Re: [Vo]:no evidence yet of safety certificate.
Thanks for this answer! Very informative! On a side note: The shutdownrossi.com site has been deleted. I of course don't know why, perhaps it has been hacked... ;) Wolf Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc...@gmx.de wrote: Out of curiosity: Has there ever been a scam in which a safety certificate from a big and independent organization has been granted? Interesting question. I do not know much about scams. I do not have a comprehensive database of them. Perhaps such a thing exists on the Internet. But anyway, most of the ones I have read about did not involve any actual equipment. The machines are just a rumor, a blurred photo, or a blueprint that the scammer offers to sell people. There was nothing to certify, so it is not as if a government expert was brought in and somehow bamboozled. I doubt that could happen. Many people say there have been scams involving cold fusion. I do not know of any, and I would probably have heard. I have been approached by 2 or 3 people who found me because of my connection with cold fusion, who I thought were either scammers or delusional. They wanted me to pay money to have a look at a secret machine. These were magic magnet machines, nothing to do with cold fusion. I offered one of them $10,000 C.O.D. for a machine delivered to me and demonstrated on the premises. I never heard from him again. I did not expect to hear from him again. Along the same lines, I have also never heard of a scam that might fool experts such as EK. Every scam I know of would be instantly found out by someone of that caliber. I mean they would take one look inside and instantly see how it actually worked. It would be like trying to persuade an auto mechanic than an ordinary gasoline motor was actually an electric motor, or like trying to persuade me that a sentence written in Korean was actually in Japanese. Abd has sometimes claimed that academic experimental scientists are pushovers. They are easily fooled because they are not conditioned to look for hidden tricks. I doubt it, but one thing is for sure: experimental scientists know as much about ordinary electrical components as any electrician or mechanic does. Someone like EK, Storms, McKubre, Duncan or Miles can glance at any ordinary machine or experiment and tell you what every component is and what it does. These people are, in effect, glorified hands-on mechanics with decades of experience. They have spent these decades mainly finding experimental errors, which are far more subtle and difficult to locate than any trick that a scammer might come up with. No one plays tricks better than Mother Nature. It is not as if Rossi was showing his machine to an insurance salesman or a mass media pundit who has never heard of the difference between AC and DC power. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:no evidence yet of safety certificate.
Still - didn't SGS have to test this prototype in some way to find out if it runs within their safety parameters? How did they run these tests? Wolf Akira Shirakawa shirakawa.ak...@gmail.com mailto:shirakawa.ak...@gmail.com wrote . . . or translated, I guess, the small print: This certificate relates solely to the above identified prototype machine within the limits of the request for voluntary testing of essential health and safety requirements relevant to Annex I of Directive 2006/42/EC. The certificate does not constitute a product certification and cannot, in any way, be used for commercial purposes and / or advertising by the company on whose behalf the certificate was issued. Ah ha! So I guess that means: this is a certificate to operate a prototype experimental device as such, in an experimental mode. Right? It is an official document certifying the reactor. Well, that is certification, sort of. In a way. A classic Rossi-ism. Similar to the claim that Ampenergo made an investment. Okay it was not a gigantic company as he claimed. And they did not actually have any money, as far as I know. So it was an investment in a narrow sense. V-e-e-r-r-y narrow. Not as in: someone wrote a check for real money. You might call it a virtual investment. This is hysterical. The reality distortion force field is with you, Obi Wan Kenobi Rossi. I say never bet against Rossi, and never invest with him. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:no evidence yet of safety certificate.
Out of curiosity: Has there ever been a scam in which a safety certificate from a big and independent organization has been granted? Wolf At 02:58 PM 9/13/2012, Craig Haynie wrote: Can someone confirm the power output? The certificate says: Power In: 200 kw (max) Power Out: 1MW Water flow rate: 1500 kg/hr Temperature in: 85C Temperature out: 120C As AK pointed out, this particular certificate doesn't certify the performance. I think the 85C-in is needed for 120C out. You can feed in colder water and get sub-boiling water out. The leaked operating manual are clearer on this.
Re: [Vo]:The secret colonel of 1MW powerplant is the leaker of the 1000C photo -- SHUTDOWN ROSSI
Roger Green will be one of the presenters at the Ecat gathering / conference in September in Zurich, so there seems to / must? be some stronger connection between Rossi and him... http://www.borderlands.de/Links/Kongress080912M-e.pdf Wolf Wasn’t impressed with the shutdownrossi.com site... Both the NDA and the Contract with Andrea Rossi had NO signatures at all; from either party. So there is no evidence yet of a *legal* binding contract between Rossi and E-Cat Australia. Doesn't mean there isn't one, but this website is not showing Rossi's signature on anything. -Mark Iverson -Original Message- From: Alan Fletcher [mailto:a...@well.com] Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2012 6:18 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:The secret colonel of 1MW powerplant is the leaker of the 1000C photo -- SHUTDOWN ROSSI From: Alan Fletcher a...@well.com Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2012 5:04:25 PM Also from eCatnews -- http://shutdownrossi.com/?page_id=759 Claims to be eMails, NDA and other info between Rossi and eCat Australia (Roger Green, Robert (?) and Gary Wright)
Re: [Vo]:The secret colonel of 1MW powerplant is the leaker of the 1000C photo
Did anybody read the 100+ mails between Roger Green, the Australian E-Cat licencee and Robert K. on shutdownrossi.com? http://shutdownrossi.com/?page_id=759 Just some more hints as to how the scam might work... Wolf So, he's a NATO Colonel, a Professor, an engineer the secret customer (used to certify the 1 MW device), and has a history with Rossi during the PetrolDragon affair? ecat builder ecatbuil...@gmail.com wrote: This is the google translation... I think this is terrible news.. Since Fioravanti certified the 1MW tests and they are known acquaintences. Dear Dr. Rossi I've gotten to know in 1975 (roughly the past years because there are many). I came to Petroldragon Boffa presented by Professor of the Polytechnic of Turin because I had plans to develop research on electrostatic filters for industrial use. That his company was building. There were ready to export to France. I remember he was very courteous and gave me a box of drawings and publications on the subject. During the visit I did visit the plant for the extraction of oil from waste. If memory serves me was the open and close there was a large quantity of used tires for recycling. I spoke with enthusiasm of the results obtained. When, in later years that followed the events related by the newspapers, I derived the impression that it was being squeezed by filibusters of various kinds because I remember well the enthusiasm so evident and sincere It was a surprise to discover that he managed to recover and become the focal point of an energy revolution. All the varied world of cold fusion is back in motion the hunt for prey. I guess the organizational problems for the construction of demonstrators from a MW, but between now and November months are many and the approval of the patent will surely artificial obstacles not to mention that in the future to defend against illegal copying of the product will be problematic. Have you ever considered the possibility of a joint venture with a state of muscular enough to defend the invention by means of weight (international agreements between States, for example)? 2012/8/11 Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com The secret colonel tells his story with Rossi here: http://www.journal-of-nuclear-physics.com/?p=360cpage=19#comment-41129 Gentile Dott. Rossi Ho avuto modo di conoscerla nel 1975 (all’incirca perché gli anni passati sono tanti). Venni alla Petroldragon presentato dal Prof Boffa del Politecnico di Torino perché avevo in progetto di sviluppare una ricerca sui filtri elettrostatici ad uso industriale. Che la sua ditta costruiva. Ce n’erano di pronti all’esportazione verso la Francia. Mi ricordo che fu molto cortese e mi diede una cassa di pubblicazioni e disegni sull’argomento. Durante la visita mi fece visitare l’impianto per l’estrazione del petrolio dai rifiuti. Se la memoria non m’inganna si trovava all’aperto ed accanto vi era una bella quantità di copertoni usati da riciclare. Mi parlò con molto entusiasmo dei risultati ottenuti. Quando, in anni successivi, seguii le vicende che la riguardavano tramite i giornali, ne ricavai l’impressione che fosse stato stritolato da filibustieri di vario genere perché mi ricordavo bene di quell’entusiasmo così evidente e sincero E stata una sorpresa scoprire che è riuscito a risollevarsi ed a diventare il focal point di una rivoluzione energetica. Tutto il variegato mondo della fusione fredda si è rimesso in moto alla caccia della preda. Immagino i problemi organizzativi per l’allestimento dei dimostratori da un MW, ma da qui a novembre i mesi sono tanti e l’approvazione del brevetto troverà sicuramente ostacoli artificiosi senza contare che difendersi in futuro dalle copie illegali del prodotto risulterà problematico. Ha mai valutato la possibilità di una joint venture con uno Stato abbastanza muscoloso da poter difendere l’invenzione con strumenti di peso (accordi internazionali fra Stati ad esempio)? Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com
Re: [Vo]:Defkalion GT at NIWeek2012
Did they say anything new? The audio quality is pretty bad, so I didn't understand everything: They are a) Talking to several countries (79 if I remember correctly) b) Trying to build production lines (which might take several years? I thought they were already building one...) c) Are they redesigning the whole thing? I thought their reactor was finished, however in Xanthoulis talk he mentions something about having something in 6 months..? It's a matter of materials. d) Does Xanthoulis say, that they received money from government or not? I understand something like Otherwise we would never finished or Other persons would never have finished? Perhaps it would be best if a native english speaker could make a transscript of both presentations..? So basically just more words, no facts and more delays..? Wolf Hello group, This is from the official DGT forum: http://www.defkalion-energy.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17t=1288 Dear readers of this forum and friends, Defkalion GT presence at NI week 2012 has been recorded in the following youtube links: 1. Alex Xanthoulis in LENR panel discussion at http://youtu.be/0iKCLHxmISs 2. The technical presentation of DGT's Hyperions at (uploading in progress) 3. Please download this technical presentation in pdf (uploaded in this topic) as well as the summary of Defkalion's at NI week 2012. 4. An interesting introduction on Anomalous Heat Effects related technologies and science by Dr. Dunkan and Greg Morrow can be viewed at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4HG9raN_2U whilst an interesting introduction to LENR, with reference to DGT's Hyperion products photo, can be viewed at President, and CEO, Dr. James Truchard's kicks off NIWeek 2012 at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxjxFdFEBsw. A presentation of DGT's technologies and progress, supported also by a scientific paper, has been scheduled for ICCF-17 in Korea. We will be back to discuss all these through this forum at August 20th, 2012 We wish you all happy summer vacations. Defkalion Green Technologies Unfortunately, even though I'm logged in, the DGT forum software says that: You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post. So I can't download the technical presentation in pdf. Cheers, S.A.
[Vo]:Re: [Vo]:Rossi’s E-Cat Technology to be Presented in Zurich, Switzerland on September 8-9
It seems to be that none of the speakers is from a company with reputation... Not a good sign in my opinion. Wolf Hello group, This is via E-CW (as most of the text below). In a different thread here on Vortex-L I hinted that a conference which might involve Rossi and his products would be held at some point in September. More information about it is starting to arise. Follow this link: http://www.e-catworld.com/2012/07/rossis-e-cat-technology-to-be-presented-in-zurich-in-september/ The conference where information about the E-Cat will be presented is entitled “Energy Change with E-Cat Technology” and will be held on September 8-9, at the Technopark Zurich, Technoparkstr. 1, CH 8005 Zurich, Auditorium. The Conference will be hosted by TransAltec Inc., E-Cat Germany and E-Cat Switzerland. Full details can be found at this link: http://www.borderlands.de/Links/Kongress080912E-e.pdf. Among the presenters will be E-Cat licensees from European regions, and (for the first time ever, I think) Andrea Rossi. Cheers, S.A.
Re: [Vo]:More Rosey Piccys
This again looks like the exact same container at the exact same spot as from last october. Shouldn't this one have been shipped by now? Wolf Along with his Behemoth: http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=257289961053144set=a.257289254386548.58520.255415831240557type=3permPage=1 http://goo.gl/p4DIl Keep hitting Next. Some good ones of The Engineer. None of The Architect (re: Matrix). Thanks to the moles. T
Re: [Vo]:More Rosey Piccys
Sorry, my bad. They're from february... nothing new here. 2012/7/17 Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc...@gmx.de This again looks like the exact same container at the exact same spot as from last october. Shouldn't this one have been shipped by now? Wolf
[Vo]:Defkalion closes forum
http://www.defkalion-energy.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4t=1278sid=5d586d1c2c35f0d82953353c6d922a99 Understandable on one side, however what did they expect with those actions which they took?... Wolf
Re: [Vo]:Andrea Rossi and Siemens working together.and more
As long as there is not at least a press release from Siemens about this, i wouldn't consider this being more than some very early discussions about a potential future working relation. Wolf http://www.e-catworld.com/2012/02/rossi-siemens-ag-helping-with-leonardo-corp-with-efficient-electricity-generation/ *Electrical Production* Rossi reported on what he considered a significant breakthrough in the area of electrical production. He said that just a few days ago Siemens AG http://www.siemens.com/entry/cc/en/ (German engineering firm) were with him in his Bologna factory and they demonstrated a turbine that could produce electricity at 30 per cent efficiency from a steam temperature of 251 C. This is much lower than the 550 C steam temperatures that are required in conventional electrical generation. Rossi said that the E-Cat becomes unstable when working at high temperatures. He said that because of this breakthrough he feels like electrical production from the 1 MW plants could take place sooner than expected. Electricity production from the small E-Cats will still take some time according to Rossi. Siemens is one of the largest engineering companies in the world, and Rossi mentioned that Leonardo corporation is getting more attention from people in the industrial sector. -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com mailto:danieldi...@gmail.com
Re: [Vo]:Test day in Greece time
I wonder where the test protocols are... It's by now nearly 16:00 in Athens, so when do the tests start? The protocols should be published before the tests begin AFAIK. The way i see it (thanks to Jed) the first paper about Ni-H goes back to 1979, and the first Focardi paper about Ni-H was published in 1994. Now, as far as i know, Defkalion has not sold any Hyperion yet. But if the tests are conclusive the most important result will be that all doubts about the technology will be lifted. It does not matter who runs the test at all. Later on, IP issues can be solved in court or by contract, if needed.
