RE: RFID tags
I found the ACA link http://www.aca.gov.au/radcomm/frequency_planning/frequency_assignment/docs/m s27.pdf You will have to paste it back togther if the link word wraps Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: WOODS, RICHARD Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 3:31 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: RFID tags OK, we have three types of tags 1) tag with no electronics other than perhaps a diode (e.g., anti-theft tag) 2) tag with electronics powered by an external EM field (e.g., a proximity type access badge) 3) tag with a battery and electronics (e.g., toll road transponder in a car) You will be happy to know that the ACA (Australia) considers all of them to be transmitters. I have the position paper if you want a copy. Number 3 is considered a transmitter in the USA and EU. What about number 2? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: fdev...@assaabloyitg.com [mailto:fdev...@assaabloyitg.com] Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:28 PM To: rehel...@mmm.com Cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org; Joshua Wiseman; owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: RFID tags Bob, Passive tags that are energized by an impending RF field are usually not considered transmitters. This is because they return their data by loading and unloading the impending RF field; this is sometimes termed backscatter. This type of passive tag does not fall under the RTTE Directive. Active tags that have their own oscillator and transmitter, however, need to meet RTTE Directive requirements. Regards, Frank de Vall Assa Abloy Identification Technology Group rehel...@mmm.com Sent by: To: Joshua Wiseman jwise...@printronix.com owner-emc-pstc@majordocc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org mo.ieee.org Subject: RE: RFID tags 11/20/2003 09:33 AM Please respond to reheller Not for sure. But it is my understanding that the passive tags are not subject to RTTE. We need someone who knows for sure to respond. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Joshua Wiseman JWiseman@printron To: rehel...@mmm.com ix.comrichwo...@tycoint.com cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org 11/20/2003 09:52 owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org AM Subject: RE: RFID tags Bob, Do you know anything about the 915MHz passive tags? Josh From: rehel...@mmm.com [mailto:rehel...@mmm.com] Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 7:24 AM To: richwo...@tycoint.com Cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org; owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Re: RFID tags = The RFID tags (active tags) are subject to the RTTE Directive and the following standards for 13.56 MHz tags: 300 330-1 (General) 300 330-2 (Radio) 301 489-3 (EMC) Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Are RFID tags (e.g., access control badges) considered to be transmitters/receivers and thus subject to the RTTE Directive? These types of tags are powered by a received signal, may receive a coded signal, and they respond with a coded signal. They are obviously very low power devices and the transmit power is far below that of their interrogator. But the nagging fact remains that they are transponders. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord
RE: RFID tags
OK, we have three types of tags 1) tag with no electronics other than perhaps a diode (e.g., anti-theft tag) 2) tag with electronics powered by an external EM field (e.g., a proximity type access badge) 3) tag with a battery and electronics (e.g., toll road transponder in a car) You will be happy to know that the ACA (Australia) considers all of them to be transmitters. I have the position paper if you want a copy. Number 3 is considered a transmitter in the USA and EU. What about number 2? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: fdev...@assaabloyitg.com [mailto:fdev...@assaabloyitg.com] Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:28 PM To: rehel...@mmm.com Cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org; Joshua Wiseman; owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: RFID tags Bob, Passive tags that are energized by an impending RF field are usually not considered transmitters. This is because they return their data by loading and unloading the impending RF field; this is sometimes termed backscatter. This type of passive tag does not fall under the RTTE Directive. Active tags that have their own oscillator and transmitter, however, need to meet RTTE Directive requirements. Regards, Frank de Vall Assa Abloy Identification Technology Group rehel...@mmm.com Sent by: To: Joshua Wiseman jwise...@printronix.com owner-emc-pstc@majordocc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org mo.ieee.org Subject: RE: RFID tags 11/20/2003 09:33 AM Please respond to reheller Not for sure. But it is my understanding that the passive tags are not subject to RTTE. We need someone who knows for sure to respond. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Joshua Wiseman JWiseman@printron To: rehel...@mmm.com ix.comrichwo...@tycoint.com cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org 11/20/2003 09:52 owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org AM Subject: RE: RFID tags Bob, Do you know anything about the 915MHz passive tags? Josh From: rehel...@mmm.com [mailto:rehel...@mmm.com] Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 7:24 AM To: richwo...@tycoint.com Cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org; owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Re: RFID tags = The RFID tags (active tags) are subject to the RTTE Directive and the following standards for 13.56 MHz tags: 300 330-1 (General) 300 330-2 (Radio) 301 489-3 (EMC) Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Are RFID tags (e.g., access control badges) considered to be transmitters/receivers and thus subject to the RTTE Directive? These types of tags are powered by a received signal, may receive a coded signal, and they respond with a coded signal. They are obviously very low power devices and the transmit power is far below that of their interrogator. But the nagging fact remains that they are transponders. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being
RE: RFID tags
Well, that is the key reason for my question. I can find no means for distinguishing between passive and active tags in regards to the RTTE Directive or the ETSI standards. It seems to me that all tags fall under the RTTE Directive. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: rehel...@mmm.com [mailto:rehel...@mmm.com] Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 11:34 AM To: Joshua Wiseman Cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: RFID tags Not for sure. But it is my understanding that the passive tags are not subject to RTTE. We need someone who knows for sure to respond. Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Joshua Wiseman JWiseman@printron To: rehel...@mmm.com ix.comrichwo...@tycoint.com cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org 11/20/2003 09:52 owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org AM Subject: RE: RFID tags Bob, Do you know anything about the 915MHz passive tags? Josh From: rehel...@mmm.com [mailto:rehel...@mmm.com] Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 7:24 AM To: richwo...@tycoint.com Cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org; owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Re: RFID tags = The RFID tags (active tags) are subject to the RTTE Directive and the following standards for 13.56 MHz tags: 300 330-1 (General) 300 330-2 (Radio) 301 489-3 (EMC) Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 === Are RFID tags (e.g., access control badges) considered to be transmitters/receivers and thus subject to the RTTE Directive? These types of tags are powered by a received signal, may receive a coded signal, and they respond with a coded signal. They are obviously very low power devices and the transmit power is far below that of their interrogator. But the nagging fact remains that they are transponders. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RFID tags
Are RFID tags (e.g., access control badges) considered to be transmitters/receivers and thus subject to the RTTE Directive? These types of tags are powered by a received signal, may receive a coded signal, and they respond with a coded signal. They are obviously very low power devices and the transmit power is far below that of their interrogator. But the nagging fact remains that they are transponders. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
CE Marking of Shipping Cartons
There are some in my company that believe the shipping cartons containing our products should be CE marked to simplify customs processing especially with the addition of the new member states in May 2004. Others feel that the marking provides no added value to the customs processing procedure. So, the question is what are the customs officials looking for in the way of CE conformity and what process will best supply that information. In particular, is there any value added in CE marking the shipping cartons? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Power adaptor to Australia
I understand that a safety certification is required only if the adapter has a secondary connector that is of the barrel type commonly used in consumer equipment. The certification can be granted by one of the provincial electrical authorities. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Carpentier Kristiaan [mailto:kristiaan.carpent...@thomson.net] Sent: Tuesday, November 18, 2003 5:57 AM To: 'Peck Hoon CHON (HPI-MY)'; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: Power adaptor to Australia Hi, External power adaptors supplied in Australia must be labelled with the regulatory C-tick mark and the supplier code. There must also be an Approval number on the label, issued by an Australian supply authority which indicates that it meets an isolating transformer standard. Regards, Kris From: Peck Hoon CHON (HPI-MY) [mailto:peckhoon.c...@my.hpi-group.com] Sent: dinsdag 18 november 2003 10:58 To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Power adaptor to Australia Hi all, Could anyone please advice for product that market to Australia, is the external power adaptor need to have both C-tick and SAA mark? Thanks, PH Chon This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Security and Alarm Systems
I have the version dated 1996 and it does explain which directives apply to various types of alarms. The report is intended as a guide for the various standards committees. Also check out ETSI TR 102070-1 -2 which provides guidelines for the integration of radio devices with other devices. You can download ETSI standards for free at http://www.etsi.org/. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Crabb, John [mailto:jo...@exchange.scotland.ncr.com] Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 5:53 AM To: peter merguerian; emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: RE: Security and Alarm Systems A limited amount of information may be found in CENELEC Report R079-001:1998 Guide to achieving compliance with EC directives for alarm systems I don't have a copy, however. Regards, John Crabb, (Product Safety) , NCR Financial Solutions Group Ltd., Discovery Centre, 3 Fulton Road, Dundee, Scotland, DD2 4SW E-Mail :john.cr...@scotland.ncr.com Tel: +44 (0)1382-592289 (direct ). Fax +44 (0)1382-622243. From: owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org [mailto:owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org] On Behalf Of peter merguerian Sent: 13 November 2003 23:08 To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Security and Alarm Systems Hello All, I am intersted to know about European Directives for Alarm and similar security systems used in commercial (airports, businesses) and household applications. What are the Directives (RTTE, Construction, etc.) involved, the standards and some of the Recognized Test Agencies for a wi-fi type alarm system. These are some of the standards that may or may not be applicable: 1. CEI 79-16 Level B 2. CEI79-2 Level 1 3. EN3220-3 4. EN301489-1 5. EN301-3 6. EN60950 7. EN50130-4 8. IMQ Level 1 Best Regards, Peter
RE: EU directives for SMPS
If the SMPS is sold to a manufacturer as a component, the EMC Directive is not applicable. However, if the SMPS is sold on the open market, the EMC Directive does apply. See the commission's guidelines at http://europa.eu.int/comm/enterprise/electr_equipment/emc/guides/emcguide.ht m If the URL word wrapped, you will have to paste it back together. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Sosnoski, Michael [mailto:gl...@wmsgaming.com] Sent: Monday, November 03, 2003 2:49 PM To: 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org' Subject: EU directives for SMPS Can anyone tell me what EU directives are required for a SMPS? I have a supplier telling me only the LVD is required? I am shocked that the EMC directive would not be required for a SMPS also. I will look at their DOC, and see what the declared-just wondering. Mike Sosnoski This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: France's new Frequency allocation
The 8 October revision of ERC/REC 70-03 lists a French restriction of 10 mW eirp indoor in Annex 1 (non-specific devices). Annex 3 (RLANs HyperLANs) lists no restrictions for indoor use and 10 mW eirp for the 2454-2483.5 MHz band. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Binnom, Cyril A [mailto:binno...@ems-t.com] Sent: Monday, November 03, 2003 11:30 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: France's new Frequency allocation All: I have been given information that France has relaxed their once restricted Frequency allocation to comply with the entire European Union per July 25, 2003. This states that for indoor use the entire 2.4GHz band is available at a power limit of 100mw. My question is are there any limitations to the new allocation, and does anybody dispute that these changes are incorrect. Regards, Cyril A. Binnom Jr. EMI/EMC Engineer LXE, Inc. (770) 447-4224 Ext. 3240 (770) 447-6928 binno...@lxe.com This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Window of Uncertainty
This brings up the question of How much margin is necessary to account for manufacturing variations? And I guess that depends upon if periodic sampling is performed or not. So, how much margin would be considered to be acceptable if no periodic sampling is performed? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: andy.wh...@nokia.com [mailto:andy.wh...@nokia.com] Sent: Friday, October 31, 2003 11:37 AM To: da...@alisonlabs.com; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: Window of Uncertainty The FCC does not allow any units (sold on the marketplace) to be 'above' the FCC limits. It is therefore prudent to ensure that 'all' finished production units comply with the FCC limits taking in to account manufacturing build tolerance/variability, product design tolerance/variability and final laboratory measurement uncertainty. Which basically leads to ensuring that your product has a designed in emissions 'margin' that will provide compliance for units leaving the production floor. In my experience during initial product development EMC testing/qualification you have to pursue to attain as much 'margin' as possible. To let a product through certification with a minimalist margin at the beginning of marketing product launch will only make subsequent product design changes/updates much more difficult to certify. Andy _ Andy White EMC Engineer Nokia Mobile Phones San Diego, CA Tel 858 831 4534 andy.wh...@nokia.com _ This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Safety of Schuko CEE7 plug (earthed plug) in Europe?
