The use of an electrically operated solenoid valve would require the control circuits to be monitored/supervised from the Fire Protection system otherwise there would be no security of valve closure. Must be fail-safe operation.
Another way that we use in NZ would be to control the domestic/commercial takeoff with an hydraulic control valve(Clayton or similar) piloted from the Sprinkler system so that when the sprinkler operates it closes the other takeoff by the system dropping to minimum design pressure. Isolation and testing of this hydraulic shut-off valve would normally be in the sprinkler valve house. Ideally the control valve should be in the valve house as well. Without knowing the details of the site it is difficult to follow what is needed, but the simplest way is to have the domestic outlet from tank above the storage volume for sprinklers then run each feed pipe separately. If the sprinklers and domestic feeds are off the same main at some distance from the tanks then individual control of the domestic takeoffs is necessary. Russell Gregory Christchurch, New Zealand e-mail [email protected] -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Joel Chaim Sent: Wednesday, 9 May 2012 8:04 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: domestic demand per nfpa 13 Domestic service while there is fire is not an issue in this situation. I'm just looking for the right solenoid valve, it’s a 2" outdoor that we are looking for -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Bruce Verhei Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2012 2:47 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: domestic demand per nfpa 13 ....bidder design world sprinklers are all. But on a fire safety analysis for a new project they are only a part of the picture. Sent from my Motorola ATRIX™ 4G on AT&T -----Original message----- From: Bruce Verhei <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Tue, May 8, 2012 18:41:09 GMT+00:00 Subject: RE: domestic demand per nfpa 13 72 building? Apartment buildings? How many units? Turning off domestic to a building during a fire is one solution. But you can't turn off domestic supply to a 1,000 people because there is a fire somewhere. How many water heaters do you empty, the refill when service is restored. Adequate infrastructure is part of development. If my presumption of twelve units per apartment building, and population estimate are ballpark, then the water in storage on a per capita basis is less than towns of 20,000 - 85,000 persons store. It follows that a smaller population needs more per capita than a larger population. Of course if they really have ability to say, pump 2,500 gpm on a continuous basis for several hours, and the tank is elevated to operate as a standpipe, as the term is used in the hydroelectric industry, then the conversation is different. I think we need more information about complex, size and height of buildings, access, available FD response, evaluation of possibility of building to building spread. Then we need a description of the water supply. In a bidder design eorld Sent from my Motorola ATRIX™ 4G on AT&T -----Original message----- From: Art Tiroly <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Tue, May 8, 2012 16:48:43 GMT+00:00 Subject: RE: domestic demand per nfpa 13 I see a bigger problem, keeping the tank full during peak domestic demands. What refills the storage tank? How much do you need for sprinkler demand. Does the domestic have pumping supply? Is that reliable for sprinkler? Arthur Tiroly ATCO Fire Protection Design Tiroly and Associates 24400 Highland Rd rm 25, CLE 44143 216-621-8899 216-570-7030 Cell WWW.ATCOfirepro.com -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Joel Chaim Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2012 11:40 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: domestic demand per nfpa 13 Would a solenoid valve be approved in such a situation? -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ron Greenman Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2012 11:40 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: domestic demand per nfpa 13 You could probably use the plumbing code tables (that's where the 13R stuff comes from) for determining the demand. On Tue, May 8, 2012 at 8:34 AM, Joel Chaim <[email protected]>wrote: > I have a job that has a 15000 gallon tank for 72 buildings and they > want to use the existing tank for fire sprinkler as well. > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Roland > Huggins > Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2012 11:15 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: domestic demand per nfpa 13 > > Why are you asking since it is normally not included in the calculations. > > Roland > > > On May 8, 2012, at 8:05 AM, Joel Chaim wrote: > > > Is there a table for domestic demand as per NFPA. 13? I only saw it > > under NFPA 13 R. > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was > > scrubbed... > > URL: > > <http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/at > > ta chments/20120508/4a03127a/attachment.html > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Sprinklerforum mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > -- Ron Greenman Instructor Fire Protection Engineering Technology Bates Technical College 1101 So. 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