Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit Gui

[TJoseph Powderly]

in honor of the incredible Amiga Video Toaster by Charles
http://mikesubuntu.com/2010/06/flying-toasters-screensaver-in-latest-ubuntu/
:)
TomP


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Re: [Emc-users] More stepgens with BeagleBone

[Jon Elson]

On 01/26/2014 02:04 PM, Andrew wrote:
>
> Standard X rules apply, since it's a standard X program.  Select via
> left button.  Insert via  or the middle mouse button if
> you have one (my mice don't and the click both left-and-right for middle
> doesn't seem to be working).
>
>
That's called "chord" and is an option you need to enable in
the pointer options menu.  Or, at least it USED to be there,
no idea where it has been moved.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Encoder Index Support Survey

[Jon Elson]

On 01/26/2014 11:54 AM, Charles Steinkuehler wrote:
> I'm working on adding software encoder support to the BeagleBone PRU
> code.  Counting up/down is easy, but I'm wondering how to deal with the
> index pulses.  Both the Mesa VHDL code and the existing software encoder
> component have quite a variety of options, and I'm wondering if it is
> necessary to support them all (more options = longer code = lower
> operating frequency).
>
> If you use encoders on your machine, what options do you have set for
> the HAL component, and (if you know) what is the maximum pulse frequency
> for your machine?
>
>
Well, I only use hardware encoders, and the minimill has 4:1 
belt
reduction, 16 TPI screws and 500 cycle/rev encoders, so that
is 128000 counts/inch.  At 60 IPM, that is 128,000 
counts/second.
That is a pretty extreme case.

The problem with the index is it is noise sensitive, and 
unless you
put a totally arbitrary delay on it, you can't do much to filter
out noise on that channel.  (I don't know if you are going to
have any filtering on the quadrature, either.)

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit Gui

[Mark Tucker]

I have one of them and swear down by it in mach3.
Excellent when the machine is along the other end of the table on my router.
Again it would be nice to get that working with the Gui.
There is some stuff in the wiki but i would think it has to be tied in 
to the gui but i am sure john will let us know.

On 26/01/14 21:42, Charles Steinkuehler wrote:
> On 1/26/2014 2:46 PM, John Prentice (FS) wrote:
>>> With your updates, do you still see the keyboard lag, or does reducing the
>> load from gremlin help this issue?
>>
>> With slow refresh on Gremlin my keyboard jog response is fine. I don't
>> however know if my GUI has jog problems with the default 50mS refresh as I
>> do all my actual jogging with the Contour Jog/Shuttle
>>
>> http://www.tormach.com/store/index.php?app=ecom&ns=prodshow&ref=30616
>>
>> It is configured with a geometric speed law on the spring-loaded ring. You
>> can jog at full rapid speed slowing to a crawl allowing touch-off to a
>> "tenth" very quickly and safely compared with an MPG or keyboard.
> Nice unit...I forgot about those.  Do you have configs available to get
> it working with LinuxCNC or does it "Just Work"?  It's not clear from
> the product page if I can just buy one and use it with a generic
> LinuxCNC install, or if it only works with Tormach machines.
>
> I have access to some similar control panels (jog-shuttle with T-Bar and
> a bunch of buttonsdid I mention my day job is HD video editing
> equipment?) and it might make for a pretty nifty control:
>
> http://www.newtek.com/component/content/article/15-3-play/3play/177-3play-control-surface.html
>
> Pretty expensive unless you get engineering prototypes free from work,
> however!
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Crayon Lathe

[Bertho Stultiens]

On 01/26/2014 11:59 PM, Charles Steinkuehler wrote:
> Anyone got kids or grandkids?
> My next CNC conversion project for the BeagleBone:
> http://hackaday.com/2014/01/26/littlebits-little-lathe/

Better develop motorized gloves first them and an arm's length tool-changer.

With the spindle's speed, you might need to invest in a
forward-time-machine too.


-- 
Greetings Bertho

(disclaimers are disclaimed)

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Re: [Emc-users] Crayon Lathe

[Marcus Bowman]

I like the idea of different coloured work. The Health and Safety guys will 
have a field day with all those sharp hand held tools, but the kids will have 
fun.

Regards,

Marcus


On 26 Jan 2014, at 22:59, Charles Steinkuehler wrote:

> Anyone got kids or grandkids?
> 
> My next CNC conversion project for the BeagleBone:
> 
> http://hackaday.com/2014/01/26/littlebits-little-lathe/
> 
> :)
> 
> -- 
> Charles Steinkuehler
> char...@steinkuehler.net
> 
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[Emc-users] Crayon Lathe

[Charles Steinkuehler]

Anyone got kids or grandkids?

My next CNC conversion project for the BeagleBone:

http://hackaday.com/2014/01/26/littlebits-little-lathe/

:)

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char...@steinkuehler.net



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Re: [Emc-users] Conversion Suggesions?

[Gregg Eshelman]

On 1/26/2014 10:20 AM, Jon Elson wrote:
> I just don't worry about this "idiot" problem.  If you've
> seen the picture of the $600 million NOAA weather
> satellite that fell over and got smashed in 2003, I
> just know that no matter HOW stupid a mistake I
> ever make, it will NEVER come close to that one!
> It cost Lockheed $150 million to fix, and the government
> paid the rest.
>
> (If you haven't seen it, just Google NOAA-19.)

A case of someone borrowing bolts and failing to leave a note saying 
"Yo! We borrowed the bolts holding this bird to the table. Might wanna 
bolt it down before you try tilting it! Tell the boss to buy another set 
of these bolts, k?"


