Re: DQuick news

2013-12-29 Thread Xavier Bigand
Le 29/12/2013 15:15, Suliman a écrit : On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 01:15:50 UTC, Xavier Bigand wrote: Latest news of DQuick for this year. The good news is, the project still alive and Bruno added some interesting stuff to the DMLengine : - Adding support of arrays - Adding support of

Re: DQuick news

2013-12-29 Thread Xavier Bigand
Le 29/12/2013 02:15, Xavier Bigand a écrit : Latest news of DQuick for this year. The good news is, the project still alive and Bruno added some interesting stuff to the DMLengine : - Adding support of arrays - Adding support of delegates - Improve error reporting from Lua Our

DDOX search support and new 2.064.2 Phobos docs

2013-12-29 Thread Sönke Ludwig
DDOX [1] has just gained support for a JavaScript based live search function. I've uploaded new DMD 2.064.2 Phobos/Druntime docs [2] with this (search box in the upper-left corner). The vibe.d docs [3] are now also searchable and documentation for old releases can now also be viewed in addition

Re: DDOX search support and new 2.064.2 Phobos docs

2013-12-29 Thread Leandro Lucarella
Sönke Ludwig, el 29 de December a las 19:07 me escribiste: DDOX [1] has just gained support for a JavaScript based live search function. I've uploaded new DMD 2.064.2 Phobos/Druntime docs [2] with this (search box in the upper-left corner). The vibe.d docs [3] are now also searchable and

Re: DDOX search support and new 2.064.2 Phobos docs

2013-12-29 Thread extrawurst
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 21:35:53 UTC, Sönke Ludwig wrote: Am 29.12.2013 21:10, schrieb Leandro Lucarella: Sönke Ludwig, el 29 de December a las 19:07 me escribiste: DDOX [1] has just gained support for a JavaScript based live search function. I've uploaded new DMD 2.064.2

Re: DDOX search support and new 2.064.2 Phobos docs

2013-12-29 Thread Sönke Ludwig
Am 29.12.2013 21:10, schrieb Leandro Lucarella: Sönke Ludwig, el 29 de December a las 19:07 me escribiste: DDOX [1] has just gained support for a JavaScript based live search function. I've uploaded new DMD 2.064.2 Phobos/Druntime docs [2] with this (search box in the upper-left corner). The

Re: DDOX search support and new 2.064.2 Phobos docs

2013-12-29 Thread Walter Bright
On 12/29/2013 1:39 PM, extrawurst wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 21:35:53 UTC, Sönke Ludwig wrote: Am 29.12.2013 21:10, schrieb Leandro Lucarella: Sönke Ludwig, el 29 de December a las 19:07 me escribiste: DDOX [1] has just gained support for a JavaScript based live search function.

Re: DDOX search support and new 2.064.2 Phobos docs

2013-12-29 Thread Andrej Mitrovic
On 12/29/13, Sönke Ludwig slud...@outerproduct.org wrote: DDOX [1] has just gained support for a JavaScript based live search function. [2]: http://vibed.org/temp/dlang.org/library/index.html Nice! I have a few notes/suggestions: - The result bubble should likely hide when you select another

Re: DDOX search support and new 2.064.2 Phobos docs

2013-12-29 Thread Sönke Ludwig
Am 29.12.2013 22:46, schrieb Dicebot: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 18:08:15 UTC, Sönke Ludwig wrote: DDOX [1] has just gained support for a JavaScript based live search function. I've uploaded new DMD 2.064.2 Phobos/Druntime docs [2] with this (search box in the upper-left corner). The

Re: DDOX search support and new 2.064.2 Phobos docs

2013-12-29 Thread Sönke Ludwig
Am 29.12.2013 22:53, schrieb Andrej Mitrovic: On 12/29/13, Sönke Ludwig slud...@outerproduct.org wrote: DDOX [1] has just gained support for a JavaScript based live search function. [2]: http://vibed.org/temp/dlang.org/library/index.html Nice! I have a few notes/suggestions: - The result

Re: What is the rationale behind std.file.setAttributes ?

2013-12-29 Thread Marco Leise
Am Sat, 28 Dec 2013 15:23:55 +0100 schrieb Jacob Carlborg d...@me.com: On 2013-12-28 03:46, Marco Leise wrote: Wait a second, what about *setting* attributes? Some difficult ones are: o toggling read-only (for whom? user, group, others?) o executable flag o hidden flag On

Re: What is the rationale behind std.file.setAttributes ?