Re: [Vo]:Test day in Greece time
Hm wouldn't it be better if they would announce such a change? Now i am sitting here and constantly hitting F5 on my keyboard with the opened Defkalion site in front of me ;) maybe they change their idea, under the demand of the tester, to avoid the crazy behavior of fans and pathoskeptics. also maybe the testers don't wan't to be identified before the test succeed to avoid looking ridiculous... cold fusion is really frightening for corp and officials... I feel like a kid waiting for santa klaus in front of the chimney. 2012/2/24 Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc...@gmx.de I wonder where the test protocols are... It's by now nearly 16:00 in Athens, so when do the tests start? The protocols should be published before the tests begin AFAIK. The way i see it (thanks to Jed) the first paper about Ni-H goes back to 1979, and the first Focardi paper about Ni-H was published in 1994. Now, as far as i know, Defkalion has not sold any Hyperion yet. But if the tests are conclusive the most important result will be that all doubts about the technology will be lifted. It does not matter who runs the test at all. Later on, IP issues can be solved in court or by contract, if needed.
Re: [Vo]:[JONP] About Leonardo Corp. property + end of partnership with NI
Turns out there seems to be another side to the story (again): http://e-catsite.com/2012/02/21/ni-corroborates-rossi-statements/ Betts confirms that the partnership has ended. She however also confirms Rossis statements on how the relation between both parties has been. Further, the term discussion seems to be meant as a deeper collaboration in the beginning. Wolf Some weeks ago, Rossi said that NI, he and the customer were working together on the 1MW plant. And now the customer wants something different? Why change a running system (if it ever was running)? And why is it important to the customer, which company supplies the controlling mechanism for a heating plant? Earning a place for your business on an approved vendor list can be your ticket to winning more government-contract work. Nearly all prime contractors maintain lists of preferred vendors and subcontractors based on the quality and timeliness of their work and other attributes. Many businesses work diligently to get on these lists because they put these businesses one step closer to participating in a government procurement. If secrecy is involved, the approved vendor has been cleared to do secret work with employees that have been vetted to the appropriate security level. The vender also assigns a security officer that maintains a confidential file system in a secured location within the vender’s facility and handles and maintains the security clearances of the employees. On Mon, Feb 20, 2012 at 7:42 AM, Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc...@gmx.de wrote: Some weeks ago, Rossi said that NI, he and the customer were working together on the 1MW plant. And now the customer wants something different? Why change a running system (if it ever was running)? And why is it important to the customer, which company supplies the controlling mechanism for a heating plant? Wolf From Rossi: Also our Customer has chosen other suppliers for the first generation of the domestic E-Cats and of the 1 MW plants. It is possible that a simple PLC/PAC could have been chosen. I don't think stabilization would be that big a challenge. All Rossi needed was some feedback. T
Re: [Vo]:[JONP] About Leonardo Corp. property + end of partnership with NI
Some weeks ago, Rossi said that NI, he and the customer were working together on the 1MW plant. And now the customer wants something different? Why change a running system (if it ever was running)? And why is it important to the customer, which company supplies the controlling mechanism for a heating plant? Wolf From Rossi: Also our Customer has chosen other suppliers for the first generation of the domestic E-Cats and of the 1 MW plants. It is possible that a simple PLC/PAC could have been chosen. I don't think stabilization would be that big a challenge. All Rossi needed was some feedback. T
Re: [Vo]:NI and Rossi not related anymore
Hm if NI was working under an NDA they would use another choice of words to deny a relationship with Rossi, I think, wouldn't they? Betts words are pretty clear (if it is correct what Krivit states on NET) and do not seem to leave much room for interpretation... Further as they explicitly mention Leonardo Corporation in their 14th November press release, why would they by now be working with a partner company of Leonardo Corp.? Of course this might be possible but by now it seems as if you really have to digg deep to find something that supports Rossi. Some weeks ago this was the other way round... For me personally, the NI statement was one of the main reasons to give Rossi some credibility, but as this argument is gone now, I wonder whats still there that speaks for Rossi? Let's hope Defkalion's tests (starting next Friday) have more substance and can really provide irrefutable evidence of LENR... Wolf Did Krivit ask if NI was working with any partner/customer/joint venturer of Rossi/Leonardo Corp. At this point if Rossi is legit he has to Partner with an entity with resources. Frankly, it would be just like Krivit not ask that question or tell if he did. Also, NI could be working under an NDA. Ransom Sent from my iPhone On Feb 18, 2012, at 11:37 PM, Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com mailto:danieldi...@gmail.com wrote: http://blog.newenergytimes.com/2012/02/18/national-instruments-denies-relationship-with-rossi/ Confirmed by! NI. -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com mailto:danieldi...@gmail.com
Re: [Vo]:Defkalion GT willing to accept Dick Smith's offer + Official tests info
It seems to me as Dick Smith doesn't want to understand what Defkalion offers: http://ecatnews.com/?p=2068 Where do they talk of a minimum COP of 3? They just say, that 3 will definitely be met and even surpassed... This is totally in line with the proclaimed COP of 20 and above as Defkalion originally mentioned. The COP of 3 was proposed by Mr. Smith originally somewhere... He even doesn't want to understand, why Defkalion currently just offers bare reactor tests... This seems to go exactly that way which some already imagined: They can't agree on the terms and conditions and therefore everything stays the same... I really hope that real tests begin on next friday and will be finished around february 28th, so that we soon know if this thing is real or not... I find this to be just annoying... Wolf On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 6:50 PM, Patrick Ellulellulpatr...@gmail.com wrote: Dick Smith will make offer official to DGT. below his replies on http://ecatnews.com/?p=2045 Assuming it really is him. Dick Smith February 16, 2012 at 9:03 pm Yes. I am the real Dick Smith and the offer is genuine. I will contact Defkalion and organize the simple testing protocols. Does anyone have the best email address? If you wish to answer: i...@defkalion-energy.com T
Re: [Vo]:Sterling Allan / S-African Free Fuel Generator FFG trip
I don't understand the comment about the amount of Hydrogen being consumend by a 5KW unit... Does Defkalion really not know how much Hydrogen it consumes if running at full power for 6 month? About the temperature: I think this is quite interesting as Rossi somewhen stated that his reaction starts at 60°. So either Rossi was misleading us or Defkalion really did some further development and improvements over Rossis technology. Wolf I think we have to focus on what he says about the Company, not who says it. And his report is convergent with other direct information about Defkalion. The season of tests will start soon. Very interesting- it is about High Temperature LENR 450-900 deg Celsius. Peter On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 1:33 PM, Andre Blum andre_vor...@blums.nl mailto:andre_vor...@blums.nl wrote: Amidst all these discussions about credibility of LENR and the different groups working on it, we send out our clown Stirling Allen to investigate. From his report ( http://pesn.com/2012/02/13/9602039_Hope_from_Athens_found_in_Cold_Fusion/): When I went out to grab a bite for dinner (Defkalion had prior appointments or they would have taken me to dinner; in fact they had to cancel two other appointments as it was, in order to meet with me), I walked by a group of younger people milling about outside an establishment (some kind of party). I pulled up a chair, stood on it, and started saying, May I have your attention, please. I would like to tell you about some hope that you have for Athens. But then two security guards came up to me and escorted me away because I was interrupting a party. When I told them briefly what I was going to say, they looked at me like I was some kind of idiot and walked away. I nearly decided to take the (in retrospect, shallow) attitude, Let Greece burn, then, but I realized that I shouldn't let that single experience jade me. They had no clue about the significance of what I wanted to say. That's okay...others will. Andre On 02/13/2012 07:52 PM, ecat builder wrote: Wow. I find it pretty interesting that Sterling is saying he is convinced of this technology. I'm also hopeful that he can indeed bring a unit home with him... and get off the NDA. Stirling Allen is in Greece now and has seen Defkalion's final test setup... in operation and producing heat. https://twitter.com/#!/PESNetwork https://twitter.com/#%21/PESNetwork Here are some links to John Bedini's pages. http://www.icehouse.net/john1/ http://www.icehouse.net/john1/index11.html - Brad -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com
Re: [Vo]:Sterling Allan / S-African Free Fuel Generator FFG trip
Thank you for the clarification! Wolf I believe the hydrogen loss they are referring to is centered about hydrogen containment, not hydrogen consumption. As for Rossi's 60°C reaction point, that was the temperature of his surrounding water during the EK testing. At around 60°C water temp, the slope of temperature gradient changed; the nickel temperature would necessarily have been higher. Wolf Fischerwolffisc...@gmx.de wrote: I don't understand the comment about the amount of Hydrogen being consumend by a 5KW unit... Does Defkalion really not know how much Hydrogen it consumes if running at full power for 6 month? About the temperature: I think this is quite interesting as Rossi somewhen stated that his reaction starts at 60°. So either Rossi was misleading us or Defkalion really did some further development and improvements over Rossis technology. Wolf I think we have to focus on what he says about the Company, not who says it. And his report is convergent with other direct information about Defkalion. The season of tests will start soon. Very interesting- it is about High Temperature LENR 450-900 deg Celsius. Peter On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 1:33 PM, Andre Blumandre_vor...@blums.nl mailto:andre_vor...@blums.nl wrote: Amidst all these discussions about credibility of LENR and the different groups working on it, we send out our clown Stirling Allen to investigate. From his report ( http://pesn.com/2012/02/13/9602039_Hope_from_Athens_found_in_Cold_Fusion/): When I went out to grab a bite for dinner (Defkalion had prior appointments or they would have taken me to dinner; in fact they had to cancel two other appointments as it was, in order to meet with me), I walked by a group of younger people milling about outside an establishment (some kind of party). I pulled up a chair, stood on it, and started saying, May I have your attention, please. I would like to tell you about some hope that you have for Athens. But then two security guards came up to me and escorted me away because I was interrupting a party. When I told them briefly what I was going to say, they looked at me like I was some kind of idiot and walked away. I nearly decided to take the (in retrospect, shallow) attitude, Let Greece burn, then, but I realized that I shouldn't let that single experience jade me. They had no clue about the significance of what I wanted to say. That's okay...others will. Andre On 02/13/2012 07:52 PM, ecat builder wrote: Wow. I find it pretty interesting that Sterling is saying he is convinced of this technology. I'm also hopeful that he can indeed bring a unit home with him... and get off the NDA. Stirling Allen is in Greece now and has seen Defkalion's final test setup... in operation and producing heat. https://twitter.com/#!/PESNetworkhttps://twitter.com/#%21/PESNetwork Here are some links to John Bedini's pages. http://www.icehouse.net/john1/ http://www.icehouse.net/john1/index11.html - Brad -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com
[Vo]:Ian Bryce's Agenda
Hi Vortex, as it seems, Ian Bryce got hold of the possiblities of the Internet and tries to spread his word... He makes appearances in some of the Ecat-News-Site's comment sections as well as, e.g., on the Defkalion forum. To be honest - i am a little bit surprised by the effort that he puts into of spreading his prove (or whatever you wanna call it). I am currently thinking about his motivation. 1. He is a philanthropist and wants to save people from wasting their money. 2. He is just what he claims to be: A skeptic and wants to spread the word... 3. He has some kind of hidden agenda...? Although I don't know what this might be... Perhaps he was mocked by some Ecat-fanboys...? ;) I am just curious about the fact that he seemingly posts everywhere that he finds the opportunity to do so. Especially with the kind of prove that he got (there is nothing new, some of the things seem to be based on speculations and the rest is word of mouth). Details can be seen in http://www.defkalion-energy.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4t=956 Also I wonder how a person which claims to have lectured for 7 years and holds a BSc (physics) and a BE (Hons), bases his prove on claims and word of mouth instead of really doing his homework, looking at the numbers and facts and then, based on that, draw conclusions. But perhaps this is, what skepticism is all about today: If you cannot prove the definitive existence of the thing, you have to be against it absolutely. There is no room for for interpretation. Wolf
Re: [Vo]:Ni-64 enrichment
Jones, if they don't know Rossis catalyst - why do they allow independent parties to test the reactor? They seem to be pretty sure about what they are doing. Perhaps they are just trying to optimize the reaction? Wolf This thread on isotopic enrichment of nickel, from a couple of weeks ago, is being revived in light of the recent mention from DGT that they are still trying different catalysts ... ... which is about as close to an admission that they do not really know Rossi's secret, as we will get at this time. It is almost imperative, if progress is going to continue on this without Rossi for information or disinformation, to learn the results of the so-called Swedish analysis, assuming it will be a full isotopic analysis with ratios. Maybe that will not happen, but assuming that DGT has tried all of the 'usual suspects' (i.e. Mills' catalysts) and is not satisfied with the results (which is strongly indicated by the current state of affairs), then by process of elimination, it is looking like the 'secret sauce' is indeed enrichment in heavy nickel. This is defined herein as the crude enrichment of nickel in the two heaviest isotopes, 64Ni and 62Ni by simple ultracentrifuge techniques, using electroless nickel (liquid) as the feedstock. If this is true, then enrichment would also explain why Mills has not reached Rossi's robust results despite a twenty year head start. He simply did not think it was possible to do it. I realize that Peter, who is an expert on isotopic enrichment, of the traditional precision variety - has discounted this possibility of enrichment, due to cost. But perhaps he has not considered that this application does not demand any kind of precision, and simply going from less than 1% 64Ni to ten times that level, mas o menos, could make an enormous improvement in ongoing stability of the reaction. Or else Rossi's major breakthrough is another way to accomplish the same enrichment and that will be the subject of a patent which is still not published (filed in the last 18 months). Much of this speculation is still based on the fact that 64Ni is a singularity in being the heaviest natural isotope (in terms of the ratio of excess mass, compared to the mass of the most common isotope of the element) of any metal in the periodic table. Only deuterium is higher and it is not a metal. ** Jones From prior thread: The most interesting set of facts that can come out of the Swedish analysis (if we the public do get to see the report) is IF the fuel is enriched in 64Ni but the copper in the ash is natural ratio. That will essentially mean that some kind of non-transmutation reaction is occurring but with energy at the level of nuclear. This would also explain the low gamma signature and the lack of radioactive copper, which MUST be there if nickel transmutes. The fact that 64Ni is the heaviest isotope in the periodic table based on the criterion of percentage increase over the most common natural isotope cannot be overlooked. There is a way to fit all of these disparate parts into one model -- and it is the non-quark proton mass model which is evolving from my improvement to Nyman's work found in: http://dipole.se/ In this paper, simulations made with two different kinds of physics software both show the following: 1. Two protons placed closely together will repel each other most of the time. 2. Two protons shot at each other will bounce off and repel each other most of the time. 3. However, it is occasionally possible for two protons to approach each other with the right speed and **quark alignment** so that they latch onto each other (strong force) instead of repel... IOW quark placement will overcome Coulomb repulsion in standard physics and QED plus QM entanglement can alter that quark alignment... with a little help. No magic required (so far). This is where Nyman fails to make the right conclusion however. He opines the protons will fuse, which is forbidden for fermions in these conditions. However, the net reaction which is instigated by strong force attraction can still be strongly gainful, as Rossi demonstrates. The Ni64 connection to it all is the final piece of the puzzle but I will await the Swedes on connecting all the dots. ØIt could easily be the case that Rossi has found that nickel with ~10% 64Ni and ~15% 62Ni works well, and that this enrichment ratio need not be precise but can be obtained from electroless Ni feedstock with one pass in an ultra-centrifuge, and that the lower weight feedstock is more valuable than natural, so that it all fits together nicely. ØI have no problem with any of those premises standing alone, but it is all of them together that seems unlikely. Stranger things have happened. ØThat could be Rossi's main secret, for all we know, and he may have learned this from his contacts in DoE where, yes, they do fund precisely this kind of thing.
