RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
In terms of overall migration FROM D3, UV is by far the easiest route - especially if you have "interesting" dictionary items. I remember a company wanted to buy our R5 application back in the mid-90's BUT it had to run under Unidata. We tried to sway this decision, BUT they already had UD in place. Anyway, the client outsourced the conversion directly to Unidata (as it was then, pre-Ardent), who speced it out as a 2 week project at the end of 2 weeks the timeline went out to a month, and at the end of that they were talking 6 months. Luckily the prospect had negotiated a fixed price with Unidata - and to cut a long story short, our R5 conversion into Unidata never happened, AND the prospect installed another system under jBASE !! (obviously my selling skills need improving). A few months later we did a conversion to UV - was all over in a day, another week to work out some spooler issues. YMMV, but as others have said, UD was always more like PR1ME Information than Pick. My bottom line for you, regardless of which platform is "better", I believe that your easiest migration would be to UV, and I don't think there are any "critical" things you would miss from UD (except for the RFS) Ross Ferris Stamina Software Visage an Evolution in Software Development >-Original Message- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-u2- >[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Piers Angliss >Sent: Saturday, 25 September 2004 12:41 AM >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe > >IMHO. > >They are very similar, with hundreds of differences - whether any are >significant to you depends on where you're coming from and what you want to >do. > >They are both M/value (Pick-like, post-relational, NFNN ...) multi-user >databases running on *nix or Windows servers. > >They have an embedded programming language (a form of Basic), a proprietary >command and enquiry interface and support for SQL. > >There are some differences in the way in which they administer files >(tables) and in the syntax of the user interface. > >UniVerse has a number of flavours (Pick, Prime Information, vanilla...) >with >syntactical differences to assist users who have migrated from particular >platforms. Unidata does not have such differences. > >Both provide support for client-server architecture, xml, web, odbc etc ... >and there are plenty on this list who can answer specific questions on >these >areas. > >I switch between the two as a multi-site developer three or four times a >day >and barely notice it most of the time, but if I were a single-site >developer >looking to maximise performance or functionality of a single system I'm >sure >I'd be doing things on one that the other did differently. > >Where are you coming from and where do you wish to go (probably in your >original post but I no longer have that, sorry) > >Piers > >- > >Yes, it does. But we've strayed considerably from my original question >which was: > >What's the difference between UniVerse and UniData? > >-- >Bob Little >Graphik Dimensions, Ltd. >High Point, NC >--- >u2-users mailing list >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ > > >--- >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >Version: 6.0.770 / Virus Database: 517 - Release Date: 27/09/2004 > --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.770 / Virus Database: 517 - Release Date: 27/09/2004 --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
I'd still go for a GUI editor - sure beats having to type in all of those spaces :-) Ross Ferris Stamina Software Visage an Evolution in Software Development >-Original Message- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-u2- >[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jerry Banker >Sent: Friday, 24 September 2004 7:13 AM >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe > >One thing I miss from the Prime editor is overlay. All you had to do is >space out to where you wanted to overly the text and overlay with the new >characters. It was very useful when you had a long string with several >instances of the same type of information and you only wanted to change one >area. >Example: >DATA = 'AAABBBCCCAAABBBCCCAAABBBCCC' >O ZZZ >DATA = 'AAABBBCCCAAABBBCCCZZZBBBCCC' >Sure beat having to type the whole line or doing a long change. > > >- Original Message - >From: "Warren, Phil" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Sent: Thursday, September 23, 2004 2:24 PM >Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe > > >As a system administrator, my choice is to use vi for my UNIX/AIX duties, >but I find it's quite a useful tool for program editing too. In fact, I'm >the only one in our shop that uses vi on a regular basis. I still can't >figure out why the remainder of our programming staff use AE. I agree it >has it's place for some tasks, but for day to day editing, I find vi easy >to >use, and it didn't take too long to get used to, when I learned it years >ago. The best part is that you'll find it on most flavors of UNIX boxes, >and the basic commands stay the same. -Phil- > >-Original Message- >From: Louis Guillaume [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 2004 7:52 PM >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe > > >Adrian Matthews wrote: >> Does anyone actually use the editor for cutting code these days though? >> > >Absolutely! From what I've seen, most folks who take the time to learn >vi will never go back. > >The only thing AE is good for is macro-fixing savedlists of records, >IMHO. It really astonishes me that folks continue to use AE for editing >programs where you can really only look at one line at a time. > >> I've been using full screen GUI editors for years now. I think I'd pull >> my hair out going back. > >GUI editors generally lack many of the vi features: use of regular >expressions, superior cut and paste, multiple cut/paste buffers, the >ability to read the output of external commands into the file, the >ability to employ Unix shell utilities (like sed or awk) to edit the >file etc etc. > >The only GUI editor I'd use for programming is vim! It is absolutely >worth it to learn vi or vim for editing in UniData (and, I'm sure >UniVerse too). If you're on Windows, there's Vim for Windows. > >I don't know much about UniVerse, but I can't imagine that an editor >should make any difference as most editors should be available to either >platform. On UniData just set the variable UDT_EDIT=/usr/local/bin/vim >(or whatever your editor is) and voila. > >-- Louis >--- >u2-users mailing list >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ >--- >u2-users mailing list >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ >--- >u2-users mailing list >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ > > >--- >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >Version: 6.0.770 / Virus Database: 517 - Release Date: 27/09/2004 > --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.770 / Virus Database: 517 - Release Date: 27/09/2004 --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Of course, if you have PRC and Wintegrate (not just dynamic connect) then Unieditor can lock (and check out and track) the file you are editing. Just so you know... >Date: Sun, 26 Sep 2004 15:16:46 -0400 >From: Dave Walker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe > >Gordon Glorfield wrote: >>Now, in the 21st century, I use the UniDebugger exclusively for both coding >>and data fixes. The color coding of the source makes it visually pleasing. >>The cut and paste, drag and drop, etc. make it a great productivity >>increasing tool. Best of all it's free! Or at least it comes with the DB >>license. >> >>Gordon J. Glorfield >>Sr. Applications Developer >>MAMSI (A UnitedHealth Company) >>301-360-8839 >> >> >Only problem we've found is that it doesn't lock the file that you're >editing. Makes its use problematic in a multi-programmer shop. --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
DISCLAIMER: This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please delete it and notify the sender immediately. Please note that there is no guarantee that this email or any attachment is virus free or has not been intercepted or amended. We are in the middle of implenting Turtle for use between our two programmer sites. (it's running at one, nearly at the other) It seems like a good idea to me and as mentioned before, it's free. Andy Moore Selima Software Ltd. -Original Message- From: Brian Leach [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 28 September 2004 11:59 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe CVS is free. WinCVS is free. TurtleCVS (integrates with Windows Explorer and Apache) is free. PRC isn't, but I've heard good things about it... ...the real question is, You can afford NOT to have a version control system? Brian -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dennis Bartlett Sent: 28 September 2004 11:17 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe You can afford a version control system? -Original Message- From: Adrian Matthews [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, 26 September, 2004 9:41 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe Surely you use a version control system in a multi-programmer environment? - GWK BEPERK/LIMITED (REG: 1997/022252/06) POSBUS 47 PO BOX 8730 DOUGLAS Direkteure/Directors: NB Jacobs, FJ Lawrence, J v/d S Botes, JH Coetzee, JGD Smit, JF Jacobs, AO M|ller, JW Smit, JP Snyman, JG Stander, JH van Dyk(MD/BD), JG Jacobs, A M|ller, M van Zyl, Sekr/Secr: E van Niekerk. Hierdie e-pos is onderworpe aan 'n vrywaring beskikbaar by: http://www.gwk.co.za/DisclaimerVrywaring.asp This e-mail is subjected to the disclaimer that can be viewed at: http://www.gwk.co.za/DisclaimerVrywaring.asp --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ This email was checked by MessageLabs SkyScan before entering Microgen. This email was checked on leaving Microgen for viruses, similar malicious code and inappropriate content by MessageLabs SkyScan. DISCLAIMER This email and any attachments are confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the named recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information. In the event of any technical difficulty with this email, please contact the sender or [EMAIL PROTECTED] Microgen Information Management Solutions http://www.microgen.co.uk --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Dennis Bartlett wrote: You can afford a version control system? ??? CVS + winCVS are gnulicensed thus cost only installation and learning time i.e. as close to free as you can come.:-) I think you can find them on sourceforge.net -- mats --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
