Unfortunately I don’t know the particulars of typhoid Mary’s
situation. I understand a bit of the folk lore, but don’t only have
an idea of what that story is about. My basic understanding was that
an individual who knew they were sick was intentionally infecting
others. Certainly a despicable act if that was the case. To better
put that in the context of today’s situation I would want to know
these things:
1. Was there typhoid vaccine that was generally available?
2. What is the mortality rate of typhoid fever versus covid? I
suspect typhoid was significantly higher, but don’t have any data
to back that up.
3. I believe there is case law to suggest intentionally infecting
people is a pretty serious crime and after the initial stupid
college intentional infection parties, we don’t really have people
intentionally trying to infect others.
If we extend that argument to other diseases, will we now require flu
vaccine? It has always been a “good idea”, especially for those in
high risk health or age groups. But it has never been required. We
don’t even require vaccine for measles, shingles, and a myriad of
other annoying and/or dangerous diseases. And these have FDA
approved vaccines.
However, I would reiterate this:
If the vaccine works, and I have been vaccinated, why do I care if
others haven’t? Am I worried the vaccine doesn’t work? Do I think
it is necessary to force people to take an experimental drug for their
own good will against their will?
Regards,
*From:* Chuck McCown <ch...@go-mtc.com>
*Sent:* Friday, July 23, 2021 2:43 PM
*To:* David Coudron <david.coud...@advantenon.com>
*Cc:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT somewhat political
One question: Should Typhoid Mary have been allowed to just roam free?
Sent from my iPhone
On Jul 23, 2021, at 1:37 PM, David Coudron
<david.coud...@advantenon.com
<mailto:david.coud...@advantenon.com>> wrote:
Here is what I find particularly challenging about suggesting that
folks who have chosen not to take the vaccine are not that smart.
1. Folks who do that never talk about that fact that this is not
an FDA approved medicine/vaccine. I took the Moderna
vaccine, the paperwork clearly stated several facts. Among
them are:
1. This is not FDA approved.
2. This “vaccine” has not been proven to prevent the virus.
While we likely all agree that there is a very good
likelihood that this “vaccine” will help prevent it, it is
far from a proven fact.
2. The argument is, “there should be no reason to think this
vaccine isn’t safe since people aren’t dying from taking the
vaccine”. Vaccines are a risk/reward type of medical
treatment. Every medicine you take has some level of side
effect. The vast majority of medicines have such negligible
side effects, that they are considered completely safe. The
FDA approval process exists to ensure we understand the
potential of serious side effects and drug interaction
issues. If you are 30 years old and folks are saying you
have to take this experimental drug to prevent this incredibly
small chance of you becoming seriously ill or dying, it seems
like an intelligent thing to say “I am not sure the risk of
getting seriously ill or dying from this disease outweighs the
risk of using an experimental drug”. It used to be that
people relied upon a conversation with their doctor to
determine personal risk of disease and use of a drug.
Apparently we no longer do that. We publicly shame people
into using experimental drugs.
3. Since it is not FDA approved, we don’t have a full
understanding of drug interactions with other medicines folks
need to take. We likely understand the very common
medicines, but, certainly not all. We have FDA approval
processes for good reason. If for example, you were under 40
and were taking seizure control medication, it would be very
fair to hold off on an experimental drug until it is fully
understood if the vaccine might lessen the effectiveness of
the seizure control medication. An incredibly low risk of
serious illness or death from the virus could turn into a good
chance of serious injury from seizure. As far as I know data
like that is certainly not available yet.
4. Why do vaccinated people feel the need to belittle those that
have decided not to get vaccinated by an experimental drug?
Does it make them feel smarter? We have people not getting
flu vaccinations every year, and that is with FDA approved
medicine. But now all of a sudden it is OK to ridicule folks
that are making a decision based limited data on an
experimental drug for which the majority of the population has
a very low chance of serious illness or death? And when they
do ridicule folks, they never discuss the facts at hand, or
want to have a serious discussion about the risk/reward of
this particular vaccine. Two years from now, with an FDA
approval in place and a full understanding of drug
interactions and effectiveness of the vaccine the conversation
might look completely different. Right now, I believe some
very intelligent people are looking at the risk/reward and
saying “not now, but probably some day as this will become the
new yearly flu vaccine”. Until then, my risk of virus
related illness doesn’t warrant a decision to take the vaccine.
5. Why are people that are vaccinated so obsessed with people
that aren’t vaccinated? For those of us that are vaccinated,
we are safe right? That was the point of taking the vaccine.
6. Most of the science that seems most accurate right now points
to this being with us permanently like an influenza sort of
virus. It will show up every year with little mutations that
will require updates, or boosters, or yearly covid shots.
What ever you want to call them. Is really so stupid to
wait until this is FDA approved before participating? If we
have to do this without FDA approval, why does that process
even exist?
I have always appreciated this list because it is usually very
fact focused, and very good at exploring solutions to problems.
While some lists are very superficial and suffer from pat answers
to technical problems, folks in this list have always tended dig
deep and find tangible information related to the email topic. I
get that it is very easy to joke about the intelligence of those
who have made a decision we don’t agree with, but I don’t believe
this topic is nearly that cut and dried.
As Chuck mentioned, unfortunately this is a somewhat political
topic. I don’t understand why, other than the fact that some
react more harshly to being told they have to do something. This
should be a scientific discussion. If definitely shouldn’t be
about public shame. We don’t know the medical situation of those
that chose not to participate in an experimental medical treatment.
Regards,
*From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com
<mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown via AF
*Sent:* Friday, July 23, 2021 1:02 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com
<mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*Cc:* Chuck McCown <ch...@go-mtc.com <mailto:ch...@go-mtc.com>>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT somewhat political
They could sponsor concerts and barbecues that only admit
unvaccinated...
How can I get that fake news to be picked up by the junk news feeds?
*From:*Forrest Christian (List Account)
*Sent:*Friday, July 23, 2021 11:55 AM
*To:*AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] OT somewhat political
I've wondered if it might be a good thing for the liberal side to
start saying "take the vaccine or not, we don't care - in fact we
would prefer that you don't so there are less of you to vote next
go around".
On Fri, Jul 23, 2021 at 11:26 AM Carl Peterson
<cpeter...@portnetworks.com <mailto:cpeter...@portnetworks.com>>
wrote:
That assumes IQ==Comon sense. Lots of smart people can be
really dumb when it comes to sports, religon, and politics.
It seems a subset**of people have convinced themselves that
vaccines, and specifically the covid vaccines, are somehow a
liberal thing.
On Fri, Jul 23, 2021 at 11:28 AM Chuck McCown via AF
<af@af.afmug.com <mailto:af@af.afmug.com>> wrote:
If the covid variants kill only unvaccinated, then global
IQ average will increase, right? Always good when your
team wins.
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