2013-12-29 Thread Marco Leise
Am Sun, 29 Dec 2013 13:44:02 +0100 schrieb Jacob Carlborg d...@me.com: On 2013-12-29 11:36, Marco Leise wrote: Oh right, they have a hidden attribute as well. I guess if Phobos should expose the 'hidden' state of a file it should write to this attribute, but read both. E.g. for a file

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 12/29/13 3:09 AM, Dicebot wrote: 1) Timon has raised the point that exact match between in naming between built-in and library type will be confusing as they will actually differ in behavior (http://forum.dlang.org/post/l99mke$q1o$1...@digitalmars.com). Andrei has proposed

Re: What is the rationale behind std.file.setAttributes ?

2013-12-29 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 12/29/13 4:20 AM, Ola Fosheim Grøstad ola.fosheim.grostad+dl...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 11:01:05 UTC, Marco Leise wrote: Basic OS level file-system I/O support is useful on its own, especially in a systems programming language. You don't need to pull in a whole bunch

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread John Colvin
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:01:03 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: On 12/29/13 3:09 AM, Dicebot wrote: 1) Timon has raised the point that exact match between in naming between built-in and library type will be confusing as they will actually differ in behavior

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 12/29/13 5:15 AM, Ola Fosheim Grøstad ola.fosheim.grostad+dl...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 06:00:31 UTC, Adam Wilson wrote: I want to make a point here that many people come to do looking for something that is as performant as C++ with the ease of C# or Java, and for the

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 12/29/13 6:35 AM, Ola Fosheim Grøstad ola.fosheim.grostad+dl...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 13:46:07 UTC, Dicebot wrote: This is not true. Assuming skilled use and same compiler backend those are equally performant. D lacks some low-level control C has (which is important

Re: std.range.iota enhancement: supporting more types (AKA issue 10762)

2013-12-29 Thread Iain Buclaw
On 27 Dec 2013 20:33, H. S. Teoh hst...@quickfur.ath.cx wrote: On Wed, Dec 25, 2013 at 02:30:45PM +, Francesco Cattoglio wrote: On Wednesday, 25 December 2013 at 10:58:53 UTC, bearophile wrote: [...] (A less important enhancement is issue 11252). On the other hand, I have honestly no

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Dicebot
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 14:35:44 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote: That low-level control also matters for performance, when you have hard deadlines. E.g. when the GC kicks in, it not only hogs all the threads that participate in GC, it also trash the caches unless you have a GC

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Jakob Ovrum
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 11:10:00 UTC, Dicebot wrote: Despite my initial desire to standardize API between library types it seems that breakage will be much more damaging than I have initially expected. Jakob example (http://forum.dlang.org/post/vkeqyorptcobufzmm...@forum.dlang.org)

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Dicebot
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:01:03 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: I think a duo `TemplateArgumentList` (auto-expansion) and `TemplateArgumentPack` (no auto-expansion) in the same module is the ticket. It also makes for a wonderful opportunity to explain the distinction in the

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Jakob Ovrum
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:01:03 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: I think a duo `TemplateArgumentList` (auto-expansion) and `TemplateArgumentPack` (no auto-expansion) in the same module is the ticket. It also makes for a wonderful opportunity to explain the distinction in the

Re: What is the rationale behind std.file.setAttributes ?

2013-12-29 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:05:31 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: Well one question is what other successful designs could we use as precedent? I don't know of any successful unified APIs for regular/remote filesystems that also allow full local file functionality. The closest

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Dicebot
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:35:50 UTC, Jakob Ovrum wrote: ... Sorry, can you make a short summary about your position? You are against adding packed list to library or just against removing expanding one (from the library)?

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Jakob Ovrum
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:45:59 UTC, Dicebot wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:35:50 UTC, Jakob Ovrum wrote: ... Sorry, can you make a short summary about your position? You are against adding packed list to library or just against removing expanding one (from the library)?

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 12/29/13 7:42 AM, Jakob Ovrum wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:01:03 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: I think a duo `TemplateArgumentList` (auto-expansion) and `TemplateArgumentPack` (no auto-expansion) in the same module is the ticket. It also makes for a wonderful opportunity to

Re: What is the rationale behind std.file.setAttributes ?

