactive performance at >>> the >>> cost of shoddy user experience. >>> >>> Before, Maya was the do-it-all tookit and still can be today. And a >>> lot of the early technology that went into the Maya side were far better >>> implemented than in any other package. The strength was indeed >>> ubiquity, >>> and it was attractive to plug-in developers alongside 3DS max. Shave >>> had >>> more functionality in Maya before it was integrated into XSI. Syflex >>> had >>> more functionality in Maya than the XSI integration too. nCloth is >>> still >>> used in both conventional and unconventional ways because every other >>> out >>> of box cloth solver just isn't good. We still rely on nCloth heavily >>> and >>> it's second only to something like Qualoft. nCloth is definitely a >>> strength to leverage. >>> >>> Also, Maya + Window = new tech hotbed. Syflex, Shave, Comet >>> Muscles, and now FE/Splice. Anything that seems promising usually >>> begins >>> it's early stages as a plug-in for Maya. No guarantees that these >>> fledgling tools would be production worthy, but I'm the first t
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Well from a companies point of view. There are MANY MANY times more high quality artists to employ, which means no problems finding people, and the artists probably drive down their own prices. Ive worked at xsi places where they just couldn't find a freelancer at all - because any good ones were permanent at other shops. At the moment this is never a a problem with Maya On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:46 PM, Emilio Hernandez wrote: > Maybe we can submit tickets to AD... > > --- > Emilio Hernández VFX & 3D animation. > > > 2014-05-22 13:44 GMT-05:00 Sebastien Sterling < > sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com>: > > I think i mentioned before that if you have ten TD's waiting on you of >> course, i assume the experience becomes a lot more fun. but most places >> even medium businesses will not have that kind of work force. >> >> >> >> >> On 22 May 2014 19:25, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: >> >>> If I were a modeler, animator, or lighter, AND I was absolved of all TD >>> responsibilities, I would absolutely love Maya. This is the vast majority >>> of the artist experience. It is being in an established shop with tools >>> already in place to get your work done or a team of TDs to make said tools. >>> I'm surrounded by happy animators, modelers, and lighters. If they hit a >>> problem, they just submit a ticket and a magic email appears asking them to >>> restart Maya to receive the new goodies. >>> >>> For non-departmentalized facilities where one artist need to wear all >>> hats and FX artists, the Maya experience is a completely different one. >>> >>> Maya is the application I have the deepest knowledge in, but even with a >>> medium to shallow working knowledge in Softimage or Houdini, I find myself >>> being more productive over time in those application as a generalist/TD >>> than in Maya alone. >>> >>> If I had a nickel for questions starting with... "In Maya, can you..." >>> The answer is always yes. Getting to that "yes" more often than not is >>> really painful. >>> >>> -Lu >>> >>> >>> >>> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 10:31 AM, Sebastien Sterling < >>> sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> Lol Lu It's amazing for this, this, this it sucks :) I believe qualoth has been discontinued. yes next person to offer a feature rich cloth solution will be a rich man/woman, may the Fabric enginz be with him. On 22 May 2014 18:18, Halim Negadi wrote: > +6 Lu > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:11 PM, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: > >> I think the only failure of the node architecture was that it wasn't >> meant to be used by artists. Had they had that in consideration, we >> would've had something like ICE or close to it ages ago. There are still >> some cool thing you can do in the Hypershade today, but it's unwieldy >> compared to applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by >> artists. >> >> Maya strengths are still it's quick interactive ability to build >> stuff and animate. Since this is an XSI list, we've all had a taste of >> what animation could be due to some really nice "quality of life" >> features. >> However, XSI never in the time I've done 3D ever caught up in terms of >> animation performance. It is still king of interactive performance at >> the >> cost of shoddy user experience. >> >> Before, Maya was the do-it-all tookit and still can be today. And a >> lot of the early technology that went into the Maya side were far better >> implemented than in any other package. The strength was indeed ubiquity, >> and it was attractive to plug-in developers alongside 3DS max. Shave had >> more functionality in Maya before it was integrated into XSI. Syflex had >> more functionality in Maya than the XSI integration too. nCloth is still >> used in both conventional and unconventional ways because every other out >> of box cloth solver just isn't good. We still rely on nCloth heavily and >> it's second only to something like Qualoft. nCloth is definitely a >> strength to leverage. >> >> Also, Maya + Window = new tech hotbed. Syflex, Shave, Comet Muscles, >> and now FE/Splice. Anything that seems promising usually begins it's >> early >> stages as a plug-in for Maya. No guarantees that these fledgling tools >> would be production worthy, but I'm the first to admit I've grabbed a >> plug-in and blindly marched into production many times. >> >> Maya's other strength is it's large user base. If you want a CG army >> that puts ancient Persia to shame, go with Maya. You are almost >> guaranteed >> you'll find someone to fill an empty seat if your shop is a Maya one. >> And >> though that pool may not be as experienced or agile as artists in other >> packages, you definitely have the advantage of choice and can c
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Maybe we can submit tickets to AD... --- Emilio Hernández VFX & 3D animation. 2014-05-22 13:44 GMT-05:00 Sebastien Sterling : > I think i mentioned before that if you have ten TD's waiting on you of > course, i assume the experience becomes a lot more fun. but most places > even medium businesses will not have that kind of work force. > > > > > On 22 May 2014 19:25, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: > >> If I were a modeler, animator, or lighter, AND I was absolved of all TD >> responsibilities, I would absolutely love Maya. This is the vast majority >> of the artist experience. It is being in an established shop with tools >> already in place to get your work done or a team of TDs to make said tools. >> I'm surrounded by happy animators, modelers, and lighters. If they hit a >> problem, they just submit a ticket and a magic email appears asking them to >> restart Maya to receive the new goodies. >> >> For non-departmentalized facilities where one artist need to wear all >> hats and FX artists, the Maya experience is a completely different one. >> >> Maya is the application I have the deepest knowledge in, but even with a >> medium to shallow working knowledge in Softimage or Houdini, I find myself >> being more productive over time in those application as a generalist/TD >> than in Maya alone. >> >> If I had a nickel for questions starting with... "In Maya, can you..." >> The answer is always yes. Getting to that "yes" more often than not is >> really painful. >> >> -Lu >> >> >> >> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 10:31 AM, Sebastien Sterling < >> sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Lol Lu >>> >>> It's amazing for this, this, this it sucks :) >>> >>> I believe qualoth has been discontinued. yes next person to offer a >>> feature rich cloth solution will be a rich man/woman, may the Fabric enginz >>> be with him. >>> >>> >>> On 22 May 2014 18:18, Halim Negadi wrote: >>> +6 Lu On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:11 PM, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: > I think the only failure of the node architecture was that it wasn't > meant to be used by artists. Had they had that in consideration, we > would've had something like ICE or close to it ages ago. There are still > some cool thing you can do in the Hypershade today, but it's unwieldy > compared to applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by > artists. > > Maya strengths are still it's quick interactive ability to build stuff > and animate. Since this is an XSI list, we've all had a taste of what > animation could be due to some really nice "quality of life" features. > However, XSI never in the time I've done 3D ever caught up in terms of > animation performance. It is still king of interactive performance at the > cost of shoddy user experience. > > Before, Maya was the do-it-all tookit and still can be today. And a > lot of the early technology that went into the Maya side were far better > implemented than in any other package. The strength was indeed ubiquity, > and it was attractive to plug-in developers alongside 3DS max. Shave had > more functionality in Maya before it was integrated into XSI. Syflex had > more functionality in Maya than the XSI integration too. nCloth is still > used in both conventional and unconventional ways because every other out > of box cloth solver just isn't good. We still rely on nCloth heavily and > it's second only to something like Qualoft. nCloth is definitely a > strength to leverage. > > Also, Maya + Window = new tech hotbed. Syflex, Shave, Comet Muscles, > and now FE/Splice. Anything that seems promising usually begins it's > early > stages as a plug-in for Maya. No guarantees that these fledgling tools > would be production worthy, but I'm the first to admit I've grabbed a > plug-in and blindly marched into production many times. > > Maya's other strength is it's large user base. If you want a CG army > that puts ancient Persia to shame, go with Maya. You are almost > guaranteed > you'll find someone to fill an empty seat if your shop is a Maya one. And > though that pool may not be as experienced or agile as artists in other > packages, you definitely have the advantage of choice and can cherry-pick > to your hearts desire. To be fair, there are good Maya users out there > with their own Maya knick-knacks that can still put up good work. And to > that point, if you're a Maya user, you're almost never out of a job if > you're smarter than the average bear. > > I still don't like it. > > -Lu > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 9:26 AM, Sebastien Sterling < > sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> In fairness the architecture is admirable, i don't think anyone ever >> made a fully nodal DCC after maya, to bad so litt
