Re: openbsd 4.2 + ftp-proxy -T + pf +tag/tagged not working

2007-12-11 Thread S. Scott Sima, CISA, CISM
The anchors are in the running rule set, per the man and faq examples, right in the nat/rdr top-of-the-rule-set section, just not shown in the (snip) included in the post. If they weren't there the "user proxy" version of snip wouldn't be working. Thanks for the link, it *may* be relevant; however

Re: openbsd 4.2 + ftp-proxy -T + pf +tag/tagged not working

2007-12-11 Thread scott
The anchors are in the running rule set, per the man and faq examples, right in the nat/rdr top-of-the-rule-set section, just not shown in the (snip) included in the post. If they weren't there the "user proxy" version of snip wouldn't be working. Thanks for the link, it *may* be relevant; however

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Ray Percival
On Dec 10, 2007, at 12:26 PM, Martin Schrvder wrote: 2007/12/10, Richard Stallman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: From what I have heard, OpenBSD does not contain non-free software (though I am not sure whether it contains any non-free firmware blobs). However, its ports system does suggest non-free prog

Re: : rouge IPs / user

2007-12-11 Thread Raimo Niskanen
On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 01:15:11AM +1300, Joel Wiramu Pauling wrote: > Tip. > > Don't allow password challenge. Problem solved. Just use key'd ssh and this > problem disappears. > Bin there, done that. You answered the wrong question. I want to know if and what I can do (on the server side) ab

Re: Can I specify the bios time offset utc?

2007-12-11 Thread Antoine Jacoutot
On Tue, 11 Dec 2007, Dongsheng Song wrote: OpenBSD assume bios time is utc, but it's PRC, can I tell OpenBSD the bios time zone? http://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq8.html#TimeZone -- Antoine

Re: Default Route Issues

2007-12-11 Thread Stuart Henderson
On 2007/12/10 19:58, Bret wrote: > The default route needs to be thru the wireless card and works fine untill I > add an IP for the wired lan vr() or I add it to the > bridge: up ral0 > up ral1 -- works great (and yes the up) > > but as soon as I add the vr0 the default route goes to

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Marc Espie
On Mon, Dec 10, 2007 at 11:27:08PM -0500, Jason Dixon wrote: > Nobody is criticizing RMS over his opinion. They are criticizing him > for ignorance and misrepresentation of the facts regarding OpenBSD. Actually, no, I am criticizing RMS over his opinion. He's supposed to have dedicated his li

HELP! boot hangs at "setting tty flags"

2007-12-11 Thread Rob Lytle
Here is the background: (yesterday) I decided to CVSUP this morning and compiled the kernel. Unlike yesterday, the boot hung right after the filesystem mounts/checks. I thought maybe I had better be in sync with Userland, but make build did nothing to rectify the situation. I was very careful in

Re: openbsd 4.2 + ftp-proxy -T + pf +tag/tagged not working

2007-12-11 Thread scott
Not sure what you're "answer" is. Yes, tag/tagged is off-tilt and being worked. No, everything with ftp-proxy is fine, it's pilot error in the rule set. Or little from "A" and little from "B." Shouldn't ftp-proxy set both its control and data channel needs correctly via its anchors. Else-wise if

GENERIC kernel compile fails at pcidevs_data.h

2007-12-11 Thread Rob Lytle
I cvsup'd this morning. Now I can't compile any kernels. They all hang at or near pcidevs_data.h Rob -- "Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds" Bob Marley, Redemption Song

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Edd Barrett
On 11/12/2007, Marc Espie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > You've got a choice of: > 1/ complete idiot > 2/ senile old fool disconnected from reality > 3/ dangerous political activist with a hidden agenda > Also I like the way he posts and disappears.