Re: [Vo]:A huge Rossi (bad) thing to be revealed soon. (Daniele Passerini)
On the LENR Facebook page, someone wrote that it perhaps is not a bad thing but more of a joke: http://www.facebook.com/EnergyCatalyzer Giuliano Bettini @Patrick. It's not properly a "bad news". In Italian it's something like a joke IMO Wolf Passerini says it is bad news for Rossi, Focardi, AND Celani. On Sun, Jan 29, 2012 at 10:06 AM, Alain Sepeda alain.sep...@gmail.com wrote: maybe they are the same ? #8*O 2012/1/28 Alan Fletcher a...@well.com MY has been banned, AG left (presumably) voluntarily. (I've seen a few recent MY posts elsewhere). - Original Message - On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 4:20 PM, Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net MY has gone as silent as AG. -- Patrick www.tRacePerfect.com The daily puzzle everyone can finish but not everyone can perfect! The quickest puzzle ever!
Re: [Vo]:insightful and concise...
Hi Mark, there have been two different news lately: The first one being that Ampenergo seemingly has gone inactive (although I don't know what this exactly means, if this is even the company which is related to Leonardo, how this would affect Rossi, etc.): http://ecatnews.com/?p=1897 Second: The University of Bologna has seemingly terminated the contract with Rossi, as Krivit has posted: http://blog.newenergytimes.com/2012/01/24/university-of-bologna-terminates-relationship-with-rossi/ I would like to know what Focardi and Levi think of that. Doesn't look like a good start for Rossi, the riddle... Wolf In the interim, while the Collective was being purged of trolls, there were a few comments that went on thru the backup vortex, and I'd like to bring one very insightful comment by Mr. Beene over to this, the main forum, for posterity... The thread was about Rossi and DGT, what the coming year will bring, and the likelihood of who gets to commercialization first... Jones summed it up like this: I think it will probably **be neither, but it will be **because of** both That is almost poetic... -m
Re: [Vo]:Rossi's Best Chance
Probably Rossi has some NI persons on the controlling front...? If Rossis statement about production facility planning is true there must be other engineers involved (although the thought of Rossi doing every single piece of engineering on himself makes me laugh :)) Perhaps (my theory): Defkalion started gathering professionals and therefore working on their own reactor from the beginning of August, whereas Rossi started the more professionalized work after the successful 1MW plant test (at least it seems like this to me). Therefore Defkalion might have a 3 to 4 month lead on Rossi? However, what interests me then, is: How long until one can buy a Hyperion? (given that the certification runs fine for Defkalion). As they only sell licenses the licensee has to first start developing a concept on what the production looks like. This in turn might Rossi give some lead back, doesn't it? Wolf I think Rossi's best chance is to stop giving out contradicting information / statements. A couple of weeks ago the home e-cat was going to ship at the end of this year, then yesterday he states that it won't be for another 12-18 months. What happened? There is the continuing inconclusive specification of the home e-cat, not to mention all the issues with the 1MW plant. It strikes me that he seems to be in a bit of panic mode as he's realised that DGT may indeed have something and beat him to market with a superiorly engineered product. Rossi really needs to get a team of professional engineers to take his products and engineer them to refined commercial products. That is assuming he hasn't already got a team doing this. If he has there is not much evidence of it. As for Ampenergo, it still exists and is still active http://www2.sos.state.oh.us/pls/bsqry/f?p=100:7:211773132719711::NO:7:P7_CHARTER_NUM:1852164. Why the e-mail address doesn't work is anyone's guess. Saying that has anyone managed to get in contact with Hydrofusion? I sent a couple of e-mails in the past and never got a reply or any acknowledgement of them receiving my e-mail. It's things like this that fuel the sceptics and the scam rumours. What is surprising, assuming DGT have what they say they have, is how quick DGT managed to come up with their own reactor technology. If no information transfer occurred between Rossi and DGT as Rossi states (which I don't believe) then DGT really pulled one out of the hat. I'm surprised no one else has managed to replicate yet if DGT managed it without any IP transfer from Rossi. In a way I feel sorry for Rossi as he has possibly found the answer to clean cheap energy but his personality may prevent him from actually being the first to market it commercially. Rossi is his own worse enemy.It may be as Jed said that he could be doing this deliberately to keep people off his back and to keep competitors from homing in. On 24/01/12 12:18, Vorl Bek wrote: Wolf Fischer wrote: there have been two different news lately: The first one being that Ampenergo seemingly has gone inactive (although I don't know what this exactly means, if this is even the company which is related to Leonardo, how this would affect Rossi, etc.): http://ecatnews.com/?p=1897 Second: The University of Bologna has seemingly terminated the contract with Rossi, as Krivit has posted: http://blog.newenergytimes.com/2012/01/24/university-of-bologna-terminates-relationship-with-rossi/ It seems to me Rossi's best chance is to hold conference calls with mom-and-pop investors and ask them to contribute $100 so that Rossi can do the last bit of engineering needed to stabilize the e-cat and allow him to run it for more than 4 hours. In return, they will get a $500 credit on whatever e-cat model they decide to buy, whenever the model gets made. The way it looks now, Rossi's enterprise is tottering, but he seems to have a number of Believers who would probably fork over the $100 or even more.
Re: [Vo]:Rossi's Best Chance
Jones, I also agree. However one question: Why does DGTs reactor provide an inferior ratio? As far as I remember, DGT claims a COP larger than 20 for a single reactor, whereas Rossi speaks of 6. Wolf Thank you, Robert. This is essentially what I have been saying for many weeks: Rossi has the ability to achieve a short run of nearly infinite COP-- 6-8 hours, after which there is inevitable quiescence. That is both his problem and his ace-in-the-hole. He has not shown an ability to move beyond that stalemate. Problem is -- thousands of man-hours of high quality engineering are now needed, and he cannot come close to doing it alone, BUT the biggest monetary value for him would only be possible if he could do it alone. However, if he could have done it months ago, then DGT would never have split, and Rossi would have adequate capital, even if not the entire 100 million. Now he is essentially penniless and cannot even give the University a pittance for desperately needed help. His time for monetizing even this slight developmental advantage is running out. Once DGT puts on a convincing show-and-tell, Rossi is nearly toast. That could happen this week. They may succeed with what is an inferior ratio of gain. Since they have never claimed self-running - this is indicative of having success through another route that does not involve a few of Rossi's secrets. Rossi's wife is smart enough to see this. Rossi's ego is too big. However, his wife will win this argument and Rossi will act like it was his idea. It is said this particular family dynamic is common in Italy. Look for a Rossi independent demo before the end of February, where -- among other things - he just admits the E-Cat will go quiescent at some time, but in this demo he does show the significantly long unpowered mode (except for the RF) which removes the possibility of a chemical reaction. Jones ** *From:*Robert Lynn ØIt wouldn't even matter if it only ran for 6 hours before falling into quiescence, clear incontrovertible independent validation of powerful LENR would still have the world beating a path to his door to give him millions. ØRealistically Rossi is in the game of selling a developmental advantage for a massive new field that will advance far ahead of his understanding within months or years. It is naive for him to try to sell a commercial product - he doesn't have the skills or resources to match what bigger players will do in a year or two (see how far ahead Defkalion appear to be now if their latest claims are true). If he doesn't realize that soon then he will ultimately be left poorer and probably embittered by his bad decisions.
Re: [Vo]:Re: Rossi and the 6 Oct data is so busted
Shaun, I don't know if you know the following thread but this topic has been analyzed before: http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg52981.html Further, Rossi answered to a question regarding the thermocouple placement: http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg52669.html Wolf Image of heat transfer material and location of thermocouple bead before the insulation was removed. http://i43.tinypic.com/zk65b4.jpg I'm no expert but those who are always tell me to get valid temperature data with a bead thermocouples, the bead head needs to be covered with a thermal transfer compound and the bead head needs to be in full face contact with the heat source. Knowing that and looking at the Lewans close up, that seems to have been taken earlier than any other image of that location I can find, where the bead head was located and the removal path it followed during it's removal is clear. Shaun On 22/01/2012 5:00 PM, Shaun Taylor wrote: I refer the reader to this report by your own Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/Rossi6Oct2011Review.pdf Please to to the bottom of page 3 where Horace discussed the placement of the Tout thermocouple and in particular these 3 images http://www.redmatica.com/media/Thermo1.jpg http://www.redmatica.com/media/Thermo2.jpg http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/LewanTcoupleClose.jpg You need to look at the first 2 images before looking at the smoking gun evidence in the 3rd image. The device in the images is a parallel plate counter flow heat exchanger in which the input primary heat inlet is applied at the same end as the secondary heat outlet. This allows a dual function manifold, which is the big brass thing in the images that couples the input primary steam tubing to the heat exchanger primary inlet and in the same solid assembly couples the secondary heat exchange outlet to the outlet piping. Doing this, I have read, increases efficiency in counter flow heat exchangers as there is heat transfer occurring from the hot steam end of the manifold through the manifold body to the cooler outlet water flow end of the manifold. As the inlet water temperature was reported as about 23 deg C and the inlet steam was at about 110 deg C, the temperature differential across the manifold body could span that temperature range. You could then selectively place a thermocouple bead somewhere on that manifold body and get anything from 110 deg C to 23 deg C. With just a bit of trial and error you would be able to find the perfect spot to make the Tout appear to be anything you desire. Like 10 deg C above the inlet water temperature. Horace assumed from the 3rd image that the thermocouple was suspended in the air in front of the stainless nut or attached to the nut. I contend, from my brief usage of thermocouples, they need some thermal goop around the bead head to ensure a good heat transfer from the measuring surface to the thermocouple head. In 3rd image do you see any goop anywhere? Any on the stainless nut? Nope. Any anywhere else? Yup. On the brass fitting to the right and below of the stainless nut. In fact it sure looks like there was a thermocouple sized head placed in the goop and then withdrawn as the insulation was opened and removed. Zoom in to get a really good look at the goop. See the withdrawal track in the goop that is about the same size as that of the thermocouple bead? There is your smoking gun as to where the bead was located. It was thermally attached to the upper surface of that brass coupling that is thermally attached to the manifold body. Now ask yourself, if your intention was to accurately measure the temperature of the water leaving the dual manifold head, why would you attach the thermocouple to the manifold and not insert in into the stream of the exiting water? Well just maybe as the manifold was also heated by the 110 deg C steam flowing into the heat exchanger it would be a good place for the Tout thermocouple to pick up a higher than reality temperature for the exiting water flow. The goop and the necessary kink in the wire is there to allow the thermocouple head to attach where the goop is and are more than a smoking gun of intentional fraud. It is proof of fraud. I also suggest the kink in the wire was there to allow the bead position to be easily altered, moved or slid across the surface of the brass fitting so as to tune the Tout temperature to be exactly what Rossi needed to best fake the 6 Oct data. The 6 Oct Ecat data is rubbish as Horace Heffner originally claimed. Horace got it right and most of the rest of you got it wrong. Rossi you are a serial liar and you are busted for intentional measurement fraud. You rigged the Tout thermocouple placement onto the manifold body to generate a higher than reality temperature of the exiting water stream instead of inserting the thermocouple head into the stream of the exiting water and directly measuring the temperature of the water. Busted, Busted,
Re: [Vo]:Re: Rossi and the 6 Oct data is so busted
Shaun, I didn't say anything about believing or not Rossi. I was more kind of questioning if this topic has to be discussed once more. Wolf On 22/01/2012 10:15 PM, Wolf Fischer wrote: Shaun, I don't know if you know the following thread but this topic has been analyzed before: http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg52981.html Further, Rossi answered to a question regarding the thermocouple placement: http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg52669.html Wolf Please, no one not even Rossi would position the Tout thermocouple bead floating in the air and expect it to accurately measure the temperature of the water in the yellow tube. The position you see is after the insulation was removed and the wire straightened out. Why do I say that? Look at how tightly the white insulation is compressed around the right side of the stainless nut. That amount of pressure on the thermocouple lead would have forced it to bend to conform to the shape of the nut. There is no evidence this occurred. Instead the thermocouple wire has a prominent kink about 50% of the way between the bead and where the wire is taped to the outlet fitting. This suggests the wire was bent in the middle and pushed down into the insulation, allowing the bead to come into contact with the brass fitting and the thermal transfer material and to be exposed to thermal leakage from the 110 deg C hot end of the manifold. Then the valley that is visible in the thermal transfer material image was formed when the insulation was removed and the bead was removed from being in contact with the brass fitting. As for Rossi saying the placement was checked to have no bias, (small lie on his part) he also said the BBB was shipped to the customer and that he had visited the customer to install the BBB (really big lie). Both of those big lie statements we now know are false. Why do you now give his Trust Me statement that he checked the placement and there was not temperature bias. I say BS Mr. Rossi. There is no way that thermocouple placement could have measured the real water temperature. No way in hell. Rossi is lying. Just liked the lied about the BBB. He has no regard for the truth and has proven that on many occasions. So please don't say to me it must be so because Rossi said it was so. He is a liar of top level lies. Stop believing his lies. Shaun
Re: [Vo]:University testing of the E-cat question asked on Rossi blog
This is were you clearly crossed the line. Get some air and do something else besides insulting people and repeating yourself! Wolf You are not very bright are you Jed. *From:* Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com *To:* John Milstone vortex-l@eskimo.com *Sent:* Sunday, 22 January 2012 10:09 PM *Subject:* Re: [Vo]:University testing of the E-cat question asked on Rossi blog John Milstone john_sw_orla...@yahoo.com mailto:john_sw_orla...@yahoo.com wrote: If the water was at 5 to 10 bars, it could easily be heated to 150 - 180 C. in the preheating process. At that point, being wrapped up in that massive insulation blanket, it would stay over 100 C for hours. There was a TC in the reactor. It measured over 100 deg C, but not 150 to 180 deg C. Also, in that scenario, the surface temperature of the reactor would be very hot when the internal temperature reached 180 deg C,then it would gradually cool down. That is not in evidence. The surface temperature was measured several times. It did not vary much. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:University testing of the E-cat question asked on Rossi blog
You (and people like you) really dont get it. This mailing list is about people discussing topics of different kinds, among them, e.g., LENR as well as Rossi. As long as there is doubt (on either side of the coin, i.e., either pro or contra) there have to be discussions, i.e., people allow other people to think and interpret the things they see and tell the rest how they see it and what they make of it. This is already the point, where you are being lost, as your behavior clearly shows! I could also translate this to such a simple concepts as freedom of speech and live and let live that you don't seem to get. The way that you try to push your opinions (because it is nothing more than that despite your saying otherwise) down our throats is just disgusting. I (and I think, although I myself am pretty new to this group, can speak for the rest here) have absolutely nothing against people who think otherwise on any topic, on the contrary! It is especially this process of at first disagreeing on a topic, then each person making their point with _constructive arguments_, then again letting the other person react to your arguments and so on, which creates a productive and constructive environment for new thoughts and theories that could actually be able to explain everything that is going on (because rarely a topic is just black and white!). In contrast to that, you stop at your very first thought (no matter if it is positive or negative, I am adressing both kind of people), you just leave absolutely no room for any kind of interpretation / doubt / whatsoever. And therefore its just not science. Its just some stupid blather which doesn't do anyone any good (except probably your self-inflated egoes). So just get off here, we really really really (have I said really?) have read what your thoughts are, more often than we actually care. And, believe it or not: We took notice! And, again, believe it or not: Most of the people already took notice a long time before you arrived here. Wolf Oh I am sorry. I forgot that Rossi is such an honest man that he would of course have put the temperature probe inside the pressure cooker Duh! *From:* Andre Blum andre_vor...@blums.nl *To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com *Sent:* Sunday, 22 January 2012 11:48 PM *Subject:* Re: [Vo]:University testing of the E-cat question asked on Rossi blog +1 On 01/22/2012 07:45 PM, Wolf Fischer wrote: This is were you clearly crossed the line. Get some air and do something else besides insulting people and repeating yourself! Wolf You are not very bright are you Jed. *From:* Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.com *To:* John Milstone vortex-l@eskimo.com mailto:vortex-l@eskimo.com *Sent:* Sunday, 22 January 2012 10:09 PM *Subject:* Re: [Vo]:University testing of the E-cat question asked on Rossi blog John Milstone john_sw_orla...@yahoo.com mailto:john_sw_orla...@yahoo.com wrote: If the water was at 5 to 10 bars, it could easily be heated to 150 - 180 C. in the preheating process. At that point, being wrapped up in that massive insulation blanket, it would stay over 100 C for hours. There was a TC in the reactor. It measured over 100 deg C, but not 150 to 180 deg C. Also, in that scenario, the surface temperature of the reactor would be very hot when the internal temperature reached 180 deg C,then it would gradually cool down. That is not in evidence. The surface temperature was measured several times. It did not vary much. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:The 1MW container is not from old footage.