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
I think i mentioned before that if you have ten TD's waiting on you of course, i assume the experience becomes a lot more fun. but most places even medium businesses will not have that kind of work force. On 22 May 2014 19:25, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: > If I were a modeler, animator, or lighter, AND I was absolved of all TD > responsibilities, I would absolutely love Maya. This is the vast majority > of the artist experience. It is being in an established shop with tools > already in place to get your work done or a team of TDs to make said tools. > I'm surrounded by happy animators, modelers, and lighters. If they hit a > problem, they just submit a ticket and a magic email appears asking them to > restart Maya to receive the new goodies. > > For non-departmentalized facilities where one artist need to wear all hats > and FX artists, the Maya experience is a completely different one. > > Maya is the application I have the deepest knowledge in, but even with a > medium to shallow working knowledge in Softimage or Houdini, I find myself > being more productive over time in those application as a generalist/TD > than in Maya alone. > > If I had a nickel for questions starting with... "In Maya, can you..." > The answer is always yes. Getting to that "yes" more often than not is > really painful. > > -Lu > > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 10:31 AM, Sebastien Sterling < > sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Lol Lu >> >> It's amazing for this, this, this it sucks :) >> >> I believe qualoth has been discontinued. yes next person to offer a >> feature rich cloth solution will be a rich man/woman, may the Fabric enginz >> be with him. >> >> >> On 22 May 2014 18:18, Halim Negadi wrote: >> >>> +6 Lu >>> >>> >>> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:11 PM, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: >>> I think the only failure of the node architecture was that it wasn't meant to be used by artists. Had they had that in consideration, we would've had something like ICE or close to it ages ago. There are still some cool thing you can do in the Hypershade today, but it's unwieldy compared to applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by artists. Maya strengths are still it's quick interactive ability to build stuff and animate. Since this is an XSI list, we've all had a taste of what animation could be due to some really nice "quality of life" features. However, XSI never in the time I've done 3D ever caught up in terms of animation performance. It is still king of interactive performance at the cost of shoddy user experience. Before, Maya was the do-it-all tookit and still can be today. And a lot of the early technology that went into the Maya side were far better implemented than in any other package. The strength was indeed ubiquity, and it was attractive to plug-in developers alongside 3DS max. Shave had more functionality in Maya before it was integrated into XSI. Syflex had more functionality in Maya than the XSI integration too. nCloth is still used in both conventional and unconventional ways because every other out of box cloth solver just isn't good. We still rely on nCloth heavily and it's second only to something like Qualoft. nCloth is definitely a strength to leverage. Also, Maya + Window = new tech hotbed. Syflex, Shave, Comet Muscles, and now FE/Splice. Anything that seems promising usually begins it's early stages as a plug-in for Maya. No guarantees that these fledgling tools would be production worthy, but I'm the first to admit I've grabbed a plug-in and blindly marched into production many times. Maya's other strength is it's large user base. If you want a CG army that puts ancient Persia to shame, go with Maya. You are almost guaranteed you'll find someone to fill an empty seat if your shop is a Maya one. And though that pool may not be as experienced or agile as artists in other packages, you definitely have the advantage of choice and can cherry-pick to your hearts desire. To be fair, there are good Maya users out there with their own Maya knick-knacks that can still put up good work. And to that point, if you're a Maya user, you're almost never out of a job if you're smarter than the average bear. I still don't like it. -Lu On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 9:26 AM, Sebastien Sterling < sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: > In fairness the architecture is admirable, i don't think anyone ever > made a fully nodal DCC after maya, to bad so little of it reaches its full > potential. > > > On 22 May 2014 17:15, Luc-Eric Rousseau wrote: > >> 20 years.. 4/5 years late..adjusted for inflation I guess ;) >> >> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 11:11 AM, Jordi Bares >> wrote: >> > Maya was ahead of its time 20 years ago
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
If I were a modeler, animator, or lighter, AND I was absolved of all TD responsibilities, I would absolutely love Maya. This is the vast majority of the artist experience. It is being in an established shop with tools already in place to get your work done or a team of TDs to make said tools. I'm surrounded by happy animators, modelers, and lighters. If they hit a problem, they just submit a ticket and a magic email appears asking them to restart Maya to receive the new goodies. For non-departmentalized facilities where one artist need to wear all hats and FX artists, the Maya experience is a completely different one. Maya is the application I have the deepest knowledge in, but even with a medium to shallow working knowledge in Softimage or Houdini, I find myself being more productive over time in those application as a generalist/TD than in Maya alone. If I had a nickel for questions starting with... "In Maya, can you..." The answer is always yes. Getting to that "yes" more often than not is really painful. -Lu On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 10:31 AM, Sebastien Sterling < sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: > Lol Lu > > It's amazing for this, this, this it sucks :) > > I believe qualoth has been discontinued. yes next person to offer a > feature rich cloth solution will be a rich man/woman, may the Fabric enginz > be with him. > > > On 22 May 2014 18:18, Halim Negadi wrote: > >> +6 Lu >> >> >> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:11 PM, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: >> >>> I think the only failure of the node architecture was that it wasn't >>> meant to be used by artists. Had they had that in consideration, we >>> would've had something like ICE or close to it ages ago. There are still >>> some cool thing you can do in the Hypershade today, but it's unwieldy >>> compared to applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by >>> artists. >>> >>> Maya strengths are still it's quick interactive ability to build stuff >>> and animate. Since this is an XSI list, we've all had a taste of what >>> animation could be due to some really nice "quality of life" features. >>> However, XSI never in the time I've done 3D ever caught up in terms of >>> animation performance. It is still king of interactive performance at the >>> cost of shoddy user experience. >>> >>> Before, Maya was the do-it-all tookit and still can be today. And a lot >>> of the early technology that went into the Maya side were far better >>> implemented than in any other package. The strength was indeed ubiquity, >>> and it was attractive to plug-in developers alongside 3DS max. Shave had >>> more functionality in Maya before it was integrated into XSI. Syflex had >>> more functionality in Maya than the XSI integration too. nCloth is still >>> used in both conventional and unconventional ways because every other out >>> of box cloth solver just isn't good. We still rely on nCloth heavily and >>> it's second only to something like Qualoft. nCloth is definitely a >>> strength to leverage. >>> >>> Also, Maya + Window = new tech hotbed. Syflex, Shave, Comet Muscles, >>> and now FE/Splice. Anything that seems promising usually begins it's early >>> stages as a plug-in for Maya. No guarantees that these fledgling tools >>> would be production worthy, but I'm the first to admit I've grabbed a >>> plug-in and blindly marched into production many times. >>> >>> Maya's other strength is it's large user base. If you want a CG army >>> that puts ancient Persia to shame, go with Maya. You are almost guaranteed >>> you'll find someone to fill an empty seat if your shop is a Maya one. And >>> though that pool may not be as experienced or agile as artists in other >>> packages, you definitely have the advantage of choice and can cherry-pick >>> to your hearts desire. To be fair, there are good Maya users out there >>> with their own Maya knick-knacks that can still put up good work. And to >>> that point, if you're a Maya user, you're almost never out of a job if >>> you're smarter than the average bear. >>> >>> I still don't like it. >>> >>> -Lu >>> >>> >>> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 9:26 AM, Sebastien Sterling < >>> sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> In fairness the architecture is admirable, i don't think anyone ever made a fully nodal DCC after maya, to bad so little of it reaches its full potential. On 22 May 2014 17:15, Luc-Eric Rousseau wrote: > 20 years.. 4/5 years late..adjusted for inflation I guess ;) > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 11:11 AM, Jordi Bares > wrote: > > Maya was ahead of its time 20 years ago, the novel architecture and > a long list of historical events and mismanagement from Softimage (owned > by > Microsoft at the time) meant XSI arrived at least 4/5 years late to the > party, which was a death sentence and big facilities by then did the full > switch (not all but the majority). > > > > The genius side (and the part I don't like
RE: Maya strengts (anyone?)
