Dennis Bathory-Kitsz writes:
My comments are not about either perfection or 'strict adherence to the
printed score', they're about playing -- or being committed to play --
what's written down without excuses or slovenliness, and for the conductor
to (a) notice and (b) point it out.
[snip]
It's als
Bailey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Dennis Bathory-Kitsz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2003 9:09 AM
Subject: Re: [Finale] TAN: Extension ranges on ... Bass Clarinet
> Well, grab onto something and steady yourself.
>
> Conduct
At 7:50 PM 10/03/03, Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote:
>Why choose music you can't play well, or don't want to play well, or don't
>want even to try to play well?
I can't speak to the latter two, but the reason to choose music you can't
play well is because you love the music and you hope that some day
At 7:09 PM -0400 10/03/03, David H. Bailey wrote:
Well, grab onto something and steady yourself.
Conductors are often caught between a rock and a hard place --
balancing the preparation of many weeks of concerts with the strict
adherence to the printed score.
snip
I paraphrase that old prayer:
At 2:15 PM -0500 10/03/03, Richard Huggins wrote:
Ray, your statement is curious to me. First I'm not exactly certain what you
mean by "mere alteration of the printed pitch." What's "mere" about it? Are
you suggesting that a ledger-line note is more respected than a note with an
8va on it?
Second,
On Fri, 03 Oct 2003 21:57:27 -0400, "Dennis Bathory-Kitsz"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
> It's not about the pedal A, it's about the attitude -- "we'll change
> whatever the composer wrote / whenever it's a bother to play the note."
Then, there is the "we'll change what the composer wrote, because t
m: "Dennis Bathory-Kitsz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, October 03, 2003 9:57 PM
Subject: Re: [Finale] TAN: Extension ranges on ... Bass Clarinet
> At 09:51 PM 10/3/03 -0400, Ray Horton wrote:
> >I'm glad you can hear every tuba pedal
iday, October 03, 2003 6:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Finale] TAN: Extension ranges on ... Bass Clarinet
> Geez, Roy...you took my message way wrong. When I said "curious," that's
> exactly and only what I meant. Nothing more and most certainly nothing
> adversarial!
>...
> -
At 09:51 PM 10/3/03 -0400, Ray Horton wrote:
>I'm glad you can hear every tuba pedal A that goes by in every crazy piece
>of new music that gets played, because our conductors haven't been able to!
It's not about the pedal A, it's about the attitude -- "we'll change
whatever the composer wrote / w
Friday, October 03, 2003 6:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Finale] TAN: Extension ranges on ... Bass Clarinet
>
> In all this discussion ... where is the conductor? What conductor would
put
> up with this behavior, pro or not? I've conducted plenty of amateurs, and
> by golly they play
At 07:09 PM 10/3/03 -0400, David H. Bailey wrote:
>Conductors are often caught between a rock and a hard place -- balancing
>the preparation of many weeks of concerts with the strict adherence to
>the printed score.
>
>Many community bands come together for a rehearsal or two and then
>essential
Well, grab onto something and steady yourself.
Conductors are often caught between a rock and a hard place -- balancing
the preparation of many weeks of concerts with the strict adherence to
the printed score.
Many community bands come together for a rehearsal or two and then
essentially to si
At 08:05 AM 10/4/03 +1000, helgesen wrote:
>I wholeheartedly agree with Ray and others. Players- especially 'non-pros',
>tend to treat 8ves (up or down) as optional. And to Richard- Yes, I'm afraid
>that outside of the "do it or you're fired" world of the pros, leger lines
>are more respected than
Ray Horton wrote:
Hey! Don't shoot the messenger! I've seen it happen, that's all. I've seen
8va markings for extreme ranges ignored, occasionally, sometimes
accidentally, sometimes on purpose. They seem to be taken less seriously,
sometimes, by some players, then are leger lines.
I have to ag
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2003 7:37 AM
Subject: Re: [Finale] TAN: Extension ranges on ... Bass Clarinet
> Hey! Don't shoot the messenger! I've seen it happen, that's all. I've
seen
> 8va markings for extreme ranges i
Geez, Roy...you took my message way wrong. When I said "curious," that's
exactly and only what I meant. Nothing more and most certainly nothing
adversarial!
That being said, I can relate to the notion of the player second-guessing
something that seems to be an example of an arranger or composer wh
ammit! And it's NOT MY
FAULT! ... There, there, calm down, Ray)
RH
- Original Message -
From: "Richard Huggins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Finale List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, October 03, 2003 3:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Finale] TAN: Extension ra
Ray, your statement is curious to me. First I'm not exactly certain what you
mean by "mere alteration of the printed pitch." What's "mere" about it? Are
you suggesting that a ledger-line note is more respected than a note with an
8va on it?