Ilan, EN60950 requires both overload and earth fault protection. Pluggable products may rely upon the building protection (mains fuses, breakers) to provide line to earth fault protection. If so, a single internal fuse or breaker can protect against overload. Such construction is allowed and is considerd to be safe even if the mains plug is not polarized. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Ilan Cohen [mailto:ico...@itl.co.il] Sent: Wednesday, October 29, 2003 8:57 AM To: 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org' Subject: Safety of Schuko CEE7 plug (earthed plug) in Europe? Dear Group I have been looking into the usage of the Continental European Plug also known as Schuko CEE7 plug (earthed plug). It can be inserted into the Wall socket without a way to ensure that line is connected to line and Neutral to Neutral. http://www.interpower.com/scripts/wsisa dll/WService=panel-icl/p80list2.p?w_country=Continental+Europe It presents a technical problem with products, which are protected by one fuse. Typically a fuse is installed in the Line in any product. To be really safe there should be two fusses, one in the line and another in the neutral. Does anyone know the actual regulations in Germany or other countries that started adopting these plugs regarding the number of fusses in the product? There is clearly a safety problem here, which is not being handled properly by safety standards like EN60950 (ITE) or EN60335 (Home appliances). But in the other hand it will be an overkill to request two fusses for products entering the EU (Germany, Italy...) -- Ilan Cohen Technical Director, Safety Telecom Divisions I.T.L (PRODUCT TESTING) Ltd. 26 Hacharoshet St, POB 211, Or Yehuda, Israel. Tel 972-3-5339022, Fax 972-3-5339019 ico...@itl.co.il, website: http://www.itl.co.il I-SPEC: The best place on the internet to learn about safety !! http://www.i-spec.com/ (I-Spec is provided free of charge as a service by ITL to the compliance community) -
RE: ETSI new rules for 2004
Richard, effective 1 July 2006, lead solder will not be allowed per the Reduction of Hazardous Substances (RoHS) Directive, 2002/95/EC. Also refer to the EU Directive on waste electrical and electronic equipment (WEEE), 2002/96/EC. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Stone, Richard [mailto:rst...@xl.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2003 8:03 AM To: ITL-EMC User Group; Emc-Pstc Group (E-mail) Subject: ETSI new rules for 2004 hello group, anyone have any word or update on required( ? ) lead free process for components being soldered on PC boards, does it apply to anyhting else, parts used prior to solder process or anything else pertaining to this? A european ETSI new requirement? heard rumors a few months ago, and nothing since.. thanks for your time, Richard, Richard A. Stone Excel Switching Corporation Compliance 75 Perseverance Way Hyannis, MA. 02601 508 862 3311 ph. 508 862 3020 fax rst...@xl.com This email message and any attachments to it contain confidential information that is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed. Any review, retransmission, dissemination, printing, or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please delete it or inform the sender. From: ITL-EMC User Group [mailto:itl-...@itl.co.il] Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2003 3:03 AM To: Emc-Pstc Group (E-mail) Subject: 47 CFR Part 90 Dear All, Does anyone know where I can download the latest version of FCC Rule 47 Part 90 (47CFR90) in pdf format? I would prefer to download the whole part in one file. Thanks to anyone who can assist. Regards David Shidlowsky Technical Writer EMC Laboratory ITL (Product Testing) Ltd. Kfar Bin Nun Israel Tel: +972-8-9797799 Fax: +972-8-9797702 Email: dav...@itl.co.il http://www.itl.co.il http://www.i-spec.com This e-mail message may contain privileged or confidential information. If you are not the intended recipient, you may not disclose, use, disseminate, distribute, copy or rely upon this message or attachment in any way. If you received this e-mail message in error, please return by forwarding the message and its attachments to the sender.
RE: IEC60950 - Language of user handbook
The German Equipment Safety Law requires the installation and maintenance manuals to be in German. Reference Annex ZC.1.7.12 of EN 60950. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: am...@westin-emission.no [mailto:am...@westin-emission.no] Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2003 4:43 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: IEC60950 - Language of user handbook Are there any requirements in IEC60950 which says that the language of installation / user handbook, must be in the official language where the product is for sale? Thanks. Best regards Amund Westin Oslo, NORWAY This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Denmark AC outlets
Kim, thanks for your input. Do I understand correctly that a 3-pin, earthing-type Danish outlet is fault-current protected such that if a Shuko plug is used and there is a mains to chassis fault, persons will be protected? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Kim Boll Jensen [mailto:k...@bolls.dk] Sent: Friday, October 24, 2003 3:53 AM To: EMC PSTC Subject: SV: Denmark AC outlets Hi all I think I ought to comment this since I live in Denmark. The situation is not so simple. It depends on the installation location, industrial, commercial, wet-room, type of equipment etc. 1. The most widely used system is a non-grounded socket protected by a fault-current circuit (app. 30 mA). Here a Schuko type plug is preferred. This covers 90% of all commercial installations and 50% of all office installations. Therefore for in commercial use people have problems with the grounded Danish plug and will have to change it to an un-grounded type themselves. 2. New requirements for installations calls for installation of the Danish grounded socket every-where. Here a Schuko is not good. But this requirement is only for new building installation NOT a requirements for equipment at the moment. 3. For professional use (laboratories etc.) most installations can use grounded plugs. 4. Some product standards have national deviations which requires a warning on Schuko connector that the installation shall have a fault current circuit or a correct grounding plug shall be fitted. Best regards, Kim Boll Jensen Bolls Raadgivning Denmark Fra: owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org [mailto:owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org]På vegne af aiken Sendt: 22. oktober 2003 21:13 Til: richwo...@tycoint.com; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org; Ronald R. Wellman Emne: Re: Denmark AC outlets Ron, Thanks. Your note below is believable. I only added that comment because I know the special Danish grounding plug requires the special Danish grounded socket outlet. The Danish people I have dealt with preferred the Schuko plug because fits the ordinary socket outlets (grounded and ungrounded) installed throughout Denmark. I have also been told by Danish people that if a grounded socket outlet is required for a particular product, an ordinary grounding type socket outlet can be installed quicker than the special Danish socket - availability I guess. The notion that a special grounding type plug and socket outlet was necessary, that is incompatible with ordinary plugs and socket outlets, never spread beyond the boarders of Denmark. My background is mostly ITE and Domestic appliances. So I sometimes get to thinking the world revolves around those two categories. Best Regards, Lou Aiken, LaMer LLC 27109 Palmetto Drive Orange Beach, AL 36561 USA tel ++ 1 251 981 6786 fax ++ 1 251 981 3054 Cell ++ 1 251 979 4648 From: Ronald R. Wellman rwell...@wellman.com To: aiken ai...@gulftel.com; richwo...@tycoint.com; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2003 2:21 PM Subject: Re: Denmark AC outlets Hello Lou, You mention that In practice, everyone I know sends Schuko plugs to Denmark. Well, that is not necessarily true for manufacturers of test and measurement, and laboratory equipment. I have always specified the Danish plugs for Denmark without any problems for TM equipment. In fact, I had requests from people in Denmark to not ship Schuko power cords to Denmark but only the Danish power cords. Best regards, Ron Wellman At 12:28 PM 10/22/2003 -0500, aiken wrote: Rich, That is true, and not only in Denmark but throughout much of the world. That Schuko plug (CEE 7, Standard Sheet VII) is specifically designed to fit either a grounded or ungrounded socket outlet. Note the side grounding contacts. I will shoot you a pdf of the page in a separate note so the group does not have to down load it. The control is the installation requirement to provide grounded socket outlets but only where they are considered necessary. The exceptions being North America, the UK, Australia NZ. Over the years I have observed that where the national language is English, grounding type socket outlets are provided everywhere. In most other countries grounded socket outlets are required in areas where grounding is considered necessary. I am sure there exceptions. This is an over simplification when the product also connects to the telephone network and grounding is necessary to provide extra protection between mains circuits and telephone circuits. I have never seen two surveys of REQUIRED plug approvals that agreed with one another. I eliminated that concern years ago by specifying plugs with the approval mark, if the country had such a mark available. Therefore, I am uncertain if the DEMKO mark is required in Denmark. Chances are that any mark from any EU country is enough. Schuko plugs made by major manufacturers will have the DEMKO approval mark. I always liked
RE: Fault condition test UL 60950
Lou, I have to take exception to your last paragraph. We often have to perform fault testing in low voltage circuits to verify conformity to SELV requirements at the output ports. We also perform fault testing to determine comformity to the limits for limited power circuits. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: aiken [mailto:ai...@gulftel.com] Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2003 2:04 PM To: Van Compernolle, Eric; emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Re: Fault condition test UL 60950 Eric. There are places in a circuit where film resistors are required by UL, such as where they bridge insulation. Ordinary carbon resistors are unacceptable in these cases - at least in the categories I usually work in. So film resistors are not considered to fault in a shorted state. As for caps and diodes you must make that decision based upon what the result of the fault will be. If an unlikely fault (short or open) will be something that can result in a hazard - within the meaning of the applicable standard - then it should be considered and provision made in the design to prevent the unacceptable increased risk. Sorry this is not such a clear cut answer but diodes and capacitors can fail in both shorted and open states, so a certain amount of circuit analysis is necessary Approved X, Y, Antenna coupling caps, Antenna bypass caps are not shorted during fault testing - at least in the categories I ordinarily work with. Components in low voltage circuits are not investigated (for safety) when the available power is below certain limits. Those limits will be given in the standard applicable to the product. Regards, Lou Aiken, LaMer LLC 27109 Palmetto Drive Orange Beach, AL 36561 USA tel ++ 1 251 981 6786 fax ++ 1 251 981 3054 Cell ++ 1 251 979 4648
Denmark AC outlets
I have heard that Danish regulations allow Type A pluggable Class 1 equipment to be installed without a ground connection as long as it is not located in a wet location. An allowable example would be such equipment that uses a Shuko plug. Does Denmark really allow this or do the regulations require the use of a Danish certified plug? Even if the practice is allowed, it would seem to me that a company should specify that its professionally installed equipment must use of a Danish plug in order to minimize liability to the company. What do you think? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Regulatory Plan
I like to keep it simple, so I list the standards that will be applied and the licenses/marks that will be obtained. I found that no one outside the compliance group really cares what is in the document as long as the list of project deliverables has a check mark by this one. Yep, its been delivered. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Joe P Martin [mailto:marti...@appliedbiosystems.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2003 4:27 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Regulatory Plan Greetings, I have been asked to put together a regulatory plan for one of our company's products. I am trying to get as many opinions as possible as to the elements of such a plan. Please share with me your elements of such a plan and, if possible, send me a copy of a plan to use as an example. Your assistance is greatly appreciated. Regards Joe Martin Applied Biosystems marti...@appliedbiosystems.com This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: EMF standard EN50371
Only two documents are referenced - EN ISO/IEC 17025 and Council Recommendation 1999/519/EC. The former is referenced for guidance for the assessment report. No test methods are mentioned; rather, subject to the specified conditions, products are deemed to comply with the standard if the power does not exceed 20 mW and the peak power does not exceed 20W. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Carpentier Kristiaan [mailto:kristiaan.carpent...@thomson.net] Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2003 11:20 AM To: 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org' Subject: EMF standard EN50371 Hi group, Can anyone tell which basic standards are to be used to demonstrate compliance with the requirements of EN50371 (Generic standard to demonstrate the compliance of low power electronic and electrical apparatus with the basic restrictions related to human exposure to electromagnetic fields (10 MHz - 300 GHz) - General public)? Vriendelijke Groeten, Best regards, Meilleures salutations, Kristiaan Carpentier Regulatory and Approval Engineer Thomson multimedia Broadband Belgium N.V., S.A. Prins Boudewijnlaan 47, B-2650 Edegem, Belgium Tel: +32 3 443 6407 - Fax: +32 3 443 6632 e-mail: kristiaan.carpent...@thomson.net www.speedtouch.com This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Australia and Radio Lans
We have an ITE product that includes a 2.45 GHz spread spectrum, low power, radio LAN card. For Australia, I understand that compliance with the following is necessary and sufficient: * Compliance with the technical requirements of ACA Radiocommunications Class Licence (Spread Spectrum Devices). * Compliance with the technical requirements of ACA Radiocommunications (Electromagnetic Radiation - Human Exposure) Standard 2001. * Compliance with the technical requirements of the EMC regulations including C-tick marking and the Declaration of Conformity. I understand there are no other licensing, marking or declaration requirements. Is this correct? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: NEMA ratings