There is also no reason why you cannot write one yourself... It's as simple as putting a wrapper around an edit function to write items into a project tagged with the programmer assigned name, and prevent others from editing the same item. As the item is completed it rolls it into a separate area for installation. Of course I mapped it out in a very simple manner but it is relativity easy to do. Most people bawk at having to use it at first but then appreciate it when their work is no longer stepped on. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Brian Leach Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 2004 6:59 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe CVS is free. WinCVS is free. TurtleCVS (integrates with Windows Explorer and Apache) is free. PRC isn't, but I've heard good things about it... ...the real question is, You can afford NOT to have a version control system? Brian -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dennis Bartlett Sent: 28 September 2004 11:17 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe You can afford a version control system? -Original Message- From: Adrian Matthews [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, 26 September, 2004 9:41 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe Surely you use a version control system in a multi-programmer environment? - GWK BEPERK/LIMITED (REG: 1997/022252/06) POSBUS 47 PO BOX 8730 DOUGLAS Direkteure/Directors: NB Jacobs, FJ Lawrence, J v/d S Botes, JH Coetzee, JGD Smit, JF Jacobs, AO M|ller, JW Smit, JP Snyman, JG Stander, JH van Dyk(MD/BD), JG Jacobs, A M|ller, M van Zyl, Sekr/Secr: E van Niekerk. Hierdie e-pos is onderworpe aan 'n vrywaring beskikbaar by: http://www.gwk.co.za/DisclaimerVrywaring.asp This e-mail is subjected to the disclaimer that can be viewed at: http://www.gwk.co.za/DisclaimerVrywaring.asp --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ This email was checked by MessageLabs SkyScan before entering Microgen. This email was checked on leaving Microgen for viruses, similar malicious code and inappropriate content by MessageLabs SkyScan. DISCLAIMER This email and any attachments are confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the named recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information. In the event of any technical difficulty with this email, please contact the sender or [EMAIL PROTECTED] Microgen Information Management Solutions http://www.microgen.co.uk --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
CVS is free. WinCVS is free. TurtleCVS (integrates with Windows Explorer and Apache) is free. PRC isn't, but I've heard good things about it... ...the real question is, You can afford NOT to have a version control system? Brian -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dennis Bartlett Sent: 28 September 2004 11:17 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe You can afford a version control system? -Original Message- From: Adrian Matthews [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, 26 September, 2004 9:41 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe Surely you use a version control system in a multi-programmer environment? - GWK BEPERK/LIMITED (REG: 1997/022252/06) POSBUS 47 PO BOX 8730 DOUGLAS Direkteure/Directors: NB Jacobs, FJ Lawrence, J v/d S Botes, JH Coetzee, JGD Smit, JF Jacobs, AO M|ller, JW Smit, JP Snyman, JG Stander, JH van Dyk(MD/BD), JG Jacobs, A M|ller, M van Zyl, Sekr/Secr: E van Niekerk. Hierdie e-pos is onderworpe aan 'n vrywaring beskikbaar by: http://www.gwk.co.za/DisclaimerVrywaring.asp This e-mail is subjected to the disclaimer that can be viewed at: http://www.gwk.co.za/DisclaimerVrywaring.asp --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ This email was checked by MessageLabs SkyScan before entering Microgen. This email was checked on leaving Microgen for viruses, similar malicious code and inappropriate content by MessageLabs SkyScan. DISCLAIMER This email and any attachments are confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the named recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information. In the event of any technical difficulty with this email, please contact the sender or [EMAIL PROTECTED] Microgen Information Management Solutions http://www.microgen.co.uk --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
You can afford a version control system? -Original Message- From: Adrian Matthews [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, 26 September, 2004 9:41 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe Surely you use a version control system in a multi-programmer environment? - GWK BEPERK/LIMITED (REG: 1997/022252/06) POSBUS 47 PO BOX 8730 DOUGLAS Direkteure/Directors: NB Jacobs, FJ Lawrence, J v/d S Botes, JH Coetzee, JGD Smit, JF Jacobs, AO M|ller, JW Smit, JP Snyman, JG Stander, JH van Dyk(MD/BD), JG Jacobs, A M|ller, M van Zyl, Sekr/Secr: E van Niekerk. Hierdie e-pos is onderworpe aan 'n vrywaring beskikbaar by: http://www.gwk.co.za/DisclaimerVrywaring.asp This e-mail is subjected to the disclaimer that can be viewed at: http://www.gwk.co.za/DisclaimerVrywaring.asp --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Please post follow-ups to the "U2-Community" list. The two primary authorities on the origin of the letters "NT" are Dave Cutler and Mark Lucovsky. Dave Cutler has confirmed the "WNT" = "VMS incremented" urban legend, but Cutler's confirmation isn't very credible, and is probably one of his noted pranks. The credible, but much less fun, story is the version told by Mark Lucovsky, who says that "NT" meant "N ten" architecture, and refers to the RISC chip which was the original platform for "NT OS/2" before moving to the x86 platform. Lucovsky's story is far more credible than Cutler's because the letters "NT" were being used in "NT OS/2" *before* the product name was changed to "Windows NT". Here's a nice little introduction to the world of Messrs Cutler and Lucovsky. Re-assemble the URL below (assuming it gets split into 2 lines by my email program.) http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/server/evaluation/news/fromms/kanoarchi tect.asp -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ The information contained in this e-mail message may be privileged and confidential information and is intended only for the use of the individual and/or entity identified in the alias address of this message. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible to deliver it to the intended recipient, you are hereby requested not to distribute or copy this communication. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by telephone or return e-mail and delete the original message from your system. --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Gang, Shall we move this to the Community board? - Charles Barouch, Moderator Bruce Nichol wrote: > Goo'day, > > IIRC, isn't there a "HAL" document as part of Win NT4 documentation - > "Hardware Acceptance Layer" - something to do with hardware and > peripherals that'll work in the NT4 environment.? > > More spooky! > > At 13:23 28/09/04, you wrote: > >> Stuart Boydell wrote: >> >>> shift one letter to the right: >>> HAL -> IBM (2001 Space Odessey) >>> VMS -> WNT (Windows NT) >>> ...even the name is unoriginal. >>> >>> >> Heh hehe. >> Spooky! >> -- >> >> Bob Little >> Graphik Dimensions, Ltd. >> High Point, NC >> >> Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. >> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus (http://www.grisoft.com). >> Version: 7.0.271 / Virus Database: 264.9.7 - Release Date: 27/09/04 > > > Regards, > > Bruce Nichol > Talon Computer Services > ALBURYNSW 2640 > Australia > > Tel: +61 (0)411149636 > Fax: +61 (0)260232119 > > If it ain't broke, fix it till it is! [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type text/x-vcard which had a name of u2ug.vcf] --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
That'd be the "Hardware Abstraction Layer" -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bruce Nichol Sent: Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:09 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe Goo'day, IIRC, isn't there a "HAL" document as part of Win NT4 documentation - "Hardware Acceptance Layer" - something to do with hardware and peripherals that'll work in the NT4 environment.? More spooky! --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Goo'day, IIRC, isn't there a "HAL" document as part of Win NT4 documentation - "Hardware Acceptance Layer" - something to do with hardware and peripherals that'll work in the NT4 environment.? More spooky! At 13:23 28/09/04, you wrote: Stuart Boydell wrote: shift one letter to the right: HAL -> IBM (2001 Space Odessey) VMS -> WNT (Windows NT) ...even the name is unoriginal. Heh hehe. Spooky! -- Bob Little Graphik Dimensions, Ltd. High Point, NC Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 7.0.271 / Virus Database: 264.9.7 - Release Date: 27/09/04 Regards, Bruce Nichol Talon Computer Services ALBURYNSW 2640 Australia Tel: +61 (0)411149636 Fax: +61 (0)260232119 If it ain't broke, fix it till it is! -- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 7.0.271 / Virus Database: 264.9.7 - Release Date: 27/09/04 --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Stuart Boydell wrote: shift one letter to the right: HAL -> IBM (2001 Space Odessey) VMS -> WNT (Windows NT) ...even the name is unoriginal. Heh hehe. Spooky! -- Bob Little Graphik Dimensions, Ltd. High Point, NC --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
> You're right about this. My Sister worked pretty extensively with the > internals of VMS and she said when she looked at the code of NT > she said it was very close to copyright infringement. shift one letter to the right: HAL -> IBM (2001 Space Odessey) VMS -> WNT (Windows NT) ...even the name is unoriginal. ** This email message and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of addressed recipient(s). If you have received this email in error please notify the Spotless IS Support Centre (61 3 9269 7555) immediately who will advise further action. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been scanned for the presence of computer viruses. ** --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