Yup. The way they argue I think Shaun Taylor and Eff Wivakeef are actually the same persons... I think I might also start creating a kill list like Jed although perhaps there is a time when one of both might actually have something worthwhile to contribute to a discussion (although this seems unlikely at the moment)... Wolf So here was Shaun's acknowledging the FACT that he doesn't know, or have evidence that Rossi is even aware of the Australian licensee (Millin): === *While I have no proof*, I would expect a few of those going to the meeting would have emailed Rossi to check on the validity of Millin's claim to be the Australian licensee. No one would invest money with Millin without that being made very clear and at least sighting the necessary executed documents to back up Millin's claim. Shaun == So it is perfectly clear, from Shaun's own words, that *While I have no proof*... So when he then states as a fact, that, He [Rossi] has been caught working with licensees... SHAUN gets caught in an irrefutable LIE!! A fabrication! What a friggin' hypocrite... -Mark -Original Message- From: Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint [mailto:zeropo...@charter.net] Sent: Sunday, January 22, 2012 3:25 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]:The 1MW container is not from old footage. Shaun states as fact: He [Rossi] has been caught working with licensees to take green family investor money despite saying he would never do this. I think I have read all the postings so far, and Shaun was specifically asked, I think twice, by others if there was any evidence that *Rossi* himself has *specifically acknowledged* that the 'licensee' in Australia was indeed legitimate, or had all the statements of Rossi's involvement been made by the licensee, and not Rossi??? It is a real possibility that the licensee is making false statements about having licensed Rossi's technology for Australia, when in fact they have no such contract. So far, I have not seen any confirmation that Rossi is even aware of the licensee that held the investor meeting which Mr. Bryce attended. The licensee stating that there was supposed to be a Skype session with Rossi is not proof that Rossi agreed to any such thing. If that evidence has been provided, I'd appreciate it if you could please provide the link to the vortex posting that proves Rossi is aware of, and working with, that licensee... -Mark
Re: [Vo]:Ian Bryce and Rossi
Shaun, Bryce may be well respected but he is doing a very poor job regarding his research on the technology (and LENR in general). Regarding his calculation: This is also no prove of Rossi conducting a scam but just leaves the possibility that there could still be something else going on. And as to Rossi not attending this Skype meeting: If it is true that he should attend there (who knows except for Rossi and the organizer of the meeting? Was there an official statement from Rossi / Leonardo etc. that Rossi will attend? Perhaps the meeting organizer intended to create his own scam?), then his excuse with the bad timing is another strange (and negative) point in his already erratic behavior. But again: This is also no prove! So do not jump to conclusions too fast... Wolf On 21/01/2012 9:57 PM, Ransom Wuller wrote: Well, maybe the scam doesn't work anything like your speculation. Listen, that interview was a huge waste of my time. This Bryce guy knows far less about any of this then anyone following this on the Vortex. Maryyugo could have done a much better job then Bryce discussing why not to invest or MORE importantly why to insist on INDEPENDANT TESTING if you plan to invest. But what was most distressing about this guys interview was the lack of any information on the connection of this group with Rossi, the investment plan, the people organizing the meeting and their connection with Rossi all of which would have been of some interest. Please stop wasting my time, I spend enough of my day on this topic as it is. Ransom What part of Rossi was to do a live video Skype link and presentation to a meeting that was organized to raise investor funds for this licensee don't you understand? It was promoted that Rossi would, in effect, be there via the Skype link. The word went out far and wide and the money flush green investors flocked to hear what they wanted to hear, cheque books at the ready to contribute to the cause. To bad Ian Bryce was there. Well bad for the Rossi licensee. Good for the investors that put their cheque books away. But when Rossi learned there was a respected aerospace engineer coming to ask questions, the Skype connection never happened. Timing problems it was claimed. What these guys can't phone or text each other to get the timing right? The excuse of bad timing was a very bad one and one that doesn't stack up. As for Bryce's lack of knowledge, he knew enough to understand how much energy it takes to raise the temperature of a known amount of water at a measured rate of increase over time. Bryce did the calcs and the rate of increase was twice that of the applied power, even when increasing the water temperature from 23 deg C. So the rate of water temperature increase versus the amount of applied power is doggy at best and intentionally fraudulent at worst. The longer this continues, the more it will unravel. Rossi's statements will dig his own grave. Shaun
Re: [Vo]:Ian Bryce and Rossi
I did a little research on this investor and so on. From what I see: This Bryon New Energy Group has been formed by a man called Sol Millin. This guy once (or still?) advertised a car running on water, using a cosmic water cell... See here: http://www.soulsofdistortion.nl/BNE.html http://www.byronnewenergy.com/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page This Bryon New Energy Group itself seems to have a record of highly speculative investments, to say this in a politically correct way. So, coming back to your mail: Yes, the Rossi talk was announced. But by whom? Rossi himself? Or just by this Sol Millin and his strange Bryon New Energy Group? And your speculation that he dropped out because he might have gotten information about this Bryce and Smith guy attending... Really? a) Rossi showed his device to some much more clever guys than this Bryce person (all those well known professors, and they have seen this thing hands on). So why should he have been afraid of this one person? b) Perhaps Rossi just found out later about this Sol Millin guy and his very strange Investment Group. Could also have happened. What I am saying: I don't know. But you don't know either :) There are still perfectly valid interpretations for both sides of the coin. Wolf On 21/01/2012 11:01 PM, Wolf Fischer wrote: Shaun, Bryce may be well respected but he is doing a very poor job regarding his research on the technology (and LENR in general). Regarding his calculation: This is also no prove of Rossi conducting a scam but just leaves the possibility that there could still be something else going on. And as to Rossi not attending this Skype meeting: If it is true that he should attend there (who knows except for Rossi and the organizer of the meeting? Was there an official statement from Rossi / Leonardo etc. that Rossi will attend? Perhaps the meeting organizer intended to create his own scam?), then his excuse with the bad timing is another strange (and negative) point in his already erratic behavior. But again: This is also no prove! So do not jump to conclusions too fast... Wolf Dick Smith sent Ian Bryce there to talk to Rossi because the Rossi Skype video link was announced to be happening. That Rossi was to be there via a Skype link was stated in the first newspaper account. I expected the attendees would be potential home E-Cat buyers. When I found out the attendees were there as investors for the Rossi Australian licensee, it all became very clear what was going on. Seems the penny dropped about what was happening with Bryce and Smith as well. Shaun
Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com
I searched a little bit online. I can find some websites claiming that the Ecat was delivered to the customer. However I am not capable of finding a statement from Rossi where he says that the plant had been delivered to the customer. Just that the customer is happy and so on... Wolf I think, this is the first time for me that Rossi was caught in a direct lie... Or is it just me, remembering Rossi saying that the container had been shipped? Of course this also sheds some light on all the insider sources ;) Or Rossi is lieing again... Wolf -- Diese Nachricht wurde von meinem Android Mobiltelefon mit GMX Mail gesendet. Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint zeropo...@charter.net schrieb: This is comical! Ya gotta laugh. So, did Rossi confirm what the Collective seems to be converging to??? Y Thnk!!! BTW, Thanks go to Patrick Ellul for taking the direct route, and just asking the horse! Good job Patrick! -Mark From: Robert Leguillon [mailto:robert.leguil...@hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2012 10:03 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com You guys must have missed the post by Patrick Ellul: 1. Italo R. January 18th, 2012 at 2:02 PM Dear Ing. Rossi, I have watched this interview with you in Bologna realized on the 12th of January 2012 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odkfAjqA4pc In it appears a 1 MW container. May I ask you if that container is the same used in the last test with ing. Fioravanti and already sold to your customer? Thank you. Kind regards, Italo R. 2. Andrea Rossi January 18th, 2012 at 6:44 PM Dear Italo R. Yes, it is the same: we are still working on it with National Instruments and with the Customer. It will take another month before it will be ready. Warm Regards, A.R. - the floor strings are a moot point...someone must have mopped
Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com
AG, Can you give us a link where he said that? I can't find any except for some websites (not directly related to Rossi) which say so. Wolf EL, Rossi has stated the plant was shipped and installed in the customers US location and that he attended to do the install. AG On 19/01/2012 7:17 PM, Energy Liberator wrote: This is what I said earlier. I don't recall Rossi ever saying that the container was shipped. The seems to have been assumed once Rossi said the customer was happy and the plant was sold.
Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com
Thanks for searching and clarifying that. So he lied, plain and simple. Someone should confront him with his earlier statements, although this is probably useless... Wolf Wolf, On 30 Oct 2011, Andrea Rossi said the 1 MW plant had been shipped to the customer and he was building the next 1 MW plant in a new container. http://www.journal-of-nuclear-physics.com/?p=510cpage=27#comment-106637 Andrea Rossi October 30th, 2011 at 2:15 PM Dear Luke Mortensen: 1- yes 2- yes 3- yes. gaskets 4- different 5- Miami (Fl), Boston (Ma), Manchester (N.H.) Warm Regards, A.R. Luke Mortensen October 30th, 2011 at 12:54 PM Dear Andrea, 1. Is the 1MW container gone? 2. Have you started building another 1MW in another container? 3. Any improvements you want in version 2? 4. Will the buyer of the next 1MW container be the same customer or a different customer? 5. What city will you be working (hiring) in the US? Best wishes, Luke Mortensen AG On 19/01/2012 10:38 PM, Wolf Fischer wrote: AG, Can you give us a link where he said that? I can't find any except for some websites (not directly related to Rossi) which say so. Wolf
Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com
I think, this is actually one of the better explanations pro Rossi so far that I have heard of... Then the question remains where he did build the other 1MW cats..? In the US directly? And the more general question to me is, why he has a place in Italy at all if he is seemingly doing most the stuff in the US and he wants the technology to be American? Still, I took the liberty of asking Rossi directly on his journal about the confusion. I tried to be as politically correct as I can :) still I fear the chances of getting a proper response might be very low... Wolf Andre, Question: Is the container gone? Answer: Yes. Can't be much simpler than that. Maybe the container in the video and picture is a demo, like the ones in car showrooms. The one the customer actually buys is the one from the lot or the one being manufactured that is shipped in a week later. When Rossi says the container is 'gone', maybe he means another container from some other factory. Or maybe it is the container in the picture that he is talking about, but he means it is 'gone' in some legal sense - it is now the property of the buyer and Rossi is just putting on the finishing touches.
Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com
Frank, Thanks for the info! Just for verification: When did you write Rossi the Mail and when was has this same interpretation been posted here on vortex? There was a user which thought of the same interpretation... Wolf I emailed Andrea Rossi this morning about this issue and recieved the following supply: Of course there has been a misunderstanding due to my bad translation. The 1 MW plant has been accepted and sold ( hence gone) but it remained in our factory of Bologna for fixings and for National Instruments improvements of the control systems. Warm Regards, A.R. On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:00 AM, Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com mailto:aussieguy.e...@gmail.com wrote: EL, Yup. The BBB never moved, was never gone, was never shipped, was never returned, is not currently operational and is not in testing despite what Rossi has claimed. Also that facility is not heated with an E-Cat. Is there another facility that is making fully functional E-Cat, has a production line, has an advanced RD facility and the US customer has one of these units? Maybe. But we have no proof of that. All we need is ONE photograph of another E-Cat on a production. Rossi claims to be making another 13. Why not post a photo of that line? Will that give away trade secrets? Instead what we get is a video of the 28 Oct BBB. Is that all Rossi has to show? If so I have wasted a lot of my and my companies time and money. AG On 20/01/2012 12:47 AM, Energy Liberator wrote: It's obvious that there is not much going on in that workshop. -- Frank Acland Publisher, E-Cat World http://www.e-catworld.com Author, The Secret Power Beneath https://www.smashwords.com/books/view/
Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com
As far as I am correct, you should have received the mail from andre_vortex at about 8:01 a.m. US central time. When did Rossi answer? But perhaps this is just too paranoid from my side and just not worth the thought... Wolf I wrote just this morning. It was 7:17 a.m. US central time. On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:30 AM, Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc...@gmx.de wrote: Frank, Thanks for the info! Just for verification: When did you write Rossi the Mail and when was has this same interpretation been posted here on vortex? There was a user which thought of the same interpretation... Wolf I emailed Andrea Rossi this morning about this issue and recieved the following supply: Of course there has been a misunderstanding due to my bad translation. The 1 MW plant has been accepted and sold ( hence gone) but it remained in our factory of Bologna for fixings and for National Instruments improvements of the control systems. Warm Regards, A.R. On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:00 AM, Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com mailto:aussieguy.e...@gmail.com wrote: EL, Yup. The BBB never moved, was never gone, was never shipped, was never returned, is not currently operational and is not in testing despite what Rossi has claimed. Also that facility is not heated with an E-Cat. Is there another facility that is making fully functional E-Cat, has a production line, has an advanced RD facility and the US customer has one of these units? Maybe. But we have no proof of that. All we need is ONE photograph of another E-Cat on a production. Rossi claims to be making another 13. Why not post a photo of that line? Will that give away trade secrets? Instead what we get is a video of the 28 Oct BBB. Is that all Rossi has to show? If so I have wasted a lot of my and my companies time and money. AG On 20/01/2012 12:47 AM, Energy Liberator wrote: It's obvious that there is not much going on in that workshop. -- Frank Acland Publisher, E-Cat World http://www.e-catworld.com Author, The Secret Power Beneath https://www.smashwords.com/books/view/ -- Frank Acland Publisher, E-Cat World http://www.e-catworld.com Author, The Secret Power Beneath https://www.smashwords.com/books/view/
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
Some of us tried to find where he said that the thing was shipped. The only thing that we found was his answer on the question Is it gone? -- Yes. The question leaves a little room for interpretation in my opinion, but really - it's only very little room... Wolf On 12-01-19 10:11 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: This discussion about Rossi's 1 MW reactor is silly. The reactor has not shipped anywhere. He said it has not shipped, and it is obvious from the photos it has not. Previously he said he did ship it. Now he says he did not. He is contradicting himself. He often does that. I would not call it a lie He said it shipped. That's a binary statement, either true or false. If false, I, personally, would call it a lie. In fact, for the most part, when a vendor says they shipped something and they really didn't, most folks would call that a lie. Photos indicate Rossi didn't ship it. That makes his statement false, thus, as I said, making it what most folks would call a lie. (That's what a lie IS, for goodness' sake! It didn't ship, he knew perfectly well it didn't ship, and he said it did ship. Right?) Now Rossi says it didn't ship, which most people would characterize as an admission, though he didn't couch it quite that way. (But of course he didn't say I admit it didn't ship -- if you're covering up an earlier lie, it's always better to make it sound like the current story was true all along, and anything else is just mistakes, misunderstandings, or stuff to be ignored and/or dismissed.) Just what would he have to do, Jed, for you to say he lied ? in the usual sense because he makes no effort to cover up or explain the contradiction. He says X on Monday and not X on Tuesday as if it makes no difference. Yup, he's what most folks would call a pathological liar. Yet you seem to be saying that because he lies habitually, nearly constantly, we should conclude that he really doesn't lie at all. I don't quite follow that. As if he never expected to be believed in the first instance, and he did not mean it. This is a totally bizarre characterization of his behavior, IMHO. Truth is malleable in his imagination. Maybe; I don't have a direct line into his imagination. From where I'm sitting he just looks like a pathological liar.
Re: [Vo]:Rossi's behavior is more tragic than deceptive
Mary, NI is not publishing _such_ a press release on any NI customer (again: Remember the mentioning of CERN / LHC in the same section as Leonardo Corporation). We had this topic here before. Wolf On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 11:28 AM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Who knows what to make of it. I am sure that NI is really working on it. Their VP wrote to Forbes, after all. Or they were working on it . . . Maybe Rossi threw them out. It would be better to be more precise. The VP of NI wrote a news release of a general nature saying that they assist many companies in fitting control systems to their products including Rossi's. That makes Rossi a customer of NI's and nothing more. And there are millions of those. Nothing about working with NI or what the VP wrote lends the slightest credibility to Rossi's claims.
Re: [Vo]:Rossi's behavior is more tragic than deceptive
Jed, Great statement! And (just to point this one out again): The cherry on the pie in the press release is the mentioning of CERN / LHC in the sentence prior to the one about Leonardo Corporation / Rossi. Wolf Chemical Engineer cheme...@gmail.com mailto:cheme...@gmail.com wrote: As long as Rossi pays for NI's hardware and software they are probably satisfied and don't mind the free advertising. This would be the worst advertising imaginable!!! What corporation wants to be associated with Rossi? Do a Google search and you find hundreds of attacks against him. Check his background and you find it is dripping in scandal. This is NOT good PR for NI. Not, not, _not_. If I were them, I would not respond to Forbes, or I would say we can't comment on whether we are in a relationship with this company. They do not require a deep knowledge of what he is doing or even if his reactor works or not. If they do not have deep knowledge they are crazy to let themselves be associated it. John Milstone john_sw_orla...@yahoo.com mailto:john_sw_orla...@yahoo.com wrote: Maybe they just got tired of the hundreds, if not thousands of annoying emails and phone calls from Rossi's fans, demanding a detailed accounting of just how great Rossi's invention really is? In that case, all they have to do is issue a statement saying no comment. Or, as I said, we never talk about customer relationships of this nature. A company that is annoyed will deny everything and make no more comments. The lady in charge of PR at the company issued a statement about Rossi. So did a VP of development. Believe me, NI is aware of this at highest levels. As Mary Yugo pointed out, they have millions of customers. The VP does not know them all by name, and will not make statements about 999,900 of these customers. It isn't at all unusual for a company to release a statement on an issue that is generating more than typical interest. It is unusual for any company anywhere to make any statement pertaining to cold fusion. _Extremely_ unusual! NI made the most insignificant acknowledgement possible . . . Nonsense. I can think up any number of less significant acknowledgement, starting with no comment. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Lewan Mats says he never thought the reactor shipped
Jed, you have to admit that it just must be difficult for some people to believe in Rossi because of the way he behaves (and therefore also separating the behavior from his claimed inventions as this requires some abstract and very rational thinking, no harm intended). The fact that you have insider knowledge is really nice for you (I envy you for that and I would really like to know more about that :)). However, this is your information only, therefore it doesn't help the rest of us because (understandably) you cannot reveal who your sources are and what they say. Therefore, the rest of the normal people is left with Rossis claims, his behavior as well as the claims from NI, NASA, DGT and of course people like you etc. And as much as I appreciate statements from you, the fact that this is the Internet and there are other people with different Insider knowledge (like, e.g., Jones Beene) simply makes it difficult to trust anything and anyone. Therefore there is not a lot of things that we can hold onto (regarding Rossi its some more or less conclusive test during the last year as well as the NI press release; we, e.g., don't know about the independent tests by 3rd parties). And from all those claims and statements everyone constructs his very own image, necessarily. This is where the big confusion and noise comes from... So have a good night (here it is 1:10 AM). Wolf Yamali Yamali yamaliyam...@yahoo.de mailto:yamaliyam...@yahoo.de (who also has the e-mail response parameter wrong) wrote: Jed Rothwell wrote: ... Rossi has no credibility. ... How can you come this far and still believe his e-cats work and he never faked anything? Haven't we dicussed endlessly how easy that would be? And yet you seem to believe that a guy without any credivility had his one honest moment in life just when it came to what would probably be the greatest breakthroughs in the history of science? I'm... ahh... puzzled. Look, this is not complicated. Please, take it one step at a time: 1. Scientific credibility comes when you are independently checked or independently replicated. It is _never_ a function of your personal credibility. If it was, no one would believe Robert Stroud (the birdman of Alcatraz) -- to take an extreme example -- because he was an habitual liar and a homicidal maniac. We believe Stroud because people have read his books, confirmed his observations, and used his techniques successfully. 2. Rossi has been independently replicated by Defkalion, and his devices have been carefully checked by many experts. 3. He cannot have faked devices checked thousands of miles away from him at Defkalion. 4. It is not physically possible for him to fake heat that burns someone. It is not possible for him to conduct 5 kW of electricity over a thin wire. No one can do that. You must separate the person from the claim in your mind. The personality or behavior of the person has no bearing on whether the claim is true or false. You can only judge the claim by experiment. Rossi has been independently confirmed by experiment. That's all there is to it. Discussions of his personality may be interesting but they CANNOT AFFECT THE VALIDITY OF HIS CLAIM. Yugo and others say that the experiment was never done except in Rossi's presence, and he might have used stage magic. That is wrong on two counts: 1. It has been done repeatedly thousands of miles from him, with equipment he never touched. He denies the equipment exists! 2. No such stage magic tricks exist, or can exist. It is physically impossible. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com
S.A., thanks for the vid! I have taken the liberty of creating a little collage where I try to compare pictures of the different 1 MW units which I have found (one version from mid september, one from the beginning of october, then the 1MW plant from the end of october as well as the newest one) http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/830/ecatcollage.png/ (You might have to download the complete picture to your HDD in order to see all the details, as this is over 4 MB in size!) You can see slight changes between the newest one and the one from the end of october (compare row 2, columns 1 and 2, on the first picture, the newest one is missing two reactors, perhaps they haven't been put in), however this doesn't prove anything (as always...). Then the sheath of the tubes next to Rossi in the 6th october test seem to be of a different material than the one on the newest cat (however this might be due to different light exposure). On row 2, column 2 you can also see an additional red vessel (hydrogen container?). In row 3, column 1 and 2, those red vessels all seem to face the same direction. Regarding new information: One thing that you didn't mention: ecat.com says that domestic Ecats will be ready for the market 12 to 18 month (I think they mean 12 to 18 month from now, as they do not state this precisely; so this means that availability might be pushed back until summer next year; this doesn't really surprise me...). Wolf Hello group, Have a look at this interesting Youtube video by ecat.com: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odkfAjqA4pc Apparently it's been filmed on January 12th. It shows that: - Rossi is currently in Bologna - Rossi's test site appears to be cold - The 1 MW E-Cat container shown during the last public demo is in Bologna too - There appears to be a new control box. Have I missed anything else? Cheers, S.A.
Re: [Vo]:New Krivit Stuff : National Instruments
The National Instruments press release (although interesting) is quite old (from November 14th). Here is the original: http://digital.ni.com/worldwide/bwcontent.nsf/websearch/2c6b449a3f0f8f3a862579480060a07f Wolf At 12:19 PM 1/18/2012, Akira Shirakawa wrote: On 2012-01-18 21:12, Alan J Fletcher wrote: Two new entries .. both interesting High-Energy Meets Low-Energy: A First at CERN http://blog.newenergytimes.com/2012/01/16/high-energy-meets-low-energy-a-first-at-cern/ According to Daniele Passerini (22passi), who's received a copy as well, Celani's email about CERN was supposed to remain confidential, and I think there might have been good reasons for that. 22passi also has a National Instruments (Italy) Press Release -- with CERN and Rossi (Leonardi) in the same paragraph ! http://22passi.blogspot.com/2012/01/se-ha-ragione-ocasapiens.html Link to http://digital.ni.com/worldwide/bwcontent.nsf/web/all/0EDB0AF6A3E7862579560030DDD8 Google translate : National Instruments provides solutions in the field of high energy physics PRESS RELEASE - National Instruments continues to provide measurement and control technologies for high performance in research and physics. NI offers standard commercial tools (COTS - commercial off-the-shelf) to support thousands of technicians and engineers working to meet the challenges of the alternative energy sector with sophisticated devices. With the design of software systems NI LabVIEW , modular instrumentation PXI platform, reconfigurable control and acquisition NI CompactRIO and other tools, National Instruments has supported many researchers to simplify the development of projects, offering advanced control solutions that would otherwise be been prohibitively expensive. For over 35 years, National Instruments has offered to innovators the tools they need to cope with major engineering challenges in the world, said Stephen Concezzi, sciences segment manager at National Instruments and big physics. We are excited about the many opportunities to support our customers to simplify the development of energy projects or advanced physics. Innovators around the world use the approach of the graphic design of NI to respond effectively to major engineering challenges in the medical field , in urban infrastructure, alternative energy and other critical applications in character. Especially in the field of physics, NI has provided solutions to some of the most advanced projects including the ' LHC (Large Hadron Collider) at CERN and the control systems of Tokamak . In addition, the Corporation intends to enter Leonardo NI tools in its control system. For more info on NI solutions for big physics applications visit ni.com / physics . About National Instruments National Instruments ( italy.ni.com ) is revolutionizing the way in which engineers and scientists design, prototype and deploy systems for measurement, automation and embedded applications.