Re: GENERIC kernel compile fails at pcidevs_data.h

2007-12-11 Thread Andreas Kahari
This was fixed a bit later. Just update from CVS again... Regards, Andreas On 11/12/2007, Rob Lytle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I cvsup'd this morning. Now I can't compile any kernels. They all > hang at or near pcidevs_data.h > > Rob > > -- > "Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Lars Noodén
Marc Espie wrote: > ... > You've got a choice of: Or 4) not up on the OpenBSD projects goals and current licensing requirements Some of that is probably due to the low profile of OpenBSD (low-profile is good, though) and the yammering of the FreeBSD crowd (which both includes a lot of MSFTers,

Re: : rouge IPs / user

2007-12-11 Thread knitti
On 12/11/07, Raimo Niskanen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I want to know if and what I can do (on the server side) about HTTP > clients that put sockets on my httpd server in state CLOSE_WAIT and > thereby chew up all sockets for the server causing a kind of > denial of service state. > > And yes, I

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Martin Schröder
2007/12/11, Lars Noodin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > 4) not up on the OpenBSD projects goals and current licensing requirements You mean not interested. He got to meet Theo personally, so he could easily stay informed -- if he wanted too. Best Martin

Re: Azalia driver doen't playback 22050 rate

2007-12-11 Thread Diego Fernando Nieto Moreno
Thanks for All! I'll be working in the source code of fxtv too. I'll wish that it record audio in (48000Khz) > hmm, I will take a look at what's going on with fxtv. > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.lonestar.org

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Ray Percival
On Dec 11, 2007, at 4:43 AM, Lars Noodin wrote: Marc Espie wrote: ... You've got a choice of: Or 4) not up on the OpenBSD projects goals and current licensing requirements Some of that is probably due to the low profile of OpenBSD (low- profile is good, though) and the yammering of the Fre

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Peter N. M. Hansteen
Lars NoodC)n <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Articles and other means of providing information about OpenBSD will > increase knowledge of OpenBSD. Yes. I was pretty determined to stay out of this thread entirely, but I think you touch on an important point here. Like most people who have been in

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Jan Stary
> In particular, see http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/freedom-or-power.html. yeah, right. > Since I consider non-free software to be unethical and antisocial, LOL > I think it would be wrong for me to recommend it to others. Therefore, > if a collection of software contains (or suggests installat

BIND and the measure of system entropy (randomness?)

2007-12-11 Thread mufurcz
Greetings, A disk in one of the old firewalls (not exactly critical) failed (running OpenBSD 2.9!), and I urgently need a DNS server to work. Replaced the disk and installed 4.2. Starting `named -g` (listing below), produces a few surprising messages, like: a) line 3: BIND trying to load

Re: BIND and the measure of system entropy (randomness?)

2007-12-11 Thread Alexander Hall
Hi, mufurcz wrote: Greetings, A disk in one of the old firewalls (not exactly critical) failed (running OpenBSD 2.9!), and I urgently need a DNS server to work. Replaced the disk and installed 4.2. Starting `named -g` (listing below), produces a few surprising messages, like: a) line 3:

Re: HELP! boot hangs at "setting tty flags"- solved

2007-12-11 Thread Rob Lytle
I found a reference to commenting out tty03 in /etc/ttys. The machine now boots. Why? I have no idea. Rob. -- "Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds" Bob Marley, Redemption Song

no 4.2-stable package updates??

2007-12-11 Thread Jonathan Thornburg
As a matter of policy, are -stable packages updated for security fixes? I know that used to be the case, but as of today (40 days after 4.2 was released), there are *no* 4.2-stable package updates shown at http://www.openbsd.org/pkg-stable.html. In contrast, there are 183 4.1-stable updates shown

Re: Default Route Issues

2007-12-11 Thread Bret
Greets OK here is the update: Internet I OpenBSD 4.2 (1) --- wired LAN I wireless card - 10.60.128.1 I I (the following is the problem box) I wireless card ral0 - 10.60.128.2 I OpenBSD 4.2 (2) wired LAN em0 - 10.60.130.1 I wireless card ral1 - 10.6

Re: Default Route Issues

2007-12-11 Thread Bret
Greets OK here is the update: Internet I OpenBSD 4.2 (1) --- wired LAN I wireless card - 10.60.128.1 I I (the following is the problem box) I wireless card ral0 - 10.60.128.2 I OpenBSD 4.2 (2) wired LAN em0 - 10.60.130.1 I wireless card ral1 - 10.6

Re: no 4.2-stable package updates??

