Re: [AFMUG] Ceragon/820C XPIC way off?

[Sterling Jacobson]

Ok. so I guess it’s sell/exchange this radio set and get one within license 
bounds.

Or change my license to match the radio set.



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Darin Steffl
Sent: Saturday, October 21, 2017 4:09 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Ceragon/820C XPIC way off?

The range is printed on the radio with the serial number. It should be obvious 
what the range supports for that radio.

You cannot change the range the radio operates in. You would need a different 
radio head to support the band you want to operate in.

On Oct 21, 2017 4:52 PM, "Sterling Jacobson" 
mailto:sterl...@avative.net>> wrote:
I figured this out.

No one told me, and I wasn't aware, that these Ceragon Radios has a fixed TX 
and RX range per sku/hardware.

So I was trying to operate the radio a bit out of range of the hardware I guess.

How do I change the TX/RX range for each of my Ceragon radios, and how 
expensive is that??

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Friday, September 29, 2017 11:25 AM
To: 'af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>' mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Subject: [AFMUG] Ceragon/820C XPIC way off?

Trying to aim up these pair of radios in XPIC and it looks like I've got a lot 
of issues.

This is just from trying to peak one side today.

I'll try more on the other side.

But it also appears that I've got a huge difference between the H and V radios 
in dB.

I mean, is a 7dB difference equivalent to like several degrees off in H/V 
rotation?

Our people tried to rotate the radio with the given groove/slack in the radio 
mount, but didn't seem to change anything.

[AFMUG] Ceragon

[Sterling Jacobson]

Is there a market for used Ceragon 11GHz radios?

I need to "swap" my radio set in the 11GHz range to match my licensed range.

So I need the 'lower' band range and I need the 'higher' band range in the 
11GHz.

My antennas and OMT etc are all good to go, just the radios are not in the 
range I need.

Re: [AFMUG] Ceragon

[Sterling Jacobson]

My model number is IP-20C-HP-11-500-7W13-H-ESX and L-ESX.

I can't even find the model number on the Ceragon web site.

What is the difference between my radio and the one listed that is: 
IP-20C-HP-11w-500.00-6W12-H-ESX

Is mine just plain outdated?
Is there any advantage of the 'new' one over mine, or vice versa?



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2017 2:25 PM
To: 'af@afmug.com' 
Subject: [AFMUG] Ceragon

Is there a market for used Ceragon 11GHz radios?

I need to "swap" my radio set in the 11GHz range to match my licensed range.

So I need the 'lower' band range and I need the 'higher' band range in the 
11GHz.

My antennas and OMT etc are all good to go, just the radios are not in the 
range I need.

Re: [AFMUG] Ceragon

[Sterling Jacobson]

This is the license, 11325 and 10835 and 80Mhz widths I think?

Maybe the coordinator can find out if it can be changed?

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of John Seaman
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2017 4:42 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Ceragon

These radios have diplexers (essentially filters) installed which limit them to 
operate in various sub-sections of the 11 GHz band.  Assuming these sub-band 
numbers correspond to Cambium's, The 7W13 in the part number corresponds to 
10915-11207MHz / 11425-11725MHz which covers the upper part of the band.  6W12 
corresponds to 10895-11205MHz  / 11385-11705MHz which is only 20 MHz lower and 
mostly overlaps with 7W13.  These sub-bands are nearly identical. 

What is the frequency and channel width on your coordination?


-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jon Langeler
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2017 2:24 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Ceragon

I could be wrong but you don’t have the wideband channel support. Otherwise it 
all relates to the filters installed. 

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


> On Oct 30, 2017, at 5:17 PM, Sterling Jacobson  wrote:
> 
> My model number is IP-20C-HP-11-500-7W13-H-ESX and L-ESX.
> 
> I can't even find the model number on the Ceragon web site.
> 
> What is the difference between my radio and the one listed that is: 
> IP-20C-HP-11w-500.00-6W12-H-ESX
> 
> Is mine just plain outdated?
> Is there any advantage of the 'new' one over mine, or vice versa?
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-----
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Jacobson
> Sent: Monday, October 30, 2017 2:25 PM
> To: 'af@afmug.com' 
> Subject: [AFMUG] Ceragon
> 
> Is there a market for used Ceragon 11GHz radios?
> 
> I need to "swap" my radio set in the 11GHz range to match my licensed range.
> 
> So I need the 'lower' band range and I need the 'higher' band range in the 
> 11GHz.
> 
> My antennas and OMT etc are all good to go, just the radios are not in the 
> range I need.

[AFMUG] DHCP Server Redundancy Survey

[Sterling Jacobson]

I want to do a more flexible/standard setup for my DHCP handouts.

I hand out public IPv4 and IPv6 dual stack to each customer router from two 
main routers on my network.

Is it best to create two redundant DHCP servers instead and use DHCP Relay 
on-net to them?

And how is everyone doing that?

I'm guessing it's probably best to have those two redundant DHCP servers be 
RADIUS controlled so billing systems can easily integrate with them.

[AFMUG] Viable/buyable unlicensed 60GHz 1Gbps PtMP

[Sterling Jacobson]

It sounds like there isn't any available/viable 60GHz PtMP product yet.

Any ideas on who is going to bring out the first readily available 1Gbps PtMP 
product that actually works?

Re: [AFMUG] Viable/buyable unlicensed 60GHz 1Gbps PtMP

[Sterling Jacobson]

Local WISPs have tried both and they are either unavailable for purchase in 
quantity, and/or suck in actual practice/usage.

Has anyone hear actually gotten more than one AP working from either company, 
and is happy with near 1Gbps performance on PtMP spread over an area of more 
than a handful of CPE in a single ‘line’ area?

I doubt it.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jason McKemie
Sent: Tuesday, October 31, 2017 4:03 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Viable/buyable unlicensed 60GHz 1Gbps PtMP

Yes, I thought both of these were already on the market.

On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, Jeff Broadwick - Lists 
mailto:jeffl...@att.net>> wrote:
Siklu and Ignite.Net.

Jeff Broadwick
CTIconnect
312-205-2519 Office
574-220-7826 Cell
jbroadw...@cticonnect.com

> On Oct 31, 2017, at 5:58 PM, Sterling Jacobson 
> > wrote:
>
> It sounds like there isn't any available/viable 60GHz PtMP product yet.
>
> Any ideas on who is going to bring out the first readily available 1Gbps PtMP 
> product that actually works?

Re: [AFMUG] Viable/buyable unlicensed 60GHz 1Gbps PtMP

[Sterling Jacobson]

That would be helpful because the testing and work I’ve been told about from 
firsthand users so far is a no go.

I did a similar writeup and test of the Motorola/Cambium 400 Platform years ago 
in my area.
That is what I would like to see. Some provider with multiple AP’s across a 360 
degree geography with real world throughput results and analysis of management 
software and platform etc.

Something like this slide deck which used data and pictures from our system way 
back in the day, lol!

http://slideplayer.com/slide/8497605/



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 10:47 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Viable/buyable unlicensed 60GHz 1Gbps PtMP

Not saying they have not published, just that I have not seen any publications. 
 If there is a real world deployment with positive results that can be 
verified, the vendors should not be bashful about crowing about it.  They all 
know they are free to post white papers here.

From: Faisal Imtiaz
Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 10:19 AM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Viable/buyable unlicensed 60GHz 1Gbps PtMP

Fair point Chuck..

But the trend lately has been to have such posts on their Blogs, and Social 
Media Pages...

I have seen presentations, documents from both Ignitenet & Siklu along those 
lines that you have expressed.

Regards.

Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet & Telecom
http://www.snappytelecom.net

Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: 
supp...@snappytelecom.net<mailto:supp...@snappytelecom.net>


From: ch...@wbmfg.com<mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 10:51:13 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Viable/buyable unlicensed 60GHz 1Gbps PtMP
Normally, the vendors of this kind of thing will publish a white paper showing 
a deployment.
Showing maps, distances, photos, signal strengths, performance specs.
Stuff you can verify.  Maybe those white papers are out there for 60 GHz but I 
have not seen any.
Tons of this kind of thing from Mot and Cambium over the years.

From: Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Tuesday, October 31, 2017 4:13 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Viable/buyable unlicensed 60GHz 1Gbps PtMP

Local WISPs have tried both and they are either unavailable for purchase in 
quantity, and/or suck in actual practice/usage.

Has anyone hear actually gotten more than one AP working from either company, 
and is happy with near 1Gbps performance on PtMP spread over an area of more 
than a handful of CPE in a single ‘line’ area?

I doubt it.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jason McKemie
Sent: Tuesday, October 31, 2017 4:03 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Viable/buyable unlicensed 60GHz 1Gbps PtMP

Yes, I thought both of these were already on the market.

On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, Jeff Broadwick - Lists 
mailto:jeffl...@att.net>> wrote:
Siklu and Ignite.Net.

Jeff Broadwick
CTIconnect
312-205-2519 Office
574-220-7826 Cell
jbroadw...@cticonnect.com<mailto:jbroadw...@cticonnect.com>

> On Oct 31, 2017, at 5:58 PM, Sterling Jacobson 
> mailto:sterl...@avative.net>> wrote:
>
> It sounds like there isn't any available/viable 60GHz PtMP product yet.
>
> Any ideas on who is going to bring out the first readily available 1Gbps PtMP 
> product that actually works?

Re: [AFMUG] Boring under 20ft of concrete

[Sterling Jacobson]

If it means anything to anyone about this, Comcast contractors are now 
installing their Comcast conduit all through my neighborhood right now.

They appear to be using those pumping/rocket type system to install the conduit 
under long runs of concrete driveways.

Takes them about an hour each one.

It does amuse me that they are paying to have all this installed when I already 
own over 80 percent of the customers here.

I’m sure they have no clue I am here with 1Gbps fiber already.
They must think it’s all crappy CenturyLink DSL they are going to be competing 
with…

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jason McKemie
Sent: Friday, November 3, 2017 12:16 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Boring under 20ft of concrete

That went through pretty easy for that guy...

[https://ipmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange-animated-no-repeat-v1.gif]

Virus-free. 
www.avast.com


On Fri, Nov 3, 2017 at 9:28 AM, Matt 
mailto:matt.mailingli...@gmail.com>> wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q4p1_B8ZYNQ

On Thu, Nov 2, 2017 at 5:02 PM, TJ Trout 
mailto:t...@voltbb.com>> wrote:
> Getting a new well installed and the pump guy wants to cut 3ft x 20ft out of
> my patio, surely this could be bored (only needs 1 1/4 to 1-1/2 line) any
> ideas that aren't super difficult?

Re: [AFMUG] Boring under 20ft of concrete

[Sterling Jacobson]

I don’t know specifics, but its on a regular truck and makes a repeating loud 
knocking noise which is really annoying.

It’s connected to the truck with an air hose I think, and they sort of load up 
the long length of schedule conduit in the hole and push it through along with 
it.



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jason McKemie
Sent: Friday, November 3, 2017 12:38 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Boring under 20ft of concrete

What kind of equipment are they using for this?

On Fri, Nov 3, 2017 at 1:19 PM, Sterling Jacobson 
mailto:sterl...@avative.net>> wrote:
If it means anything to anyone about this, Comcast contractors are now 
installing their Comcast conduit all through my neighborhood right now.

They appear to be using those pumping/rocket type system to install the conduit 
under long runs of concrete driveways.

Takes them about an hour each one.

It does amuse me that they are paying to have all this installed when I already 
own over 80 percent of the customers here.

I’m sure they have no clue I am here with 1Gbps fiber already.
They must think it’s all crappy CenturyLink DSL they are going to be competing 
with…

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Jason McKemie
Sent: Friday, November 3, 2017 12:16 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Boring under 20ft of concrete

That went through pretty easy for that guy...

[https://ipmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange-animated-no-repeat-v1.gif]<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon>

Virus-free. 
www.avast.com<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=link>


On Fri, Nov 3, 2017 at 9:28 AM, Matt 
mailto:matt.mailingli...@gmail.com>> wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q4p1_B8ZYNQ

On Thu, Nov 2, 2017 at 5:02 PM, TJ Trout 
mailto:t...@voltbb.com>> wrote:
> Getting a new well installed and the pump guy wants to cut 3ft x 20ft out of
> my patio, surely this could be bored (only needs 1 1/4 to 1-1/2 line) any
> ideas that aren't super difficult?

Re: [AFMUG] Facebook Ireland IP flooding traffic

[Sterling Jacobson]

Also Brett, you might want to keep in mind geo-location for your IPv4 space.

If the subnet you are using is still showing on some geo services as another 
state or country weird things can happen with CDN routing etc.



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Tuesday, November 7, 2017 7:16 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook Ireland IP flooding traffic

Thanks Mike.
Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

On Nov 7, 2017, at 5:35 PM, Mike Hammett 
mailto:af...@ics-il.net>> wrote:
Upload or download? Download, I assume?

Contact their NOC, contact info here: https://peeringdb.com/net/979


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
Midwest Internet Exchange
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
The Brothers WISP
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]




From: "Brett A Mansfield" 
mailto:li...@silverlakeinternet.com>>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 7, 2017 5:14:17 PM
Subject: [AFMUG] Facebook Ireland IP flooding traffic

I have a customer that is using 3x the bandwidth all my remaining customers on 
the same leg of the network use. The traffic is almost all from the same IP 
address.

31.13.70.51

I was thinking a torrent VPN service, but this shows as a Facebook IP in the 
RIPE region and is registered as a direct assign to Facebook Ireland. Any idea 
what can cause this IP to have a nearly consistent 100Mb of bandwidth?

I asked the customer and he said that he doesn’t do any torrenting and he 
thought it might be game updates (he is a PC gamer). I’ve seen what game 
updates do, and it’s nothing like this.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

Re: [AFMUG] Facebook Ireland IP flooding traffic

[Sterling Jacobson]

For the rented IPv4 space they might have tools, or be responsible, for fixing 
such geo location and blacklist type problems.

That would be another good reason to use IPv4 rented instead of auction in some 
cases.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Tuesday, November 7, 2017 8:14 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook Ireland IP flooding traffic

This customer has been doing this prior to implementing the new IPs.

The new subnet is for NJ, so I’ve submitted tickets to get that adjusted. 
Hopefully that happens soon. For some reason nobody on my new subnet can load 
ksl.com<http://ksl.com> either. That seems to be the only url to have this 
issue so far.
Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

On Nov 7, 2017, at 7:22 PM, Sterling Jacobson 
mailto:sterl...@avative.net>> wrote:
Also Brett, you might want to keep in mind geo-location for your IPv4 space.

If the subnet you are using is still showing on some geo services as another 
state or country weird things can happen with CDN routing etc.



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Tuesday, November 7, 2017 7:16 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook Ireland IP flooding traffic

Thanks Mike.
Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

On Nov 7, 2017, at 5:35 PM, Mike Hammett 
mailto:af...@ics-il.net>> wrote:
Upload or download? Download, I assume?

Contact their NOC, contact info here: https://peeringdb.com/net/979


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions<http://www.ics-il.com/>
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png]<https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]<https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
Midwest Internet Exchange<http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]<https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
The Brothers WISP<http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]


<https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>

From: "Brett A Mansfield" 
mailto:li...@silverlakeinternet.com>>
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 7, 2017 5:14:17 PM
Subject: [AFMUG] Facebook Ireland IP flooding traffic

I have a customer that is using 3x the bandwidth all my remaining customers on 
the same leg of the network use. The traffic is almost all from the same IP 
address.

31.13.70.51

I was thinking a torrent VPN service, but this shows as a Facebook IP in the 
RIPE region and is registered as a direct assign to Facebook Ireland. Any idea 
what can cause this IP to have a nearly consistent 100Mb of bandwidth?

I asked the customer and he said that he doesn’t do any torrenting and he 
thought it might be game updates (he is a PC gamer). I’ve seen what game 
updates do, and it’s nothing like this.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

Re: [AFMUG] voip

[Sterling Jacobson]

I don’t have staff for that, so I don’t do it.

We did have good success with it years ago having it in house, but we also had 
larger business clients with 100’s of phone lines on it.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Wednesday, November 8, 2017 7:30 AM
To: Animal Farm 
Subject: [AFMUG] voip

Big question here.
Is it worth it to be a voip provider? With all the paperwork and 911 stuff?
How is everyone doing this?
If your paying for hosted what end user rates do you charge?
--
[cid:image001.jpg@01D35881.920409C0]

Re: [AFMUG] Blocked by the major streaming providers after getting new subnet

[Sterling Jacobson]

Vudu is the worst.

Again, see if the renting company will help you deal with it.

But essentially you have to just call support on each one and get through to 
someone that knows WTH is going on.

And, have customers contact support and explain that they don't live in a 
different country  and are not on a VPN.
That helps a lot too, both parties can hit it at the same time.

Eventually what happens is they take the /24 or whatever and whitelist it in 
their database.

Also, a lot of the CDNs use a service themselves for blacklist and if you fix 
it with that service, it fixes it for a large number of them simultaneously.


-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Wednesday, November 8, 2017 10:35 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Blocked by the major streaming providers after getting new 
subnet

Anyone have contacts at Hulu, Vudu, Netflix or any of the other major streaming 
providers? 

I just leased a new subnet and it is being blocked by their servers for 
“proxy”. There are no proxies on my network. 

I dealt with this a while back, but now it is happening again.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

Re: [AFMUG] IPArchitechs

[Sterling Jacobson]

Similar case with me which I kind of already pointed out.

They couldn’t figure out a BGP issue and wanted to virtualize and put in a lab 
and spend hours on top of hours analyzing.

I stopped them right there and said no thanks to that.

Then I called Dennis and he took a few minutes, found out it likely wasn’t my 
problem, and worked with my upstream provider to fix it.

And it was fixed after some emails back and forth between all of us.

I asked IPArchitechs to refund me since they had charged me hundreds of dollars 
to get nowhere.
One of their sales guys made out a personal check to me for some reason, 
claiming his reputation was on the line or something like that.
I think it was a shady play at emotions, but I don’t have many emotions, so it 
didn’t work with me, lol!

I took whatever little money they could refund me, however they wanted to 
refund and ‘play’ that.
Then they gave me credit which I still have, to use.

Likely I’ll not be doing BGP stuff with them, but maybe they will do something 
more benign, like standard server work.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of can...@believewireless.net
Sent: Thursday, November 9, 2017 10:01 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] IPArchitechs

We used them once and we weren't happy. I wanted to give them a try to see how 
they compared to others.
What I thought was a simple BGP issue that could have been handled with a 15-30 
minute phone call ended
up taking over two weeks. They "needed" to get our router configs and 
virtualize them in their network. Then
figure out which interfaces were backhaul links, etc.

They then came up with a crazy network design that, to me, made no sense. After 
them burning a lot of hours
on that, a simple call at the end of that process amounted to just creating a 
single EoIP tunnel to fix the issue.

So my thought is they want to burn hours whenever they can.

On Thu, Nov 9, 2017 at 10:04 AM, Paul McCall 
mailto:pa...@pdmnet.net>> wrote:
So, IPArchitechsis there a current consensus on whether they are worth 
investing time with?   We are looking to layer BGP within (or upon) our OSPF 
network to better control traffic between towers, subnets, etc.

IPA talked a good game, but we didn't roll out with them.

Any thoughts?

Paul

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Dennis Burgess
Sent: Tuesday, August 8, 2017 1:47 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] IPArchitechs

We are always here :)


Dennis Burgess - Network Solution Engineer - Consultant MikroTik Certified 
Trainer/Consultant - MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE

For Wireless Hardware/Routers visit www.linktechs.net<http://www.linktechs.net> 
Radio Frequency Coverages: www.towercoverage.com<http://www.towercoverage.com>
Office: 314-735-0270
E-Mail: dmburg...@linktechs.net<mailto:dmburg...@linktechs.net>


-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Tuesday, August 8, 2017 12:45 PM
To: 'af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>' mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Subject: [AFMUG] IPArchitechs
That company was a bust.