"...the work around is to put a parent constraint, then delete it :P" ..hahah really? Damn thats really out of the box...! thanks IMDB | Portfolio | Vimeo | Linkedin Date: Thu, 22 May 2014 18:45:07 +0100 Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) From: sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com " the other day I wanted to do a quick pivot operation... (to match the pivot of an x object...) couldn't find how to do that in maya!! someone at work told me I need a script for something that simple... " Ahahaha! Yes i know right ?! its infuriating, the work around is to put a parent constraint, then delete it :P Ever tried hiding a group of polygonz... On 22 May 2014 18:35, Manuel Huertas Marchena wrote: "...applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by artists." well said Lu. Personally I am transitioning to Maya for the moment... (most jobs are maya related in lookdev/lighting so not too much of a choice unfortunatly atm..) ..and I am amazed at how something like the hypershade is used to do production shading... it looks ultra clumbsy to me, render tree in soft is easy on the eyes and everything is well organized it just feels well crafted... haven't got the time to test the node editor in maya for shading but it looks like it does not come close to xsi's one.. also I dont see too many tutorials about using the maya node editor for shading, most I find are with the hypershade... if someone has some good links to share, that ll be cool, thanks. the other day I wanted to do a quick pivot operation... (to match the pivot of an x object...) couldn't find how to do that in maya!! someone at work told me I need a script for something that simple... -Manu IMDB | Portfolio | Vimeo | Linkedin Date: Thu, 22 May 2014 10:11:09 -0700 Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) From: ntmon...@gmail.com To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com I think the only failure of the node architecture was that it wasn't meant to be used by artists. Had they had that in consideration, we would've had something like ICE or close to it ages ago. There are still some cool thing you can do in the Hypershade today, but it's unwieldy compared to applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by artists. Maya strengths are still it's quick interactive ability to build stuff and animate. Since this is an XSI list, we've all had a taste of what animation could be due to some really nice "quality of life" features. However, XSI never in the time I've done 3D ever caught up in terms of animation performance. It is still king of interactive performance at the cost of shoddy user experience. Before, Maya was the do-it-all tookit and still can be today. And a lot of the early technology that went into the Maya side were far better implemented than in any other package. The strength was indeed ubiquity, and it was attractive to plug-in developers alongside 3DS max. Shave had more functionality in Maya before it was integrated into XSI. Syflex had more functionality in Maya than the XSI integration too. nCloth is still used in both conventional and unconventional ways because every other out of box cloth solver just isn't good. We still rely on nCloth heavily and it's second only to something like Qualoft. nCloth is definitely a strength to leverage. Also, Maya + Window = new tech hotbed. Syflex, Shave, Comet Muscles, and now FE/Splice. Anything that seems promising usually begins it's early stages as a plug-in for Maya. No guarantees that these fledgling tools would be production worthy, but I'm the first to admit I've grabbed a plug-in and blindly marched into production many times. Maya's other strength is it's large user base. If you want a CG army that puts ancient Persia to shame, go with Maya. You are almost guaranteed you'll find someone to fill an empty seat if your shop is a Maya one. And though that pool may not be as experienced or agile as artists in other packages, you definitely have the advantage of choice and can cherry-pick to your hearts desire. To be fair, there are good Maya users out there with their own Maya knick-knacks that can still put up good work. And to that point, if you're a Maya user, you're almost never out of a job if you're smarter than the average bear. I still don't like it. -Lu On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 9:26 AM, Sebastien Sterling wrote: In fairness the architecture is admirable, i don't think anyone ever made a fully nodal DCC after maya, to bad so little of it reaches its full potential. On 22 May 2014 17:15, Luc-Eric Rousseau wrote: 20 years.. 4/5 years late..adjusted for inflation I guess ;) On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 11:11 AM, Jordi Bares wrote: > Maya was ahead of its time 20 years ago,
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
" the other day I wanted to do a quick pivot operation... (to match the pivot of an x object...) couldn't find how to do that in maya!! someone at work told me I need a script for something that simple... " Ahahaha! Yes i know right ?! its infuriating, the work around is to put a parent constraint, then delete it :P Ever tried hiding a group of polygonz... On 22 May 2014 18:35, Manuel Huertas Marchena wrote: > "...applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by artists." > > well said Lu. > Personally I am transitioning to Maya for the moment... (most jobs are > maya related in lookdev/lighting so not too much of a choice unfortunatly > atm..) > ..and I am amazed at how something like the hypershade is used to do > production shading... it looks ultra clumbsy to me, render tree in soft is > easy on the eyes > and everything is well organized it just feels well crafted... haven't > got the time to test the node editor in maya for shading but it looks like > it does not come close to xsi's one.. > also I dont see too many tutorials about using the maya node editor for > shading, most I find are with the hypershade... if someone has some good > links to share, that ll be cool, thanks. > > the other day I wanted to do a quick pivot operation... (to match the > pivot of an x object...) couldn't find how to do that in maya!! someone at > work told me I need a script for something that simple... > > -Manu > > > IMDB <http://www.imdb.com/name/nm4755969/> | Portfolio > <http://envmanu.com> <http://envmanu.carbonmade.com/>| > Vimeo<http://vimeo.com/manuelhuertasmarchena>| > Linkedin <http://www.linkedin.com/in/manuelhuertas> > > > -- > Date: Thu, 22 May 2014 10:11:09 -0700 > > Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) > From: ntmon...@gmail.com > To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com > > > I think the only failure of the node architecture was that it wasn't meant > to be used by artists. Had they had that in consideration, we would've had > something like ICE or close to it ages ago. There are still some cool > thing you can do in the Hypershade today, but it's unwieldy compared to > applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by artists. > > Maya strengths are still it's quick interactive ability to build stuff and > animate. Since this is an XSI list, we've all had a taste of what > animation could be due to some really nice "quality of life" features. > However, XSI never in the time I've done 3D ever caught up in terms of > animation performance. It is still king of interactive performance at the > cost of shoddy user experience. > > Before, Maya was the do-it-all tookit and still can be today. And a lot > of the early technology that went into the Maya side were far better > implemented than in any other package. The strength was indeed ubiquity, > and it was attractive to plug-in developers alongside 3DS max. Shave had > more functionality in Maya before it was integrated into XSI. Syflex had > more functionality in Maya than the XSI integration too. nCloth is still > used in both conventional and unconventional ways because every other out > of box cloth solver just isn't good. We still rely on nCloth heavily and > it's second only to something like Qualoft. nCloth is definitely a > strength to leverage. > > Also, Maya + Window = new tech hotbed. Syflex, Shave, Comet Muscles, and > now FE/Splice. Anything that seems promising usually begins it's early > stages as a plug-in for Maya. No guarantees that these fledgling tools > would be production worthy, but I'm the first to admit I've grabbed a > plug-in and blindly marched into production many times. > > Maya's other strength is it's large user base. If you want a CG army that > puts ancient Persia to shame, go with Maya. You are almost guaranteed > you'll find someone to fill an empty seat if your shop is a Maya one. And > though that pool may not be as experienced or agile as artists in other > packages, you definitely have the advantage of choice and can cherry-pick > to your hearts desire. To be fair, there are good Maya users out there > with their own Maya knick-knacks that can still put up good work. And to > that point, if you're a Maya user, you're almost never out of a job if > you're smarter than the average bear. > > I still don't like it. > > -Lu > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 9:26 AM, Sebastien Sterling < > sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: > > In fairness the architecture is admirable, i don't think anyone ever made > a fu
RE: Maya strengts (anyone?)
"...applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by artists." well said Lu. Personally I am transitioning to Maya for the moment... (most jobs are maya related in lookdev/lighting so not too much of a choice unfortunatly atm..) ..and I am amazed at how something like the hypershade is used to do production shading... it looks ultra clumbsy to me, render tree in soft is easy on the eyesand everything is well organized it just feels well crafted... haven't got the time to test the node editor in maya for shading but it looks like it does not come close to xsi's one..also I dont see too many tutorials about using the maya node editor for shading, most I find are with the hypershade... if someone has some good links to share, that ll be cool, thanks. the other day I wanted to do a quick pivot operation... (to match the pivot of an x object...) couldn't find how to do that in maya!! someone at work told me I need a script for something that simple... -Manu IMDB | Portfolio | Vimeo | Linkedin Date: Thu, 22 May 2014 10:11:09 -0700 Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) From: ntmon...@gmail.com To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com I think the only failure of the node architecture was that it wasn't meant to be used by artists. Had they had that in consideration, we would've had something like ICE or close to it ages ago. There are still some cool thing you can do in the Hypershade today, but it's unwieldy compared to applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by artists. Maya strengths are still it's quick interactive ability to build stuff and animate. Since this is an XSI list, we've all had a taste of what animation could be due to some really nice "quality of life" features. However, XSI never in the time I've done 3D ever caught up in terms of animation performance. It is still king of interactive performance at the cost of shoddy user experience. Before, Maya was the do-it-all tookit and still can be today. And a lot of the early technology that went into the Maya side were far better implemented than in any other package. The strength was indeed ubiquity, and it was attractive to plug-in developers alongside 3DS max. Shave had more functionality in Maya before it was integrated into XSI. Syflex had more functionality in Maya than the XSI integration too. nCloth is still used in both conventional and unconventional ways because every other out of box cloth solver just isn't good. We still rely on nCloth heavily and it's second only to something like Qualoft. nCloth is definitely a strength to leverage. Also, Maya + Window = new tech hotbed. Syflex, Shave, Comet Muscles, and now FE/Splice. Anything that seems promising usually begins it's early stages as a plug-in for Maya. No guarantees that these fledgling tools would be production worthy, but I'm the first to admit I've grabbed a plug-in and blindly marched into production many times. Maya's other strength is it's large user base. If you want a CG army that puts ancient Persia to shame, go with Maya. You are almost guaranteed you'll find someone to fill an empty seat if your shop is a Maya one. And though that pool may not be as experienced or agile as artists in other packages, you definitely have the advantage of choice and can cherry-pick to your hearts desire. To be fair, there are good Maya users out there with their own Maya knick-knacks that can still put up good work. And to that point, if you're a Maya user, you're almost never out of a job if you're smarter than the average bear. I still don't like it. -Lu On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 9:26 AM, Sebastien Sterling wrote: In fairness the architecture is admirable, i don't think anyone ever made a fully nodal DCC after maya, to bad so little of it reaches its full potential. On 22 May 2014 17:15, Luc-Eric Rousseau wrote: 20 years.. 4/5 years late..adjusted for inflation I guess ;) On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 11:11 AM, Jordi Bares wrote: > Maya was ahead of its time 20 years ago, the novel architecture and a long > list of historical events and mismanagement from Softimage (owned by > Microsoft at the time) meant XSI arrived at least 4/5 years late to the > party, which was a death sentence and big facilities by then did the full > switch (not all but the majority). > > The genius side (and the part I don't like) was the viral nature of Maya in > which you have to write stuff for pretty much everything which meant > everybody was building tons of software (and complex ones too) on top of Maya > so by the time XSI was starting to pick up pace it was an impossible fight. > > Was maya great for character animation? Yes, It has always been very good at > that because the animation editor and dope shee