2013-12-29 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 12/29/13 7:43 AM, Ola Fosheim Grøstad ola.fosheim.grostad+dl...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:05:31 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: Well one question is what other successful designs could we use as precedent? I don't know of any successful unified APIs for

Re: groupBy predicates: unary, binary, or both?

2013-12-29 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 12/29/13 2:20 AM, monarch_dodra wrote: There is precedence for this in phobos with schwatzSort: It use a unaryFun, followed by a binaryFun. I've found this works quite well: More often than not, a unary fun is more than enough (the default a b/a == b is fine). And in the cases where you

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Jakob Ovrum
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 16:01:41 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: I also think it should be shorter, because a) it's a fundamental, and thus very commonly used template, and b) code that manipulates lists are functional in nature which results in long lines that are also hard to split up

Re: groupBy predicates: unary, binary, or both?

2013-12-29 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 12/29/13 2:27 AM, bearophile wrote: But another common need is to group by equivalent classes using an associative array. Both C# and Clojure have this functionality (on LINQ and in the functions toolkit). This means that a hashGroup builds an associative array inside and returns it. See

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 12/29/13 8:14 AM, Jakob Ovrum wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 16:01:41 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: I also think it should be shorter, because a) it's a fundamental, and thus very commonly used template, and b) code that manipulates lists are functional in nature which results in

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Jakob Ovrum
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 16:19:57 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: It's been discussed before - these are advanced notions that won't be used frequently and naively. I guess I'm biased by writing a lot of library code, where it's quite frequently used. I can imagine application code

Re: Bypassing the postblit?

2013-12-29 Thread Ritu
No. In D, struct are freely copied or moved depending on whether the source is an lvalue or an rvalue. What is possible is to define the post-blit function to work on the already-blitted destination object. For example, if you don't want the source and the destination share a member slice,

Re: What is the rationale behind std.file.setAttributes ?

2013-12-29 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 16:06:32 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: I think we (and others) have done a fine job so far at abstracting away e.g. very different ways of figuring whether an entry is a directory on Windows vs. Posix. Now we're to throw all that away and go back to silex

Re: bugtracker and auto-tester down

2013-12-29 Thread John Colvin
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 12:57:43 UTC, Ivan Kazmenko wrote: I can't access http://d.puremagic.com/issues/ for at least an hour now. On a related note, http://d.puremagic.com/test-results/ seems to be down, too. works fine for me.

Re: readln() returns new line charater

2013-12-29 Thread Jeroen Bollen
On Saturday, 28 December 2013 at 17:42:26 UTC, Jakob Ovrum wrote: On Saturday, 28 December 2013 at 17:23:30 UTC, Jeroen Bollen wrote: Usually if you're working with a console though the input stream won't exhaust and thus the blocking 'readln' would be a better option, no? The blocking

Cross referencing in Ddoc

2013-12-29 Thread Jacob Carlborg
If nothing has happened recently the current situation of cross referencing in Ddoc sucks. What's currently being used in the Phobos documentation is the XREF, CXREF and ECXREF ddoc macros. These macros take two arguments, append std, core or etc and form a link of the arguments. The problem

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:22:29 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: Wait, what? Go excused itself out of the competition, and you'd Agree. I consider Go to be a web-service language atm. need to bring some evidence that D is not as fast/tight as C++. I have accumulated quite a bit of

Re: readln() returns new line charater

2013-12-29 Thread Jakob Ovrum
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 17:25:39 UTC, Jeroen Bollen wrote: Wouldn't byline return an empty string if the inputstream is exhausted but not closed? No, both `readln` and `byLine` will block until either EOL or EOF. They differ in their handling of EOF - `readln` returns an empty string,

Re: Bypassing the postblit?

2013-12-29 Thread Benjamin Thaut
Am 29.12.2013 17:22, schrieb Ritu: No. In D, struct are freely copied or moved depending on whether the source is an lvalue or an rvalue. What is possible is to define the post-blit function to work on the already-blitted destination object. For example, if you don't want the source and the

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread jerro
On Sun, 29 Dec 2013 17:54:51 +, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote: C is so barebones that you can do your own coroutines without language support if you wish. You can do that in D too. core.thread.Fiber is implemented in D (with a bit of inline assembly), without any special language support.