2007-12-11 Thread Antoine Jacoutot
On Tue, 11 Dec 2007, Jonathan Thornburg wrote: So, am I just "lucky" that no bugs-important-enough-for-stable-updates have been found in any 4.2 packages yet? Is there somewere other than http://www.openbsd.org/pkg-stable.html that I should be watching if I want to keep -stable packages up to da

Re: BIND and the measure of system entropy (randomness?)

2007-12-11 Thread Andreas Maus
On Wed, Dec 12, 2007 at 01:08:42AM +1100, mufurcz wrote: Hi. > Greetings, > > A disk in one of the old firewalls (not exactly critical) failed (running > OpenBSD 2.9!), and I urgently > need a DNS server to work. Replaced the disk and installed 4.2. Starting > `named -g` (listing below)

HUAWEI not recognized properly (3 modem)

2007-12-11 Thread Markus Bergkvist
I borrowed a HUAWEI modem just to see how it is recognized. With umass enabled it is recognized as a CD. Disabling umass and it is found as ugen. From this thread http://marc.info/?l=openbsd-misc&m=118468178731619&w=2 I figured it should have been recognized as ubsa. Any suggestions? dmesg wit

Re: no 4.2-stable package updates??

2007-12-11 Thread Martin Schröder
2007/12/11, Antoine Jacoutot <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > There're no -stable packages anymore. Get -stable ports fixed? Best Martin

Re: Azalia driver locks up computer Sony SZ460N

2007-12-11 Thread Rob Lytle
Gqmeg works so its either XMMS or the way XMMS controls the driver. I will recompile XMMS. -- "Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds" Bob Marley, Redemption Song

Re: HUAWEI not recognized properly (3 modem)

2007-12-11 Thread [EMAIL PROTECTED]@mgedv.net
- Original Message - From: "Markus Bergkvist" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I borrowed a HUAWEI modem just to see how it is recognized. With umass enabled it is recognized as a CD. Disabling umass and it is found as ugen. From this thread http://marc.info/?l=openbsd-misc&m=118468178731619&w=2

Azalia driver locks up computer Sony SZ460N

2007-12-11 Thread Rob Lytle
Here is the dmesg. Note that I have #define AZALIA_DEBUG but there are no debug messages. OpenBSD 4.2-current (ROBKERN3) #0: Mon Dec 10 21:56:24 PST 2007 root@:/usr/src/sys/arch/i386/compile/ROBKERN3 cpu0: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 CPU T7200 @ 2.00GHz ("GenuineIntel" 686-class) 2.01 GHz cpu0: FPU,V

Re: Default Route Issues

2007-12-11 Thread Stuart Henderson
On 2007/12/11 08:40, Bret wrote: > OK here is the update: > ral0: flags=8843 mtu 1500 > ieee80211: nwid tri-statebroadband.com_2 chan 3 bssid > inet 10.60.128.2 netmask 0xc000 broadcast 10.60.191.255 > ral1: flags=8843 mtu 1500 > ieee80211: nwid tri-statebroadband.com_2_1 chan 1 b

Re: no 4.2-stable package updates??

2007-12-11 Thread Antoine Jacoutot
On Tue, 11 Dec 2007, Martin Schrvder wrote: > Get -stable ports fixed? Lack of interest/man power. -- Antoine

Re: Default Route Issues

2007-12-11 Thread Insan Praja SW
On Tue, 11 Dec 2007 22:40:06 +0700, Bret <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Greets OK here is the update: Internet I OpenBSD 4.2 (1) --- wired LAN I wireless card - 10.60.128.1 I I (the following is the problem box) I wireless card ral0 - 10.60.128.2 I OpenBSD 4.

Re: HUAWEI not recognized properly (3 modem)

2007-12-11 Thread Stuart Henderson

Re: Can I specify the bios time offset utc?