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Lol Lu It's amazing for this, this, this it sucks :) I believe qualoth has been discontinued. yes next person to offer a feature rich cloth solution will be a rich man/woman, may the Fabric enginz be with him. On 22 May 2014 18:18, Halim Negadi wrote: > +6 Lu > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:11 PM, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: > >> I think the only failure of the node architecture was that it wasn't >> meant to be used by artists. Had they had that in consideration, we >> would've had something like ICE or close to it ages ago. There are still >> some cool thing you can do in the Hypershade today, but it's unwieldy >> compared to applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by >> artists. >> >> Maya strengths are still it's quick interactive ability to build stuff >> and animate. Since this is an XSI list, we've all had a taste of what >> animation could be due to some really nice "quality of life" features. >> However, XSI never in the time I've done 3D ever caught up in terms of >> animation performance. It is still king of interactive performance at the >> cost of shoddy user experience. >> >> Before, Maya was the do-it-all tookit and still can be today. And a lot >> of the early technology that went into the Maya side were far better >> implemented than in any other package. The strength was indeed ubiquity, >> and it was attractive to plug-in developers alongside 3DS max. Shave had >> more functionality in Maya before it was integrated into XSI. Syflex had >> more functionality in Maya than the XSI integration too. nCloth is still >> used in both conventional and unconventional ways because every other out >> of box cloth solver just isn't good. We still rely on nCloth heavily and >> it's second only to something like Qualoft. nCloth is definitely a >> strength to leverage. >> >> Also, Maya + Window = new tech hotbed. Syflex, Shave, Comet Muscles, and >> now FE/Splice. Anything that seems promising usually begins it's early >> stages as a plug-in for Maya. No guarantees that these fledgling tools >> would be production worthy, but I'm the first to admit I've grabbed a >> plug-in and blindly marched into production many times. >> >> Maya's other strength is it's large user base. If you want a CG army >> that puts ancient Persia to shame, go with Maya. You are almost guaranteed >> you'll find someone to fill an empty seat if your shop is a Maya one. And >> though that pool may not be as experienced or agile as artists in other >> packages, you definitely have the advantage of choice and can cherry-pick >> to your hearts desire. To be fair, there are good Maya users out there >> with their own Maya knick-knacks that can still put up good work. And to >> that point, if you're a Maya user, you're almost never out of a job if >> you're smarter than the average bear. >> >> I still don't like it. >> >> -Lu >> >> >> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 9:26 AM, Sebastien Sterling < >> sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> In fairness the architecture is admirable, i don't think anyone ever >>> made a fully nodal DCC after maya, to bad so little of it reaches its full >>> potential. >>> >>> >>> On 22 May 2014 17:15, Luc-Eric Rousseau wrote: >>> 20 years.. 4/5 years late..adjusted for inflation I guess ;) On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 11:11 AM, Jordi Bares wrote: > Maya was ahead of its time 20 years ago, the novel architecture and a long list of historical events and mismanagement from Softimage (owned by Microsoft at the time) meant XSI arrived at least 4/5 years late to the party, which was a death sentence and big facilities by then did the full switch (not all but the majority). > > The genius side (and the part I don't like) was the viral nature of Maya in which you have to write stuff for pretty much everything which meant everybody was building tons of software (and complex ones too) on top of Maya so by the time XSI was starting to pick up pace it was an impossible fight. > > Was maya great for character animation? Yes, It has always been very good at that because the animation editor and dope sheet were very nice, also very fast with multiple characters and some versions very robust. Manipulators made life a pleasure (remember XSI introduced them late) so it was not a myth, but today it XSI is imho way superior for animation, shame the envelop deformers were never looked after properly. > > Jordi Bares > jordiba...@gmail.com > > On 22 May 2014, at 14:25, "Leendert A. Hartog" wrote: > >> Okay, a more specific question. Back in the day I always heard that Maya was the most useful tool for Character Animation (discounting Softimage from the equation). Was this just myth or is it just outdated info? >> >> -- >> >> Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue >> Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
+6 Lu On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 7:11 PM, Meng-Yang Lu wrote: > I think the only failure of the node architecture was that it wasn't meant > to be used by artists. Had they had that in consideration, we would've had > something like ICE or close to it ages ago. There are still some cool > thing you can do in the Hypershade today, but it's unwieldy compared to > applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by artists. > > Maya strengths are still it's quick interactive ability to build stuff and > animate. Since this is an XSI list, we've all had a taste of what > animation could be due to some really nice "quality of life" features. > However, XSI never in the time I've done 3D ever caught up in terms of > animation performance. It is still king of interactive performance at the > cost of shoddy user experience. > > Before, Maya was the do-it-all tookit and still can be today. And a lot > of the early technology that went into the Maya side were far better > implemented than in any other package. The strength was indeed ubiquity, > and it was attractive to plug-in developers alongside 3DS max. Shave had > more functionality in Maya before it was integrated into XSI. Syflex had > more functionality in Maya than the XSI integration too. nCloth is still > used in both conventional and unconventional ways because every other out > of box cloth solver just isn't good. We still rely on nCloth heavily and > it's second only to something like Qualoft. nCloth is definitely a > strength to leverage. > > Also, Maya + Window = new tech hotbed. Syflex, Shave, Comet Muscles, and > now FE/Splice. Anything that seems promising usually begins it's early > stages as a plug-in for Maya. No guarantees that these fledgling tools > would be production worthy, but I'm the first to admit I've grabbed a > plug-in and blindly marched into production many times. > > Maya's other strength is it's large user base. If you want a CG army that > puts ancient Persia to shame, go with Maya. You are almost guaranteed > you'll find someone to fill an empty seat if your shop is a Maya one. And > though that pool may not be as experienced or agile as artists in other > packages, you definitely have the advantage of choice and can cherry-pick > to your hearts desire. To be fair, there are good Maya users out there > with their own Maya knick-knacks that can still put up good work. And to > that point, if you're a Maya user, you're almost never out of a job if > you're smarter than the average bear. > > I still don't like it. > > -Lu > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 9:26 AM, Sebastien Sterling < > sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> In fairness the architecture is admirable, i don't think anyone ever made >> a fully nodal DCC after maya, to bad so little of it reaches its full >> potential. >> >> >> On 22 May 2014 17:15, Luc-Eric Rousseau wrote: >> >>> 20 years.. 4/5 years late..adjusted for inflation I guess ;) >>> >>> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 11:11 AM, Jordi Bares >>> wrote: >>> > Maya was ahead of its time 20 years ago, the novel architecture and a >>> long list of historical events and mismanagement from Softimage (owned by >>> Microsoft at the time) meant XSI arrived at least 4/5 years late to the >>> party, which was a death sentence and big facilities by then did the full >>> switch (not all but the majority). >>> > >>> > The genius side (and the part I don't like) was the viral nature of >>> Maya in which you have to write stuff for pretty much everything which >>> meant everybody was building tons of software (and complex ones too) on top >>> of Maya so by the time XSI was starting to pick up pace it was an >>> impossible fight. >>> > >>> > Was maya great for character animation? Yes, It has always been very >>> good at that because the animation editor and dope sheet were very nice, >>> also very fast with multiple characters and some versions very robust. >>> Manipulators made life a pleasure (remember XSI introduced them late) so it >>> was not a myth, but today it XSI is imho way superior for animation, shame >>> the envelop deformers were never looked after properly. >>> > >>> > Jordi Bares >>> > jordiba...@gmail.com >>> > >>> > On 22 May 2014, at 14:25, "Leendert A. Hartog" >>> wrote: >>> > >>> >> Okay, a more specific question. Back in the day I always heard that >>> Maya was the most useful tool for Character Animation (discounting >>> Softimage from the equation). Was this just myth or is it just outdated >>> info? >>> >> >>> >> -- >>> >> >>> >> Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue >>> >> Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >>> >> >>> > >>> > >>> >>> >> >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