Re: [Vo]:New Krivit Stuff
I don't like Krivits behavior, still: Why don't they just throw him out / cancel his membership / whatsoever? Shouldn't be too difficult, or? Also, if information should be kept confidential, then why post it on any kind of semi-public forum? Wolf It wouldn't be the first time that Krivit would have released something that he shouldn't have. All of the recent info that comes to mind was all derived from CMNS communications. Date: Wed, 18 Jan 2012 21:19:41 +0100 From: shirakawa.ak...@gmail.com To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:New Krivit Stuff On 2012-01-18 21:12, Alan J Fletcher wrote: Two new entries .. both interesting High-Energy Meets Low-Energy: A First at CERN http://blog.newenergytimes.com/2012/01/16/high-energy-meets-low-energy-a-first-at-cern/ According to Daniele Passerini (22passi), who's received a copy as well, Celani's email about CERN was supposed to remain confidential, and I think there might have been good reasons for that. Cheers, S.A.
Re: [Vo]:Congress responds quickly to opposition to SOPA and PIPA -- how this relates to cold fusion
Jed, I agree with you that it all depends on how fast the LENR community gets the truth out. Therefore, as much as I would prefer your scenario over Eds, getting the truth out is exactly the problem IMHO: The media will brainwash people and the big energy lobby will brainwash the politicians. Let some mass media promote the idea that cold fusion involves a nuclear reaction (also including some gamma rays) and nuclear reactions are bad (just look at Fukushima). Just some stupid statement like this and it will become much more difficult and will take a longer time to get the truth out. Additional time which will help lobbyists to force some political actions regarding the protection of the economy (which is not that far fetched regarding a short term view and this is what it is mostly about today, sadly enough). Therefore you would have fear for your health (gamma rays...) and fear for your job. It's fear which helps you steer the people. Wolf Google, Wikipedia and many other web sites are campaigning against the proposed laws governing the Internet, the so-called SOPA and PIPA acts. Key supporters of the acts in Congress have already bowed to public pressure. The acts are not likely to pass. See: http://slatest.slate.com/posts/2012/01/16/jimmy_wales_wikipedia_blackout_to_protest_sopa_on_wednesday.html If it becomes generally known that cold fusion is real, and that it will save thousands of dollars a year per person, there will be an enormous brouhaha in the mass media. There is likely to be opposition to cold fusion from the fossil fuel industry, the DoE and others. Some people, including Ed Storms, predict that it may take many years to push aside this opposition to allow reactors and commercial development in the U.S. I suppose that is possible, but I predict another scenario. I predict that people will be outraged when they learn that vested interests are preventing them from saving huge sums of money. Nothing excites people more than money. Nothing is more likely to trigger widespread activism. I predict the voters will raise hell, the way they are today with SOPA and PIPA. Within months, or perhaps even weeks, the opposition will be swept aside. I predicate this prediction on the hope that the public becomes fully aware of the potential of cold fusion. It is possible this potential will not be reported in the mass media. Perhaps the mass media will continue to report the kind of nonsense Mark Gibbs in Forbes has been publishing lately. In that case, all bets are off. Cold fusion will be effectively suppressed if that happens. It all depends on whether we can reach the public, and motivate the public. I quoted a British engineer in the intro to my book, who described how it was that effective anti-pollution laws were finally passed in England, after centuries of dithering: on public opinion, and on it alone, finally rests the issue. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com
Just some speculation from my side, but I think that the reactor has been moved at least once. In the following video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t19C-7WJPTMfeature=related taken from the october 28th, the camera man starts at the back of the BBB and then moves along the left side of the reactor to the front. On the left side, there is another table standing and still the camera man seems to get though without problems. If you compare this to the pictures from my collage (especially at 1,1), there seems to be less space on the picture, especially at the opening to the front. But perhaps this is just my perception. Wolf Akira Shirakawa shirakawa.ak...@gmail.com mailto:shirakawa.ak...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks for the collage. It looks like the container has never been moved from its original location. It is probably the same container, in that case. I think it would be difficult to place a second one in exactly the same spot. I was watching people erect a concrete parking garage the other day. They were moving huge beams and pre-formed slabs into precisely aligned positions, with a crane. This can be done, but it is a lot of work. I assume if they brought in a second shipping container they would not go to the effort to set it down precisely where the first one was. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com
I did some further analysis of the picture and I am now pretty sure that the Ecat has either NOT been moved or it has been put back to exactly the same position. I have reuploaded the picture in the following link: http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/696/ecatcollage.png/ The important stuff is in the pictures in row 3 (i drew a red circle around the additional black lines and the crossings which I think are important; At the back of the ecat I only inserted the vertical black line, the crossing horizontal black line is from the window / wall / whatever). Both vertically as well as horizontally this seems to be the same position (give or take a few centimeters because of the picture resolution as well as the slightly different angle / position of the camera man). Wolf Akira, Then are you saying Rossi was a bit untruthful when he said the customer was completely satisfied with the demo, and took delivery? Anyway - I'm not so sure that it is exactly in the same position on Jan 12 as Oct 28. It is in a similar position, as it would need to be, near the loading dock door and on the mat. Jones -Original Message- From: Akira Shirakawa It looks like the container has never been moved from its original location. Cheers, S.A.
RE: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com
I think, this is the first time for me that Rossi was caught in a direct lie... Or is it just me, remembering Rossi saying that the container had been shipped? Of course this also sheds some light on all the insider sources ;) Or Rossi is lieing again... Wolf -- Diese Nachricht wurde von meinem Android Mobiltelefon mit GMX Mail gesendet. Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint zeropo...@charter.net schrieb: This is comical! Ya gotta laugh. So, did Rossi confirm what the Collective seems to be converging to??? Y Thnk!!! BTW, Thanks go to Patrick Ellul for taking the direct route, and just asking the horse! Good job Patrick! -Mark From: Robert Leguillon [mailto:robert.leguil...@hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2012 10:03 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com You guys must have missed the post by Patrick Ellul: 1. Italo R. January 18th, 2012 at 2:02 PM Dear Ing. Rossi, I have watched this interview with you in Bologna realized on the 12th of January 2012 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odkfAjqA4pc In it appears a 1 MW container. May I ask you if that container is the same used in the last test with ing. Fioravanti and already sold to your customer? Thank you. Kind regards, Italo R. 2. Andrea Rossi January 18th, 2012 at 6:44 PM Dear Italo R. Yes, it is the same: we are still working on it with National Instruments and with ! the Customer. It will take another month before it will be ready. Warm Regards, A.R. - the floor strings are a moot point...someone must have mopped
Re: [Vo]:Forbes and Gibbs Garbage: NASA says Cold Fusion is Nothing Useful
This depends on how you classify the statement. If you expected it to help in the Rossi case, sure, it's not useful. But this was not NASA intentions. In the other case, where they are promoting LENR, this is tremendously helpful / useful. Therefore, I think, Gibbs headline is misleading and therefore not useful at all. Wolf Well, I have to agree with Gibbs, at least in the title. He said that NASA didn't say anything useful and not that cold fusion is useless 2012/1/17 Ron Kita chiralex.k...@gmail.com mailto:chiralex.k...@gmail.com Greetings Vortex: More Gibbs Garbage: http://www.forbes.com/sites/markgibbs/2012/01/16/cold-fusion-nasa-says-nothing-useful/ Gibb is not useful. Respectfully, Ron Kita, Chiralex -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com mailto:danieldi...@gmail.com
Re: [Vo]:Rossi on the Smart Scarecrow Show
Can't this type of gamma rays be shielded (I think he meant 511 keV gammas)? Using google I found, e.g., the following (although I don't know how well the shielding works): http://www.corning.com/specialtymaterials/products_capabilities/radiation_shielding_glass/Med_Pet.aspx Further here http://www.google.com/url?sa=trct=jq=how%20to%20shield%20511%20kev%20gamma%20rayssource=webcd=1ved=0CB0QFjAAurl=http%3A%2F%2Frpop.iaea.org%2FRPOP%2FRPoP%2FContent%2FDocuments%2FTrainingPETCT%2FLectures%2FPETCT_L06_Protective_Equipment_WEB_.pptei=PRwUT7HPAdH7sgaV4YG7AQusg=AFQjCNHrlOvOzMONXpQShs8BoOzCShHAkQcad=rja They are talking about 3-5 cm of lead shielding which would be required. Levi, e.g., says that the majority of the reactors weight comes due to lead shielding (about 2cm). By the way: I tried to ask Rossi about this on his journal. Seems as if he didn't like the question... Defkalion however just answered that shielding is easy: http://www.defkalion-energy.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23t=865p=5375#p5375 They refer to this company: http://www.ecomass.com/index.html Wolf 512 keV 180 deg Gammas have been detected. Then why is he still alive - and how can he possibly claim to put serious effort in developing home units when from that factor alone it is abundantly clear that none of this technology will ever run anywhere that somebody calls home?
Re: [Vo]:Rossi on the Smart Scarecrow Show
year expected life. Customer price between $400 to $500 for a home E-Cat 10 kW thermal unit. AG On 1/15/2012 10:29 AM, Wolf Fischer wrote: Hi there, Rossi was just on the Smart Scarecrow Show. There were some new information / clarification (although I can't remember them all; the information below should be correct however I sometimes had problems understanding Rossi because of a pretty low audio quality and me not being a native English speaker): 1. He sold another 1MW reactor (in addition to the 13 which have already been sold), but many potential customers are in line... 2. Production should start in autumn, distribution in winter (if everything works out as planned) 3. He wants to sell one million Ecats next year (this is what they are aiming for in a complete year regarding production) 4. Price of the Home Ecat is down to 500$ 5. Ecat is thought for heating the home, not for heating the water for showering etc. 6. Refueling the Ecat is done by replacing a cartridge. This cartridge will cost around 10$ and will then be sent back to a factory where it will be recycled. 7. The testing of the Ecat through the University of Bologna is currently not at the top of his priority list (there is currently the engineering of the production facilities) but he said something about starting with this next month 8. I wanted to know something about the stability of the reactor (I was referring to the uptime of the reactor, however Sterling shortened the question). According to Rossi, especially the temperature output was stabilized with the help of NI (at least this is what I understood). 9. On patenting - his lawyers are working on that. 10. Regarding the radio frequency generator: He didn't want to reveal anything. He compared this to Martial Arts and said something about that it is important for overcoming the coulomb barrier. 11. If I understood him correctly (If!), while explaining the working mechanism of the reactor core, he said that in the reaction gamma rays will be emitted, then hit a lead shielding which then will heat up and therefore heat the water. 12. The first question regarding the first customer was (of course) not answered because of an NDA This is what I did just remember from 1:30h... There will surely be a transcript available soon. Wolf
Re: [Vo]:Rossi on the Smart Scarecrow Show
Just another point from the interview: Rossi has admitted that last year they had peaks even when the reactor should just produce about 120C°. This problem seems to have been resolved (because of NI), so no more peaks. Besides that NI is especially helping in the problem of getting the reactor up to 400C° in order to produce electricity. Somehow the customer of the first 1MW plant is helping in solving those problems, as it is not as trivial as just putting the Ecats in serial in order to reach higher temperatures. What I learned from the interview. 10 kW home E-Cat is the size of a portable computer. Rossi calls the recharges Energy Sticks, fits with the ball point pen refill statement. Replacement is simple and can be done by anyone. No H2 canisters used. Reactor stores and recycles the H2. Only uses picograms of H2. Reactor control is via regulation of operational heat point. Fuel lasts 4,320 operational hours (180 days at 24 hours a day). E-Cat will signal when refill is needed. Customer can purchase several refills and keep them in stock. Cost of the refill to the customer will be $10 plus installation if needed. Will be available via internet sales. Home units will run in self sustain mode. 512 keV 180 deg Gammas have been detected. 1st 1 MW plant is in modification. Should be operation in 1 - 2 months. 12 additional 1 MW plants are being built. 1 additional 1 MW plant has been sold to another customer. UL certification of the home E-Cat is in process. 2.7 to 2.9 kWs needed for 1 hour to start the home 10 kW E-Cat. Home E-Cat has only 1 reactor. Rossi claims the RFG helps the Coulomb barrier work with the reaction and not against it. First E-Cat factory is in Florida. Rossi is going to Massachusetts to further discuss building another E-Cat plant there. Home E-Cat production will start in the US fall. Sales will start in the US winter. Rossi is not interested in family investors as the business is still risky. Large hedge funds are welcome but only with a small % investment. Does plan to go public. Home E-Cat has a 30 year expected life. Customer price between $400 to $500 for a home E-Cat 10 kW thermal unit. AG On 1/15/2012 10:29 AM, Wolf Fischer wrote: Hi there, Rossi was just on the Smart Scarecrow Show. There were some new information / clarification (although I can't remember them all; the information below should be correct however I sometimes had problems understanding Rossi because of a pretty low audio quality and me not being a native English speaker): 1. He sold another 1MW reactor (in addition to the 13 which have already been sold), but many potential customers are in line... 2. Production should start in autumn, distribution in winter (if everything works out as planned) 3. He wants to sell one million Ecats next year (this is what they are aiming for in a complete year regarding production) 4. Price of the Home Ecat is down to 500$ 5. Ecat is thought for heating the home, not for heating the water for showering etc. 6. Refueling the Ecat is done by replacing a cartridge. This cartridge will cost around 10$ and will then be sent back to a factory where it will be recycled. 7. The testing of the Ecat through the University of Bologna is currently not at the top of his priority list (there is currently the engineering of the production facilities) but he said something about starting with this next month 8. I wanted to know something about the stability of the reactor (I was referring to the uptime of the reactor, however Sterling shortened the question). According to Rossi, especially the temperature output was stabilized with the help of NI (at least this is what I understood). 9. On patenting - his lawyers are working on that. 10. Regarding the radio frequency generator: He didn't want to reveal anything. He compared this to Martial Arts and said something about that it is important for overcoming the coulomb barrier. 11. If I understood him correctly (If!), while explaining the working mechanism of the reactor core, he said that in the reaction gamma rays will be emitted, then hit a lead shielding which then will heat up and therefore heat the water. 12. The first question regarding the first customer was (of course) not answered because of an NDA This is what I did just remember from 1:30h... There will surely be a transcript available soon. Wolf
Re: [Vo]:Rossi on the Smart Scarecrow Show
Mary, aren't you getting tired of repeating yourself all the time? Wolf Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com schrieb: On Sun, Jan 15, 2012 at 3:34 PM, Alan Fletcher wrote: Last I heard, Rossi was still saying you need a WATER line to the eCat. I hope that's changed. If it hasn't, I'm sure it will. All you have to do to hear just about any claim from Rossi is to wait a bit.