IIRC the head architect of NT (David Cutler) came from Digital. Here is an article going through the background of NT and where it came from http://www.winnetmag.com/Article/ArticleID/4494/4494.html Regards David Logan Database Administrator HP Managed Services 139 Frome Street, Adelaide 5000 Australia +61 8 8408 4273 - Work +61 417 268 665 - Mobile +61 8 8408 4259 - Fax -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jerry Banker Sent: Tuesday, 28 September 2004 8:54 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe You're right about this. My Sister worked pretty extensively with the internals of VMS and she said when she looked at the code of NT she said it was very close to copyright infringement. - Original Message - From: "Rosenberg Ben" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> was that UniData was already running on VMS, which was in some ways a precursor to NT. --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
You're right about this. My Sister worked pretty extensively with the internals of VMS and she said when she looked at the code of NT she said it was very close to copyright infringement. - Original Message - From: "Rosenberg Ben" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> was that UniData was already running on VMS, which was in some ways a precursor to NT. --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
> -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-u2- > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rosenberg Ben > Sent: Monday, September 27, 2004 12:49 PM > To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' > Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe > > > -Original Message- > > From: Dawn M. Wolthuis [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > I don't know if this is true, but it is the way > > I think of it -- UniData is more tied to the OS > > (which was UNIX from the start) and, therefore, > > a bit harder to work with the Windows/NT version. > > Sorry Dawn, you've got this backwards. > > UniData wasn't more UNIX-centric. > (Unless you believed Unidata Inc.'s marketers.) > > UniData was more C-centric, > and more OS-independent. > > UniData was running on both VMS and on UNIX > back when UniVerse was running only on UNIX. Good point. I experienced some pain with Windows NT and that is likely where my misconception came from. > UniData used (and still uses) standard libraries > and standard system calls more than UniVerse does. > > You can see this on Unix by running a benchmark, > where you'll see that UniData uses more "system" > cpu time, while UniVerse uses more "user" cpu time. > (Typically, UDT is 70% "system" and UV is 70% "user".) > > When UniData was initially ported to VMS, it compiled > and ran okay on the very first attempt. Of course, > that was followed by a lot of VMS-specific features > before the VMS version was ready for Prime-time, > but the use of standard libraries made it easier > to port UDT to a new host o/s platform. > > A contractor in Seattle who converted both > UniVerse and UniData to NT said that UniData was > easier. In addition to UniData using more > standard C libraries, the other reason for this > was that UniData was already running on VMS, > which was in some ways a precursor to NT. Interesting ... was it Digital folks who went over to Microsoft or what is it that makes VMS a bit of a precursor to NT? > UniVerse being slightly more of a VM (virtual > machine) means that UniVerse needs more os-specific > code for each host o/s platform > under which that VM runs. Yes and my impression, although I'll believe I was wrong about it, was that because UniVerse is slightly more of a VM, it shields the user-developer more from the underlying OS. > You can argue either way as to whether the > additional platform-specific code in UniVerse > leads to them being better "integrated" with > the host o/s, but you can't argue with the fact > that the architecture makes it slightly harder > to port UniVerse to a new platform. But easier for the end-developer to port their code from one platform to another? Just wondering as that was my perception, which might be unfounded. Thanks --dawn --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
> -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-u2- > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rosenberg Ben > Sent: Monday, September 27, 2004 12:49 PM > To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' > Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe > > > -Original Message- > > From: Dawn M. Wolthuis [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > I don't know if this is true, but it is the way > > I think of it -- UniData is more tied to the OS > > (which was UNIX from the start) and, therefore, > > a bit harder to work with the Windows/NT version. > > Sorry Dawn, you've got this backwards. > > UniData wasn't more UNIX-centric. > (Unless you believed Unidata Inc.'s marketers.) > > UniData was more C-centric, > and more OS-independent. > > UniData was running on both VMS and on UNIX > back when UniVerse was running only on UNIX. Good point. I experienced some pain with Windows NT and that is likely where my misconception came from. > UniData used (and still uses) standard libraries > and standard system calls more than UniVerse does. > > You can see this on Unix by running a benchmark, > where you'll see that UniData uses more "system" > cpu time, while UniVerse uses more "user" cpu time. > (Typically, UDT is 70% "system" and UV is 70% "user".) > > When UniData was initially ported to VMS, it compiled > and ran okay on the very first attempt. Of course, > that was followed by a lot of VMS-specific features > before the VMS version was ready for Prime-time, > but the use of standard libraries made it easier > to port UDT to a new host o/s platform. > > A contractor in Seattle who converted both > UniVerse and UniData to NT said that UniData was > easier. In addition to UniData using more > standard C libraries, the other reason for this > was that UniData was already running on VMS, > which was in some ways a precursor to NT. Interesting ... was it Digital folks who went over to Microsoft or what is it that makes VMS a bit of a precursor to NT? > UniVerse being slightly more of a VM (virtual > machine) means that UniVerse needs more os-specific > code for each host o/s platform > under which that VM runs. Yes and my impression, although I'll believe I was wrong about it, was that because UniVerse is slightly more of a VM, it shields the user-developer more from the underlying OS. > You can argue either way as to whether the > additional platform-specific code in UniVerse > leads to them being better "integrated" with > the host o/s, but you can't argue with the fact > that the architecture makes it slightly harder > to port UniVerse to a new platform. But easier for the end-developer to port their code from one platform to another? Just wondering as that was my perception, which might be unfounded. Thanks --dawn --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
I wrote: > -Original Message- > From: Rosenberg Ben > UniVerse BASIC does have some ULT features (for example, > ULT EXECUTE syntax) which are missing from UniVerse BASIC. Oops. I meant to say that UniVerse BASIC has some ULT features that are missing from *** UniData UniBASIC ***. --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ The information contained in this e-mail message may be privileged and confidential information and is intended only for the use of the individual and/or entity identified in the alias address of this message. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible to deliver it to the intended recipient, you are hereby requested not to distribute or copy this communication. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by telephone or return e-mail and delete the original message from your system. --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Surely you use a version control system in a multi-programmer environment? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dave Walker Sent: 26 September 2004 20:17 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe Gordon Glorfield wrote: >I absolutely hate AE. Come on folks, can we please join the rest of the >human race in the 21st century? The eighties are over. Even back then I >felt the old Jet editor was better than ED/AE. > >Now, in the 21st century, I use the UniDebugger exclusively for both coding >and data fixes. The color coding of the source makes it visually pleasing. >The cut and paste, drag and drop, etc. make it a great productivity >increasing tool. Best of all it's free! Or at least it comes with the DB >license. > >Gordon J. Glorfield >Sr. Applications Developer >MAMSI (A UnitedHealth Company) >301-360-8839 > > Only problem we've found is that it doesn't lock the file that you're editing. Makes its use problematic in a multi-programmer shop. --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ The information contained in this email is strictly confidential and for the use of the addressee only, unless otherwise indicated. If you are not the intended recipient, please do not read, copy, use or disclose to others this message or any attachment. Please also notify the sender by replying to this email or by telephone +44 (0)20 7896 0011 and then delete the email and any copies of it. Opinions, conclusions (etc.) that do not relate to the official business of this company shall be understood as neither given nor endorsed by it. IG Markets Limited and IG Index Plc are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority and, in Australia, by the Australian Securities and Investments Commission. --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Gordon Glorfield wrote: I absolutely hate AE. Come on folks, can we please join the rest of the human race in the 21st century? The eighties are over. Even back then I felt the old Jet editor was better than ED/AE. Now, in the 21st century, I use the UniDebugger exclusively for both coding and data fixes. The color coding of the source makes it visually pleasing. The cut and paste, drag and drop, etc. make it a great productivity increasing tool. Best of all it's free! Or at least it comes with the DB license. Gordon J. Glorfield Sr. Applications Developer MAMSI (A UnitedHealth Company) 301-360-8839 Only problem we've found is that it doesn't lock the file that you're editing. Makes its use problematic in a multi-programmer shop. --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