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Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit Gui

[Charles Steinkuehler]

On 1/26/2014 2:46 PM, John Prentice (FS) wrote:
> 
>> With your updates, do you still see the keyboard lag, or does reducing the
> load from gremlin help this issue?
> 
> With slow refresh on Gremlin my keyboard jog response is fine. I don't
> however know if my GUI has jog problems with the default 50mS refresh as I
> do all my actual jogging with the Contour Jog/Shuttle
> 
> http://www.tormach.com/store/index.php?app=ecom&ns=prodshow&ref=30616
> 
> It is configured with a geometric speed law on the spring-loaded ring. You
> can jog at full rapid speed slowing to a crawl allowing touch-off to a
> "tenth" very quickly and safely compared with an MPG or keyboard.

Nice unit...I forgot about those.  Do you have configs available to get
it working with LinuxCNC or does it "Just Work"?  It's not clear from
the product page if I can just buy one and use it with a generic
LinuxCNC install, or if it only works with Tormach machines.

I have access to some similar control panels (jog-shuttle with T-Bar and
a bunch of buttonsdid I mention my day job is HD video editing
equipment?) and it might make for a pretty nifty control:

http://www.newtek.com/component/content/article/15-3-play/3play/177-3play-control-surface.html

Pretty expensive unless you get engineering prototypes free from work,
however!

-- 
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char...@steinkuehler.net



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[Emc-users] New trajectory planner - testers wanted.

[sam sokolik]

This is an extension of the 'slow gcode' thread.  The work that Robert 
has done on the TP are now in the beta stage.  (has been for a little 
while - but I forgot to post anything about it on the user list.. :( )

I think the best way forward is to look at the thread on the forum and 
follow the directions to build it.  (if you are wanting to test the new TP)

http://www.linuxcnc.org/index.php/english/forum/10-advanced-configuration/27368-new-trajectory-planner-testersprograms-wanted

currently the new TP improves the path velocity (by read ahead) if the 
segments are

Line-line
Tangent line-arc
Tangent arc-arc

Here are a couple screenshots..  This is showing a simple program (one 
rogge had posted a while back with an entry/exit move )

%
(1" square with rounded corners)
G90 G54 G20
g64p.001q.001
G0 X0 Y.25 Z.25
z0
G1 Y.75 F999
G2 X.25 Y1 I.25
G1 X.75
G2 X1 Y.75 J-.25
G1 Y.25
G2 X.75 Y0 I-.25
G1 X.25
G2 X0 Y.25 J.25
g0z.25
M30

http://electronicsam.com/images/KandT/testing/screenshots/Screenshot%20from%202014-01-26%2014:53:00.png

This is running new TP strait G64 - peaks at 222ipm
http://electronicsam.com/images/KandT/testing/screenshots/Screenshot%20from%202014-01-26%2014:34:21.png

Old TP running strait G64 - peaks at 159ipm
http://electronicsam.com/images/KandT/testing/screenshots/Screenshot%20from%202014-01-26%2014:36:20.png

This is the new TP running G64P.001Q.001 Still peaks at 222ipm - just 
slows a bit at the sharp corners.
http://electronicsam.com/images/KandT/testing/screenshots/Screenshot%20from%202014-01-26%2014:42:11.png

Old TP running G64P.001Q.001 - slows down a lot more..  (I think mainly 
because the parabolic blend needs to be slowed down quite a bit compared 
to the circular blend to match the path)
http://electronicsam.com/images/KandT/testing/screenshots/Screenshot%20from%202014-01-26%2014:40:36.png

Thanks all goes to Robert - he has coded this all on his own.. (again - 
impressive)

sam


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Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit Gui

[Philipp Burch]

Hi John!

On 01/26/2014 09:46 PM, John Prentice (FS) wrote:
> [...]
> With slow refresh on Gremlin my keyboard jog response is fine. I don't
> however know if my GUI has jog problems with the default 50mS refresh as I
> do all my actual jogging with the Contour Jog/Shuttle
> 
> http://www.tormach.com/store/index.php?app=ecom&ns=prodshow&ref=30616
> 
> It is configured with a geometric speed law on the spring-loaded ring. You
> can jog at full rapid speed slowing to a crawl allowing touch-off to a
> "tenth" very quickly and safely compared with an MPG or keyboard.
> [...]

Hey, thanks for this link! I'm currently controlling a machine just with
the keyboard, which is a bit annoying. I've thought of hooking up a
joystick for easier positioning, but such a thingy could be even handier.

Regards,
Philipp

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Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit Gui

[John Prentice (FS)]

-Original Message-
From: Charles Steinkuehler [mailto:char...@steinkuehler.net] 
Sent: 26 January 2014 13:01

>One comment I'll add is the gremlin back-plot display seems to interact
with the X-Server and add significant lag to keyboard jogging (at 
> least the way it's setup by default).  Switching away from gremlin (ie:
the DRO tab in Axis) restores the keyboard's normal response when
>  jogging.

>With your updates, do you still see the keyboard lag, or does reducing the
load from gremlin help this issue?

With slow refresh on Gremlin my keyboard jog response is fine. I don't
however know if my GUI has jog problems with the default 50mS refresh as I
do all my actual jogging with the Contour Jog/Shuttle

http://www.tormach.com/store/index.php?app=ecom&ns=prodshow&ref=30616

It is configured with a geometric speed law on the spring-loaded ring. You
can jog at full rapid speed slowing to a crawl allowing touch-off to a
"tenth" very quickly and safely compared with an MPG or keyboard.

I will edit Gremlin and give keyboard control a try tomorrow.

Best wishes

John Prentice



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Re: [Emc-users] Encoder Index Support Survey

[John Prentice (FS)]

Greetings

I am very happy with Peter's comments on the handling of Index and polarity.

On frequency, my calcs. are like this:

Lathe: Spindle speed up to 3500 RPM. Threading and tapping will be slower
than this but very handy to have actual spindle speed display of whole
range. Encoder at 500 lines (gives 0.18 deg resolution) and easily sourced.
A/B pulse train 29.2 kHz though on some encoders Index can be very narrow.
In this case, if one does need it, a hardware latch with control by A/B
would not be hard.