Re: bugtracker and auto-tester down

2013-12-29 Thread Ivan Kazmenko
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 17:12:14 UTC, John Colvin wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 12:57:43 UTC, Ivan Kazmenko wrote: I can't access http://d.puremagic.com/issues/ for at least an hour now. On a related note, http://d.puremagic.com/test-results/ seems to be down, too. works fine

Re: Cross referencing in Ddoc

2013-12-29 Thread Sönke Ludwig
Am 29.12.2013 18:38, schrieb Jacob Carlborg: A. Automatic cross reference This is done for the DDOX based docs that were supposed to end up on the home page at some point: http://forum.dlang.org/thread/l9poef$210u$1...@digitalmars.com http://vibed.org/temp/dlang.org/library/index.html * It

Re: Bypassing the postblit?

2013-12-29 Thread Maxim Fomin
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 16:22:04 UTC, Ritu wrote: I have a struct that wraps a class object and lazily initializes it. Now in case the struct instance is passed as an argument to a function and it has not been initialized yet, the default copy constructor and the postblit do not offer a

Re: readln() returns new line charater

2013-12-29 Thread Dmitry Olshansky
28-Dec-2013 21:13, Vladimir Panteleev пишет: On Saturday, 28 December 2013 at 17:07:58 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: On 12/28/13 8:50 AM, Jeroen Bollen wrote: On Saturday, 28 December 2013 at 16:49:15 UTC, Jeroen Bollen wrote: Why is when you do readln() the newline character (\n) gets read

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread CJS
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:26:35 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: On 12/29/13 6:35 AM, Ola Fosheim Grøstad ola.fosheim.grostad+dl...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 13:46:07 UTC, Dicebot wrote: This is not true. Assuming skilled use and same compiler backend those are

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Dmitry Olshansky
29-Dec-2013 20:01, Andrei Alexandrescu пишет: On 12/29/13 7:42 AM, Jakob Ovrum wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:01:03 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: I also think it should be shorter, because a) it's a fundamental, and thus very commonly used template, and b) code that manipulates

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 18:29:52 UTC, jerro wrote: You can do that in D too. core.thread.Fiber is implemented in D (with a bit of inline assembly), without any special language support. Yes, coroutines was a bad example, you probably can do that in many stack-based languages. My point

Re: Bypassing the postblit?

2013-12-29 Thread monarch_dodra
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 18:40:07 UTC, Maxim Fomin wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 16:22:04 UTC, Ritu wrote: I have a struct that wraps a class object and lazily initializes it. Now in case the struct instance is passed as an argument to a function and it has not been initialized

Re: Bypassing the postblit?

2013-12-29 Thread monarch_dodra
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 18:27:16 UTC, Benjamin Thaut wrote: No unfortunately not. You could solve the issue by adding another level of indirection. So always allocate the additional indirection, then its save to copy it, and then you can lazy instaniate the actual instance when needed

Re: readln() returns new line charater

2013-12-29 Thread Vladimir Panteleev
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 18:45:36 UTC, Dmitry Olshansky wrote: I've come to conclusion that the only sane line ending behavior is to do what Unicode standard says, and detect the following pattern as line separator: \r\n | \r | \f | \v | \n | \u0085 | \u2028 | \u2029 This includes

Re: readln() returns new line charater

2013-12-29 Thread Dmitry Olshansky
29-Dec-2013 23:28, Vladimir Panteleev пишет: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 18:45:36 UTC, Dmitry Olshansky wrote: I've come to conclusion that the only sane line ending behavior is to do what Unicode standard says, and detect the following pattern as line separator: \r\n | \r | \f | \v | \n |

Re: Cross referencing in Ddoc

2013-12-29 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On 2013-12-29 19:35, Sönke Ludwig wrote: This is done for the DDOX based docs that were supposed to end up on the home page at some point: http://forum.dlang.org/thread/l9poef$210u$1...@digitalmars.com http://vibed.org/temp/dlang.org/library/index.html Right, forgot about that. When _are_

Re: Bypassing the postblit?

2013-12-29 Thread Benjamin Thaut
Am 29.12.2013 20:26, schrieb monarch_dodra: Even with that, you'd still have to make sure the newly inserted indirection gets initialized *prior* to the copy, so it's back to square one... For that you can easily disable the default constructor. And then make the user call a constructor of

Re: groupBy predicates: unary, binary, or both?