For a picture of the history that led to U2, see http://www.tincat-group.com/images/MVFamilyTreeColor.pdf If you are migrating from D3, I would recommend using UniVerse (even though I have more background with UniData). It is friendlier to Pick language features. You might be able to see from the Family Tree why it has more Pick in it than does UniData. In addition to their clean-room version of UniVerse, based on Prime Information, they bought a product that originated in the Pick thread of the languages and incorporated it into UniVerse. --dawn Dawn M. Wolthuis Tincat Group, Inc. www.tincat-group.com Take and give some delight today. > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-u2- > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bob Little > Sent: Friday, September 24, 2004 10:59 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe > > Piers Angliss wrote: > > >IMHO. > > > >They are very similar, with hundreds of differences - whether any are > >significant to you depends on where you're coming from and what you want > to > >do. > > > >Where are you coming from and where do you wish to go > > > We are running AIX/D3 right now. > The question has been raised "Do we want to stay with Pick or move to > another database?" Common sense, in this case, dictates stay on Pick. > > I have started looking into the different MV database products > available: Revelation(?), jBASE, QM, and the U2 products. My initial > question was: "Why two different products? What's the difference?" > > That's all really. > > > <>(probably in your original post but I no longer have that, sorry) > > Yeah, I don't think *I* even have that anymore. 'Twas a while back by > now :) > <> > > -- > Bob Little > Graphik Dimensions, Ltd. > High Point, NC > --- > u2-users mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
The reason for two products is historical, very broadly : UniVerse was developed by a company called VMark Unidata was developed by a company called Unidata They competed for a number of years Then they merged and became Ardent, with two products. I think they considered merging the products but decided against it Ardent was then taken over by Informix, nothing much happened Informix was taken over by IBM, there is more activity Still two products -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Bob Little Sent: 24 September 2004 16:59 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe Piers Angliss wrote: >IMHO. > >They are very similar, with hundreds of differences - whether any are >significant to you depends on where you're coming from and what you want to >do. > >Where are you coming from and where do you wish to go > We are running AIX/D3 right now. The question has been raised "Do we want to stay with Pick or move to another database?" Common sense, in this case, dictates stay on Pick. I have started looking into the different MV database products available: Revelation(?), jBASE, QM, and the U2 products. My initial question was: "Why two different products? What's the difference?" That's all really. > <>(probably in your original post but I no longer have that, sorry) Yeah, I don't think *I* even have that anymore. 'Twas a while back by now :) <> -- Bob Little Graphik Dimensions, Ltd. High Point, NC --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Bob, "Why two different products? What's the difference?" The reason for two products is historical. UniVerse and UniData were originally developed by different companies. They used to compete for the same market share. In a practical sense, the difference I've seen is that UniData tends to be in the largest shops while UniVerse seems to be more in the small to mid-size shops. That isn't an analysis of the products, it's just an observation. -- - Charles Barouch (718) 762-3884 x 1 - Key Ally Voice Mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Consulting services [EMAIL PROTECTED] - News [EMAIL PROTECTED] - U2-Users Moderator [EMAIL PROTECTED]- Zeus Data Integration Mount Olympus, Home of Zeus Data Integration --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
I didn't mean to start the "editor" discussion, but it was informative. Anyway, AFAIK UniData supports only Prime-type dictionaries, while UniVerse supports both Pick and Prime style dictionaries. If converting from a Pick system, UniVerse is easier from a dictionary standpoint. Dick Kryka Director of Applications CCCS of Greater Denver, Inc. Paragon Financial Services 303-632-2226 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Beahm Sent: Friday, September 24, 2004 8:51 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe I didn't voice my opinion earlier because I know this list has a lot of developers with more experience in both than I do, but here goes... One of the most critical elements in the MV market has been cross-system compatibility. Companies have invested in systems and like what they've got -- they just want to move to a newer box and/or add new capabilities. UniData and UniVerse, having been originally developed by different companies, meet this need in different ways. In UniVerse, one creates an account and decides what "flavor" the account will be. Largely this is a matter of command line and BASIC syntax, although it also affects details such as how select lists are handled in certain situations, etc. There are some ways to add elements from alternate flavors, but things are generally set once you create the account. In UniData, the different syntaxes and behaviors are intermingled but can be specifically accessed by setting runtime variables (UDT options, BASICTYPE, ECLTYPE, using lowercase commands) at the command line or within programs. If you wanted to bring together code from a variety of systems, UD would probably support that better than UV. Even so, the syntax is about 80% identical between them. Each has unique methods for file processing, which comes dramatically into play when file sizes exceed 2GB. AFAIK UniData has one method for dealing with large files (make them dynamic), while UniVerse has a few (part files that break one file into many, 64-bit file addressing, maybe something else?) The UniData debugger is significantly better than UV's, however I believe if you use UniDebugger this point becomes less significant. Both provide nearly identical support for UniObjects in developing VB/VCC/.Net/Java applications. UD has a GUI tool for defining ODBC schema while UV relies on DICT entries and a few other settings. It seems to me that UV tries to figure things out for ODBC on the fly, while UD decides ahead of time and applies less forgiving but faster logic. There are dozens of little things that one offers that the other doesn't, things one person loves and another hates. For instance I wish UD supported Q-pointers (shortcuts to files in other accounts), and I wish UV allowed sending LIST output straight to a file the way UD does. In both cases I made workarounds for these, but it's always nicer to have these things out of the box. Fortunately, features added to one are also being added to the other, so IBM is doing a nice job with that. I hope that helps clear things up, and I hope I didn't get too much wrong. ;^) I expect others will be along shortly with corrections/explanations/rationalizations/pontifications. Best, David Beahm Bob Little wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > >> Since this thread seems to be going on forever.. >> >> > > Yes, it does. But we've strayed considerably from my original question > which was: > > What's the difference between UniVerse and UniData? --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Piers Angliss wrote: >IMHO. > >They are very similar, with hundreds of differences - whether any are >significant to you depends on where you're coming from and what you want to >do. > >Where are you coming from and where do you wish to go > We are running AIX/D3 right now. The question has been raised "Do we want to stay with Pick or move to another database?" Common sense, in this case, dictates stay on Pick. I have started looking into the different MV database products available: Revelation(?), jBASE, QM, and the U2 products. My initial question was: "Why two different products? What's the difference?" That's all really. > <>(probably in your original post but I no longer have that, sorry) Yeah, I don't think *I* even have that anymore. 'Twas a while back by now :) <> -- Bob Little Graphik Dimensions, Ltd. High Point, NC --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
I didn't voice my opinion earlier because I know this list has a lot of developers with more experience in both than I do, but here goes... One of the most critical elements in the MV market has been cross-system compatibility. Companies have invested in systems and like what they've got -- they just want to move to a newer box and/or add new capabilities. UniData and UniVerse, having been originally developed by different companies, meet this need in different ways. In UniVerse, one creates an account and decides what "flavor" the account will be. Largely this is a matter of command line and BASIC syntax, although it also affects details such as how select lists are handled in certain situations, etc. There are some ways to add elements from alternate flavors, but things are generally set once you create the account. In UniData, the different syntaxes and behaviors are intermingled but can be specifically accessed by setting runtime variables (UDT options, BASICTYPE, ECLTYPE, using lowercase commands) at the command line or within programs. If you wanted to bring together code from a variety of systems, UD would probably support that better than UV. Even so, the syntax is about 80% identical between them. Each has unique methods for file processing, which comes dramatically into play when file sizes exceed 2GB. AFAIK UniData has one method for dealing with large files (make them dynamic), while UniVerse has a few (part files that break one file into many, 64-bit file addressing, maybe something else?) The UniData debugger is significantly better than UV's, however I believe if you use UniDebugger this point becomes less significant. Both provide nearly identical support for UniObjects in developing VB/VCC/.Net/Java applications. UD has a GUI tool for defining ODBC schema while UV relies on DICT entries and a few other settings. It seems to me that UV tries to figure things out for ODBC on the fly, while UD decides ahead of time and applies less forgiving but faster logic. There are dozens of little things that one offers that the other doesn't, things one person loves and another hates. For instance I wish UD supported Q-pointers (shortcuts to files in other accounts), and I wish UV allowed sending LIST output straight to a file the way UD does. In both cases I made workarounds for these, but it's always nicer to have these things out of the box. Fortunately, features added to one are also being added to the other, so IBM is doing a nice job with that. I hope that helps clear things up, and I hope I didn't get too much wrong. ;^) I expect others will be along shortly with corrections/explanations/rationalizations/pontifications. Best, David Beahm Bob Little wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Since this thread seems to be going on forever.. Yes, it does. But we've strayed considerably from my original question which was: What's the difference between UniVerse and UniData? --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