Mill: Potential spindle speed 12,000 RPM. With 500 line encoder = 100 kHz so
probably necessary to limit display of actual speed or use 100 line encoder
with a software quadrature decoder.

I would like to have a driver that presents the data from the one hardware
decoder that is visible on the 'bone headers. That would easily do very high
speed spindles.

100 line MPG is a walk-in-the-park but nevertheless will be very useful.

Best wishes

John Prentice

-Original Message-
From: Charles Steinkuehler [mailto:char...@steinkuehler.net] 
Sent: 26 January 2014 17:54
To: EMC2-Users-List
Subject: [Emc-users] Encoder Index Support Survey

I'm working on adding software encoder support to the BeagleBone PRU code.
Counting up/down is easy, but I'm wondering how to deal with the index
pulses.  Both the Mesa VHDL code and the existing software encoder component
have quite a variety of options, and I'm wondering if it is necessary to
support them all (more options = longer code = lower operating frequency).

If you use encoders on your machine, what options do you have set for the
HAL component, and (if you know) what is the maximum pulse frequency for
your machine?

--
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char...@steinkuehler.net



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Re: [Emc-users] More stepgens with BeagleBone

[Andrew]

-01-26 Charles Steinkuehler 

> It's just a plain xterm...no need to go calling it names!  ;-)
>
> Standard X rules apply, since it's a standard X program.  Select via
> left button.  Insert via  or the middle mouse button if
> you have one (my mice don't and the click both left-and-right for middle
> doesn't seem to be working).
>
> You can also use <(left|right)-click> to bring up some
> configuration options for the xterm.  I need to do this on some of my
> smaller screens to get text big enough for my old eyes to read.
>

That's incredible, Charles!
I'm no LInux guy, so it's a revelation. Thanks!
It also copies to a text editor with mouse clicks... X magic :)

Andrew
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Re: [Emc-users] Encoder Index Support Survey

[Gene Heskett]

On Sunday 26 January 2014 13:14:29 Charles Steinkuehler did opine:

> I'm working on adding software encoder support to the BeagleBone PRU
> code.  Counting up/down is easy, but I'm wondering how to deal with the
> index pulses.  Both the Mesa VHDL code and the existing software encoder
> component have quite a variety of options, and I'm wondering if it is
> necessary to support them all (more options = longer code = lower
> operating frequency).
> 
> If you use encoders on your machine, what options do you have set for
> the HAL component, and (if you know) what is the maximum pulse frequency
> for your machine?

I do, but not on a BB yet. I am using a 50 slot optical disc, A/B/X, with 
ATM about a 2000 rpm max spindle speed.  With the older motor & gearing it 
was 2500 revs tops and still had considerable headroom.

Currently that calculates to 150 microseconds per slot edge, with a 23 u-
sec base thread.  So my sample rates theoretically have a more than 
sufficient time to do their work.

Where 100x or more accurate knowledge would be required to move a joint 
precisely than the 2.4 degrees I get, and the number of joints to track is 
some multiple of 3, or even 9, I can easily see a missed count situation 
arising since my safety factor for one, the spindle, is only 6. But at more 
normal, say 600 rpm turning speeds, there isn't any excuse to miss a count, 
ever.  That data then could be used to infer the maximum velocity that a 
joint could be expected to move w/o errors in tracking it in real time.

In the case of the BBB, maybe its time to set an output pin true as the 
encoder module is entered, and clear it before that final return, and 
develop some timing information that would give us a better handle on our 
estimates of just how much processing time is actually used by hal out of 
each base-thread incarnation, ditto the TP and servo-thread?  That 
information would certainly be enlightening.  Even just having hal set the 
flag pin going in, and clearing it when it falls back to idle, which I have 
to assume in some cases won't be a spin in place, but to finish an 
unfinished servo or TP thread incarnation.  The hal method would be far 
simpler, and by tossing a # in front of a modules addf, an individual 
modules execution time can be deduced.  Its more complex than that of 
course in terms of editing the hal file, but still something that needs to 
be done.  We might find that the BBB really doesn't have the computational 
iron to do the job.  While I'm happier than that famous pig with my pair of 
atoms, I have also found that it does have some real limits in an all 
software situation.

Where there are multiple joints per axis, that strikes me as a very strong 
argument in favor of hardware solutions that are hopefully 100 to 1000x 
faster than software unless call a surveyor to set stakes speeds are usable 
for that job.  Since the machine needs to bill at a profit to justify even 
bidding on the job, I cannot imagine a situation where those limited speeds 
would be justifiable.  Either build state of the art, or stay home like I 
do.

Cheers, Gene
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Re: [Emc-users] More stepgens with BeagleBone

[Charles Steinkuehler]

On 1/26/2014 12:39 PM, Andrew wrote:
> 2014-01-26 Viesturs Lācis
> https://mail.google.com/mail/u/0/?view=cm&fs=1&tf=1&to=viesturs.la...@gmail.com>
> 
>> In terminal it should be ctrl+shift+c and ctrl+shift+v or shift+insert
> 
> Hi Viesturs! Thanks, but it won't work in Machinekit. It has some nasty
> terminal, I could not find a combination...

It's just a plain xterm...no need to go calling it names!  ;-)

Standard X rules apply, since it's a standard X program.  Select via
left button.  Insert via  or the middle mouse button if
you have one (my mice don't and the click both left-and-right for middle
doesn't seem to be working).

You can also use <(left|right)-click> to bring up some
configuration options for the xterm.  I need to do this on some of my
smaller screens to get text big enough for my old eyes to read.

-- 
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Re: [Emc-users] More stepgens with BeagleBone

[Charles Steinkuehler]

On 1/26/2014 12:29 PM, Andrew wrote:
> 2014-01-26 Charles Steinkuehler 
> 
>> The combined ubc3-joints_axes4 branch is relatively untested.  Can you
>> try using the latest ubc3 branch and see if it behaves any better?
>>
>> I used the same branch and config with the prevoius Machinekit 09-02 and
> it was better, I even managed to shoot a video :)
> But I'll try ubc3 too. I just have to convert my config from ja4 to normal.
> BTW what branch is pre-installed on Machinekit?

