Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto design

On Friday 29 June 2018, Daniel Koc4� wrote: > > All in all this is a good example for OSM-Carto being at a > > crossroads (and having been for quite some time) between staying > > avant-garde and pushing the boundaries of cartographic design and > > technology or being satisfied with shuffling the

Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto design

Hi, without going into the finer details, I'd like to offer an outsider's view of OSM Carto development. When Andy first created OSM Carto, he set out a road map that has long been superseded but thanks to version control we can still look at it: https://github.com/gravitystorm/openstreetmap-

Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto design

So what is intended to replace CartoCSS? Vector tiles? On Fri, Jun 29, 2018, 5:42 AM Frederik Ramm, wrote: > Hi, > >without going into the finer details, I'd like to offer an outsider's > view of OSM Carto development. > > When Andy first created OSM Carto, he set out a road map that has lon

Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto design

I've been involved in OpenStreetMap Carto less and less, partially because I work with CartoCSS setups enough for work. On 2018-06-29 2:06 AM, Christoph Hormann wrote: And you are wrong that "nobody seems to be even noticing" complexity of the roads code. At least Lucas, Paul and me have a ve

[OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

New Wikimedia Foundation blog post: https://blog.wikimedia.org/2018/06/28/interactive-maps-now-in-your-language/ -- Andy Mabbett @pigsonthewing http://pigsonthewing.org.uk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

"Add the missing names to OSM in your language." That is inflating the OSM database with something that Wikidata has solved already in a much better way. Why would someone from wikimedia recommend to create a less mentainable version of their database? On 29.06.2018 12:18, Andy Mabbett wrot

Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto design

Rendering (unpaved) surface is a real need. Judging from the map notes users don't get the distinction and conflate track symbol with unpaved. Mappers do it too. In Poland (and maybe somewhere else) wrongly tagged tracks (what should be residential+unpaved) are a big problem, almost intractable in

Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto design

On 2018-06-29 2:48 AM, James wrote: So what is intended to replace CartoCSS? Vector tiles? CartoCSS is a styling language, vector tiles is an architecture choice. You can use CartoCSS with vector tiles, as the Cycle Map and Transport Map layers on osm.org do, or you can use CartoCSS with just

Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto design

But they say CartoCSS is dead, what is the intended replacement(if it's dead it's because there's a newer better thing?)? just a data structure that contains data/styling? On Fri, Jun 29, 2018, 6:49 AM Paul Norman, wrote: > On 2018-06-29 2:48 AM, James wrote: > > So what is intended to replace C

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

Not only that. It confuses "translations" with "names commonly in use for the place in your language" we only want the later in OSM. If the WMF wants the former in WD that is their call (the rather small place (3'000 pop)I live in has name entries in 30 languages, even though there are at most 2 n

Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto design

On Friday 29 June 2018, Paul Norman wrote: > > I had a go at fixing the roads code with > https://github.com/gravitystorm/openstreetmap-carto/pull/2869, but > didn't have free time. Based on that work, I'd estimate that the > roads code is twice the size and complexity of what it needs to be. > > W

[OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto release v4.12.1

Dear all, Today, v4.12.1 of the OpenStreetMap Carto stylesheet (the default stylesheet on the OSM website) has been released. Once changes are deployed on the openstreetmap.org it will take couple of days before all tiles show the new rendering. The sole change is dropping rendering of the surfa

Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto design

W dniu 29.06.2018 o 11:39, Frederik Ramm pisze: > Hi, > >without going into the finer details, I'd like to offer an outsider's > view of OSM Carto development. Thanks, Frederik! I lack such insights (we know our ideas inside the team quite well), so I appreciate your comments a lot. I would b

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

On 29 June 2018 at 11:38, Max wrote: > "Add the missing names to OSM in your language." > > That is inflating the OSM database with something that Wikidata has solved > already in a much better way. Why would someone from wikimedia recommend to > create a less mentainable version of their databas

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

On 29 June 2018 at 11:57, Simon Poole wrote: >> On 29.06.2018 12:18, Andy Mabbett wrote: >>> New Wikimedia Foundation blog post: >>> >>> >>> https://blog.wikimedia.org/2018/06/28/interactive-maps-now-in-your-language/ > they should not be calling for their users to vandalize OSM. Nor are they.