IMHO. They are very similar, with hundreds of differences - whether any are significant to you depends on where you're coming from and what you want to do. They are both M/value (Pick-like, post-relational, NFNN ...) multi-user databases running on *nix or Windows servers. They have an embedded programming language (a form of Basic), a proprietary command and enquiry interface and support for SQL. There are some differences in the way in which they administer files (tables) and in the syntax of the user interface. UniVerse has a number of flavours (Pick, Prime Information, vanilla...) with syntactical differences to assist users who have migrated from particular platforms. Unidata does not have such differences. Both provide support for client-server architecture, xml, web, odbc etc ... and there are plenty on this list who can answer specific questions on these areas. I switch between the two as a multi-site developer three or four times a day and barely notice it most of the time, but if I were a single-site developer looking to maximise performance or functionality of a single system I'm sure I'd be doing things on one that the other did differently. Where are you coming from and where do you wish to go (probably in your original post but I no longer have that, sorry) Piers - Yes, it does. But we've strayed considerably from my original question which was: What's the difference between UniVerse and UniData? -- Bob Little Graphik Dimensions, Ltd. High Point, NC --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
>Yes, it does. But we've strayed considerably from my original question >which was: It sure has 'strayed considerably' !! grs --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Since this thread seems to be going on forever.. Yes, it does. But we've strayed considerably from my original question which was: What's the difference between UniVerse and UniData? -- Bob Little Graphik Dimensions, Ltd. High Point, NC --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
What I miss is the companionship of the horse when plowing the fields. Using a tractor and getting paid by the hour is not as much fun. But more efficient Garry Smith Dir. Info Systems Charles McMurray Company V# 559-292-5782 F# 559-346-6169 CONFIDENCE NOTICE: This is an e-mail message, theretofore may have many accompanying documents, and is truly for the intended recipient(s) and heretofore may contain data and information. Surely any unauthorized review, use, disclosure, distribution or copying could become arum nauseous. If you are not the intended recipient, please look deep within yourself by any means and immediately forgo digesting the original message. > -Original Message- > From: Jerry Banker [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Thursday, September 23, 2004 2:13 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe > > One thing I miss from the Prime editor is overlay. All you had to do is > space out to where you wanted to overly the text and overlay with the new > characters. It was very useful when you had a long string with several > instances of the same type of information and you only wanted to change > one > area. > Example: > DATA = 'AAABBBCCCAAABBBCCCAAABBBCCC' > O ZZZ > DATA = 'AAABBBCCCAAABBBCCCZZZBBBCCC' > Sure beat having to type the whole line or doing a long change. > > > - Original Message - > From: "Warren, Phil" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Thursday, September 23, 2004 2:24 PM > Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe > > > As a system administrator, my choice is to use vi for my UNIX/AIX duties, > but I find it's quite a useful tool for program editing too. In fact, I'm > the only one in our shop that uses vi on a regular basis. I still can't > figure out why the remainder of our programming staff use AE. I agree it > has it's place for some tasks, but for day to day editing, I find vi easy > to > use, and it didn't take too long to get used to, when I learned it years > ago. The best part is that you'll find it on most flavors of UNIX boxes, > and the basic commands stay the same. -Phil- > > -----Original Message- > From: Louis Guillaume [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 2004 7:52 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe > > > Adrian Matthews wrote: > > Does anyone actually use the editor for cutting code these days though? > > > > Absolutely! From what I've seen, most folks who take the time to learn > vi will never go back. > > The only thing AE is good for is macro-fixing savedlists of records, > IMHO. It really astonishes me that folks continue to use AE for editing > programs where you can really only look at one line at a time. > > > I've been using full screen GUI editors for years now. I think I'd pull > > my hair out going back. > > GUI editors generally lack many of the vi features: use of regular > expressions, superior cut and paste, multiple cut/paste buffers, the > ability to read the output of external commands into the file, the > ability to employ Unix shell utilities (like sed or awk) to edit the > file etc etc. > > The only GUI editor I'd use for programming is vim! It is absolutely > worth it to learn vi or vim for editing in UniData (and, I'm sure > UniVerse too). If you're on Windows, there's Vim for Windows. > > I don't know much about UniVerse, but I can't imagine that an editor > should make any difference as most editors should be available to either > platform. On UniData just set the variable UDT_EDIT=/usr/local/bin/vim > (or whatever your editor is) and voila. > > -- Louis > --- > u2-users mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ > --- > u2-users mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ > --- > u2-users mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Couldn't resist. Way back when, in the PICK days, I had used the Jet editor for a while but went back to the line editor. I still use the line editor, these days it's AE... Note, used vi for about 3 months in the mid-90's... Have a Great Day! > Paul Trebbien > Kore Technologies, Senior Support Tech. > "Solutions that work. People who care." > V 858.678.0030 F 858.300.2600 W www.koretech.com > -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, September 23, 2004 2:06 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe Since this thread seems to be going on forever... Many of us came up when PICK was native. The line editor was second nature, it better have become second nature since that is what we had. AE is a turbo charged version of the old PICK editor. I am very comfortable with it an can be very productive using it. I tried to pick up vi when the company I worked for went to a Sequoia. I determined that I could be non-productive with vi until it was second nature or continue with the Pick editor. I now use Accuterms WED editor. Easy to use. intuitive. Even the proponents of vi can't say that. Anyway, bottom line, you are going to use what you are comfortable with and productive using. Bruce M Neylon Health Care Management Group "Warren, Phil" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 09/23/2004 03:24 PM Please respond to u2-users To: "'[EMAIL PROTECTED]'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> cc: Subject:RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe As a system administrator, my choice is to use vi for my UNIX/AIX duties, but I find it's quite a useful tool for program editing too. In fact, I'm the only one in our shop that uses vi on a regular basis. I still can't figure out why the remainder of our programming staff use AE. I agree it has it's place for some tasks, but for day to day editing, I find vi easy to use, and it didn't take too long to get used to, when I learned it years ago. The best part is that you'll find it on most flavors of UNIX boxes, and the basic commands stay the same. -Phil- --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
One thing I miss from the Prime editor is overlay. All you had to do is space out to where you wanted to overly the text and overlay with the new characters. It was very useful when you had a long string with several instances of the same type of information and you only wanted to change one area. Example: DATA = 'AAABBBCCCAAABBBCCCAAABBBCCC' O ZZZ DATA = 'AAABBBCCCAAABBBCCCZZZBBBCCC' Sure beat having to type the whole line or doing a long change. - Original Message - From: "Warren, Phil" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 2004 2:24 PM Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe As a system administrator, my choice is to use vi for my UNIX/AIX duties, but I find it's quite a useful tool for program editing too. In fact, I'm the only one in our shop that uses vi on a regular basis. I still can't figure out why the remainder of our programming staff use AE. I agree it has it's place for some tasks, but for day to day editing, I find vi easy to use, and it didn't take too long to get used to, when I learned it years ago. The best part is that you'll find it on most flavors of UNIX boxes, and the basic commands stay the same. -Phil- -Original Message- From: Louis Guillaume [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 2004 7:52 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe Adrian Matthews wrote: > Does anyone actually use the editor for cutting code these days though? > Absolutely! From what I've seen, most folks who take the time to learn vi will never go back. The only thing AE is good for is macro-fixing savedlists of records, IMHO. It really astonishes me that folks continue to use AE for editing programs where you can really only look at one line at a time. > I've been using full screen GUI editors for years now. I think I'd pull > my hair out going back. GUI editors generally lack many of the vi features: use of regular expressions, superior cut and paste, multiple cut/paste buffers, the ability to read the output of external commands into the file, the ability to employ Unix shell utilities (like sed or awk) to edit the file etc etc. The only GUI editor I'd use for programming is vim! It is absolutely worth it to learn vi or vim for editing in UniData (and, I'm sure UniVerse too). If you're on Windows, there's Vim for Windows. I don't know much about UniVerse, but I can't imagine that an editor should make any difference as most editors should be available to either platform. On UniData just set the variable UDT_EDIT=/usr/local/bin/vim (or whatever your editor is) and voila. -- Louis --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Since this thread seems to be going on forever...