2007-12-11 Thread Nick Guenther
On Dec 11, 2007 12:58 AM, Dongsheng Song <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > 2007/12/11, Darren Spruell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > > On Dec 10, 2007 9:58 PM, Dongsheng Song <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > OpenBSD assume bios time is utc, but it's PRC, can I tell OpenBSD the > > > bios time zone? > > > >

Re: Can I specify the bios time offset utc?

2007-12-11 Thread Nick Guenther
On Dec 11, 2007 11:26 AM, Nick Guenther <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Dec 11, 2007 12:58 AM, Dongsheng Song <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > 2007/12/11, Darren Spruell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > > > > On Dec 10, 2007 9:58 PM, Dongsheng Song <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > OpenBSD assume bios t

Re: About non-free software in OpenBSD

2007-12-11 Thread Sebastian Raible
Hi, On Mon, Dec 10, 2007 at 11:43:35AM -0500, Nick Guenther wrote: > << their software application must ship the sources or a written notice > on where to get sources. Since web applications are applications, all > web applications and html pages that are powered by GNU scripts must > ship the so

aggregate-address in openbgpd

2007-12-11 Thread bitbucket
How I can aggregate small prefixes, received from internal peers into big one in openbgpd ? Like cisco's 'aggregate-address' feature. I've search in documentation and source code, but found nothing about prefix aggregation.

Re: : rouge IPs / user

2007-12-11 Thread Marti Martinez
Yep, synproxy in your answer for OpenBSD. For linux or freebsd, try enabling syn cookies. On Dec 11, 2007 5:43 AM, knitti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 12/11/07, Raimo Niskanen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I want to know if and what I can do (on the server side) about HTTP > > clients that put

HP LaserJet P2015 on OpenBSD -- BEWARE

2007-12-11 Thread Matthew Szudzik
I recently purchased an HP LaserJet P2015 printer, and I wanted to warn other users not to make the same mistake. The printer crashes intermittently while trying to print PostScript files with lpd. A little googling revealed that other users have also had problems with this model http://www.mac

Re: : rouge IPs / user

2007-12-11 Thread Daniel Ouellet
Raimo Niskanen wrote: On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 01:15:11AM +1300, Joel Wiramu Pauling wrote: Tip. Don't allow password challenge. Problem solved. Just use key'd ssh and this problem disappears. Bin there, done that. You answered the wrong question. I think you got the right answer many time

Re: About non-free software in OpenBSD

2007-12-11 Thread Marco Peereboom
wow how completely uninteresting. How about kicking the lawyers out and writing some code instead? I know its a weird concept. On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 05:24:24PM +0100, Sebastian Raible wrote: > Hi, > > > On Mon, Dec 10, 2007 at 11:43:35AM -0500, Nick Guenther wrote: > > << > their software ap

halt -p/reboot -> ddb (was Re: halt -p: Stopped at gettick+0xec: inb $0x40,%al)

2007-12-11 Thread Stuart Henderson
On 2007/12/10 17:32, Stuart Henderson wrote: > On 2007/12/10 17:06, Stuart Henderson wrote: > > I've got a ServerWorks-based Fujitsu-Siemens Xeon box. At 'halt -p' > > (with or without acpi) the following happens (no panic). > > Ugh. 'reboot', too. More info: with bsd.mp, reboot drops to ddb too,

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Daniel Ouellet
Peter N. M. Hansteen wrote: Using OpenBSD we build the systems we need, and they work a helluva lot better than most of the other stuff out there. OpenBSD is free and lets us create reliable, high performance, low maintenance networks and services, Stuff That Just Works. In fact it's so good it

Re: no 4.2-stable package updates??