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

Am 29.06.2018 um 13:21 schrieb Andy Mabbett: > ... > Nor are they. > > I expected some negativity in response to this remarkable good news; > but this hyperbolic response is beyond acceptable. So you are denying that they are asking their users to add names to OSM so that their application looks

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

On Friday 29 June 2018, Andy Mabbett wrote: > New Wikimedia Foundation blog post: > > > https://blog.wikimedia.org/2018/06/28/interactive-maps-now-in-your-la >nguage/ In the past i have been only slightly annoyed by Wikimedia people failing to understand or to accept the idea behind OpenStreet

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

Hi, On 29.06.2018 13:44, Simon Poole wrote (quoting Wikimedia): > Add the missing names to OSM in your language. I think that this simply means we need much better name QA in the future, and must not be afraid to remove names that don't belong there. Until now we've practically let every language

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

Il giorno ven 29 giu 2018 alle ore 13:48 Simon Poole ha scritto: > Am 29.06.2018 um 13:21 schrieb Andy Mabbett: > > ... > > Nor are they. > > I expected some negativity in response to this remarkable good news; > but this hyperbolic response is beyond acceptable. > > So you are denying that they

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

On 2018-06-29 3:38 AM, Max wrote: That is inflating the OSM database with something that Wikidata has solved already in a much better way. Why would someone from wikimedia recommend to create a less mentainable version of their database? Wikidata has 412978 "thoroughfare" items. OSM has 121

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

On 29 June 2018 at 12:44, Simon Poole wrote: >>> they should not be calling for their users to vandalize OSM. >> Nor are they. >> I expected some negativity in response to this remarkable good news; >> but this hyperbolic response is beyond acceptable. > > So you are denying that they are askin

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

Ha! I was going to cite that as an example. I recently removed precisely that absurd tag in Paris. On Fri, Jun 29, 2018, 14:06 Frederik Ramm wrote: > Hi, > > On 29.06.2018 13:44, Simon Poole wrote (quoting Wikimedia): > > Add the missing names to OSM in your language. > > I think that this simpl

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

W dniu 29.06.2018 o 14:03, Christoph Hormann pisze: > * adding non-verifiable name translations (verifiability being > understood according to OSM principles, not those of Wikipedia) to OSM With translations "on the ground rule" is not working in most of the cases. There are different sources,

Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto design

W dniu 29.06.2018 o 13:02, Christoph Hormann pisze: > But the surface rendering from Lucas is something you could fairly well > re-integrate into a reworked road rendering framework afterwards - and > this is probably also the way i would approach it. > How to implement something like that in a

Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto design

W dniu 29.06.2018 o 12:57, James pisze: > But they say CartoCSS is dead, what is the intended replacement(if > it's dead it's because there's a newer better thing?)? just a data > structure that contains data/styling? Being "dead" means it's no longer in development, but it's still perfectly usabl

[OSM-talk] en.osm.town: Announcing a new Mastodon instance for OSM (en)

Hi all, I've set up a Mastodon instance for OSM (english speaking)! https://en.osm.town/ Mastodon is an open source, federated micro-blogging system, with more than a million users. Basically open source twitter, spread across many servers. This is a new instance/server focused on OpenS

Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto design

W dniu 29.06.2018 o 11:06, Christoph Hormann pisze: > I did not make any assumptions on avant-garde being a positive thing > here. In fact for a long time i have clearly said that i think that > OSM map design should become more pluralistic. It is now and it does not go away, so I still see n

[OSM-talk] About OSM social implications and what can/should be displayed on the map (or not)

Dear all, After participating in this openstreetmap-carto issue discussing to create an icon for casinos in which I stated that they should not be highlighted with an icon due to their grave consequences derived from gambling addict