It's the MachineKit branch, which is a snapshot of UBC3 that I have
verified actually works.  The branch doesn't get updated often
(generally, only when I'm making new images), so if you want to track
development, you should use UBC3, typically from Michael Haberler's
github repository.

> I also have a few questions regarding Machinekit:
> 1. How do I copy/paste from terminal window?
> 2. Is auto-login possible?

Yes, but I'm not 100% sure how.  I'm a command-line guy, and the fact
that the GUI comes up at all on the BeagleBone is mostly a testament to
the Debian developers and the LinuxCNC crew.  :)

>  3. Pre-installed text editor would be useful. I installed scite, there are
> probably better options.

If it makes you feel any better, I didn't install vim by default and
curse the system every time I start with a new image, go to edit a file,
and find half the key commands I'm used to don't do the right thing!

I have mostly tried to make the pre-built image the minimal required to
actually get LinuxCNC running, but yes, a text editor would be a good
addition.  I'm open to suggestions for a light-weight editor, or I could
just confuse all the new users and install gvim!  :)

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Re: [Emc-users] More stepgens with BeagleBone

[Andrew]

2014-01-26 Viesturs Lācis
https://mail.google.com/mail/u/0/?view=cm&fs=1&tf=1&to=viesturs.la...@gmail.com>
>

> In terminal it should be ctrl+shift+c and ctrl+shift+v or shift+insert
>

Hi Viesturs! Thanks, but it won't work in Machinekit. It has some nasty
terminal, I could not find a combination...

Andrew
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Re: [Emc-users] Conversion Suggesions?

[John Alexander Stewart]

REN NOAA-19.

Neat. The building behind mine @work tests space vehicles, and, for some
of the testing people can not be in the same room, in case of bits flying
off (e.g., program the linear accelerator to simulate an Airiane 5 launch,
and see what happens to the satellite.

Don't think they've dropped anything by accident, but there's always a
first time, I'd guess.

Have not been through in years, but an interesting place to visit, for sure!

John.
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Re: [Emc-users] More stepgens with BeagleBone

[Viesturs Lācis]

2014-01-26 Andrew 

> 1. How do I copy/paste from terminal window?


In terminal it should be ctrl+shift+c and ctrl+shift+v or shift+insert

Viesturs
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Re: [Emc-users] More stepgens with BeagleBone

[Andrew]

2014-01-26 Charles Steinkuehler 

> The combined ubc3-joints_axes4 branch is relatively untested.  Can you
> try using the latest ubc3 branch and see if it behaves any better?
>
> I used the same branch and config with the prevoius Machinekit 09-02 and
it was better, I even managed to shoot a video :)
But I'll try ubc3 too. I just have to convert my config from ja4 to normal.
BTW what branch is pre-installed on Machinekit?


> If things don't work better with UBC3, you may be running out of
> resources.  If you're using axis, please switch to the DRO tab
> immediately after power-on, and do not go back to the gremlin back-plot
> display.
>

I did that. Otherwise the machine is not quite responsive in world mode.


> You might also try dramatically lowering the thread rate to
> see if that's the problem.
>

I did that too. Servo period is 2ms, cycle_time is 0.020s. I'll try larger
values.

I also have a few questions regarding Machinekit:
1. How do I copy/paste from terminal window?
2. Is auto-login possible?
 3. Pre-installed text editor would be useful. I installed scite, there are
probably better options.

Thanks,
Andrew
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Re: [Emc-users] LCNC performance recorder?

[andy pugh]

On 25 January 2014 00:15, Greg Bentzinger  wrote:

> Goal – to be able to hook into an existing working CNC machine and monitor 
> encoder counts, spindle functions etc. so as to be able to record and analyze 
> the machine performance and characteristics so that a LCNC integrator has a 
> known good working baseline so that he can duplicate the original OEM 
> manufactures performance.

This seems like something that could be relatively easily set up with
just HAL, and with the output going to halsampler / halstreamer (or
could be monitored on Halscope).

-- 
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Re: [Emc-users] Encoder Index Support Survey

[Charles Steinkuehler]

On 1/26/2014 12:11 PM, Peter C. Wallace wrote:
> 
> I would simplify the index logic to this:
> 
> Always latch the current count on index (probably rising) edge
> and provide the latched count to the driver. Have a (clearable) bit
> that indicates the index was latched.

Thanks!  That makes sense and really helps.



> main things missing:
> 
> index polarity, AB gating of index, input filtering

I can do signal polarity for all encoder inputs in one XOR instruction,
so I'll have that.  I was thinking of adding input filtering, since I am
hopeful that I can get the encoder software taking less than 1 uS per
loop, and I think I can implement it with a few instructions per signal
(10-20 nS extra per bit) and have minimal overhead when disabled.

The AB gating logic is out, if you don't think it's required.  That
makes things a *LOT* easier.  :)

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Re: [Emc-users] Conversion Suggesions?

[Gene Heskett]

On Sunday 26 January 2014 13:05:06 Jon Elson did opine:

> I just don't worry about this "idiot" problem.  If you've
> seen the picture of the $600 million NOAA weather
> satellite that fell over and got smashed in 2003, I
> just know that no matter HOW stupid a mistake I
> ever make, it will NEVER come close to that one!
> It cost Lockheed $150 million to fix, and the government
> paid the rest.