2007-12-11 Thread Marcos Laufer
My opinion is that more money should be raised in order to keep -stable up to date. I think it's important to mantain a stable distribution, it's one of the things that give openbsd it's fame of being solid rock Marcos - Original Message - From: "Antoine Jacoutot" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To:

Re: aggregate-address in openbgpd

2007-12-11 Thread Claudio Jeker
On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 06:41:30PM +0300, bitbucket wrote: > How I can aggregate small prefixes, received from internal peers into > big one in openbgpd ? Like cisco's 'aggregate-address' feature. > I've search in documentation and source code, but found nothing about > prefix aggregation. > bgp

Re: : rouge IPs / user

2007-12-11 Thread Stuart Henderson
On 2007/12/11 09:40, Marti Martinez wrote: > Yep, synproxy in your answer for OpenBSD. For linux or freebsd, try > enabling syn cookies. synproxy works at the start of the connection, not the end. CLOSE_WAIT is the state where the network stack waits for the application (httpd) to close the conne

Re: Azalia driver locks up computer Sony SZ460N

2007-12-11 Thread Deanna Phillips
Rob Lytle writes: > Here is the dmesg. Note that I have #define AZALIA_DEBUG but there > are no debug messages. > > OpenBSD 4.2-current (ROBKERN3) #0: Mon Dec 10 21:56:24 PST 2007 > root@:/usr/src/sys/arch/i386/compile/ROBKERN3 Can you reproduce this (whatever it is) while running a snapsho

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread ropers
> > You've got a choice of: (...) > > 3/ dangerous political activist with a hidden agenda > Or > > 4) not up on the OpenBSD projects goals and current licensing requirements To quote Robert Steele (from memory): "Given a choice between incompetence and conspiracy, always go for incompetence, be

Re: BIND and the measure of system entropy (randomness?)

2007-12-11 Thread knitti
On 12/11/07, Andreas Maus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Wed, Dec 12, 2007 at 01:08:42AM +1100, mufurcz wrote: > > b) lines 34 and 35: `could not open entropy source /dev/arandom: file not > > found` and `using pre-chroot > > entropy source /dev/arandom` complaining about a missing > > /var/n

Re: : rouge IPs / user

2007-12-11 Thread knitti
On 12/11/07, Stuart Henderson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 2007/12/11 09:40, Marti Martinez wrote: > > Yep, synproxy in your answer for OpenBSD. For linux or freebsd, try > > enabling syn cookies. > > synproxy works at the start of the connection, not the end. > > CLOSE_WAIT is the state where t

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Ken Ismert
From my perspective as someone outside the BSD and GPL cultures, both camps seem to have many more similarities than differences. I see both Theo and Richard as principled iconoclasts, stubbornly creating and promoting software that meets their individual high standards, meeting and overcoming dif

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Darrin Chandler
On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 12:28:29PM -0600, Ken Ismert wrote: > It seems likely that no one license can preserve all possible > freedoms. In my view, both licenses have advantages the other > cannot possess. So I don't think reconciliation is required, or > even desirable (and, from a purely selfish

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Richard Stallman
Why don't you ask Theo, whom you once praised, about OpenBSD? Because he tends to be unfriendly.

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Richard Stallman
Um, OpenBSD is the only common OS that is actively against blobs. See http://www.openbsd.org/lyrics.html#39 We're on the same side here. That is good. (gNewSense and Ututo are also against blobs.) Sir, it was brought up that the [GNU/]linux distributions you do suggest do oft

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Richard Stallman
OpenBSD is by far the most free OS in the landscape. Everything that ships with it is free or else it won't be distributed with it. Yes, that's what I was told. I was also told that OpenBSD's ports system includes non-free programs. Is that accurate too? There is not a single

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Richard Stallman
Is the list at: http://www.gnu.org/links/links.html#FreeGNULinuxDistributions the list of operating systems that meet your criteria? It appears that gNewSense includes LAME in binary format, and BLAG "recommends" it at https://wiki.blagblagblag.org/Lame in much the same way O

Re: : rouge IPs / user

2007-12-11 Thread Daniel Ouellet
knitti wrote: On 12/11/07, Stuart Henderson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 2007/12/11 09:40, Marti Martinez wrote: Yep, synproxy in your answer for OpenBSD. For linux or freebsd, try enabling syn cookies. synproxy works at the start of the connection, not the end. CLOSE_WAIT is the state where

setxkbmap kills X

2007-12-11 Thread Pau Amaro-Seoane
Hi, as you can read in the subject, running e.g. setxkbmap us will kill X totally. I don't see any core dumped or similar. What can be the problem? Here you are my dmesg (an "zzz" froze the laptop and I had to power it off) and xorg.conf But X crashed also when not using an xorg.conf (i.e., ru