Unforunately John, the EU Commission does think that IP ratings are regulatory matters, since they have published in the OJ the reference to EN 60529 under the LVD. The problem is that the standard was not written for a direct application by the maufacturer, rather it was witten for standards committees to adopt. However, since the standard is referenced in the OJ, we do reference it on our DoCs for products intended for outdoor use. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: John Woodgate [mailto:j...@jmwa.demon.co.uk] Sent: Sunday, October 05, 2003 2:01 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Re: NEMA ratings I read in !emc-pstc that GARY MCINTURFF mcinturff3...@msn.com wrote (in bay5-dav31v5punsipz3...@hotmail.com) about 'NEMA ratings' on Fri, 3 Oct 2003: How about the European IP ratings - owned (meaning you have to submit to some specific organization) or attested to through testing. IP ratings are not involved directly in regulatory matters at all, so a manufacturer simply states the ratings of his products. Of course, false claims are subject to the basic legislation about false advertising etc. Incidentally, IP ratings are not 'European'. They are the subject of an international standard IEC 60529. -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Interested in professional sound reinforcement and distribution? Then go to http://www.isce.org.uk PLEASE do NOT copy news posts to me by E-MAIL! This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: FCC part 15 verification
Sorry, my brain needed more coffee. An audio amplifier that processes signals over 9 kHz is considered to be an unintentional radiator and must be verifified. My previous reply is correct for amplifiers processing frequencies less than 9 kHz. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: WOODS, RICHARD Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2003 12:40 PM To: Emc-Pstc (E-mail) Subject: RE: FCC part 15 verification Such equipment is considered to be an incidental radiator (does not intentionally generate/use rf) and is not covered by the Part 15 rules. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Colgan Christopher [Soundcraft UK] [mailto:christopher.col...@soundcraft.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2003 12:02 PM To: Emc-Pstc (E-mail) Subject: FCC part 15 verification Hello all Sorry dumb question - I should know the answer to this: Does non-digital electronic equipment, such as an analogue audio ampifier, require FCC Verification? Thanks and regards Chris Colgan This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: FCC part 15 verification
Such equipment is considered to be an incidental radiator (does not intentionally generate/use rf) and is not covered by the Part 15 rules. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Colgan Christopher [Soundcraft UK] [mailto:christopher.col...@soundcraft.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2003 12:02 PM To: Emc-Pstc (E-mail) Subject: FCC part 15 verification Hello all Sorry dumb question - I should know the answer to this: Does non-digital electronic equipment, such as an analogue audio ampifier, require FCC Verification? Thanks and regards Chris Colgan This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
FCC proposed Rulemaking
The FCC has proposed changing Part 2.948 concerning lab accreditation. The current rules do not require accreditation for labs testing products under the certification route, but the new rules add the accrediation requirements for the certification route and change them for the DoC route. The proposed rules can be found at http://www.fcc.gov/oet/ I think the FCC really screwed this one up since they provided no justification whatsoever for requiring accreditation for the certification route. If your lab, like ours, is affected, you have 30 days from publication to respond to the proposal. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: IEC 1000-4-4
Kirk, IEC standards are effective upon publication unlike in the EU where a DOW is provided for the equivalent ENs. EN 61000-4-4 A2 has a DOW of 2004-07-01. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Kirk Thomas [mailto:k...@cclab.com] Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2003 12:09 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: IEC 1000-4-4 Can someone tell me when IEC 1000-4-4 amendment 2 goes into effect. Many Thanks, Kirk T. This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: CE Marking - Production Requirements
It depends upon which Annex of the Directive you have chosen to use - Annex II, IV or V (see Article 10). Annex II, point 6 says, The manufacturer must take all measures necessary in order that the maufacturing process ensures compliance of the manufactured products with the technical documentation referred to in point 2 and the requirements of this Directive that apply to them. Annex IV includes the requirements of Annex II. Annex V specifies the requirements for a full quality assurance program. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Gopalkrishna Nayak A. [mailto:gopalna...@softhome.net] Sent: Friday, September 12, 2003 11:21 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: CE Marking - Production Requirements Hi, My Company is planning to go for CE Marking on our products (Telecom). I have more or less understood what needs to be done to get the product to qualify. But I have no information on the kind of changes that need to be brought into the Company's processes, both in Design and Manufacturing. If anybody has information on this, can you please pass it on. Thanks, Gopalkrishna. This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Extending Freq Range of Sig Gen
I need to characterize a filter up to 10 GHz, but my signal generator has a top end of 4 GHz. Is there a simple means of generating a third harmonic from a signal generator while maintaining a 50 ohm source impedance? My thinking is that a diode circuit should be able to create the harmonics and then follow that circuit up with a 3-6 dB pad to maintain the source impedance. Am I on the right track? Any circuit and component suggestions would be appreciated. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
FCC Human Exposure Limits
Consider a handheld wireless device operating in the 915 MHz band or 2.45 GHz band. Do I understand correctly that such a handheld device where the radiating elements are expected to be at least 20 cm from the head and torso of the body is considered to be a mobile device by the FCC, and thus it is sufficient to demonstrate compliance by whole body exposure using the spatially averaged field? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: SRD - Inductive product - European limitations ?
You need to consult ERC Recommendation 70-03 which lists the frequency restrictions for SRDs. See annex 9 for inductive loop devices. You can obtain the document with this link: http://www.ero.dk/doc98/official/pdf/rec7003e.pdf Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Pierre Selva [mailto:e.l...@wanadoo.fr] Sent: Friday, August 01, 2003 10:12 AM To: Forum Safety-emc (Forum Safety-emc) Subject: SRD - Inductive product - European limitations ? Hello all, Does somebody know if there is restriction for use of an SRD system (inductive loop for anti theth system) in European countries. This product can be used in the following frequency range : 6.765 - 6.795 MHz 7.400 - 8.800 MHz 13.553 - 13.567 MHz. They are compliant with EN300330 standard requirements. Following a brief search on some web sites, it seems to me that most of the countries accept these kind of products without licensing, but I would like to be sure that all of them are sharing this position. Many thanks for you inputs, Best regards, Pierre eLABs (emc, safety, radio, eco-design - product regulations) 1 rue des Essarts 38610 GIERES - FRANCE Pierre SELVAPhone : 33 (0)4 38 370 007 Gérant Fax : 33 (0)4 38 371 004 e-mail : mailto:pierre.se...@e-labs.fr pierre.se...@e-labs.fr http://www.e-labs.fr/ www.e-labs.fr This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: EN55022
The DOW for EN 55022:1998 and A1:2000 are postponed until 2005-08-01 according to C172 published in the OJ on 22.07.2003. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Joshua Wiseman [mailto:jwise...@printronix.com] Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 2:03 PM To: Emc-Pstc (E-mail) Subject: EN55022 As you are all aware August 1, 2003 is right around the corner. This is the new date for the conducted emissions requirements for Telco ports. I know there was talk of postponing this a second time. As of right now I have not heard anything. Does anyone know if this will be postponed again? Thanks, Josh Anyone who stops learning is old, whether at twenty or eighty. Anyone who keeps learning stays young. The greatest thing in life is to keep your mind young. --Henry Ford This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Argentina's Electrical Safety ('S' mark)
Keven, check out the following sites.
http://www.ul.com/argentina/index.htm
http://www.ul.com/argentina/overview.htm
http://www.int-app.tuv.com/SouthAm/Argentina/Argentina.htm
http://www.ce-mag.com/ARG/Jones.html
http://europe2.dynamicweb.dk/Default.asp?ID=72
http://www.usatrade.gov/Website/ccg.nsf/CCGurl/CCG-ARGENTINA2002-CH-6:-00762
014
http://www.iram.org.ar/Boletin/Mayo-03/1.htm
Regards,
Richard Woods
Sensormatic Electronics
Tyco International
From: Kevin Richardson [mailto:kevin.richard...@ieee.org]
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2003 4:25 AM
To: EMC-PSTC
Subject: Argentina's Electrical Safety ('S' mark)
Sensitivity: Confidential
Can anyone advise where I can find:
- good information on Argentina's regulatory requirements concerning
electrical safety and what you need to do etc
- where I can find a listing of non-Argentine labs whose reports are
acceptable
- information relating to differences, if any, from USA and IEC standards
etc
Any help greatly appreciated. Thank you.
Best regards,
Kevin Richardson
Stanimore Pty Limited
Compliance Solutions for Technology Products
(Legislation/Regulations/Standards/Australian Agent Services)
Ph: 02-4329-4070 (Int'l: +61-2-4329-4070)
Fax: 02-4328-5639 (Int'l: +61-2-4328-5639)
Mobile: 04-1224-1620 (Int'l: +61-4-1224-1620)
Email:kevin.richard...@ieee.org
This material (this message and the information contained in all attachments
to this message) is confidential and/or privileged information and is
intended only for the addressee/s named above. Any unauthorised
dissemination, copying, use of or reliance upon this material by persons or
entities other than the addressee/s named above is prohibited. If you
receive this material in error, please notify Stanimore Pty Limited and
destroy all copies (electronic and hardcopy) of this message and all
attachments immediately.
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CISPR Receiver/SA
If you were purchasing a brand new, fully CISPR compliant EMC receiver/SA, and wanted to obtain the best value at the lowest cost, what would you choose and why? Likewise, if you decided to purchase a used receiver/SA, what would you choose and why? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
My company has notified many products to all of the EU and EFTA member
countries based upon using a harmonized standard and a non-harmonized band
and we have never needed to add a Notified Body number to the form. Indeed,
in the beginning when we left that part blank, some countries asked for the
information. Then we got smart and indicated on the form that the number was
not required because we applied a harmonized standard. After that, we had no
problems.
Regards,
Richard Woods
Sensormatic Electronics
Tyco International
From: alain.sam...@gigabyte.com.tw [mailto:alain.sam...@gigabyte.com.tw]
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 9:51 PM
To: jheff...@core.com; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
Even though individual country forms do not explicitly suggest the if
applicable condition, just take the initiative to put not considered or
not considered - the product is conformed to harmonized standards in place
of the number of the NB.
I guess many of us tried it, and it worked.
Alain
Giga-Byte
From: Gerald Tammi [mailto:gera...@zoom.com]
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2003 4:35 AM
To: 'richwo...@tycoint.com'; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
The 2.4 Ghz frequency spectrum is NOT harmonized. France is one of the
countries that has a restricted band allocation
It may not be true per the a directive, however if you download the required
individual notification forms by country; you will see that there is an
entry required for the notified body name and number. The general form in
the EU catalog says if applicable. the individual country forms are
similar but customized to that country. Many of the forms are in the
language of the country only, with no English version.
From: richwo...@tycoint.com [mailto:richwo...@tycoint.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 2:32 PM
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
Gerald, please explain why a Notified Body number is required? I thought
that a harmonized ETSI standard exists.
Richard Woods
Sensormatic Electronics
Tyco International
From: Gerald Tammi [mailto:gera...@zoom.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 12:52 PM
To: 'Jan Heffken'; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
I have gone through the process of a 802.11 WLAN.
France is not harmonized to the rest on the EU in the 2.4Ghz spread
spectrum.
Yes you will need a NOTIFIED BODY number to submit with the country
notifications
Yes you need to send notification to each country that you want to sell
into.
There is a 30 day waiting period for each country to reply before you can
sell into that market. {they may respond sooner that the 30 days} They may
reject especially if there is an external antenna.
If you are shipping out of the United States, and the product has an
embedded encryption engine; you need to file for an export license with the
US BXA. Also you need to comply with control of export to the T7 terrorist
countries ban.
Gerald Tammi
Zoom Telephonics.
Boston, MA
From: Jan Heffken [mailto:jheff...@core.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 10:04 AM
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
I am a little confused about paragraph 31 of the RTTE Directive. I
have copied it below. My understanding is that if our equipment (2.4GHz
outdoor WLAN) operates in a non-harmonised frequency band, then we have
to Notify Member States where it is not harmonised.
Where can I find answers to the following questions.
Is the 2,4GHz. spread spectum band harmonized through the EU?
Which Member States have not harmonized?
Do I have to go through a Notified Body to Notify?
Since paragraph 31 uses should and not shall do I have to do it all?
Paragraph 31 from the RTTE Directive.