It cost Lockheed $150 million to fix, but the taxpayers paid the rest.
There, I fixed it for you. :)
 
> (If you haven't seen it, just Google NOAA-19.)
> 
> Jon
> 
> 
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> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users


Cheers, Gene
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Re: [Emc-users] Encoder Index Support Survey

[Peter C. Wallace]

On Sun, 26 Jan 2014, Charles Steinkuehler wrote:

> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2014 11:54:24 -0600
> From: Charles Steinkuehler 
> Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
> 
> To: EMC2-Users-List 
> Subject: [Emc-users] Encoder Index Support Survey
> 
> I'm working on adding software encoder support to the BeagleBone PRU
> code.  Counting up/down is easy, but I'm wondering how to deal with the
> index pulses.  Both the Mesa VHDL code and the existing software encoder
> component have quite a variety of options, and I'm wondering if it is
> necessary to support them all (more options = longer code = lower
> operating frequency).
>
> If you use encoders on your machine, what options do you have set for
> the HAL component, and (if you know) what is the maximum pulse frequency
> for your machine?
>
> -- 
> Charles Steinkuehler
> char...@steinkuehler.net
>
>

I would simplify the index logic to this:

Always latch the current count on index (probably rising) edge
and provide the latched count to the driver. Have a (clearable) bit
that indicates the index was latched.

The rest can be handled in the driver


notes:

You really never want clear-on-index as this borks velocity 
estimation.

Always latching the encoder on index provides a nice way to sanity check
the encoder counting (if abs (delta_latched_counts - counts/turn) >2 or so 
>>> badd)
.

main things missing:

index polarity, AB gating of index, input filtering


Peter Wallace
Mesa Electronics

(\__/)
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(")_(") signature to help him gain world domination.


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Re: [Emc-users] More stepgens with BeagleBone

[Charles Steinkuehler]

On 1/26/2014 11:52 AM, Andrew wrote:
> 2014-01-26 Andrew 
> 
>> I recently upgraded to Machinekit 12-28 and installed ubc3-joints_axes4.
>> The very first start of hexapod config caused severe crash. I moved joints
>> then switched to world mode and back, moved some joint again and in just
>> could not stop. LCNC froze, then the screen went black. I had to reset the
>> power.
>> I have to check my PSU but I don't expect it to solve a problem.
> 
> I replaced the PSU and tried again. The same problem. Jerky moves in joint
> or world mode then "14: Unexpected realtime delay on RT thread 1". The next
> joint move just did not stop, I saw "EMCMOT did not respond" (or something)
> and the BBB froze to a blank screen.
> Now the whole thing is just not usable.

The combined ubc3-joints_axes4 branch is relatively untested.  Can you
try using the latest ubc3 branch and see if it behaves any better?

If things don't work better with UBC3, you may be running out of
resources.  If you're using axis, please switch to the DRO tab
immediately after power-on, and do not go back to the gremlin back-plot
display.  You might also try dramatically lowering the thread rate to
see if that's the problem.

-- 
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[Emc-users] Encoder Index Support Survey

[Charles Steinkuehler]

I'm working on adding software encoder support to the BeagleBone PRU
code.  Counting up/down is easy, but I'm wondering how to deal with the
index pulses.  Both the Mesa VHDL code and the existing software encoder
component have quite a variety of options, and I'm wondering if it is
necessary to support them all (more options = longer code = lower
operating frequency).

If you use encoders on your machine, what options do you have set for
the HAL component, and (if you know) what is the maximum pulse frequency
for your machine?

-- 
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Re: [Emc-users] More stepgens with BeagleBone

[Andrew]

2014-01-26 Andrew 

> I recently upgraded to Machinekit 12-28 and installed ubc3-joints_axes4.
> The very first start of hexapod config caused severe crash. I moved joints
> then switched to world mode and back, moved some joint again and in just
> could not stop. LCNC froze, then the screen went black. I had to reset the
> power.
> I have to check my PSU but I don't expect it to solve a problem.
>

I replaced the PSU and tried again. The same problem. Jerky moves in joint
or world mode then "14: Unexpected realtime delay on RT thread 1". The next
joint move just did not stop, I saw "EMCMOT did not respond" (or something)
and the BBB froze to a blank screen.
Now the whole thing is just not usable.

Andrew
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Re: [Emc-users] Conversion Suggesions?

[Jon Elson]

I just don't worry about this "idiot" problem.  If you've
seen the picture of the $600 million NOAA weather
satellite that fell over and got smashed in 2003, I
just know that no matter HOW stupid a mistake I
ever make, it will NEVER come close to that one!
It cost Lockheed $150 million to fix, and the government
paid the rest.

(If you haven't seen it, just Google NOAA-19.)

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] More stepgens with BeagleBone

[Andrew]

2013-12-29 Charles Steinkuehler 

> On 12/29/2013 1:22 PM, Andrew wrote:> The whole control is not quite
> stable, it freezes time by time. And
> > something's wrong with the axes limits, I have to figure it out yet.
>
> What happens when it freezes?  Are there any error messages on the
> serial console port?
>
> Older BeagleBone kernels had an mmc bug that would cause a hung-task
> timeout and then the system would pretty much halt (since the root
> filesystem is on the MMC which can't be read from anymore).  If this is
> the problem you're having, it should be fixed in the -bone28 and newer
> kernels.  I also just released a new image that uses the latest -bone33
> kernel if you need to upgrade.
>

I recently upgraded to Machinekit 12-28 and installed ubc3-joints_axes4.
The very first start of hexapod config caused severe crash. I moved joints
then switched to world mode and back, moved some joint again and in just
could not stop. LCNC froze, then the screen went black. I had to reset the
power.
I have to check my PSU but I don't expect it to solve a problem.

Andrew
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Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit Gui

[Charles Steinkuehler]

On 1/26/2014 9:05 AM, Chris Morley wrote:
> 
>> I know charles is wanting a 3d printer gui,but i would like to alter it 
>> for milling etc,so it should be easy to remove the extra 3d printer 
>> stuff like heated beds etc.
> 
> Since it is so easy to create skins for Gscreen I would create one 
> specifically
> for 3d printers, the Gaxis  skin is just an easy starting point for testing / 
> basing.
> In fact Gaxis is for milling type machines right now. If you are ambitious 
> you can
> create your very own skin using Gscreen - Norbert created Gmoccapy as a skin.