I think the only failure of the node architecture was that it wasn't meant to be used by artists. Had they had that in consideration, we would've had something like ICE or close to it ages ago. There are still some cool thing you can do in the Hypershade today, but it's unwieldy compared to applications that knew nodes was going to be tinkered with by artists. Maya strengths are still it's quick interactive ability to build stuff and animate. Since this is an XSI list, we've all had a taste of what animation could be due to some really nice "quality of life" features. However, XSI never in the time I've done 3D ever caught up in terms of animation performance. It is still king of interactive performance at the cost of shoddy user experience. Before, Maya was the do-it-all tookit and still can be today. And a lot of the early technology that went into the Maya side were far better implemented than in any other package. The strength was indeed ubiquity, and it was attractive to plug-in developers alongside 3DS max. Shave had more functionality in Maya before it was integrated into XSI. Syflex had more functionality in Maya than the XSI integration too. nCloth is still used in both conventional and unconventional ways because every other out of box cloth solver just isn't good. We still rely on nCloth heavily and it's second only to something like Qualoft. nCloth is definitely a strength to leverage. Also, Maya + Window = new tech hotbed. Syflex, Shave, Comet Muscles, and now FE/Splice. Anything that seems promising usually begins it's early stages as a plug-in for Maya. No guarantees that these fledgling tools would be production worthy, but I'm the first to admit I've grabbed a plug-in and blindly marched into production many times. Maya's other strength is it's large user base. If you want a CG army that puts ancient Persia to shame, go with Maya. You are almost guaranteed you'll find someone to fill an empty seat if your shop is a Maya one. And though that pool may not be as experienced or agile as artists in other packages, you definitely have the advantage of choice and can cherry-pick to your hearts desire. To be fair, there are good Maya users out there with their own Maya knick-knacks that can still put up good work. And to that point, if you're a Maya user, you're almost never out of a job if you're smarter than the average bear. I still don't like it. -Lu On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 9:26 AM, Sebastien Sterling < sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote: > In fairness the architecture is admirable, i don't think anyone ever made > a fully nodal DCC after maya, to bad so little of it reaches its full > potential. > > > On 22 May 2014 17:15, Luc-Eric Rousseau wrote: > >> 20 years.. 4/5 years late..adjusted for inflation I guess ;) >> >> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 11:11 AM, Jordi Bares >> wrote: >> > Maya was ahead of its time 20 years ago, the novel architecture and a >> long list of historical events and mismanagement from Softimage (owned by >> Microsoft at the time) meant XSI arrived at least 4/5 years late to the >> party, which was a death sentence and big facilities by then did the full >> switch (not all but the majority). >> > >> > The genius side (and the part I don't like) was the viral nature of >> Maya in which you have to write stuff for pretty much everything which >> meant everybody was building tons of software (and complex ones too) on top >> of Maya so by the time XSI was starting to pick up pace it was an >> impossible fight. >> > >> > Was maya great for character animation? Yes, It has always been very >> good at that because the animation editor and dope sheet were very nice, >> also very fast with multiple characters and some versions very robust. >> Manipulators made life a pleasure (remember XSI introduced them late) so it >> was not a myth, but today it XSI is imho way superior for animation, shame >> the envelop deformers were never looked after properly. >> > >> > Jordi Bares >> > jordiba...@gmail.com >> > >> > On 22 May 2014, at 14:25, "Leendert A. Hartog" >> wrote: >> > >> >> Okay, a more specific question. Back in the day I always heard that >> Maya was the most useful tool for Character Animation (discounting >> Softimage from the equation). Was this just myth or is it just outdated >> info? >> >> >> >> -- >> >> >> >> Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue >> >> Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >> >> >> > >> > >> >> >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Time passes so fast in hyper-London I just made you guys 4 years older! X-D Sent from my iPhone > On 22 May 2014, at 17:15, Luc-Eric Rousseau wrote: > > 20 years.. 4/5 years late..adjusted for inflation I guess ;) > >> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 11:11 AM, Jordi Bares wrote: >> Maya was ahead of its time 20 years ago, the novel architecture and a long >> list of historical events and mismanagement from Softimage (owned by >> Microsoft at the time) meant XSI arrived at least 4/5 years late to the >> party, which was a death sentence and big facilities by then did the full >> switch (not all but the majority). >> >> The genius side (and the part I don't like) was the viral nature of Maya in >> which you have to write stuff for pretty much everything which meant >> everybody was building tons of software (and complex ones too) on top of >> Maya so by the time XSI was starting to pick up pace it was an impossible >> fight. >> >> Was maya great for character animation? Yes, It has always been very good at >> that because the animation editor and dope sheet were very nice, also very >> fast with multiple characters and some versions very robust. Manipulators >> made life a pleasure (remember XSI introduced them late) so it was not a >> myth, but today it XSI is imho way superior for animation, shame the envelop >> deformers were never looked after properly. >> >> Jordi Bares >> jordiba...@gmail.com >> >>> On 22 May 2014, at 14:25, "Leendert A. Hartog" wrote: >>> >>> Okay, a more specific question. Back in the day I always heard that Maya >>> was the most useful tool for Character Animation (discounting Softimage >>> from the equation). Was this just myth or is it just outdated info? >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue >>> Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
In fairness the architecture is admirable, i don't think anyone ever made a fully nodal DCC after maya, to bad so little of it reaches its full potential. On 22 May 2014 17:15, Luc-Eric Rousseau wrote: > 20 years.. 4/5 years late..adjusted for inflation I guess ;) > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 11:11 AM, Jordi Bares > wrote: > > Maya was ahead of its time 20 years ago, the novel architecture and a > long list of historical events and mismanagement from Softimage (owned by > Microsoft at the time) meant XSI arrived at least 4/5 years late to the > party, which was a death sentence and big facilities by then did the full > switch (not all but the majority). > > > > The genius side (and the part I don't like) was the viral nature of Maya > in which you have to write stuff for pretty much everything which meant > everybody was building tons of software (and complex ones too) on top of > Maya so by the time XSI was starting to pick up pace it was an impossible > fight. > > > > Was maya great for character animation? Yes, It has always been very > good at that because the animation editor and dope sheet were very nice, > also very fast with multiple characters and some versions very robust. > Manipulators made life a pleasure (remember XSI introduced them late) so it > was not a myth, but today it XSI is imho way superior for animation, shame > the envelop deformers were never looked after properly. > > > > Jordi Bares > > jordiba...@gmail.com > > > > On 22 May 2014, at 14:25, "Leendert A. Hartog" > wrote: > > > >> Okay, a more specific question. Back in the day I always heard that > Maya was the most useful tool for Character Animation (discounting > Softimage from the equation). Was this just myth or is it just outdated > info? > >> > >> -- > >> > >> Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > >> Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > >> > > > > > >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
20 years.. 4/5 years late..adjusted for inflation I guess ;) On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 11:11 AM, Jordi Bares wrote: > Maya was ahead of its time 20 years ago, the novel architecture and a long > list of historical events and mismanagement from Softimage (owned by > Microsoft at the time) meant XSI arrived at least 4/5 years late to the > party, which was a death sentence and big facilities by then did the full > switch (not all but the majority). > > The genius side (and the part I don't like) was the viral nature of Maya in > which you have to write stuff for pretty much everything which meant > everybody was building tons of software (and complex ones too) on top of Maya > so by the time XSI was starting to pick up pace it was an impossible fight. > > Was maya great for character animation? Yes, It has always been very good at > that because the animation editor and dope sheet were very nice, also very > fast with multiple characters and some versions very robust. Manipulators > made life a pleasure (remember XSI introduced them late) so it was not a > myth, but today it XSI is imho way superior for animation, shame the envelop > deformers were never looked after properly. > > Jordi Bares > jordiba...@gmail.com > > On 22 May 2014, at 14:25, "Leendert A. Hartog" wrote: > >> Okay, a more specific question. Back in the day I always heard that Maya was >> the most useful tool for Character Animation (discounting Softimage from the >> equation). Was this just myth or is it just outdated info? >> >> -- >> >> Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue >> Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >> > >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Maya was ahead of its time 20 years ago, the novel architecture and a long list of historical events and mismanagement from Softimage (owned by Microsoft at the time) meant XSI arrived at least 4/5 years late to the party, which was a death sentence and big facilities by then did the full switch (not all but the majority). The genius side (and the part I don't like) was the viral nature of Maya in which you have to write stuff for pretty much everything which meant everybody was building tons of software (and complex ones too) on top of Maya so by the time XSI was starting to pick up pace it was an impossible fight. Was maya great for character animation? Yes, It has always been very good at that because the animation editor and dope sheet were very nice, also very fast with multiple characters and some versions very robust. Manipulators made life a pleasure (remember XSI introduced them late) so it was not a myth, but today it XSI is imho way superior for animation, shame the envelop deformers were never looked after properly. Jordi Bares jordiba...@gmail.com On 22 May 2014, at 14:25, "Leendert A. Hartog" wrote: > Okay, a more specific question. Back in the day I always heard that Maya was > the most useful tool for Character Animation (discounting Softimage from the > equation). Was this just myth or is it just outdated info? > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
I must admit I much prefer to modo animation tools to Mayas and even soft images (note just talking animation not rigging) Using the spacing chart , being able to adjust animation arcs visually , creating on the fly ui’s to watch and create keys just for what I am looking at in such an easy way to me makes it so much more intuitive. For me working with the curves in the Modo graph editor just seem much more fluid. That being said Maya is heavily production proven in this area so it does have that advantage. From: Mario Reitbauer mailto:cont...@marioreitbauer.at>> Reply-To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>" mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>> Date: Thursday 22 May 2014 at 4:01 PM To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>" mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>> Subject: Re: Maya strengts (anyone?) For Character Animation you can still use max if you want to animate for games. Which in the end isn't any better... 2014-05-22 15:48 GMT+02:00 Mirko Jankovic mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>>: Unfortunately for character animation part there are no alternatives. Alternative is something you can do same job easier or at least same level of effectiveness. There is no one out commercially available. On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 3:35 PM, Leendert A. Hartog mailto:hirazib...@live.nl>> wrote: Okay, but discounting Softimage and considering the alternatives (again: possibly only back in the day)? -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com<http://si-community.com> This communication is intended for the addressee only. It is confidential. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately and destroy the original message. You may not copy or disseminate this communication without the permission of the University. Only authorised signatories are competent to enter into agreements on behalf of the University and recipients are thus advised that the content of this message may not be legally binding on the University and may contain the personal views and opinions of the author, which are not necessarily the views and opinions of The University of the Witwatersrand, Johannesburg. All agreements between the University and outsiders are subject to South African Law unless the University agrees in writing to the contrary.
