No, I feel VERY strongly against (not hate though.. I did hate Milosovic) BOTH sides in this idiocy.
I also feel that to call something a war crime or someone a war criminal is ranking up there with pedophile or serial child murderer/rapist. It is to be applied carefully as once that bell is rung it can not be unrung. Neither the Israeli nor the Palestinian leadership is after a respectful peace. They are both self serving assholes. That said, when it comes to war crimes... I have seen NOTHING that qualifies from the Israeli side, they have been very careful to walk that line so they can stay as clean as possible in the worlds eyes while executing their plans. Then with basically unlimited resources and weaponry (given the theatre and foe) they can afford to do this and purposely play with the mouse that is Hamas... This should be a war crime but is not. Hamas simply does not get the political side of a conflict. They have broken the accords from Geneva and elsewhere in weaponry used, locating their defensive and offensive weapons, and targets chosen. They DELIBERATELY target civilians and their homes etc. As I have often said... the leaders on both sides should be lined up and shot. I have no preference as to who gets the first bullet or the last. On 1/18/09, lef <[email protected]> wrote: > > Mark, I have followed your posts here for some time now and mostly I > agree with you but on this subject you make no sense at all. It's > clear you feel very strongly against the Palestinians. Hate is an > emotion too. May I suggest you check yours at the door, as well, and > take another look. > > On 18 Jan, 15:24, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: > > No, Mike. War crimes and that which makes them so is carefully defined > > in the covenants. Nothing you are proffering meets the requirements. > > > > I am not justifying anything. I am saying your logic is flawed and > > that it is NOT supported by fact. > > > > By using the acts of Hamas I am pointing out things that DO qualify as > > war crimes. It is, for me, an arguement over legalities. > > confrontations like these have no good and bad, just bad and worse. > > legal definitions do NOT contain or allow room for emotions. I suggest > > you check yours at the door and take another look. > > > > On 1/18/09, liberal mike532 ! <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > the one small detail as you call it is that they are committing war > > > crimes ! > > > and you are trying to justify the indefensible by saying but the > > > Palestinians are bad people too . so fucking what ? they are all bad > > > people people and the war crimes are still being committed ! > > > On Jan 17, 4:14 pm, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Mike, on this issue you are NO different than Gaar. you are paying > > > > attention to one SMALL but not insignificant part of the story and > > > > considering that which sticks in your craw as the ONLY point of view. > > > > > > Phosphorous is legal. Bombing a house where there are combatants is > > > > NOT a crime. Throwing a grenade into your living room is illegal > > > > EXCEPT when an overt threat is directed at me.... it does NOT MATTER > > > > who is there with you. There were shots fired from the UN compound > > > > (not the first time, I have seen it in the Congo) The UN (my > > > > employers) were NOT allowed in the compound yet were (and are), > > > > responsible for those that enter and what is on their persons, they > > > > are trying to deny their responsibilities. To take action against > > > > shots from within or from nearby that compound is NOT a crime. To stop > > > > a boat from entering Israeli waters when that is its STATED and > > > > MANIFESTED purpose is NOT a crime. Israel gave notice to the > > > > international community and shipping about hours and places of > > > > admission... and have complied with that schedule.... the people on > > > > that boat CHOSE to ignore it, they could have been legally sunk. > > > > > > NEXT !!!!! > > > > > > By definition these are NOT in any sense of the word, war crimes. > > > > > > It is Hamas that is steadfastly refusing the cease fire and demanding > > > > unchecked admission to Israel. > > > > > > On 1/17/09, liberal mike532 ! <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > mark are you saying the Israelis have not used phosphorus or bombed > > > > > civilian houses ? oh and lets not forget about bombing the UN camp as > > > > > well as attacking ships in international waters . > > > > > each and every one of these things is a war crime as you well know and > > > > > nothing the palestinians do or did will justify the Jews committing > > > > > war crimes . > > > > > On Jan 17, 3:14 pm, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > You have yet to point to one FACT confirming your position.... you > > > > > > are > > > > > > starting to sound just like Gaar. > > > > > > > > On 1/17/09, liberal mike532 ! <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Do you think Hamas did NOT realize that offensive action would be > > > > > > > > taken when the Israelis were fired on ?? > > > > > > > that has nothing to do with the fact that the Jews are committing > > > > > > > war > > > > > > > crimes ! nothing can justifie commiting war crimes nothing ! > > > > > > > On Jan 17, 12:35 pm, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > It seems that you overlooked this one small point. > > > > > > > > > > Do you think Hamas did NOT realize that offensive action would > > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > taken when the Israelis were fired on ?? They knew. They did > > > > > > > > not care. > > > > > > > > > > Mike, if you shoot at me from your family room and it is full of > > > > > > > > peole... I'm shooting back. Where the confrontation takes place > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > your choice and the results (based on location) on your head. > > > > > > > > > > Israeli PM Olmert said Hamas militants had fired at Israeli > > > > > > > > troops > > > > > > > > from the location. > > > > > > > > > > Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert said the military fired > > > > > > > > artillery > > > > > > > > shells at the U.N. compound after Hamas militants opened fire > > > > > > > > from the > > > > > > > > location. Three people were wounded. > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 10:18 AM, liberal mike532 ! > > > > > > > > > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Israeli Forces Shell UN Headquarters in Gaza > > > > > > > > >http://www.truthout.org/011509C > > > > > > > > > Ibrahim Barzak and Amy Teibel, The Associated Press: "Israeli > > > > > > > > > forces > > > > > > > > > shelled the United Nations headquarters in the Gaza Strip on > > > > > > > > > Thursday, > > > > > > > > > setting fire to the compound filled with hundreds of refugees > > > > > > > > > as U.N. > > > > > > > > > chief Ban Ki-moon was in the region on a mission to end > > > > > > > > > Israel's > > > > > > > > > devastating offensive against the territory's Hamas rulers." > > > > > > > > > > > On Jan 17, 10:15 am, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > >> What proof do you have of that Mike?? > > > > > > > > > > >> The