Many of us came up when PICK was native. The line editor was second
nature, it better have become second nature since that is what we had. AE
is a turbo charged version of the old PICK editor. I am very comfortable
with it an can be very productive using it. I tried to pick up vi when
the company I worked for went to a Sequoia. I determined that I could be
non-productive with vi until it was second nature or continue with the
Pick editor.
I now use Accuterms WED editor. Easy to use. intuitive. Even the
proponents of vi can't say that.
Anyway, bottom line, you are going to use what you are comfortable with
and productive using.
Bruce M Neylon
Health Care Management Group
"Warren, Phil" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
09/23/2004 03:24 PM
Please respond to u2-users
To: "'[EMAIL PROTECTED]'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
cc:
Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
As a system administrator, my choice is to use vi for my UNIX/AIX duties,
but I find it's quite a useful tool for program editing too. In fact, I'm
the only one in our shop that uses vi on a regular basis. I still can't
figure out why the remainder of our programming staff use AE. I agree it
has it's place for some tasks, but for day to day editing, I find vi easy
to
use, and it didn't take too long to get used to, when I learned it years
ago. The best part is that you'll find it on most flavors of UNIX boxes,
and the basic commands stay the same. -Phil-
---
u2-users mailing list
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
I absolutely hate AE. Come on folks, can we please join the rest of the human race in the 21st century? The eighties are over. Even back then I felt the old Jet editor was better than ED/AE. Now, in the 21st century, I use the UniDebugger exclusively for both coding and data fixes. The color coding of the source makes it visually pleasing. The cut and paste, drag and drop, etc. make it a great productivity increasing tool. Best of all it's free! Or at least it comes with the DB license. Gordon J. Glorfield Sr. Applications Developer MAMSI (A UnitedHealth Company) 301-360-8839 > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Warren, Phil > Sent: Thursday, September 23, 2004 3:24 PM > To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' > Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe > > > As a system administrator, my choice is to use vi for my > UNIX/AIX duties, but I find it's quite a useful tool for > program editing too. In fact, I'm the only one in our shop > that uses vi on a regular basis. I still can't figure out > why the remainder of our programming staff use AE. I agree > it has it's place for some tasks, but for day to day editing, > I find vi easy to use, and it didn't take too long to get > used to, when I learned it years ago. The best part is that > you'll find it on most flavors of UNIX boxes, and the basic > commands stay the same. -Phil- > > -Original Message- > From: Louis Guillaume [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 2004 7:52 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe > > > Adrian Matthews wrote: > > Does anyone actually use the editor for cutting code these days > > though? > > > > Absolutely! From what I've seen, most folks who take the time > to learn > vi will never go back. > > The only thing AE is good for is macro-fixing savedlists of records, > IMHO. It really astonishes me that folks continue to use AE > for editing > programs where you can really only look at one line at a time. > > > I've been using full screen GUI editors for years now. I think I'd > > pull my hair out going back. > > GUI editors generally lack many of the vi features: use of regular > expressions, superior cut and paste, multiple cut/paste buffers, the > ability to read the output of external commands into the file, the > ability to employ Unix shell utilities (like sed or awk) to edit the > file etc etc. > > The only GUI editor I'd use for programming is vim! It is absolutely > worth it to learn vi or vim for editing in UniData (and, I'm sure > UniVerse too). If you're on Windows, there's Vim for Windows. > > I don't know much about UniVerse, but I can't imagine that an editor > should make any difference as most editors should be > available to either > platform. On UniData just set the variable > UDT_EDIT=/usr/local/bin/vim > (or whatever your editor is) and voila. > > -- Louis > --- > u2-users mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ > --- > u2-users mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ > This e-mail, including attachments, may include confidential and/or proprietary information, and may be used only by the person or entity to which it is addressed. If the reader of this e-mail is not the intended recipient or his or her authorized agent, the reader is hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by replying to this message and delete this e-mail immediately. --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
winvi32 brings the power of the "vi" editor to Windows. It's a wonderful thing. For more information, Google for "winvi32". You're actual editor, and mileage with your actual editor, may vary. - Original Message - From: "Warren, Phil" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 2004 3:24 PM Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe As a system administrator, my choice is to use vi for my UNIX/AIX duties, but I find it's quite a useful tool for program editing too. In fact, I'm the only one in our shop that uses vi on a regular basis. I still can't figure out why the remainder of our programming staff use AE. I agree it has it's place for some tasks, but for day to day editing, I find vi easy to use, and it didn't take too long to get used to, when I learned it years ago. The best part is that you'll find it on most flavors of UNIX boxes, and the basic commands stay the same. -Phil- --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
As a system administrator, my choice is to use vi for my UNIX/AIX duties, but I find it's quite a useful tool for program editing too. In fact, I'm the only one in our shop that uses vi on a regular basis. I still can't figure out why the remainder of our programming staff use AE. I agree it has it's place for some tasks, but for day to day editing, I find vi easy to use, and it didn't take too long to get used to, when I learned it years ago. The best part is that you'll find it on most flavors of UNIX boxes, and the basic commands stay the same. -Phil- -Original Message- From: Louis Guillaume [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 2004 7:52 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe Adrian Matthews wrote: > Does anyone actually use the editor for cutting code these days though? > Absolutely! From what I've seen, most folks who take the time to learn vi will never go back. The only thing AE is good for is macro-fixing savedlists of records, IMHO. It really astonishes me that folks continue to use AE for editing programs where you can really only look at one line at a time. > I've been using full screen GUI editors for years now. I think I'd pull > my hair out going back. GUI editors generally lack many of the vi features: use of regular expressions, superior cut and paste, multiple cut/paste buffers, the ability to read the output of external commands into the file, the ability to employ Unix shell utilities (like sed or awk) to edit the file etc etc. The only GUI editor I'd use for programming is vim! It is absolutely worth it to learn vi or vim for editing in UniData (and, I'm sure UniVerse too). If you're on Windows, there's Vim for Windows. I don't know much about UniVerse, but I can't imagine that an editor should make any difference as most editors should be available to either platform. On UniData just set the variable UDT_EDIT=/usr/local/bin/vim (or whatever your editor is) and voila. -- Louis --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
I second VI-Improved (vim, gvim, etc.) as a free download. I've installed in on my RS/6000, too. The syntax hi-lighting is awesome and customizable. But for me, one of the most awesome features is its 'many-level' undo. For those interested in a few basics of vi, I wrote a white-paper entitled 'Common VI Commands' which is available at http://ourldsfamily.com/mypapers/vi.html. Karl On Wed, 2004-09-22 at 17:51, Louis Guillaume wrote: > Adrian Matthews wrote: > > Does anyone actually use the editor for cutting code these days though? > > > > Absolutely! From what I've seen, most folks who take the time to learn > vi will never go back. > > The only thing AE is good for is macro-fixing savedlists of records, > IMHO. It really astonishes me that folks continue to use AE for editing > programs where you can really only look at one line at a time. > > > I've been using full screen GUI editors for years now. I think I'd pull > > my hair out going back. > > GUI editors generally lack many of the vi features: use of regular > expressions, superior cut and paste, multiple cut/paste buffers, the > ability to read the output of external commands into the file, the > ability to employ Unix shell utilities (like sed or awk) to edit the > file etc etc. > > The only GUI editor I'd use for programming is vim! It is absolutely > worth it to learn vi or vim for editing in UniData (and, I'm sure > UniVerse too). If you're on Windows, there's Vim for Windows. > > I don't know much about UniVerse, but I can't imagine that an editor > should make any difference as most editors should be available to either > platform. On UniData just set the variable UDT_EDIT=/usr/local/bin/vim > (or whatever your editor is) and voila. > > -- Louis > --- > u2-users mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ -- Karl L. Pearson Director of IT, ATS Industrial Supply Direct: 801-978-4429 Toll-free: 888-972-3182 x29 Fax: 801-972-3888 http://www.atsindustrial.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Adrian Matthews wrote: Does anyone actually use the editor for cutting code these days though? Absolutely! From what I've seen, most folks who take the time to learn vi will never go back. The only thing AE is good for is macro-fixing savedlists of records, IMHO. It really astonishes me that folks continue to use AE for editing programs where you can really only look at one line at a time. I've been using full screen GUI editors for years now. I think I'd pull my hair out going back. GUI editors generally lack many of the vi features: use of regular expressions, superior cut and paste, multiple cut/paste buffers, the ability to read the output of external commands into the file, the ability to employ Unix shell utilities (like sed or awk) to edit the file etc etc. The only GUI editor I'd use for programming is vim! It is absolutely worth it to learn vi or vim for editing in UniData (and, I'm sure UniVerse too). If you're on Windows, there's Vim for Windows. I don't know much about UniVerse, but I can't imagine that an editor should make any difference as most editors should be available to either platform. On UniData just set the variable UDT_EDIT=/usr/local/bin/vim (or whatever your editor is) and voila. -- Louis --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