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Tom Van Looy
Hi About the ports tree, maybe you are right and OpenBSD should go kick out the possibly 50 ports that you have a problem with. Now, about BSD/GPL that's an other story. But that doesn't mean we can't learn from each other and help each other. I hope it has to do Richards efforts on the GNU

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Marcus Andree
Sir, please check my inline comments. On 12/11/07, Richard Stallman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >Is the list at: >http://www.gnu.org/links/links.html#FreeGNULinuxDistributions >the list of operating systems that meet your criteria? It appears that >gNewSense includes LAME in binary

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Lars Noodén
Richard Stallman wrote: >... > On the other hand, if a distro's policies say something is allowed, > then it isn't a mistake, and I can't expect it to be fixed. That's > what gives me stronger concern. The presence of non-free programs > in the OpenBSD ports system is not a mistake, it's intentio

Re: no 4.2-stable package updates??

2007-12-11 Thread Jason LaRiviere
Marcos Laufer wrote: > My opinion is that more money should be raised in order to > keep -stable up to date. > I think it's important to mantain a stable distribution, it's one > of the things that give openbsd it's fame of being solid rock > > Marcos Seriously? More money? Like enough to woo som

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Josh Grosse
I have been reading this debate with interest, and am confused on one key point. RMS wrote: > Ututo and gNewSense have the policy not to include non-free programs, > not even in a ports system. According to http://www.gnewsense.org/Main/Features, "Universe enabled by default" Does selectin

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Iñigo Tejedor Arrondo
El mar, 11-12-2007 a las 14:00 -0500, Richard Stallman escribiC3: > My main basis for judging any distro is the policies it has adopted. So a distro that comes (de-binaryzed) from ubuntu, that comes from debian that any of them allow you to install a (nvidia) blob or any of the non-free ports of

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Daniel Ouellet
Richard Stallman wrote: OpenBSD is by far the most free OS in the landscape. Everything that ships with it is free or else it won't be distributed with it. Yes, that's what I was told. I was also told that OpenBSD's ports system includes non-free programs. Is that accurate too?

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread mcb, inc.
Watching the latest flame war, I can't help thinking that as founders of their respective projects Theo and RMS are trapped in a jail of rigid consistency and absolutism demanded by children and utopians. Only at home, with the door locked, are they free to boot their home's sole computer, a Wind

Re: aggregate-address in openbgpd

2007-12-11 Thread bitbucket
11.12.07, 20:43, Claudio Jeker ([EMAIL PROTECTED]): > On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 06:41:30PM +0300, bitbucket wrote: > > How I can aggregate small prefixes, received from internal peers into > > big one in openbgpd ? Like cisco's 'aggregate-address' feature. > > I've search in documentation and s

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Karsten McMinn
On Dec 11, 2007 11:00 AM, Richard Stallman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > My main basis for judging any distro is the policies it has adopted. > > Everyone makes mistakes, and well-intentioned people fix their > mistakes. So if someone finds a non-free program in gNewSense, or in > OpenBSD, in vio

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Johan SANCHEZ
Hi all, > OpenBSD "refuses to accept it's users being forced into depending on > vendor binaries" and pushes people to "send a message that open support > for hardware matters". Unix is becoming mainstream again. You should all > work together at educating new people. http://www.fsf.org/news/f

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Jack J. Woehr
mcb, inc. wrote: Watching the latest flame war, I can't help thinking that as founders of their respective projects Theo and RMS are trapped in a jail of rigid consistency and absolutism demanded by children and utopians. Well, yes and no. Theo's absolutism has kept OpenBSD pretty much the last

