Sandra wrote: It has also been stated here in Alaska that Jr.Youth should not take the Ruhi course but, instead take the course (patterned after Ruhi) especially for Youth. I'm not sure what that is called. I'm curious if it is the same elsewhere. Regardless, it is only offered to Youth
Sandra wrote: It has also been stated here in Alaska that Jr.Youth should not take the Ruhi course but, instead take the course (patterned after Ruhi) especially for Youth. I'm not sure what that is called. I'm curious if it is the same elsewhere. Regardless, it is only offered to Youth
Hi Mark,
I am a bit confused as how you mean this. Do you mean to say that discussions of this sort assume that there is something called goodness in people, do you mean to say that goodness changes with each new Manifestation, that each new Manifestation, because of the taxonomies He uses
If there are other areas in which the House of Justice is given covenantal
protection (ma'sum/'ismat), or infallibility, I think they would need to be
substantiated from the Sacred Texts or the interpretations of the Guardian.
Dear Mark,
You ommitted one very important quote:
Unto the Most Holy
Hi, Janine,
At 07:17 AM 1/24/2005, you wrote:
The problem I see is that various religions have different views on how
things should be handled. all religions except the Bahai faith have priests
and different schools of thought.
Actually, there are many religions which do not have clergy,
On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 05:17:28 -0800 (PST), louise mchenry
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Janine:
The problem I see is that various religions have different views on how
things should be handled. all religions except the Bahai faith have priests
and different schools of thought.
Gilberto:
I know
Hi, Janine,
At 07:21 AM 1/24/2005, you wrote:
I am a bit confused as how you mean this. Do you mean to say that discussions
of this sort assume that there is something called goodness in people, do you
mean to say that goodness changes with each new Manifestation, that each new
Manifestation,
In a message dated 1/24/2005 8:11:22 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
I believe that each Bahai has their own version of the Bahai faith.
And it is the love each baha`i has in his heart for Baha`u'llah that keeps it united. The love expressed as trust in Baha`u'llah's laws,
In a message dated 1/24/2005 8:33:48 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
But that's not even the main issue. The thing I'm having troubleseeing from your perspective is why God would have mandated thepunishment to begin with? Even though I disagree with many of thethings you
In a message dated 1/24/2005 8:38:50 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
But if "good" is worth calling "good" then shouldn't it be independentof the prophet?
God is the Source of All BOunty. The manifestation is the Revealer of God's Bounty.
I avoid the term Prophet because I
On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 06:31:12 -0800, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gilberto: But don't people still try to remember the dead. Or stay alive
longer, extending life, getting plastic surgery. etc?
Sure. But I'm not sure what you're driving at.
You had mentioned the Egyptian
On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 06:55:33 -0800 (PST), louise mchenry
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
HI Gilberto,
It seems I did not make myself clear. I apologise. I made some remarks in
that post which showed forth my ignorance ;o)
First, I assumed from your post that you meant that religion needs to
Gilberto: You had mentioned the Egyptian obsession with immortality. I'm
driving at the idea that many human beings have this desire in different
ages.
Well, yeah. But that's merely stating the obvious. I don't see your point.
Gilberto: I'm pretty sure that street churches where long-haired
On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 10:05:10 EST, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
In a message dated 1/24/2005 8:53:18 AM Central Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
History
After Charles Mason Remey's proclamation in 1960 that he was the
second Guardian of the Baha'i Faith, his followers
On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 08:36:04 -0800, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gilberto: I'm pretty sure that street churches where long-haired hippies
go around in public openly proclaiming the gospel are alot older than the
kind with pews : )
I totally agree, and I think that's a
Gilberto: I'm not sure if you got it. You mentioned these hippie churches
during the 60's as if they were a new thing. My point (which I certainly
am not the first person to point out) is in certain respects these new
hippies were superficially and in a deeper sense kind of like Jesus'
Dear Rich,
The payment of jizya continued until the time of Baha'u'llah. I don't have
time now to get into the story of how this insidious tax was lifted by
Nasiri'd-Din Shah through the guidance of Baha'u'llah and the leg-work of
Manikji Sahib, but you might find some pieces of the info in
Mark:I am saying that "goodness" (or "badness") is simply a name to signify what a particular Prophet, group, or ordinary individual regards as being good (or bad).JS:
So are you saying that nothing above and beyond what the Manifestations reveal exists in man's mind, heart, or his environment
Gilberto Simpson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 09:53:13 -0800 (PST), Ahang Rabbani<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote: Dear Rich, The payment of jizya continued until the time of Baha'u'llah. I don't have time now to get into the story of how this insidious tax At various times depending on
(a) that people normally leave off the reservation that it is insidious in our time and it was not insidious during the time of Muhammad,
or (b) it is insidious because the true Law of the Qur'an was supposed to be symbolic and never implemented, that jizya is actually a misinterpretation, by
On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 12:09:56 -0800 (PST), JS [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Mark:
I am saying that goodness (or badness) is simply a name to signify what
a particular Prophet, group, or ordinary individual regards as being good
(or bad).
