Hi Mike, thank you for an interesting and informative post. I was wondering if putting the electrodes in the sonic cleaner which I use for my liposomal Vit C would be any good for cleaning them. I did it once with my old ones but they went a peculiar flat colour so I discarded them for the new ones. Would this weird matt colour have mattered (pardon the pun!) or would this be a good way of cleaning the electrodes? Many thanks. dee
On 12 Sep 2011, at 18:38, Mike Monett wrote: > To All, > > Many people have commented on the drop in conductance after the brew > is finished. It can be quite significant, and can reach 40% to 60% > of the original strength in the first 48 hours after the cs is put > in storage. > > This can greatly reduce the effectiveness of the cs, especially when > the silver ion concentration is marginal to begin with. > > High Ion Concentration Is Needed > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > When the cs is weak, and you are fighting a particularly virulent > Herpes Simplex or Herpes Zoster virus, you can drink as much cs as > you want and it will have little or no effect. > > But if you can raise the ion concentration to a true 20uS or more, > the infections are quickly subdued. For example, please see my post > to Sol on 19 Oct 2004. Note that Sol also found that a stronger cs > worked better for her as well. (The mail archive scrambles email > addresses, so please replace the (at) with "@") > > http://www.mail-archive.com/silver-list(at)eskimo.com/msg76134.html > > Silver Sulfide Tarnish > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > I have finally tracked down the cause of the drop in conductance, > and figured out how to to solve it. > > The drop in conductance is caused by silver sulfide - plain ordinary > silver tarnish. Interestingly enough, it is also the reason your cs > turns purple when you take sips from the main storage container, > instead of transferring it to a smaller container. It is caused by > the sulfur ions in the solution, and not by the silver ions as > everyone assumes. > > Sulfur is everywhere in the environment. It is largely generated in > automobile combustion and fossil fuel generating plants. It also > comes from the water traps in the kitchen and bathroom sinks as > sewer gas, or hydrogen sulfide, H2S. [1] > > Keep Your Plumbing Clean > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > You may notice an unpleasant odor sometimes when you go near the > kitchen sink. That is an indication it may be time to clean out the > gunk and old food debris that accumulates on the walls of the > downspout. I use an old coathanger with a small hook bent at one > end, and a small flashlight to show where the gunk is. > > It takes a bit of work to find all the gunk and knock it into the > trap. Flush with water from time to time so you don't end up with > one gigantic ball that can plug the pipe. When you are done, your > sink will thank you. It will drain much faster than before, and will > smell fresh and clean, at least for a few days. Doing it yourself is > a lot better than having to pay a plumber when the drain becomes > completely plugged. > > If you have a garbage disposal or a dishwasher, the situation is a > bit more complicated. It may require disassembling the drain pipes > to remove the gunk. This is a messy job, but well within the > capability of a handy homeowner. Here are some links that can help: > > http://www.freeplumbingtips.net/public_html/KitchensinkCDTS_1.htm > > "http://plumbing.about.com/od/drains/ss/Clearing-A-Clogged-Kitchen-Sink-Through-The-Trap.htm"; > > Keeping the plumbing clean helps to minimize the amount of sulfur > generated from bacterial action, and helps to minimize the resulting > tarnish that forms on the silver electrodes of your cs generator. > > Sulfur Chemistry > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Sulfur loves to combine with silver. Anyone who has silver utensils > knows how hard it is to keep them free of tarnish, and clean and > shiny. The chemistry is deceptively simple: > > H2S + 2Ag --> Ag2S + H2 [2] > > However, silver tarnish is one of the most insoluble of all silver > compounds. The solubility is only 8.5e-12 mg/L in water, which makes > it extremely difficult to remove. [3] > > The film of tarnish does not have to be very thick to have a severe > impact on the brewing process. > > The ion concentrations we work with are so low that the tarnish film > can be completely invisible and still ruin your brew. > > Cleaning Tarnished Coins > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Coin collectors use a simple electrochemical process to remove > tarnish from silver coins using aluminum, baking soda and hot water. > > Here is an example of how it works: > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ij4QynD7Ao8 > > This relies on the galvanic action of aluminum and silver to > generate a small voltage between the silver and aluminum which > drives the reaction. > > But