2013-12-29 Thread Timon Gehr
On 12/29/2013 05:17 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: On 12/29/13 2:27 AM, bearophile wrote: But another common need is to group by equivalent classes using an associative array. Both C# and Clojure have this functionality (on LINQ and in the functions toolkit). This means that a hashGroup builds

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Walter Bright
On 12/29/2013 5:46 AM, Dicebot wrote: D lacks some low-level control C has For instance? On the other hand, D has an inline assembler and C (without vendor extensions) does not. C doesn't even have (without vendor extensions) alignment control on struct fields.

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Jonathan M Davis
On Sunday, December 29, 2013 07:22:28 Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: Clearly there's work we need to do on improving particularly the standard library. But claiming that D code can't be efficient because of some stdlib artifacts is like claiming C++ code can't do efficient I/O because it must use

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Jonathan M Davis
On Sunday, December 29, 2013 12:19:33 Walter Bright wrote: On 12/29/2013 5:46 AM, Dicebot wrote: D lacks some low-level control C has For instance? On the other hand, D has an inline assembler and C (without vendor extensions) does not. C doesn't even have (without vendor extensions)

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Walter Bright
On 12/29/2013 11:15 AM, Ola Fosheim Grøstad ola.fosheim.grostad+dl...@gmail.com wrote: It is probably feasible to create a real-time friendly garbage collector that can cooperate with realtime threads, but it isn't trivial. To get good cache coherency all cores have to cooperate on what memory

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 20:36:27 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: I'll reiterate that the GC will NEVER EVER pause your program unless you are actually calling the GC to allocate memory. A loop that does not GC allocate WILL NEVER PAUSE. That's fine, except when you have real-time threads.

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Dicebot
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 20:19:35 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 12/29/2013 5:46 AM, Dicebot wrote: D lacks some low-level control C has For instance? On the other hand, D has an inline assembler and C (without vendor extensions) does not. C doesn't even have (without vendor

Re: Go compiler moving from C to Go

2013-12-29 Thread CJS
I'm not sure if D's operator overloading is sufficiently rich to allow separate operators for matrix multiplication and element-wise multiplication in matrix. (Dealing with this is a pain in numpy, the most common Python matrix library, as well as in Eigen, a common c++ matrix library.) I

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 12/29/13 12:47 PM, Ola Fosheim Grøstad ola.fosheim.grostad+dl...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 20:36:27 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: I'll reiterate that the GC will NEVER EVER pause your program unless you are actually calling the GC to allocate memory. A loop that does not GC

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Walter Bright
On 12/29/2013 12:47 PM, Ola Fosheim Grøstad ola.fosheim.grostad+dl...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 20:36:27 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: I'll reiterate that the GC will NEVER EVER pause your program unless you are actually calling the GC to allocate memory. A loop that does not

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Dicebot
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 19:02:57 UTC, Dmitry Olshansky wrote: And having to deal with all kinds of aliases people are _expected_ to create? Why not pick something accessible in the first place? Because no good short name has ever been proposed so far. I'd strongly discourage creating

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Dicebot
Back to fighting :) On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:35:50 UTC, Jakob Ovrum wrote: Breakage that causes errors in secondary locations and cannot be automatically repaired (e.g. search replace) is the worst kind of breakage, after silent failures, that I can think of. This is why I have

Re: readln() returns new line charater

2013-12-29 Thread Jeroen Bollen
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 18:13:30 UTC, Jakob Ovrum wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 17:25:39 UTC, Jeroen Bollen wrote: Wouldn't byline return an empty string if the inputstream is exhausted but not closed? No, both `readln` and `byLine` will block until either EOL or EOF. They

[RFC] I/O and Buffer Range

2013-12-29 Thread Dmitry Olshansky
Didn't mean this to be kind of under the tree .. Planned to post long ago but I barely had the time to flesh it out. TL;DR: Solve the input side of I/O problem with new kind of ranges. I'm taking on the buffering primitive on top of the low-level unbuffered I/O sources specifically. Links

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 21:39:52 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: Since you can control if and when the GC runs fairly simply, this is not any sort of blocking issue. I agree, it is not a blocking issue. It is a cache-trashing issue. So unless the GC is cache-friendly I am concerned about

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Walter Bright
On 12/29/2013 2:10 PM, Ola Fosheim Grøstad ola.fosheim.grostad+dl...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 21:39:52 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: Since you can control if and when the GC runs fairly simply, this is not any sort of blocking issue. Your reply doesn't take into account

