>Sorry it came across as snippy, but Harold came across *to me* as
>colossally arrogant and condescending.
>
>So, I brought my own baggage, too.
>
>Duly noted.
>
>But I assume the readers of my posts are sufficiently attentive to
be
>able to judge for themselves whether what I've said is credib
>> > On 18 Jul 2002, at 1:08, Harold Steinhardt wrote:
> >> What set me off, was my perceived insistence of others who feel, in
> >> the composing process, that a complete midi playback with every element
> >> accounted for is needed for their proofing purposes.
> >
> > Well, no one in this discus
On 18 Jul 2002, at 19:34, Doug Auwarter wrote:
> on 7/18/02 11:19 AM, David W. Fenton at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> > On 18 Jul 2002, at 1:08, Harold Steinhardt wrote:
> >
> >> What set me off, was my perceived insistence of others who feel, in
> >> the composing process, that a complete midi
on 7/18/02 11:19 AM, David W. Fenton at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> On 18 Jul 2002, at 1:08, Harold Steinhardt wrote:
>
>> What set me off, was my perceived insistence of others who feel, in
>> the composing process, that a complete midi playback with every element
>> accounted for is needed for
On 18 Jul 2002, at 1:08, Harold Steinhardt wrote:
> What set me off, was my perceived insistence of others who feel, in
> the composing process, that a complete midi playback with every element
> accounted for is needed for their proofing purposes.
Well, no one in this discussion, so far as I ha
At 6:31 AM -0400 7/18/02, David H. Bailey wrote:
> What the right tool IS, how that is concept defined by various
>people, and whether or not tools can change.
>
>And it is this last question (whether or not tools can or should
>change) that is at issue here --
[big, bit clip]
>But even if y
At 01:13 AM 7/18/02 -0400, Christopher BJ Smith wrote:
>The problem with the pitch wheel is that it alters EVERY pitch being
>played on that MIDI channel, making it useless for tuning chords.
Ah, yes, absolutely right. I would have remembered this only when doing it,
and would have created a sep
Harold Steinhardt wrote:
[snip]
> Finale is a music notation program that can do midi. It's strength
> is notation. When you want fine detail over notation, use Finale.
> Logic is an example of a music sequencing program that can do notation.
> It's strength is sequencing. When you want fi
On Wednesday, July 17, 2002, at 11:08 PM, Harold Steinhardt wrote:
> Finale is a music notation program that can do midi. It's
> strength is notation...
The Enigma file format is a database and Finale is a sequencer
in the sense that it organizes the data into what are called
frames and then
Colin, I do admit my comment was a great generalization, that even I
don't completely agree with. And this all started with with my
opinion that Coda should spend most of their resources improving the
notational problems that still exist rather than added midi capabilities.
I can't write without
Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote:
>
> Sure, live concerts are great for the tension of the imminent mistake
> (composer Daron Hagen believes it's only the possibility of calamity that
> keeps people going to opera and NASCAR races), the idiosyncratic
> interpretations and bizarre behavior,
La
At 3:38 AM -0400 7/17/02, Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote:
>At 12:14 AM 7/17/02 -0400, Christopher BJ Smith wrote:
>>The faint note is probably there, and it is most likely a sum tone,
>>which only are audible in the proper key when the instruments are
>>playing in tune - which is to say NOT in equal t
On 17 Jul 2002, at 10:52, Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote:
> At 09:54 AM 7/17/02 -0400, you wrote:
> >On 16 Jul 2002, at 15:54, Harold Steinhardt wrote:
> >
> >> However, the best of midi playback still does not give you an honest
> >> representation of what real human beings, playing a real acoustic
- Original Message -
From: "Harold Steinhardt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> If an arranger or a composer does not know what it will sound like
> BEFORE notating it, then they do not know their art/craft very well.
There is so much wrong with this generalisation, I don't know where to
begin.
I can hear a piece in my head. I know how it sounds. Then I have it played by
humans. There is a slight change in the music. The players bring in another
ingredient. I get used to it. Then you play the piece in front of an audience
and it becomes "another ball game".
It's like hearing music or wat
Many are circling around what I have stated are primary reasons for using
advanced MIDI playback from a Finale file. I certainly use Finale's MIDI
playback as a composer and arranger, and only need that to be _very basic_,
because I still am able to use my imagination to envision real performance
At 09:54 AM 7/17/02 -0400, you wrote:
>On 16 Jul 2002, at 15:54, Harold Steinhardt wrote:
>
>> However, the best of midi playback still does not give you an honest
>> representation of what real human beings, playing a real acoustic
>> instruments will sound like.
>
>That is as true of playback f
Harold Steinhardt wrote:
> If an arranger or a composer does not know what it will sound
> like BEFORE notating it, then they do not know their art/craft
> very well. If they don't already know what it will sound like,
> how do they determine what to write in the first place?