So I'm looking again for a professional team/company that can professionally 
handle my network contracting needs in a reasonable time frame.

Dennis, I'll be asking for your help again in the meantime as soon as I get 
refunded from IPArchitechs.

Re: [AFMUG] PPS limits

[Sterling Jacobson]

Most standard routers would die on that much pps of that size.

If you look on routerboard.com at the mikrotik stuff, they have charts at the 
bottom of most of their gear that show how much traffic they can move given the 
packet size and pps and Mbps etc.

Compare that with the CPU and you can get an idea of what it takes to 
switch/router or packet inspect stuff with rules.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Zach Underwood
Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2017 2:32 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] PPS limits

I am trying to put some ddos attacks in perspective in terms of pps.

Here are two examples
545.4 Mbps/2.4 Mpps udp packet size less than 150byte
2.0 Gbps/8.5 Mpps udp packet size less than 150byte

What size router would fall over with 1+ Mpps of traffic.
example ubnt ER-8 clams 2Mpps.


--
Zach Underwood (RHCE,RHCSA,RHCT,UACA)
My website
advance-networking.com

Re: [AFMUG] 4k tv

[Sterling Jacobson]

I have a 65” and sit about 12 feet away.

You can tell the 4k content difference from 1080p, it’s a nice upgrade, but not 
something you really miss if it’s not there.

I think you see it a lot more if you project like 120” screen and are 14 feet 
away.

That’s where it starts to really come out, on the bigger screens, sitting 
closer to the content.

As far as content, a lot of the TV shows from the last two years on most 
content providers is 4k available.

Vudu is good with 4k as is a lot of Netflix stuff.

Some recent movies as well, but a lot are still provided in 1080 instead.

Can’t speak to satellite TV since I haven’t had that in years.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of CBB - Jay Fuller
Sent: Monday, November 20, 2017 1:54 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 4k tv


I had about an hour to kill this afternoon so I spent it in Costco roaming 
around...

Some of the pictures on the Samsung TVs that are UTV or even Beyond UTV are 
absolutely astonishing.

At the end of the TV section was the DirecTV rep.  I have DirecTV satellite and 
I like my high definition picture and my high-definition home projector.

All of my TV's in my home were purchased in the last five to ten years and 
they're all HD capable.  Most are smart TVs that run apps but the apps don't 
ever update and you pretty much get what the TV has and that's it

So I decided to get all excited I had a little money burning a hole in my 
pocket I thought I would grab one of these super duper Samsung Ultra 
high-definition televisions.  Ok not really but lets pretend I did

I told the DirecTV lady when HD first came out it took the broadcasters a while 
to start broadcasting in HD. I asked her for a list of which channels broadcast 
in 4kShe gave me the list

104.DTV4k
105cine4k
106Live4k

BasicallyNONE

How much programming on Netflix is in 4k? I am aware of the extreme bandwidth 
requirements

And guaranteed if I got a hacked Amazon Fire stick it's not going to show me 
anything in 4k

What is the point? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? Bueller?


Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Smartphone

Re: [AFMUG] Residential router recommendation.

[Sterling Jacobson]

My main recommendations now are Asus and Netgear Nighthawk (NOT regular 
Netgear, those suck).

I don't provide routers to our customers, so I'm thinking we now have hundreds 
of either brand/line of these routers and they seem to be the least failure 
prone.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jay Weekley
Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2017 9:43 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Residential router recommendation.

I have a friend that is looking for a new router from a big box store 
like Best Buy, Walmart or Officemax.   Since I've been using Mikrotiks 
and the occasional Readynet and TPlink for the past several years I have no 
idea what to tell them to get.  It's not for a customer and I will hopefully 
have nothing to do with this router.  If you were me what would you tell them 
to get?

Re: [AFMUG] Jeff Evans query?

[Sterling Jacobson]

Have you tried Amazon for distribution?

I have no idea how that works, but I do notice a large variety of odd things 
now available via amazon, some with free 2-day shipping.

Honestly, the distro model is dead except the large players like Amazon now, 
and good riddance.

At least Amazon can have some accountability and rating/feedback that helps 
buyers etc.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Forrest Christian (List 
Account)
Sent: Tuesday, December 5, 2017 3:32 PM
To: af 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Jeff Evans query?

I'm getting really sick of distributors asking me for a deep discount, extended 
length net terms, and to drop ship all of their orders to their customers.  
There's a reason why we haven't gone down this path.



On Tue, Dec 5, 2017 at 1:05 PM, Steve Jones 
mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Distributors that dont maintain accurate web based on hand/out of stock are the 
devils condom. I hate them. The only thing worse is the ones that lie and you 
get an order in with a "drop ship from mfg" F those guys, they take your money 
right quick, thats for sure

On Tue, Dec 5, 2017 at 10:27 AM, mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> 
wrote:
We offer dry storage, sequestered inventory and order fulfillment to all 
distributors so they can stock at our warehouse, ship from our warehouse, and 
keep from paying double freight (for the galvanized steel parts).  Some take 
advantage of this and some don't.

-Original Message- From: ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 5, 2017 9:26 AM
To: af@afmug.com

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Jeff Evans query?

We try, our restock level is approx equivalent to a 30 day inventory, but we
are constantly having runs on one particular part or another and then when a
distributor wants something dropped we don't have it and they attempt to
blame us.

The main reason to use a two tier distribution network is so that the
distributors have inventory, not us.  That is how they add value.  Otherwise
I would just sell direct.

We build to forecast and to order but the channel that stocks is the channel
that gets the sales.

Some of our distributors are much better than than others with this.

-Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
Sent: Tuesday, December 5, 2017 9:22 AM
To: ch...@wbmfg.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Jeff Evans query?

Wouldn't this be on you to make sure you have proper stock levels to
absorb the 20-30 day time frames?

I know there have been times when I've waited to get mounts because they
were drop shipping but "we didn't know when the supplier would have the
parts in".

On 12/5/17 11:14 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
I got a note from a guy saying that Jeff Evans was looking for stock on our 
tower mount products.
Some of our distributors stock, some don’t.  We have most of the stuff on our 
e-commerce site but it is MSRP.  You get discounts from going to the 
distributors.
Not sure if there was a specific product in question or not.  I don’t have 
visibility into the inventory levels of my distributors so I can never answer 
as to what they may or may not have.  If you hit me off list I can give an 
opinion as to who may have them.
I will say this: those distributors that do stock sell much more than those 
that don’t and expect us to drop ship for them.  We may not always have the 
stuff depending on production cycles.  We have a huge unknown in the cycle due 
to the galvanization.  Sometimes the company that dips the parts can turn them 
around in 2-3 days, other times it is 20 or 30 days.





--
Forrest Christian CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc.
Tel: 406-449-3345 | Address: 3577 Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602
forre...@imach.com | 
http://www.packetflux.com
[https://s3.amazonaws.com/images.wisestamp.com/icons/linkedin.png]
 [https://s3.amazonaws.com/images.wisestamp.com/icons/facebook.png] 
  
[https://s3.amazonaws.com/images.wisestamp.com/icons/twitter.png] 

Re: [AFMUG] OT HDD lessons

[Sterling Jacobson]

Lol!

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2017 8:33 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] OT HDD lessons

Learn when to stop boring:
https://facebook.com/streetfx/videos/10160258906695112/

Re: [AFMUG] Fiber media converters

[Sterling Jacobson]

No to hijack, but are there any simple or managed media converters from SFP+ 
10Gbps SMF to Ethernet/Copper 2.5 and 5Gbps or even 10Gbps over Cat6?

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jay Weekley
Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2017 3:58 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber media converters

I ran into this recommendation in a previous post.

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIABCW6678914&ignorebbr=1&nm_mc=KNC-GoogleMKP-PC&cm_mmc=KNC-GoogleMKP-PC-_-pla-_-Network+-+Transceivers-_-9SIABCW6678914&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIvbiZn8mW2AIVCgaRCh3EbwoBEAQYASABEgLrrfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Jay Weekley wrote:
> Looking for recommendations for a gigabit media converter that takes 
> SC connectors.  I've pulled a few recommendations from a previous 
> thread but am looking for a few more.
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> http://www.avg.com
>
>

[AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

[Sterling Jacobson]

So here is a current update on my months long progress moving from Platypus to 
Sonar.

It's not automatic by any means.

Data import is taking a long time and its painful and costs a lot extra.

I'm having to manually correct/add accounts to Sonar with rate group changes, 
address validations etc.

They appear to be understaffed.

A lot of their system isn't theirs too, which is OK I guess, just didn't 
realize that.

Import is a third party process if you don't want to do it yourself.
Actual payment site isn't them, you host it yourself or get a hosting company, 
and have to maintain it yourself.
Paper statements are not directly them, you have to set up a third party 
account and pay/manage them.

This is just a 'simple' import of billing function only.

I didn't even have any network information for any accounts, so I shudder to 
think how that would have migrated.

Also I didn't really see them emphasizing the fact that their database and Plat 
could get seriously out of synch if you are not careful.

I've had to manually suspend everything in Platypus to assure data isn't out of 
sync with the new system until it comes online.

That means it's been days of people calling/contacting me trying to pay bills 
and I'm stuck in the middle.

Don't want to roll back since I've spent so many hours now on migration.

Can't go forward yet because I'm still waiting on massive fixes to rates on 
customers, and web site creation/setup for billing.

Let's just say I'm excited to get onboarding done and running, but I'm also 
crying because it's not there yet and help is slow to come some days.

Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

[Sterling Jacobson]

Sure, in my spare time I'll just create some DB scripts and then go through 
every account to make sure it worked out and reload.

Oh wait, how is that saving me time and money?

It isn't.

I elected to take their import, do some brief overview to make sure things were 
generally ok.
Then modify/update the ones that have problems.

Though that takes time, it's still less effort than starting from scratch.

What I was told was it would be easy to migrate in a day or two and get running.

So not the case.



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 1:36 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

If I recall correctly, the Sonar documentation suggested using the API to write 
a script to set everything up.  I think the idea is you can test your import 
script, then just blow away the Sonar instance and try again if you have 
problems.  Repeat until your script does everything you want.  Then when flag 
day comes you have a well tested process.

I know I heard that somewhereif it wasn't in the docs it might have been in 
one of the videos.

-Adam


-- Original Message ------
From: "Sterling Jacobson" 
To: "af@afmug.com" 
Sent: 1/10/2018 2:51:58 PM
Subject: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

>So here is a current update on my months long progress moving from 
>Platypus to Sonar.
>
>It's not automatic by any means.
>
>Data import is taking a long time and its painful and costs a lot 
>extra.
>
>I'm having to manually correct/add accounts to Sonar with rate group 
>changes, address validations etc.
>
>They appear to be understaffed.
>
>A lot of their system isn't theirs too, which is OK I guess, just 
>didn't realize that.
>
>Import is a third party process if you don't want to do it yourself.
>Actual payment site isn't them, you host it yourself or get a hosting 
>company, and have to maintain it yourself.
>Paper statements are not directly them, you have to set up a third 
>party account and pay/manage them.
>
>This is just a 'simple' import of billing function only.
>
>I didn't even have any network information for any accounts, so I 
>shudder to think how that would have migrated.
>
>Also I didn't really see them emphasizing the fact that their database 
>and Plat could get seriously out of synch if you are not careful.
>
>I've had to manually suspend everything in Platypus to assure data 
>isn't out of sync with the new system until it comes online.
>
>That means it's been days of people calling/contacting me trying to pay 
>bills and I'm stuck in the middle.
>
>Don't want to roll back since I've spent so many hours now on 
>migration.
>
>Can't go forward yet because I'm still waiting on massive fixes to 
>rates on customers, and web site creation/setup for billing.
>
>Let's just say I'm excited to get onboarding done and running, but I'm 
>also crying because it's not there yet and help is slow to come some 
>days.
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

[Sterling Jacobson]

Well, I manually fixed all my account types.

Now, a week later, the billing portal hosted part is showing up, BUT nothing 
works, no login and their guy Jacob is MIA again.

I’ve had accounts and cash flow FROZEN for a week for this.

It’s crazy, I’m about to lose my mind with SONAR.

Damnit!


From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 8:30 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

My wife had a temp job once re-entering accounts for an insurance company which 
was migrating systems.
As long as the human meat computer operating the keyboard is smart enough to 
solve more problems than they create then it sounds good in theory.


-- Original Message --
From: "CBB - Jay Fuller" 
mailto:par...@cyberbroadband.net>>
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: 1/10/2018 6:05:02 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus



we have done something like 3...maybe 4 purchases of networks upwards to 350 
customers / devices.  Each time I've had our people manually enter data.  Too 
risk adverse of import problems or things not working right.  I've had them do 
the data entry and I've come behind them to check everything.  I'm not sure at 
this point I'd do it any other way.   I remember Evan doing something similar - 
he had 3-4-5 data entry people entering people at one time during a conversion.

It is never pretty but in the end when you're done it is a pretty good feeling.


- Original Message -
From: Adam Moffett<mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com>
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 2:44 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

Sorry, I wasn't trying to say you were doing it wrong or anything.


-- Original Message --
From: "Sterling Jacobson" mailto:sterl...@avative.net>>
To: "af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Sent: 1/10/2018 3:40:27 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

>Sure, in my spare time I'll just create some DB scripts and then go
>through every account to make sure it worked out and reload.
>
>Oh wait, how is that saving me time and money?
>
>It isn't.
>
>I elected to take their import, do some brief overview to make sure
>things were generally ok.
>Then modify/update the ones that have problems.
>
>Though that takes time, it's still less effort than starting from
>scratch.
>
>What I was told was it would be easy to migrate in a day or two and get
>running.
>
>So not the case.
>
>
>
>-Original Message-
>From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
>Of Adam Moffett
>Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 1:36 PM
>To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
>Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>
>If I recall correctly, the Sonar documentation suggested using the API
>to write a script to set everything up.  I think the idea is you can
>test your import script, then just blow away the Sonar instance and try
>again if you have problems.  Repeat until your script does everything
>you want.  Then when flag day comes you have a well tested process.
>
>I know I heard that somewhereif it wasn't in the docs it might have
>been in one of the videos.
>
>-Adam
>
>
>-- Original Message --
>From: "Sterling Jacobson" mailto:sterl...@avative.net>>
>To: "af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
>Sent: 1/10/2018 2:51:58 PM
>Subject: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>
>>So here is a current update on my months long progress moving from
>>Platypus to Sonar.
>>
>>It's not automatic by any means.
>>
>>Data import is taking a long time and its painful and costs a lot
>>extra.
>>
>>I'm having to manually correct/add accounts to Sonar with rate group
>>changes, address validations etc.
>>
>>They appear to be understaffed.
>>
>>A lot of their system isn't theirs too, which is OK I guess, just
>>didn't realize that.
>>
>>Import is a third party process if you don't want to do it yourself.
>>Actual payment site isn't them, you host it yourself or get a hosting
>>company, and have to maintain it yourself.
>>Paper statements are not directly them, you have to set up a third
>>party account and pay/manage them.
>>
>>This is just a 'simple' import of billing function only.
>>
>>I didn't even have any network information for any accounts, so I
>>shudder to think how that would have migrated.
>>
>>Also I didn't really see them emph

Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

[Sterling Jacobson]

It gets worse.

I wasn’t aware that ALL of my customers are now going to have to re-create 
their account login credentials because they don’t carry over from Plat.
I guess this is universal with SONAR, if you want a billing portal for your 
customers, they will ALL have to be sent some notification or link asking them 
to re-create that info or make new credentials based off their account email 
address.

What a cluster F

I’m going to cry

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2018 9:38 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

Well, I manually fixed all my account types.

Now, a week later, the billing portal hosted part is showing up, BUT nothing 
works, no login and their guy Jacob is MIA again.

I’ve had accounts and cash flow FROZEN for a week for this.

It’s crazy, I’m about to lose my mind with SONAR.

Damnit!


From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 8:30 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

My wife had a temp job once re-entering accounts for an insurance company which 
was migrating systems.
As long as the human meat computer operating the keyboard is smart enough to 
solve more problems than they create then it sounds good in theory.


-- Original Message --
From: "CBB - Jay Fuller" 
mailto:par...@cyberbroadband.net>>
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: 1/10/2018 6:05:02 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus



we have done something like 3...maybe 4 purchases of networks upwards to 350 
customers / devices.  Each time I've had our people manually enter data.  Too 
risk adverse of import problems or things not working right.  I've had them do 
the data entry and I've come behind them to check everything.  I'm not sure at 
this point I'd do it any other way.   I remember Evan doing something similar - 
he had 3-4-5 data entry people entering people at one time during a conversion.

It is never pretty but in the end when you're done it is a pretty good feeling.


- Original Message -
From: Adam Moffett<mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com>
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 2:44 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

Sorry, I wasn't trying to say you were doing it wrong or anything.


-- Original Message --
From: "Sterling Jacobson" mailto:sterl...@avative.net>>
To: "af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Sent: 1/10/2018 3:40:27 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

>Sure, in my spare time I'll just create some DB scripts and then go
>through every account to make sure it worked out and reload.
>
>Oh wait, how is that saving me time and money?
>
>It isn't.
>
>I elected to take their import, do some brief overview to make sure
>things were generally ok.
>Then modify/update the ones that have problems.
>
>Though that takes time, it's still less effort than starting from
>scratch.
>
>What I was told was it would be easy to migrate in a day or two and get
>running.
>
>So not the case.
>
>
>
>-Original Message-
>From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
>Of Adam Moffett
>Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 1:36 PM
>To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
>Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>
>If I recall correctly, the Sonar documentation suggested using the API
>to write a script to set everything up.  I think the idea is you can
>test your import script, then just blow away the Sonar instance and try
>again if you have problems.  Repeat until your script does everything
>you want.  Then when flag day comes you have a well tested process.
>
>I know I heard that somewhereif it wasn't in the docs it might have
>been in one of the videos.
>
>-Adam
>
>
>-- Original Message --
>From: "Sterling Jacobson" mailto:sterl...@avative.net>>
>To: "af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
>Sent: 1/10/2018 2:51:58 PM
>Subject: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>
>>So here is a current update on my months long progress moving from
>>Platypus to Sonar.
>>
>>It's not automatic by any means.
>>
>>Data import is taking a long time and its painful and costs a lot
>>extra.
>>
>>I'm having to manually correct/add accounts to Sonar with rate group
>>changes, address validations etc.
>>
>>They appear to be understaffed.
>>
>>A lot of their system isn't theirs too, which is OK I guess, just
>>d

Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

[Sterling Jacobson]

Well, I guess that does make sense in some regards.

But in Plat it's not for the username/password.

The CC information is encrypted, but thankfully they WERE able to transfer all 
of those over as far as I can tell.

At least customer won't have to put THAT information in again.


-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Josh Reynolds
Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2018 9:59 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

You would have to do that with any platform, as those passwords should be 
salted+hash, which is one-way encryption.