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
For Character Animation you can still use max if you want to animate for games. Which in the end isn't any better... 2014-05-22 15:48 GMT+02:00 Mirko Jankovic : > Unfortunately for character animation part there are no alternatives. > Alternative is something you can do same job easier or at least same level > of effectiveness. > There is no one out commercially available. > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 3:35 PM, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > >> Okay, but discounting Softimage and considering the alternatives (again: >> possibly only back in the day)? >> >> >> -- >> >> Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue >> Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >> >> >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Maya's animation tools are better than they were, yes ( I like the fcurve lattice but even that needs work in its selection/manipulation area) , but not better than the current Softimage. Our lead animator who was a maya fanboy now complains that the current Maya fcurve editor is slowing him down. On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 8:33 AM, Peter Agg wrote: > I'd say that it is better now though, if only because Soft hasn't really > had much development. > > > -=T=-
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Look at World of Warcraft for example. By todays standards technically its supposedly not that great. What it did have however was timing. At the time it was the best of what was there and it was marketed extremely well. As such even in decline at 7 Million plus subscribers it still orders of magnitude more popular then most new MMO¹s To me Maya is very much the same. It got to be the industry standard by being better and more marketed for a sort period of time then anything else. Now its got to the point where people have invested so much into it that its hard to think about using something else. However time = money will eventually bring houdini more and more into the main pipeline application space. Accountancy always wins. On 2014/05/22, 12:59 PM, "Leendert A. Hartog" wrote: >So, absolutely no strengths? Market leader on marketing voodoo alone? >Somehow I doubt that... ;) > >-- > >Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue >Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > This communication is intended for the addressee only. It is confidential. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately and destroy the original message. You may not copy or disseminate this communication without the permission of the University. Only authorised signatories are competent to enter into agreements on behalf of the University and recipients are thus advised that the content of this message may not be legally binding on the University and may contain the personal views and opinions of the author, which are not necessarily the views and opinions of The University of the Witwatersrand, Johannesburg. All agreements between the University and outsiders are subject to South African Law unless the University agrees in writing to the contrary.
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Unfortunately for character animation part there are no alternatives. Alternative is something you can do same job easier or at least same level of effectiveness. There is no one out commercially available. On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 3:35 PM, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > Okay, but discounting Softimage and considering the alternatives (again: > possibly only back in the day)? > > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Okay, but discounting Softimage and considering the alternatives (again: possibly only back in the day)? -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
I'd say that it is better now though, if only because Soft hasn't really had much development. On 22 May 2014 14:31, Eric Turman wrote: > Propaganda. > > > It wasn't bad, just not really any better and in some areas (like trax) > worse. > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 8:25 AM, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > >> Okay, a more specific question. Back in the day I always heard that Maya >> was the most useful tool for Character Animation (discounting Softimage >> from the equation). Was this just myth or is it just outdated info? >> >> >> -- >> >> Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue >> Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >> >> > > > -- > > > > > -=T=- >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Propaganda. It wasn't bad, just not really any better and in some areas (like trax) worse. On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 8:25 AM, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > Okay, a more specific question. Back in the day I always heard that Maya > was the most useful tool for Character Animation (discounting Softimage > from the equation). Was this just myth or is it just outdated info? > > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > > -- -=T=-
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Well, the node editor can be clunky--especially how it has the propensity to throw in unit converters all over the place and you end up getting double or triple degree to radian calculations without asking for them. And the functions that are not missing can be hidden or the way to achieve themnot clean...like subtracting, or single argument conditionals etc. But it does evaluate fast (like Softimage's expressions) Maya and soft are kind of opposites in the node/tri-count area Softimage can handle a bazillion triangles on as long as you have few nodes (meshes, nulls etc.) in the scene, and Maya can handle a huge number of nodes, but not nearly the number or triangles as Softimage. -- -=T=-
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Okay, a more specific question. Back in the day I always heard that Maya was the most useful tool for Character Animation (discounting Softimage from the equation). Was this just myth or is it just outdated info? -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
BTW, just to clarify... I don't hate Maya per se (ok... I hate it throughout the day... Several times). It is actually a good package (it didn't become the standard in film just for no reason). However, to me, "strengths" reads as "qualities that surpass anything else by an noticeable margin". In that sense, I can't pinpoint any. But then again, that's maybe just due to how I use the application (I'm just the rigging part of the chain). I guess a pipeline TD would maybe have a different opinion. I will add that Maya does scale well, and plays fairly with all the other pipeline apps. Dunno what else to say... There's a lot of available scripts/plugins out there that will help you live through its defects? ( but that can be said for pretty much any application ). Sergio Muciño. Sent from my iPad. > On May 22, 2014, at 8:37 AM, "Stefan Kubicek" wrote: > > A robot a day keeps the doctor away? > > > http://www.cgmeetup.net/home/making-of-the-amazing-spider-man-2-rhino/ > > blaa ? > > >> On 22 May 2014 13:11, Martin wrote: >> Tough question. >> >> Modeling. Nothing really. A few tools that SI lacks like preserve uvs, lock >> sub components, sculpt tool, some tools that work better, but nothing >> special. >> >> Animation. Nothing either. >> >> nCloth, nHair, and muscles may be an strength point but I almost never use >> them so I can't talk about it. >> >> Viewport. Even the old Maya viewport is better than the newest SI one. And >> this is a big difference when you have to deal with alpha bitmaps, vertex >> colors and normal maps when you're modeling game assets. >> >> Coding. You have access to a lot more places than with SI. But writing in >> Mel is a nightmare if you write something big, and the Python experience >> isn't very pleasant but I don't have experience with Pymel. >> >> ASCII format. >> >> Ignore version option. You can open data in older versions, sometimes. I >> find this feature a little unreliable since 2012 (or 2013?, can't remember) >> >> I can't think about any other big strength, sorry. >> >> Oh wait. It isn't dead, and you can find a lot of jobs and users around the >> world. It isn't a Maya feature but that's the main reason why Maya is the >> leader. >> >> Martin >> Sent from my iPhone > > > > > -- > > - >Stefan Kubicek ste...@keyvis.at > - > Alfred Feierfeilstraße 3 > A-2380 Perchtoldsdorf bei Wien > Phone: +43 (0) 699 12614231 >www.keyvis.at > This email and its attachments are > confidential and for the recipient only
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
I actually thought it was the worst node editor I've used in my life. Sergio Muciño. Sent from my iPad. > On May 22, 2014, at 8:30 AM, Mario Reitbauer > wrote: > > I would say after using it a bit. The node editor is acutally something worth > using it. > > > 2014-05-22 14:03 GMT+02:00 Sebastien Sterling : >> Are you trying to attain a specific level of generalism ? >> >> >>> On 22 May 2014 12:44, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: >>> Thanks for that... >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue >>> Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
I'm gonna be with Sebastien on this one. Maya is not stronger than anything in a way worth mentioning. It is the winner if the race for historical reasons, and because the race was rigged (ha... See what I did there? ;-) ). If anything, it is a very open package, but that doesn't get you anything by itself. Maybe, as it was mentioned before, it is the most rounded package. It does everything, and it does it well but at the cost of making you pay in blood for it. Personally, after using Modo, I don't miss Maya for a single second (it was a package I never really liked, to start with... It just allowed me to get my work done much more efficiently than Max). Granted, there are still many things that Modo doesn't do yet, but some of these I can fake (I.e. Muscles), and others are changing rapidly. I'm happier there than having to deal with a package that after strutting for 3 minutes forces me to enter some arcane line of code from the lost books of the Ancients just to add a circle shape to my joint (are you for f real?.). There. Now, back to my usual happy part of the day (the rest of it, with no Maya included) :-) Sergio Muciño. Sent from my iPad. > On May 22, 2014, at 6:59 AM, "Leendert A. Hartog" wrote: > > So, absolutely no strengths? Market leader on marketing voodoo alone? Somehow > I doubt that... ;) > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
A robot a day keeps the doctor away? http://www.cgmeetup.net/home/making-of-the-amazing-spider-man-2-rhino/ blaa ? On 22 May 2014 13:11, Martin wrote: Tough question. Modeling. Nothing really. A few tools that SI lacks like preserve uvs, lock sub components, sculpt tool, some tools that work better, but nothing >>special. Animation. Nothing either. nCloth, nHair, and muscles may be an strength point but I almost never use them so I can't talk about it. Viewport. Even the old Maya viewport is better than the newest SI one. And this is a big difference when you have to deal with alpha bitmaps, >>vertex colors and normal maps when you're modeling game assets. Coding. You have access to a lot more places than with SI. But writing in Mel is a nightmare if you write something big, and the Python experience >>isn't very pleasant but I don't have experience with Pymel. ASCII format. Ignore version option. You can open data in older versions, sometimes. I find this feature a little unreliable since 2012 (or 2013?, can't remember) I can't think about any other big strength, sorry. Oh wait. It isn't dead, and you can find a lot of jobs and users around the world. It isn't a Maya feature but that's the main reason why Maya is the >>leader. Martin Sent from my iPhone -- - Stefan Kubicek ste...@keyvis.at - Alfred Feierfeilstraße 3 A-2380 Perchtoldsdorf bei Wien Phone: +43 (0) 699 12614231 www.keyvis.at This email and its attachments are confidential and for the recipient only