Do you think this is just your independent opinion or is
I don't know why the Qur'an sanctioned jizya. Why did the Bible endorse
slavery, why did it call homosexuality an abomination, why did it sanction
stoning if you plot different vegetables side by side, why did it allow one to
sells his daughter, why did it prohibit touching pigs on Sabbath? None
On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 07:17:26 -0800 (PST), louise mchenry
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Yep.
but they are not considered bahais. They call themselves Orthodox Bahais.
Despite that they call themselves Bahai and see themselves as followers of
Baha;u;llah, yet they have violated the covenant, because
Hi, Janine,
At 08:11 AM 1/24/2005, you wrote:
about the Bahai faith: what I feel is that there are different ideas in the
Bahai faith because people are different.
Yes, I think that would be true by definition.
My take is that one idea cannot develop in a different school of thought
leading
In a message dated 1/24/2005 10:40:20 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Didn't the French NSA approve of Remey's claims at the time? Werethere only 200 Bahais in France at the time?
Five of the NSA voted to go with Remey. The Hands sent in a couple representatives and declared
In a message dated 1/24/2005 10:40:20 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Look. All I'm really saying is that it is insulting to cast all sortsof negative aspersions on other religions for being split, when yourown religion has obvious splits. It's like this massive act of
Hi, Gilberto,
At 08:38 AM 1/24/2005, you wrote:
But if good is worth calling good then shouldn't it be independent of the
prophet?
I am not sure how something could be worth calling good. I have not been a
neo-Platonist for about 5 or 6 years, so I don't see *goodness* as a quality
detached
Hi, Susan,
I am combining a response to both messages.
At 07:27 AM 1/24/2005, you wrote:
problems which have caused difference and questions that are obscure are
both rather vaque categories and it is from these that the House draws its
authority to elucidate. Granted that the House considers
So are you saying that nothing above and beyond what the Manifestations
reveal exists in man's mind, heart, or his environment to manifest signs of
and lessons on, goodness? In other words, God has no interaction with man
outside of the interaction between man and the Manifestation.
Well, I
Hi, Gilberto,
At 02:40 PM 1/24/2005, you wrote:
Do you think this is just your independent opinion or is it ultimately rooted
in the Bahai faith somehow? I suspect that it probably is common among Bahais
who have thought about ethics and morality a certain way but I would be
interested in your
In a message dated 12/29/2004 8:34:43 P.M. Central Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
In studying the Writings, we should not take a single verse on
its own, but rather take a wide selection of the writings.
Dear Firouz,
I would take this to mean that sometimes
Besides, jizya was meant for the Jews and Christians. Qur'an says nothing
about the Zoroastrians, where this tax was imposed with great vehemence to
the
destruction of that community.
Uh Ahang, if the Zoroastrians hadn't been deemed eligible to pay the jiziya,
they might have been killed
These stats are 10 years old, but they are still basically accurate:
Catholic 968,000,000
Protestant 395,867,000
Other Christians 275,583,000
Orthodox 217,948,000
Anglicans 70,530,000
http://adherents.com/adh_branches.html#Christianity
Even throwing in other Christians and Anglicans, there
Gilberto,
At 05:29 PM 1/24/2005, you wrote:
If so perhaps *all* the followers of Bahaullah are declining.
Stagnating, not necessarily declining. Most religions are not growing. Notable
exceptions are some of the branches of Islam, the pentecostal-charismatic
movement, Mormonism, and the
Hi Gilberto,
thanks for your response. Food for thought and a challenge to make my understanding and thoughts more clear.
: My question was: how can religion by itself do this? Suppose that a Bahai country interprets the Bahai writings to say that an arsonist should be burned. So this country
Hi, Janine,
At 06:22 PM 1/24/2005, you wrote:
From where I am sitting, here in Europe, I cannot see that there are even
different groups of Bahais. For me, where I am sitting, every Bahai has their
own take on the Bahai religion, and although some will support some thoughts
some people have
Can you give me examples?
I must say that I am allergic to putting labels on people. I hate having put a label on myself, and so think that others would not like that either. I think that there is far more to people than what we may see. And in the west we are so fond of classifying that we
Janine,
At 06:49 PM 1/24/2005, you wrote:
Can you give me examples?
I would rather not get that specific.