On Thu, Jan 11, 2018 at 10:47 PM, Sterling Jacobson  
wrote:
> It gets worse.
>
>
>
> I wasn’t aware that ALL of my customers are now going to have to 
> re-create their account login credentials because they don’t carry over from 
> Plat.
>
> I guess this is universal with SONAR, if you want a billing portal for 
> your customers, they will ALL have to be sent some notification or 
> link asking them to re-create that info or make new credentials based 
> off their account email address.
>
>
>
> What a cluster F
>
>
>
> I’m going to cry
>
>
>
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Jacobson
> Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2018 9:38 PM
>
>
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>
>
>
> Well, I manually fixed all my account types.
>
>
>
> Now, a week later, the billing portal hosted part is showing up, BUT 
> nothing works, no login and their guy Jacob is MIA again.
>
>
>
> I’ve had accounts and cash flow FROZEN for a week for this.
>
>
>
> It’s crazy, I’m about to lose my mind with SONAR.
>
>
>
> Damnit!
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
> Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 8:30 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>
>
>
> My wife had a temp job once re-entering accounts for an insurance 
> company which was migrating systems.
>
> As long as the human meat computer operating the keyboard is smart 
> enough to solve more problems than they create then it sounds good in theory.
>
>
>
>
>
> -- Original Message --
>
> From: "CBB - Jay Fuller" 
>
> To: af@afmug.com
>
> Sent: 1/10/2018 6:05:02 PM
>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
> we have done something like 3...maybe 4 purchases of networks upwards 
> to 350 customers / devices.  Each time I've had our people manually enter 
> data.
> Too risk adverse of import problems or things not working right.  I've 
> had them do the data entry and I've come behind them to check everything.  I'm
> not sure at this point I'd do it any other way.   I remember Evan doing
> something similar - he had 3-4-5 data entry people entering people at 
> one time during a conversion.
>
>
>
> It is never pretty but in the end when you're done it is a pretty good 
> feeling.
>
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
>
> From: Adam Moffett
>
> To: af@afmug.com
>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 2:44 PM
>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>
>
>
> Sorry, I wasn't trying to say you were doing it wrong or anything.
>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Sterling Jacobson" 
> To: "af@afmug.com" 
> Sent: 1/10/2018 3:40:27 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>
>>Sure, in my spare time I'll just create some DB scripts and then go 
>>through every account to make sure it worked out and reload.
>>
>>Oh wait, how is that saving me time and money?
>>
>>It isn't.
>>
>>I elected to take their import, do some brief overview to make sure 
>>things were generally ok.
>>Then modify/update the ones that have problems.
>>
>>Though that takes time, it's still less effort than starting from 
>>scratch.
>>
>>What I was told was it would be easy to migrate in a day or two and 
>>get running.
>>
>>So not the case.
>>
>>
>>
>>-Original Message-
>>From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
>>Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 1:36 PM
>>To: af@afmug.com
>>Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>>
>>If I recall correctly, the Sonar documentation suggested using the API 
>>to write a script to set everything up.  I think the idea is you can 
>>test your import script, then just blow away the Sonar instance and 

Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

[Sterling Jacobson]

I think in the case of the CC info it was already encrypted and moved over as 
such, but so was the key.


-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Josh Reynolds
Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2018 10:20 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

If you were able to transfer it over, that means it was either (A) not 
encrypted to being with, or (B) was decrypted upon export. Either way it would 
have transferred via cleartext. *shrug*

On Thu, Jan 11, 2018 at 11:16 PM, Sterling Jacobson  
wrote:
> Well, I guess that does make sense in some regards.
>
> But in Plat it's not for the username/password.
>
> The CC information is encrypted, but thankfully they WERE able to transfer 
> all of those over as far as I can tell.
>
> At least customer won't have to put THAT information in again.
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Josh Reynolds
> Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2018 9:59 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>
> You would have to do that with any platform, as those passwords should be 
> salted+hash, which is one-way encryption.
>
> On Thu, Jan 11, 2018 at 10:47 PM, Sterling Jacobson  
> wrote:
>> It gets worse.
>>
>>
>>
>> I wasn’t aware that ALL of my customers are now going to have to 
>> re-create their account login credentials because they don’t carry over from 
>> Plat.
>>
>> I guess this is universal with SONAR, if you want a billing portal 
>> for your customers, they will ALL have to be sent some notification 
>> or link asking them to re-create that info or make new credentials 
>> based off their account email address.
>>
>>
>>
>> What a cluster F
>>
>>
>>
>> I’m going to cry
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Jacobson
>> Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2018 9:38 PM
>>
>>
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>>
>>
>>
>> Well, I manually fixed all my account types.
>>
>>
>>
>> Now, a week later, the billing portal hosted part is showing up, BUT 
>> nothing works, no login and their guy Jacob is MIA again.
>>
>>
>>
>> I’ve had accounts and cash flow FROZEN for a week for this.
>>
>>
>>
>> It’s crazy, I’m about to lose my mind with SONAR.
>>
>>
>>
>> Damnit!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 8:30 PM
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>>
>>
>>
>> My wife had a temp job once re-entering accounts for an insurance 
>> company which was migrating systems.
>>
>> As long as the human meat computer operating the keyboard is smart 
>> enough to solve more problems than they create then it sounds good in theory.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- Original Message --
>>
>> From: "CBB - Jay Fuller" 
>>
>> To: af@afmug.com
>>
>> Sent: 1/10/2018 6:05:02 PM
>>
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>>
>> we have done something like 3...maybe 4 purchases of networks upwards 
>> to 350 customers / devices.  Each time I've had our people manually enter 
>> data.
>> Too risk adverse of import problems or things not working right.  
>> I've had them do the data entry and I've come behind them to check 
>> everything.  I'm
>> not sure at this point I'd do it any other way.   I remember Evan doing
>> something similar - he had 3-4-5 data entry people entering people at 
>> one time during a conversion.
>>
>>
>>
>> It is never pretty but in the end when you're done it is a pretty 
>> good feeling.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> - Original Message -
>>
>> From: Adam Moffett
>>
>> To: af@afmug.com
>>
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 2:44 PM
>>
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>>
>>
>>
>> Sorry, I wasn't trying to say you were doing it wrong or anything.
>>
>>
>> -- Original Message --
>> From: "Sterling Jacobson" 
>> To: "af@afmug.com" 
>> Sent: 1/10/2018 3:40:27 PM
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
>>
>>

Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

[Sterling Jacobson]

Plat encrypts stuff, but you can see their account password if you elect to I 
guess.
So yeah, that could have carried over I think.

BUT it appears to be two different systems with Sonar at that point.
There is the Sonar instance, and then a completely separate website portal 
instance which stores it’s own username/password I guess.
That’s different from Plat, where Plat does have a separate website instance, 
but it just a front for the SQL database.
Sonar appears to be more new in that it has it’s own published API fronting the 
database and the portal instance uses that I guess.

Yes, I am paying them during the transition period, but I got them to just 
charge me the base amount per month while we do it.
Transition was ‘free’. Which in my case means I still spent about $1000 to have 
Spencer Lambert use some half broken scripting to “mostly” move my data over. 
It was still well worth that money to save me time transferring accounts and 
preserving autopay information though.



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Friday, January 12, 2018 9:12 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

So you're paying them monthly and being charged to migrate?  Seems harsh.

You're paying someone to migrate and fixing it yourself?  What are you paying 
for?


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Jan 12, 2018 at 8:16 AM, Mike Hammett 
mailto:af...@ics-il.net>> wrote:
Doesn't Plat store things in plaintext? Why can't that be carried over?



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions<http://www.ics-il.com/>
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png]<https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]<https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
Midwest Internet Exchange<http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]<https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
The Brothers WISP<http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]


<https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>

From: "Sterling Jacobson" mailto:sterl...@avative.net>>
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2018 10:47:23 PM

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus
It gets worse.

I wasn’t aware that ALL of my customers are now going to have to re-create 
their account login credentials because they don’t carry over from Plat.
I guess this is universal with SONAR, if you want a billing portal for your 
customers, they will ALL have to be sent some notification or link asking them 
to re-create that info or make new credentials based off their account email 
address.

What a cluster F

I’m going to cry

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2018 9:38 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

Well, I manually fixed all my account types.

Now, a week later, the billing portal hosted part is showing up, BUT nothing 
works, no login and their guy Jacob is MIA again.

I’ve had accounts and cash flow FROZEN for a week for this.

It’s crazy, I’m about to lose my mind with SONAR.

Damnit!


From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 8:30 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

My wife had a temp job once re-entering accounts for an insurance company which 
was migrating systems.
As long as the human meat computer operating the keyboard is smart enough to 
solve more problems than they create then it sounds good in theory.


-- Original Message --
From: "CBB - Jay Fuller" 
mailto:par...@cyberbroadband.net>>
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: 1/10/2018 6:05:02 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus



we have done something like 3...maybe 4 purchases of networks upwards to 350 
customers / devices.  Each time I've had our people manually enter data.  Too 
risk adverse of import problems or things not working right.  I've had them do 
the data entry and I've come behind them to check everything.  I'm not sure at 
this point I'd do it any other way.   I remembe

Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

[Sterling Jacobson]

Plat is great, and Sonar costs more, but I wanted a more modern system and I 
was constantly fighting small glitches and bugs in the system including PCI 
compliance.

Also I don’t want to host anything myself anymore, it’s a hassel to maintain 
and back up the database reliably.

And it has more of the features I want going forward, hopefully.

I’m kind of regretting it right now, but I’m hoping it pans out sooner than 
later.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Philip Rankin
Sent: Sunday, January 14, 2018 11:59 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar Migration from Platypus

I’m curious, why change. I really like Plat and it does everything I need.

Phil

On Wed, Jan 10, 2018 at 1:52 PM Sterling Jacobson 
mailto:sterl...@avative.net>> wrote:
So here is a current update on my months long progress moving from Platypus to 
Sonar.

It's not automatic by any means.

Data import is taking a long time and its painful and costs a lot extra.

I'm having to manually correct/add accounts to Sonar with rate group changes, 
address validations etc.

They appear to be understaffed.

A lot of their system isn't theirs too, which is OK I guess, just didn't 
realize that.

Import is a third party process if you don't want to do it yourself.
Actual payment site isn't them, you host it yourself or get a hosting company, 
and have to maintain it yourself.
Paper statements are not directly them, you have to set up a third party 
account and pay/manage them.

This is just a 'simple' import of billing function only.

I didn't even have any network information for any accounts, so I shudder to 
think how that would have migrated.

Also I didn't really see them emphasizing the fact that their database and Plat 
could get seriously out of synch if you are not careful.

I've had to manually suspend everything in Platypus to assure data isn't out of 
sync with the new system until it comes online.

That means it's been days of people calling/contacting me trying to pay bills 
and I'm stuck in the middle.

Don't want to roll back since I've spent so many hours now on migration.

Can't go forward yet because I'm still waiting on massive fixes to rates on 
customers, and web site creation/setup for billing.

Let's just say I'm excited to get onboarding done and running, but I'm also 
crying because it's not there yet and help is slow to come some days.

--
Philip J. Rankin
Wireless Telecommunications Services
PO Box 24
Pittsburg, KS  66762

Re: [AFMUG] OT 844E routers

[Sterling Jacobson]

That sucks.

Was in the same boat last year with Mikrotik RB260GS units for about a month, 
real panic attack.

I actually had to order some for more $$ off of eBay and Amazon.

Good luck!

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:33 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] OT 844E routers

Anyone have any stock they are willing to part with?  We just ran out and Calix 
is predicting a Feb ship date on our order that was supposed to ship tomorrow.

Re: [AFMUG] OT: USB backup drive

[Sterling Jacobson]

Ditto.

I keep all my 'files' on one of the cloud services, mostly OneDrive right now

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2018 11:59 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: USB backup drive

Cloud.

-Original Message-
From: Jay Weekley
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2018 11:55 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] OT: USB backup drive 

Mom needs a USB backup drive. I have a Western Digital but I don't want to risk 
my inheritance on a hard drive that may fail when it's needed.  
What do the experts recommend?

Re: [AFMUG] Failover / Recovery Time Testing?

[Sterling Jacobson]

I think also you could do something similar with floodping?

I used to use that a lot on wireless connections to test consistency (with 
Mikrotik on each end)

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Christopher Gray
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2018 5:08 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Failover / Recovery Time Testing?

Adam,

This looks like it will work quite well! So far with some tests I've found 100% 
success, which is the foundation for some good test results.


Example from a VM through a couple Juniper switches to a MikroTik:
# ping 10.11.1.3 -i 0.001 -f -c 1
PING 10.11.1.3 (10.11.1.3) 56(84) bytes of data.

 --- 10.11.1.3 ping statistics ---
1 packets transmitted, 1 received, 0% packet loss, time 1ms
rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 0.111/0.122/2.160/0.037 ms, ipg/ewma 1.000/0.118 ms


I'll calculate just like you described + the average ping time to account for 
ping replies lost at the beginning of the failure.

I'm not looking to do this everywhere on everything (which would be a reason to 
re-consider where my time should be spent), I'm doing testing on the existing 
failover methods I've been using. If I find anything is really not as good as I 
thought (or much better), then I can use that to guide future design decisions.

Thank you for your help, Chris


On Mon, Jan 29, 2018 at 12:37 PM, Adam Moffett 
mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com>> wrote:
It also occurred to me just now that you might want to add -c 1 or similar 
to end the ping command after a certain point.
When you kill it with ctrl+c you can have a false drop reported because you 
might have killed it in between a request and reply.


-- Original Message --
From: "Adam Moffett" mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com>>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 1/29/2018 12:25:18 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Failover / Recovery Time Testing?

Maybe it's obvious, but this method ought to be fairly accurate IF the time 
from one ping to another is very consistent.  I don't know the specific cause 
of the cases where the command is unable to satisfy the request for 1 ping per 
.001 second.  Obviously if that cause leads to variance from one ping to 
another then the accuracy suffers.


Even if you don't get 1 ping per ms, you might be able to estimate as:
(pings transmitted / time = time per ping)
and
(failover time = time per ping * (pings transmitted - pings received))

[AFMUG] Force10 Guru

[Sterling Jacobson]

Anyone out there a Force10 switch IOS guru?

I need to hire/retain someone that knows these units better than I do, lol!

I'm talking the older 'pre-Dell' hardware.

Re: [AFMUG] OT Porn ..... (filtering)

[Sterling Jacobson]

I like those comments.

Went they first passed a form of this, I asked their task group to send me "the 
list".
They couldn't do it, and therefore it was not enforceable.

I'm thinking again, unless a state provides "the list", they can't force an ISP 
to do anything about it.

Plus it's entirely fruitless.

They should really go after the content provider networks with better abilities 
to code protect and lock down content.

Like culinary water, I would like to have something potable for my kids.
But I don't want the overhead as an ISP, and the definition of "potable" water 
is undefinable really.

They need to leave the "pipe" alone, and focus on the ends, the third party 
filters is where it's at, and the CDN's providing better tools.

I can't properly filter, or code protect even my Netflix on most devices.
I just have to check on the kids all the time or be in the same room (four 8 - 
18 yr old boys, lol!) and use Qustodio where possible.
As it is, I've had to lock down most stuff to either ON or OFF and I took back 
the smartphone my oldest had because of this.
Now he has a flip phone with no internet.





From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Tuesday, February 6, 2018 10:07 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] OT Porn . (filtering)

Based on all your comments (thank you), I sent the following to the legislative 
working group:
(You guys helped me look smarter than I am ).



Some random thoughts.

If you are going to an HTTPS site, it is all encrypted.  If you are attempting 
to analyze a flow of traffic HTTPS traffic looks the same to us whether it is 
porn or online banking.

Do we also block Bit Torrent?
XBox Grand Theft Auto
Any game with online chat.  Scrub online chat during games?
All game servers
Twitter
Instagram
Youtube
News outlets
Facebook
Email
Instant messaging
Periscope
Streaming
FTP
IRC

The lowly ping facility has a space for payload.  I could send porn via pings 
if I wanted.

What is defined as harmful content?  Medical, artistic, Bible readings?  
Genesis 19, 29 etc etc.
Language, if so what language?  Bare shoulders. Knees?
Curtains blowing in the breeze.

How about what I consider pornographic music lyrics.
Do we have to police music.  Police Pandora.

There are always ways around.
For every block there is a proxy or VPN that will get you around it.

Filters can give parents a false sense of security.  Filters are gimmicks.  
Snake oil.
But we do offer them.  Not home grown.  They are 3rd party.

Re: [AFMUG] New Server Hardware

[Sterling Jacobson]

I like Dells, but I have HP's because of the excess/price on eBay.

You are saying HP doesn't support like Dell?

I can believe that.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Faisal Imtiaz
Sent: Tuesday, February 6, 2018 1:14 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New Server Hardware

In my opinion, check out the firmware / support polices for HP  vs Dell, before 
you make a decision on what hardware to purchase.

:)

Regards.

Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet & Telecom
http://www.snappytelecom.net

Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net

- Original Message -
> From: "Andreas Wiatowski" 
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: Tuesday, February 6, 2018 1:08:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New Server Hardware

> I just pickup off lease HP's on Ebay, lots of ram processors and 
> disk... usually don't pay more than $500-800 for them.  Gen 7 and 8's.  
> Lots of reputable sellers.
> 
> Also, Checkout PROXMOX. It's a pretty cool virtualization platform 
> with a community edition that you hack around to get the latest 
> version. I find it very easy... you can take VMDK files and convert 
> them and spin up a new instance of anything easily.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Andreas Wiatowski, CEO
> Silo Wireless Inc.
> 1-866-727-4138 x-600
> http://www.silowireless.com  Wireless | 
> Fibre | VoIP | PBX | IPTV
> 
> Silo Wireless is a Proud Member of:
> CanWISP http://www.canwisp.ca
> WISPA http://wispa.org
> Brantford Brant Chamber of Commerce
> Paris Chamber of Commerce
> Cambridge Chamber of Commerce
> 
> 
> _
> The contents of this email message and any attachments are intended 
> solely for the addressee(s) and may contain confidential and/or 
> privileged information and may be legally protected from disclosure. 
> If you are not the intended recipient of this message or their agent, 
> or if this message has been addressed to you in error, please 
> immediately alert the sender by reply email and then delete this 
> message and any attachments. If you are not the intended recipient, 
> you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination, copying, or storage of 
> this message or its attachments is strictly prohibited.
> 
>On 2018-02-06, 1:02 PM, "Af on behalf of Nate Burke" 
> wrote:
> 
>I'm going to need to bring online a couple new servers (OS Instances) in
>the next month or 2.  They could probably be housed inside a single
>physical machine as VM's.  It's been a while since I've had to pickup
>new server hardware.  What's a good spec now for a machine to do VM's.
>Are NAS prices cheap enough now that you'd go with external storage, or
>just have a single physical machine with internal HDD's.  Hardware NAS,
>or another machine running linux and ZFS?  With external Storage, does
>it all have to be 10G networking to prevent bottlenecks?  About 6 years
>ago I put in a single standalone server running VMWare, but it's out of
>resources to add new VM's to it.
>
>It looks like Newegg has lots of Refurb Dell and HP servers (with no
>HDD's) for cheap.  DL380G5 ~$100.  I'd like to stay in the $2k-$3k range
>for this project.  Or is hosting your own hardware not even worth it
>anymore?  Just go get a server from 1and1 for $5/mo setup a VPN back to
> the network and be done?

Re: [AFMUG] Content filtering - Trustwave

[Sterling Jacobson]

What should really happen law wise, is that the state (Utah in this case) 
approve a group of content filtering companies for end users.
Then mandate AT MOST that the ISP allow/offer at least one of those up to 
customers as a certified filtering option.

Again, not mandatory, but as viable options that are semi-pushed from the ISP 
side, still for profit.

It’s just too much and too variant to have to mandate the ISP do any kind of 
filtering ‘mid-stream’ style.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Thursday, February 8, 2018 9:30 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Content filtering - Trustwave

Unrelated to Chuck's thread, we started talking internally about offering 
content filtering as a value add.

An initial conversation with Trustwave seemed promising, and I'm supposed to 
have a follow up to discuss tech details later.

But does anybody still do this?  Is there still consumer interest?  How much 
are/were you selling it for?

Re: [AFMUG] Content filtering - Trustwave

[Sterling Jacobson]

I agree, but Utah seems hell bent on doing something obtrusive.

Since they can’t seem to let it go, that was my next proposal in lieu of 
abandoning the fruitless endeavor altogether.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of George Skorup
Sent: Thursday, February 8, 2018 11:43 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Content filtering - Trustwave

IMO, completely 100% wrong. You don't get to come into my house or tell a 
private company that we don't meet your moral standards. The people can make 
their own damn decisions. Stop trying to legislate morality. The politicians 
that try this stuff are usually the ones that end up being freaks or porn 
addicts.