crime being committed is the use of non-combatants as > > > > > > > > >> fodder. > > > > > > > > > > >> There is no proof Israel has used a single illegal weapon, > > > > > > > > >> targeted a > > > > > > > > >> single spot without proof a combatant was there, or > > > > > > > > >> prosecuted the war > > > > > > > > >> with unnecessary force. > > > > > > > > > > >> Yet Hamas demands unfettered access to Israel as one of > > > > > > > > >> their demands. > > > > > > > > >> Hell, it takes a passport to enter canada and mexico now.... > > > > > > > > >> no one > > > > > > > > >> gets unfettered access to anyone elses country. Talk about > > > > > > > > >> unreal and > > > > > > > > >> knowing it !! > > > > > > > > > > >> On 1/17/09, liberal mike532 ! <[email protected]> > > > > > > > > >> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >> > not one word of that has anything to do the Jews > > > > > > > > >> > committing war > > > > > > > > >> > crimes ! > > > > > > > > > > >> > On Jan 17, 9:46 am, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > >> > > Margareth, > > > > > > > > > > >> > > Being nice did not work. The Moslem fanatics can not > > > > > > > > >> > > allow it to work. > > > > > > > > >> > > It is absolutely counter to their goals and hoped for > > > > > > > > >> > > control of every > > > > > > > > >> > > aspect of the lives of every Moslem to allow it to do so. > > > > > > > > > > >> > > Just imagine what would happen to their doctrine if rule > > > > > > > > >> > > of > > > > > > > > >> > > non-secular law were to function in the very heart of > > > > > > > > >> > > their > > > > > > > > >> > > territories. > > > > > > > > > > >> > > On 1/17/09, margareth <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > If you check the map of Palestine, and Gaza, it would > > > > > > > > >> > > > be useful if you > > > > > > > > >> > > > remember that the country is smaller than most North > > > > > > > > >> > > > American > > > > > > > > >> > > > counties, and holds 1.4 million residents. Of course > > > > > > > > >> > > > they are aiming > > > > > > > > >> > > > at civilian targets.... it would be hard to miss them. > > > > > > > > >> > > > Having said > > > > > > > > >> > > > that, the Israelis are their own worst enemies in > > > > > > > > >> > > > this situation, The > > > > > > > > >> > > > destruction of Gaza and all the people in it is the > > > > > > > > >> > > > most likely result > > > > > > > > >> > > > if they persist with the bombs, etc. It is the > > > > > > > > >> > > > Israelis who seem to > > > > > > > > >> > > > have a surplus of armaments for this purpose. Just > > > > > > > > >> > > > who is likely to > > > > > > > > >> > > > profit from this war? > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > On Jan 17, 3:16 am, "liberal mike532 !" > > > > > > > > >> > > > <[email protected]> > > > > > > > > >> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > >> > > > > can you dispute an of the points i have made with > > > > > > > > >> > > > > facts? > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > On Jan 16, 3:49 pm, frankg <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > That is just NOT true, It is very unlike you. > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > That's kinda funny, actually. I think this is very > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > much like Mike, who > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > will exaggerate, embellish or fabricate whatever > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > is required to make > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > his point. > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > On Jan 16, 1:45 pm, Mark <[email protected]> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > That is just NOT true, It is very unlike you. > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > The phosphorous is allowed as an obscurant. > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > There has been no proof of > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > TARGETING civilians. If the UN (my ex boss) does > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > not want its camps > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > hit then they need to keep them free of > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > combatants (it is one of their > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > responsibilities). > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > It is completely legal to target combatants > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > regardless of where they > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > set up camp. This includes day care centers and > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > schools and hospitals > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > and nursing homes. > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > On 1/16/09, liberal mike532 ! > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > the Jews have been using white phoperous on > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > civilians which is a war > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > crime and have been targeting civilians not to > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > mention a UN refuge > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > camp . > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > On Jan 16, 11:36 am, THE ANNOINTED ONE > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > No, Mike, they are not. They have not used a > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > single banned weapon or > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > tactic. > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > They have not targeted a single location > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > that did not have > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > combatants. > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > There is no proof to the contrary. This can > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > NOT be said for Hamas or > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > the Gazan people. > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > The fact that women and children are in the > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > locations where the > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Palestinian combatants set up shop speaks to > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > the value they place on > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > their own people. It also shows the > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > non-combatants basic intelligence > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > for staying with their women and children > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > (or actually bringing them > > > > ... > > > > läs mer »- Dölj citerad text - > > > > - Visa citerad text - > > > -- Mark M. Kahle Blessed are the bewildered for they don't know the difference.... Me --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. * Read the latest breaking news, and more. -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
