Thanks Markus for chime in on this.
As Markus said, the TVM PPMC is fully committed to work towards consensus
and address issues to the best of our ability.
In particular, to address X1. Following trademark's recommendation and
thanks to INFRA's help,
We have now migrated the community forum to h
Just to echo and expand on my comment on the vote thread: From my
perspective as a mentor, TVM is ready to be a top level project.
I base this assessment not on any particular issue, but on how the
community conducts itself: Everything is discussed out in the open,
(mirrored) on mailing lists and
Thanks Justin and Ming for the followup feedback about the
https://tvmconf.org/, which I believe we have collectively work to resolve
the issue.
Would love to hear more feedbacks wrt to the current summary of the state
in below and suggestions for further improvements.
TQ
Thanks Justin, Henry, D
Hi,
> Thanks Justin. As mentioned in the last email. We are following the
> previous naming convention of similar conferences like "Kafka Summit" and
> "Spark + AI Summit”.
I believe are slightly different sort of events as they are not run by the
project but by another 3rd party / commercial en
Per Justin's feedback. The title has been changed to "Apache TVM and Deep
Learning Compilation Conference".
The TVM PPMC is fully committed to make sure the Apache brand is protected.
Would love to hear about more constructive feedbacks :)
TQ
On Mon, Aug 31, 2020 at 8:40 PM Tianqi Chen wrote:
Thanks Justin. As mentioned in the last email. We are following the
previous naming convention of similar conferences like "Kafka Summit" and
"Spark + AI Summit".
We would be more than happy to change the title to something like "Apache
TVM and Deep Learning Compilation Conference" if the trademar
Hi,
> The TVM PPMC would certainly be more than happy to follow trademarks
> suggestions on event brandings and make sure the event is compliant.
> To follow up the naming compliance. Notably, in the main page the project
> name "Apache (incubating) TVM" is used in the first and most prominent
> r
Thanks Ming and Justin.
Yes, the conference is in discussion with trademarks@. The event is
organized by volunteers who are also active contributors to the project and
follows similar patterns of other events.
The TVM PPMC would certainly be more than happy to follow trademarks
suggestions on eve
Hi,
The conference hasn’t yet been approved by trademarks, but a request to use
that domain has been asked [1]. I don’t think this is an issue unless
trademarks says otherwise. My guess is that they may want a little more
information to see if it complies with event branding policy [2]. It btw
hello, tianqi,
thanks for your detailed response.
I have another question: https://tvmconf.org/ who has control of this
domain name?
Looks like it's controlled by https://github.com/tvmconf.
Thanks,
Ming Wen, Apache APISIX & Apache SkyWalking
Twitter: _WenMing
Tianqi Chen 于2020年8月31日周一 下午1:08写道
Thanks Justin, Henry, Dave, Ming, Matt for helpful feedbacks.
Personally I find the current conversation a good living example of the
Apache way for consensus building :)
Thanks to the helpful feedback we have resolved several issues.
In order to clarify the situation, please allow me to dissect
I would like to revisit a bit about the release topic to shed light about
the release process.
The TVM PPMC has always been focusing on producing high quality releases.
- The project has produced five major (non-apache) releases prior joining
Apache
- While most incubator projects start with a DIS
We have also talked to Apache INFRA about the use of the https://ci.tvm.ai/ due
to the need of special setups in terms of GPU based resources etc.
So far we have received warm help from the INFRA and they are super helpful
in helping setting up CI hooks so that the community can enjoy quick
develo
tvmlang.org was an old url by the project that eventually got deprecated at
some time point, it now redirects to the https://tvm.apache.org/
The PMC makes sure to redirect to the static Apache project when possible
for official project related information.
Due to the mechanism of the discourse we
Hi,
Sorry my mistake, I meant to say tvm.ai not tvm.io, but as I said subdomains on
tvm.ai are not redirecting. For instance discuss.tvm.ai stays as it is. Other
sub-domains include ci.tvm.ai , tracking.tvm.ai and docs.tvm.ai that I’ve
found. There might be others, of those four, only docs redi
Thanks Justin. To further address your listed points:
P0: tvm.io
The original project only uses the domain tvm.ai, which is redirected to
the https://tvm.apache.org/.
Other tvm related domain names have nothing to do with ApacheTVM. Note that
because TVM as a three letter abbreviation is quite co
Hi,
Thanks for the response. I think the docker issue is resolved.
I still have concerns about use of tvm.io. I have discovered several other
subdomains (six in total) that do not redirect to the Apache site, there might
be others. It's still unclear who has control of this domain name. The iss
Thanks Ming.
Certainly, different PMC can take a different approach towards release.
We are not suggesting that every PMC should take our approach.