Public institutions, schools, libraries, etc. yeah, filter away. That's 
standard here in KIllinois, too.
On 2/8/2018 11:31 AM, Sterling Jacobson wrote:
What should really happen law wise, is that the state (Utah in this case) 
approve a group of content filtering companies for end users.
Then mandate AT MOST that the ISP allow/offer at least one of those up to 
customers as a certified filtering option.

Again, not mandatory, but as viable options that are semi-pushed from the ISP 
side, still for profit.

It’s just too much and too variant to have to mandate the ISP do any kind of 
filtering ‘mid-stream’ style.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Thursday, February 8, 2018 9:30 AM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: [AFMUG] Content filtering - Trustwave

Unrelated to Chuck's thread, we started talking internally about offering 
content filtering as a value add.

An initial conversation with Trustwave seemed promising, and I'm supposed to 
have a follow up to discuss tech details later.

But does anybody still do this?  Is there still consumer interest?  How much 
are/were you selling it for?

Re: [AFMUG] ISP in a box

[Sterling Jacobson]

I think that was me you asked about those three items.

AND we still use 8.8.8.8 DNS resolvers.

I know, it’s bad, but one of my upstreams is directly on Google CDN so it 
‘applies’.

I do like redundancy though.

So if you use one CCR, get two of them for your project, they are relatively 
cheap.

With fiber you really don’t need the extra servers for bandwidth shaping, I 
just shape at the CPE or switch port.

So in one cabinet you put say a 144 count panel and splice on, then get a SFP 
switch and two CCR routers.
I have used the 1036 CCR in some areas to start, and a pair of those running 
VRRP between them works great.
Plug both into 10Gbps SFP+ ports on the switch/switches and you have ‘standard’ 
redundancy.

Meaning you can bring in two 10Gbps links, one to each of the CCR units, and 
have redundant SFP+ links to the switch bank as well.

They have more than enough horse power to run DHCP, NAT, DNS etc between them 
to fill the duties for the cabinet/site.

Get a UPS, I use Alpha, and four batteries on it should work well.

Cabinet can be 20AMP and run plenty of switches on that.

I also buy an AC unit and attach it to the side of the cabinet.

I put some monitoring in there on a separate managed network to keep track of 
power and heat/temp and track the switches/CPE’s etc.

That’s about it.

Rinse, repeat.






From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2018 1:02 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ISP in a box

Guess I don’t need DNS.  8.8.8.8 seems cheap and easy...

From: Chuck McCown
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2018 12:59 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] ISP in a box

Had a subdivision developer contact me, wanting service for their hundred or so 
homes.
I can get DIA close to the area at a reasonable area.  It will require some 
build but that is OK, that is something I feel some level of expertise.

Considering a minimal NOC build.

I asked this question of someone once before and I cannot find their answer.  
Not sure if asked on the list or not.  But the answer went something like this:


  1.  Buy a big CCR.
  2.  Hire Linktechs to configure it.
  3.  Put in a big switch for the AE SFPs and rock and roll.

I am sure I would need at least one server.  DHCP, NAT, DNS?
But can all of that be provided by the CCR?

What is the smallest NOC configuration that could be created?

Batts, rectifier, cooling.

I really could put all this in a cabinet on the corner of the street.

Re: [AFMUG] ISP in a box

[Sterling Jacobson]

This is my trace route to 8.8.8.8 by the way

C:\Users\Sterling>tracert 8.8.8.8

Tracing route to google-public-dns-a.google.com [8.8.8.8]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1<1 ms<1 ms<1 ms  108-165-31-1.avative.net [108.165.31.1]
  2<1 ms<1 ms<1 ms  tg1-8--200.br01.lsan.acedc.net [69.27.173.37]
  320 ms20 ms20 ms  ve131.br01.snju.acedc.net [199.58.196.114]
  420 ms20 ms20 ms  eqixsj-google-gige.google.com [206.223.116.21]
  520 ms20 ms20 ms  108.170.242.225
  620 ms20 ms20 ms  216.239.46.51
  720 ms20 ms20 ms  google-public-dns-a.google.com [8.8.8.8]

Trace complete.

It goes from my router to my upstream router to their other router then to 
google.
The rest is inside google network itself.

Works great as long as they don’t have an issue, which is about once a year for 
a few minutes at a time.

I need to move off and get my own servers on a VM soon.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2018 2:13 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ISP in a box

If 8.8.8.8 isn't available to the closest node as a local network, you're not 
using it.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions<http://www.ics-il.com/>
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png]<https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]<https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
Midwest Internet Exchange<http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]<https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
The Brothers WISP<http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]<https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]


<https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>

From: "Sterling Jacobson" mailto:sterl...@avative.net>>
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2018 3:09:33 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ISP in a box
I think that was me you asked about those three items.

AND we still use 8.8.8.8 DNS resolvers.

I know, it’s bad, but one of my upstreams is directly on Google CDN so it 
‘applies’.

I do like redundancy though.

So if you use one CCR, get two of them for your project, they are relatively 
cheap.

With fiber you really don’t need the extra servers for bandwidth shaping, I 
just shape at the CPE or switch port.

So in one cabinet you put say a 144 count panel and splice on, then get a SFP 
switch and two CCR routers.
I have used the 1036 CCR in some areas to start, and a pair of those running 
VRRP between them works great.
Plug both into 10Gbps SFP+ ports on the switch/switches and you have ‘standard’ 
redundancy.

Meaning you can bring in two 10Gbps links, one to each of the CCR units, and 
have redundant SFP+ links to the switch bank as well.

They have more than enough horse power to run DHCP, NAT, DNS etc between them 
to fill the duties for the cabinet/site.

Get a UPS, I use Alpha, and four batteries on it should work well.

Cabinet can be 20AMP and run plenty of switches on that.

I also buy an AC unit and attach it to the side of the cabinet.

I put some monitoring in there on a separate managed network to keep track of 
power and heat/temp and track the switches/CPE’s etc.

That’s about it.

Rinse, repeat.






From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2018 1:02 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ISP in a box

Guess I don’t need DNS.  8.8.8.8 seems cheap and easy...

From: Chuck McCown
Sent: Monday, February 12, 2018 12:59 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: [AFMUG] ISP in a box

Had a subdivision developer contact me, wanting service for their hundred or so 
homes.
I can get DIA close to the area at a reasonable area.  It will require some 
build but that is OK, that is something I feel some level of expertise.

Considering a minimal NOC build.

I asked this question of someone once before and I cannot find their answer.  
Not sure if asked on the list or not.  But the answer went something like this:


  1.  Buy a big CCR.
  2.  Hire Linktechs to configure it.
  3.  Put in a big switch for the AE SFPs and rock and roll.

I am sure I would need at least one server.  DHCP, NAT, DNS?
But can all of that be provided by the CCR?

What is the smallest NOC configuration that could be created?

Batts, rectifier, cooling.

I really could put all this in a cabinet on the corner of the street.

Re: [AFMUG] 1000BASE-LX SFP compatibility

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

I think they are, but again I'm not 100 percent sure.

I can get the pair of 20k SFP modules for under $30 shipped.
At that price I would just replace both sides of anything that is under 
question.

From: Af [mailto:af-bounces+sterling=avative@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Paul 
Conlin via Af
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 1:28 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 1000BASE-LX SFP compatibility

Are 1000BASE-LX SFP modules compatible with 1000BASE-LX-10 SFP modules?  
Specifically talking SM fiber.  
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigabit_Ethernet#1000BASE-LX says LX-10 is good 
for 10km whereas LX can only do 5km.  I get that LX-10 has twice the range due 
to "better optics", but at distances of less than 5km are they compatible / 
interchangeable?  All specs I can find match up implying they are but I can't 
specifically find word on compatibility.

Is it just me or has Google become nothing more than a shopping mall?  It is 
getting much hard to find information other than prices. 

PC
Blaze Broadband

Re: [AFMUG] Google is Slow WAS 1000BASE-LX SFP compatibility

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

It might be your internet is slow (ducks)!

My google runs lighting fast and the links when I go to them or hover over them 
don’t contain any back tracking.

Maybe you have cookie trackers or malware?

Maybe your DNS isn’t optimized?

These are all things I’ve noticed on others machines that make the fastest 
internet look super slow.

Also, routers. Don’t get me started on routers

From: Af [mailto:af-bounces+sterling=avative@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken 
Hohhof via Af
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 5:35 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 1000BASE-LX SFP compatibility

Also it seems like Google has become sloow.  The links are now some 
humongous long string and my suspicion is they are doing a lot more data mining 
now when you click on a link, like vacuuming all the data out of your computer 
before sending your browser to the page in the search results.

It used to be Google was lightning fast, and the search results linked directly 
to the page.

I’m probably wrong about the why, but something has definitely changed over the 
last year or so.


From: Eric Markow via Af
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 6:29 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 1000BASE-LX SFP compatibility

Totally agree that Google search results have been getting worse and worse, 
especially when I’m just looking for INFORMATION, not necessarily to purchase 
something. I generally can’t stand Microsoft, but perhaps I’ll give Bing a try.

From: Af [mailto:af-bounces+eric=belairinternet@afmug.com] On Behalf Of 
Paul Conlin via Af
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 12:27 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 1000BASE-LX SFP compatibility

Are 1000BASE-LX SFP modules compatible with 1000BASE-LX-10 SFP modules?  
Specifically talking SM fiber.  
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigabit_Ethernet#1000BASE-LX says LX-10 is good 
for 10km whereas LX can only do 5km.  I get that LX-10 has twice the range due 
to “better optics”, but at distances of less than 5km are they compatible / 
interchangeable?  All specs I can find match up implying they are but I can’t 
specifically find word on compatibility.

Is it just me or has Google become nothing more than a shopping mall?  It is 
getting much hard to find information other than prices. 

PC
Blaze Broadband



This e-mail and any attachments may contain confidential and privileged 
information. If you are not the intended recipient,please notify the sender 
immediately by return e-mail, delete this e-mail and destroy any copies. Any 
dissemination or use of this information by a person other than the intended 
recipient is unauthorized and may be illegal.


This e-mail and any attachments may contain confidential and privileged 
information. If you are not the intended recipient,please notify the sender 
immediately by return e-mail, delete this e-mail and destroy any copies. Any 
dissemination or use of this information by a person other than the intended 
recipient is unauthorized and may be illegal.

Re: [AFMUG] Google is Slow WAS 1000BASE-LX SFP compatibility

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Ah, you have a good point.

It is indeed sending information back to google.com.

Hovering over it shows the correct short URL, but the browser itself is 
obfuscating the tracking.

Doesn’t seem to affect speed for me, and I personally don’t care what google 
takes from my clicking on it. But it is sending stuff back.

Here is what my source shows:

http://www.wispa.org/";>WISPA: Home


From: Af [mailto:af-bounces+sterling=avative@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken 
Hohhof via Af
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 6:06 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Google is Slow WAS 1000BASE-LX SFP compatibility

So why when I inspect the source for a link that appears to go to 
http://www.wispa.org/ do I see this:

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&sqi=2&ved=0CB4QFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wispa.org%2F&ei=S3EbVLi4Iaa78QHTuYGIBw&usg=AFQjCNEVUAuzl5-AVZjw7h8eAshpd7DBNQ&bvm=bv.75774317,d.cWc";<http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&sqi=2&ved=0CB4QFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wispa.org%2F&ei=S3EbVLi4Iaa78QHTuYGIBw&usg=AFQjCNEVUAuzl5-AVZjw7h8eAshpd7DBNQ&bvm=bv.75774317,d.cWc%22>>WISPA:
 Home

And you see the strange URL briefly in the address bar of your browser.  Is 
this for data mining?  Or pre-caching the pages it thinks you might click on?


From: Sterling Jacobson via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 6:40 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Google is Slow WAS 1000BASE-LX SFP compatibility

It might be your internet is slow (ducks)!

My google runs lighting fast and the links when I go to them or hover over them 
don’t contain any back tracking.

Maybe you have cookie trackers or malware?

Maybe your DNS isn’t optimized?

These are all things I’ve noticed on others machines that make the fastest 
internet look super slow.

Also, routers. Don’t get me started on routers

From: Af [mailto:af-bounces+sterling=avative@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken 
Hohhof via Af
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 5:35 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 1000BASE-LX SFP compatibility

Also it seems like Google has become sloow.  The links are now some 
humongous long string and my suspicion is they are doing a lot more data mining 
now when you click on a link, like vacuuming all the data out of your computer 
before sending your browser to the page in the search results.

It used to be Google was lightning fast, and the search results linked directly 
to the page.

I’m probably wrong about the why, but something has definitely changed over the 
last year or so.


From: Eric Markow via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 6:29 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 1000BASE-LX SFP compatibility

Totally agree that Google search results have been getting worse and worse, 
especially when I’m just looking for INFORMATION, not necessarily to purchase 
something. I generally can’t stand Microsoft, but perhaps I’ll give Bing a try.

From: Af [mailto:af-bounces+eric=belairinternet@afmug.com] On Behalf Of 
Paul Conlin via Af
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 12:27 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: [AFMUG] 1000BASE-LX SFP compatibility

Are 1000BASE-LX SFP modules compatible with 1000BASE-LX-10 SFP modules?  
Specifically talking SM fiber.  
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigabit_Ethernet#1000BASE-LX says LX-10 is good 
for 10km whereas LX can only do 5km.  I get that LX-10 has twice the range due 
to “better optics”, but at distances of less than 5km are they compatible / 
interchangeable?  All specs I can find match up implying they are but I can’t 
specifically find word on compatibility.

Is it just me or has Google become nothing more than a shopping mall?  It is 
getting much hard to find information other than prices. 

PC
Blaze Broadband



This e-mail and any attachments may contain confidential and privileged 
information. If you are not the intended recipient,please notify the sender 
immediately by return e-mail, delete this e-mail and destroy any copies. Any 
dissemination or use of this information by a person other than the intended 
recipient is unauthorized and may be illegal.


This e-mail and any attachments may contain confidential and privileged 
information. If you are not the intended recipient,please notify the sender 
immediately by return e-mail, delete this e-mail and destroy any copies. Any 
dissemination or use of this information by a person other than the intended 
recipient is unauthorized and may be illegal.

Re: [AFMUG] Mikrotik-tik-tik-tik

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

I've seen that before, but not with fiber anywhere.

My current deployments with RB2011 don't show this and it's similar to your 
setup.


From: Af [mailto:af-bounces+sterling=avative@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam 
Moffett via Af
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 2:41 PM
To: Animal Farm
Subject: [AFMUG] Mikrotik-tik-tik-tik

So I've got several setups like this: CCR <-> SFP <-> Fiber <-> SFP <-> RB2011
sometimes pinging the RB2011 I can see this once per second delay.  Those pings 
are at an interval of .2 seconds (ping -i .02) so you can see the delay on 
every 5th packet corresponds to a once per second "tick" of some sort.  If I 
vary the interval, the tick still occurs every one second.  I have multiple 
installations that do this, and multiples that don'tand I cannot find any 
rhyme or reason to it.  Connected to one CCR on SFP2 I have an RB2011 that has 
the symptom, and then I made a virtually identical installation on SFP3 that 
doesn't do it.  The only thing different is the IP addresses and the length of 
the fiber (3 feet on the good one, a couple thousand feet on the bad one).

The delay varies anywhere from a few ms to upwards of a hundred ms, and when 
it's high it affects VoIP so it is a real issue.  I have a few more 
combinations of things to test, but I wonder if somebody has seen this already 
who can save me a ton of time.  Anybody?

P.S.:  I emailed supp...@mikrotik.com yesterday.  
Do they eventually respond or is it a blackhole?

[cid:image001.png@01CFD8DD.4F7C1E20]

Re: [AFMUG] ObamaCare

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

After I sold last year I did Cobra until 2014, then used Obamacare to get 
pretty much the same exact policy for about 10 percent less.

But that was on a family policy, not a group policy anymore.

Sounds like group policy has gone way up.

One more reason not to hire employees anymore, lol!

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Tushar Patel via Af
Sent: Wednesday, October 8, 2014 9:45 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ObamaCare

Ours went up, 19%.

Tushar


> On Oct 8, 2014, at 10:42 AM, Travis Johnson via Af  wrote:
> 
> Hi...
> 
> I'm not sure exactly how this ObamaCare thing was supposed to "save everyone 
> money" and provider "better health care". We just received our group health 
> insurance premium notice for the upcoming year, and our rates will go up by 
> 10% starting 2015.
> 
> On top of that, everyone is now paying a 3% ObamaCare tax on their personal 
> income taxes. This doesn't really seem like much of a savings to me... :(
> 
> Travis
> 

[AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Anyone there that would like to update?

I couldn't make it.

Not sure that I would have gotten anything out of it anyways.

I don't use any equipment from any of the sponsors/vendors of fiber weekend.

I'm just curious if they are all talking/preaching the same ONT/deployment 
strategies as usual?

I wonder how close they are to what I am doing.

Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Hybrid model, I bring bandwidth in via wireless to the neighborhood and set up 
a cabinet that serves all the houses in active Ethernet fiber.
GPON is ok, but in this model so much of the expense was burial of conduit that 
it really didn’t make sense to just pull for GPON.
Plus GPON restricts you to a specific vendor market.

My model might not scale to thousands of installs a month, but it works for 
hundreds a POP.

A POP is about $15k for 200+ connections completely contained and redundant.
The end points and fiber construction are on top of that of course.

That is the major expense, the labor to bore and trench and splice hella ton of 
conduit, boxes and fiber strands.
My entire GigE NID/ONT setup is less than $100 installed though.

Buried conduit all the way to the side of the house, and fiber to the NID.
It’s built to last, the conduit and fiber being our biggest expense and asset.

Mikrotik “ONT” and off the shelf lasers from china for next to nothing.

I haven’t seen any cheaper ONT setup than what we do, and it’s full GigE.
The only piece of the puzzle I’m missing to do 10GigE to the home is a cheaper 
transceiver.
I’m sure that will come next year. Sky’s the limit once the fiber is in the 
ground on a one to one basis with the switch and the ONT.
We leave enough fiber to do a pair at the house, though everything is BIDI 
right now.

I don’t believe in VoIP or TV, so it’s all Ethernet. The customer can get their 
traditional phone and TV elsewhere.
Which is nice for regulations because we dodge every single headache I used to 
have with a WISP.

This fiber stuff is s much better and easier.

Costs more though.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jason Pond via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 8:03 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza


So enlighten us to what you are doing Sterling.  So far so good.

Tomorrow will answer some more.

Sincerely,

Jason Pond
Owner
Grizzly Internet, Inc
p...@grizzlyinternet.com<mailto:p...@grizzlyinternet.com>
On Oct 11, 2014 6:36 PM, "Sterling Jacobson via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Anyone there that would like to update?

I couldn't make it.

Not sure that I would have gotten anything out of it anyways.

I don't use any equipment from any of the sponsors/vendors of fiber weekend.

I'm just curious if they are all talking/preaching the same ONT/deployment 
strategies as usual?

I wonder how close they are to what I am doing.

Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Airfiber units.

That's just to start, then we bring in the fiber end to end connection at 
10Gig. The wireless stays on for backup.

Technically we buy it from another service provider, so we have complete 
redundancy in case a fiber gets dug up.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Tyler Treat via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 10:56 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

What are you using to backhaul GIGe neighborhoods wirelessly?!
___
Mangled by my iPhone.
___

Tyler Treat
Corn Belt Technologies, Inc.

tyler.tr...@cornbelttech.com<mailto:tyler.tr...@cornbelttech.com>
___


On Oct 11, 2014, at 11:46 PM, Sterling Jacobson via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Hybrid model, I bring bandwidth in via wireless to the neighborhood and set up 
a cabinet that serves all the houses in active Ethernet fiber.
GPON is ok, but in this model so much of the expense was burial of conduit that 
it really didn't make sense to just pull for GPON.
Plus GPON restricts you to a specific vendor market.