Notating one's
On 16 Jul 2002, at 10:18, Linda Worsley wrote:
> I love Finale, warts and all, and while I understand the many
> complaints, I sometimes want to go on the list and shout "This is
> your mother speaking! Stop whining or I'll stop he car!" Don't ANY
> of you remember what it was like to make sc
On 16 Jul 2002, at 17:37, David H. Bailey wrote:
> I am very happy for everybody who pretends to be deaf like Beethoven
> when they compose. I am not like that. I am not a Mozart. I can't
> conceive of scores complete in my head and write them down perfectly so
> I don't ever want to change
On 16 Jul 2002, at 15:54, Harold Steinhardt wrote:
> However, the best of midi playback still does not give you an honest
> representation of what real human beings, playing a real acoustic
> instruments will sound like.
That is as true of playback from your fancy-schmancy professional
sequenc
At 12:14 AM 7/17/02 -0400, Christopher BJ Smith wrote:
>The faint note is probably there, and it is most likely a sum tone,
>which only are audible in the proper key when the instruments are
>playing in tune - which is to say NOT in equal temperament as most
>synths and pianos. Getting the tuni
At 11:56 PM -0400 7/16/02, Christopher BJ Smith wrote:
>At 2:21 PM -0500 7/16/02, Harold Steinhardt wrote:
>>
>>If an arranger or a composer does not know what it will sound like
>>BEFORE notating it, then they do not know their art/craft very well. If
>>they don't already know what it will sound
At 8:45 PM -0400 7/16/02, Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote:
>
>>I often find with real acoustic instruments the
>>richness of overtones and perhaps some sympathetic
>>vibrations, I may faintly hear another note which is not
>>written. For example, in a simple minor triad with
>>acoustic instruments, I
At 2:21 PM -0500 7/16/02, Harold Steinhardt wrote:
>
>If an arranger or a composer does not know what it will sound like
>BEFORE notating it, then they do not know their art/craft very well. If
>they don't already know what it will sound like, how do they
>determine what to write in the first pla
David:
That's the way I do it. I can hear it in my head. Sometimes I make changes
later. That's the problem I have with Finale. It is so easy to make changes.
That's the way I do it. I am not complaining about anyone's way of doing
things. The important thing is to do realize the music the best w
I appreciate all the comments about this ... I know that I fought against
Midi implementation 10 years ago, but I've changed my mind entirely. More
than entirely.
At 10:18 AM 7/16/02 -0700, Linda Worsley wrote:
>Don't ANY
>of you remember what it was like to make scores with ink and Ozalid?
Li
That's fine -- I suppose you never have to revise your scores after you
hear them? Never change the dynamics? Never decide to add a ritard
because it would sound nice, after you heard the piece without the ritard?
I am very happy for everybody who pretends to be deaf like Beethoven
when they
if
>they are writing for instruments they don't play (or can't play
>simultaneously!), and this skill allows one to work faster and therefore
>presumably make a better living.
>
>Stu
>
>-Original Message-
>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTE
I remember my teacher telling me: "You have to see with your ears and hear
with your eyes". I don't use a piano or Finale's playback. Forgive me if I
sound arrogant. I am in complete agreement with Harold Stienhardt.
Bob Florence
Harold Steinhardt wrote:
> On Tuesday, July 16, 2002 12:43 PM, Da
Yes Tim, I think I can agree with you here. My objection to this thread, is I
believe many people were wanting it to become more of a full-fledged sequencer on the
order of Performer and Logic. However, better implementation of what it does provide
would not be a horrible thing.
But please
Harold,
I do and don't agree with you. When I want to make a nice MIDI demo of a
piece I notated in Finale, I certainly export the MIDI into Digital
Performer, or some other sequencer and do it there. And, likewise, I don't
use Performer for notation.
However, Finale _already has_ a thorough M
Personally, I make it a policy to never write what I hear -- I mean if I
can hear it why bother?
Now writing beyond what I hear -- that's engaging!
It's like T-shirts. Why wear T-shirts from places you've been to. You've
been there - why bother with a T-shirt? Instead wear T-shirts from places
> On Tuesday, July 16, 2002 12:43 PM, David H. Bailey
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >Finale is a music program -- not merely a word-processor for notation.
> >Finale is a lot more like a full-fledged page-layout program than it is
> >like Word in your analogy. Being deprived of being able to h
On Tuesday, July 16, 2002 12:43 PM, David H. Bailey
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>Finale is NOT just a page-layout program for engravers, it is also a
>tool used by arrangers and composers who want to hear how what they
are
>working on sounds
>
If an arranger or a composer does not know what
On Tuesday, July 16, 2002 12:43 PM, David H. Bailey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Finale is a music program -- not merely a word-processor for notation.
>Finale is a lot more like a full-fledged page-layout program than it is
>like Word in your analogy. Being deprived of being able to hear full
You're absolutely right! Let's demand that Coda remove any further midi
development from their wish-list. NOT!
Finale is a music program -- not merely a word-processor for notation.