Regards, Mark A. Foster http://markfoster.net [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sacred cows make the tastiest hamburger. Abbie Hoffman
__
You
Ok. That is a pity though, cause I do not know what you mean. You could write it to me privately.
janine "Mark A. Foster" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Janine,At 06:49 PM 1/24/2005, you wrote:Can you give me examples?I would rather not get that specific. Regards, Mark A. Foster
In a message dated 1/15/2005 12:54:24 P.M. Central Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
It seems
that the harshness of this punishment is, at least in part, relatedto and
intended to be a deterrent to acts such as the wholesale genocidalburning
of homes villages
Dear Patti,
Hi Susan,
do you mean to say that Baha'u'llah revealed laws which are meant to last about 1000 years because of certain conditions which were surely temporary conditions in the countries He resided in?
I mean it is possible God doeth what He willeth. yet that does not really make sense to
On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 17:57:57 -0600, Mark A. Foster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gilberto,
At 05:19 PM 1/24/2005, you wrote:
I guess one of the things which makes me say what I said, especially with
regard to prophets is the notion of sinlessness.
However, sinlessness by what standard? Moses
In a message dated 1/24/2005 8:35:53 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Mark I did not accept Baha'u'llah based on His character. In fact, I knew next to nothing about Him when I became a Baha'i in 1970. For whatever *reason*, my heart responded to His claim, and I recognized
Gilberto,
At 08:33 PM 1/24/2005, you wrote:
Personally I don't see the above issues as requiring or suggesting
relativism. In the case of Moses one could argue that the death was in
self-defense. The issue of Muhammad and Aishah might be addressed by pointing
out that marrying a young woman,
Iskandar,
why could Aishah not marry again?
much love,
janine"Iskandar Hai, M.D." [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Mon, 24 Jan 2005, Gilberto Simpson wrote: Gilberto: Personally I don't see the above issues as requiring or suggesting relativism. In the case of Moses one could argue that the death
In a message dated 1/24/2005 7:25:05 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Dear Patti,
That's possible, but in cities like Constantinople at the time of Baha'u'llah a simple act of arson could have catastrophic consequences. As I recall much of the city burnt one year.
In a message dated 1/24/2005 9:11:47 P.M. Central Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
why could Aishah not marry again?
Dear John,
In the Islamic (and Baha'i) context it is unheard of for someone who was
married to prophet to ever marry someone else. That's why Shoghi
In a message dated 1/24/2005 9:24:02 P.M. Central Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
We also have the example of the Hammurabi Code's
punishments.
Dear Scott,
I'm not sure what you are trying to say here.
warmest, Susan
__
You
In a message dated 1/24/2005 9:25:47 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Dear Scott,
I'm not sure what you are trying to say here.
If a house collapses the builder forfeits his life, for instance. A harsh punishment making sense in a particular society like laws against
On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 10:09:27 EST, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I think this is descending to petty quibbles.
Ok. Let's stop.
Peace
Gilberto
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You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:archive@mail-archive.com
To
On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 20:50:55 -0600, Mark A. Foster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gilberto,
At 08:33 PM 1/24/2005, you wrote:
Personally I don't see the above issues as requiring or suggesting
relativism. In the case of Moses one could argue that the death was in
self-defense. The issue of
I'd say a child of around 7 or 9 lunar years of age is a more accurate
term than young woman when she marries a person 50 years older than her.
She is what she is whether she is married or not.
She was barely 18 when she became a widow, and could not marry again
hmm... maybe you are right... though I find it difficult to imagine, seeing how much has changed here in Europe in 100 years time, and my optimism for the future of the world. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
In a message dated 1/24/2005 7:28:54 P.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
In a message dated 1/24/2005 11:57:19 A.M. Central Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
How
did you do that?
It got reported in an interview the Israeli press had with him.
"He [Abu Mazen] does not forget to ask that I write he is still awaiting an
apology by former Mossad chief
In the Quran it says:
33.6] The Prophet has a greater claim on the faithful than they have
on themselves, and his wives are (as) their mothers; and the
possessors of relationship have the better claim in the ordinance of
Allah to inheritance, one with respect to another, than (other)
believers,
I know that the World Centre was unable to produce a specific reference to
that effect. However, given that 'ismat/ma'sum translates as protection
(i.e., from impurity or sin), how else can `Abdu'l-Baha's station as a
perfect Exemplar be understood?
Dear Mark,
But I don't think that is a term
In a message dated 1/24/2005 7:21:38 A.M. Central Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
that
each new Manifestation, because of the taxonomies He uses defines anew what
goodness is?
Dear Janine,
Isn't that what this passage implies?
"O leaders of religion! Weigh not the Book of
In a message dated 1/24/2005 7:18:25 A.M. Central Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Only the
Bahai faithis steeped in the practice of
consultation.
Dear Janine,
The Baha'i concept of consultation is derived from Islam.
warmest, Susan
In studying the Writings, we should not take a single verse on its
own, but rather take a wide selection of the writings.
Dear Firouz,
I would take this to mean that sometimes Baha'u'llah accessed books
supernaturally and other times He did so the old fashion way. In other words,
most of
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