In the particular case of TVM, the community has been working on several
major features including Ansor, uTVM and it does not make sense to cut
the re
I think only two releases and only one release manager are blocking issues.
Considering that TVM merges 150 PRs a month on average, but only two
releases within a year and a half, that is, users use codes that are much
behind the master, which is not friendly to the community.
Second, there is no
Thanks Matt!
The main reason we used thirdparty(as stated above) is that the TVM PPMC
believes it is important to
protect the Apache brand and release policy(artifact being compatible
apache).
Given some of the optional test packages (e.g. pytorch/tensorflow) are not
what we could control,
and it
Makes sense. Do you think the recent changes to Docker Hub will affect
this? It might be a good idea to move the images into the Apache org, even
if they’re not for end users.
On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 20:52 Tianqi Chen wrote:
> Thanks Matt!
>
>
>
> That was indeed the approach we used before. The
Thanks Matt!
That was indeed the approach we used before. The main problem of this
approach is
- There could be certain upstream changes (say tensorflow get updated) that
may not retrigger the rebuild
- The CI instance itself can quickly get crowded by the historical cached
images and causes disk
Is there even a need to upload the Docker images for CI? Docker recognizes
layers by checksums, so CI build agents will cache the image layers
regardless of whether or not you upload them to Docker Hub. Layers get
rebuilt when the Docker file changes or you force an update.
On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at
Thanks Justin and Henry for the discussion thread.
Please allow me to dissect and summarize again some of the discussion
points:)
C0: Docker Image
- There was a mis-understanding that the docker image like ci-gpu
contains tvm. They do not, and instead contain an environment to
build and run t
Hi Justin:
Again to further clarify the Docker image.
First of all, the PPMC is 100% with you that it is NOT fine to
release docker images with the Apache brand, or not following the
apache official release tag.
The test cache binary used by TVM CI is a different thing.
As the docker image itsel
Sure, that is easy to fix and good suggestion. But, hope it is not a
blocker issue.
On Fri, Aug 28, 2020, 5:09 PM Justin Mclean
wrote:
> Hi,
>
> The "install from source” page should probably point people to the source
> releases rather than the latest code in GitHub.
>
> Thanks,
> Justin
>
Look like TQ has given you answer and proposed solution about the Docker
images.
Hope that helps.
On Fri, Aug 28, 2020, 5:01 PM Justin Mclean
wrote:
> Hi,
>
> > I am sure there are many other binary packaging out there that use Apache
> > project names, for example this one for Apache Spark:
>
Hi,
The "install from source” page should probably point people to the source
releases rather than the latest code in GitHub.
Thanks,
Justin
-
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For additional comma
Hi,
> I am sure there are many other binary packaging out there that use Apache
> project names, for example this one for Apache Spark:
> https://hub.docker.com/r/bitnami/spark/
What other Apache projects do (Spark in particular for various reasons) are not
always good examples to follow. But yo
Thanks TQ, I understand the situation for the current Docker images.
The reason I mentioned about having official Docker images for TVM in the
ASF Docker hub to help differentiate between community/ external one, and
the one officially come from Apache TVM (P)PMC.
- Henry
On Fri, Aug 28, 2020, 4
Thanks Henry.
In this case, we choose the thirdparty for binary testing cache in
particular to simplify the trademark concerns
(since we do not want to vet the license of the test env). Which I believe
is allowed.
In terms of the docker image source, the community strives to release
source releas
The Apache does have official Docker hub [1].
So, the TVM PPMC could, in the near future, create Docker images for Apache
TVM for official distribution to help people quickly consume and run the
source code releases.
[1] https://hub.docker.com/u/apache
On Fri, Aug 28, 2020, 4:29 PM Tianqi Che
To follow up the comment on docker image, as I mentioned in my previous
email.
We are changing the use of docker hub name to a new name that does not
contain tvm https://github.com/apache/incubator-tvm/pull/6360
The tvmai docker hub will be removed after the PR is merged
As I stated in my previous
Hi Justin,
I am sure there are many other binary packaging out there that use Apache
project names, for example this one for Apache Spark:
https://hub.docker.com/r/bitnami/spark/
Are you concern about the name? The Docker image hub clearly stated this is
not official Docker image from Apache TVM
Thanks Justin!
Docker Images and Downloads Stats
- These images are indeed only used for testing purposes.
Note that there are more than 150 PRs every month, results in more than
tens of thousands of tests being triggered.
Every now and then the CI machine need to pull the fresh new image a
Hi,
On that installation pages it does says "We provide docker utility scripts to
help developers to setup development environment. They are also helpful run
through TVM demo and tutorials.” and "You can find some un-official prebuilt
images in https://hub.docker.com/r/tvmai/.” IMO this doesn’t
Hi,
> Then why do they have 40K+ downloads? It also doesn’t explain the version
> numbers.
