On 9/17/20 1:45 PM, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
That's kind of my point. mm2 works for me and my use, I'd much rather
prefer to keep it working than to rip it out and replace it, including
installed and maintaining a database, a framework, a new setup of custom
admin scripts unique to my setup, etc. No one has sold me on mm3 yet.
It's because you don't want to be sold. But I will say this, what you
want as a list owner, and what your list members want are two different
things. They may line up and they may not. But I suspect many list
owners are watching their mm2 lists shrink either in membership size or
posting activity. Communication behavior changes. Social media has had a
tremendous impact on how communications work on the web. Integrations
are very important to a lot of groups. None of these things are possible
with Mailman 2. Mailman 2 is inflexible as your position to not be
swayed to use Mailman 3.
Also your above comments show your unjustified bias against Mailman 3:
"you have to do so many things to use Mailman 3". No you don't. I think
the real culprit is your custom admin scripts that you are using to make
up for whatever shortcomings you found with MM2. You don't want to go
through the task of getting them to work with Mailman 3. Perhaps you
can't. So at least that is a valid point for wanting to stick with MM2.
However that is not the fault of Mailman 3.
I'm not sure what the point of this is. According to
<https://www.mailop.org/about/>;, MAILOP is already on Mailman 3.
They are not, (i'd guess most likely due to overly optimistic views on
how easy a migration to mm3 would be, perhaps they needed a bigger
server or had to hire a database guy, who really knows). What i do know
is that, from a post yesterday, they are still using an old Mailman
version:
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2020 08:37:43 -0500
Subject: Re: [mailop] Spam using bit.ly link shorteners,
this time via Outlook
X-BeenThere:mai...@mailop.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: For mail operators <mailop.mailop.org>
I'd email Simon to ask why the discrepancy, but he's already alluded to
it a few times on their list. Note: he originally planned to started
moving mailop.org to mm3 last December, so he's had plenty of time.
Please let Simon know I can install Mailman 3 and migrate his list to
Mailman 3 within a day.
It appears NANOG has only 3 public Mailman 2.1 lists and only one has
archives pre-dating MM 2.1 which could require attention before
importing to HyperKitty. So list migration via `mailman import21` and
`django-admin hyperkitty_import` should be straightforward.
I guess you are saying that step 1, "First install Mailman 3" would be
the sticking point, but this is the same whether you are NANOG or
mail.python.org or tiny site with one list, and it has been accomplished
multiple times by multiple people. I've documented my experience at
<https://wiki.list.org/x/17891998>;. Brian's take is at
<https://wiki.list.org/x/17892066>;.
I've read both of those links in the past, and honestly that is good
detail to have. What I was looking for in an "elevator pitch" is a 30
second statement on what benefit someone would have by moving to mm3.
Given the time and effort (big or small) why should anyone move to mm3
if their mm2 installation still works and functions fine? There are
people here saying "move to mm3 now!!, etc.", but what's the selling
point?
-Jim P.
I have been posting those selling points frequently. But you are
*inflexible* in your insistence in using MM2.
I will give you a 3 second selling point: *flexibility*, choices, future
new features, searchable archives, a growing community of users, etc.
--
Brian Carpenter
Harmonylists.com
Emwd.com
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