Re: aggregate-address in openbgpd

2007-12-11 Thread Claudio Jeker
On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 10:44:38PM +0300, bitbucket wrote: > 11.12.07, 20:43, Claudio Jeker ([EMAIL PROTECTED]): > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 06:41:30PM +0300, bitbucket wrote: > > > How I can aggregate small prefixes, received from internal peers into > > > big one in openbgpd ? Like cisco's 'ag

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Ken Ismert
Darrin Chandler wrote: > There seems to be a subtext in your message that one license is more > free than the other, and that the more free license is the GPL. This is > not true. I like both licenses and use software under both licenses. For software I write, I can easily see scenarios where I w

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Nick Guenther
On Dec 11, 2007 2:55 PM, Josh Grosse <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I have been reading this debate with interest, and am confused on one key > point. > > RMS wrote: > > > Ututo and gNewSense have the policy not to include non-free programs, > > not even in a ports system. > > According to http://www

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Darrin Chandler
On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 02:41:27PM -0600, Ken Ismert wrote: > Darrin Chandler wrote: > > > Offering something to someone as "free" with one hand, while taking back > > rights with the other is not free. BSD/MIT/ISC licenses retain a very > > minimal set of rights to the original author(s), and giv

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread William Boshuck
On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 02:00:14PM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: > OpenBSD is by far the most free OS in the landscape. Everything that > ships with it is free or else it won't be distributed with it. > > Yes, that's what I was told. I was also told that OpenBSD's ports > system include

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Nick Guenther
On Dec 11, 2007 3:21 PM, Karsten McMinn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Dec 11, 2007 11:00 AM, Richard Stallman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > My main basis for judging any distro is the policies it has adopted. > > > > Everyone makes mistakes, and well-intentioned people fix their > > mistakes

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread RedShift
Richard Stallman wrote: It looks like some people are having a discussion in which they construct views they would find outrageous, attribute them to me, and then try to blame me for them. For such purposes, knowledge of my actual views might be superfluous, even inconvenient. However, if anyon

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Jason Beaudoin
On Dec 11, 2007 2:00 PM, Richard Stallman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > OpenBSD is by far the most free OS in the landscape. Everything that > ships with it is free or else it won't be distributed with it. > > Yes, that's what I was told. I was also told that OpenBSD's ports > system inclu

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread STeve Andre'
On Tuesday 11 December 2007 14:00:43 Richard Stallman wrote: > Why don't you ask Theo, whom you once praised, about OpenBSD? > > Because he tends to be unfriendly. Now *that* I find humorous. I find it Kafka-esque, your inability to reccomend OpenBSD because of some "unfree" items in the port

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Theo de Raadt
> On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 02:00:14PM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: > > OpenBSD is by far the most free OS in the landscape. Everything that > > ships with it is free or else it won't be distributed with it. > > > > Yes, that's what I was told. I was also told that OpenBSD's ports > > sy

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Ryan Corder
I'm a very happy user of both OpenBSD and GNU/Linux systems, but what I don't get is, how is limiting a users choice in what he/she runs on his/her system more free than one that doesn't? Absolute freedom is to be able to do whatever the hell you want to with no limitations placed on you whatsoev

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Ken Ismert
Darrin Chandler wrote: > ... BSD/MIT/ISC licenses are more Free than GPL. There's nothing > to debate about that. It's just the way things are ... I don't doubt your claims one iota. But in saying that, don't believe you have convinced me that the other side somehow has less valid claims. And ye

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread RedShift
Richard Stallman wrote: OpenBSD is by far the most free OS in the landscape. Everything that ships with it is free or else it won't be distributed with it. Yes, that's what I was told. I was also told that OpenBSD's ports system includes non-free programs. Is that accurate too?