My model might not scale to thousands of installs a month, but it works for 
hundreds a POP.

A POP is about $15k for 200+ connections completely contained and redundant.
The end points and fiber construction are on top of that of course.

That is the major expense, the labor to bore and trench and splice hella ton of 
conduit, boxes and fiber strands.
My entire GigE NID/ONT setup is less than $100 installed though.

Buried conduit all the way to the side of the house, and fiber to the NID.
It's built to last, the conduit and fiber being our biggest expense and asset.

Mikrotik "ONT" and off the shelf lasers from china for next to nothing.

I haven't seen any cheaper ONT setup than what we do, and it's full GigE.
The only piece of the puzzle I'm missing to do 10GigE to the home is a cheaper 
transceiver.
I'm sure that will come next year. Sky's the limit once the fiber is in the 
ground on a one to one basis with the switch and the ONT.
We leave enough fiber to do a pair at the house, though everything is BIDI 
right now.

I don't believe in VoIP or TV, so it's all Ethernet. The customer can get their 
traditional phone and TV elsewhere.
Which is nice for regulations because we dodge every single headache I used to 
have with a WISP.

This fiber stuff is s much better and easier.

Costs more though.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jason Pond via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 8:03 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza


So enlighten us to what you are doing Sterling.  So far so good.

Tomorrow will answer some more.

Sincerely,

Jason Pond
Owner
Grizzly Internet, Inc
p...@grizzlyinternet.com<mailto:p...@grizzlyinternet.com>
On Oct 11, 2014 6:36 PM, "Sterling Jacobson via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Anyone there that would like to update?

I couldn't make it.

Not sure that I would have gotten anything out of it anyways.

I don't use any equipment from any of the sponsors/vendors of fiber weekend.

I'm just curious if they are all talking/preaching the same ONT/deployment 
strategies as usual?

I wonder how close they are to what I am doing.

Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Our ROI is 5 years. We fund per neighborhood and usually come out easily paying 
out the 5 years monthly on the loan plus plenty left over for operations.

Our build costs to the home are skewed because we build at cost.

It’s going to vary a lot by your market and circumstance.



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of TJ Trout via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 10:58 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza


Any numbers on what it costs to serve an average urban or suburban neighborhood 
per home ? Trying to get some ideas if we can afford the investment in fiber.

Like what would it cost to serve say 100 or 200 homes? And idea on roi if you 
were paying for the fiber to be laid like I will be?
On Oct 11, 2014 9:46 PM, "Sterling Jacobson via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Hybrid model, I bring bandwidth in via wireless to the neighborhood and set up 
a cabinet that serves all the houses in active Ethernet fiber.
GPON is ok, but in this model so much of the expense was burial of conduit that 
it really didn’t make sense to just pull for GPON.
Plus GPON restricts you to a specific vendor market.

My model might not scale to thousands of installs a month, but it works for 
hundreds a POP.

A POP is about $15k for 200+ connections completely contained and redundant.
The end points and fiber construction are on top of that of course.

That is the major expense, the labor to bore and trench and splice hella ton of 
conduit, boxes and fiber strands.
My entire GigE NID/ONT setup is less than $100 installed though.

Buried conduit all the way to the side of the house, and fiber to the NID.
It’s built to last, the conduit and fiber being our biggest expense and asset.

Mikrotik “ONT” and off the shelf lasers from china for next to nothing.

I haven’t seen any cheaper ONT setup than what we do, and it’s full GigE.
The only piece of the puzzle I’m missing to do 10GigE to the home is a cheaper 
transceiver.
I’m sure that will come next year. Sky’s the limit once the fiber is in the 
ground on a one to one basis with the switch and the ONT.
We leave enough fiber to do a pair at the house, though everything is BIDI 
right now.

I don’t believe in VoIP or TV, so it’s all Ethernet. The customer can get their 
traditional phone and TV elsewhere.
Which is nice for regulations because we dodge every single headache I used to 
have with a WISP.

This fiber stuff is s much better and easier.

Costs more though.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Jason Pond via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 8:03 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza


So enlighten us to what you are doing Sterling.  So far so good.

Tomorrow will answer some more.

Sincerely,

Jason Pond
Owner
Grizzly Internet, Inc
p...@grizzlyinternet.com<mailto:p...@grizzlyinternet.com>
On Oct 11, 2014 6:36 PM, "Sterling Jacobson via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Anyone there that would like to update?

I couldn't make it.

Not sure that I would have gotten anything out of it anyways.

I don't use any equipment from any of the sponsors/vendors of fiber weekend.

I'm just curious if they are all talking/preaching the same ONT/deployment 
strategies as usual?

I wonder how close they are to what I am doing.

Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

What are they telling you guys that are at the fiber weekend?

I would be interested to hear what they are saying in terms of ONT/NID costs, 
fiber passed per household on single family homes costs etc.

MDU are obviously less expensive.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of TJ Trout via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 10:58 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza


Any numbers on what it costs to serve an average urban or suburban neighborhood 
per home ? Trying to get some ideas if we can afford the investment in fiber.

Like what would it cost to serve say 100 or 200 homes? And idea on roi if you 
were paying for the fiber to be laid like I will be?
On Oct 11, 2014 9:46 PM, "Sterling Jacobson via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Hybrid model, I bring bandwidth in via wireless to the neighborhood and set up 
a cabinet that serves all the houses in active Ethernet fiber.
GPON is ok, but in this model so much of the expense was burial of conduit that 
it really didn’t make sense to just pull for GPON.
Plus GPON restricts you to a specific vendor market.

My model might not scale to thousands of installs a month, but it works for 
hundreds a POP.

A POP is about $15k for 200+ connections completely contained and redundant.
The end points and fiber construction are on top of that of course.

That is the major expense, the labor to bore and trench and splice hella ton of 
conduit, boxes and fiber strands.
My entire GigE NID/ONT setup is less than $100 installed though.

Buried conduit all the way to the side of the house, and fiber to the NID.
It’s built to last, the conduit and fiber being our biggest expense and asset.

Mikrotik “ONT” and off the shelf lasers from china for next to nothing.

I haven’t seen any cheaper ONT setup than what we do, and it’s full GigE.
The only piece of the puzzle I’m missing to do 10GigE to the home is a cheaper 
transceiver.
I’m sure that will come next year. Sky’s the limit once the fiber is in the 
ground on a one to one basis with the switch and the ONT.
We leave enough fiber to do a pair at the house, though everything is BIDI 
right now.

I don’t believe in VoIP or TV, so it’s all Ethernet. The customer can get their 
traditional phone and TV elsewhere.
Which is nice for regulations because we dodge every single headache I used to 
have with a WISP.

This fiber stuff is s much better and easier.

Costs more though.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Jason Pond via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 8:03 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza


So enlighten us to what you are doing Sterling.  So far so good.

Tomorrow will answer some more.

Sincerely,

Jason Pond
Owner
Grizzly Internet, Inc
p...@grizzlyinternet.com<mailto:p...@grizzlyinternet.com>
On Oct 11, 2014 6:36 PM, "Sterling Jacobson via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Anyone there that would like to update?

I couldn't make it.

Not sure that I would have gotten anything out of it anyways.

I don't use any equipment from any of the sponsors/vendors of fiber weekend.

I'm just curious if they are all talking/preaching the same ONT/deployment 
strategies as usual?

I wonder how close they are to what I am doing.

Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Interesting device, I haven't seen it in production yet.

They don't know what they are doing obviously.

Fiber to the home requires a lot more lead line and usually a splice tray to 
hold it.

So their outdoor enclosure isn't going to work for most deployments, it will 
still be put in a larger outdoor enclosure.

If they made a version that had a built in splice tray and entrance for a 1" 
conduit pipe then it would work for us.

But interesting.



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof via Af
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2014 1:20 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

They've got this, but it seems like there's no place to spool up excess fiber, 
plus it's just a media converter, not a smart demarc AFAIK.
http://routerboard.com/RBFTC11


From: CBB - Jay Fuller via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2014 1:43 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza


stupid question, but i know the fiber mikrotik stuff / demarc still needs 
power.  what if the point you enter the house does not have power right there?  
how do you hook that up?  utilize POE in some shape, form, or fashion?
- Original Message -
From: Gino Villarini via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
To: mailto:af@afmug.com><mailto:af@afmug.com%3e>
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2014 9:10 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

Still using the firce10 switches?

Sent from Marconi's and Graham Bell's fused thoughts!!!


On Oct 12, 2014, at 1:35 AM, Sterling Jacobson via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Our ROI is 5 years. We fund per neighborhood and usually come out easily paying 
out the 5 years monthly on the loan plus plenty left over for operations.
Our build costs to the home are skewed because we build at cost.
It's going to vary a lot by your market and circumstance.
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of TJ Trout via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 10:58 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

Any numbers on what it costs to serve an average urban or suburban neighborhood 
per home ? Trying to get some ideas if we can afford the investment in fiber.

Like what would it cost to serve say 100 or 200 homes? And idea on roi if you 
were paying for the fiber to be laid like I will be?
On Oct 11, 2014 9:46 PM, "Sterling Jacobson via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Hybrid model, I bring bandwidth in via wireless to the neighborhood and set up 
a cabinet that serves all the houses in active Ethernet fiber.
GPON is ok, but in this model so much of the expense was burial of conduit that 
it really didn't make sense to just pull for GPON.
Plus GPON restricts you to a specific vendor market.
My model might not scale to thousands of installs a month, but it works for 
hundreds a POP.
A POP is about $15k for 200+ connections completely contained and redundant.
The end points and fiber construction are on top of that of course.
That is the major expense, the labor to bore and trench and splice hella ton of 
conduit, boxes and fiber strands.
My entire GigE NID/ONT setup is less than $100 installed though.
Buried conduit all the way to the side of the house, and fiber to the NID.
It's built to last, the conduit and fiber being our biggest expense and asset.
Mikrotik "ONT" and off the shelf lasers from china for next to nothing.
I haven't seen any cheaper ONT setup than what we do, and it's full GigE.
The only piece of the puzzle I'm missing to do 10GigE to the home is a cheaper 
transceiver.
I'm sure that will come next year. Sky's the limit once the fiber is in the 
ground on a one to one basis with the switch and the ONT.
We leave enough fiber to do a pair at the house, though everything is BIDI 
right now.
I don't believe in VoIP or TV, so it's all Ethernet. The customer can get their 
traditional phone and TV elsewhere.
Which is nice for regulations because we dodge every single headache I used to 
have with a WISP.
This fiber stuff is s much better and easier.
Costs more though.
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Jason Pond via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 8:03 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

So enlighten us to what you are doing Sterling.  So far so good.

Tomorrow will answer some more.

Sincerely,

Jason Pond
Owner
Grizzly Internet, Inc
p...@grizzlyinternet.com<mailto:p...@grizzlyinternet.com>
On Oct 11, 2014 6:36 PM, "Sterling Jacobson via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Anyone there that would like to update?

I couldn't make it.

Not sure that I would have gotten anything out of it anyways.

I don't use any equipment from any of the sponsors/vendors of fiber weekend.

I'm just curious if they are all talking/preaching the same ONT/deployment 
strategies as usual?

I wonder how close they are to what I am doing.

Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

We’ve only run the fiber into the house a couple of times.

It’s best for us to leave the demarcation on the outside of the house, and just 
use PoE from the inside.

That makes a clear line between us and them.

If they unplug their own power, they have cut themselves off, not our problem.

The RB2011 isn’t powerful enough to NAT/masquerade more than half the GigE 
traffic.
The RB260GS is better since it’s a switch and can switch a full GigE 900+Mbps 
of traffic.

I would definitely recommend a AC router with GigE switch ports if you are 
doing full GigE.

The newer Apple routers with a newer Apple laptop even on N wireless will do 
150Mbps wireless easily.

I can do about 3-400Mbps on a cheap USB 3.0 Wireless AC adapter and a dual 
chain AC router.

Not much is three channel yet, but they are coming.

Supposedly my Samsung Note 3 can do AC, but I haven’t gotten it to connect that 
way.
It only does about 50Mbps on wireless.



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Paul Conlin via Af
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2014 8:11 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

So once you get Gigabit to the home how do you deliver that via WiFi?  Ok, so 
you really can’t deliver 1000 Mbps via WiFi but is it really necessary to spend 
$200 on the latest 802.11AC router to get 300 Mbps?  What kind of WiFi 
throughput can you get from an RB2011?  How about the RB951Ui-2HnD?

PC
Blaze Broadband



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chris Fabien via Af
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2014 6:56 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza


We decided to use indoor/outdoor drop and run fiber to a 2011 at desktop or in 
utility area. Avoids poe injector which can be confusing for customer and 
generate service cslls.
On Oct 12, 2014 6:35 PM, "Jason McKemie via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
I put the RB in an outdoor case and run cat5e out to it. Fiber terminates at 
the closure. When I was using standard ONTs I ran a separate DC power wire to 
the UPS/power supply inside of the house.

-Jason

On Sunday, October 12, 2014, CBB - Jay Fuller via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:

I figured you'd want to enter the house where most other things enter the 
house...the fiber/mtik would be on the outside of the house?
- Original Message -
From: Jason Pond via Af
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2014 3:33 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

So Yes you can use POE with the MT units but I would just run fiber as far as 
you can to a power location.

Sincerely,

Jason Pond

On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 12:43 PM, CBB - Jay Fuller via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:

stupid question, but i know the fiber mikrotik stuff / demarc still needs 
power.  what if the point you enter the house does not have power right there?  
how do you hook that up?  utilize POE in some shape, form, or fashion?
- Original Message -
From: Gino Villarini via Af
To: mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2014 9:10 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

Still using the firce10 switches?

Sent from Marconi's and Graham Bell's fused thoughts!!!


On Oct 12, 2014, at 1:35 AM, Sterling Jacobson via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Our ROI is 5 years. We fund per neighborhood and usually come out easily paying 
out the 5 years monthly on the loan plus plenty left over for operations.
Our build costs to the home are skewed because we build at cost.
It’s going to vary a lot by your market and circumstance.
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of TJ Trout via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 10:58 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

Any numbers on what it costs to serve an average urban or suburban neighborhood 
per home ? Trying to get some ideas if we can afford the investment in fiber.

Like what would it cost to serve say 100 or 200 homes? And idea on roi if you 
were paying for the fiber to be laid like I will be?
On Oct 11, 2014 9:46 PM, "Sterling Jacobson via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Hybrid model, I bring bandwidth in via wireless to the neighborhood and set up 
a cabinet that serves all the houses in active Ethernet fiber.
GPON is ok, but in this model so much of the expense was burial of conduit that 
it really didn’t make sense to just pull for GPON.
Plus GPON restricts you to a specific vendor market.
My model might not scale to thousands of installs a month, but it works for 
hundreds a POP.
A POP is about $15k for 200+ connections completely contained and redundant.
The end points and fiber construction are on top of that of course.
That is the major expense, the labor to bore and trench and splice hella ton of 
conduit, boxes and fiber strands.
My entire GigE NID/ONT setup is less than $100 installed though.
Buried conduit all th

Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Yeah GigE PoE.

The GigE PoE adapters are cheap and work well with the RB260 models.

I like it that way, then the customer can decide if they want to put on 100 
hours of battery backup or not.

We just maintain the outside device at the Demarc on the side of their house.


From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of CBB - Jay Fuller via Af
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2014 12:44 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza


stupid question, but i know the fiber mikrotik stuff / demarc still needs 
power.  what if the point you enter the house does not have power right there?  
how do you hook that up?  utilize POE in some shape, form, or fashion?
- Original Message -
From: Gino Villarini via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
To: <mailto:af@afmug.com%3e>
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2014 9:10 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

Still using the firce10 switches?

Sent from Marconi's and Graham Bell's fused thoughts!!!


On Oct 12, 2014, at 1:35 AM, Sterling Jacobson via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Our ROI is 5 years. We fund per neighborhood and usually come out easily paying 
out the 5 years monthly on the loan plus plenty left over for operations.
Our build costs to the home are skewed because we build at cost.
It's going to vary a lot by your market and circumstance.
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of TJ Trout via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 10:58 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

Any numbers on what it costs to serve an average urban or suburban neighborhood 
per home ? Trying to get some ideas if we can afford the investment in fiber.

Like what would it cost to serve say 100 or 200 homes? And idea on roi if you 
were paying for the fiber to be laid like I will be?
On Oct 11, 2014 9:46 PM, "Sterling Jacobson via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Hybrid model, I bring bandwidth in via wireless to the neighborhood and set up 
a cabinet that serves all the houses in active Ethernet fiber.
GPON is ok, but in this model so much of the expense was burial of conduit that 
it really didn't make sense to just pull for GPON.
Plus GPON restricts you to a specific vendor market.
My model might not scale to thousands of installs a month, but it works for 
hundreds a POP.
A POP is about $15k for 200+ connections completely contained and redundant.
The end points and fiber construction are on top of that of course.
That is the major expense, the labor to bore and trench and splice hella ton of 
conduit, boxes and fiber strands.
My entire GigE NID/ONT setup is less than $100 installed though.
Buried conduit all the way to the side of the house, and fiber to the NID.
It's built to last, the conduit and fiber being our biggest expense and asset.
Mikrotik "ONT" and off the shelf lasers from china for next to nothing.
I haven't seen any cheaper ONT setup than what we do, and it's full GigE.
The only piece of the puzzle I'm missing to do 10GigE to the home is a cheaper 
transceiver.
I'm sure that will come next year. Sky's the limit once the fiber is in the 
ground on a one to one basis with the switch and the ONT.
We leave enough fiber to do a pair at the house, though everything is BIDI 
right now.
I don't believe in VoIP or TV, so it's all Ethernet. The customer can get their 
traditional phone and TV elsewhere.
Which is nice for regulations because we dodge every single headache I used to 
have with a WISP.
This fiber stuff is s much better and easier.
Costs more though.
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Jason Pond via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 8:03 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

So enlighten us to what you are doing Sterling.  So far so good.

Tomorrow will answer some more.

Sincerely,

Jason Pond
Owner
Grizzly Internet, Inc
p...@grizzlyinternet.com<mailto:p...@grizzlyinternet.com>
On Oct 11, 2014 6:36 PM, "Sterling Jacobson via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Anyone there that would like to update?

I couldn't make it.

Not sure that I would have gotten anything out of it anyways.

I don't use any equipment from any of the sponsors/vendors of fiber weekend.

I'm just curious if they are all talking/preaching the same ONT/deployment 
strategies as usual?

I wonder how close they are to what I am doing.

Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Oh wow!

That’s like every single WISP operator then!

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ryan Spott via Af
Sent: Monday, October 13, 2014 11:45 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

Check your local electrical codes for wiring power over Ethernet.

Things got sticky in WA state over this issue and it took considerable effort 
to change the electrical rules.

ryan

On Oct 13, 2014, at 07:38, Sterling Jacobson via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Yeah GigE PoE.

The GigE PoE adapters are cheap and work well with the RB260 models.

I like it that way, then the customer can decide if they want to put on 100 
hours of battery backup or not.

We just maintain the outside device at the Demarc on the side of their house.


From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of CBB - Jay Fuller via Af
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2014 12:44 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza


stupid question, but i know the fiber mikrotik stuff / demarc still needs 
power.  what if the point you enter the house does not have power right there?  
how do you hook that up?  utilize POE in some shape, form, or fashion?
- Original Message -
From: Gino Villarini via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
To: <mailto:af@afmug.com%3e>
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2014 9:10 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

Still using the firce10 switches?

Sent from Marconi's and Graham Bell's fused thoughts!!!