Re: [RFC] I/O and Buffer Range

2013-12-29 Thread Vladimir Panteleev
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 22:02:57 UTC, Dmitry Olshansky wrote: [snip] Hmm, just yesterday I was rewriting a parser to use a buffer instead of loading the whole file in memory, so this is quite timely for me. Questions: 1. What happens when the distance between the pinned and current

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Paulo Pinto
On 29.12.2013 14:15, Ola Fosheim Grøstad ola.fosheim.grostad+dl...@gmail.com wrote: D/Rust/Go/this-C#-language all claim to be system levels programming languages. I think they are not, as long as C/C++ is a better solution for embedded programming it will remain THE system level programming

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Paulo Pinto
On 29.12.2013 23:27, Walter Bright wrote: On 12/29/2013 2:10 PM, Ola Fosheim Grøstad ola.fosheim.grostad+dl...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 21:39:52 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: Since you can control if and when the GC runs fairly simply, this is not any sort of blocking issue.

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 22:27:43 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: Your reply doesn't take into account that you can control if and when the GC runs fairly simply. So you can run it at a time when it won't matter to the cache. In a computer game GC should run frequently. You don't want to

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 12/29/13 3:14 PM, Ola Fosheim Grøstad ola.fosheim.grostad+dl...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 22:27:43 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: Your reply doesn't take into account that you can control if and when the GC runs fairly simply. So you can run it at a time when it won't matter

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 23:58:34 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: Then don't use the GC. I agree! Thus: any language that makes it hard to not use the GC is not competing with C++ as a performant language. ;-]

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 12/29/13 4:08 PM, Ola Fosheim Grøstad ola.fosheim.grostad+dl...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 23:58:34 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: Then don't use the GC. I agree! Thus: any language that makes it hard to not use the GC is not competing with C++ as a performant

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Timon Gehr
On 12/29/2013 10:41 PM, Dicebot wrote: ... Use in static foreach - works with alias this Use in special expressions that operate on types, such as `is`, `typeof` and `typeid` - any code that does on expanded lists right now is completely broken and must be re-written according to existing spec.

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread develop32
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 23:14:59 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 22:27:43 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: Your reply doesn't take into account that you can control if and when the GC runs fairly simply. So you can run it at a time when it won't matter to the

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad
On Monday, 30 December 2013 at 01:09:26 UTC, develop32 wrote: I work on a somewhat large game using D, there is no GC running because there are no allocations. That's cool! As far as I know, people tend not to use system primitives like malloc/free in C++ games either as even those are too

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread David Nadlinger
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:42:34 UTC, Jakob Ovrum wrote: I think we should use this chance to rectify the capitalization of the name. As the result is not exclusively a list of types, current conventions state that the name should be lowerCamelCase. I believe you got this one the

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread develop32
Because you want to stream them to the GPU when you walk across the land in a seamless engine? Indeed, but the arrays that are used for holding the data are allocated (not in GC heap) before the main loop and always reused.

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread David Nadlinger
On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:42:34 UTC, Jakob Ovrum wrote: I think we should use this chance to rectify the capitalization of the name. As the result is not exclusively a list of types, current conventions state that the name should be lowerCamelCase. I believe you got this one the

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad
Indeed, but the arrays that are used for holding the data are allocated (not in GC heap) before the main loop and always reused. Yes, I merely tried to point out that you don't want to spend a lot of memory for dead objects waiting for the GC to kick in. You can use that space for caching

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread develop32
I assumed GC would be useful for AI/game world. It will benefit from GC because you have complex interdependencies, many different classes and want to be able to experiment. Experimentation and explicit memory deallocation is a likely source for memory leaks… However this will only work well

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad
On Monday, 30 December 2013 at 02:18:34 UTC, develop32 wrote: In the end, AI/game logic uses the same mechanic as texture streaming - reuse of the previously allocated memory. That is a possibility of course, but for a heterogenous environment you risk running out of slots. E.g. online games,

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread develop32
That is a possibility of course, but for a heterogenous environment you risk running out of slots. E.g. online games, virtual worlds, sandbox games where users build etc. No, not really, just allocate more. The memory is managed by a single closed class, I can do whatever I want with it.

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread Ola Fosheim Grøstad
On Monday, 30 December 2013 at 02:44:27 UTC, develop32 wrote: The thing is, all of that game logic data takes a really surprisingly small amount of memory. In that case you probably could use GC, so why don't you?