(31) Whereas manufacturers should notify Member States
of their intention to place radio equipment on the
market using frequency bands whose use is not
harmonised throughout the Community; whereas
Member States therefore need to put in place procedures
for such notification; whereas such procedures
should be proportionate and should not constitute a
conformity assessment procedure additional to those
provided for in Annexes IV or V; whereas it is desirable
that those notification procedures should be
harmonised and preferably implemented by electronic
means and one-stop-shopping;
Thanks in advance,
Jan Heffken
--
CoreComm Webmail.
http://home.core.com
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For policy
RE: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
I understand that Class 1 products use harmonized bands. 13.56 MHz is not harmonized. Sigh! Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: rehel...@mmm.com [mailto:rehel...@mmm.com] Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:05 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: RTTE Directive Member States Notification Out of curiosity...are there ANY harmonized frequencies in Europe? Is 13.56 MHz harmonized? Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651- 778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
Ah, you have hit upon a problem that I see with the Directive. When the
spectrum is not harmonized and Notification is required, who is responsible
for ensuring that the equipment operates according to the spectrum usage
requirements of the Notified country. Is it the responsibility of the
manufacturer or the country spectrum authorities? If I fail to receive a
reply from my Notification, the Directive says I am free to market the
equipment after the Notifcation period has elapsed. But what if the country
failed to reply and yet the country has a spectrum restriction? I have
received some replies that say they have received my Notification and I can
market the equipment if it conforms with the spectrum regulations. Huh? They
may as well have said We received your Notification but did not read it.
This reply is just a formality and all of the conformity responsiblity
belongs to you.
My understanding of the Directive is that I can market my product unless the
spectrum authority specifically says NO. Of course, the spectrum authority
who sent the crazy worded message probably thinks otherwise.
Richard Woods
Sensormatic Electronics
Tyco International
From: Barker, Neil [mailto:neil.bar...@e2vtechnologies.com]
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:11 AM
To: 'Bill Stumpf'; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
My understanding is that where there is a harmonised standard, but the
spectrum usage is not harmonised, then there is no need to involve a
Notified Body for any of the testing, but you do need a Spectrum Usage
Report from a Notified Body to ratify the intended usage of the device in
the target destination. I have had such reports produced by BABT, and the
cost is quite minimal, probably equivalent to about one man-day's effort,
which is about all that it should take to review the documentation. In this
instance, I would suggest that it is perfectly legitimate to place the NB
number alongside the CE marking to indicate their involvement in determining
the product's suitability for the intended market.
Broadly speaking, it seems to me that for a Class 1 device (harmonised
standards and spectrum usage) there is no need for a NB, but for Class 2
devices, a NB will need to be involved for the spectrum usage at least.
Best regards,
Neil R. Barker
Compliance Engineering Manager
e2v technologies ltd
Waterhouse Lane
Chelmsford
Essex
CM1 2QU
U.K.
Tel: +44 (01245) 453616
Fax: +44 (01245) 453410
E-mail: neil.bar...@e2vtechnologies.com
-Original Message-
From: Bill Stumpf [mailto:bstu...@dlsemc.com]
Sent: 02 July 2003 13:59
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
Richard Woods wrote: Gerald, please explain why a Notified Body number
is required? I thought that a harmonized ETSI standard exists.
A Notified Body number is not required unless a Notified Body (NB or
CAB) is consulted for the job. Since there are Harmonized
standards that
can be used for this type of product, a NB/CAB is not required. The
manufacturer is responsible for compliance with the Essential
Requirements of the Directives, therefore they are responsible for
notifying the different Member States of the EU of their intent to
market the device in their country.
William M Stumpf
DLS Electronics
166 South Carter St.
Genoa City WI 53128
ph: 262-279-0210
fx: 262-279-3630
email: bstu...@dlsemc.com
EU CAB for EMC and RTTE
-Original Message-
From: richwo...@tycoint.com [mailto:richwo...@tycoint.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 1:32 PM
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
Gerald, please explain why a Notified Body number is
required? I thought
that a harmonized ETSI standard exists.
Richard Woods
Sensormatic Electronics
Tyco International
-Original Message-
From: Gerald Tammi [mailto:gera...@zoom.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 12:52 PM
To: 'Jan Heffken'; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
I have gone through the process of a 802.11 WLAN.
France is not harmonized to the rest on the EU in the 2.4Ghz spread
spectrum.
Yes you will need a NOTIFIED BODY number to submit with the country
notifications
Yes you need to send notification to each country that you
want to sell
into.
There is a 30 day waiting period for each country to reply before you
can
sell into that market. {they may respond sooner that the 30
days} They
may
reject especially if there is an external antenna.
If you are shipping out of the United States, and the product has an
embedded encryption engine; you need to file for an export
license with
the
US BXA. Also you need to comply with control of export to the T7
terrorist
countries ban.
Gerald Tammi
Zoom Telephonics.
Boston, MA
-Original Message-
From: Jan Heffken [mailto:jheff...@core.com]
Sent
RE: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
Gerald, please explain why a Notified Body number is required? I thought
that a harmonized ETSI standard exists.
Richard Woods
Sensormatic Electronics
Tyco International
From: Gerald Tammi [mailto:gera...@zoom.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 12:52 PM
To: 'Jan Heffken'; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
I have gone through the process of a 802.11 WLAN.
France is not harmonized to the rest on the EU in the 2.4Ghz spread
spectrum.
Yes you will need a NOTIFIED BODY number to submit with the country
notifications
Yes you need to send notification to each country that you want to sell
into.
There is a 30 day waiting period for each country to reply before you can
sell into that market. {they may respond sooner that the 30 days} They may
reject especially if there is an external antenna.
If you are shipping out of the United States, and the product has an
embedded encryption engine; you need to file for an export license with the
US BXA. Also you need to comply with control of export to the T7 terrorist
countries ban.
Gerald Tammi
Zoom Telephonics.
Boston, MA
From: Jan Heffken [mailto:jheff...@core.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 10:04 AM
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RTTE Directive Member States Notification
I am a little confused about paragraph 31 of the RTTE Directive. I
have copied it below. My understanding is that if our equipment (2.4GHz
outdoor WLAN) operates in a non-harmonised frequency band, then we have
to Notify Member States where it is not harmonised.
Where can I find answers to the following questions.
Is the 2,4GHz. spread spectum band harmonized through the EU?
Which Member States have not harmonized?
Do I have to go through a Notified Body to Notify?
Since paragraph 31 uses should and not shall do I have to do it all?
Paragraph 31 from the RTTE Directive.
(31) Whereas manufacturers should notify Member States
of their intention to place radio equipment on the
market using frequency bands whose use is not
harmonised throughout the Community; whereas
Member States therefore need to put in place procedures
for such notification; whereas such procedures
should be proportionate and should not constitute a
conformity assessment procedure additional to those
provided for in Annexes IV or V; whereas it is desirable
that those notification procedures should be
harmonised and preferably implemented by electronic
means and one-stop-shopping;
Thanks in advance,
Jan Heffken
--
CoreComm Webmail.
http://home.core.com
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RE: laser safety label
If the light source is an LED, there are no FDA requirements. The requiremens for lasers can be found in 21 CFR 1000-1010 and 1040. Also see the many publications and notices from the DHHS. http://www.fda.gov/cdrh/ Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Neil Helsby [mailto:nei...@solid-state-logic.com] Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2003 10:58 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: laser safety label In the USA, what safety labels and/or manual information is required when a class 1 (fibre optic) device is fitted to a panel for equipment interconnection? Are the requirements the same as those for EN 60825-1? Many thanks for your assistance. Regards, Neil Helsby ** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.mimesweeper.com ** This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Russian Radio Approvals
I would like to hear from anyone who has obtained approval from the Russian spectrum authorities for low power, short range radio transmitting equipment. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: ESD - not applicable ?
Clause 8.3.1 of EN 61000-4-2 says The static electricity discharges shall be applied only to such points and surfaces of the EUT which are acessible to personnel during normal usage. And it also says The application of discharges to any point of the equipment which is assessible only for maintenance purposes, excluding customer's maintenance, is not allowed unless different prescription is given in the dedicated product specification. So, unless the product or family spec says otherwise, no testing is required if a product is touched only during maintenance other than customer maintenance. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Pettit, Ghery [mailto:ghery.pet...@intel.com] Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 2:59 PM To: am...@westin-emission.no; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: ESD - not applicable ? Amund, CISPR 24 (and EN 55024) provides reasons to not perform various tests, but ESD doesn’t have any of these “outs”. I think you are entirely correct in wanting the test done. Like you, I have seen this to be one of the more applicable immunity tests (along with surge) and we test to higher levels, too. Did the lab explain how the equipment would be installed, if not touched by human hands? Ghery S. Pettit Intel Corporation From: am...@westin-emission.no [mailto:am...@westin-emission.no] Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 11:29 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: ESD - not applicable ? ESD has always been in my view, one of the most applicable EMC tests . We tests all our products with higher levels than stated in the standards. Last week I visited a local test lab and they told me that . you do not need to ESD test your new equipment because it will not be operated (no keys to press) by humans or not accessible for humans (installed minimum 2.5m above the floor level) .. Well, I was a bit surprised, because you can easily climb up to it and during maintenance you may touch it. So, what's your interpretation for ESD and situation where it is not applicable? We'll carry out the ESD test anyway, because I have no intention to discuss this case with a number of world-wide certification bodies. 20 minutes testing and all parts are satisfied ... if it pass . Best regards Amund Westin, Oslo / Norway
RE: Question about OATS
You can't go wrong by having an oversized ground. I understand that tapering the ground plane into the earth provides a better impedance match, althought I did not do that on our 10m site. I did make the plane larger than required, however and used several ground stakes on each side. I recall reading a paper from HP about one of their sites where a fence existed far (relatively) outside their elipse. Yet, when the wind blew, variations in readings would be noted. So much for elipse theory. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International -Original Message- From: emcp...@aol.com [mailto:emcp...@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 8:13 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Question about OATS Hello, I'm building an open area test site, and have some questions about the ellipse and ground plane. I'm following ANSI C63.7:1992. I have used several OATS and done site attenuation before, but this is the first time building one from the ground up. I'm building a 10 Meter OATS with a 14 foot turntable. Figure 1 in ANSI C63.7 says that the minor diameter of the ellipse shall be 17.3 Meters and the major diameter shall be 20 meters for a 10 meter site. For the ground plane, Table 1 in ANSI C63.7 says for a 10 meter site, the width shall be 12 meters and the length shall be 15.3 meters. The corners of the ground plane will be outside the ellipse. Is this ok, or should the ground plane be smaller, to fit inside the ellipse? What would be the minimum ground plane size I could use for this 10 meter site with a 14 foot turntable? Also, there is a chain-link fence running parallel with the proposed site, but the fence is just outside the ellipse. Would there be any problems with site attenuation? I can alter the ellipse so the site is not exactly parallel with the fence. (Antenna would be somewhat diagonal to the fence) Would that help avoid any problems? Thanks in advance for any input you may have. Tim Pierce EMC Engineer
New EU Member States
I received information that the Czech Republic has until 2005 to completely implement the Packaging and Packaging Waste Directive. Does anyone know if the 10 new member states to be added next year have any time frames for conforming with the various Directives, in particular the LV, EMC and RTTE Directives? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
LED Emissions Measurements
I am seeking a low cost means of determining the image size of an extended source (LED) using software operating on the data received by a CCD camera. Has anyone implemented a do-it-yourself software solution or purchased a low cost software package that will analyze the pixel intensities? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: LED Emissions
The answer to my questions can be found in Clause 5.2.2.4 of TR 60825-9. A rectangular aperture is required for oblong sources and the method of measurement is presented in that clause - it isn't easy. Sigh. -Original Message- From: WOODS, RICHARD Sent: Wednesday, June 11, 2003 9:50 AM To: 'emc-pstc' Subject: LED Emissions I am attempting to measure, in accordance with IEC 60825-1+A1 +A2, the size of the apparent source of a LED plastic fiber optic driver when the fiber is removed. The driver assembly consists of a visible red LED, clear magnifying lens and a barrel into which the 2.2 mm dia plastic fiber cable is inserted up to the lens surface. When I focus a relay lens near the tip of the barrel, I can find a minimal size image that consists of a bright center with concentric rings (reflections along the length of the barrel). The image diameter is about 2.3 mm. When I focus further inside the assembly, I can find a smaller virtual image of the magnified LED surface - about 1 mm diameter. Which of these two images is considered to be the apparent source? If the image near the tip of the barrel is the apparent source, it is a near circular image and I can use a circular aperture to determine the apparent size. If the apparent source is the one inside the barrel, the image is square (the LED die), and the standard appears to say that I must use a rectangular aperture. Is this correct or may I use a circular aperture? If so, the standard does not provide the procedure to determine the apparent size using a rectangular aperture. Any hints? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
LED Emissions
I am attempting to measure, in accordance with IEC 60825-1+A1 +A2, the size of the apparent source of a LED plastic fiber optic driver when the fiber is removed. The driver assembly consists of a visible red LED, clear magnifying lens and a barrel into which the 2.2 mm dia plastic fiber cable is inserted up to the lens surface. When I focus a relay lens near the tip of the barrel, I can find a minimal size image that consists of a bright center with concentric rings (reflections along the length of the barrel). The image diameter is about 2.3 mm. When I focus further inside the assembly, I can find a smaller virtual image of the magnified LED surface - about 1 mm diameter. Which of these two images is considered to be the apparent source? If the image near the tip of the barrel is the apparent source, it is a near circular image and I can use a circular aperture to determine the apparent size. If the apparent source is the one inside the barrel, the image is square (the LED die), and the standard appears to say that I must use a rectangular aperture. Is this correct or may I use a circular aperture? If so, the standard does not provide the procedure to determine the apparent size using a rectangular aperture. Any hints? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
FW: Interconnecting Cables