> -Original Message- > From: Adrian Matthews [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Saturday, September 18, 2004 9:47 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe > > > Does anyone actually use the editor for cutting code these > days though? Yes, our lead programmer has been using ED for over 15 years, and she won't change :-) I have been using SED from ladybridge for over 6 years and i won't change, it's the best editor i have ever seen :-) best regards from freezing Denmark Claus Derlien Frie Funktionfrer - faglig organisation og tvfrfaglig a-kasse - www.f-f.dk *** Denne email og alle filer vedlagt som bilag kan indeholde fortroligt materiale, der kun er beregnet for adressaten, og maa ikke udleveres eller kopieres til uvedkommende. Har De ved en fejltagelse modtaget denne email, bedes De venligst omgaaende meddele os dette pr. telefon : 6313 8550. Paa forhaand tak. *** This email and any files transmitted with it may contain confidential information intended for the addressee(s) only. The information is not to be surrendered or copied to unauthorised persons. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by telephone: +45 6313 8550. Thank you. *** --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Adrian Matthews wrote: Does anyone actually use the editor for cutting code these days though? I've been using full screen GUI editors for years now. I think I'd pull my hair out going back. Eight hours a day five days a week. Of course, I use vi at home, too. By choice. Regards, -- Dave Walker --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Goo'day. Talking of "freebie" U2 editors, wot about "UniEditor" from Martin Scholl? http://www.martinscholl.com/ Very pretty... At 11:47 18/09/04, you wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Tony which of the below are freeware? I'm surprised you asked, but the only freeware editor below is from mvtools.net. I hope I didn't imply otherwise. [Moderator-friendly snippage] > wED from AccuTerm: http://www.asent.com > mvToolbox http://mvtoolbox.com/ > RED, CRED, LED, and other editors from http://www.mvtools.net/ If you miss them > I'll probably have them on my freeware site later. Maybe it was that last line that gotcha, sorry. It looked in-context to me. T --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ -- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 7.0.271 / Virus Database: 264.9.3 - Release Date: 17/09/04 Regards, Bruce Nichol Talon Computer Services ALBURYNSW 2640 Australia Tel: +61 (0)411149636 Fax: +61 (0)260232119 If it ain't broke, fix it till it is! -- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 7.0.271 / Virus Database: 264.9.3 - Release Date: 17/09/04 --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
If I had the flexibility to do I'd be happy to install my ED+ on every system out there but in most cases that's not an option. So, use the PC editors when I can, use AE when I can't, and drink heavily when done working on Universe (w/o AE). :-) -Kevin [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.PrecisOnline.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Allen E. Elwood (CA) Sent: Saturday, September 18, 2004 12:50 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe Kevin King Wrote: >If the S/A is >paranoid and won't open up ftp access, and there are no other good >transfer tools available, it's easier to open up AE and make a couple >of minor changes Yes, that's when I use my full page editor written in U2. All the comforts of a windows based editor, but without the file-transfer hassles (permission OR slow modems). Plus I can modify it at whim to create short cuts that would be impossible any other way for special projects that have a lot of repetitious activity. If I have a fast connection and permission, then I used WED which comes with Accuterm. --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Kevin King Wrote: >If the S/A is >paranoid and won't open up ftp access, and there are no other good >transfer tools available, it's easier to open up AE and make a couple >of minor changes Yes, that's when I use my full page editor written in U2. All the comforts of a windows based editor, but without the file-transfer hassles (permission OR slow modems). Plus I can modify it at whim to create short cuts that would be impossible any other way for special projects that have a lot of repetitious activity. If I have a fast connection and permission, then I used WED which comes with Accuterm. --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Eclipse is nice, but I find it a bit heavyweight and possibly more than a person would need for BASIC. Great for Java apps though. I use jEdit for lightweight BASIC editing. All that being said, there's still some value in having a good editor available inside the environment. Considering that I'm often working hundreds or thousands of miles away from the machine, getting the code to the U2 directory can be more hassle than it's worth. If the S/A is paranoid and won't open up ftp access, and there are no other good transfer tools available, it's easier to open up AE and make a couple of minor changes (keeping the local code in sync, of course) than it is to work within the walls and protections baked into the customer's box. -Kevin [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.PrecisOnline.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Donald Kibbey Sent: Saturday, September 18, 2004 5:49 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe As for editors, I have long used a pc based editor (CodeWright) with the UniVerse source I manage. No need to play around with the line editor. Most any full screen editor can be linked up to UniVerse as long as your source code is kept in type 19 files. If you want a great free solution, download the Eclipse platform from ibm. It's not full integrated as far as debugging and such, but there's a pretty good editor in there and Eclipse will run just about anywhere. Don Kibbey Financial Systems Manager Finnegan, Henderson, Farabow, Garrett & Dunner LLP --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
As for editors, I have long used a pc based editor (CodeWright) with the UniVerse source I manage. No need to play around with the line editor. Most any full screen editor can be linked up to UniVerse as long as your source code is kept in type 19 files. If you want a great free solution, download the Eclipse platform from ibm. It's not full integrated as far as debugging and such, but there's a pretty good editor in there and Eclipse will run just about anywhere. Don Kibbey Financial Systems Manager Finnegan, Henderson, Farabow, Garrett & Dunner LLP --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Does anyone actually use the editor for cutting code these days though? I've been using full screen GUI editors for years now. I think I'd pull my hair out going back. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kryka, Richard Sent: 17 September 2004 22:10 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe I know this is probably not the highest on others lists, but the UniData editor is like god next to the pitiful excuse of an editor that UniVerse provides. I don't understand why IBM doesn't release the UniData editor with UniVerse and do away with the UniVerse version. In addition, the UniData debugger is at least an order of magnitude better than the RAID debugger on UniVerse. As someone who has spent the last 12 years fixing and debugging code written by other, these two issues are important to me. For Basic programming, UniData is IMHO much, much better than UniVerse! Dick Kryka Director of Applications CCCS of Greater Denver, Inc. Paragon Financial Services 303-632-2226 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of George Smith Sent: Friday, September 17, 2004 2:21 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe Group, I was just talking to someone like myself who is trying to decide between Unidata and Universe. We are coming from d3 and mvBase and really would like someone experienced with both to give and overview of the strengths and weakness of both - that is Unidata vs Universe. Thanks to all that reply. grs --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ The information contained in this email is strictly confidential and for the use of the addressee only, unless otherwise indicated. If you are not the intended recipient, please do not read, copy, use or disclose to others this message or any attachment. Please also notify the sender by replying to this email or by telephone +44 (0)20 7896 0011 and then delete the