Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

> On May 19, 2017, at 3:39 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer > wrote: > > I would suggest another wording for this, as courier service ships could be > misread as ship e.g.: https://www.iereexpress.com/images/banner16.jpg Accepts_items / item_pickup?

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

sent from a phone > On 18. May 2017, at 23:46, John Willis wrote: > > Courier:service:ships=yes/no I would suggest another wording for this, as courier service ships could be misread as ship e.g.: https://www.iereexpress.com/images/banner16.jpg cheers, Martin

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Javbw > On May 19, 2017, at 12:36 AM, Tobias Wrede wrote: > > If they have a package window I would definitely tag that with shop=courier, > but not the whole warehouse. This is why I wanted to add Courier:service:ships=yes/no Courier:service:pickup=yes/no To the

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On Thu, May 18, 2017 at 11:36 AM, Tobias Wrede wrote: > In that respect UPS is not any different from a supermarket or a dry > cleaner. You go to the shop=supermarket or shop=dry clener but not Tesco's > warehouse or the central dry cleaning facility. Exactly. This is what

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

>IMHO The problem at hand is how does a regular OSM user find a courier. At least for me I need a courier less often than a supermarket but significantly more often than a pharmacy. So from my viewpoint we should really focus on the shop aspect for now. Thinks the same Kelvin

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Am 16.05.2017 um 23:42 schrieb John Willis: On May 16, 2017, at 4:29 PM, Tobias Wrede wrote: May I suggest to focus the proposal on the frontend for now? The front end is the most difficult part, and having a proposal that covers the chain and many permutations is

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Javbw > On May 16, 2017, at 4:29 PM, Tobias Wrede wrote: > > May I suggest to focus the proposal on the frontend for now? The front end is the most difficult part, and having a proposal that covers the chain and many permutations is important. For example, I would

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

> I would use amenity=courier for this, maybe a subtag which says something about scope (local, regional, national, international) and about kind of shipped goods (parcel, letters/documents, medicine, etc.). The scope of area of service will be a very helpful subtag, may be we could decide one

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Am 16.05.2017 um 12:20 schrieb Warin: On 16-May-17 06:01 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: The tag in the first proposal wasn't chosen badly, it was insufficiently defined. Office is not a good tag for the public facing frontend with counters etc. I disagree. Shops frequently have counters

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On 16-May-17 06:01 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: sent from a phone On 16. May 2017, at 09:29, Tobias Wrede wrote: May I suggest to focus the proposal on the frontend for now? Let's find a proper tagging for the place a customer goes to drop of his parcel, mail his

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Am 16.05.2017 um 10:27 schrieb Marc Gemis: On Tue, May 16, 2017 at 10:01 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: For shops that offer courier services as a minor part / not primarily, it should be a property for the shop, maybe with the carrier in the key, e.g. amenity=fuel,

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On Tue, May 16, 2017 at 10:01 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: > For shops that offer courier services as a minor part / not primarily, it > should be a property for the shop, maybe with the carrier in the key, e.g. > amenity=fuel, courier:UPS=yes? Maybe it's a silly

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On 15/5/17 22:36, Tobias Wrede wrote: The bigger concerns focused indeed around how to reasonably differentiate and use a=post_office and a/o=courier, especially in worlds where there is no clear differentiation (any more). I wouldn't have thought that this would be too hard to do. The

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

sent from a phone > On 16. May 2017, at 02:10, John Willis wrote: > > Courier:handles:automobiles=yes I would use a different main tag for shipping trade and couriers. There's a lot of shipping going on via cargo trains, ships (container, tanker, etc.), air freight and

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

sent from a phone > On 16. May 2017, at 09:29, Tobias Wrede wrote: > > May I suggest to focus the proposal on the frontend for now? Let's find a > proper tagging for the place a customer goes to drop of his parcel, mail his > letter, buy his stamp, collect his poste

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Javbw > On May 15, 2017, at 10:28 PM, Tobias Wrede wrote: > > What you write makes a lot of sense. Just, that a lot of that exactly applies > to post offices/postal services as well. So why should post_office be an > amenity and courier a shop? I still suggest to

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

sent from a phone > On 15. May 2017, at 18:51, Kevin Kenny wrote: > > The default resolution to many tagging questions appears to be that the > mapper eventually gives up. you can always add a tag like amenity=courier + name and/or operator=foo and be done.