On Oct 12, 2014, at 1:35 AM, Sterling Jacobson via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Our ROI is 5 years. We fund per neighborhood and usually come out easily paying 
out the 5 years monthly on the loan plus plenty left over for operations.
Our build costs to the home are skewed because we build at cost.
It’s going to vary a lot by your market and circumstance.
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of TJ Trout via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 10:58 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

Any numbers on what it costs to serve an average urban or suburban neighborhood 
per home ? Trying to get some ideas if we can afford the investment in fiber.

Like what would it cost to serve say 100 or 200 homes? And idea on roi if you 
were paying for the fiber to be laid like I will be?
On Oct 11, 2014 9:46 PM, "Sterling Jacobson via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Hybrid model, I bring bandwidth in via wireless to the neighborhood and set up 
a cabinet that serves all the houses in active Ethernet fiber.
GPON is ok, but in this model so much of the expense was burial of conduit that 
it really didn’t make sense to just pull for GPON.
Plus GPON restricts you to a specific vendor market.
My model might not scale to thousands of installs a month, but it works for 
hundreds a POP.
A POP is about $15k for 200+ connections completely contained and redundant.
The end points and fiber construction are on top of that of course.
That is the major expense, the labor to bore and trench and splice hella ton of 
conduit, boxes and fiber strands.
My entire GigE NID/ONT setup is less than $100 installed though.
Buried conduit all the way to the side of the house, and fiber to the NID.
It’s built to last, the conduit and fiber being our biggest expense and asset.
Mikrotik “ONT” and off the shelf lasers from china for next to nothing.
I haven’t seen any cheaper ONT setup than what we do, and it’s full GigE.
The only piece of the puzzle I’m missing to do 10GigE to the home is a cheaper 
transceiver.
I’m sure that will come next year. Sky’s the limit once the fiber is in the 
ground on a one to one basis with the switch and the ONT.
We leave enough fiber to do a pair at the house, though everything is BIDI 
right now.
I don’t believe in VoIP or TV, so it’s all Ethernet. The customer can get their 
traditional phone and TV elsewhere.
Which is nice for regulations because we dodge every single headache I used to 
have with a WISP.
This fiber stuff is s much better and easier.
Costs more though.
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Jason Pond via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 8:03 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fiber Weekend Wispalooza

So enlighten us to what you are doing Sterling.  So far so good.

Tomorrow will answer some more.

Sincerely,

Jason Pond
Owner
Grizzly Internet, Inc
p...@grizzlyinternet.com<mailto:p...@grizzlyinternet.com>
On Oct 11, 2014 6:36 PM, "Sterling Jacobson via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Anyone there that would like to update?

I couldn't make it.

Not sure that I would have gotten anything out of it anyways.

I don't use any equipment from any of the sponsors/vendors of fiber weekend.

I'm just curious if they are all talking/preaching the same ONT/deployment 
strategies as usual?

I wonder how close they are to what I am doing.

Re: [AFMUG] Samsung Test environment for 7.5Gbps

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

28Ghz for cell phones? That doesn't go through walls?

Lame.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Rory Conaway via Af
Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2014 10:11 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Samsung Test environment for 7.5Gbps

http://global.samsungtomorrow.com/?p=43349

Rory Conaway
Triad Wireless
4226 S. 37th Street
Phoenix, Az.  85040
602-426-0542
r...@triadwireless.net
www.triadwireless.net

[AFMUG] Google Vs. Vivint

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Looks like Google is moving in to Vivints wireless territory/technology.

http://www.zdnet.com/google-tests-ultra-high-speed-wireless-internet-technology-734751/

Who's going to win?

Re: [AFMUG] Vivint wireless

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

I just built out one of their local neighborhoods.

Some have it good, some not so good.

I think that’s how it goes with their radio to radio mesh type network.

A lot are switching to my fiber though.

They appear to have locked in some people to a two year contract though.

Some of those can’t wait to get out of contract and switch.

The radios in this neighborhood are fed from a school that is nearby on fiber.

It looks like a square with a two or three antennas sticking up from the top 
and down from the bottom.

Mounted on an arm, lots of short jumper coax cables.

Powered over Ethernet.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jaime Solorza via Af
Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2014 9:39 PM
To: Animal Farm
Subject: [AFMUG] Vivint wireless


Spoke to young guys from Vivint
Today at lunch and they are beta testing 50 x 50 mbps wireless using a fiber 
fed hub and then cover a neighborhood.  Testing here and Utah somewhere.  They 
work for automation branch and didnt know particulars.   Anyone hear about this?
Jaime Solorza

Re: [AFMUG] Mikrotik CCR and PPPoE

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

They probably finally utilized the extra cores in the code.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt via Af
Sent: Friday, October 24, 2014 11:52 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Mikrotik CCR and PPPoE

Recently updated to a 36 core CCR as a PPPoE server.  Was having some issues 
with higher tier packages such as our office getting more than 20mbps through a 
single connection.  IPv6 seemed to perform better then IPv4 for speed tests.  
Upgraded the CCR from v6.17 to v6.20.  Now every pppoe connection is screaming 
fast.  I don't know what Mikrotik did but something has changed.  I wonder if 
they did anything with there BGP code?  We have another one doing a couple 
gigabit full BGP connections.  Seems to work fine but one core is almost always 
at 100 percent.  Its currently running v6.19.

Re: [AFMUG] Holy Grail

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Is it just me, or is no one realizing that we are still not that far from 2005 
with wireless.

Yes, we have 300-1Gbps capable radios.
But they trade that for larger channel allocations and even more signal to 
noise requirements.

But the spectrum allocations haven’t changed enough to use these new features 
to their fullest in a radio dense environment.

When doing cost analysis in my area last year for wireless I realized I had to 
forklift upgrade most of my network, and build towers out in a half mile range.

This was to get the 30Mbps plan rates to really work.

The costs were skyrocketing because of all the towers and sectors.

I think the real winners of late are still the rural and low density wireless 
provider domains.
They are the ones with clean enough spectrum to cost this competitively.



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jaime Solorza via Af
Sent: Friday, October 24, 2014 6:41 PM
To: Animal Farm
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Holy Grail


Bring out the Holy Grenade of Antioch...

Jaime Solorza
On Oct 24, 2014 5:56 PM, "Jayson Baker via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Anyone else get this email?

Anyone know what it is?

Re: [AFMUG] Holy Grail

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Heee, in 2005 we had a very redundant successful layer 2 network.
I think mainly because the radios had finally implemented filtering and storm 
control at the consumer side.

We have about 100 new protocols now it seems like, but basic networking is 
still the same since then.

That could use a major simplification and overhaul as well.

I wish the FCC would rework the lower frequency spectrum like white spaces and 
open up huge chunks of it.

That would single handedly turn the wireless WISP industry into a very 
competitive powerhouse.

It’s not like it doesn’t exist.

There is no way all that spectrum is being constantly used all over the US all 
the time.
I get the feeling most of it is unused most of the time.

Has anyone ever done a semi-comprehensive study of actual raw spectrum 
noise/usage across significant bands in major dense areas?

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via Af
Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2014 11:17 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Holy Grail

Big flat network... instant worm propagation... ahh yes, the good old days...

From: Ken Hohhof via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2014 10:48 AM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Holy Grail

That is like saying the car I drive today isn’t much faster than my first car 
in 1969.  There is no comparison though when you look at all the incremental 
improvements.  Hey, that 1969 Camaro had an AM radio and a heater!

If you think the Internet service you offer today is not much different than 
2005, just a little faster, you need to travel back in time and visit your 2005 
WISP and see all the differences between then and now.  I look at the sub-ms 
backhauls and redundant rings and 24x7 reliability and monitoring and quick 
restoration people expect today because their lives revolve around connectivity 
and cloud apps, and it’s a world of difference.  The only thing that has stayed 
the same is the price we get away with charging, in fact that has not even kept 
pace with inflation.


From: Travis Johnson via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2014 11:22 AM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Holy Grail

I agree that the only thing that has changed is speed... but what do you 
expect? The PC hasn't changed much in 30 years... just faster... it still does 
the same thing it did 30 years ago, just faster.

Travis
On 10/24/2014 11:22 PM, That One Guy via Af wrote:
Sterling, thank you! I think you and me must be the only ones who can see the 
elephant.. OH LOOKY LOOKY AC PTMP!!

On Fri, Oct 24, 2014 at 9:09 PM, Sterling Jacobson via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Is it just me, or is no one realizing that we are still not that far from 2005 
with wireless.

Yes, we have 300-1Gbps capable radios.
But they trade that for larger channel allocations and even more signal to 
noise requirements.

But the spectrum allocations haven’t changed enough to use these new features 
to their fullest in a radio dense environment.

When doing cost analysis in my area last year for wireless I realized I had to 
forklift upgrade most of my network, and build towers out in a half mile range.

This was to get the 30Mbps plan rates to really work.

The costs were skyrocketing because of all the towers and sectors.

I think the real winners of late are still the rural and low density wireless 
provider domains.
They are the ones with clean enough spectrum to cost this competitively.



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Jaime Solorza via Af
Sent: Friday, October 24, 2014 6:41 PM
To: Animal Farm
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Holy Grail


Bring out the Holy Grenade of Antioch...

Jaime Solorza
On Oct 24, 2014 5:56 PM, "Jayson Baker via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Anyone else get this email?

Anyone know what it is?



--
All parts should go together without forcing. You must remember that the parts 
you are reassembling were disassembled by you. Therefore, if you can't get them 
together again, there must be a reason. By all means, do not use a hammer. -- 
IBM maintenance manual, 1925

Re: [AFMUG] Mikrotik CCR and PPPoE

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Oh, that's even better.

So they still haven't opened up their entire code base to multithreading using 
multiple cores?

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Dennis Burgess via Af
Sent: Friday, October 24, 2014 8:56 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mikrotik CCR and PPPoE

No multi-core at all.  Just optimization.  

Dennis Burgess, Link Technologies, Inc. 
314-735-0270

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Jacobson via Af
Sent: Friday, October 24, 2014 7:11 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mikrotik CCR and PPPoE

They probably finally utilized the extra cores in the code.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt via Af
Sent: Friday, October 24, 2014 11:52 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Mikrotik CCR and PPPoE

Recently updated to a 36 core CCR as a PPPoE server.  Was having some issues 
with higher tier packages such as our office getting more than 20mbps through a 
single connection.  IPv6 seemed to perform better then IPv4 for speed tests.  
Upgraded the CCR from v6.17 to v6.20.  Now every pppoe connection is screaming 
fast.  I don't know what Mikrotik did but something has changed.  I wonder if 
they did anything with there BGP code?  We have another one doing a couple 
gigabit full BGP connections.  Seems to work fine but one core is almost always 
at 100 percent.  Its currently running v6.19.

Re: [AFMUG] Mikrotik CCR and PPPoE

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Dennis, was it you who said you figured out or have knowledge of the btest at 
the coding level?

I have a project that I need that in the next month or so.



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Dennis Burgess via Af
Sent: Friday, October 24, 2014 8:56 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mikrotik CCR and PPPoE

No multi-core at all.  Just optimization.  

Dennis Burgess, Link Technologies, Inc. 
314-735-0270

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Jacobson via Af
Sent: Friday, October 24, 2014 7:11 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mikrotik CCR and PPPoE

They probably finally utilized the extra cores in the code.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt via Af
Sent: Friday, October 24, 2014 11:52 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Mikrotik CCR and PPPoE

Recently updated to a 36 core CCR as a PPPoE server.  Was having some issues 
with higher tier packages such as our office getting more than 20mbps through a 
single connection.  IPv6 seemed to perform better then IPv4 for speed tests.  
Upgraded the CCR from v6.17 to v6.20.  Now every pppoe connection is screaming 
fast.  I don't know what Mikrotik did but something has changed.  I wonder if 
they did anything with there BGP code?  We have another one doing a couple 
gigabit full BGP connections.  Seems to work fine but one core is almost always 
at 100 percent.  Its currently running v6.19.

[AFMUG] Odd switch question - CX4 to SFP+ direct attach copper cable?

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Is there a direct attach copper 10Gbps cable that has a CX4 format on one end 
and SFP+ format on the other end?

I want to connect my Dell array with CX4 Ethernet uplink module compatibility 
to my SFP+ switch port without using optics/conversion.

Can't seem to find such a beast, but maybe I'm looking in all the wrong places.

Re: [AFMUG] Favorite SFP vendors

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Forrest, what kind of SFP modules are you looking for?


From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett via Af
Sent: Thursday, November 6, 2014 6:48 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite SFP vendors

I don't, but I believe their CWDM muxes are 1/2 to 1/3 the price of FiberStore.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com

[Image removed by sender.][Image removed by 
sender.][Image 
removed by 
sender.][Image
 removed by sender.]


From: "Jason McKemie via Af" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Thursday, November 6, 2014 7:40:48 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Favorite SFP vendors
Interesting.  Do you know how these compare to the ones offered at 
fiberstore.com?

On Thu, Nov 6, 2014 at 7:10 PM, Mike Hammett via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Now I have Baltic's MaxxWave and Mikrotik SFPs, but I'll probably be buying 
from Gigalight going forward. A friend of mine likes them enough that last week 
he ordered 200 SFP+ modules from them.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com

[Image removed by sender.][Image removed by 
sender.][Image 
removed by 
sender.][Image
 removed by sender.]

From: "Forrest Christian (List Account) via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>>
To: "af" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Sent: Thursday, November 6, 2014 7:05:51 PM
Subject: [AFMUG] Favorite SFP vendors
It's time for me to acquire a range of SFP's here for development and testing. 
Instead of me randomly going out and acquiring some, I figured a smarter move 
was to ask here what everyone's favorite SFP vendors/model numbers were and go 
and get a couple of the most commonly used ones.

So, what SFP's do each of you use in your network?

-forrest

Re: [AFMUG] good fiber supply source?

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

I don’t know, seems about the same as local electrical?

I would like to find a good supply for a fully loaded single mode fiber panel 
26-144 SC patch.

Seem any good sites/places for that?



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of timothy steele via Af
Sent: Saturday, November 8, 2014 4:05 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] good fiber supply source?

Found this link on a diffrent forum.. the rates really seem lower then others?

http://www.comstarsupply.com/

Re: [AFMUG] good fiber supply source?

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Chuck McCown needs to fabricate fiber patch panels fully loaded.

There has got to be a huge profit margin in there somewhere.

I mean essentially it’s a rack mount case with patch module inserts which are 
basically just a bunch of SC/LC pigtails.

And maybe a splice tray or fancy tray system.

That’s it. Can’t be more than a few hundred dollars of materials in there.

SC to SC pigtails are less than a buck a piece.
The rest is just shaped metal/plastic.


From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck Hogg via Af
Sent: Saturday, November 8, 2014 4:38 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] good fiber supply source?

We use Comstar, best to have it custom quoted.  The thing is, I've had quotes 
from Codale, PTSupply, and Comstar.  All quoted slightly differently, but they 
were within a few dollars of each other.  Just presented a different way.  I 
found out that they submit to the same manufacturers and the manus basically 
spit it back to them at roughly the same price.  Only thing you might get a 
better deal on is if they have local stock.

Regards,
Chuck

On Sat, Nov 8, 2014 at 6:31 PM, Sterling Jacobson via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
I don’t know, seems about the same as local electrical?

I would like to find a good supply for a fully loaded single mode fiber panel 
26-144 SC patch.

Seem any good sites/places for that?



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of timothy steele via Af
Sent: Saturday, November 8, 2014 4:05 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: [AFMUG] good fiber supply source?

Found this link on a diffrent forum.. the rates really seem lower then others?

http://www.comstarsupply.com/

Re: [AFMUG] Customer routers

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Do you already have a CPE/ONT device at their house/building?

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Joseph Marsh via Af
Sent: Saturday, November 8, 2014 5:09 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Customer routers


Doing a new area should I put a managed router at every customer house or 
business or just let them do their own ?

Sent from my iPhone

Re: [AFMUG] Customer routers

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

I never did, the SM has enough to control what you need to from the provider 
side.

I prefer a demarcation at the SM/ONT and let the customer be responsible for 
their side of their network.

If I had done managed router then I would have gotten double the calls for 
everyones NAT to their Xbox and filtering etc.

What this industry needs is a way for the consumer to know for themselves if 
their provider is the network issue, or their router.

I'm working on an app/site for that right now that they can use their 
phone/device to tell them if it's their problem or the providers.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Joseph Marsh via Af
Sent: Saturday, November 8, 2014 5:48 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Customer routers

Sm on the side of the house 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 8, 2014, at 6:26 PM, Sterling Jacobson via Af  wrote:
> 
> Do you already have a CPE/ONT device at their house/building?
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Joseph Marsh via Af
> Sent: Saturday, November 8, 2014 5:09 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: [AFMUG] Customer routers
> 
> 
> Doing a new area should I put a managed router at every customer house or 
> business or just let them do their own ?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone

[AFMUG] Man I love 10Gbps connections!

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Got a couple of cloudcore routers running over a 14 mile single strand fiber 
link using BIDI SFP+ connectors.

Re: [AFMUG] Man I love 10Gbps connections!

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

It’s my own fiber.

We have a growing portfolio of fiber runs across town and through other cities 
now.

We keep growing it by building and trading.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of TJ Trout via Af
Sent: Monday, November 10, 2014 4:42 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Man I love 10Gbps connections!

how much was the fiber lease?

On Mon, Nov 10, 2014 at 3:38 PM, Gino Villarini via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
How much bw  can you pull via the ccrs ?

Gino A. Villarini
@gvillarini



> On Nov 10, 2014, at 7:33 PM, Sterling Jacobson via Af 
> mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
>
> Got a couple of cloudcore routers running over a 14 mile single strand fiber 
> link using BIDI SFP+ connectors.
>

Re: [AFMUG] Man I love 10Gbps connections!

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

I think about 3Gbps both ways unswitched/unrouted.

That's going from CCR to CCR.

I suspect it doesn't multithread it well, because the CPU is only around 14 
percent.

Would probably do better if traffic were passing through the routers instead of 
using the routers btest function.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Gino Villarini via Af
Sent: Monday, November 10, 2014 4:38 PM
To: 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Man I love 10Gbps connections!

How much bw  can you pull via the ccrs ?

Gino A. Villarini
@gvillarini



> On Nov 10, 2014, at 7:33 PM, Sterling Jacobson via Af  wrote:
> 
> Got a couple of cloudcore routers running over a 14 mile single strand fiber 
> link using BIDI SFP+ connectors.
> 

[AFMUG] Dell Force10 S4810 switches

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Anyone on this list use these? Or know where I can find an 'expert' in force10 
SFP switches?

[AFMUG] For love of all that is evil (mikrotik/routerboard)

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Freaking hell, I just spent 30 minutes trying to unravel a router mystery.

Ended up that both of my CCR Mikrotik routers had THE SAME MAC ADDRESSES 
between them!

They are identical. Every port had a consecutive MAC number, but they were the 
same numbers for both the SFP and GigE ports across the two routers.

I'm guessing they flashed them both at the manufacturer the exact same, then 
didn't make it through a MAC renumbering.

Or is this common with Mikrotik now days?

I'm sure I've encountered it before, but like once every five years.

Just a FYI for all y'all who use Mikrotiks.

Watch your backs (I mean MACs)!

Re: [AFMUG] For love of all that is evil (mikrotik/routerboard)

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Fortunately it has a very convenient button right on the interface page to 
immediately change the int MAC.

I was on the phone with my provider who helped me identify the problem from 
their MAC table.

I hit that change MAC button and problem solved.

The provider guy was completely mystified that I could do that immediately in 
real time.

I guess that would be a WIN for Mikrotik over clunky old school gear.

If it hadn’t been Mikrotiks problem to begin with…

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of George Skorup (Cyber 
Broadcasting) via Af
Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2014 12:18 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] For love of all that is evil (mikrotik/routerboard)

Do an /interface ethernet print detail. You'll see if the MAC matches the orig 
(hardware) MAC. You can then reset to that original MAC.