we don't want to subject our silver electrodes to a solution of > baking soda. This could contaminate the electrodes and be very > difficult to remove. > > Instead, we can use our knowledge of silver chemistry and our cs > generator to supply the dc current needed to convert the silver > sulfide back to silver. > > To perform this magic, cut a strip of aluminum foil an inch or so > wide and place it in the generator so it is halfway between the > electrodes. Fill the container with dw, and if you have a Hanna or > COM-100, measure the conductance of the water. > > Now connect the positive terminal of your supply to the aluminum > foil, and the negative terminal to both electrodes. Turn on the > current and wait. > > Here is an example of a typical conductance plot using a constant > current of 500uA. The red curve is the cell voltage using the scale > on the left, and the blue curve is the cell conductance using the > scale on the right. Note the cell conductance quickly increases, > followed by a characteristic double hump in both curves. This > indicates there are two separate reactions occurring that are > separated in time. The reason for this double hump is still under > investigation. > > http://pstca.com/misc/3f2b6ba5.gif > > When the reaction is complete, the conductance stabilizes at a low > value. This indicates there are very few ions left in the solution > to conduct current. > > If you stop the process at this point and remove the electrodes, you > may notice a slight silver sheen on the surface of the dw. This is > caused by silver atoms released by the sulfur enclosing hydrogen gas > formed at the cathode. The bubbles rise to the surface and he > hydrogen gas escapes, leaving a thin monoatomic layer of silver > floating on the surface. > > If you measure the conductance of the dw with your Hanna or COM-100, > you will find it is virtually identical to the original reading you > took before applying the current. > > So we have created a reaction that filled the dw with two sets of > ions, then the reaction self-terminated and the conductance of the > dw dropped back to the value of the original dw. And the electrodes > are now both a dull gray color. > > The conclusion is we have removed compounds from the silver > electrodes and deposited them on the aluminum foil. The compounds > expected are silver sulfide, and any other anions or deposits from > the distilled water. > > Chemical Equations > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > I originally intended to supply the chemical equations that show the > process at this point, but I have uncovered what may be a > significant error in the classical explanation of what is happening. > I will study this further to see if I can determine the reason for > the discrepancy. > > However, this does not stop you from performing this operation on > your own electrodes and enjoying the benefits of increased ion > concentration in your brew. > > Results of Desulfurizing > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > My brews used to lose a great deal of conductance after the cs was > placed in storage. I usually saw between 40% to 60% drop, and the > Salt Test confirmed the loss of silver ions. It was very weak. > > Now, the brew loses less than 12% of the initial conductance, and I > get consistent readings above 30uS. The Salt Test and Faraday > calculation both confirm this concentration is accurate. > > Storing Your CS Generator > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Now that you have cleaned the electrodes and hopefully can start to > see an improvement in your readings, it would be a shame to let the > tarnish form again and return things to the way they were before. > > One thing that can help is to keep your sink plumbing clean, as > described above. > > Another way to minimize tarnish buildup is to store your generator > in clear polyethylene bags like the ones used in the vegetable > section of grocery stores. I prefer to use two bags to help minimize > the seepage of hydrogen sulfide through the bags. > > The tarnish and other deposits from the dw will eventually build up > again, so this process needs to be repeated whenever you notice any > degredation in your brew. > > Best Regards, > > Mike Monett > SilverCell > > Links > ~~~~~ > [1] http://telstar.ote.cmu.edu/environ/m3/s4/cycleSulfur.shtml > [2] > "http://www.tippcityschools.com/16912052313413413/lib/16912052313413413/HW%20Answers/NDG_007AD.pdf"; > [3] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silver_sulfide > > > -- > The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. > Rules and Instructions: http://www.silverlist.org > > Unsubscribe: > <mailto:silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com?subject=unsubscribe> > Archives: > http://www.mail-archive.com/silver-list@eskimo.com/maillist.html > > Off-Topic discussions: <mailto:silver-off-topic-l...@eskimo.com> > List Owner: Mike Devour <mailto:mdev...@eskimo.com> > >