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
I would say after using it a bit. The node editor is acutally something worth using it. 2014-05-22 14:03 GMT+02:00 Sebastien Sterling : > Are you trying to attain a specific level of generalism ? > > > On 22 May 2014 12:44, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > >> Thanks for that... >> >> >> -- >> >> Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue >> Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >> >> >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
http://www.cgmeetup.net/home/making-of-the-amazing-spider-man-2-rhino/ blaa ? On 22 May 2014 13:11, Martin wrote: > Tough question. > > Modeling. Nothing really. A few tools that SI lacks like preserve uvs, > lock sub components, sculpt tool, some tools that work better, but nothing > special. > > Animation. Nothing either. > > nCloth, nHair, and muscles may be an strength point but I almost never use > them so I can't talk about it. > > Viewport. Even the old Maya viewport is better than the newest SI one. And > this is a big difference when you have to deal with alpha bitmaps, vertex > colors and normal maps when you're modeling game assets. > > Coding. You have access to a lot more places than with SI. But writing in > Mel is a nightmare if you write something big, and the Python experience > isn't very pleasant but I don't have experience with Pymel. > > ASCII format. > > Ignore version option. You can open data in older versions, sometimes. I > find this feature a little unreliable since 2012 (or 2013?, can't remember) > > I can't think about any other big strength, sorry. > > Oh wait. It isn't dead, and you can find a lot of jobs and users around > the world. It isn't a Maya feature but that's the main reason why Maya is > the leader. > > Martin > Sent from my iPhone >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Tough question. Modeling. Nothing really. A few tools that SI lacks like preserve uvs, lock sub components, sculpt tool, some tools that work better, but nothing special. Animation. Nothing either. nCloth, nHair, and muscles may be an strength point but I almost never use them so I can't talk about it. Viewport. Even the old Maya viewport is better than the newest SI one. And this is a big difference when you have to deal with alpha bitmaps, vertex colors and normal maps when you're modeling game assets. Coding. You have access to a lot more places than with SI. But writing in Mel is a nightmare if you write something big, and the Python experience isn't very pleasant but I don't have experience with Pymel. ASCII format. Ignore version option. You can open data in older versions, sometimes. I find this feature a little unreliable since 2012 (or 2013?, can't remember) I can't think about any other big strength, sorry. Oh wait. It isn't dead, and you can find a lot of jobs and users around the world. It isn't a Maya feature but that's the main reason why Maya is the leader. Martin Sent from my iPhone
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Well, I am a "mere" hobbyist, so the generalist approach has always seem prudent. -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Are you trying to attain a specific level of generalism ? On 22 May 2014 12:44, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > Thanks for that... > > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Yeah am trying to optimize the layout for current shot by deleting out of camera hierarchies but Maya keeps freezing 10 minutes at a time when selecting. Lass tool is single threading right? On 22 May 2014 12:42, "Stefan Kubicek" wrote: > Total nightmare. Reminds me on stories of the making of Myst (the game), > with sometimes hours of loading time. > I couldn't imagine working like that. To be fair, I always found > loading/saving in Maya pretty fast, even compared to XSI. > I tried with scenes of equal complexity (lots of geo, but little to no > construction history) and found it to actually load faster than XSI in most > cases. > Memory consumption was often two to three times higher though - I was able > to load and work on scenes in XSI that wouldn't even fit in memory with > Maya. That was yeras ago, don't know if anything was improved in this > regard. > > Yes about 30 mins to load > On 22 May 2014 12:21, "Stefan Kubicek" wrote: > >> Is it done loading ? >> >> Currently loading a 12.3gb scene... >> On 22 May 2014 12:12, "Sebastien Sterling" >> wrote: >> >>> Could you say it is scalable? able to do games and films ? i agree that >>> from a TD perspective it seems ok, doesn't sweeten the pill for the end >>> user though. >>> >>> strengths, like it has more skinning algorithms then any other package: >>> Voxel, quaternion, heat... but then it also has weight painting so bad i >>> have never seen a TD ever use anything more then linear, or maybe >>> quaternion. >>> >>> Viewport 2.0 yea, that a legitimate better. >>> >>> >>> >>> On 22 May 2014 12:02, Mirko Jankovic wrote: >>> Also you ahve to ask more precicely. Do you mean strengths from technical point as it seems that TD guys loves it, or from artist point as it seems there is big difference there. On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 12:59 PM, Leendert A. Hartog < hirazib...@live.nl> wrote: > So, absolutely no strengths? Market leader on marketing voodoo alone? > Somehow I doubt that... ;) > > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > > >>> >> >> >> -- >> >> - >>Stefan Kubicek >> ste...@keyvis.at<%22ste...@keyvis.at%22+%3cste...@keyvis.at%3E> >> - >> Alfred Feierfeilstraße 3 >> A-2380 Perchtoldsdorf bei Wien >> Phone: +43 (0) 699 12614231 >>www.keyvis.at >> This email and its attachments are >> confidential and for the recipient only >> > > > > -- > > - >Stefan Kubicek > ste...@keyvis.at<%22ste...@keyvis.at%22+%3cste...@keyvis.at%3E> > - > Alfred Feierfeilstraße 3 > A-2380 Perchtoldsdorf bei Wien > Phone: +43 (0) 699 12614231 >www.keyvis.at > This email and its attachments are > confidential and for the recipient only >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Thanks for that... -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Total nightmare. Reminds me on stories of the making of Myst (the game), with sometimes hours of loading time. I couldn't imagine working like that. To be fair, I always found loading/saving in Maya pretty fast, even compared to XSI. I tried with scenes of equal complexity (lots of geo, but little to no construction history) and found it to actually load faster than XSI in most cases. Memory consumption was often two to three times higher though - I was able to load and work on scenes in XSI that wouldn't even fit in memory with Maya. That was yeras ago, don't know if anything was improved in this regard. Yes about 30 mins to load On 22 May 2014 12:21, "Stefan Kubicek" wrote: Is it done loading ? Currently loading a 12.3gb scene... On 22 May 2014 12:12, "Sebastien Sterling" wrote: Could you say it is scalable? able to do games and films ? i agree that from a TD perspective it seems ok, doesn't sweeten the pill for the end user though. strengths, like it has more skinning algorithms then any other package: Voxel, quaternion, heat... but then it also has weight painting so bad i have never seen a TD ever use anything more then linear, or maybe quaternion. Viewport 2.0 yea, that a legitimate better. On 22 May 2014 12:02, Mirko Jankovic wrote: Also you ahve to ask more precicely. Do you mean strengths from technical point as it seems that TD guys loves it, or from artist point as it seems there is big difference there. On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 12:59 PM, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: So, absolutely no strengths? Market leader on marketing voodoo alone? Somehow I doubt that... ;) -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com -- - Stefan Kubicek ste...@keyvis.at - Alfred Feierfeilstraße 3 A-2380 Perchtoldsdorf bei Wien Phone: +43 (0) 699 12614231 www.keyvis.at This email and its attachments are confidential and for the recipient only -- - Stefan Kubicek ste...@keyvis.at - Alfred Feierfeilstraße 3 A-2380 Perchtoldsdorf bei Wien Phone: +43 (0) 699 12614231 www.keyvis.at This email and its attachments are confidential and for the recipient only
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
And sorry yes this is just Bg environment geometry On 22 May 2014 12:37, "Rob Chapman" wrote: > Yes about 30 mins to load > On 22 May 2014 12:21, "Stefan Kubicek" wrote: > >> Is it done loading ? >> >> Currently loading a 12.3gb scene... >> On 22 May 2014 12:12, "Sebastien Sterling" >> wrote: >> >>> Could you say it is scalable? able to do games and films ? i agree that >>> from a TD perspective it seems ok, doesn't sweeten the pill for the end >>> user though. >>> >>> strengths, like it has more skinning algorithms then any other package: >>> Voxel, quaternion, heat... but then it also has weight painting so bad i >>> have never seen a TD ever use anything more then linear, or maybe >>> quaternion. >>> >>> Viewport 2.0 yea, that a legitimate better. >>> >>> >>> >>> On 22 May 2014 12:02, Mirko Jankovic wrote: >>> Also you ahve to ask more precicely. Do you mean strengths from technical point as it seems that TD guys loves it, or from artist point as it seems there is big difference there. On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 12:59 PM, Leendert A. Hartog < hirazib...@live.nl> wrote: > So, absolutely no strengths? Market leader on marketing voodoo alone? > Somehow I doubt that... ;) > > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > > >>> >> >> >> -- >> >> - >>Stefan Kubicek >> ste...@keyvis.at<%22ste...@keyvis.at%22+%3cste...@keyvis.at%3E> >> - >> Alfred Feierfeilstraße 3 >> A-2380 Perchtoldsdorf bei Wien >> Phone: +43 (0) 699 12614231 >>www.keyvis.at >> This email and its attachments are >> confidential and for the recipient only >> >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Yes about 30 mins to load On 22 May 2014 12:21, "Stefan Kubicek" wrote: > Is it done loading ? > > Currently loading a 12.3gb scene... > On 22 May 2014 12:12, "Sebastien Sterling" > wrote: > >> Could you say it is scalable? able to do games and films ? i agree that >> from a TD perspective it seems ok, doesn't sweeten the pill for the end >> user though. >> >> strengths, like it has more skinning algorithms then any other package: >> Voxel, quaternion, heat... but then it also has weight painting so bad i >> have never seen a TD ever use anything more then linear, or maybe >> quaternion. >> >> Viewport 2.0 yea, that a legitimate better. >> >> >> >> On 22 May 2014 12:02, Mirko Jankovic wrote: >> >>> Also you ahve to ask more precicely. >>> >>> Do you mean strengths from technical point as it seems that TD guys >>> loves it, or from artist point as it seems there is big difference there. >>> >>> >>> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 12:59 PM, Leendert A. Hartog >> > wrote: >>> So, absolutely no strengths? Market leader on marketing voodoo alone? Somehow I doubt that... ;) -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >>> >> > > > -- > > - >Stefan Kubicek > ste...@keyvis.at<%22ste...@keyvis.at%22+%3cste...@keyvis.at%3E> > - > Alfred Feierfeilstraße 3 > A-2380 Perchtoldsdorf bei Wien > Phone: +43 (0) 699 12614231 >www.keyvis.at > This email and its attachments are > confidential and for the recipient only >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