I didn't receive any comments at all, so I am trying again. Any comments would be welcomed. -Original Message- From: WOODS, RICHARD Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2003 10:58 AM To: 'emc-pstc' Subject: Interconnecting Cables I need to determine the robustness requirements for the outer insulation of an interconnecting cable for ITE when the cable contains hazardous voltages and when the cable will be in the same physical environment as the power cord. Clause 1.5.5 of EN 60950:2000 says that the cable must comply with the relevant requirements of the standard, but those requirements are not further specified in the standard. One might infer that the insulation must be no lighter than the requirements for power cords specified in Clause 3.2.5, but that is not clear. In particular, I need to determine if properly voltage rated computer interconnect cables (e.g., UL style 2464) are sufficiently robust to comply with the standard. Any suggestions on acceptable cable types/styles would be appreciated. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Interconnecting Cables
I need to determine the robustness requirements for the outer insulation of an interconnecting cable for ITE when the cable contains hazardous voltages and when the cable will be in the same physical environment as the power cord. Clause 1.5.5 of EN 60950:2000 says that the cable must comply with the relevant requirements of the standard, but those requirements are not further specified in the standard. One might infer that the insulation must be no lighter than the requirements for power cords specified in Clause 3.2.5, but that is not clear. In particular, I need to determine if properly voltage rated computer interconnect cables (e.g., UL style 2464) are sufficiently robust to comply with the standard. Any suggestions on acceptable cable types/styles would be appreciated. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Markings per RTTE Directive
The RTTE Directive requires that any restrictions on country of use be noted on the product packaging. Up until now, that was easy for us since our products could be used in all of the EU and EFTA member states. We just listed all of the ISO 2-letter country codes on the box label. However, now we have some new products that cannot be used in all of those states and we are trying to determine how we should mark the box label. Several suggestions have been made: 1) List only the country codes where use is allowed 2) X out or otherwise mark the codes where use is not allowed 3) Have two lists - one where allowed and one where not allowed and place a graphical prohibited sign in front of the latter What are you doing? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Safety testing after equipment repair
Management is asking me if we really need to perform certain safety inspections and tests after the equipment is repaired. Of course, the answer is that the inspections and/or tests are a prudent action to ensure continued safety of the product. Then they ask Does anyone else do it? Good question. Here is what we do. We intentionally tried to minimize the amount of inspections and testing. The protocol consists of certain visual inspections for such things as damaged insulation and missing fasteners; and a hypot test is specified only if the safety critical part being changed would be stressed by the test. So, let me pose the question - Does your company perform specified safety inspections and/or tests after repair of mains circuits? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: emc_p...@symbol.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RTTE DoC languages
According to the Commission/TCAM web site http://europa.eu.int/comm/enterprise/rtte/tcam5.htm#tcam5_3 TCAM has determined that it is sufficient to provide with the product the following RTTE Declaration in the multiple official languages as long as the real DoC is available at a web site. Hereby, [Name of manufacturer], declares that this [type of equipment] is in compliance with the essential requirements and other relevant provisions of Directive 1999/5/EC. TCAM has provided the statement in the 11 official languages of the EU; however, what is missing are the official languages of Iceland and Norway (EFTA members) as well as the languages of the 10 new member states to be added next May. Perhaps some persons in this forum could save us all a lot of effort and translation costs by providing accurate translations of the above statement in the following languages: Icelandic Norwegian Czech Hungarian Polish Slovak Slovene Estonian Latvian Lithuanian Turkish (note 1) Maltese (note 2) (1) The Turkish speaking part of Cyprus is not presently included in the EU membership agreement, but may be included in the future if a political solution is implemented (i.e. there will be only one Cyprus); therefore, it is prudent to plan ahead and include the statement in the Turkish language. (2) English is also an official language, but I have not been able to determine if it is legally sufficient to provide the statement in English only. Unless this can be determined, I plan to include Maltese. Anything the group can provide would be appreciated, but I would ask that persons refrain from offering translations if they are not sufficiently competent in the language. Thanks in advance, Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Use of a triangle on warning labels
Doug, the triangle is intended for a warning sign and is specified in ISO 3864. The circle has the meaning of prohibition or mandatory action, and the rectangle is for information including instructions. The diagonal line in a circle is at 45 degrees. The standard covers all aspects of the design of these symbols. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International -Original Message- From: POWELL, DOUG [mailto:doug.pow...@aei.com] Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 7:53 PM To: EMC-PSTC (E-mail) Subject: Use of a triangle on warning labels Hello group, It has become apparent to me that various standards require triangles at times when others do not. For example, IEC 61010-1 Table 1 only indicates 3 symbols that have the triangle enclosing the symbol. While, IEC 60417 does not indicate this. One that seems to be missing from IEC 61010-1 is the exclamation point in triangle. I've reviewed IEC 60204-1, EN50178, EN60950 as well and I find varying requirements, some more than others. SEMI S2 seems to indicate that nearly every symbol belongs in a triangle. I'm guessing that if it is an informational symbol, you do not use the triangle, but countering this, I have seen the hearing protection warning in a circle without the triangle. Does anyone know of a reliable rule-of-thumb for when to use a triangle on an IEC/ISO international warning symbol? By the way, here's a trivia question to which I do know the answer: On the circle-bar label warning, which angle does the slash take, from 10:00 to 4:00 or from 2:00 to 8:00 on the clock face? thanks, -doug Douglas E. Powell Regulatory Compliance Engineer Advanced Energy Industries, Inc. Fort Collins, CO 80535 USA ___ This message, including any attachments, may contain information that is confidential and proprietary information of Advanced Energy Industries, Inc. The dissemination, distribution, use or copying of this message or any of its attachments is strictly prohibited without the express written consent of Advanced Energy Industries, Inc.
RE: reinforced insulation - EN60950
Alex, consult section 2.3.5 of EN 60950:1992 which specifies the conditions under which SELV can be connected to other circuits including ELV. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Alexandru Guidea [mailto:gui...@cae.com] Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 6:47 PM To: 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org' Subject: reinforced insulation - EN60950 Dear colleagues, As part of a PCB design required to be compliant with EN60950, we want to use the configuration described below, to be able to relax the traces separation. The circuit intended to become SELV is accessible to the operator. Questions: 1. Is the combination of Basic Insulation + FuseTransorb(15V) equivalent to Reinforced Insulation? 2. Does the transorb have to comply with a specific EN safety standard (like one applicable to Y caps)? Thanks, Alexandru Guidea CAE Inc. Canada Basic Insulation | | ELV||---FUSE--SELV (??) | T | R A N S O R B | | GND (EARTH) This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Acoustic Noise Level
Does anyone know of a recommended maximum acoustic noise level for a laboratory? I'm not looking for a regulatory level, but a recommended maximum level that will allow employees in the lab to carry out normal activities without the noise causing undue problems with their productivity. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: EU Language requirements for Manuals
Gerald, is the Spanish requirement for a particular directive? Which one(s)? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Gerald Tammi [mailto:gera...@zoom.com] Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 9:52 AM To: 'ext-dave.wil...@nokia.com'; john_t...@bose.com; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: EU Language requirements for Manuals I have just gone through a major project as it applies to language. The EU directives only require that the manuals (user and service) and the DoC be in an official language of the EU (13 possibilities). However it gives the local countries the authority to impose additional if not contradictive regulations. As a compromise, there is an informal brief DoC in thirteen languages that can be inserted in the manual that will cover most circumstances. In the case of Spain, they require that the user and service manuals be printed in the official language of Spain (Castilian). The also require that there be an official full signed printed DoC in Castilian be in the manual. If not the manufacture or importer of the product can be fined. This requirement is not in any EU document, but is buried in the rules and regulations under royal decree (be prepare it is available only in Spanish). I had to read a total of about 1200 pages of Spanish law to find the regulations I have not yet come up with any other country regulations regarding specific language requirements.
RE: D of C again
Good questions Santo. Our particular RTTE products do not have user manuals perse since they are professionally installed and there are no user controls. Therefore, the DoC is on a single sheet of paper in the box. There are some that have advocated providing information to the user that says the DoC is available at a website. However, it is not clear that is a legal approach. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Mazzola, Santo [mailto:santo.mazz...@baesystems.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 5:55 PM To: 'richwo...@tycoint.com'; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: D of C again Rich, Just a question. If you are not going to put the D of C in the users manual to satisfy the RTTE directive requirement of having a D of C with the product, is there another more elegant place to put it. Any other suggestions would be interesting to note. How about the idea of putting an online link to where the DOC could be found. Do you think that would meet the RTTE requirement of D of c with product. Thanks Sandy Mazzola BAE Systems From: richwo...@tycoint.com [mailto:richwo...@tycoint.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 1:48 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: D of C again Doug, I respectfully disagree with your general statement that A copy of the D of C that states the directives complied with must be placed in the user manual. There may be a particular directive that may have this requirement, but I don't beleive that it is the LV, EMC nor the RTTE Directives. The RTTE Directive does require that a copy of the DoC be included with the product, but there is no requirement that it be included in the user manual. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: douglas_beckw...@mitel.com [mailto:douglas_beckw...@mitel.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 11:19 AM To: lfresea...@aol.com Cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Re: D of C again And the answer is The D of C must be signed by the responsible person designated by the manufacturer. The signatory does not have to be located in the EU. The manufacturer must designate a representative in the EU who will hold the certificate and the technical file. This could be an agent, distributor. A copy of the D of C that states the directives complied with must be placed in the user manual. Note, this does not have to be signed, but it must state where the signed original can be obtained. i.e. the EU representative's contact details. Doug Beckwith (OOPO) lfresea...@aol.com Sent by: To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org owner-emc-pstc@majordom cc: o.ieee.org Subject: D of C again 04/29/03 09:13 AM Please respond to Lfresearch Hi folks, I've been asked by a US manufacturer who's signature if any should appear on the D of C, and should they be located on European soil. Is there a clear consensus? Thanks, Derek N. Walton Owner L F Research EMC Design and Test Facility Poplar Grove, Illinois, USA www.lfresearch.com This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single
RE: AC outlet max current
The US and Canadian National Electrical Codes requires the plug for ITE to be rated for at least 125% of the load. That is origin of the 80%. See NEC Article 645.5. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Gonzalez, Kenneth P (Rocky) [mailto:kpgon...@ingr.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 6:10 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: AC outlet max current Group It was my understanding that one could only draw 80% of the max current from an AC wall outlet. Is this true? Where does the NEC specify this? Thanks to all, Kenneth Gonzalez Intergraph Solutions Group This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: D of C again
Doug, I respectfully disagree with your general statement that A copy of the D of C that states the directives complied with must be placed in the user manual. There may be a particular directive that may have this requirement, but I don't beleive that it is the LV, EMC nor the RTTE Directives. The RTTE Directive does require that a copy of the DoC be included with the product, but there is no requirement that it be included in the user manual. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: douglas_beckw...@mitel.com [mailto:douglas_beckw...@mitel.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 11:19 AM To: lfresea...@aol.com Cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Re: D of C again And the answer is The D of C must be signed by the responsible person designated by the manufacturer. The signatory does not have to be located in the EU. The manufacturer must designate a representative in the EU who will hold the certificate and the technical file. This could be an agent, distributor. A copy of the D of C that states the directives complied with must be placed in the user manual. Note, this does not have to be signed, but it must state where the signed original can be obtained. i.e. the EU representative's contact details. Doug Beckwith (OOPO) lfresea...@aol.com Sent by: To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org owner-emc-pstc@majordom cc: o.ieee.org Subject: D of C again 04/29/03 09:13 AM Please respond to Lfresearch Hi folks, I've been asked by a US manufacturer who's signature if any should appear on the D of C, and should they be located on European soil. Is there a clear consensus? Thanks, Derek N. Walton Owner L F Research EMC Design and Test Facility Poplar Grove, Illinois, USA www.lfresearch.com This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: D of C again
DoCs that are signed by me in the USA do incude our local EU contact information; however, I understand that inclusion of the contact information is not a legal requirement. If it is a legal requirement, I would like for someone to point to the Directive or to a document published by the Commission that states this requirement. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International -Original Message- From: Gregg Kervill [mailto:gr...@test4safety.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 5:13 PM To: lfresea...@aol.com; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: D of C again The person making the declaration – e.g. Engineering V.P. in whatever country – If not in the E.U. then the name and address of the Authorized Rep is required - but not their signature. Best regards Gregg This and other information is available at http://www.test4safety.com/html/elearning.htm http://www.test4safety.com/html/elearning.htm From: owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org [mailto:owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org]On Behalf Of lfresea...@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 9:13 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: D of C again Hi folks, I've been asked by a US manufacturer who's signature if any should appear on the D of C, and should they be located on European soil. Is there a clear consensus? Thanks, Derek N. Walton Owner L F Research EMC Design and Test Facility Poplar Grove, Illinois, USA www.lfresearch.com
RE: D of C again
On page 35 of the Commission's Guide to the implementation of the directives based on the New Approach and the Global Approach, they say the DoC must must have the signature and title or an equivalent marking of authorized person. And in a footnote they say, It is not necessary for the signatory to be domiciled in the community. A manufacturer established outside the Community is entitled to carry out all of the certification procedures at his premises and, therefore, to sign the declaration of conformity unless otherwise provided for in the directive(s). Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International -Original Message- From: lfresea...@aol.com [mailto:lfresea...@aol.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 9:13 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: D of C again Hi folks, I've been asked by a US manufacturer who's signature if any should appear on the D of C, and should they be located on European soil. Is there a clear consensus? Thanks, Derek N. Walton Owner L F Research EMC Design and Test Facility Poplar Grove, Illinois, USA www.lfresearch.com
RE: Is notified body needed?