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On Mon, May 15, 2017 at 11:34 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer < dieterdre...@gmail.com> wrote: > It is correct that "perfect is the enemy of the good", but if you don't > even try to make it good, it will very likely be bad ;-) > I don't often see that happen in the 'tagging' mailing list. But I've seen

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

2017-05-15 16:49 GMT+02:00 Kevin Kenny : > It may be a difficult idea for a German - I understand that you really > don't have courier offices over there separate from Bundespost since DHL > was nationalized - but in the US, we have a common type of shop, with names >

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On Mon, May 15, 2017 at 10:12 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer < dieterdre...@gmail.com> wrote: > +1, these cases should all be addressed and differentiated. Additionally > it could be needed to separately address letters and parcels. The proposals > I have seen so far didn't solve this in any way, they

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

sent from a phone > On 15. May 2017, at 14:46, John Willis wrote: > > > "Tag" level - a business that does something else ( a convenience store, a > strawberry farm, a department store) that offers courier service in some > manner. Be it local delivery or international

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Am 15.05.2017 um 14:59 schrieb John Willis: My email accidentally got sent before I was finished, but I think you see where I am going. What you write makes a lot of sense. Just, that a lot of that exactly applies to post offices/postal services as well. So why should post_office be an

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

My email accidentally got sent before I was finished, but I think you see where I am going. Shop=courier for a box shop or other retail outlet that "sells" shipping is a great place to start. The rest is such a big mess of combinations or it is mapping the commercial facilities that the

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

The fact that office=courier doesn't attempt to replace post office seems a step in the right direction. So let's think of a massive courier - linked a regional or national one. This combination will vary, but: "Tag" level - a business that does something else ( a convenience store, a

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Hi, Am 15.05.2017 um 12:45 schrieb muzirian: I think I tried to address suggestions made.Are you suggesting to scrap the proposal and use post office instead? Regards Well, when reading through the comments of the no voters (and the comments here in the thread) I believe that it was only a

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

I think I tried to address suggestions made.Are you suggesting to scrap the proposal and use post office instead? Regards On Monday, May 15, 2017, Tobias Wrede wrote: > Hi Kelvin, > > I still don't see how this proposal addresses any of the many concerns > brought

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Hi Kelvin, I still don't see how this proposal addresses any of the many concerns brought forward in the previous amenity=courier voting or this thread. Just changing amenity to office doesn't make the whole post-office/courier tagging any better (quite the opposite in my opinion). Tobi

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Is it okay to push this to voting again? Regards On Wed, Apr 26, 2017 at 2:08 PM, John Willis wrote: > > On Apr 25, 2017, at 8:46 PM, Tobias Wrede wrote: > > Am 25.04.2017 um 11:21 schrieb John Willis: > > If I search for a supermarket and you send me to

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

> On Apr 25, 2017, at 8:46 PM, Tobias Wrede wrote: > > Am 25.04.2017 um 11:21 schrieb John Willis: >> If I search for a supermarket and you send me to a 7-11, you failed. > > I partly agree but when I tag Walmart or Trader Joe's as a supermarket's > brand that carries

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Am 25.04.2017 um 11:21 schrieb John Willis: If I search for a supermarket and you send me to a 7-11, you failed. Post offices have different scopes in different places, ways we usually separate by tag, because we separate "duckiness" by tag. This varies by region, so we need a way to

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Am 25.04.2017 um 10:29 schrieb Marc Gemis: On Tue, Apr 25, 2017 at 9:17 AM, Tobias Wrede wrote: With this proposal how would I tag an amenity that sells stamps, offers registered mail, receives parcels but does not accept commercial mass mail and does not offer banking

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On Tue, Apr 25, 2017 at 9:17 AM, Tobias Wrede wrote: > With this proposal how would I tag an amenity that sells stamps, offers > registered mail, receives parcels but does not accept commercial mass mail > and does not offer banking services? It's not a "traditional post

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

sent from a phone > On 25. Apr 2017, at 05:13, Marc Gemis wrote: > > I still believe that for the feature at hand it is enough to have > amenity=courier, just so we can distinguish it from the traditional > postal_office. I also believe we should have a tagging scheme

