On Apr 22, 2004, at 1:03 PM, Aaron Held wrote:
I would love to see a book - I've taught webware and written some tutorials and guides - but nothing recent.

I think a pure webware book would fail, and there have been a few less then interesting Web Development in Python books as well.

I agree -- I don't think a Webware book would work. In fact, I don't think Python is ready for any web programming books (except Zope -- but even those suck tremendously, so maybe Zope isn't ready either ;).


The books that have existed seem to be scattered and incomplete, or just cover one framework under the guise of being general. There was one that covered Slither, I think... ever heard of Slither? I hadn't. There's another book with a chapter on Webware/PSP -- I haven't had the heart to even read the final version. I reviewed it, and the structure was horrible, with none of the depth where it was necessary, and pedantic coverage of useless details elsewhere -- when they returned a second draft with none of the changes I suggested, I gave up on them.

The reality is that Python web programming is a fucking mess. It's pathetic. There's no way to write a book, because there's no material that's appropriate book material. I like Webware, but it's not going to take over the world, not even the modest Python world. Neither will Zope, not even Zope 3... and if I thought it would, maybe I'd switch over happily. Well, to Zope 3, Zope 2 is a fucking mess, and fixing it only makes it worse, and I know I'll never be happy there. All the other frameworks are in the same shape as Webware -- they have some users, occasional spurts of activity. Some have solid enough communities to have a viable future, but many do not. None of them is compellingly great. Yes, even Webware.

BTW, if anyone wants to talk about these larger issues, Web-SIG is probably an appropriate venue: http://www.python.org/sigs/web-sig -- feel free to post anything that comes to your mind, it's too damn quiet there.

--
Ian Bicking | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://blog.ianbicking.org



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