The relevant standards have been published in the OJ, so you do no need a Notified Body if you apply the standards. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: sh...@samsung.co.kr [mailto:sh...@samsung.co.kr] Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2003 10:06 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Is notified body needed? Hi group, Does anyone know the current situation for 2.4GHz WLAN products and whether a Notified Body MUST be used under the RTTE in Europe? In the RTTE directive, Annex III states that selecting the test suites considered essential is the responsibility of a notified body... except where test suites are defined in the harmonised standards. The OJ lists EN 301 489-17 and EN 300 328-2 which as far as I can see are applicable to these products. So, I think that if we can use Annex III, we should not need to have a notified body involved, though we would need to know about any country specific requirements. Am I right? Stephen Colclough SEQAL This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Fiber and AC mains wire runs
The EU wiring rules are based upon HD384 which is based upon IEC 60364. You can purchase a single part copy as BSI 7671. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: John Woodgate [mailto:j...@jmwa.demon.co.uk] Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2003 5:26 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Re: Fiber and AC mains wire runs I read in !emc-pstc that Cereceres, David dcerece...@pelco.com wrote (in b2cc0e0f2c10d511b86600b0d06898420541f...@localhost.pelco.dns) about 'Fiber and AC mains wire runs' on Wed, 16 Apr 2003: Is there a European equivalent of the NEC that I could possibly reference? An *international* standard, IEC 60364, a huge multi-part standard. -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Interested in professional sound reinforcement and distribution? Then go to http://www.isce.org.uk PLEASE do NOT copy news posts to me by E-MAIL! This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
EN55022:2003
Voting ended on 21 March, but the results are not published on the CENELEC site. Was it approved? Are there any common modifications concerning emissions from telecom ports? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Antenna Data Sheets
Can anyone provide me with data sheets for the following horn antennas: AEL model APN101B, Scientific Atlanta model 12-12. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Noise Factor
I need verification that I am computing the noise factor (NF) of my emissions receiver correctly. The system will measure emissions in the 1-10 GHz band and will use a horn antenna followed by a high pass filter followed by a preamp feeding a spectrum analyzer. I can ignore the NF of the spectrum analyzer. since gain of the preamp is 20 dB, so the total NF will be set by the other three elements. The NF of the preamp is 4 dB, the insertion loss of the filter is 1 dB and the antenna factor of the horn is 39 dB at 10 GHz. I understand that the NF of the filter will be equal to the insertion loss, 1 dB. And the NF of the antenna will be equal to its insertion loss (antenna factor), 39 dB at 10 GHz. Therefore the total NF of the three elements will be the sum of their NFs - i.e., 39 + 1 + 4 = 44 dB. It seems that I don't have to be overly concerned about the NF when I select a preamp, since the only way of reducing the NF significantly would be to improve the antenna factor. Are my calculations correct? This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
CISPR 22 Ed. 4.0 Vote Results
Voting on CISPR/I/67/FDIS for CISPR 22 Ed. 4.0 ended 2003-03-21. Does anyone know the results? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Crossed out wheelie bin symbol (WEEE Directive)
The directive says The symbol must be printed visibly, legibly and indelibly. No minimum size is specified. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: James, Chris [mailto:c...@dolby.co.uk] Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2003 9:27 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Crossed out wheelie bin symbol (WEEE Directive) Anyone know if there is a size requirement for this symbol? i.e. not less than a certain height as applies to the CE mark which must be at least 5mm tall. Regards, Chris ___ Chris James Engineering Services Manager Dolby Laboratories, Inc. (UK) This message (including any attachments) may contain confidential information intended for a specific individual and purpose. If you are not the intended recipient, delete this message. If you are not the intended recipient, disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking any action based on this message is strictly prohibited. This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Flame Ratings of EU Cables
Can someone enlighten me on the current EU legal requirements for flame spread of cables installed in walls and ceilings of retail/commercial/light industrial establishments? Do these requirements conflict with UL ratings (e.g., VW-1, CL2P)? For these same establishments, are there any current legal requirements to use halogen-free cables or low smoke/fumes cables? Are any of these requirements likely to change over the next three years? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Demonstrating compliance with Human Exposure to EMF requireme nts
If you are going to claim compliance to EN50385, you will have to make the assessment according to the standard. Otherwise, you have the following choices: Claim safety conformity to the procedures of the RTTE Directive and create a Technical Construction File and consult with a Notified Body as to the assessment method. Claim safety conformity to the procedures of the LVD (the RTTE Directive allows this)and build a TCF. Under the LVD the use of a Notified Body is not required if harmonized standards are not applied. Obviously, this process has risks since a harmonized standard does exist. In case of challenge, conformity may be difficult to prove without the opinion of a NB. However, I did use this route myself when the the EMF standard I use was in draft form. In your case you should probably use one of the first two choices. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Charles Blackham [mailto:cblac...@airspan.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 26, 2003 11:49 AM To: emc-pstc Subject: Demonstrating compliance with Human Exposure to EMF requirements All I'm attempting to demonstrate the compliance of our fixed wireless access system with the human exposure to EMF requirements of Article 3.1a of the RTTE directive: The applicable standard, EN50385, requires the field strengths to be measured/calculated according to EN50383 against the limits detailed in 1999/519/EC. My reading of 1999/519/EC is that the maximum allow E-filed is 61 V/m for 2-300 GHz. I calculate that our subscriber equipment is generating a field of 10 V/m at 0.5m distance. So, so save measuring/calculating near field values, can I just add to the user manual that you should not stand within 0.5m of the front of the equipment? (The antenna wouldn't work so well if you did, and it would be difficult to anyway as it typically pole/chimney mounted) regards Charlie Blackham Approvals Manager Airspan Communications This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: EN61000-4-3 Radiated Immnuity Product Monitoring
Alex, we used a standard camera with a good zoom with remote control, mounted it to the ceiling in the upper corner of the room behind the antenna with the wires running out a small hole and covered it in a screened enclosure. Before we did that we verified that the enclosure did not perturb the calibrated field. It works great up to 10V/m. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Alex McNeil [mailto:alex.mcn...@ingenicofortronic.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 26, 2003 6:34 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: EN61000-4-3 Radiated Immnuity Product Monitoring Hi Forum, I have a EN61000-4-3 compliance test set up in a Chamber. Some of our products have LCD displays 2cm X 8cm. My problem is I bought a Teseo RF proofed camera that cannot zoom in on the display at a distance of 2m (from the corner of the chamber). I can obviously see the display if I place the camera next to the product. However, it seems that the camera must be positioned outwith the 1.5Msq calibrated field area? I heard that there are fibre optic probes that can be positioned at the display and fed back into the camera lense via an adaptor? Has anyone heard of this method? Has anyone any idea of overcoming my problem without the need to purchase a £5K camera? How near am I allowed to place the camera? Thanks in advance for your kind comments. Kind Regards Alex McNeil Principal Engineer Tel: +44 (0)131 479 8375 Fax: +44 (0)131 479 8321 email: alex.mcn...@ingenicofortronic.com This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
New EMC RTTE standards list
New reference lists for EMC and RTTE standards were published in the OJ today. http://europa.eu.int/eur-lex/en/oj/2003/c_07420030326en.html Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Noxious and Hazardous Substances in Packaging
One of the essential requirements of the Packaging and Packaging Waste Directive is that the presence of noxious and other hazardous substances are minimized with regard to their presence in emissions, ash, or leachate. EN 13428 was intended to address this issue, but the Commission determined that the standard was inadequate in this regard. The standard referenced Directive 67/548 and its amendments, but with the Commission's decision, its not clear that this reference is valid or sufficient. Directive 76/769 lists certain dangerous substances, but again it is not clear that this is a sufficient list. So, until the standard is revised, what means are available to determine if an additive is noxious or hazardous? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Noxious and Hazardous Substances in Packaging
Fire Retardants
If a plastic containing a fire retardant is subjected to high heat (for example, due to a overheated component) for an extended period of time (many hours or several days), is it possible that the fire retardant in the plastic will outgas sufficiently to decrease the flame rating of the plastic in the heated area? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Harsh Chemical Environments
Can anyone point me to guidance documents for designing electrical/electronic equipment for harsh chemical environments? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Exemption from Flicker Testing
Clause 6.1 of EN 61000-3-3 + A1 says Tests shall not be made on equipment which is unlikely to produce significant voltage fluctuations or flicker. It may be necessary to determine, by examination of the circuit diagram and specifications of the equipment and by a short functional test, whether significant voltage fluctuations are likely to be produced. Am I standing on firm ground assuming that equipment consuming less than 75W can be exempted from test? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Japan Radio
Is anyone aware of a radio test lab located in the USA that is recognized by TELEC (Japan). Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: FDA Laser Requirements
The FDA says the correct reference is 1002.31. -Original Message- From: WOODS, RICHARD Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2003 11:56 AM To: 'emc-pstc' Subject: FDA Laser Requirements 21CFR1002.30(b) refers to 1002.61 which does not exist. Does anyone know the correct reference? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
FDA Laser Requirements
21CFR1002.30(b) refers to 1002.61 which does not exist. Does anyone know the correct reference? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Class 2 laser
Are any national restrictions on the use of a Class 2 laser in areas where the general public would be exposed? A good example would be a beam across a doorway to detect entry and exit. Assume the product is fully compliant with IEC 60825-1. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Superseded standard
EN 50082-1:1992 was supperseded by the 1997 version on 1 July 2001; and therefore no longer provides for the persumption of conformity to the EMC Directive after that date. If you wish to continue to use harmonized standards as the basis of conformity, you will have to use current standards. And yes, that means a re-evaluation to any changes in the standard. Your DoC must list current standards. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: McBurney, Ian [Allen Heath UK] [mailto:ian.mcbur...@allen-heath.com] Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 5:57 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Superseded standard Sirs; Can anyone tell me when products tested to EN 50082-1:1992 and still in production should have been retested because the 1992 standard has now been superseded. I assume any reports and declaration of conformity documents issued for products declaring conformity with EN 50082-1:1992 are now not legitimate. Ian McBurney. Allen Heath Ltd. email: ian.mcbur...@allen-heath.com ***DISCLAIMER*** This Email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual to whom or the entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the sender immediately. Please note that any views or opinions presented in this email are those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Allen Heath Limited. The recipient should check this email and any attachments for the presence of viruses. Allen Heath Limited accepts no liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted via this email.