On 11/13/2014 1:13 PM, Ty Featherling via Af wrote:
I know on Mikrotik if you copy a config from one device to another and you do 
not sanitize any MAC addresses in it you can rewrite the MACs on the new 
device. Any chance you did something like that? If so a reset to default config 
should restore the original MACs.

-Ty

On Thu, Nov 13, 2014 at 1:10 PM, Chuck McCown via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
I recommend you use different MACs on Ethernet devices that are connected to 
other Ethernet devices.  Especially if they are all on the same collision 
domain.

Improper operation may result in having both devices use the same MAC.

Of course this will continue to be a problem until MAC-V6 is widely 
implemented, but try to find different MACs.  I know they are hard to come by, 
but it is sure to make you life easier...

(I used to have a block of MACs assigned to my company.  Not sure if I had to 
pay Xerox for them or what.  Been a long time ago.)

From: That One Guy via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2014 11:48 AM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] For love of all that is evil (mikrotik/routerboard)

I always wondered how manufactures reuse their MACs, apparently all in the same 
batch

On Thu, Nov 13, 2014 at 12:35 PM, Sterling Jacobson via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
Freaking hell, I just spent 30 minutes trying to unravel a router mystery.

Ended up that both of my CCR Mikrotik routers had THE SAME MAC ADDRESSES 
between them!

They are identical. Every port had a consecutive MAC number, but they were the 
same numbers for both the SFP and GigE ports across the two routers.

I'm guessing they flashed them both at the manufacturer the exact same, then 
didn't make it through a MAC renumbering.

Or is this common with Mikrotik now days?

I'm sure I've encountered it before, but like once every five years.

Just a FYI for all y'all who use Mikrotiks.

Watch your backs (I mean MACs)!



--
All parts should go together without forcing. You must remember that the parts 
you are reassembling were disassembled by you. Therefore, if you can't get them 
together again, there must be a reason. By all means, do not use a hammer. -- 
IBM maintenance manual, 1925

Re: [AFMUG] WARNING: Steamy Subject Matter

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Yes, Fiber.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via Af
Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2014 12:32 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] WARNING: Steamy Subject Matter

And Fiber Sterling?

-Original Message-
From: Jay Weekley via Af
Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2014 12:29 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] WARNING: Steamy Subject Matter

MDU deployment. Wired and wireless.

Jason Petrillo via Af wrote:
>
> So that is what it takes to get your attention…
>
>
> As has been mentioned several times in the recent past we are working 
> on the Animal Farm 9 agenda.  We could really use some input from you 
> the participants in this process.  Currently I am counting on the 
> usual suspect to show their wares in a similar fashion to what they 
> have done in the past. Beyond that I would ask what would you like to learn 
> more about?
> Panel discussions?  How to meet girls? How to pick the perfect 
> emoticon to best capture mood and intonation?  I’m open to anything 
> and would be happy to chase down industry experts to enlighten us all.
>
> Thoughts?
>
> If you would rather not respond to the group with your suggestions 
> please feel free to contact me at ja...@cni.net  
> or 360.442.4414.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jason Petrillo
>
> Last Mile Gear
>

[AFMUG] CCR1009-8G-1S-1S+

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Had one of these routerboards/Mikrotik units blank out on my this morning, 
requiring a physical reboot.

Anyone else tried these units?

I'm realizing there might be production issues with them, and I am scared to 
install the other one I have.

I have two of the newer dual SFP+ slot ones on backorder.
I wonder if those are any better?

[AFMUG] Need some WAN topology/protocol advice

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

I know a lot of us here span networks across large areas and have multiple 
providers.

I want my IP address space to be redundant and I guess I can either make sure I 
have a ring with OSPF/ static routes, or I can BGP.

Since I sell to other providers that would like BGP and I would like to 
preserve my routing by /24 classes via BGP.
Maybe I should just use BGP at each site/area?

That would restrict me to keeping the sites at /24 class size or larger though, 
since external BGP doesn't like anything smaller.

I think that's ok, but it does lend itself to waste if I come short of using 
the 254 IP's or I just break the barrier into another /24 for the site.

But I can't think of any way around it without relying on infrastructure to 
ring me back to a central BGP point or two, using OSPF inside.

What do you guys do?

Re: [AFMUG] Need some WAN topology/protocol advice

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Yeah Dennis, I might do that.

Was looking for general input into what others are doing on the list as well 
though.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Dennis Burgess via Af
Sent: Wednesday, November 19, 2014 3:35 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Need some WAN topology/protocol advice

Sterling, we do consulting on that type of networking questions.  Hit me 
off-list if you want and we can get you a ticket put in and a 1/2 hour 
conversation can go a long way to help you get some understanding..  I'm sure 
though there will be a good discussion here. 

Dennis Burgess, CTO, Link Technologies, Inc.
den...@linktechs.net - 314-735-0270 - www.linktechs.net


-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Jacobson via Af
Sent: Wednesday, November 19, 2014 4:04 PM
To: 'af@afmug.com'
Subject: [AFMUG] Need some WAN topology/protocol advice

I know a lot of us here span networks across large areas and have multiple 
providers.

I want my IP address space to be redundant and I guess I can either make sure I 
have a ring with OSPF/ static routes, or I can BGP.

Since I sell to other providers that would like BGP and I would like to 
preserve my routing by /24 classes via BGP.
Maybe I should just use BGP at each site/area?

That would restrict me to keeping the sites at /24 class size or larger though, 
since external BGP doesn't like anything smaller.

I think that's ok, but it does lend itself to waste if I come short of using 
the 254 IP's or I just break the barrier into another /24 for the site.

But I can't think of any way around it without relying on infrastructure to 
ring me back to a central BGP point or two, using OSPF inside.

What do you guys do?

Re: [AFMUG] Need some WAN topology/protocol advice

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Yeah.

I'll take a look at that.

I'm not sure I want all IP at the core, since different areas need different 
BGP handoffs for myself and other providers on LIT services.

I guess what I'm really debating with myself is do I continue to treat each 
'area' cabinet (akin to Tower sites) separately redundant, or do I just go 
ahead and institute a giant redundant ring.

I'll have the ring in most areas eventually anyways, but to start out it 
appears like a star with redundancy at the ends to other providers/links.



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Jenkins via Af
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 9:25 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Need some WAN topology/protocol advice

Is this for fiber? Are you building fiber rings? If so, you may want to look 
into G.8032v2 designs.



Matthew Jenkins
SmarterBroadband
m...@sbbinc.net
530.272.4000

On 11/19/2014 02:04 PM, Sterling Jacobson via Af wrote:
> I know a lot of us here span networks across large areas and have multiple 
> providers.
>
> I want my IP address space to be redundant and I guess I can either make sure 
> I have a ring with OSPF/ static routes, or I can BGP.
>
> Since I sell to other providers that would like BGP and I would like to 
> preserve my routing by /24 classes via BGP.
> Maybe I should just use BGP at each site/area?
>
> That would restrict me to keeping the sites at /24 class size or larger 
> though, since external BGP doesn't like anything smaller.
>
> I think that's ok, but it does lend itself to waste if I come short of using 
> the 254 IP's or I just break the barrier into another /24 for the site.
>
> But I can't think of any way around it without relying on infrastructure to 
> ring me back to a central BGP point or two, using OSPF inside.
>
> What do you guys do?
>

[AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

What I really want is an integrated system that isn't stuck in the 90's.

I want the customer to have an app on their phone that tells them when their 
network is having issues and why.
I want it to also remind them to pay their bill and provide a lazy/easy way to 
do that.

I want that same system to have an engineer app that tells us when nodes fail 
and why.

So if a node goes down and it's important, it should show up on my phone and I 
can take action.
One of those actions would be to message to outage impacted customers the ETA 
to fix etc.

Emails from Cacti don't count.

Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

BUT, the phones now days are smart enough to know when wifi sucks or goes out 
completely.

They fall back to 3/4G.

Which is awesome, because it could still talk to the service provider end and 
tell the customer the status.

I think this would work better than a green/red light.

The phone App would tell you that your service is correct to the house, but 
that inside it's not talking.
Then walk the customer through a set of standard fix it routines.

That would solve most of our calls right there.

On the back end it just needs to talk to a server process that can get access 
to the device on the side of the house.

The best would be an embedded speed test in the ONT/CPE that could report back 
to the App and say they are getting what they are paying for to the side of 
their house. And then give them suggestions for fixing their crappy wifi.

I bet it wouldn't take much to get this done and working with a few larger 
billing systems and equipment platforms, who's with me??

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof via Af
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 12:35 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

Part of the problem is so many customers are 100% WiFi now, so unless you have 
a managed router there, you have 2 big problem areas beyond the demarc - the 
customer's router and the customer's WiFi.


-Original Message-
From: Bill Prince via Af
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 1:04 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

Linktechs built a tool a couple years ago that ran on the customer's PC 
(WIndows only) that would give the customer a "connection health"
indication.  It would monitor the local gateway, and give both a green light 
for connected, plus a reading on the latency.  You go too much beyond that, and 
you will get a bunch of false positives when something beyond your local 
network is having some kind of issue (we get our share of these).

I don't think they got much response from it, and I don't think they offer it 
any longer.

bp


On 11/20/2014 9:43 AM, Sterling Jacobson via Af wrote:
> What I really want is an integrated system that isn't stuck in the 90's.
>
> I want the customer to have an app on their phone that tells them when 
> their network is having issues and why.
> I want it to also remind them to pay their bill and provide a 
> lazy/easy way to do that.
>
> I want that same system to have an engineer app that tells us when 
> nodes fail and why.
>
> So if a node goes down and it's important, it should show up on my 
> phone and I can take action.
> One of those actions would be to message to outage impacted customers 
> the ETA to fix etc.
>
> Emails from Cacti don't count.
>

Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Wrong on both counts.

I used to be in software development, so like anything else, it's who you know.
I can get this done for a lot less.

And having an app for the customer to view and fix or find problems on their 
own is a differentiator itself.
Every one of my customers I've talked to about this has expressed great 
interest in not having to call in if they can help it.

I'm guessing a few of the older generation won't have a phone or care to use an 
app, they can always call in.

But in general it looks like it will greatly reduce support overhead for the 
ISP and increase customer satisfaction at the same time.

I guess time will tell.

I already have this underway, parts are developed already, but if someone wants 
to help out, let me know!

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson via Af
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 2:15 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

Sterling,

This sounds like an easy task, but I can tell you as someone that is currently 
developing software, and is starting December 1 to build a simple iPhone app, 
software development is very expensive. My app is a pretty simple... easy to 
use front-end with a cloud based database back-end... yet the quotes I have 
gotten are $50,000 - $75,000. This is from 3 different development companies 
all based in Utah. All of them are busy and each has 20+ full-time developers 
working for them, so they have enough business and must not be totally out of 
line on their quotes.

I said this 10+ years ago, and I'll say it again... customer service is the 
only thing that makes you different than the big cable and telco companies. 
Having a live person that can help people troubleshoot and fix issues is the 
key to keeping people with your service. If you are just going to send them to 
an app on their phones, you become the same as every other provider... and your 
service becomes a commodity just like everyone else.

Travis

On 11/20/2014 1:49 PM, Sterling Jacobson via Af wrote:
> BUT, the phones now days are smart enough to know when wifi sucks or goes out 
> completely.
>
> They fall back to 3/4G.
>
> Which is awesome, because it could still talk to the service provider end and 
> tell the customer the status.
>
> I think this would work better than a green/red light.
>
> The phone App would tell you that your service is correct to the house, but 
> that inside it's not talking.
> Then walk the customer through a set of standard fix it routines.
>
> That would solve most of our calls right there.
>
> On the back end it just needs to talk to a server process that can get access 
> to the device on the side of the house.
>
> The best would be an embedded speed test in the ONT/CPE that could report 
> back to the App and say they are getting what they are paying for to the side 
> of their house. And then give them suggestions for fixing their crappy wifi.
>
> I bet it wouldn't take much to get this done and working with a few larger 
> billing systems and equipment platforms, who's with me??
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof via Af
> Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 12:35 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's
>
> Part of the problem is so many customers are 100% WiFi now, so unless you 
> have a managed router there, you have 2 big problem areas beyond the demarc - 
> the customer's router and the customer's WiFi.
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Bill Prince via Af
> Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 1:04 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's
>
> Linktechs built a tool a couple years ago that ran on the customer's PC 
> (WIndows only) that would give the customer a "connection health"
> indication.  It would monitor the local gateway, and give both a green light 
> for connected, plus a reading on the latency.  You go too much beyond that, 
> and you will get a bunch of false positives when something beyond your local 
> network is having some kind of issue (we get our share of these).
>
> I don't think they got much response from it, and I don't think they offer it 
> any longer.
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 11/20/2014 9:43 AM, Sterling Jacobson via Af wrote:
>> What I really want is an integrated system that isn't stuck in the 90's.
>>
>> I want the customer to have an app on their phone that tells them 
>> when their network is having issues and why.
>> I want it to also remind them to pay their bill and provide a 
>> lazy/easy way to do that.
>>
>> I want that same system to have an engineer app that tells us when 
>> nodes fail and why.
>>
>> So if a node goes down and it's important, it should show up on my 
>> phone and I can take action.
>> One of those actions would be to message to outage impacted customers 
>> the ETA to fix etc.
>>
>> Emails from Cacti don't count.
>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Lol!

I imagine in the App a line with points on it that connect from both ends.

Kind of like the Xbox line test.

Where it shows green lights on the provider service, the unit on the side of 
the house, then the router inside their house, and then their device.

It might break in the middle, so the phone could show that it sees their wifi, 
but on 4G it talks to the ISP and shows green dots up to their CPE, then a red 
dot for their router.

It’s not complicated programming on the ISP side.

It could even tell you if the customers router IP was registered in the ARP 
table, or if just the physical connection is made and no MAC or IP etc.

I think most of us have a service table for the customer record that has the 
CPE IP address.

Maybe it would need another table in the customer relation to the router, or 
maybe it’s implicit in the IP address or Gateway IP etc.



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof via Af
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 2:22 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

For VoIP we bridge the ATA ahead of the router.  I love it when someone calls 
on the VoIP phone to tell us “the tower is down”.

From: Shayne Lebrun via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 2:56 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

What we need to do is get people to view the ‘internet light’ like the ‘check 
engine’ light on their car.  It could mean ‘your gas cap is loose’ or it could 
mean ‘your driveshaft just fell out of your car’ but if you want to know, it’s 
going to cost $250 just for somebody to open the hood and plug in the 
diagnostic checker.

Wouldn’t that be nice…..

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via Af
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 2:53 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

As determined by DHCP adds a horrible layer of complexity for a cheap and 
simple device.
How about ping to 8.8.8.8?

From: Josh Luthman via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 12:41 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

Red/green light for successful DNS and ping to a server determined by DHCP


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 1:05 PM, Chuck McCown via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
What would be the determining factor?  Ping DNS server OK?

From: Jason McKemie via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 11:03 AM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

A red/green led would probably suffice for this purpose.

On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 12:01 PM, Gino Villarini via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
We need a “device” that plugs between router and internet connection with a big 
screed that says Internet OK! Or Internef BAD… filter out calls with customer 
having issues with wifi



Gino A. Villarini
President
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
www.aeronetpr.com<http://www.aeronetpr.com>
@aeronetpr



From: "af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Reply-To: "af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Date: Thursday, November 20, 2014 at 1:47 PM
To: "af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

*An app for my phone?  Yuck
*Something that pushes to cutomers letting them know we're having issues?  Yuck
*Something that let's the customer verify their particular service is good/not? 
 That'd be great!
*Web portal for billing, easy peasy

Why a node fails probably won't be detectable by a machine - in some cases it's 
difficult for a person to narrow it down (radio, connectors, cables, ethernet, 
surge, etc) but I'd like to see ideas on this of course.

I use/suggest an outgoing message.  IF the customer is having issues and they 
do call us, they hear we're having issues and hang up.  This means that we're 
not telling 100 people there are issues when 25 are effecting ending up with 75 
calls next month saying we owe them a credit when they had nothing to do with 
an outage.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 12:43 PM, Sterling Jacobson via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
What I really want is an integrated system that isn't stuck in the 90's.

I want the customer to have an app on their phone that tells them when their 
network is having issues and why.
I want it to also remind them to pay their bill and provide a lazy/easy way to 
do that.

I want that same system to have a

Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Yeah, I agree.

We have the PoE with a green light.

I want to build that into the App, so it shows or walks through a series of 
steps like check the adapter that looks like THIS for a green light. Check GFI 
tripped, check cables connected in proper order to PoE and router etc.

The customer wants to be able to do that themselves before calling in.

I think that would eliminate a lot of the calls and customers can do things on 
their own time.

I guess the App could also help them schedule a paid visit if it determines the 
ISP service is working, but they can’t figure out their stuff.

I would almost like to have it refer them to a list of local computer/network 
shops instead.
Or those ISPs that want to make money off that kind of visit could schedule 
themselves.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof via Af
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 2:53 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

I feel you’re overthinking this, at the risk of adding more stuff to fail or 
for the customer to bitch about.

We use the Tycon POEs with current indicator, we tell the customer the light 
should be green.  That covers a lot of calls – cables unplugged or chewed or 
POE not getting AC power.

If the customer thinks their Internet is down, and they have a customer 
supplied router, we tell them to power cycle the router, this is the most 
common issue.

If the customer is 100% WiFi, we try to make sure they have a spare Ethernet 
cable on a LAN port of the router.  Most laptops have an Ethernet port, we tell 
them to take their laptop over to the router, plug it in, and if they have 
Internet then they have a WiFi problem.

Once these 3 steps are done, or if they are complaining about speed, I think 
Travis is right, you’re better off having them call.  If nothing else, this may 
be an upsell opportunity, if they talk to a human.  Or you may get to explain a 
few things about P2P or video streaming or botnets to them.


From: Sterling Jacobson via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 3:28 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

Lol!

I imagine in the App a line with points on it that connect from both ends.

Kind of like the Xbox line test.

Where it shows green lights on the provider service, the unit on the side of 
the house, then the router inside their house, and then their device.

It might break in the middle, so the phone could show that it sees their wifi, 
but on 4G it talks to the ISP and shows green dots up to their CPE, then a red 
dot for their router.

It’s not complicated programming on the ISP side.

It could even tell you if the customers router IP was registered in the ARP 
table, or if just the physical connection is made and no MAC or IP etc.

I think most of us have a service table for the customer record that has the 
CPE IP address.

Maybe it would need another table in the customer relation to the router, or 
maybe it’s implicit in the IP address or Gateway IP etc.



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof via Af
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 2:22 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

For VoIP we bridge the ATA ahead of the router.  I love it when someone calls 
on the VoIP phone to tell us “the tower is down”.

From: Shayne Lebrun via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 2:56 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

What we need to do is get people to view the ‘internet light’ like the ‘check 
engine’ light on their car.  It could mean ‘your gas cap is loose’ or it could 
mean ‘your driveshaft just fell out of your car’ but if you want to know, it’s 
going to cost $250 just for somebody to open the hood and plug in the 
diagnostic checker.

Wouldn’t that be nice…..

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via Af
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 2:53 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

As determined by DHCP adds a horrible layer of complexity for a cheap and 
simple device.
How about ping to 8.8.8.8?

From: Josh Luthman via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 12:41 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Network Monitoring in the 2010's

Red/green light for successful DNS and ping to a server determined by DHCP


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 1:05 PM, Chuck McCown via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
What would be the determining factor?  Ping DNS server OK?

From: Jason McKemie via Af<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 11:03 AM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
S

Re: [AFMUG] FS: Network consultant looking for gigs

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

I think it hides email addresses now on the list.

Can you send me an email at sterling at Avative dot net?



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Robertson via Af
Sent: Friday, November 21, 2014 8:29 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] FS: Network consultant looking for gigs

Hi, folks!

