Niall Pemberton wrote:
On 3/23/06, Henri Yandell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Struts is a cool community. The users are actively involved, in terms
of answering and asking; people obviously care about the community -
as shown by both your and Dakota's questions and by the desire of the
committers to work to keep things together; and there's an active
future happening plus legacy being actively maintained by both
contributors and committers.
I don't believe this is true - from what I see Jonathan Revusky's only
desire is to see the demise of Apache -
Very good, Niall. Since you're so good at reading my mind, could you
tell me how I plan to bring this about?
he has no interest in Struts
or Web Frameworks at all, except if they use/support his Freemarker
templating tool.
Well, to an increasing extent, they basically all do. The default
presentation technology in Webwork a.k.a. Struts Action 2 is in fact
FreeMarker. FreeMarker is also increasingly popular in Spring-land.
In general, I am interested in the web application space. It probably is
true that I am largely concerned with things as they relate to FreeMarker.
Dakota on the other hand is a different matter - he
at least has been part of this community for a long time, although I
understood he now uses Spring MVC rather than Struts (I'm sure if I
have this wrong he will correct/clarify this). From what I see though,
neither is actually interested in Struts - except in a negative way.
The disappointing thing from my perspective is that the valid points
they make are lost in the noise of the insults and FUD they spread.
As regards insults, there is a difference of perspective here. My own
feeling is that in all of my posts I have exercised a great degree of
self-restraint. If I were to express forthrightly in modern English
vernacular what I think of some of the people here, it would be....
rather ugly.
You have to understand that I am somebody who really believes that a
core idea in open-source is that people who are willing and able to
contribute should be allowed to do so. This whole line that you have to
have some self-selected elite who keep everybody else's grubby unwashed
hands off the code is to me something completely laughable and basically
contemptible.
You have parts of the conversation where people literally claim that the
managers of the project do not have to listen to criticism. I responded
to this individual _respectfully_ I think. I suggested respectfully that
he reconsider this viewpoint. I could have responded with much less
self-restraint.
As regards FUD, if I have said anything false, then address it.
Otherwise, I think you should retract the statement, Niall.
I strongly believe that a guiding principle the basic idea of open
source is that if someone is willing and able to pitch in, they should
have the chance to do so.
Now, any approach should still be judged on results. What I consider
amazing is that when this closed club approach has clearly failed, that
you have had to accept that this community's work was not competitive
with Webwork, you guys still talk with this level of arrogance, and
still assert that the closed club approach is the right way.
You guys talk so much about meritocracy but do not accept the logic and
structure of meritocracy in any real way. If you want to be arrogant,
win the competition, produce the better framework. If you lose the
competition, you have to be humble and consider your mistakes.
Jonathan only arrived in this community part way through this thread,
hopefully he'll get bored and leave soon.
Well, the truth is that hanging around here is not a very enriching
experience.
Now, concretely, I just responded to Henri Yandell's question about the
website. Would you prefer that I refrain from other similar comments? If
you request that I refrain from further such criticism, I will respect
your request.
Regards,
Jonathan Revusky
--
lead developer, FreeMarker project, http://freemarker.org/
FreeMarker group blog, http://freemarker.blogspot.com/
Niall
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