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Am 25.04.2017 um 05:13 schrieb Marc Gemis: I still believe that for the feature at hand it is enough to have amenity=courier, just so we can distinguish it from the traditional postal_office. Do we need subtags for courier yet ? I do not think so. We are mapping supermarkets/convenience stores

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Thanks Marc Gemis, I would also suggest the same.But I just don't wish this to be rejected because it isn't included. Cheers ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

I still believe that for the feature at hand it is enough to have amenity=courier, just so we can distinguish it from the traditional postal_office. Do we need subtags for courier yet ? I do not think so. We are mapping supermarkets/convenience stores which offer different products/services for

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Javbw > On Apr 24, 2017, at 11:50 PM, Tobias Wrede wrote: > > In my area in Germany only the big main "Deutsche Post" offices of a city > have survived. This is true in the US - I have maybe 3 post offices I can think of in 4-5 KM of my old house in San Diego. I

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

> there are even more different kinds of businesses, e.g. in big cities there are often courier services that only operate locally, with cars, bicycles or light motorcycles. It is not clear which kind of courier is addressed with the current proposal and I would also expect the suggestion of

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

sent from a phone > On 24. Apr 2017, at 16:50, Tobias Wrede wrote: > > So, disapproving of amenity/office=courier does not mean I ignore other > countries' traditions and tagging needs. I disapprove because this pair of > post_office and courier would polarize the

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Am 16.04.2017 um 17:30 schrieb muzirian: >And (speaking as an American), if someone asked me to direct them to a post office, unless they were obviously about to send a parcel, I wouldn't send them to FedEx or the local copy shop (most of which offer shipping services, and some of which also

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Am 15.04.2017 um 20:04 schrieb Marc Gemis: As I wrote before, it is not because something does not exists in one country, that one has to vote against a proposal. One has to try to understand that different countries with different traditions and tagging needs. Exactly, but these proposals do

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

>And (speaking as an American), if someone asked me to direct them to a post office, unless they were obviously about to send a parcel, I wouldn't send them to FedEx or the local copy shop (most of which offer shipping services, and some of which also offer a mailbox service). Thanks for

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On 04/16/2017 06:01 AM, Paul Johnson wrote: On Sun, Apr 16, 2017 at 4:54 AM, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com > wrote: My impression is that worldwide the branding of 'Post Office' implies a government run service with international links to other 'Post

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On Sun, Apr 16, 2017 at 9:08 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: >> I doubt people will go to DHL/UPS/... to send their Christmas cards. > > > why? Maybe those mentioned offer only parcel shipping but there are also > private letter mail operators in some places I cannot find

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On Sun, Apr 16, 2017 at 4:54 AM, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote: > > My impression is that worldwide the branding of 'Post Office' implies a > government run service with international links to other 'Post Offices'. > A 'posted' item would be through the 'Post Office' no mater the sending or

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On 16-Apr-17 05:34 PM, Paul Johnson wrote: On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 10:04 AM, Marc Gemis > wrote: On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 2:14 PM, Paul Johnson > wrote: > How is it not a post

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

> I would expect from the proposal to define which places are to get the tag: Made them clear on proposal. On Sun, Apr 16, 2017 at 1:11 PM, Paul Johnson wrote: > > On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 1:04 PM, Marc Gemis wrote: > >> I doubt people will go to

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 1:04 PM, Marc Gemis wrote: > I doubt people will go to DHL/UPS/... to send their Christmas cards. Not to sound contrarian, but why not? When I was homeless, my "permanent address" was a rental box at a UPS Store by where I went to high school.