When I started with LinuxCNC on the BeagleBone I was very excited about
the ease of creating custom gscreen skins, but got discouraged by the
high CPU usage and the fact that the gscreen sim configurations I tried
were mostly broken on the BeagleBone.

With the CPU usage reduced dramatically and several examples working as
expected on the BeagleBone, this now looks like a good way to go.

...I'd still prefer someone more artistically inclined than myself
actually do the GUI design.  Otherwise you probably won't be able to
distinguish it from tkemc!  :)

If left to me, I'll probably wind up mostly copying one of the existing
serial control programs designed to talk to the AVR controllers (ie:
Pronterface, repetier host, etc).

-- 
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Re: [Emc-users] Conversion Suggesions?

[Mark Wendt]

On Sun, Jan 26, 2014 at 10:16 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:

> > >
> > > And I'm glad, otherwise we'd be insufferable. ;-)
> > >
> > > Cheers, Gene
> >
> > I resemble that remark.  ;-)
> >
> > Mark
>
> And that is something I wouldn't ever refer to you as being.  Myself now,
> thats a different horse...
>
>
> Cheers, Gene
>

No worries Gene.  My wife tells me that all the time.  ;-)

Mark
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Re: [Emc-users] Conversion Suggesions?

[Gene Heskett]

On Sunday 26 January 2014 10:13:19 Mark Wendt did opine:

> On Sun, Jan 26, 2014 at 9:50 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> > > And we're always good company.  Humor-wise anyway.  ;-)
> > > 
> > > Mark
> > 
> > And I'm glad, otherwise we'd be insufferable. ;-)
> > 
> > Cheers, Gene
> 
> I resemble that remark.  ;-)
> 
> Mark

And that is something I wouldn't ever refer to you as being.  Myself now, 
thats a different horse...


Cheers, Gene
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Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit Gui

[Chris Morley]

> Charles/Chris
> 
> How long before these changes with gscreen are merged with the 
> machinekit git repo?
> Or how do i pull the changes from master into machinekit?
> I have done the git pull from master on my developer desktop and the sim 
> works great,now just try and get it into machinekit.

while in a branch of machinekit enter: git merge master
whether it merges cleanly I don't know, but probably.
machine kit is based on UB3 and master is regularly merged into UB3.
So merging UB3 into machinekit may be all you need.

> I also did a git pull in machinekit but could not see any gscreen 
> changes yet.
> I know charles is wanting a 3d printer gui,but i would like to alter it 
> for milling etc,so it should be easy to remove the extra 3d printer 
> stuff like heated beds etc.

Since it is so easy to create skins for Gscreen I would create one specifically
for 3d printers, the Gaxis  skin is just an easy starting point for testing / 
basing.
In fact Gaxis is for milling type machines right now. If you are ambitious you 
can
create your very own skin using Gscreen - Norbert created Gmoccapy as a skin.


Chris M

  
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Re: [Emc-users] Conversion Suggesions?

[Mark Wendt]

On Sun, Jan 26, 2014 at 9:50 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:

>
> >
> > And we're always good company.  Humor-wise anyway.  ;-)
> >
> > Mark
>
> And I'm glad, otherwise we'd be insufferable. ;-)
>
> Cheers, Gene
>


I resemble that remark.  ;-)

Mark
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Re: [Emc-users] Conversion Suggesions?

[Gene Heskett]

On Sunday 26 January 2014 09:31:10 Mark Wendt did opine:

> On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 12:53 PM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> > > Gene,
> > > 
> > > Hie thee to this divine web site, and look under Lead Screws, then
> > > PS style lead screws and PS style nuts.  I've got one of these on
> > > my Z axis on my CNC saw beveler.  The screws are some kind of
> > > modified acme, teflon coated.  They're anti-backlash PS style nut
> > > is pretty much indestructible, and thankfully for me, idiot proof.
> > > 
> > > http://www.pic-design.com/
> > > 
> > > Mark
> > 
> > Looks neat although the spec'd accuracy is .003" at best.  I grabbed
> > the whole catalog.pdf for perusal when I am ready.  I think some back
> > repairs will happen first however.  I like the idiot proof comment,
> > cuz I'm the idiot that will test it. :)
> > 
> > Cheers, Gene
> 
> Gene,
> 
> No worries.  The idiot has already tested it.  ;-)

Good to know I have company. ;-)
 
> Mark
> 
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Cheers, Gene
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Re: [Emc-users] Conversion Suggesions?

[Gene Heskett]

On Sunday 26 January 2014 09:48:44 Mark Wendt did opine:

> On Sun, Jan 26, 2014 at 9:32 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> > On Sunday 26 January 2014 09:31:48 Mark Wendt did opine:
> > > On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 12:53 PM, Gene Heskett 
> > 
> > wrote:
> > > > > Gene,
> > > > > 
> > > > > Hie thee to this divine web site, and look under Lead Screws,
> > > > > then PS style lead screws and PS style nuts.  I've got one of
> > > > > these on my Z axis on my CNC saw beveler.  The screws are some
> > > > > kind of modified acme, teflon coated.  They're anti-backlash PS
> > > > > style nut is pretty much indestructible, and thankfully for me,
> > > > > idiot proof.
> > > > > 
> > > > > http://www.pic-design.com/
> > > > > 
> > > > > Mark
> > > > 
> > > > Looks neat although the spec'd accuracy is .003" at best.  I
> > > > grabbed the whole catalog.pdf for perusal when I am ready.  I
> > > > think some back repairs will happen first however.  I like the
> > > > idiot proof comment, cuz I'm the idiot that will test it. :)
> > > > 
> > > > Cheers, Gene
> > > 
> > > Gene,
> > > 
> > > No worries.  The idiot has already tested it.  ;-)
> > > 
> > > Mark
> > 
> > Good to know, us idiots like company. ;-)
> 
> And we're always good company.  Humor-wise anyway.  ;-)
> 
> Mark

And I'm glad, otherwise we'd be insufferable. ;-)

Cheers, Gene
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
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Genes Web page 

NOTICE: Will pay 100 USD for an HP-4815A defective but
complete probe assembly.