Re: [OSM-talk] About OSM social implications and what can/should be displayed on the map (or not)

Do keep in mind that none of the maintainers opposed (as far as I can see). The comments are essentially from random people who may or may not be closely involved in the project. Michał pt., 29 cze 2018, 17:30 użytkownik Carlos Cámara napisał: > Dear all, > > After participating in this openstr

Re: [OSM-talk] About OSM social implications and what can/should be displayed on the map (or not)

Not showing things on map to me is a form of censorship. I.E if a study finds that the sight of trees triggers suicide by hanging do we start removing all tree icons? This sets a precedent to what can and can't be displayed on map. There are some disputed boarders that are displayed differently in

Re: [OSM-talk] About OSM social implications and what can/should be displayed on the map (or not)

Carlos Cámara wrote: > Willing to read your points of view on that matter. There is a whole lot I could say on this (writing "Eurocentric" in a discussion about casinos seems really weird, and I'm not sure Native Americans would thank you for it) but ultimately it's a little academic at the moment

Re: [OSM-talk] About OSM social implications and what can/should be displayed on the map (or not)

Hello, TL;DR: I disagree with the proposal, OSM would fall apart without OTGR. As for "we should change the world by creating the map", this is THE antithesis to OpenStreetMap. As soon we depart from the On-The-Ground Rule, and start mapping "what _I_think_ ought (not) exist", we become OpenGeoFi

Re: [OSM-talk] About OSM social implications and what can/should be displayed on the map (or not)

29. Jun 2018 17:27 by carlos.cam...@gmail.com : > OSM does not take "any ethical stance and display the world as it is." > It is for that reason that I want to raise that particular topic to OSM > community: > Is that true? yes   > and if so, should it be

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

29. Jun 2018 13:18 by a...@pigsonthewing.org.uk : > On 29 June 2018 at 11:38, Max <> abonneme...@revolwear.com > > > wrote: > >> "Add the missing names to OSM in your language." >> >> That is inflating the OSM database with so

Re: [OSM-talk] About OSM social implications and what can/should be displayed on the map (or not)

W dniu 29.06.2018 o 17:27, Carlos Cámara pisze: > This is to say that openstreetmap-carto is OSM's business card, which > should serve as an entry point to the project to people from many > conditions and hence, we have a responsibility in deciding what do we > display and how we do it Of course.

Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto design

sent from a phone > On 29. Jun 2018, at 11:39, Frederik Ramm wrote: > > I would love it if OSM Carto > could be split into a "bread and butter" style that is easy to work > with, easy on the eye and easy to render, and a "cartography > navel-gazing" add-on where we show off how we can render d

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

* The BIG part of the announcement is that OSM data is now being used to create truly multilingual map with a very large exposure. I hope some people here are not saying that such project should not have been built? If you want to help, see at the end. * I do not think names should be simply copie

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

While there is a lot of things said here in this thread, I notice that: 1 there is very little advice in the article on how to enter names in OSM. 2 there no comment on the blog that would give advice on how to enter names in OSM. It would be the right time if OSM people would take the time to

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Names I would especially encourage you to read the entire section "Avoid transliteration", which also discusses translation issues. On Sat, Jun 30, 2018 at 7:08 AM, Yves wrote: > While there is a lot of things said here in this thread, I notice that: > 1 ther

Re: [OSM-talk] WMF: "Interactive maps, now in your language"

On 30/06/18 15:08, Yves wrote: While there is a lot of things said here in this thread, I notice that: 1 there is very little advice in the article on how to enter names in OSM. 2 there no comment on the blog that would give advice on how to enter names in OSM. It would be the right time if O

Re: [OSM-talk] About OSM social implications and what can/should be displayed on the map (or not)

On 2018-06-29 17:27, Carlos Cámara wrote: Dear all, After participating in this openstreetmap-carto issue [1] discussing to create an icon for casinos in which I stated that they should not be highlighted with an icon due to their grave consequences derived from gambling addiction (there are ple