email and any copies of it. Opinions, conclusions (etc.) that do not relate to the official business of this company shall be understood as neither given nor endorsed by it. IG Markets Limited and IG Index Plc are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority and, in Australia, by the Australian Securities and Investments Commission. --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Tony which of the below are freeware? I'm surprised you asked, but the only freeware editor below is from mvtools.net. I hope I didn't imply otherwise. [Moderator-friendly snippage] > wED from AccuTerm: http://www.asent.com > mvToolbox http://mvtoolbox.com/ > RED, CRED, LED, and other editors from http://www.mvtools.net/ If you miss them > I'll probably have them on my freeware site later. Maybe it was that last line that gotcha, sorry. It looked in-context to me. T --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Although I have used UniVerse more that UniData, I believe that the ODBC connections and SQL is easier on UniVerse than UniData, this probably is due to Datastage development. UniVerse also has an authorization statement in BASIC which allows a program to run at a higher security level than the user has rights to, UniData does not have this. I know there are some large UniVerse sites, but I don't know to what size UniData can scale to. UniData has a sophisticated recovery File System, but I think Dynamic files are better on UniVerse. IBM is providing the same client facilities to both although some items may be released 6 months earlier in one product than another, but this is mixed for both product lines. With the editors, UniDebbuer comes with both products and it is a reasonable GUI editor. Both are good databases, so the best is to work out what you are looking for to choose the database Regards David Jordan --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Tony which of the below are freeware? "As far as editors go, there are third-party products which have been ported cross-platform. In my opinion, anything is better than ED or AE once you've used a real editor. - My personal favorite for simple editing is wED, which is the Windows EDitor built into AccuTerm. http://www.asent.com - The mvToolbox is impressive with a huge set of features, way above and beyond standard editors. It's sort of the Emacs of the Pick world, if that means anything to anyone. http://mvtoolbox.com/ - The RED editor has been ported to many platforms. I know nothing about it except the web site that hosts this and other utilities is going away in the next week or so. Download a copy of RED, CRED, LED, and other editors from http://www.mvtools.net/ If you miss them I'll probably have them on my freeware site later." --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Robert Paterson wrote: In the latest releases UV has the AE editor - so you can have the best of all worlds... The problem with the comparisons is that it all depends on how you are using D3 now and more importantly which elements are "make or break". Everyone's shopping list is different. If you get that list together the rest of us will be better able to advise on things. Don't forget that some of the smaller things can end up real bugbears as well! True, but I think what I'd like to know first off is why two different products? It would seem that one would take on the capabilities of the other over time, and one would be phased out. What's the difference between UniData and UniVerse mainly? Then - it would be good to hear from the users some of the pro's (particularly) and con's in your experience with the product. Bob Little Graphik Dimensions, Ltd. High Point, NC --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
Robert Paterson wrote: > In the latest releases UV has the AE editor - so you can have the > best of all worlds... Dick Kryka wrote: > I know this is probably not the highest on others lists, but the > UniData editor is like god next to the pitiful excuse of an editor > that UniVerse provides. As far as editors go, there are third-party products which have been ported cross-platform. In my opinion, anything is better than ED or AE once you've used a real editor. - My personal favorite for simple editing is wED, which is the Windows EDitor built into AccuTerm. http://www.asent.com - The mvToolbox is impressive with a huge set of features, way above and beyond standard editors. It's sort of the Emacs of the Pick world, if that means anything to anyone. http://mvtoolbox.com/ - The RED editor has been ported to many platforms. I know nothing about it except the web site that hosts this and other utilities is going away in the next week or so. Download a copy of RED, CRED, LED, and other editors from http://www.mvtools.net/ If you miss them I'll probably have them on my freeware site later. About comparing Unidata and Universe, the general concensus seems to be that Universe is much more complex than Unidata. As already mentioned, you need to create a list of requirements and then see which environment gets the most check boxes. Coming from a strong D3 background, I know that platform has a lot of features that many sites unfortunately never use. With product differentiation being what it is though, the more features you use the more proprietary hooks you need to replace. When looking for any new platform, look for the best ways to get what you need without locking into non-standard options. Separation of UI, buiness rules, and data go a long way in this regard, though I know that's easier said than done. Tony (Not selling the tools mentioned above or getting paid for recommendations.) (Not a bad idea though...) --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
In the latest releases UV has the AE editor - so you can have the best of all worlds... The problem with the comparisons is that it all depends on how you are using D3 now and more importantly which elements are "make or break". Everyone's shopping list is different. If you get that list together the rest of us will be better able to advise on things. Don't forget that some of the smaller things can end up real bugbears as well! Robert Paterson Technology Support Manager www.epicor.com Tel.: +44 (1344) 468231 Cell: +44 (7799) 348513 Fax: +44 (1344) 468050 E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 1 The Arena, Downshire Way, Bracknell, Berks, UK, RG12 1PU This e-mail is for the use of the intended recipient(s) only. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately and then delete it. If you are not the intended recipient, you must not use, disclose or distribute this e-mail without the author's prior permission. We have taken precautions to minimize the risk of transmitting software viruses, but we advise you to carry out your own virus checks on any attachment to this message. We cannot accept liability for any loss or damage caused by software viruses. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kryka, Richard Sent: 17 September 2004 14:10 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe I know this is probably not the highest on others lists, but the UniData editor is like god next to the pitiful excuse of an editor that UniVerse provides. I don't understand why IBM doesn't release the UniData editor with UniVerse and do away with the UniVerse version. In addition, the UniData debugger is at least an order of magnitude better than the RAID debugger on UniVerse. As someone who has spent the last 12 years fixing and debugging code written by other, these two issues are important to me. For Basic programming, UniData is IMHO much, much better than UniVerse! Dick Kryka Director of Applications CCCS of Greater Denver, Inc. Paragon Financial Services 303-632-2226 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of George Smith Sent: Friday, September 17, 2004 2:21 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe Group, I was just talking to someone like myself who is trying to decide between Unidata and Universe. We are coming from d3 and mvBase and really would like someone experienced with both to give and overview of the strengths and weakness of both - that is Unidata vs Universe. Thanks to all that reply. grs --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
Re: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
George Smith wrote: Unidata vs Universe. I have wondered about this myself. It'd be even better for me if someone with jBASE experience could compare the three products also. Bob Little Graphik Dimensions, Ltd. High Point NC --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
RE: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe
I know this is probably not the highest on others lists, but the UniData editor is like god next to the pitiful excuse of an editor that UniVerse provides. I don't understand why IBM doesn't release the UniData editor with UniVerse and do away with the UniVerse version. In addition, the UniData debugger is at least an order of magnitude better than the RAID debugger on UniVerse. As someone who has spent the last 12 years fixing and debugging code written by other, these two issues are important to me. For Basic programming, UniData is IMHO much, much better than UniVerse! Dick Kryka Director of Applications CCCS of Greater Denver, Inc. Paragon Financial Services 303-632-2226 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of George Smith Sent: Friday, September 17, 2004 2:21 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [U2] Comparison Unidata and Universe Group, I was just talking to someone like myself who is trying to decide between Unidata and Universe. We are coming from d3 and mvBase and really would like someone experienced with both to give and overview of the strengths and weakness of both - that is Unidata vs Universe. Thanks to all that reply. grs --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/ --- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