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of functions performed by private citizens.
-- Alexis de Tocqueville
A pen in the hand of this president is far more
dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of
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Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit Gui

[Chris Morley]

> 
> (a) Gremlin needs lots of CPU - I don't know whether it is screen rendering
> without the hardware accelerators that is the culprit.
> 

Gremlin's update rate is set at 50ms which is quite high.
I once set it to 100 the plot was only a little more jerky.
(I use software rendering on my laptop.)
maybe we should make it configurable.

> 
> (e) The GUI is surprisingly useable at very low rates of updating the
> toolpath, G code and even axis DROs. 1 second is OK. This makes significant
> average CPU savings. The this low rate is tested when running a real
> machine. The audio/visual feedback from the hardware makes the system feel
> snappy even though the screen is lagging. Tests with no machine are
> misleading.
>

In Gscreen you can set the update rate from the INI
[DISPLAY]
CYCLE_TIME = 100
100 is the default update rate

> A BBB ought to be plenty powerful enough. Perhaps the proper GPU graphics
> will fix things. It would be nice to design an experiment to dummy out the
> graphics work that could be done by hardware or to verify in some other way
> that there are not other bottlenecks.
 
graphics acceleration surely would help a lot.

Cheers
Chris M
  
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Re: [Emc-users] Conversion Suggesions?

[Mark Wendt]

On Sun, Jan 26, 2014 at 9:32 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Sunday 26 January 2014 09:31:48 Mark Wendt did opine:
>
> > On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 12:53 PM, Gene Heskett 
> wrote:
> > > > Gene,
> > > >
> > > > Hie thee to this divine web site, and look under Lead Screws, then
> > > > PS style lead screws and PS style nuts.  I've got one of these on
> > > > my Z axis on my CNC saw beveler.  The screws are some kind of
> > > > modified acme, teflon coated.  They're anti-backlash PS style nut
> > > > is pretty much indestructible, and thankfully for me, idiot proof.
> > > >
> > > > http://www.pic-design.com/
> > > >
> > > > Mark
> > >
> > > Looks neat although the spec'd accuracy is .003" at best.  I grabbed
> > > the whole catalog.pdf for perusal when I am ready.  I think some back
> > > repairs will happen first however.  I like the idiot proof comment,
> > > cuz I'm the idiot that will test it. :)
> > >
> > > Cheers, Gene
> >
> > Gene,
> >
> > No worries.  The idiot has already tested it.  ;-)
> >
> > Mark
>
> Good to know, us idiots like company. ;-)
>

And we're always good company.  Humor-wise anyway.  ;-)

Mark
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Re: [Emc-users] Conversion Suggesions?

[Gene Heskett]

On Sunday 26 January 2014 09:31:48 Mark Wendt did opine:

> On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 12:53 PM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> > > Gene,
> > > 
> > > Hie thee to this divine web site, and look under Lead Screws, then
> > > PS style lead screws and PS style nuts.  I've got one of these on
> > > my Z axis on my CNC saw beveler.  The screws are some kind of
> > > modified acme, teflon coated.  They're anti-backlash PS style nut
> > > is pretty much indestructible, and thankfully for me, idiot proof.
> > > 
> > > http://www.pic-design.com/
> > > 
> > > Mark
> > 
> > Looks neat although the spec'd accuracy is .003" at best.  I grabbed
> > the whole catalog.pdf for perusal when I am ready.  I think some back
> > repairs will happen first however.  I like the idiot proof comment,
> > cuz I'm the idiot that will test it. :)
> > 
> > Cheers, Gene
> 
> Gene,
> 
> No worries.  The idiot has already tested it.  ;-)
> 
> Mark

Good to know, us idiots like company. ;-)

> 
> -- CenturyLink Cloud: The Leader in Enterprise Cloud Services.
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Cheers, Gene
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

NOTICE: Will pay 100 USD for an HP-4815A defective but
complete probe assembly.

Nick the Greek's Law of Life:
All things considered, life is 9 to 5 against.
A pen in the hand of this president is far more
dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of
 law-abiding citizens.

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Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit Gui

[Charles Steinkuehler]

On 1/26/2014 6:23 AM, John Prentice (FS) wrote:
> 
> I am working with a custom GUI in GTK2 including Gremlin on my BBB. The
> following are anecdotal observations. I would love to properly profile the
> running code bit do not yet see how to use the available tools (e.g.
> cProfile)
> 
> (a) Gremlin needs lots of CPU - I don't know whether it is screen rendering
> without the hardware accelerators that is the culprit.
> 
> (b) Showing the nicely shaded cylindrical tool is costly. If I cheat, and
> make it appear a negligible length/diameter one, then CPU drops by about 10%
> 
> (c) I have GCode display in sourceview widget. If code (e.g. engraving) is
> very long then moving the active line in this seems very expensive.
> 
> (d) Data which is "display only", e,g, Distance To Go DROs, implemented as
> labels are much cheaper than general ones that can accept input like the
> machine-axis DROs.
> 
> (e) The GUI is surprisingly useable at very low rates of updating the
> toolpath, G code and even axis DROs. 1 second is OK. This makes significant
> average CPU savings. The this low rate is tested when running a real
> machine. The audio/visual feedback from the hardware makes the system feel
> snappy even though the screen is lagging. Tests with no machine are
> misleading.
> 
> A BBB ought to be plenty powerful enough. Perhaps the proper GPU graphics
> will fix things. It would be nice to design an experiment to dummy out the
> graphics work that could be done by hardware or to verify in some other way
> that there are not other bottlenecks.