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Steve Shockley
Richard Stallman wrote: ISTR LAME is free software, but I will double-check. The source code of LAME is licensed under the LGPL; however, the mp3 format itself is patented and restricted. Further reading: http://www.mp3-tech.org/patents.html http://www.mp3licensing.com/help/developers.html

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Steve Shockley
Richard Stallman wrote: Why don't you ask Theo, whom you once praised, about OpenBSD? Because he tends to be unfriendly. Interestingly enough, if you specified that as the reason you recommend against using OpenBSD, this thread would have been a lot shorter. Somehow I think Theo is more

Re: HUAWEI not recognized properly (3 modem)

2007-12-11 Thread ttw+bsd
On 11.12-16:11, Stuart Henderson wrote: > On 2007/12/11 16:13, Markus Bergkvist wrote: > > I borrowed a HUAWEI modem just to see how it is recognized. > > With umass enabled it is recognized as a CD. Disabling umass and it is > > found as ugen. > > From this thread http://marc.info/?l=openbsd-misc

Re: : rouge IPs / user

2007-12-11 Thread knitti
On 12/11/07, Daniel Ouellet <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: [... snipped away a lot ...] > There is a lots that can be done, however, when you reach this level, an > answer doesn't fit all and is really dependent on your setup. > > Hope this help answering your question. It's not me having the problem,

Re: setxkbmap kills X

2007-12-11 Thread Louis V. Lambrecht
Try this ln -s /etc/X11/xkb /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/xkb Pau Amaro-Seoane wrote: Hi, as you can read in the subject, running e.g. setxkbmap us will kill X totally. I don't see any core dumped or similar. What can be the problem? Here you are my dmesg (an "zzz" froze the laptop and I had to power

Re: : rouge IPs / user

2007-12-11 Thread Daniel Ouellet
knitti wrote: On 12/11/07, Daniel Ouellet <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: [... snipped away a lot ...] There is a lots that can be done, however, when you reach this level, an answer doesn't fit all and is really dependent on your setup. Hope this help answering your question. It's not me having t

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Jacob Meuser
On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 01:49:19PM -0700, Jack J. Woehr wrote: > mcb, inc. wrote: > >Watching the latest flame war, I can't help thinking that as > >founders of their respective projects Theo and RMS are trapped > >in a jail of rigid consistency and absolutism demanded by > >children and utopians.

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Richard Stallman
> I think it would be wrong for me to recommend it to others. Therefore, > if a collection of software contains (or suggests installation of) > some non-free program, I do not recommend it. The systems I recommend > are therefore those that do not contain (or suggest installation

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Rui Miguel Silva Seabra
On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 04:49:34PM -0500, STeve Andre' wrote: > On Tuesday 11 December 2007 14:00:43 Richard Stallman wrote: > > Why don't you ask Theo, whom you once praised, about OpenBSD? > > > > Because he tends to be unfriendly. > > Now *that* I find humorous. > > I find it Kafka-esque,

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Jack J. Woehr
Jacob Meuser wrote: his absolutism also causes people to see BSD as a "problem", a "social failure". In everything, there is light and dark, interwoven :-) recently we saw theft of BSD to GPL, and a large part of the GPL community thinks there's no problem with that, that the BSD community i

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread ropers
> > On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 02:00:14PM -0500, Richard Stallman wrote: > > > OpenBSD is by far the most free OS in the landscape. Everything that > > > ships with it is free or else it won't be distributed with it. > > > > > > Yes, that's what I was told. I was also told that OpenBSD's por

Re: Real men don't attack straw men

2007-12-11 Thread Jason Dixon
On Dec 11, 2007, at 6:56 PM, Richard Stallman wrote: Including a program by name in the ports system does suggest using that program. It grants the program a sort of legitimacy, and that is what I am opposed to. Where is your line in the sand? When does an operating system become free by

Re: : rouge IPs / user

2007-12-11 Thread knitti
On 12/12/07, Daniel Ouellet <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > knitti wrote: > > HTTP keep alives have nothing to do with it. If the socket is in > > CLOSE_WAIT, the TCP connection can't be reused, the server > > has sent its FIN and the client its FIN/ACK, but the server doesn't > > have yet sent its fi

Re: : rouge IPs / user

2007-12-11 Thread Daniel Ouellet
knitti wrote: you tell me that there is some correlation between HTTP keep alives and a socket ending up in CLOSE_WAIT for some time. That is the practical observation. But I'm interested in whether this is by design or not. RFC 2616 doesn't mention implementation details, and I can't see why the

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