What does the scene consist off ? that would be an advantage, if it could hold more individual none instanced assets, when it comes to mesh density xsi outstrips it easily. you can in fact smooth a character in softimage and playback at a decent speed, something i have never witnessed in maya outside a playblast. On 22 May 2014 12:18, Rob Chapman wrote: > Currently loading a 12.3gb scene... > On 22 May 2014 12:12, "Sebastien Sterling" > wrote: > >> Could you say it is scalable? able to do games and films ? i agree that >> from a TD perspective it seems ok, doesn't sweeten the pill for the end >> user though. >> >> strengths, like it has more skinning algorithms then any other package: >> Voxel, quaternion, heat... but then it also has weight painting so bad i >> have never seen a TD ever use anything more then linear, or maybe >> quaternion. >> >> Viewport 2.0 yea, that a legitimate better. >> >> >> >> On 22 May 2014 12:02, Mirko Jankovic wrote: >> >>> Also you ahve to ask more precicely. >>> >>> Do you mean strengths from technical point as it seems that TD guys >>> loves it, or from artist point as it seems there is big difference there. >>> >>> >>> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 12:59 PM, Leendert A. Hartog >> > wrote: >>> So, absolutely no strengths? Market leader on marketing voodoo alone? Somehow I doubt that... ;) -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >>> >>
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Is it done loading ? Currently loading a 12.3gb scene... On 22 May 2014 12:12, "Sebastien Sterling" wrote: Could you say it is scalable? able to do games and films ? i agree that from a TD perspective it seems ok, doesn't sweeten the pill for the end user >>though. strengths, like it has more skinning algorithms then any other package: Voxel, quaternion, heat... but then it also has weight painting so bad i have >>never seen a TD ever use anything more then linear, or maybe quaternion. Viewport 2.0 yea, that a legitimate better. On 22 May 2014 12:02, Mirko Jankovic wrote: Also you ahve to ask more precicely. Do you mean strengths from technical point as it seems that TD guys loves it, or from artist point as it seems there is big difference there. On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 12:59 PM, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: So, absolutely no strengths? Market leader on marketing voodoo alone? Somehow I doubt that... ;) -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com -- - Stefan Kubicek ste...@keyvis.at - Alfred Feierfeilstraße 3 A-2380 Perchtoldsdorf bei Wien Phone: +43 (0) 699 12614231 www.keyvis.at This email and its attachments are confidential and for the recipient only
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
I find Maya to be more snapier to Character Animation than XSi, its Hard to explain, but i prefer to Character Animate there than in Xsi, but only that :) On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 1:18 PM, Rob Chapman wrote: > Currently loading a 12.3gb scene... > On 22 May 2014 12:12, "Sebastien Sterling" > wrote: > >> Could you say it is scalable? able to do games and films ? i agree that >> from a TD perspective it seems ok, doesn't sweeten the pill for the end >> user though. >> >> strengths, like it has more skinning algorithms then any other package: >> Voxel, quaternion, heat... but then it also has weight painting so bad i >> have never seen a TD ever use anything more then linear, or maybe >> quaternion. >> >> Viewport 2.0 yea, that a legitimate better. >> >> >> >> On 22 May 2014 12:02, Mirko Jankovic wrote: >> >>> Also you ahve to ask more precicely. >>> >>> Do you mean strengths from technical point as it seems that TD guys >>> loves it, or from artist point as it seems there is big difference there. >>> >>> >>> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 12:59 PM, Leendert A. Hartog >> > wrote: >>> So, absolutely no strengths? Market leader on marketing voodoo alone? Somehow I doubt that... ;) -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >>> >>
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Currently loading a 12.3gb scene... On 22 May 2014 12:12, "Sebastien Sterling" wrote: > Could you say it is scalable? able to do games and films ? i agree that > from a TD perspective it seems ok, doesn't sweeten the pill for the end > user though. > > strengths, like it has more skinning algorithms then any other package: > Voxel, quaternion, heat... but then it also has weight painting so bad i > have never seen a TD ever use anything more then linear, or maybe > quaternion. > > Viewport 2.0 yea, that a legitimate better. > > > > On 22 May 2014 12:02, Mirko Jankovic wrote: > >> Also you ahve to ask more precicely. >> >> Do you mean strengths from technical point as it seems that TD guys loves >> it, or from artist point as it seems there is big difference there. >> >> >> On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 12:59 PM, Leendert A. Hartog >> wrote: >> >>> So, absolutely no strengths? Market leader on marketing voodoo alone? >>> Somehow I doubt that... ;) >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue >>> Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >>> >>> >> >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Could you say it is scalable? able to do games and films ? i agree that from a TD perspective it seems ok, doesn't sweeten the pill for the end user though. strengths, like it has more skinning algorithms then any other package: Voxel, quaternion, heat... but then it also has weight painting so bad i have never seen a TD ever use anything more then linear, or maybe quaternion. Viewport 2.0 yea, that a legitimate better. On 22 May 2014 12:02, Mirko Jankovic wrote: > Also you ahve to ask more precicely. > > Do you mean strengths from technical point as it seems that TD guys loves > it, or from artist point as it seems there is big difference there. > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 12:59 PM, Leendert A. Hartog > wrote: > >> So, absolutely no strengths? Market leader on marketing voodoo alone? >> Somehow I doubt that... ;) >> >> >> -- >> >> Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue >> Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >> >> >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
My 5 cents: The viewport is more "modern", faster than XSI's, and supports DX11 shaders. The SDK is really open, there is hardly anything you don't have access to. Texture swimming works. The general notion of complex rig performance is that it's better than in XSI's. Fluids and Muscles out of the box, abeit not user friendly and of limited usability/stability. More robust NURBS import and surface modeling (e.g. curves on surface, etc). Better support from game-related 3rd parties (exporters to various game engines). MentalRay is a plugin (that has both pros and cons) -- - Stefan Kubicek ste...@keyvis.at -
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Both would interest me ATM. Greetz Leendert -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Also you ahve to ask more precicely. Do you mean strengths from technical point as it seems that TD guys loves it, or from artist point as it seems there is big difference there. On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 12:59 PM, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > So, absolutely no strengths? Market leader on marketing voodoo alone? > Somehow I doubt that... ;) > > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
So far I can think of one... viewport. And maybe better connection with 3rd party clients like game engines as it is more support then SI. The rest.. cant think of any right now really On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 12:10 PM, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > As a “perfect companion” to the very interesting “Houdini Weaknesses” > thread that has developed here recently, I would be interested not so much > in the weaknesses but in the specific strengths of Maya. The weaknesses > from a Softimage POV would seem to be pretty well documented, what > interests me here would be its strengths (if any, hopefully), its redeeming > features as it were, again from a Softimage POV. > I’m hoping all the experience bundled in this List could help paint a > realistic picture. > > Greetz > Leendert > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > > >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
You mean they didn't have a big team before :P On 22 May 2014 11:56, Mário Domingos wrote: > The biggest advantage I can see now is that they have a really big team > working to make it better. Let's if they can make it > > > On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 11:53 AM, Leendert A. Hartog > wrote: > >> Ah, shucks, give me something. I am just learning Maya and I could really >> use a little boost... ;) >> >> -- >> >> Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue >> Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com >> >> >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
So, absolutely no strengths? Market leader on marketing voodoo alone? Somehow I doubt that... ;) -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Yoouuu willl... never be alone in hell ? On 22 May 2014 11:53, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > Ah, shucks, give me something. I am just learning Maya and I could really > use a little boost... ;) > > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
The biggest advantage I can see now is that they have a really big team working to make it better. Let's if they can make it On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 11:53 AM, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > Ah, shucks, give me something. I am just learning Maya and I could really > use a little boost... ;) > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > >
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Ah, shucks, give me something. I am just learning Maya and I could really use a little boost... ;) -- Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
Re: Maya strengts (anyone?)
Isn't it allegedly easy to build pipelines around it ? that is the theory right ? also you can drive attributes without expressions. If i had to guess i'd say it does everything shittly out of the box, however... it does do EVERYTHING to some extent: Fur cloth fuids muscle sims... plus most of the Nucleus systems work together... If you have a team of dev's and TD's behind it, they can do quite a good job at salvaging the features? so if you are a big shop and you can afford to have a pipe built around it, that probably makes it viable... all be it in the worst way possible for the end user. On 22 May 2014 11:10, Leendert A. Hartog wrote: > As a “perfect companion” to the very interesting “Houdini Weaknesses” > thread that has developed here recently, I would be interested not so much > in the weaknesses but in the specific strengths of Maya. The weaknesses > from a Softimage POV would seem to be pretty well documented, what > interests me here would be its strengths (if any, hopefully), its redeeming > features as it were, again from a Softimage POV. > I’m hoping all the experience bundled in this List could help paint a > realistic picture. > > Greetz > Leendert > > -- > > Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue > Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com > > >