Sorry 4K I misread that, but even that seem high for something that is used for
testing.
Thanks,
Justin
-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: gener
Hi,
> - As you can see that the domain redirects to https://tvm.apache.org/.
> So hopefully there is no confusion here.
In some cases it does not. e.g. discuss.tvm.ai IMO this is a graduation blocker.
> P2: releases
> - The PPMC has a well documented release process[1]
> that anyone can go and
Thanks Justin for bringing up these points!
P0: tvm.ai domain
- As you can see that the domain redirects to https://tvm.apache.org/.
So hopefully there is no confusion here.
P2: releases
- The PPMC has a well documented release process[1]
that anyone can go and produce a release.
- While we
Hi,
I’m also concerned that the person who seems responsible for these docker
images seems to be the proposed chair of the project.
Thanks,
Justin
-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org
For additional
Hi,
I also have several concerns.
1. Use of the tvm.ai domain - has permission been obtained from trademark to
use this domain? Who has control of it?
2. With only 2 releases with 1 release manager I don’t think the project is
mature enough to graduate,
3. Branding/trademarks on these docke
Thanks Dave, Henry, Ming for the discussions so far.
Please allow me to try to dissect and summarize the
discussion points and answers so far:
D0: Release process
- The PPMC has a well document release process[1] and has proj
D1: Use of github and dev@
- We follow the principle “everything happe
Thanks for the comments, Ming Wen.
About the content of the list, it is not a problem and also not unusual on
changes sent to dev@ list.
Some Apache projects like MetaModel and during the early of Apache Flink
also have Github change sent to dev@ list.
Also some Apache projects have all JIRA updat
> As per apache way, everything happens (also happens) on dev@tvm. We try to
> set up the mechanism to enable maximum participation from the community,
> while complying with ASF rules :)
> The emails from the dev@tvm are also forwarded to the github thread.
The mailing list seems to be a backup o
Thanks Ming.
While we agree that we have only done two releases so far, both of them are
high quality and follow the Apache release process.
We feel that the community is mature enough that we can push for graduation
as it is, and continue to push for high quality releases concurrently. It
also a
I think Apache TVM need more Apache releases and more release manager.
TVM has two apache releases(12/05/2019 and 07/10/2020), and ONLY one
release manager(liuyizhi) [1].
[1] https://incubator.apache.org/clutch/tvm.html
Thanks,
Ming Wen, Apache APISIX & Apache SkyWalking
Twitter: _WenMing
Henry
Yes, as Tianqi has mentioned, the PPMC members watch the commits and
development of TVM podling using Github notifications, which sent to dev@
list.
So, they are still in the podling list.
And of course we can always review the commits@ list via Pony mail [1] when
needed.
- Henry
[1] https://li
Thanks Dave!
> With no one subscribed to commits@ how is the PPMC watching the codebase?
>
I believe most of us watch the codebase through github instead of the
commits@.
Note that the github discuss issues (VOTE, RFC, COMMUNITY) are forwarded to
dev@(rather than commits), so we can make sure th
Hi -
> On Aug 27, 2020, at 11:48 AM, Henry Saputra wrote:
>
> Hi Dave,
>
> The Apache TVM podling PPMC has been working hard to increase
> the community participation and involvement. The Reviewer concept is
> another way we try to reward and encourage contributors to the community.
Why not ma
Hi Dave,
The Apache TVM podling PPMC has been working hard to increase
the community participation and involvement. The Reviewer concept is
another way we try to reward and encourage contributors to the community.
As Tianqi had mentioned, ALL emails from Github are sync to dev@ list, so
no messag
Thank you Dave!
(1) They have invented a new position between Contributor and Committer
> called “Reviewer”. I’m not sure why this was done. It seems to me that
> these individuals should just become Committers.
>
Reviewer is not an official position, but as a way for us to encourage
reviews and
> On Aug 27, 2020, at 10:27 AM, Dave Fisher wrote:
>
> Hi -
>
> I am bothered by two things that TVM does.
>
> (1) They have invented a new position between Contributor and Committer
> called “Reviewer”. I’m not sure why this was done. It seems to me that these
> individuals should just be
Hi -
I am bothered by two things that TVM does.
(1) They have invented a new position between Contributor and Committer called
“Reviewer”. I’m not sure why this was done. It seems to me that these
individuals should just become Committers.
(2) All discussions are threaded in GitHub and then re
Edit the subject so that it is obvious as a discussion thread in
general@incubator.
TQ
FYI, following a heated discussion with great support from our mentors,
> committers and community members.
> The Apache(incubating) TVM is starting a vote to graduate as TLP
>
> - [1] community DISCUSS thread
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