Re: [Vo]:1MW delay
Didn't Ampenergo put some cash into Rossi last year in May? Here it is: http://www.e-catworld.com/2011/05/fast-facts-about-ampenergo-andrea-rossis-north-and-south-american-commercial-partner/ Wolf On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 8:30 PM, Alan J Fletchera...@well.com wrote: January 13th, 2012 at 5:51 PM http://www.journal-of-nuclear-physics.com/?p=516cpage=15#comment-169415 The 1 MW Customer is not yet working with the 1 MW plant, because we are still completing the control systems with National Instruments. I wonder how he is running financially. Not a single eCat delivered to date; but, already pricing mega eCats for the future. No wonder the skeptics are skeptical. T
Re: [Vo]:1MW delay
Where did you get the information that the customer sent the 1MW plant back? Are you an employee of the customer? (as you mention the word we) Wolf Why read something else into this? LOL. You must be joking. Because Rossi spoke it, for one thing - and because it is misleading for another, just short of complete dishonesty. You should know this, AG - if you talk to Rossi as much as you claim; and if he is being straight with you. Rossi did deliver, yes, but the customer has sent it back. Rossi's spin: we will add controls. Only Rossi has NOT even admitted that it has been returned. That would sound too much like failure. Customers complaint: *did not work over extended periods*, so of no value for intended use, despite the fact that it does work for short periods. Thus we sent it back to Bologna. -Original Message- From: Aussie Guy E-Cat Rossi has delivered a 1 MW E-Cat, has said they are building the other 13 x 1 MW E-Cats and he has ample cash. What he said here was they are not yet finished with the optimization of the NI system. Why read something else into his statement? AG
Re: [Vo]:1MW delay
Thanks for the info! Can you share some more information? If so: - Do you know, if works for a short time means that it actually delivers more energy than has been put in? How long is short? ;) - Is the customer waiting for a new and improved version or has he canceled all the contracts? Wolf No, I am not an employee of the customer, but it is a rather large group... ... ever heard of any large group keeping a secret secure, once too many tongue-waggers know about it? People talk. If J. Edgar could not suppress the incredible secret (that he was a gay cross-dresser) during the 40s, back when 'gay' - meant something else - AND - the USA was better about keeping secrets than today, AND the FBI pretty much could do what it wanted to, does anyone really think that Rossi can keep this kind of thing quiet for long? BTW - new movie out about Hoover. -Original Message- From: Wolf Fischer Where did you get the information that the customer sent the 1MW plant back? Are you an employee of the customer? (as you mention the word we) Wolf Why read something else into this? LOL. You must be joking. Because Rossi spoke it, for one thing - and because it is misleading for another, just short of complete dishonesty. You should know this, AG - if you talk to Rossi as much as you claim; and if he is being straight with you. Rossi did deliver, yes, but the customer has sent it back. Rossi's spin: we will add controls. Only Rossi has NOT even admitted that it has been returned. That would sound too much like failure. Customers complaint: *did not work over extended periods*, so of no value for intended use, despite the fact that it does work for short periods. Thus we sent it back to Bologna. -Original Message- From: Aussie Guy E-Cat Rossi has delivered a 1 MW E-Cat, has said they are building the other 13 x 1 MW E-Cats and he has ample cash. What he said here was they are not yet finished with the optimization of the NI system. Why read something else into his statement? AG
Re: [Vo]:1MW delay
Jones, thank you very much for this long and interesting post! Although I don't really understand the Payola reference (and Google didn't help me here), I still think I know who you are referring to (I think, this customer that you are referring to, has been mentioned all along after the test in October because of the Colonel who was making the measurements). I don't want to be rude or anything, so if you don't want to or cant answer any more questions, I am absolutely fine with it. Of course, however, if you can (and want to) I would be very happy to ask you some further questions: Are there more problems with the BBB besides the quiescence? What about the sum of energy being generated? Does it produce 1MW? Is it a constant 1MW or is it varying? If it is varying, how much? If the BBB goes quite, is it easy to restart? Or does it need to cool down first? Or is there some other way of reseting it? Do you mean by come out soon that the buyer will go public with it? Thank you again! Wolf Wolf, The following is strong on opinion and weak on fact, for the obvious reason. Whenever you see the word apparently below, the factuality of the report cannot be verified. Several insiders know about this, and I am not an insider. You may remember that Defkalion backed out of the original deal with Rossi. However, the contract milestone called for a 48 hour run and apparently Rossi could not even provide 12 hours continuous. Ergo, they feel completely justified to blame AR for the split-up. IOW, Rossi reneged on the original contract and not DGT. That part is what DGT publicly stated, but regardless - the problem of 'quiescence' could not be overcome then, and it highlights the ongoing situation which is relevant to the future of BBB, the big blue box. Apparently, this problem of self-extinguishing operation (aka 'quiescence') has not been solved. I have some technical information to share on that subject, for a later post. Rossi claims that this has been solved (in principle with better controls) but... is that more Rossi-speak? Apparently the customer is willing to buy several more if the problem of quiescence can be solved, but has written-off the cost of this one, if it cannot be fixed. There will be no refund, but there is no animosity. The BBB apparently had to be sent back to Bologna, instead of fixed in situ since as you know, Rossi installed some kind of anti-tamper device to keep it from being analyzed. On the positive side, the device does produce massive excess heat for periods up to a day, maybe more. There is a bona fide and massive thermal anomaly, but this unit should not have gone out the door until it was further along in development. Personally, I think it could take several years to engineer a commercial product, and that DGT could easily get there ahead of Rossi, since they are better staffed and funded (apparently due to saving the ~100,000,000 Euros that they were able to legally keep when AR could not perform up to the terms of the contract). As for the identity of the customer, it is kind of a don't ask, don't tell since taxpayer money is apparently involved and even AR's detractors (insiders) believe the technology is valid and do not want outside interference. Yet this will probably come out soon. Rossi has mentioned the N-word before. Another clue is that the report - which others on vortex know about, apparently comes out of Brussels. A hint: there could be some kind of Payola involved. Use the Italian spelling.g -Original Message- From: Wolf Fischer Thanks for the info! Can you share some more information? If so: - Do you know, if works for a short time means that it actually delivers more energy than has been put in? How long is short? ;) - Is the customer waiting for a new and improved version or has he canceled all the contracts?
Re: [Vo]:1MW delay
Hi AG, Jones gave a lot of hints in his answer to my questions 4:30 hours earlier. The customers name seems to start with N, is an organization in Brussel, Rossi also once mentioned the name in the context of the 28th october 1MW test while talking about the Colonel (my guess, the name has four letters and ends with O ;)). Wolf Interesting info. So you are confirming Rossi DID ship the 1 MW reactor to his customer. That it did not work over extended periods is to be expected with new technology. If this has happened it says 2 things: Rossi did ship the reactor to his customer. Excellent news The reactor did work but not as the customer expected. Also excellent news as it does work. Rossi is working to rectify any issues. Again excellent news as Rossi is working to meet the customers needs. So the customer is real, the device works but not as reliably as the customer expects and Rossi is working with NI to meet the customer's expectations. This is a real world result. This is an excellent result. This is product development in the flesh. So Mr. Beene now that you have started talking, who is the customer? AG On 1/15/2012 2:23 AM, Jones Beene wrote: Why read something else into this? LOL. You must be joking. Because Rossi spoke it, for one thing - and because it is misleading for another, just short of complete dishonesty. You should know this, AG - if you talk to Rossi as much as you claim; and if he is being straight with you. Rossi did deliver, yes, but the customer has sent it back. Rossi's spin: we will add controls. Only Rossi has NOT even admitted that it has been returned. That would sound too much like failure. Customers complaint: *did not work over extended periods*, so of no value for intended use, despite the fact that it does work for short periods. Thus we sent it back to Bologna.
Re: [Vo]:1MW delay
AG, I am just repeating what Jones Beene has posted (look at his post and what he said there). Perhaps I misunderstood him. http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l%40eskimo.com/msg61115.html His reference to payola and its italian wording could mean Giampaolo Di Paola, the Chairman of the NATO Military Committee. But yes, I also know Rossis statements... We will see, hopefully soon... Wolf Wolf, Rossi has stated the customer is a US organization engaged in military research, the first 1 MW plant was at the customers site in the US and that he and others have attended to install the plant. Later he stated, he, the customer's engineer and NI are working on the advanced control system and they have made excellent progress. AG On 1/15/2012 9:17 AM, Wolf Fischer wrote: Hi AG, Jones gave a lot of hints in his answer to my questions 4:30 hours earlier. The customers name seems to start with N, is an organization in Brussel, Rossi also once mentioned the name in the context of the 28th october 1MW test while talking about the Colonel (my guess, the name has four letters and ends with O ;)). Wolf Interesting info. So you are confirming Rossi DID ship the 1 MW reactor to his customer. That it did not work over extended periods is to be expected with new technology. If this has happened it says 2 things: Rossi did ship the reactor to his customer. Excellent news The reactor did work but not as the customer expected. Also excellent news as it does work. Rossi is working to rectify any issues. Again excellent news as Rossi is working to meet the customers needs. So the customer is real, the device works but not as reliably as the customer expects and Rossi is working with NI to meet the customer's expectations. This is a real world result. This is an excellent result. This is product development in the flesh. So Mr. Beene now that you have started talking, who is the customer? AG On 1/15/2012 2:23 AM, Jones Beene wrote: Why read something else into this? LOL. You must be joking. Because Rossi spoke it, for one thing - and because it is misleading for another, just short of complete dishonesty. You should know this, AG - if you talk to Rossi as much as you claim; and if he is being straight with you. Rossi did deliver, yes, but the customer has sent it back. Rossi's spin: we will add controls. Only Rossi has NOT even admitted that it has been returned. That would sound too much like failure. Customers complaint: *did not work over extended periods*, so of no value for intended use, despite the fact that it does work for short periods. Thus we sent it back to Bologna.
[Vo]:Rossi on the Smart Scarecrow Show
Hi there, Rossi was just on the Smart Scarecrow Show. There were some new information / clarification (although I can't remember them all; the information below should be correct however I sometimes had problems understanding Rossi because of a pretty low audio quality and me not being a native English speaker): 1. He sold another 1MW reactor (in addition to the 13 which have already been sold), but many potential customers are in line... 2. Production should start in autumn, distribution in winter (if everything works out as planned) 3. He wants to sell one million Ecats next year (this is what they are aiming for in a complete year regarding production) 4. Price of the Home Ecat is down to 500$ 5. Ecat is thought for heating the home, not for heating the water for showering etc. 6. Refueling the Ecat is done by replacing a cartridge. This cartridge will cost around 10$ and will then be sent back to a factory where it will be recycled. 7. The testing of the Ecat through the University of Bologna is currently not at the top of his priority list (there is currently the engineering of the production facilities) but he said something about starting with this next month 8. I wanted to know something about the stability of the reactor (I was referring to the uptime of the reactor, however Sterling shortened the question). According to Rossi, especially the temperature output was stabilized with the help of NI (at least this is what I understood). 9. On patenting - his lawyers are working on that. 10. Regarding the radio frequency generator: He didn't want to reveal anything. He compared this to Martial Arts and said something about that it is important for overcoming the coulomb barrier. 11. If I understood him correctly (If!), while explaining the working mechanism of the reactor core, he said that in the reaction gamma rays will be emitted, then hit a lead shielding which then will heat up and therefore heat the water. 12. The first question regarding the first customer was (of course) not answered because of an NDA This is what I did just remember from 1:30h... There will surely be a transcript available soon. Wolf
Re: [Vo]:I wish Krivit would come out of the closet pertaining to the WL theory
Excellent post! I wondered about Krivits behavior too. Some days ago I wanted to post a comment on one of his articles, where he started to repeat himself. I just wanted to show what I think of Rossi and his behavior (just to give a little IMHO reasonable counter weight to his article) and how all of this seems to work together. But my post was censored. However I got an email from Krivit saying that he wants me to retain my speculation because he doesn't want to add to the wild speculation. And then all those boring and repetitive recent articles... I mean, what does the closing of the school, where Rossi got his degree, have to do with LENR or Ecat? Yeah, of course I can see the connection, but it is not really relevant (at least to me) and sounds more like another way of simply wanting to bash Rossi (for whatever reason). And then currently those articles about again the failure of Rossis reactor on June 30th... Perhaps Krivit doesn't seem to have anything more what he can put up and just sees his ship sinking right now..? Wolf I just received another email alert from New Energy Times. The content of the email states: * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *Where Does the Energy Come From in LENR?* I received a question from a /New Energy Times/ reader a few days ago: What exactly is causing the energy to be produced in the LENR reaction according to the Widom-Larsen theory? Is it energy produced due to the transmutation of elements, or something else entirely? Click here to go to the article http://click.icptrack.com/icp/relay.php?r=7604970msgid=576748act=8PX2c=229442destination=http%3A%2F%2Fblog.newenergytimes.com%2F2012%2F01%2F12%2Fwhere-does-the-energy-come-from-in-lenr%2F * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * I wish Mr. Krivit would just come out of the closet and state for the record what kind of a relationship he has established with the Widom-Larsen camp is. There is absolutely nothing wrong with advocating for a particular group, cause, or theory. For example, the Pure Energy Systems web site makes it very clear that they have established a working business relationship with Andrea Rossi. PESN states: *Full Disclosure:* PES Network has a business relationship with Andrea Rossi. Readers can then take such disclosures into account when they read information posted at such web sites. Often, the information posted, slanted it may be, can still be high quality. There is also the implication that such web sites may also have firsthand knowledge pertaining to their favorite subject that may not necessarily be available to the rest of the population or news sources. IOW, there can be advantages to making it clear to readers that such web sites have established themselves as an advocate outlet. However, Krivit seems to be attempting to give readers the impression that NET is an impartial news service. To that end I suspect there are few within the Vort Collective that perceive NET as behaving as if it's an impartial news service, particularly when it comes to cold fusion news. Krivit has relentlessly promoted the Widom-Laren theory above all other theories. The fact that Krivit supports the Widom-Larsen theory doesn't bother me. Why shouldn't the Widom-Larsen camp have a few supporters of their own, advertising the theory's alleged advantages. What bothers me is that apparently in order to enhance the perceived credibility of the Widom-Larsen theory Krivit has felt the need to attack the credentials of prominent CF researchers who are not in the Widom-Larsen camp. Krivit has also attacked Andrea Rossi, claiming the Italian inventor is a fraud. Some of the evidence Krivit recently presented in regards to Rossi was incredibly shoddy, such as when Krivit quoted verbatim a conversation he had with Rossi last year when he personally visited him. Krivit quoted Rossi's halting English speech patterns verbatim in an attempt to insinuate to gullible readers that the Italian lacks clarity in his thinking processes. That was an incredibly stupid thing for Krivit to have posted out on NET. It really drove home to me what lengths Krivit was willing to go to in order to find fault in those he perceives as the opposition, or perhaps even as the enemy. Meanwhile, Krivit has claimed that he would stop promoting the widom-larsen theory if he learned of new information that would suggest there is a better theory out there. However, based on the fact that Krivit has refused to listen to advice from credible experts who have serious reservations about the Widom-Larsen theory, and the fact that Krivit was willing to perform incredibly cheap posting theatrics to make others, like Rossi, look feeble minded, I don't believe Krivit's sincerity one bit. Not one bit at all. I just wish Krivit would simply come out of the closet state for the record what is
Re: [Vo]:video from NASA about lenr (cold fusion)
I am a little bit surprised to see such comments... The technologygateway is not intended for scientists or for details on science which is going on at NASA. It is for showing the / a broader public what NASA is doing. It's a kind of advertisement place for NASA to a broader public! This is, why there are no details in the video (for this, see also the quote of Zawodny at the end of Krivits recent article http://blog.newenergytimes.com/2012/01/13/lenr-gold-rush-begins-at-nasa/). And this is also why there are subtitles: Deaf people really have problems in understanding what is being said in the video. The reason, why this is a breakthrough, is not because of technical details or new inventions, but because NASA is so sure of LENR that they are willing to publicly stand behind LENR and defend it (and I don't mean public in the sense of let some scientists and the community know this might be real but let average Joe know this is real!)! There is no other organization of this weight and with this reputation which is doing that at the moment! (and there aren't many organizations in the world with this reputation at all, perhaps MIT / Stanford and some others, although wasn't it MIT which discredited the FPE back in 89?). Wolf You can reach the video from here: http://technologygateway.nasa.gov/and it's headlined like this Feature Stories: NASA's Method for a Clean Nuclear Energy For Your Power Operated Technology This is, well... sort of weird. I wonder if anyone in NASA's PR department or higher management has seen it. First of all, the production values are lousy. It looks as if it was shot with a cheap web cam. It features Zawodny who is mostly out of focus during his strange, hesitant talk which is hard enough to understand, it's subtitled!They talk about an un-named fuel of some sort which is unchanged in mass by the reaction which is basically unexplained. They don't say where the excess heat is from. They keep referring to this fuel as it. And they only say somehow carbon, nickel and hydrogen are involved. The rest is the usual obvious and irrelevant comments about how inexpensive thermal energy can be used. Everybody already knows that. As Angus wrote on the Moletrap forum: Oh goodie. Another we're looking at it, and if we can get it to work it could heat your house and do other wonderful things video. There's nothing new about the idea of using surface plasmons to bung neutrons into atomic nuclei. NASA has been looking at it since 2005 http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2006cmns...12..156C. So far nobody's house is getting heated. I might add nobody has made a cup of tea with it either. Craig Brown, still, amazingly enough, a Steorn believer, is promoting this clip as a breakthrough. It's nothing of the kind. There is no real theory presented, there is no experiment, and there are no results. I am disappointed that NASA would air such a contentless clip. I have no idea what they're thinking.