Finale is a lot more like a full-fledged page-layout program than it is
like Word in your analogy. Being depriv
At 11:28 PM -0500 7/15/02, Harold Steinhardt wrote:
>Exactly! Finale is a NOTATION program with rudimentary midi
>capabilities - it is not a sequencer. When you want minute detail over midi
>playback, dump the midi data to a program designed to do that, like
>Logic or Performer.
>
>Use the right
Exactly! Finale is a NOTATION program with rudimentary midi
capabilities - it is not a sequencer. When you want minute detail over midi
playback, dump the midi data to a program designed to do that, like
Logic or Performer.
Use the right tool for the right job.
All this complaining about midi
Andrew Stiller wrote:
>
>I should emphasize again that I am not primarily interested in
>making the MIDI sound good *to me* (though obviously I need a
>certain degree of clarity for proofhearing purposes) but to a
>hypothetical on-line listener using unknown equipment. I have been
>operating u
>
>How do you mix the sounds from the Quicktime instruments coming from
>your computer and those of the hardware synth?
I don't. I used to use my synth for playback, when all I was
concerned about was proofhearing, but since MIDI demos are
increasingly important (especially for orchestra music
On Sunday, July 14, 2002, at 01:17 PM, Andrew Stiller wrote:
>> the newer icon types have APIs to create composites and
>> blends, change the background colors, use the system label
>> colors, etc.
> All of which are a great excuse to for wasting time instead of
> actually working with the p
I wrote:
Can you set volume levels from within the mixer, real or virtual?
This may be the best way to go for instrument templates that you use
a lot.
Andrew Stiller wrote:
>What mixer? QuickTime Player? How do I do that?
>And another question: how do I increase the *maximum* volume? On my
>ha
>the newer icon types have APIs to create composites and blends,
>change the background colors, use the system label colors, etc.
All of which are a great excuse to for wasting time instead of
actually working with the program. God forbid Coda should throw away
another upgrade cycle emphasizin
On Sunday, July 14, 2002, at 04:52 AM, David H. Bailey wrote:
> Also, from a more practical standpoint, if Coda makes Finale
> more user-friendly (not necessarily improving notation
> capabilites, but completely rewriting the interface so that
> beginners have an even easier time than they al
At 4:52 AM 07/14/02, John Bell wrote:
>[...] I believe that when Finale's notation capabilities are perfected is
>the time to start concentrating on improving its playback facilities.
"Perfected"? How literally shall we read that? Because it is essentially
equivalent to never.
mdl
__
Yours is a very valid point of view.
So is the point of view that for many of us the notation capabilities
ARE perfected for what we do and that now is the time for Finale to
concentrate development money on the playback aspect of the program.
Which is why there is such lively debate on this l
On 14.07.2002 5:52 Uhr, John Bell wrote
> Finale is, in my opinion, the best music notation program currently
> available. It's playback performance is limited: you can aurally
> proof-read your work, and with a small amount of effort you can even
> produce a modest demo.
>
> I believe that when
Finale is, in my opinion, the best music notation program currently
available. It's playback performance is limited: you can aurally
proof-read your work, and with a small amount of effort you can even
produce a modest demo.
I believe that when Finale's notation capabilities are perfected is
>2) Make sure that the play continuous data is checked in the
>playback preferences.
That's doubtless it, as I have that disabled by default.
>
>Can you set volume levels from within the mixer, real or virtual?
>This may be the best way to go for instrument templates that you use
>a lot.
Wha
1) Changes in MIDI don't usually play back until you click the stop
button in the Playback tool. This tells the program to dump the
memory of the previous playback.
2) Make sure that the play continuous data is checked in the playback
preferences.
3) I know you don't want to go this route, bu
Following the advice given by several folks on the list, I tried
changing the volume of one orchestral staff by assigning it a fixed
value rather than applying a percentage. Still no go. The loudness is
unaffected, though Finale does at least seem to recognize that
something was done.
What
As a side bar --and it probably won't suit everybody but ---I duplicate the
staff/score tool dynamics, reduce their size, enclose them in < > and set to
brackets don't print - hot key 'em all and put in default file.
Crude but effective dynamics.
Jerry
Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote:
> At 11:22 A
After you selected the staff, you have to double-click-and-drag over a
region so a highlighted area appears. To select the entire staff I
think you have to go to the edit menu and choose Select All (or cmd-A or
whatever the Mac version of Windows' ctrl-A is).
You can't alter by percentage becau
At 11:22 AM 7/11/02 -0400, Andrew Stiller wrote:
>OK, I've entered flutes, obs, clars. The General Midi clarinet is TOO
>LOUD, so, per advice, I go to the MIDI tool, select the staff, choose
>Continuous Data from the Midi menu and enter controller 7: volume,
>click OK, choose Percent Alter from
OK, I've entered flutes, obs, clars. The General Midi clarinet is TOO
LOUD, so, per advice, I go to the MIDI tool, select the staff, choose
Continuous Data from the Midi menu and enter controller 7: volume,
click OK, choose Percent Alter from the Midi menu, enter 50% and
click OK. Nothing happ
56 matches
Mail list logo