I'm not big on fancy, glossy "collateral" (why do they call it that,
anyway?) so I'm just laying out my qualifications and reasons why you should 
hire me to solve all those pesky network problems you don't have time or staff 
for.  So, just like Dennis' coincidental posting, there's no attached PDF.  
(Sorry, Dennis! :-) )

I started Great Basin Internet Services in Reno in 1993, and sold it a couple 
of years ago.  Since then, wanting extra cash flow (don't we
all?) I've been consulting for them, and a handful of other ISPs.  Most 
recently I've been involved with a greenfield fiber project in rural Nevada.  
So I have plenty of real world experience.

I'm very happy playing with Layer 1 on up, VLANs, VoIP, both IPv4 and IPv6, 
MPLS, OSPF, BGP, NAT, DNS, DHCP, Radius, and probably most any other acronym.  
I'm handy with some of the administrative stuff, like dealing with ARIN for 
instance.  Need more redundancy?  I'm your guy.

I know my way around most routers and switches, especially anything with a 
Cisco-like interface.  I'm still learning Mikrotik, but I've learned enough to 
have set up an MPLS/OSPF/BGP network of CCRs, through both the CLI and the web 
interface.  I don't really know the scripting stuff yet, but I can learn it if 
need be.

I have lots of experience with Cambium licensed and unlicensed radios, and with 
Ubiquiti.  I have lots of out-of-date experience with Canopy, and absolutely no 
field experience with the new ePMP stuff.  (Still waiting for Cambium to send 
me my free AP and SU for attending a seminar awhile ago.)

So that's about it.  Essentially, there's nothing involving the ISP business I 
don't know or can't figure out.  I'm willing to travel, but most of the work I 
do can be done remotely.  Oh, and I'm a Linux guy.  I know my way around 
Windows, but if you need someone to set up your Windows Server stuff, you can 
probably find someone more qualified.

If you're interested, please hit me off-list for more information, rates, all 
that sort of stuff.  Hey Dennis, if you like what you see, you can consider 
this to be a resume - but I'm not moving to Missouri!

Re: [AFMUG] OT: RC Cars

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

You should get a Truggy.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Used-losi-mini-8ight-t-RTR-with-upgrades-/271689504456?pt=Radio_Control_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3f41f4d6c8

You might need to buy a charger for the batteries.

I have an XRAY 808E, but it's a lot more than $200 and has a lower profile.
But I race it with other truggies on a hard dirt track.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Nate Burke via Af
Sent: Monday, December 01, 2014 4:48 PM
To: Animal Farm
Subject: [AFMUG] OT: RC Cars

For a long time I've wanted an RC car.  I was at the beach over the weekend, 
and saw a guy running one through the sand and jumping it around and it looked 
really fun.  I think I'm finally in a position in life where I can allow myself 
to get one.  I'm thinking I may want one step above one you can buy at a 
big-box, but I also don't plan on making it into a hobby.  Any pointers for a 
guy who just wants to run a car around sometimes?

Some things I think I want, unless I'm told I'm wrong.

4wd
Ability to cross sand/mud/shallow water (does this mean waterproof?) Won't 
break if it flips/crashes.
100 yard range.
Rechargeable battery

Anything specific to look for?  Anything to stay away from?  I'm hoping to keep 
this little endeavor around $200, that way I don't have to go through all the 
requisition forms and justification analysis with the wife.

Nate

Re: [AFMUG] OT - amazed what local Microcenter store has on shelf

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Looks like that's gone now?

I have the 840 Pro and it's a very nice SSD drive!

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof via Af
Sent: Monday, December 01, 2014 5:02 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT - amazed what local Microcenter store has on shelf

I needed one I could go get locally.  Also 840 is not 850, and EVO is not PRO.  
But those do look like good prices.  Nice upgrade for a laptop, if you can 
successfully move the OS.


From: Josh Reynolds via Af
Sent: Monday, December 01, 2014 4:26 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT - amazed what local Microcenter store has on shelf

www.slickdeals.net has the 840evo's on sale, 256 for 
$80 and 512 for like $200

Today only.


josh reynolds :: chief information officer

spitwspots :: www.spitwspots.com
On 12/01/2014 01:19 PM, Ken Hohhof via Af wrote:
I needed a replacement HDD for a server and was surprised to find my local 
Microcenter store had Western Digital RE series drives and Samsung 850 PRO 
series SSDs in stock.� Not online or deliver to store, actually on the shelf 
in the store.� I was impressed, those are enterprise level drives, not what 
you'll find at Best Buy or Frys.

Re: [AFMUG] Showdown coming on Ethernet standard to serve faster Wi-Fi | PCWorld

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

That’s pretty cool.

I’m ready to deliver 10Gbps SFP+ to the side of customer’s houses.
But since it tranceives to copper, I was going to be limited.

This would help, esp if a cheap transceiver is made between SFP+ and the new 
copper standard.


From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jaime Solorza via Af
Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2014 8:08 PM
To: Animal Farm
Subject: [AFMUG] Showdown coming on Ethernet standard to serve faster Wi-Fi | 
PCWorld


http://www.pcworld.com/article/2854692/showdown-coming-on-ethernet-standard-to-serve-faster-wifi.html

Jaime Solorza

Re: [AFMUG] Well there goes all our bandwidth. Amazon streaming 4K now.

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

That’s pretty cool.

You can do 4k direct from Youtube.

Several of the ones I’ve tested are sustained around 20-30Mbps.

But on my network it tends to burst to 90Mbps then sit around for a while, then 
burst back to 90Mbps.

I think the 4k will require a lot of optimizations before it works on the built 
in TV’s.



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Richardson via Af
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 5:12 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Well there goes all our bandwidth. Amazon streaming 4K now.

Lovely

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ryan Ghering via Af
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 3:38 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Well there goes all our bandwidth. Amazon streaming 4K now.

http://www.cnet.com/news/amazon-starts-4k-uhd-streams/

--
Ryan Ghering
Network Operations - Plains.Net
Office: 970-848-0475 - Cell: 970-630-1879

Re: [AFMUG] Mikrotik brute force

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Butch Evans has a nice inexpensive script for Mikrotik that takes care of this 
nicely.

Why even let it through the input chain is my thought.


From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ty Featherling via Af
Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 7:30 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mikrotik brute force

Note to self, double check all API services are OFF.

-Ty

On Tue, Dec 9, 2014 at 4:03 PM, Mike Hammett via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
I have seen an increase in API attacks lately.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com


From: "George Skorup (Cyber Broadcasting) via Af" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 3:51:18 PM
Subject: [AFMUG] Mikrotik brute force

Nice. WTF.

http://mkbrutusproject.github.io/MKBRUTUS/

[AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

I'm not sure what is going on, but recently I've noticed Ookla has changed 
speedtest.net so it works a lot better with IE.

And it USED to work just fine with Chrome, but they changed something in the 
past month.

Anyone else seeing this?

It's very apparent at Gigabit speeds, see attached.

Same everything except using IE instead of Chrome.

Noticed this on several machines and several host servers on speedtest.net

Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

AFMUG server must have stripped the jpgs, because they are attached in the send 
folder, but when I received my own message the jpgs were gone.

Anywho, I am seeing several hundred megs difference between IE and Chrome on 
several machine to several different servers in Utah.

I get about 900Mbps both ways with IE and about 6-700Mbps in Chrome.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Bill Prince via Af
Sent: Friday, December 12, 2014 11:41 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

no attachment...

--
bp


On 12/12/2014 10:20 AM, Sterling Jacobson via Af wrote:
> I'm not sure what is going on, but recently I've noticed Ookla has changed 
> speedtest.net so it works a lot better with IE.
>
> And it USED to work just fine with Chrome, but they changed something in the 
> past month.
>
> Anyone else seeing this?
>
> It's very apparent at Gigabit speeds, see attached.
>
> Same everything except using IE instead of Chrome.
>
> Noticed this on several machines and several host servers on speedtest.net
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Good point, I'll check for that!

Since Chrome pulls the same context on all my machines that I log into Google, 
that makes sense why it would affect more than just one.



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chris Wright via Af
Sent: Monday, December 15, 2014 9:58 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

Chrome plugins causing the drop, perhaps? Even naked Chrome runs pretty heavy 
on resources.

Chris Wright
Velociter Wireless

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Jacobson via Af
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2014 1:14 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

AFMUG server must have stripped the jpgs, because they are attached in the send 
folder, but when I received my own message the jpgs were gone.

Anywho, I am seeing several hundred megs difference between IE and Chrome on 
several machine to several different servers in Utah.

I get about 900Mbps both ways with IE and about 6-700Mbps in Chrome.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Bill Prince via Af
Sent: Friday, December 12, 2014 11:41 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

no attachment...

--
bp


On 12/12/2014 10:20 AM, Sterling Jacobson via Af wrote:
> I'm not sure what is going on, but recently I've noticed Ookla has changed 
> speedtest.net so it works a lot better with IE.
>
> And it USED to work just fine with Chrome, but they changed something in the 
> past month.
>
> Anyone else seeing this?
>
> It's very apparent at Gigabit speeds, see attached.
>
> Same everything except using IE instead of Chrome.
>
> Noticed this on several machines and several host servers on speedtest.net
>
>

[AFMUG] Wireless router internet help video?

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOdOBVKenzQ

Just got another support ticket complaining of crappy to no internet for 10 
days...

Response to my queries of specifics:

"we are wireless.  The fastest we've seen in the last two weeks is about 30 
mbps up or down.  Sometimes it's so weak, I can't even test it.  I reset our 
router several times...
It's always slow, but sometimes our devices can't even open pages because it's 
so slow or even dead for a few minutes."

It's the same old "my internet hasn't worked for days" problem that isn't our 
problem.

Does anyone have a better video/solution than this one, for explaining to 
customers your 'wireless router' sucks problem?

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless router internet help video?

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Very, very good content!
Well done!

I think I'll share that around to our 'neighbors' in Saratoga Springs.

I also think we should adapt this into a general version using one of those 
'drawing' methods.

Anyone want to help fund a new generalized version we all can use?



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via Af
Sent: Monday, December 15, 2014 1:27 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Wireless router internet help video?

Here is one I did:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cp4nKu4SaIs&feature=youtu.be

-Original Message-
From: Sterling Jacobson via Af
Sent: Monday, December 15, 2014 12:49 PM
To: 'af@afmug.com'
Subject: [AFMUG] Wireless router internet help video?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOdOBVKenzQ

Just got another support ticket complaining of crappy to no internet for 10 
days...

Response to my queries of specifics:

"we are wireless.  The fastest we've seen in the last two weeks is about 30 
mbps up or down.  Sometimes it's so weak, I can't even test it.  I reset our 
router several times...
It's always slow, but sometimes our devices can't even open pages because it's 
so slow or even dead for a few minutes."

It's the same old "my internet hasn't worked for days" problem that isn't our 
problem.

Does anyone have a better video/solution than this one, for explaining to 
customers your 'wireless router' sucks problem?

Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

I just got my new speedtest.net server running with Dave's help. Thanks Dave!

It's at http://avative.speedtest.net


Can any of you get over 500Mbps to it?
It has a 10Gbps adapter and sits on a 10Gbps circuit, but I think I've got 
something cutting it to 600Mbps...

I also talked to Ookla and they know about a problem with Chrome on Windows 
where flash isn't allowing it to do the full Gbps. So for now use a Mac? Or use 
IE on windows if you have a Gigabit connection to test on speedtest.net



-Original Message-
From: Sterling Jacobson 
Sent: Monday, December 15, 2014 12:42 PM
To: 'af@afmug.com'
Subject: RE: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

Good point, I'll check for that!

Since Chrome pulls the same context on all my machines that I log into Google, 
that makes sense why it would affect more than just one.



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chris Wright via Af
Sent: Monday, December 15, 2014 9:58 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

Chrome plugins causing the drop, perhaps? Even naked Chrome runs pretty heavy 
on resources.

Chris Wright
Velociter Wireless

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Jacobson via Af
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2014 1:14 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

AFMUG server must have stripped the jpgs, because they are attached in the send 
folder, but when I received my own message the jpgs were gone.

Anywho, I am seeing several hundred megs difference between IE and Chrome on 
several machine to several different servers in Utah.

I get about 900Mbps both ways with IE and about 6-700Mbps in Chrome.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Bill Prince via Af
Sent: Friday, December 12, 2014 11:41 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

no attachment...

--
bp


On 12/12/2014 10:20 AM, Sterling Jacobson via Af wrote:
> I'm not sure what is going on, but recently I've noticed Ookla has changed 
> speedtest.net so it works a lot better with IE.
>
> And it USED to work just fine with Chrome, but they changed something in the 
> past month.
>
> Anyone else seeing this?
>
> It's very apparent at Gigabit speeds, see attached.
>
> Same everything except using IE instead of Chrome.
>
> Noticed this on several machines and several host servers on speedtest.net
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Interesting.

I talked to Ookla about Gigabit, and they sent me information and some links to 
their stuff.

I can get about 5-600Mbps locally to my machine, but I’ve got some work to do 
before it shows 960Mbps it should be doing.


From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck Hogg via Af
Sent: Friday, December 19, 2014 6:14 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3998189472

I get 250x250...have multi-gig here...

On our own directly connected, I get 780's-840's.

Regards,
Chuck

On Fri, Dec 19, 2014 at 4:56 PM, Sterling Jacobson via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
I just got my new speedtest.net<http://speedtest.net> server running with 
Dave's help. Thanks Dave!

It's at http://avative.speedtest.net


Can any of you get over 500Mbps to it?
It has a 10Gbps adapter and sits on a 10Gbps circuit, but I think I've got 
something cutting it to 600Mbps...

I also talked to Ookla and they know about a problem with Chrome on Windows 
where flash isn't allowing it to do the full Gbps. So for now use a Mac? Or use 
IE on windows if you have a Gigabit connection to test on 
speedtest.net<http://speedtest.net>



-----Original Message-
From: Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Monday, December 15, 2014 12:42 PM
To: 'af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>'
Subject: RE: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

Good point, I'll check for that!

Since Chrome pulls the same context on all my machines that I log into Google, 
that makes sense why it would affect more than just one.



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Chris Wright via Af
Sent: Monday, December 15, 2014 9:58 AM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

Chrome plugins causing the drop, perhaps? Even naked Chrome runs pretty heavy 
on resources.

Chris Wright
Velociter Wireless

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Sterling Jacobson via Af
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2014 1:14 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

AFMUG server must have stripped the jpgs, because they are attached in the send 
folder, but when I received my own message the jpgs were gone.

Anywho, I am seeing several hundred megs difference between IE and Chrome on 
several machine to several different servers in Utah.

I get about 900Mbps both ways with IE and about 6-700Mbps in Chrome.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Bill Prince via Af
Sent: Friday, December 12, 2014 11:41 AM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

no attachment...

--
bp


On 12/12/2014 10:20 AM, Sterling Jacobson via Af wrote:
> I'm not sure what is going on, but recently I've noticed Ookla has changed 
> speedtest.net<http://speedtest.net> so it works a lot better with IE.
>
> And it USED to work just fine with Chrome, but they changed something in the 
> past month.
>
> Anyone else seeing this?
>
> It's very apparent at Gigabit speeds, see attached.
>
> Same everything except using IE instead of Chrome.
>
> Noticed this on several machines and several host servers on 
> speedtest.net<http://speedtest.net>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

So, did it ever get above 1000Mbps?

I have a 10Gbps SFP+ adapter coming in for my computer to test 10Gig from the 
client browser end.

Am I fooling myself?

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Carlos Alcantar via Af
Sent: Friday, December 19, 2014 8:51 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

We have done some extensive testing with the ookla speedtest.net server 
software as we wanted to optimize our speedtest server to be able to support 
multi gig's /sec.  What we have found that firefox/opera actually preformed the 
best.  We also noted that going from win 8 to win 8.1 network performance 
dropped.  OS X seemed to have performed the same across different versions of 
the OS.  We ran head to head on 10gig ports with the speedtest server just to 
make sure there was no outside influencers.  We ended up finding the right 
hardware/ os / browser match for our field tech laptops that would net us 950+ 
on the speedtest server.  Network interface drivers seem to be a big issue once 
you get into these higher speeds.


Carlos Alcantar
Race Communications / Race Team Member
1325 Howard Ave. #604, Burlingame, CA. 94010
Phone: +1 415 376 3314 / car...@race.com<mailto:car...@race.com> / 
http://www.race.com<http://www.race.com/>


From: Sterling Jacobson via Af mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Reply-To: "af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Date: Friday, December 19, 2014 at 5:38 PM
To: "af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

Interesting.

I talked to Ookla about Gigabit, and they sent me information and some links to 
their stuff.

I can get about 5-600Mbps locally to my machine, but I've got some work to do 
before it shows 960Mbps it should be doing.


From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck Hogg via Af
Sent: Friday, December 19, 2014 6:14 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3998189472

I get 250x250...have multi-gig here...

On our own directly connected, I get 780's-840's.

Regards,
Chuck

On Fri, Dec 19, 2014 at 4:56 PM, Sterling Jacobson via Af 
mailto:af@afmug.com>> wrote:
I just got my new speedtest.net<http://speedtest.net> server running with 
Dave's help. Thanks Dave!

It's at http://avative.speedtest.net


Can any of you get over 500Mbps to it?
It has a 10Gbps adapter and sits on a 10Gbps circuit, but I think I've got 
something cutting it to 600Mbps...

I also talked to Ookla and they know about a problem with Chrome on Windows 
where flash isn't allowing it to do the full Gbps. So for now use a Mac? Or use 
IE on windows if you have a Gigabit connection to test on 
speedtest.net<http://speedtest.net>



-Original Message-
From: Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Monday, December 15, 2014 12:42 PM
To: 'af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>'
Subject: RE: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

Good point, I'll check for that!

Since Chrome pulls the same context on all my machines that I log into Google, 
that makes sense why it would affect more than just one.



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Chris Wright via Af
Sent: Monday, December 15, 2014 9:58 AM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

Chrome plugins causing the drop, perhaps? Even naked Chrome runs pretty heavy 
on resources.

Chris Wright
Velociter Wireless

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Sterling Jacobson via Af
Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2014 1:14 PM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

AFMUG server must have stripped the jpgs, because they are attached in the send 
folder, but when I received my own message the jpgs were gone.

Anywho, I am seeing several hundred megs difference between IE and Chrome on 
several machine to several different servers in Utah.

I get about 900Mbps both ways with IE and about 6-700Mbps in Chrome.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Bill Prince via Af
Sent: Friday, December 12, 2014 11:41 AM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Speedtest.net optomized for IE??

no attachment...

--
bp


On 12/12/2014 10:20 AM, Sterling Jacobson via Af wrote:
> I'm not sure what is going on, but recently I've noticed Ookla has changed 
> speedtest.net<http://speedtest.net> so it works a lot better with IE.
>
> And it USED to work just fine with Chrome, but they changed something in the 
> past month.
>
> An

[AFMUG] Outdoor rated short 6' jumper cat5e?

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

I know it's probably the laziest method ever, but is there an outlet that sells 
inexpensive outdoor rated cat6 cat5e jumper cables?
Like around six feet?

Re: [AFMUG] Outdoor rated short 6' jumper cat5e?

[Sterling Jacobson via Af]

Ok, I'll email them and see what they can do.


-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of David via Af
Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2014 12:43 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Outdoor rated short 6' jumper cat5e?

Get any size type cable or length @ Besttronics.com. They even do Pre-Rack kits 
and Nema enclosures along din rail configs you specify.
We have used these guys since 2003 with no issue.

On 12/30/2014 12:18 PM, Sterling Jacobson via Af wrote:
> I know it's probably the laziest method ever, but is there an outlet that 
> sells inexpensive outdoor rated cat6 cat5e jumper cables?
> Like around six feet?
>
>