Re: [Vo]:Rossi : customer can refill
Also if it is just an extra dose of powder: How do you contain the vacuum..? What kind of cheap and save mechanism could it be to contain the vacuum? Or to create a new one after refueling? Or will the reactor core completely be replaced and recycled in a factory? Wolf At a minimum a replaceable cartridge needs to have an additional supply of hydrogen - and that means a sealable connection (not something you would necessarily trust a muppet consumer with - a lot of people don't even know how to tighten a nut. Also if we are to believe recent speculation about RF excitation that that would need to be delivered to the inside of the cartridge somehow. My speculation is that it is just the addition of an extra dose of powder through a sealable port into an oversized reaction chamber - the old powder may be somewhat inert but the new powder's activity isn't hampered by the presence of the old. On 12 January 2012 23:56, Alan J Fletcher a...@well.com mailto:a...@well.com wrote: At 03:46 PM 1/12/2012, Aussie Guy E-Cat wrote: Yes it is a BIG change. The reactor design must be VERY different. It is a good development. Go Rossi Go. It must be an integrated Nickel+Hydrogen cartridge.
Re: [Vo]:Request volunteer assistance revamping LENR-CANR.org website
Hi Jed, I think, what you are looking for, is a Content Management System (CMS), e.g. Joomla http://www.joomla.org/, which is free and seems to have a nice and big community. Once you have a layout (there are also websites which provide free standard and minimalistic layouts), you can easily add new components and edit everything directly from within your webpage. So you wouldn't need to install a separated program on your computer but you can do everything from within any web browser. There is, e.g., the following component http://extensions.joomla.org/extensions/living/education-a-culture/books-a-libraries/14935?qh=YTo0OntpOjA7czo3OiJsaWJyYXJ5IjtpOjE7czo5OiJsaWJyYXJpZXMiO2k6MjtzOjk6ImxpYnJhcnknLiI7aTozO3M6OToibGlicmFyeSdzIjt9 which seems to allow you to manage your own private or public library, which could be especially useful in your case..? What your provider must offer in this case is PHP and MySQL support. Then the rest shouldn't be too difficult, I think / hope (however I am no expert on CMSs). Wolf Ed Storms, Akira Shirakawa and others have suggested I update the look and feel of the LENR-CANR.org website. In particular, the library indexes are badly out of data and useless. I was thinking of doing this a few years ago but a large organization said they might take over the maintenance of the site, so I put it off. I have not heard from them lately so I guess that's on hold. Anyway, I've been thinking about doing this. The actual work is trivial because the website is simple. I could do it in a week. It would save me time and prevent errors if someone who knows about modern rituals would assist. I could pay a consultant but it am a cheapskate and this is a volunteer effort anyway so I don't feel like paying. Please contact me by direct e-mail if you're interested in assisting. This is off topic here, but let me briefly what I have in mind. LOOK FEEL Converting the screens to a modern look should take a week. It could use some reorganization along the way. I welcome any suggestions. The thing about the look and feel is, I do not like the way modern websites look so I have not bothered to do it. I have no strong opinion about this, but changing it seems pointless. If someone who likes modern web design would be willing to lend a hand and get me started I would be happy to finish up. I do not want to burden it with pop-ups or lots of graphic images. Akira suggested I look at Wordpress instead of HTML editors. I see it has some advantages but it seems more suited to blog-style web pages than a library. I use Namo Webeditor 9. That is a creaky, unfriendly old program. LENR-CANR.org pages is so rudimentary I often just edit the HTML directly by hand. INDEXES In the present version of LENR-CANR.org the indexes are crude, static HTML code. The obvious way to do this is with SQL. When we started, the ISP did not even offer an online utility SQL. Later we moved to ISPs that offer this kind of thing but it cost a lot of money. So I never bothered to convert. Now that MySQL and PostgreSQL are free, I might as well use SQL instead of my home-grown indexes. I downloaded the manual. Relational databases have no changed much since the 1980s. This is simple database with only 3000 items so it is a piece of cake. I tested the PostgreSQL at our ISP, which is Jumpline.com. There is nothing to it. I can reformat the database into their import format and make the one-to-many links and whatnot. The problem is, Namo Webeditor 9 does not want to talk to Jumpline's SQL utilities. Maybe I just can't figure out the right parameters. Companies such as Jumpline and Namo offer no help for things like that. I have been poking around with Wavemaker.com and some other SQL utilities. I do not like the idea of using two different programs to maintain the website. Perhaps someone can recommend an integrated solution? One program that does it all and works with the latest version of PostgreSQL? I don't mind paying for a program. I am not that much of a cheapskate! I do not want any Microsoft web programs such as Frontpage. I am allergic to Microsoft. Frontpage was a nightmare to work with. It generated outrageously bloated HTML with lots of nonfunctional stuff. I mean stuff like HTML that does not display! You wonder how they managed to do that. HTML is an idiotic standard in many ways. It has lots of ad hoc stuff lying around. But it is simple and relatively foolproof. How do you manage to crank out HTML code that flies off the screen or makes the background the same as the foreground?!? It takes a kind of genius. I have to convert Word files to HTML sometimes, for the abstracts in the database. I ended up writing a Pascal program to clean out the garbage. I see that Frontpage has been replaced with Microsoft Expression. Probably just as bad. As I said, contact me directly if you would like to assist. For free. Bearing in mind that virtue is
Re: [Vo]:video from NASA about lenr (cold fusion)
It is even directly featured on the Technologygateway main site: http://technologygateway.nasa.gov/ On the right, headlined with the words: *NASA's Method for a Clean Nuclear Energy For Your Power Operated Technology http://technologygateway.nasa.gov/media/CC/lenr/lenr.html* Wolf David, I wonder how did you find that video?! That NASA site is really a chaotic. There ugly presentation reflects bad implementation: trying to search for LENR related keywords and nothing comes out. mic 2012/1/12 Akira Shirakawashirakawa.ak...@gmail.com: On 2012-01-12 08:16, David ledin wrote: video from NASA about lenr (cold fusion) http://technologygateway.nasa.gov/media/CC/lenr/lenr.html Wow!, Just... wow! Cheers, S.A.
Re: [Vo]:video from NASA about lenr (cold fusion)
I didn't follow the discussions on the potential catalyst here (as I am no physicist), but could carbon be the missing ingredient (as C is being mentioned in the video)? Have there ever been publications on a H-Ni-C LENR experiment? Or is this something that NASA is working on and hasn't published any details yet? video from NASA about lenr (cold fusion) http://technologygateway.nasa.gov/media/CC/lenr/lenr.html
[Vo]:Ecat production will be robotized...
Hi all, Rossi made the following statement on his journal: /Andrea Rossi January 10th, 2012 at 4:05 PM/ /Dear Keith W: We are making the certification . Attention: I did not say that we will begin to deliver in August, I said we can be ready to make order confirmations in Autumn; we are right now making the engineerization of the factory ( *the production will be completely robotized to squeeze down the price as much as possible*) and, even if we will be very good, the first deliveries will start perhaps within the year, but I cannot promise it; I can say that the price will be lower than expected and that it will be a revolution. We are making a tremendous work with top level Partners. Warm Regards, A.R. / I wonder how difficult it is to set up a complete and fully robotized production facility for such a product. Of course the Ecat should be pretty simple, but does someone here have experience on how likely it is that this could happen until summer / autumn of this year? Perhaps they are reusing the production facilities from other partners? Wolf
Re: [Vo]:Ecat production will be robotized...
Dear Peter, could you elaborate? How do you come to this conclusion, especially about the robotization (does this word exist? ;))? However I would agree on some of your points like kill the competition and this strange list with 10.000 domestic E-cats. Wolf Dear Wolf, This, the Customers, the list of 10,000 domestic E-cats, dumping to kill the competition, the Catalyst, and many other things are marketing tricks and fairy tales for adults (Kindermarchen fur Erwachsene) Interesting but untrue in their greatest part, mixtures of fiction and reality, of desires and facts. Not as good as the 35th of May. Peter On Wed, Jan 11, 2012 at 3:57 PM, Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc...@gmx.de wrote: Hi all, Rossi made the following statement on his journal: /Andrea Rossi January 10th, 2012 at 4:05 PM/ /Dear Keith W: We are making the certification . Attention: I did not say that we will begin to deliver in August, I said we can be ready to make order confirmations in Autumn; we are right now making the engineerization of the factory ( *the production will be completely robotized to squeeze down the price as much as possible*) and, even if we will be very good, the first deliveries will start perhaps within the year, but I cannot promise it; I can say that the price will be lower than expected and that it will be a revolution. We are making a tremendous work with top level Partners. Warm Regards, A.R. / I wonder how difficult it is to set up a complete and fully robotized production facility for such a product. Of course the Ecat should be pretty simple, but does someone here have experience on how likely it is that this could happen until summer / autumn of this year? Perhaps they are reusing the production facilities from other partners? Wolf -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com
Re: [Vo]:Ecat production will be robotized...
Dear Peter, I didn't know your blog, thanks for the link. I have read some of your posts until the beginning of october and will continue reading, some nice thoughts there. @others: Regarding my initial questions: Can someone with more experience in production automatization comment on Rossis statement? Is it technically possible? Wolf Dear Wolf, I have elaborated, and many times, and step by step in my papers labelled NEW ENERGY published via my blog http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com following Rossi's series of experiments and statements. Be so kind to tell me where or why do you not agree with what I have stated and I am ready to discuss - with pleasure. Robotization is good, the great drawback is that you need robots. Peter On Wed, Jan 11, 2012 at 4:22 PM, Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc...@gmx.de wrote: Dear Peter, could you elaborate? How do you come to this conclusion, especially about the robotization (does this word exist? ;))? However I would agree on some of your points like kill the competition and this strange list with 10.000 domestic E-cats. Wolf Dear Wolf, This, the Customers, the list of 10,000 domestic E-cats, dumping to kill the competition, the Catalyst, and many other things are marketing tricks and fairy tales for adults (Kindermarchen fur Erwachsene) Interesting but untrue in their greatest part, mixtures of fiction and reality, of desires and facts. Not as good as the 35th of May. Peter On Wed, Jan 11, 2012 at 3:57 PM, Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc...@gmx.de wrote: Hi all, Rossi made the following statement on his journal: /Andrea Rossi January 10th, 2012 at 4:05 PM/ /Dear Keith W: We are making the certification . Attention: I did not say that we will begin to deliver in August, I said we can be ready to make order confirmations in Autumn; we are right now making the engineerization of the factory ( *the production will be completely robotized to squeeze down the price as much as possible*) and, even if we will be very good, the first deliveries will start perhaps within the year, but I cannot promise it; I can say that the price will be lower than expected and that it will be a revolution. We are making a tremendous work with top level Partners. Warm Regards, A.R. / I wonder how difficult it is to set up a complete and fully robotized production facility for such a product. Of course the Ecat should be pretty simple, but does someone here have experience on how likely it is that this could happen until summer / autumn of this year? Perhaps they are reusing the production facilities from other partners? Wolf -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com