Excellent notes, John, thanks for sharing!

One comment I'll add is the gremlin back-plot display seems to interact
with the X-Server and add significant lag to keyboard jogging (at least
the way it's setup by default).  Switching away from gremlin (ie: the
DRO tab in Axis) restores the keyboard's normal response when jogging.

With your updates, do you still see the keyboard lag, or does reducing
the load from gremlin help this issue?

-- 
Charles Steinkuehler
char...@steinkuehler.net



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Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit Gui

[John Prentice (FS)]

Greetings

Charles wrote:
> It looks good, but for some reason the CPU usage on my BeagleBone is
around 50%!

> I don't know if this is specifically BeagleBone related, or perhaps due to
the fact that I just pulled the configs/sim/gscreen and
 > share/gscreen/ directories from Master (skipping anything else updated
outside these two directory trees).

>Regardless, it seems responsive enough when I use keyboard jog, so I'll try
and get it working with a real 
>configuration and try moving motors.

I am working with a custom GUI in GTK2 including Gremlin on my BBB. The
following are anecdotal observations. I would love to properly profile the
running code bit do not yet see how to use the available tools (e.g.
cProfile)

(a) Gremlin needs lots of CPU - I don't know whether it is screen rendering
without the hardware accelerators that is the culprit.

(b) Showing the nicely shaded cylindrical tool is costly. If I cheat, and
make it appear a negligible length/diameter one, then CPU drops by about 10%

(c) I have GCode display in sourceview widget. If code (e.g. engraving) is
very long then moving the active line in this seems very expensive.

(d) Data which is "display only", e,g, Distance To Go DROs, implemented as
labels are much cheaper than general ones that can accept input like the
machine-axis DROs.

(e) The GUI is surprisingly useable at very low rates of updating the
toolpath, G code and even axis DROs. 1 second is OK. This makes significant
average CPU savings. The this low rate is tested when running a real
machine. The audio/visual feedback from the hardware makes the system feel
snappy even though the screen is lagging. Tests with no machine are
misleading.

A BBB ought to be plenty powerful enough. Perhaps the proper GPU graphics
will fix things. It would be nice to design an experiment to dummy out the
graphics work that could be done by hardware or to verify in some other way
that there are not other bottlenecks.

Best wishes

John Prentice


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Re: [Emc-users] Conversion Suggesions?

[Mark Wendt]

On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 12:53 PM, Gene Heskett  wrote:

>
> >
> > Gene,
> >
> > Hie thee to this divine web site, and look under Lead Screws, then PS
> > style lead screws and PS style nuts.  I've got one of these on my Z
> > axis on my CNC saw beveler.  The screws are some kind of modified acme,
> > teflon coated.  They're anti-backlash PS style nut is pretty much
> > indestructible, and thankfully for me, idiot proof.
> >
> > http://www.pic-design.com/
> >
> > Mark
>
> Looks neat although the spec'd accuracy is .003" at best.  I grabbed the
> whole catalog.pdf for perusal when I am ready.  I think some back repairs
> will happen first however.  I like the idiot proof comment, cuz I'm the
> idiot that will test it. :)
>
> Cheers, Gene
>


Gene,

No worries.  The idiot has already tested it.  ;-)

Mark
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Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit Gui

[Charles Steinkuehler]

On 1/26/2014 6:03 AM, Mark Tucker wrote:
> Charles/Chris
> 
> How long before these changes with gscreen are merged with the 
> machinekit git repo?
> Or how do i pull the changes from master into machinekit?
> I have done the git pull from master on my developer desktop and the sim 
> works great,now just try and get it into machinekit.
> I also did a git pull in machinekit but could not see any gscreen 
> changes yet.

The MachineKit branch is quite stale at the moment, and it will probably
be a while until it gets updated.  The MachineKit branch exists mainly
to be a snapshot of UBC3 for "stable" releases, and I don't really
intend to update it until I get the pinmux fixes sorted out.

The general order of code updates is:

  Master -> UBC3 -> MachineKit

...where code goes in the oldest applicable branch.  So gscreen code
goes in master, and Xenomai code goes in UBC3.

Michael Haberler usually keeps UBC3 pretty current with master, but IIRC
he's off-line for a while having real-world adventures.  You should be
able to pull master into UBC3 with little or no problem so you can have
the latest gscreen changes.

Holler if you get stuck.

-- 
Charles Steinkuehler
char...@steinkuehler.net



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Re: [Emc-users] Machinekit Gui

[Michael Haberler]

Am 26.01.2014 um 13:03 schrieb Mark Tucker :

> Charles/Chris
> 
> How long before these changes with gscreen are merged with the 
> machinekit git repo?
> Or how do i pull the changes from master into machinekit?

I regularly merge master into 
https://github.com/mhaberler/linuxcnc/tree/unified-build-candidate-3 which is 
the tree to use for machinekit

or on demand, like right now that branch is current with master, and I think 
it's also current with Charles' work

so pull again from above and you should be fine

if you need something urgent, drop me a mail

- Michael


> I have done the git pull from master on my developer desktop and the sim 
> works great,now just try and get it into machinekit.
> I also did a git pull in machinekit but could not see any gscreen 
> changes yet.
> I know charles is wanting a 3d printer gui,but i would like to alter it 
> for milling etc,so it should be easy to remove the extra 3d printer 
> stuff like heated beds etc.
> 
> 
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[Emc-users] Machinekit Gui

[Mark Tucker]

Charles/Chris

How long before these changes with gscreen are merged with the 
machinekit git repo?
Or how do i pull the changes from master into machinekit?
I have done the git pull from master on my developer desktop and the sim 
works great,now just try and get it into machinekit.
I also did a git pull in machinekit but could not see any gscreen 
changes yet.
I know charles is wanting a 3d printer gui,but i would like to alter it 
for milling etc,so it should be easy to remove the extra 3d printer 
stuff like heated beds etc.


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