RE: Japan 13.56 MHz
I just heard some more about this. The proposal was to implement the same limits and spectrum mask as CEPT Recommendation 70-03 Annex 9 Figure 3 (inductive loop devices). I just heard from another source that it was approved. Can anyone confirm this? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International -Original Message- From: WOODS, RICHARD Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 8:30 AM To: 'emc-pstc' Subject: Japan 13.56 MHz Last year a Japan was considering raising the intentional emissions limit at 13.56 MHz for short range devices to match the ETSI/FCC limit of 42 dBuA/m. Does any one know if this proposal was adopted? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Japan 13.56 MHz
Last year a Japan was considering raising the intentional emissions limit at 13.56 MHz for short range devices to match the ETSI/FCC limit of 42 dBuA/m. Does any one know if this proposal was adopted? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Custom Units in EU
The commission addressed this issue in section 3.1 of their guide to the new approach directives. http://europa.eu.int/comm/enterprise/newapproach/legislation/guide/legislati on.htm (past this long address back together if it wrapped) A product may be put into service without prior placing on the market (such as a product manufactured for own use). In such a case the person who puts the product into service must assume the responsibilities of the manufacturer. Accordingly, he must ensure that the product complies with the directive, and that the appropriate conformity assessment has been carried out. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Joe P Martin [mailto:marti...@appliedbiosystems.com] Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2003 3:49 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Custom Units in EU Greetings, We are planning to manufacture up to 50 units for laboratory use. Each of these units will be one of a kind. These units will be shipped to the EU to our own laboratory and operated by our personnel. If I recall correctly there are exemptions for one of a kind units for EMC, LVD and Machinery Directives. However, I was unable to locate this information in the guidelines to these Directives. Can members of the group provide me with specific information regarding the requirements, if any, for one of a kind units located in the manufacturers facility and operated by employees of the manufacturer in the EU? All responses are appreciated. Regards Joe Martin Applied Biosystems marti...@appliedbiosystems.com This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Infra Red
David, IR emissions are subject to the limits and markings of EN 60825-1 which is referenced in EN60950. There are no EMC requirements for these types of ports. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: David Sproul [mailto:david.spr...@alexanderlynn.co.uk] Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2003 2:08 PM To: EMC-PSTC Subject: Infra Red Dear group, could anyone please tell me what the emc (if any) and safety requirements for IR ports in PC's would be. I could find no reference to this in BS EN 60950: 2000. Thanks in advance for your help. Best regards, David Sproul.
RE: 60950 clauses
My copy has at the bottom of the first page, Ref. No. EN 60950:2000 E and does not include a clause 7. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: boconn...@t-yuden.com [mailto:boconn...@t-yuden.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2003 12:18 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: 60950 clauses The index of my copy of EN 60950:2000 refers to non-existent clauses (e.g., 7.x, 1.2.13.14, etc). Is is safe to assume that these are typos ? R/S, Brian O'Connell Taiyo Yuden (USA), Inc.
RE: product safety audit scenario
In the real world, however, such jugements are made by the safety agency factory inspectors. Unfortunately, our factories have received several variance notices in the past, but not a single one has resulted in an immediate line shut-down by the inspector. In some cases, it is obvious that a simple paperwork change is required. In others cases where there is a more serious variance, the manufacturer must resolve the problem within a specified period of time. Usually, in this case, the manufacture works with the agency engineer to provide a resolution and the agency engineer notifies the follow-up services group of the resolution which allows production to continue. If your inspector is shuting down your line, you either have a serious breech of safety or a very strict inspector. If you feel the latter is the case, you need to speak to the inspector's managment. I have had to do that on one ocassion when the inspector was being concerned about items that I felt were beyound his concern. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Gregg Kervill [mailto:gr...@test4safety.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2003 7:20 AM To: 'Lay Siang Saw'; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: product safety audit scenario When the product differs from your product description - (most) auditors are expressly forbidden to make engineering judgments - therefore is it says Painted Steel in the narrative description and its actually Anodized Aluminum then he will have no option but to stop shipment. Best regards Gregg From: owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org [mailto:owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org]On Behalf Of Lay Siang Saw Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2003 4:51 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: product safety audit scenario Hi all, Can anyone share with me under what conditions an auditor is allowed to stop shipments ? Thanks,alice -- Forwarded by Lay Siang Saw/MY/Asia/Celestica on 02/18/2003 06:09 PM --- Lay Siang Saw 02/18/2003 10:50 AM To:emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org cc: Subject:product safety audit scenario Hi all, Thank you very much for your comments.I have received many replies from this forum. May be someone out there can standardize this,applicable to UL,TUV,CSA etc. On the reportOn the physical part VN ? . 1. Rating (V) 90-135/180-265V115/230V NO,as this part has been tested in 90-135/180-265V range 2. Rating (I) 12/10A 10A NO,as this rating is within the tested rating 3. Rating (V) 120-127/220-240V 125/230V NO,as this part has been tested in 120-127/220-240V range 4. Rating (V) 120-127/220-240V 120-127V NO,the rating used within the tested range Once again ,thank you all and it would be good if there is standardisation made on this issue. Regards,alice -- Forwarded by Lay Siang Saw/MY/Asia/Celestica on 02/18/2003 10:51 AM --- Lay Siang Saw 02/17/2003 11:40 AM To:emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org cc: Subject:product safety audit scenario Hi all,can anyone share with me with your comments Scenario : Component A with rating mentioned in the UL's product report as 90-135/180-265 Vac, however in the phyical unit is written as 115/230 V . Q1 : Is this a non conformity ? Should a VN be raised ?50 % says Yes and other 50% says No Scenario :In the report, it mentioned the marking on the label as 120-127V , however in the actual label on the unit it is written as 120-127V/220-240V. Q2. Is this a non conformity ? Should a VN be raised ?100% yes Scenario : In the report, it mentioned component B carries many safety agency certification, however i the actual physical unit, it only containes one or two safety agency logos. Q3. Is this a non conformity ? Should a VN be raised ? 90% says YES and 10% says NO Q4. When an IPI ( Initial product inspection ) is carried out, should the UL's product report been approved by the UL ? Q5. Should the report used during IPI is a detailed report with Sec general and condition of testing been included ? Q6. Can anyone share with me the correct ways the product report/FUS procedure for a product should be written so that we are not caught up with it, particularly on the rating,model and safety agency certification requirement for the product ? I am looking forwards to hearing a reply from you. Thanks Regards, alice saw This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send
Applicable EMC tests
Consider an outdoor housing intended to contain an electronic product subject to the generic EMC standards. The only electrical circuit in the housing is a heater with a PTC temperature control. The power input port is 24V AC/DC. My thinking is that this device is also subject to the generic EMC standards. EN61000-6-3 indicates that a test is not required for the enclosure since there are no high frequency sources, and the AC mains test is not required since this is a low voltage device. It would seem that the conducted emissions test on the AC/DC port is not required by a simple inspection of the electrical circuits - i.e., there are no components that will generate emissions in the frequency bands specified by CISPR22. Therefore, is it acceptable to note all of this in the test report and declare compliance to EN61000-6-3 without testing? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Resource for Online Standard.
If any company has such a program, it is probably IHS. http://global.ihs.com/ Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Cheng-Wee Lai [mailto:chengwee_...@emclab2000.com] Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 7:24 PM To: Emc-Pstc Subject: Resource for Online Standard. All, I know this might be a very stupid question to ask, but is there a place where I can pay a flat subscription fee and able to read all these new standard (e.g. all these IEC, EN, ISO, ANSI, UL, AU/NZ etc), so I don't need to worry about collecting all the up to date standard. Cause by the time I get the whole set, I find myself ready to redo the collecting cycle again because there are new edition coming. Cheng-Wee Lai This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
EN61000-3-3 + A1
The IEC version of amendment A1 says that the instrurment standard, IEC 60868, will be withdrawn and replaced with IEC 61000-4-15 in 2003. Would someone please tell me what the CENELEC version of A1 has to say about this change in the instrument standard? In particular, did CENELEC revise the normitive reference to EN 60868:1993 in Annex ZA? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: What happens when an RTTE non compliant product is placed on the market?
There are three Directives at play here, LVD, EMCD, and RTTED. Market survalence authorities under the LVD: http://europa.eu.int/comm/enterprise/electr_equipment/lv/index.htm Under the EMCD: Not listed on the commission's web site, but check out the guidelines. http://europa.eu.int/comm/enterprise/electr_equipment/emc/index.htm Under the RTTED: Not listed but I understand they are the spectrum management authorities. http://europa.eu.int/comm/enterprise/rtte/infor.htm Also see: http://europa.eu.int/comm/enterprise/newapproach/legislation/guide/legislati on.htm Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Ilan Cohen [mailto:ico...@itl.co.il] Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 1:34 PM To: 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org' Subject: What happens when an RTTE non compliant product is placed on the market? Hi All Does anyone know the format and the status of the surveillance bodies which were supposed to be places by the member states and by the EU for enforcement of the RTTE directive. What happens when an RTTE non compliant product is placed on the market? Does anyone care? (For example an RTTE product which is declared under the LVD and the EMC only. Or worse, when a product is being declared to comply with the RTTE directive without compliance with the RTTE directive requirements of EMC, safety, telecom and the construction file) Ilan Ilan Cohen Technical Director, Safety Telecom Divisions I.T.L (PRODUCT TESTING) Ltd. 26 Hacharoshet St, POB 211, Or Yehuda, Israel. Tel 972-3-5339022, Fax 972-3-5339019 ico...@itl.co.il, website: http://www.itl.co.il This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
Agilent 6842A Technical Question
Is anyone aware of any amendments or revisions of the relevant test equipment standards or product test standards that are not supported by the Agilent 6842A? We are currently trying to evaluate dmax during power up (inrush current) per Annex B of EN 61000-3-3 + A1 and having some difficulty. Has anyone found a way of programming the unit to allow this test? In particular, can the equipment report the rms current during any half period (we can only find an estimated current), and can the equipment report all 24 values of dmax (we can only find the maximum value in the series)? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International
RE: Member States versus EU
Depends upon the Directive. Each Directive is addressed to the member states and requires that the Directive be transposed into national law. Generally, a national law may not be in conflict with the Directive in order to allow for the free movement of goods. However, in some cases, a Directive may state miminum requirements and allow a state to have more stringent requirements. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Joe P Martin [mailto:marti...@appliedbiosystems.com] Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 1:44 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Member States versus EU Greetings, If Member States of the European Union have existing laws in place that conflict with, or are in addition to, European Union Directives, do the Member States have to amend their laws to be in line with the Directives? Any and all responses are appreciated. Regards Joe Martin Applied Biosystems This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: HP 6034L Power supply schematics / repair (was Agilent 6842A)
We had ours repaired by California Instruments, the actual manufacturer of the power supply section. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Kurt M. Marden [mailto:kmar...@curtis-straus.com] Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 11:40 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Cc: Michael Taylor; 'emcp...@aol.com' Subject: HP 6034L Power supply schematics / repair (was Agilent 6842A) On that note of (lack of) support, Agilent has no or will not release documentation on the old 6034L power supply. I recently acquired one which powers up but has no output and the front panel display shows 0 volts / amps. Agilent will be happy to charge me $140 just to look at it. Best effort is all they can guarantee on a repair (which would be over and above the $140). Sheesh! Anybody have a owners manual or repair guide / schematics for this model? Thanks, Kurt Michael Taylor wrote: If you think Carley and the rest of HP / Agilent upper management are really more concerned about your thoughts - over short term profits, there are several of us that would like to interest you in some swamp land in Florida and a bridge in New Jersey. Seriously, I have had several instances lately with Agilent that convince me that the old HP is gone and the NEW - lean-mean Agilent machine no longer values customer loyalty the way the old HP did. In my case, the way I was treated on several issues would have never occurred under the old HP. The net result is I now consider purchasing test equipment from others - something I would have never done in the past. Welcome to the brave new world of bean counting business. Michael Taylor (loyal HP test equipment fan) Frozen in Colorado From: emcp...@aol.com [ mailto:emcp...@aol.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 11:00 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Agilent 6842A I think all of the people that own the Agilent 6842A Harmonic and Flicker Test System should get together and request Agilent to update their software for the new standards. As a loyal HP/Agilent customer, I would expect them to take care of this issue. This is why we buy certain brands of test equipment, and not others. I feel that we got ripped on this deal since the 6842A is not a cheap piece of test equipment. Tim Pierce -- Kurt M. Marden Environmental Simulation Manager Curtis-Straus LLCkmar...@curtis-straus.com Laboratory for EMC,Safety Environmental Simulation Lab NEBS,SEMI-S2 and Telecom168 Ayer Rd. 527 Great Road Littleton, MA 01460 Littleton, MA 01460 voice (978) 486-8880 http://www.curtis-straus.comfax (978) 486-0806
RE: Agilent 6842A
Tim, which amendments or revisions of the test equipment standards or product test standards do you believe are not supported? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: emcp...@aol.com [mailto:emcp...@aol.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 1:00 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Agilent 6842A I think all of the people that own the Agilent 6842A Harmonic and Flicker Test System should get together and request Agilent to update their software for the new standards. As a loyal HP/Agilent customer, I would expect them to take care of this issue. This is why we buy certain brands of test equipment, and not others. I feel that we got ripped on this deal since the 6842A is not a cheap piece of test equipment. Tim Pierce
RE: UL508 and UL60950
We once had a UL508 panel where the Listed construction allowed us to install a specified UL 60950 Listed ITE device into the panel at the customer site. So, it can be done. In our particular case, UL was the Listing agency. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Pierre SELVA [mailto:e.l...@wanadoo.fr] Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 7:48 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: UL508 and UL60950 Hello from France, One of my customer is providing Human Machine Interfaces (Industrial programmable controllers, Displays, ...). Most of these products are included in UL508 certified complete products, and are themselves UL508 certified. But, can we use UL60950 certified products in a complete UL508 product. In other words, do we have to demonstrate compliance of the included product to UL 508 if it's UL60950 certified ? For example, can we use UL60950 industrial computers in a UL 508 complete product ? Any input is welcome Many thanks in advance. Pierre Selva This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Proposed new EMC Directive.