Re: Microsoft working on new systems language

2013-12-29 Thread develop32
On Monday, 30 December 2013 at 02:48:30 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote: On Monday, 30 December 2013 at 02:44:27 UTC, develop32 wrote: The thing is, all of that game logic data takes a really surprisingly small amount of memory. In that case you probably could use GC, so why don't you?

Re: readln() returns new line charater

2013-12-29 Thread Marco Leise
Am Sun, 29 Dec 2013 22:03:14 + schrieb Jeroen Bollen jbin...@gmail.com: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 18:13:30 UTC, Jakob Ovrum wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 17:25:39 UTC, Jeroen Bollen wrote: Wouldn't byline return an empty string if the inputstream is exhausted but not

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Dicebot
On Monday, 30 December 2013 at 00:20:43 UTC, Timon Gehr wrote: What would be an example of code that you consider to be broken? (TemplateArgumentList!(int, double) is a valid type and TemplateArgumentList!(1, 2.0) is a value of that type.) Stuff that relies that, for example, that

Re: readln() returns new line charater

2013-12-29 Thread Marco Leise
Am Sat, 28 Dec 2013 17:08:38 + schrieb Vladimir Panteleev vladi...@thecybershadow.net: On Saturday, 28 December 2013 at 17:07:23 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: On 12/28/13 8:49 AM, Jeroen Bollen wrote: Why is when you do readln() the newline character (\n) gets read too? Wouldn't

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Dicebot
On Monday, 30 December 2013 at 01:36:48 UTC, David Nadlinger wrote: On Sunday, 29 December 2013 at 15:42:34 UTC, Jakob Ovrum wrote: I think we should use this chance to rectify the capitalization of the name. As the result is not exclusively a list of types, current conventions state that the

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread David Nadlinger
On Monday, 30 December 2013 at 03:01:08 UTC, Dicebot wrote: Do we actually have guidelines about casing in context of aliased content? I had impression that it is symbol on its own that matters and thus TemplateArgumentPack needs to be CamelCased simply because it is a type/template, whatever

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Dicebot
On Monday, 30 December 2013 at 03:19:36 UTC, David Nadlinger wrote: On Monday, 30 December 2013 at 03:01:08 UTC, Dicebot wrote: Do we actually have guidelines about casing in context of aliased content? I had impression that it is symbol on its own that matters and thus TemplateArgumentPack

Re: readln() returns new line charater

2013-12-29 Thread Vladimir Panteleev
On Monday, 30 December 2013 at 03:03:37 UTC, Marco Leise wrote: Am Sat, 28 Dec 2013 17:08:38 + schrieb Vladimir Panteleev vladi...@thecybershadow.net: On Saturday, 28 December 2013 at 17:07:23 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: On 12/28/13 8:49 AM, Jeroen Bollen wrote: Why is when you do

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Timon Gehr
On 12/30/2013 03:58 AM, Dicebot wrote: On Monday, 30 December 2013 at 00:20:43 UTC, Timon Gehr wrote: What would be an example of code that you consider to be broken? (TemplateArgumentList!(int, double) is a valid type and TemplateArgumentList!(1, 2.0) is a value of that type.) Stuff that

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 12/29/13 6:58 PM, Dicebot wrote: On Monday, 30 December 2013 at 00:20:43 UTC, Timon Gehr wrote: What would be an example of code that you consider to be broken? (TemplateArgumentList!(int, double) is a valid type and TemplateArgumentList!(1, 2.0) is a value of that type.) Stuff that relies

Re: DIP54 : revamp of Phobos tuple types

2013-12-29 Thread Dicebot
On Monday, 30 December 2013 at 03:44:49 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: I don't understand the question. I think there's no particular relation between TemplateArgument{List,Pack}!(int, double) and TemplateArgument{List,Pack}!(1, 2.0). One is a list of two types and the other is a list of two

Re: Cross referencing in Ddoc

2013-12-29 Thread H. S. Teoh
On Sun, Dec 29, 2013 at 06:38:55PM +0100, Jacob Carlborg wrote: If nothing has happened recently the current situation of cross referencing in Ddoc sucks. What's currently being used in the Phobos documentation is the XREF, CXREF and ECXREF ddoc macros. These macros take two arguments, append

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