Second, are you saying that the performer might arbitrari
I am chiming in late on the overworked 8va vs. leger line fight:
As a performer, I have sometimes observed other performers, good and bad,
amateur and professional, ignore 8va markings when it suited their purpose.
(Such as "I don't like this piece, and I don't feel like working that hard
by playi
At 9/30/2003 04:43 PM, Andrew Stiller wrote:
>This certainly was not true for me, either on clarinet or bassoon.
>Note names were associated with the notation from the very beginning.
>What came later was the idea that note names recurred in different
>octaves.
Agreed. And that the different octa
Yes, and another way to think about this is to realize that
beginning instrumentalists do not first learn to identify, label and
play "notes," but "fingerings." They learn, in other words, a
tablature that applies to their instrument, with each line or space
denoting a specific fingering. Lab
On Tuesday, September 30, 2003, at 09:52 AM, Daniel Dorff wrote (in part):
A flutist associates high high C above
the 5th line with a certain fingering and seeing that note up there sets up
automatic muscle memory in fingers and embouchure that isn't true for the
visual experience of the C on the
On the senza misura question, I know from personal experience that
many performers want to know exactly when to play, and don't do well
with approximate rhythmic notation. But as soon as one makes the
notation more specific, then the freeness is hopelessly lost.
Tim
I do some of my Renaissance
At 10:10 AM 9/30/03 -0400, Tim Thompson wrote:
>On the senza misura question, I know from personal experience that many
>performers want to know exactly when to play, and don't do well with
>approximate rhythmic notation. But as soon as one makes the notation
>more specific, then the freeness i
On Tuesday, September 30, 2003, at 07:58 AM, David Horne wrote:
On Tue, 30 Sep 2003 09:52:35 -0400, "Daniel Dorff"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
So if this theory is valid, and I
believe it is, then it makes most sense to always write for flute
without
8va signs, but to sometimes use them for piano.
On Tue, 30 Sep 2003 09:52:35 -0400, "Daniel Dorff"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
> So if this theory is valid, and I
> believe it is, then it makes most sense to always write for flute without
> 8va signs, but to sometimes use them for piano. It sounds like Dennis's
> colleagues would agree with this.
Based on anecdotal evidence, I would agree with this theory (in most
cases).
Tim
On Tuesday, September 30, 2003, at 09:52 AM, Daniel Dorff wrote:
I've heard some editors point out that the piano keyboard looks the
same in
each octave and requires the same eye/hand coordination patterns in any
On Tuesday, September 30, 2003, at 09:20 AM, Dennis Bathory-Kitsz
wrote:
To return to the ledger lines question: I use the clear-at-three-feet
rule,
based on my aging vision.
Good rule. I haven't quite hit 40 yet, and I'm sure that when I do, I
will have a new appreciation for that!
On the s
I've heard some editors point out that the piano keyboard looks the same in
each octave and requires the same eye/hand coordination patterns in any
octave, whereas wind and string instruments are fingered differently in the
highest registers compared to below. A flutist associates high high C abov
At 10:47 PM 9/29/03 -0400, Tim Thompson wrote:
>I was rehearsing a piece today on tenor sax with a pianist. My part
>went up to C (5 lines above), and I don't have to think too hard about
>that, as I am only reading one line, but the pianist was constantly
>asking "what's that note?"
I work wi
I was rehearsing a piece today on tenor sax with a pianist. My part
went up to C (5 lines above), and I don't have to think too hard about
that, as I am only reading one line, but the pianist was constantly
asking "what's that note?" His part frequently had 6 ledger lines on
both ends, and on
On Monday, September 29, 2003, at 05:01 PM, Daniel Dorff wrote:
The reasons why I brought up the other options are that I do see them
on music put in front of me, and that clarinetists aren't used to as
many ledger lines below as tubists, which is why they should get used
to seeing them.
But (
them.
-DD
- Original Message -
From: "Andrew Stiller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "finale list" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 4:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Finale] TAN: Extension ranges on ... Bass Clarinet
> Daniel Dorff:
>
> >when t
Daniel Dorff:
when there's music for the bottom few notes, that's a lot of ledger
lines, leaving 3 options: a) write treble clef at the normal
transposition a 9th higher than sounds, and let the player get used
to ledger lines or pencil in the note names,
Oh c'mon, it's only 4 lines! Tuba pla
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