I also recommend reading this guide. http://europa.eu.int/comm/enterprise/ne approach/legislation/guide/legislation.htm See section 3 concerning private branded products. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: WOODS, RICHARD Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 1:43 PM To: IEEE Forum (E-mail) Subject: RE: Proposed new EMC Directive. Ian, I recommend that you visit the European Commission's EMC web site: http://europa.eu.int/comm/enterprise/electr_equipment/emc/index.htm You will find a guide that describes the file requirements and your obligations for reselling a private branded product. The basic requirements are not going to change with the revised directive. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: White, Ian [mailto:ianwh...@spiraxsarco.com] Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 11:34 AM To: IEEE Forum (E-mail) Subject: Proposed new EMC Directive. Hi everyone. We have been working through consequences of the New Proposed Emc Directive. As we are not a large electronics company so we will not be able to quote all the standards we quoted today as we don't use equipment detailed in that said standard. The new directive states we will have to establish technical documentation which enables conformity to be assed, which would include design and manufacturing information as well as test results. No doubt detailing the instrumentation used as well. This is going to make for a very large file for each product. There is also the point, that we buy in products and put the Spirax label on it. Upto this point we have excepted a suppliers D of C. Across the company this a large number of products. We would be left assessing if a supplier was complying by reading his technicial documentation. The amount of paperwork this would entail is a bit overpowering to think about. Have we been reading the Proposed EMC Directive correctly ? Thanks Ian
RE: Country Deviations to IEC 60950
Richard, the national deviations of countries participating in the CB scheme can be found in the CB Bulletin that can be purchased from the IEC. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Richard Meyette [mailto:meye...@pacbell.net] Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 12:54 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Country Deviations to IEC 60950 Group, I have a question regarding the country deviations to IEC 60950, 3rd Edition. Some of the country specific differences are referenced in the IEC standard as notes to the Subclause. For example, 4.3.6 has notes regarding the testing of direct plug-in equipment in Australia and the United Kingdom. Some of the country differences are not referenced directly in the standard. For example Singapore requires a more stringent humidity conditioning test than the test specified in Subclause 2.9.2., however there is no note that references this deviation. Subclause 1.1.2 (Additional Requirements) only has a note stating that the authorities of some countries impose additional requirements. The country specific deviations for the European Union are documented in EN 60950 (Annex ZB, Special National Conditions), and the US and Canadian deviations are contained in UL60950/CSA C22.2, No. 60950. Some of the IEC standards have a list of the specific country differences in the Forward section of the standard, however IEC 60950 does not. So my question is this. Is there a reference source that contains a list of the country deviations for the rest of the world to IEC 60950? Regards, Richard Meyette This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: Proposed new EMC Directive.
Ian, I recommend that you visit the European Commission's EMC web site: http://europa.eu.int/comm/enterprise/electr_equipment/emc/index.htm You will find a guide that describes the file requirements and your obligations for reselling a private branded product. The basic requirements are not going to change with the revised directive. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: White, Ian [mailto:ianwh...@spiraxsarco.com] Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 11:34 AM To: IEEE Forum (E-mail) Subject: Proposed new EMC Directive. Hi everyone. We have been working through consequences of the New Proposed Emc Directive. As we are not a large electronics company so we will not be able to quote all the standards we quoted today as we don't use equipment detailed in that said standard. The new directive states we will have to establish technical documentation which enables conformity to be assed, which would include design and manufacturing information as well as test results. No doubt detailing the instrumentation used as well. This is going to make for a very large file for each product. There is also the point, that we buy in products and put the Spirax label on it. Upto this point we have excepted a suppliers D of C. Across the company this a large number of products. We would be left assessing if a supplier was complying by reading his technicial documentation. The amount of paperwork this would entail is a bit overpowering to think about. Have we been reading the Proposed EMC Directive correctly ? Thanks Ian
RE: EN55022:1998 and telecom ports
Unfortunately, EN 55022 is the only available emissions standard for CCTV products used for security applications. Even the standard for professional video equipment, EN55103-1, references EN 55022 as does the generic standard. Perhaps the CISPR ITE committee is not aware that they are affecting a lot of products other than ITE when they make changes to EN55022. Now back to my question about coax connected CCTV equipment. As I read the standard, I am going to have to test these video ports since the coax cables can extend for very large distances. It is just not clear that the authors had this in mind. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Pettit, Ghery [mailto:ghery.pet...@intel.com] Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 11:39 AM To: 'richwo...@tycoint.com'; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: EN55022:1998 and telecom ports Richard, Cameras, monitors, etc are not ITE. CISPR 22 does not apply to them. Ghery Pettit Intel From: richwo...@tycoint.com [mailto:richwo...@tycoint.com] Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 7:20 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: EN55022:1998 and telecom ports OK, so widely dispersed is a key element in determining if a network needs to be tested. That is consistent with the problem of long balanced pairs having common mode emissions. The standard also includes tests for coax and alludes to emissions caused by imperfect shielding. That seems to imply that a network of video products (e.g., cameras, monitors, muxes, VCRs, etc) with base band signals in coax would also be subject to testing. However, it is not clear that is what the authors had in mind. Comments? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Carpentier Kristiaan [mailto:carpenti...@thmulti.com] Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2003 5:54 PM To: 'richwo...@tycoint.com'; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: EN55022:1998 and telecom ports Richard, In addition to Gherys explanation of the note, there is also the definition itself that inherently excludes certain interfaces by means of the wordings widely dispersed and multi-user. But I agree that adding some more definitions of interfaces would help, also myself. Clause 6.3: Telecommunications port Point of connection for voice , data and signalling transfers intended to connect widely dispersed systems via such means as direct connection to multi-user telecom networks (e.g. PSTN, ISDN, xDSL, LAN (token ring, ethernet, etc) and similar networks. Note A port generally intended for connection of components of an ITE system under test (e.g. RS232, IEEE standard 1284 (parallel printer), USB, IEEE Std 1394 (fire wire) etc) and used in accordance with its functional specifications ( e.g. for the max. length of cable to be connected to it), is not considered to be a telecommunications/network port under this definition Regards, Kris This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back
RE: EN55022:1998 and telecom ports
OK, so widely dispersed is a key element in determining if a network needs to be tested. That is consistent with the problem of long balanced pairs having common mode emissions. The standard also includes tests for coax and alludes to emissions caused by imperfect shielding. That seems to imply that a network of video products (e.g., cameras, monitors, muxes, VCRs, etc) with base band signals in coax would also be subject to testing. However, it is not clear that is what the authors had in mind. Comments? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Carpentier Kristiaan [mailto:carpenti...@thmulti.com] Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2003 5:54 PM To: 'richwo...@tycoint.com'; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: EN55022:1998 and telecom ports Richard, In addition to Gherys explanation of the note, there is also the definition itself that inherently excludes certain interfaces by means of the wordings widely dispersed and multi-user. But I agree that adding some more definitions of interfaces would help, also myself. Clause 6.3: Telecommunications port Point of connection for voice , data and signalling transfers intended to connect widely dispersed systems via such means as direct connection to multi-user telecom networks (e.g. PSTN, ISDN, xDSL, LAN (token ring, ethernet, etc) and similar networks. Note A port generally intended for connection of components of an ITE system under test (e.g. RS232, IEEE standard 1284 (parallel printer), USB, IEEE Std 1394 (fire wire) etc) and used in accordance with its functional specifications ( e.g. for the max. length of cable to be connected to it), is not considered to be a telecommunications/network port under this definition Regards, Kris This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: EN55022:1998 and telecom ports
hu...OK, what about RS-485 and RS-422 ports? Are they similar networks and therefore must be tested as a telecom port or are they dissimilar like RS232? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Pettit, Ghery [mailto:ghery.pet...@intel.com] Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2003 1:45 PM To: 'richwo...@tycoint.com'; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: EN55022:1998 and telecom ports Richard, Further clarification to this question was provided by the addition of the following note at the end of article 3.6 of CISPR 22:1997 as part of Amendment 2 which was published in October of last year. NOTE A port generally intended for interconnection of components of an ITE system under test (e.g. RS-232, IEEE Standard 1284 (parallel printer), Universal Serial Bus (USB), IEEE Standard 1394 (Fire Wire), etc.) and used in accordance with its functional specifications (e.g. for the maximum length of cable connected to it), is not considered to be a telecommunications/network port under this definition. I haven't seen an EN version of this amendment yet, but CENELEC should be coming with it one of these days. You can purchase a copy of the entire amendment, which adds information on multifunction equipment, from the IEC web page at http://www.iec.ch . Ghery Pettit Intel From: richwo...@tycoint.com [mailto:richwo...@tycoint.com] Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2003 10:32 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: EN55022:1998 and telecom ports EN55022:1998 defines telecommunication ports as Ports which are intended to be connected to telecommunications networks (e.g. public switched telecommunication networks, integrated services digital networks), local area networks (e.g. Ethernet, token ring) and similar networks. Since similar networks are included, it would seem that dissimilar networks are excluded. What distinguishes a similar network to a dissimilar network? What are some examples of dissimilar networks that are not included? Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org Archive is being moved, we will announce when it is back on-line. All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieeecommunities.org/emc-pstc
RE: EN61000-3-2/3 applicability
Sam, Section 5 of EN61000-3-2 lists examples of the environments and a partial listing include houses, shops, offices, cinemas, bars, and workshops. An industrial device that is intended to be used in both an industrial location (i.e., not from the public distribution grid) and in a cinema, for example, would have to comply with EN61000-3-2. Products intended solely for industrial locations and not powered from the public distribution grid (i.e. the grid that powers the listed locations above) do not have to comply with this standard. Richard Woods Sensormatic Electronics Tyco International From: Sam Wismer [mailto:swis...@acstestlab.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2003 2:43 PM To: EMC Forum Subject: EN61000-3-2/3 applicability The scope of these standards includes all equipment having an input current upto and including 16A per phase and intended to be connected to a public low-voltage distribution systems of between 220V and 250V at 50Hz line to neutral. Does public infer that only consumer goods that use residential service are obligated to these standards or are industrial products used in industrial locations that meet the electrical specifications as identified above also obligated to these standards? Kind Regards, Sam Wismer Engineering Manager ACS, Inc. *Tel: (770) 831-8048 *Fax: (770) 831-8598 *Web: http://www.acstestlab.com www.acstestlab.com mailto:*swis...@acstestlab.com *swis...@acstestlab.com