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 10:04 AM, Marc Gemis wrote: > On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 2:14 PM, Paul Johnson wrote: > > How is it not a post office that just happens to have an operator other > than > > the state? > > So if I ask you "where is the nearest post

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

sent from a phone > On 15. Apr 2017, at 20:04, Marc Gemis wrote: > > We have different words for the two concepts in many languages, so why > can't we use those two words in mapping/tagging ? is it really 2 different concepts and not maybe more? Ciao, Martin

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

sent from a phone > On 15. Apr 2017, at 20:04, Marc Gemis wrote: > > In Belgium you can e.g buy tax stamps in a post office, and not in a > courier office. this could change any time though. In Italy you can buy tax stamps at tobacco shops. > I doubt people will go

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 7:25 PM, Thilo Haug OSM wrote: > In Germany this is the same : > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutsche_Post As I wrote before, it is not because something does not exists in one country, that one has to vote against a proposal. One has to try to understand

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

If made simple, Deutsche Post is the brand name for postal serives and DHL is the name for logistics/courier services from what I understand from the wiki. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Deutsche Post DHL Group still has different divisions. check https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutsche_Post#Post.2C_ecommerce.2C_Parcel_division and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutsche_Post_(brand). I think they should come under post office tag. While DHL Express can be counted as courier

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

In Germany this is the same : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutsche_Post Am 15.04.2017 um 17:04 schrieb Marc Gemis: > On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 2:14 PM, Paul Johnson wrote: >> How is it not a post office that just happens to have an operator other than >> the state? > So if

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 2:14 PM, Paul Johnson wrote: > How is it not a post office that just happens to have an operator other than > the state? So if I ask you "where is the nearest post office?" , it is possible that you send me to a DHL office ? m

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

This has been addressed several times on the list for the previous proposal as well as on the main page and discuss page of previous proposal.And this same thing is mentioned on the last few mails of the main thread for this rfc,if you are following. I hope you are following,If not please check

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 7:00 AM, muzirian wrote: > I have been trying to address all the suggestions mentioned on the other > problem, if you feel I missed something.Please feel to talk about it.It > will help greatly if you can explain it in bit more detail or mention it on

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Also looks like you have started another thread on the topic. On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 5:30 PM, muzirian wrote: > I have been trying to address all the suggestions mentioned on the other > problem, if you feel I missed something.Please feel to talk about it.It > will help

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

I have been trying to address all the suggestions mentioned on the other problem, if you feel I missed something.Please feel to talk about it.It will help greatly if you can explain it in bit more detail or mention it on the talk page. Regards Kelvin On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 2:42 PM, Paul Johnson

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)

>Would you clarify how to use "courier:brand=yes/office/subsidiary"? It was taken from a a suggestion on the other previos proposal, i will add more info on that. Kelvin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org

Re: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

Looks like bike-shedding the previous proposal without addressing the root problem. On Thu, Apr 13, 2017 at 11:48 AM, muzirian wrote: > The proposal for amenity=courier was rejected, so going on with another > suggestion office=courier. > >

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)

On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 3:02 AM, John Willis wrote: > I'm surprised people can't see the separation (or understand it might be > different in other countries), similar to how police and fire services are > different from a armored truck service or a home security company. Yes,

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)

Javbw > On Apr 15, 2017, at 7:48 AM, muzirian wrote: > > But still many vote against just because they think post office tag is enough > for this I'm surprised people can't see the separation (or understand it might be different in other countries), similar to how

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)

To muzirian, Would you clarify how to use "courier:brand=yes/office/subsidiary"? muramoto 2017-04-15 8:19 GMT+09:00 muzirian : > edit: so I don't know if it will be approved even after that. > > Kelvin > > ___ > Tagging mailing

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)

edit: so I don't know if it will be approved even after that. Kelvin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)

edit: so I don't know if it will approved even after that. Kelvin On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 4:18 AM, muzirian wrote: > This page is mostly copied from the other one :P > If you guys can help with definitions or suggest additions to be made, may > be we could revote the other

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)

This page is mostly copied from the other one :P If you guys can help with definitions or suggest additions to be made, may be we could revote the other one (or just improve this). But still many vote against just because they think post office tag is enough for this, so do know if it will

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)

sent from a phone > On 14. Apr 2017, at 16:17, Mark Bradley wrote: > > Personally I am disappointed this proposal was rejected. I read the section > of the wiki that talks about offices, and I think amenity fits a courier > business better. I agree,

[Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)

> Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2017 22:18:40 +0530 > From: muzirian <muzir...@gmail.com> > To: "Tag discussion, strategy and related tools" > <tagging@openstreetmap.org> > Subject: [Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)" > > Th

[Tagging] "Feature Proposal - RFC - (office=courier)"

The proposal for amenity=courier was rejected, so going on with another suggestion office=courier. https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Office%3Dcourier Regards Kelvin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org